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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

April 26 Open Chat: D.J. Lurks
2005-04-26 17:00
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

Tonight's Game

Before people get too eager about D.J. Houlton becoming a No. 5 starter, keep in mind that opponents are batting .423 against him this season - 11 hits in 26 at-bats. In Houlton's favor, 10 of this hits have been singles, none have been homers, and he has only walked one while striking out five in 6 1/3 innings. Bad luck?

Comments (256)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2005-04-26 18:11:46
1.   Marty
I have to say, Erickson scares me. Let's hope he gives us 5 innings.
2005-04-26 18:15:45
2.   Marty
Continuing from the previous thread, Arod already has 3 homeruns so far against the Angels and is up now with 2 on.
2005-04-26 18:17:53
3.   Marty
And he singles, 1 RBI
2005-04-26 18:21:55
4.   Bob Timmermann
Marty has trouble with double digits.... ;)

It's 10 RBI

2005-04-26 18:23:21
5.   Marty
I wanted to say 1 MORE RBI, but got too excited.
2005-04-26 18:27:59
6.   Bob Timmermann
Choi is getting another start in the #2 slot. I guess Russ Ortiz doesn't pitch too hard.

Ledee in left field.

2005-04-26 18:32:50
7.   bigcpa
5th starter in waiting...

Derek Thompson AA
22ip, 31k, 6bb, 0hr, 4.09 ERA

Plus he wears a nifty shell necklace like Lowe.

2005-04-26 18:49:34
8.   KAYVMON
Bobby Cox just put in a loogy for Kolb and it worked. However, if Tracy ever thought of putting in a loogy for Gagne or Yhency for that matter to get the last out of a game, I think hed have to be fired.
2005-04-26 18:49:42
9.   Linkmeister
Shell necklaces ain't necessarily all they're cracked up to be: the Giants just sent Jerome Williams (he of the puka shells) down to Fresno.
2005-04-26 18:52:39
10.   Bob Timmermann
Kolb, unlike Gagne or Yhency, isn't very good.
2005-04-26 18:52:46
11.   Suffering Bruin
Alex Rodriguez has 10 RBI in the sixth inning. He has hit three homeruns--a two-run shot, a three-run and a grand slam, all off Bartolo Colon. He singled in the sixth to drive in the tenth run.

I hate the Yankees.

-----------------------------------------------

TODAY'S FACT OF CHOI, SB'S FAVORITE PLAYER, 2005:

Two comments to start off today...

a) I missed the last two editions of Fact of Choi because the kid has held the computer hostage with his Lego Star Wars game. An unusually entertaining game it is, by the by. And...

b) Saenz pinch-hitting for Choi last night made no earthly sense to me. None whatsoever. I am open to suggestions as to why it was a good move.

So here we go. I have officially made a request to the Dodgers for a press pass so I could interview our hero as I am running out of information for these things. There isn't much on the net in the way of interviews with Choi and there is apparently good reason for it. A buddy of mine has a friend in the Chicago Trib's sports department who claims that as an interview, Choi is duller than grease-pocked pans.

This the only interview I could find, from 2001, just before Choi got called up by the Cubs. Try to stay awake. I dare you. (courtesy Korea Times)

Korea Times: In the pre-season reviews you were picked as one of the top prospects in the Chicago Cubs system as well as in all of baseball. What are your goals for this season and for the next couple years?

CHOI: I want to go to Chicago this season and be the first Korean position player to reach the major leagues. It would be a great honor to be the first and I want to stay there and play well for a long time.

Times: This is just your third season in the Cubs system and you are already in triple-A ball in Iowa. What have you done to get there and what do you feel are your best attributes?

CHOI: I think the Cubs like my offense the most. I can hit for a good average and I can hit for power.

Times: Who has been the biggest influence in your baseball career and how have they helped you?

CHOI: My high school coach was very good and he told me that I should be a hitter and not a pitcher. My hitting coaches each year with the Cubs have been good too. I have learned a lot here.

Times: What are you focusing on this season with the Iowa Cubs to improve your game?

CHOI: I just need to learn to be more consistent. I'm also focusing on learning a new level of baseball. The closer you get to the major leagues, the harder it gets, so I'm just trying to learn as much as I can.

Times: Do you feel there is any chance of you making it to the big team this year with Matt Stairs and Julio Zuleta (now with Iowa) splitting duty at first base? When do you think you will make it to the MLB?

CHOI: I think I can get there this year if my hand gets better. Those other guys are good players, but I hope to get a chance to show what I can do too.

Times: The Chicago Cubs are still in first place nearly halfway through the season. Do you think they will stay there? Why or why not?

CHOI: Yes, they can stay there because they have good pitching and everyone on the team can play good so they should be a good team.

Times: This season you have struggled a bit at the plate and been injured, both pretty new things in your baseball career. What are you doing to get back on track?

CHOI: I just get treatment on it every day and try to keep the rest of my body in shape so when my hand is better I'll be ready to play.

Times: A number of Koreans are finding success in the Major Leagues and in the minors -- Park Chan-ho, Kim Byung-hyun, Kim Sun-woo and yourself to mention a few. Do you keep track of what other Koreans are doing? Do you keep in contact with any of them?

CHOI: Yes. I watch for them on TV and I keep in touch with most of them by cellular phone. They are all very nice guys.

Times: Many Korean athletes are pressured to `bring glory to Korea.' Have you faced any of this kind of pressure? What motivates you?

CHOI: I feel a little pressure just because I'm the first Korean position player to be this close to the majors, but I just want to make the people of Korea happy and proud of me.

Times: Do your teammates realize that you are Korean? What do you tell them about Korea?

CHOI: Yes, they know I'm Korean, and I tell them it is a lot like the US. I tell them they would like it there

2005-04-26 18:53:56
12.   bigcpa
Kolb 9ip, 4k, 8bb, 8.00 ERA

He gets the Rolaids award for the wrong reason.

2005-04-26 18:55:16
13.   bigcpa
Suffering Bruin-
Email me- I have a stupendous fact of Choi to slip you. bigcpa@cox.net
2005-04-26 18:56:08
14.   Suffering Bruin
Linkmeister,

A lot of the Choi stuff I get is from baseball.playerprofiles.com. I pick out a fact and then do some Googling to see if there's any color to add. With Choi, colorful stories are not easy. His young career so far has been blissfully free of acrimony.

2005-04-26 18:57:09
15.   eagle2x
newbie here... mission: seeking rational Dodger discussion with little resemblance to LA Times sports section and local sports talk radio. Mission accomplished. Good site. Tidbit about me: I was at the Brian Johnson game in '97 (live in bay area for 6 tough Dodger years). Eddie Murray hit into a DP with the bases loaded in extra innings. The 'stick was averaging something like 12,000 per game, but had 52,000 that day. Took me one hour to get to my car, another hour to get out of the parking lot, and yet another hour to get back to the city. Brutal day.
2005-04-26 18:59:34
16.   Vishal
re: houlton... it could be bad luck. i hope it's not good luck, that they were all just singles.
2005-04-26 18:59:38
17.   Blue Crew
First off let me say that I am pretty new to this site and think it's great. Jon seems like a class act and many of the poster appear to know their baseball.

With that said, what's up with Repko? I like this kid and thought he was doing a decent job filling in for Werth? Anyone have an idea?

BC

2005-04-26 19:02:46
18.   Adam M
Sun-woo Kim found success?
2005-04-26 19:02:57
19.   Bob Timmermann
In the "Go Figure" Dept.
The Twins, with Johan Santana pitching (he of 16 straight victories without a loss) is tied 1-1 in the 7th at KC against Jose Lima.
2005-04-26 19:07:11
20.   Jim Hitchcock
Okay. The miasma ends now.
2005-04-26 19:08:16
21.   Adam M
Choi Fun Fact #2:
On the day gagne's streak got broke last year by lenny freakin' harris, a scowling Choi was the first man out of the tunnel by about 15 minutes and could not have gotten out of the Stadium faster if he'd been fired from a cannon. Can't say I blame him. Lima, on the other hand, shook hands with all the fans, then went down to get some leftovers from the dugout club buffet. That clown will be missed.
2005-04-26 19:10:11
22.   KAYVMON
In honor of two dollar tickets, we will have an entertaining game tonight.
2005-04-26 19:14:35
23.   KAYVMON
Erickson: our first inning rotation stopper.
2005-04-26 19:14:48
24.   eagle2x
I wonder how many runners went from 1st to 3rd for the Angels tonight in their 12-4 loss.
2005-04-26 19:16:44
25.   Blue Crew
8 pitches? Nice. Can he keep it up?

BC

2005-04-26 19:17:05
26.   DXMachina
That was a nice inning.
2005-04-26 19:18:22
27.   Jim Hitchcock
Choi would have gotten a base hit last night :)
2005-04-26 19:18:55
28.   KAYVMON
That looked like an inside high fastball that Choi just hit. Maybe he is adjusting.
2005-04-26 19:24:51
29.   GoBears
I wonder how many runners went from 1st to 3rd for the Angels tonight in their 12-4 loss.

Ha! Good one. And more to the point, how much extra did they pay for those advancements?

2005-04-26 19:26:07
30.   GoBears
Rats. Choi got his hit, but Izzy, Drew, and Kent all hit the ball hard for outs.

Erickson looks good so far. He made Gonzo and Glaus look bad.

2005-04-26 19:27:03
31.   Bob Timmermann
The pitcher in for KC now has the first name of Ambiorix.
2005-04-26 19:27:20
32.   GoBears
My bad. Spoke too soon. Will Shawn give his gloves away?
2005-04-26 19:27:52
33.   GoBears
Aw, shucks. What a nice fellah...
2005-04-26 19:28:07
34.   KAYVMON
Jon, youre question from yesterday was just answered.
2005-04-26 19:28:40
35.   Jim Hitchcock
Hey lady, ever listened to the Spinal Tap album?
2005-04-26 19:29:42
36.   fernandomania
LOL, Jim.
2005-04-26 19:32:44
37.   Daniel Zappala
I was having a hard time deciding: is Shawn Green the type of hitter Scott Erickson can actually get out, or is Scott Erickson the type of pitcher Shawn Green can actually hit.

Score 1 for Green.

2005-04-26 19:33:27
38.   Bob Timmermann
I see we're spilling stuff on our tie again tonight.
2005-04-26 19:33:58
39.   KAYVMON
At this point, Erickson is the type of pitcher Russ Ortiz can hit.
2005-04-26 19:34:23
40.   Blue Crew
Well, I guess he can't keep it up. I thought he looked decent in the first. Hopefully he/we can recover.

BC

2005-04-26 19:34:32
41.   Fearing Blue
I missed the first inning. Erickson certainly hasn't looked good in the second. Not considering the walk, singles, and 2 HRs, he seems like he's fallen behind every batter he's faced.
2005-04-26 19:35:21
42.   GoBears
Yowch. That second HR was CRUSHED. But at least Vinnie is talking about SLG% and OBP. That's bigger news than Erickson being Erickson.
2005-04-26 19:36:14
43.   Dodgerkid
Where's Ishii?!?!?
2005-04-26 19:37:54
44.   Marty
OK, they have to release Erickson between innings.
2005-04-26 19:38:28
45.   eagle2x
I also noticed that Vin just used SLG% and OBP. Where do u think that comes from?
2005-04-26 19:38:37
46.   jasonungar05
who calls weaver pinch hitting for choi tonight?
2005-04-26 19:39:00
47.   jasonungar05
Ishi is on the DL
2005-04-26 19:40:13
48.   Marty
Nice AB Milton
2005-04-26 19:40:51
49.   Fearing Blue
Ouch.. poor Valentin.
2005-04-26 19:43:27
50.   Bob Timmermann
The Dodgers could set an LA record for HBP in a season. It's 52 set in 2003. Nothing like having Alex Cora AND Mike Kinkade around for that task.

(Yes, I looked this up Sunday)

Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2005-04-26 19:44:34
51.   Marty
#45, Vinnie been mentioning OBP and slugging for a few games now. He's no idiot and probably reads the papers and knows what's going on with management. All that to say I doubt he's been told to talk about those stats if that is what you were inferring.
2005-04-26 19:45:35
52.   Eric L
Would you say that Phillips is dressed to the nines?
2005-04-26 19:46:45
53.   Sam DC
C'mon Scott, you owe Russ one.
2005-04-26 19:48:03
54.   Sam DC
Well, got 7 pitches out of him at least.
2005-04-26 19:48:21
55.   Bob Timmermann
I've always had a near pathological hatred for Russ Ortiz.

Why is that?

2005-04-26 19:49:05
56.   GoBears
Sheesh - never meant to imply that Vinnie was an idiot. He's just old school. I remember when he started getting excited about pitch counts. IT came out of nowhere, but became a bit of an obsession for a while. Hey, Vinnie's value ain't his sabermetric savvy. So I was just pleasantly surprised.
2005-04-26 19:52:08
57.   Linkmeister
Back in 1967 we had Ron Hunt, who held the HBP career record (I think) until Don Baylor came along. Hunt was hit 10 times that year.
2005-04-26 19:52:26
58.   Bob Timmermann
The Dodgers old webmaster said that Vin was always open to learning new things and using the web and such.

I think with using new stats, he would only want to use things he knows enough about. He knows about sample sizes.

2005-04-26 19:52:52
59.   GoBears
Bob (#55). It's because he's overrated. Good, but not as good as his paycheck or his press. Either that or the bushy eyebrows.
2005-04-26 19:53:28
60.   GoBears
Wow, Vinnie's getting emotional about that dumb warning on the Glaus HBP. Go Vinnie!
2005-04-26 19:54:14
61.   Dodgerkid
Yes we might get a fight tonight!
2005-04-26 19:54:59
62.   GoBears
Umpires really *&^$ me off.
2005-04-26 19:55:36
63.   Marty
Go Bears, I was responding to #45, not you.
2005-04-26 19:55:57
64.   Steve
I don't know why people rip on Dan Kolb. He got a "Hold" tonight. Just because his WHIP is getting as high as his ERA...

Luis Terrero? You have to be kidding me. Dan Kolb could get Luis Terrero out. Thanks for the memories Scott, but there's a new DJ on the dial.

2005-04-26 19:56:26
65.   DXMachina
I was gonna say. If Erickson was going to throw at anyone, you'd think it'd be Green.
2005-04-26 19:57:36
66.   Blue in SF
Did Greenie give away the gloves, or what?
2005-04-26 19:59:51
67.   Jim Hitchcock
I was about to call that...
2005-04-26 19:59:55
68.   Bob Timmermann
Hunt is the single season HBP leader. Baylor is the "modern" career leader. Hughie Jennings had more but he played in the 19th century for part of his career so his pain counts for less.
2005-04-26 20:00:11
69.   Marty
HR Choi!
2005-04-26 20:00:14
70.   Fearing Blue
I think it was Bob's eel last night that caused that :).
2005-04-26 20:00:27
71.   Bob Timmermann
Olmedo that!
2005-04-26 20:01:52
72.   Steve
YAY! Jim Tracy is getting the most out of Choi!
2005-04-26 20:03:26
73.   DXMachina
#66 "Did Greenie give away the gloves, or what?"

He did.

2005-04-26 20:03:34
74.   Fearing Blue
I think we should put a Dodger Thoughts fund together to send Choi a steak every time he hits a homerun.
2005-04-26 20:03:55
75.   Marty
Ortiz looks very beatable tonight.
2005-04-26 20:04:57
76.   GoBears
#66: Yes, Green did toss his gloves to the fans.

Check out Fourth Outfieder for another take on the Saenz PH decision last night. I agree with it completely, but didn't realize that Saenz's platoon split was SO huge. He was, arguably, not just a bad choice to replace Choi there, but the worst possible choice off the bench against a RHP.

Wow - Ortiz isn't fooling anyone. That's a lot of booming outs we've made so far.

2005-04-26 20:08:25
77.   Eric L
I think if I ever start a blog, I'm going to name it "Beach Balls Suck".
2005-04-26 20:09:34
78.   GoBears
Er, uh, Fourth OutfieLder -- http://www.all-baseball.com/fourthof

By the way, Choi is terrific over there at 1st. Helps to be 6' 5". Right Bob?

2005-04-26 20:11:40
79.   DeucesAreWild
Erickson has quietly entered a groove. Perhaps a quality start is on the horizon. Any chance he gives us a couple more good innings and keeps us in the game?
2005-04-26 20:16:37
80.   Berkeley Doug
#79 I hope you didn't just jinx him. :-)

It is bad enough to still be at work but it is worse to see LA fall behind in a game again. That's ok, though, we will just get single runs in the next five innings and win 7-3.

2005-04-26 20:17:56
81.   Eric L
If it was (or were) Jeter making the play that Cesar just made, he would have done one of his cute jump throws. The guys on Baseball Tonight would talk about how fantastic he is at making the jump throw and on and on...
2005-04-26 20:20:26
82.   GoBears
Meanwhile, I'm starting to think that Vinnie and Craig Counsell should get a room.
2005-04-26 20:20:33
83.   DeucesAreWild
I'm all about the MLB Audio Pass for those nights I can't get out of work at a decent hour, and I've forgotten to set Tivo.
2005-04-26 20:21:25
84.   Blue Crew
Let's hope he has. Hopefully he can get some movement on that ball.
2005-04-26 20:21:41
85.   Marty
GB, LOL
2005-04-26 20:22:21
86.   DeucesAreWild
Holy crap - is Brett Butler really the D-backs' first base coach?
2005-04-26 20:24:35
87.   Blue in SF
Counsel has looked remarkably Ruthian against the Dodgers
2005-04-26 20:25:15
88.   Odysseus
Choi is now up to .234.
Before today
Choi 200/294/311 (45 ABs)
Saenz 409/500/682 (22 ABs)
Grabowski 143/240/286 (21 ABs)
Nakamura 174/208/217 (23 ABs)

I don't know what Choi's OBP and SLG are after tonight, but Hee Seop gets to eat meat tonight!

2005-04-26 20:26:28
89.   joekings
If Erickson makes it out of this inning do you hit for him leading off the fifth?
2005-04-26 20:27:41
90.   Sam DC
Did Gonzalez' fly ball really graze up against the right field wall like Gameday shows?
2005-04-26 20:28:13
91.   GoBears
That Gonzo fly-out was weird. IT looked like he hit it perfectly, but just didn't swing that hard. Result - warning track out. Made me feel old just watching that swing. And I'm 3 months older than Gonzo.
2005-04-26 20:29:19
92.   Sam DC
GB -- Thanks, even though I 'spect you didn't know you were answering my question.
2005-04-26 20:29:32
93.   GoBears
Yes, joekings, I do hit for Erickson. Count yourself lucky to get 5 decent innings out of him (well, 3 good, 1 bad, and this one).
2005-04-26 20:29:54
94.   GoBears
CUT BAIT! CUT BAIT!
2005-04-26 20:30:21
95.   Steve
Hit for Erickson.
2005-04-26 20:31:05
96.   Sam DC
I'll just add that Gameday places Glaus' shot over the right center wall.
2005-04-26 20:31:27
97.   Marty
Definitely, get Erickson out of there now.
2005-04-26 20:32:12
98.   joekings
Good decision, bad pinch hitter.
2005-04-26 20:32:13
99.   Steve
A key test for Jim Tracy after a few bad days.
2005-04-26 20:33:15
100.   Ben P
Why leave Erickson in to face the very dangerous Glaus if you're just going to hit for him? Why not double-switch?
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2005-04-26 20:33:24
101.   Steve
Leave Erickson in! :)
2005-04-26 20:33:31
102.   regfairfield
Yet again Grabowski is the first one of the bench...
2005-04-26 20:33:53
103.   DeucesAreWild
I am thinking we have 5 guys in the minors who, given Grabowski's ABs, could do at least a somewhat competent job. He is just terrible.
2005-04-26 20:34:36
104.   joekings
If you double switch you'd have to take out philips and replace him with Bako.
2005-04-26 20:35:16
105.   joekings
ortiz fears choi
2005-04-26 20:35:46
106.   joekings
why did he run him!!!!
2005-04-26 20:36:09
107.   Eric L
Isn't Grabowski being the first one off the bench sort of a trickle down thing right now?

If Werth is healthy, would Leedee be the first lefty off the bench?

2005-04-26 20:37:50
108.   GoBears
On first glance, it looked like Cesar was out at 2nd, but the replays make me think he beat the throw.

Hee-Seop is 3 for 3. Think he'll finish the game?

2005-04-26 20:37:56
109.   regfairfield
I think I would believe that if Grabowksi didn't set the pinch hit record last year.
2005-04-26 20:39:10
110.   Ben P
Re #104, if you were going to put Grabowski in anyway you could have double-switched him in for Ledee.

As for the Izturis CS, Vin keeps saying there was a missed hit-and-run sign with Choi. I don't think it was missed. The pitch bounced 2 feet in front of the plate. Of course Choi didn't swing at it.

2005-04-26 20:40:10
111.   Steve
Why would you run against a pitcher who gives up baserunners like candy from a PEZ dispenser with the heart of your lineup coming up? And Tracy kills another rally in its crib.
2005-04-26 20:41:39
112.   Marty
Yeah Steve, I don't understand it. They had Ortiz right where they wanted him.
2005-04-26 20:43:20
113.   Steve
I wonder if Schmoll can go five innings.
2005-04-26 20:45:30
114.   LAT
Bears, thanks for your post on the other string. I agree that Tracy should be consistent. Not sure I'm convinced Choi is the better hitter but what do I know? I've been selling Choi stock all day and tonight it hits a 52 week high.
2005-04-26 20:45:52
115.   Mulder
Steve, how many side arm, starting pitchers are there? I dont recall seeing one.
2005-04-26 20:46:18
116.   A E LUTHER
Houlton to pitch out of the mini-jam...
2005-04-26 20:47:47
117.   A E LUTHER
This may be a stretch but does Choi remind anyone of Frank Howard?
2005-04-26 20:48:49
118.   A E LUTHER
mini-jam over, D-back's left him stranded.
2005-04-26 20:48:54
119.   Bob Timmermann
Hmm,
Choi is lefthanded and doesn't wear glasses.
2005-04-26 20:49:03
120.   DeucesAreWild
DJ is displaying some stuff. Nice out pitches. Gives you a bit more confidence than Erickson...
2005-04-26 20:50:48
121.   A E LUTHER
How was Frank Howard's fielding?
2005-04-26 20:51:03
122.   Vishal
apart from that curveball on the second pitch, did dj houlton throw anything other than high fastballs for the rest of the inning?

btw, izturis looked safe to me on the replay.

2005-04-26 20:51:15
123.   GoBears
Well, that Izzy CS might have been a blown hit-and-run. But Ben P could also be right. The pitch was so bad that CHoi couldn't possibly hit the ball, so why waste a strike? If Vin is right AND Ben P is right, then the DBax were just lucky that Ortiz's pitch was so horrible. Sometimes lucky is better than good.
2005-04-26 20:53:20
124.   Bob Timmermann
I still really, really, really, really, really hate Russ Ortiz.

I think I need to see a therapist about it.

2005-04-26 20:54:59
125.   regfairfield
We are talking about Russ Ortiz here. It's just as likely he'll hit the backstop as the strike zone.
2005-04-26 20:55:19
126.   GoBears
It's possible (POSSIBLE) that Izzy would not have scored had been called safe on the SB. Choi got an infield hit, which would have moved Izzy to 3rd. Then Drew got a broken-bat IF hit, which MIGHT have scored Izzy, but he might have been held with 1 out. Then Kent's FC could easily have been an inning-ending DP. Had Izzy not even tried to steal, then he'd have been at 2nd on Choi's IF hit, and almost certainly would never have scored.
2005-04-26 20:55:30
127.   DeucesAreWild
Bob, Dusty Baker likes Russ Ortiz.
2005-04-26 20:55:38
128.   Daniel Zappala
Is there going to be a Hee Seop Choi Marching and Chowder Society?
2005-04-26 20:55:41
129.   Xeifrank
Houlton's DIPs is around 2.30 which is very good. No HRs allowed, 1 walk and over 10 strike outs. Not bad.

vr

Xeifrank

2005-04-26 20:55:48
130.   LAT
I really, really, really, really, really hate beach balls.
2005-04-26 20:56:17
131.   Sam DC
How ya feelin' about Ricky Ledee?
2005-04-26 20:56:26
132.   GoBears
Bob - another thought. Perhaps your hatred of RussO is because Dusty loved him so? A little misplaced resentment?
2005-04-26 20:56:55
133.   Bob Timmermann
If Dusty Baker likes Russ Ortiz, then I don't feel so bad. Dusty likes guys like Neifi Perez, Shawon Dunston, Tom Goodwin, and such.
2005-04-26 20:57:37
134.   A E LUTHER
Come on throw another one about 58 feet.
2005-04-26 20:58:25
135.   Bob Timmermann
Odalis Perez curses in the dugout about that one.
2005-04-26 20:58:35
136.   Xeifrank
wow, Green is killing the Dodgers tonight. HR and great run saving diving catch to end the bottom of the 6th.

vr

Xei

2005-04-26 20:59:10
137.   Mulder
I think I take Green in a contact year for $4 million. Not a bad Outfield-1st basemen.
2005-04-26 20:59:11
138.   GoBears
re: 127/132 -- Or what DAW said.
2005-04-26 20:59:26
139.   DeucesAreWild
Are Shawon Dunston and Chone Figgins friends?
2005-04-26 20:59:51
140.   LAT
That's what you get when the visiting right fielder knows DS better than the Dodgers RFer
2005-04-26 21:00:30
141.   Fearing Blue
Re: #122: I think you're right. Fastballs sitting at 91 mph just above belt high. I'm a little concerned that if he doesn't change speeds a little, the better hitters are going to smack him around.
2005-04-26 21:00:56
142.   GoBears
Didn't Green get an extension, such that this is not a contract year?
2005-04-26 21:01:38
143.   Mulder
This was his last year on his contact
2005-04-26 21:02:50
144.   LAT
This was his last year bit he did get an extension
2005-04-26 21:04:02
145.   GoBears
So Green would have cost LA what, $16M this year, or $14M? So he's cheap for Zona this year, but I thought he insisted on an extension to agree to the trade - so that they're now on the hook for more money in years to come. Anyone remember the details?
2005-04-26 21:04:12
146.   Steve
Shawn Green's last walk year was tremendous. Just ask Bill Plaschke.

What a dumb walk. The baseball Gods have been tempted.

2005-04-26 21:05:17
147.   GoBears
Thanks LAT
2005-04-26 21:07:18
148.   LAT
my recollection is he gets $10M per but can't remember if its 3 or 4 years. Seems like something Bob T would be on top of but I think he's blinded by rage tonight.
2005-04-26 21:07:21
149.   Mulder
What I meant by the 4 million in a contract year was that Depo traded Green to free up 4 million (and the minor league catcher). I would take Green for $4 million in the last year of his contract.
2005-04-26 21:12:13
150.   Mulder
Nice job. I love to see guys get picked off at 1st.
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2005-04-26 21:12:46
151.   Steve
Arizona's Kangaroo Court should have some fun with that one tomorrow.
2005-04-26 21:13:14
152.   regfairfield
Never having to see Shawn Green go into his strike out pose again is well worth 10 million dollars.
2005-04-26 21:15:24
153.   Mulder
They should search bags for those beach balls
2005-04-26 21:15:31
154.   Blue in SF
Why so much hate for Green? All he did was play well for the Dodgers and be a class act in the community. Yeah Towers gave him too much money, but that's not his fault.
2005-04-26 21:16:59
155.   LAT
Blue, I agree. By the way it was Sheriff Malone not Towers
2005-04-26 21:17:00
156.   Bob Timmermann
That's the Dodgers problem, we've been having the San Diego GM write the contracts!
2005-04-26 21:17:41
157.   GoBears
What I meant by the 4 million in a contract year was that Depo traded Green to free up 4 million (and the minor league catcher). I would take Green for $4 million in the last year of his contract.

But that choice wasn't available to anyone. To get Green in a contract year would have cost LA more, the full $14M OR $16M or whatever. For Zona to get him this year for $4M (if that's right) cost them more in the long run.

2005-04-26 21:17:49
158.   Mulder
I like Green. He liked playing for the Dodgers. Sounds pretty bitter about being shipped out.
2005-04-26 21:18:09
159.   LAT
Bob I notice you are back now that RO is out
2005-04-26 21:18:15
160.   Fearing Blue
I agree Blue in SF. I wish Green well when he's not playing the Dodgers. He certainly did OK financially in the deal. Didn't he get a 3-year $30 million extension from the Diamondbacks out of the trade?
2005-04-26 21:19:04
161.   Vic
Thank God Tracy pulled Choi last night -- bastard's ice cold.
2005-04-26 21:20:27
162.   Mulder
The Diamondbacks paid a lot for their free agents. It might look good this year, but in a year or two I think they will be kicking themselves.
2005-04-26 21:20:30
163.   Im So Blue
Is that Plaschke/Simers doing the official scoring (denying Choi his 4th hit)?
2005-04-26 21:20:52
164.   GoBears
Naw, I always liked Shawn Green. I think almost everyone did. But that doesn't mean it wasn't smart to jettison his contract, once his production started to decline. He's an average-to-good player now, making superstar money.
2005-04-26 21:21:02
165.   Bob Timmermann
Oh, I was on a mission to look through old LA Times articles to see if anyone liked or didn't like the Dugout Level seats when the park opened in 1962. I can't find articles one way or the other about them.

Wouldn't the view from those seats be just as bad as the new ones down the lines are?

2005-04-26 21:22:02
166.   Bob Timmermann
The Pads lead the Giants 3-2. Schmidt got pulled after throwing 131 pitches in 6.2 innings.
2005-04-26 21:22:05
167.   LAT
Bears, if Green's agent is to be believed he offered to restructure his contract with the Dodgers and take even less then $10M a year if the Dodgers needed more $$ to keep Beltre. Of course I read this in a Plaschke article so who knows if its true.
I have always thought that regardless of whether you like Green or not, the new Dodgers handled the whole off season with him pretty poorly.
2005-04-26 21:22:13
168.   Steve
Dodger scoring is very political this year. That's why Valentin has so many errors.
2005-04-26 21:22:29
169.   Dodgerkid
Bob when are you going to start your own blog? You have a lot of time on your hands, and are a fountain of strange knowledge about LA.
2005-04-26 21:23:14
170.   Bob Timmermann
Yea! 4 for 4 for Hee Seop! Yippee!

The Dodgers are really ripping a lot of line drives tonight.

Unfortunately not in the right places.

2005-04-26 21:24:17
171.   LAT
Holly crap the world is coming to an end. . .Choi 4 for 4!!!!!
2005-04-26 21:26:44
172.   Mulder
Has anyone noticed they stop printing those annoying letters from fans in the LA Times regurgitating Plaschke/Simers.
2005-04-26 21:27:33
173.   Blue in SF
Sorry, I meant the other Kevin. Green is the most gracious Dodger I have known. Another in a long line of class Dodgers to get punked.
2005-04-26 21:27:44
174.   Im So Blue
Valentin woulda caught that if it weren't for those new seats...
2005-04-26 21:27:46
175.   Steve
Well, now that we don't have to worry about Choi for awhile, who wants to tackle the Valentin problem?
2005-04-26 21:27:49
176.   Daniel Zappala
I would not read Bob's blog if all he talked about was eating eels and spilling on his tie. Sorry. :-)
2005-04-26 21:28:28
177.   bokonon42
I think Green got an extension when he was traded. Three years thirty million.
2005-04-26 21:28:44
178.   Fearing Blue
Re #160: Correcting myself. Here is Green's salary structure with the Diamondbacks, as reported in:
http://tinyurl.com/8f3rr

$2 million signing bonus
2005 - $16 million
2006 - $8 million
2007 - $9.5 million
2008 - $10 million w/ $2 million buyout

The Diamondbacks received $10 million from the Dodgers. Thus, the Diamondbacks are on the hook for $27.5 million over 3 years assuming they purchase the buyout. Still seems pretty high for a slugger of Green's caliber and age.

2005-04-26 21:31:26
179.   Vic
Highway robbery, anyone?
2005-04-26 21:34:24
180.   Steve
Alex Cora would have fouled off twelve pitches, then walked and stolen second on the throw back to the pitcher.
2005-04-26 21:34:45
181.   dzzrtRatt
Milt looks like he's had enuf of this losin' crap.
2005-04-26 21:35:38
182.   LAT
Bob, my firm put me in charge of their seats. We used to have the old dug out seats before the Fox conversion. They were a fun novelty and great for client development but only fair seats to watch a game. Every routine fly ball looked like a HR. When Fox built the Dugout Club they offered to move us to the new three rows, AA, BB, CC past visitors dugout. Those seats were okay but perspective of the field was skewed. Left field and third base were a mile away and the seats were installed straight ahead rather than at an angle, so your neck was stiff by the end of the game looking to the left. Now comes the new AA, BB, CC etc seats which are by far the worst of all. Can't see the batter or the entire field. I am taking a lot of heat for these seats.
2005-04-26 21:36:40
183.   Eric L
re: 165

According to my dad, the dugout seats were pretty unremarkable.

2005-04-26 21:37:37
184.   Vic
Steve, you're way off -- Cora would've called time, left the stadium to rescue some old ladies from a deadly fire with his own bare hands, returned to the stadium and reconstructed the new seats to render each person's view crystal clear, then cured SARS while walking back to the batter's box in the time it took Kent to take that walk.
2005-04-26 21:38:14
185.   Mulder
Valentin hasnt looked good in awhile.
2005-04-26 21:39:05
186.   Daniel Zappala
A steal and two productive outs would have gotten that run home.
2005-04-26 21:39:10
187.   Steve
First, most temporary solution to the Valentin problem. He hits eighth.
2005-04-26 21:40:32
188.   Bob Timmermann
I'm adding to Craig Counsell to guys I hate a lot too.

But he went to Notre Dame, so he is besmirched forever in my view.

2005-04-26 21:41:29
189.   Ben P
Speaking of Valentin's slump, is Guzman getting any time at 3B in the minors? With Izturis signed for awhile, why not move Guzman over there now to get used to the position? We may need him soon.
2005-04-26 21:41:52
190.   joekings
once again we've left a small village on the base paths.
2005-04-26 21:41:57
191.   Mulder
Watch it Bob. Im a Doomer.
2005-04-26 21:42:25
192.   Daniel Zappala
The tough thing is when a guy you absolutely love (Glaus) plays for the other team.
2005-04-26 21:42:30
193.   Eric L
Shawn Green is one of my favorite players. I had him on my fantasy team the year before he was traded to the Dodgers (42 HR, 123 RBI, 20 SB). Needless to say, I was excited that the Dodgers picked him up.

That being said, I don't think he got punked. He didn't fit into the Dodgers plans and was traded. It isn't like this is the first time a player, with or without class, has been traded when he starts declining.

Besides, he got the sweet contract extension from AZ.

2005-04-26 21:43:27
194.   capdodger
187:

Tracy wouldn't do that til Valentin is below the Mendoza line.

2005-04-26 21:46:53
195.   Jim Hitchcock
Don't listen to Bob, Mulder...he owns `Rudy' on
DVD, VHS, and Laserdisc.
2005-04-26 21:46:53
196.   Steve
So, Thursday then?
2005-04-26 21:49:06
197.   Steve
So Thursday then. Well, heaven knows I'm a patient soul.
2005-04-26 21:49:22
198.   LAT
Its not that he got traded but how he got traded. First traded for Sosa, then Piazza, then Yankees, tehn Yankees/AZ. All along Depo says he's not activly looking to trade Green. He's not making calls -just taking calls. Its B.S. Just no respect for the player. Same for Beltre and Cora.
2005-04-26 21:52:04
199.   Steve
Jason Phillips has a taxi to catch.
2005-04-26 21:52:12
200.   Jim Hitchcock
Voodoo Chile Olmeda Saenz.
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2005-04-26 21:53:56
201.   Aug C
1. Green for $16 mill in 2005 stinks, but so does paying $10 million for Dionner Navarro. However, it's still the right play if Hee-Seop can replicate Green's performance this year or if Choi can nearly replicate Green while Navarro becomes a useful major league catcher. Worst case scenario for Green trade: Choi stinks it up and Russell Martin becomes our catcher of the future.

2. It's nice to see a lot of action on the board tonight.

3. It's rally time. I hope.

2005-04-26 21:54:31
202.   Steve
Tracy actually ran for Saenz. Wow. I was just about to go off about him not doing it.
2005-04-26 21:55:12
203.   regfairfield
But who will bat for Hee Seop when he comes up now?
2005-04-26 21:55:26
204.   alex 7
wow, Choi might get a chance to be the hero.
bunt Repko over or let Ceasar swing it.
2005-04-26 21:56:38
205.   Jim Hitchcock
Hee-Seop Hero.
2005-04-26 21:56:42
206.   Steve
Well, we all got what we wanted didn't we, Choi fans?
2005-04-26 21:56:46
207.   alex 7
here we go. Choi, choi, choi, choi, choi...what a story he would make tonight.
2005-04-26 21:56:47
208.   Blue in SF
Cesar for president
2005-04-26 21:58:12
209.   Aug C
Darnit... the "Hee Seop Choi" chant was giving me goosebumps too.
2005-04-26 21:58:54
210.   alex 7
dang, lol, drew, drew, drew, drew...
2005-04-26 22:00:42
211.   dzzrtRatt
"...so the runners have a slight edge..." How many times have I heard Vin say that?
2005-04-26 22:01:36
212.   alex 7
what an ab, 6 pitches so far. advantage hitter now right? (grasping for straws)
2005-04-26 22:01:51
213.   GoBears
Feh on the respect thing. LIke $16M/yr ain't enough respect?

And I don't know how many of those trade rumors were unfounded. Perhaps some of you do. But Green KNEW he wasn't going anywhere unless he wanted to, and that's part of the game. ESPECIALLY when you sign a monster contract. You're financially secure, but might have to put up with the team trying to trade your albatross contract.

2005-04-26 22:02:37
214.   GoBears
Aw, rats!
2005-04-26 22:02:41
215.   alex 7
blaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh. let d
o
o
o
o
o
o
own
2005-04-26 22:03:31
216.   dzzrtRatt
"Who are those guys?"
2005-04-26 22:03:32
217.   Ben P
Apparently we were not meant to win that game. Drew's hit was supposed to be a single.
2005-04-26 22:03:40
218.   GoBears
Dodgers clobbered the ball tonight, but didn't hit 'em where they ain't. Oh well. Gotta defend first place tomorrow night.
2005-04-26 22:03:58
219.   Steve
Did Drew hit it hard?
2005-04-26 22:04:30
220.   Ben P
Apparently we were not meant to win that game. Drew's hit was supposed to be a single. Total fluke play.
2005-04-26 22:04:46
221.   Bob Timmermann
I really hate Russ Ortiz.

Perhaps I have a distaste for guys who went to Montclair Prep.

I will be polite and reserve my comments that I usually have about Notre Dame. They would create a sense of comity.

2005-04-26 22:05:50
222.   Bob Timmermann
Giants lead the Pads 6-5 in the 9th.
2005-04-26 22:06:28
223.   dzzrtRatt
No. It was a routine grounder.

LA might've underestimated Arizona pitching a little. And the D-backs were good defensively. They won due to some great plays by Counsell and Green.

2005-04-26 22:06:30
224.   joekings
how quickly things change in a week.
2005-04-26 22:06:42
225.   alex 7
just got here for the 9th inning, but it looks like the Dodgers outplayed the DBacks. more hits and base runners, fewer errors, just hard hit balls at people is what I'm hearing?

Should be able to hit tomorrow. DBacks starter has only walked 2 in 23 innings. Lots of strikes coming to a team hitting the ball well.

Early in the season, but playing for 1st place tomorrow =)

2005-04-26 22:06:45
226.   Mulder
I sure hope we dont get swept.

GoBears - We could have had Green for 4 million. Sunk Costs my friend. His contact was already written. We gave up green for 4 million and Navarro. I'll take Green in a contract year. Navarro isnt that good. Hope I am wrong.

2005-04-26 22:08:34
227.   alex 7
Hee Seop Choi: .646 OPS
Adrian Beltre: .597 OPS
Steve Finley: .558 OP

saw that at http://depounderthescope.blogspot.com/

2005-04-26 22:08:43
228.   Bob Timmermann
Brad Halsey won at Dodger Stadium last year as a Yankee. That was a really ugly game as I recall.
2005-04-26 22:11:24
229.   regfairfield
That win had nothing to do with Arizona pitching. We constantly smashed balls that couldn't find gaps. We keep getting 11 hits a night like we've been doing, we'll win a lot of games.
2005-04-26 22:11:37
230.   Eric L
How many trade rumors do we read or hear every offseason that barely have any credibility?

Beltre may have not gotten the proper amount of respect, but I'm not sure that we are ever going to know the true story on that one. I am of the opinion that Beltre was going to the highest bidder whether it be the Dodgers or another team.

As far as Cora goes, he was going to probably get a nice raise in arbitration to be a back-up infielder. IIRC, his raise was going to be more than the 1.3 million he is getting this year from Cleveland.

2005-04-26 22:12:08
231.   Bob Timmermann
When Halsey beat the Dodgers 6-2, Nomo gave up a 3-run homer to Matsui, but also hit a homer of his own.
2005-04-26 22:12:50
232.   bigcpa
The Drew ball was headed for CF. Lyon's deflection could have gone 45 degrees either way and everyone's safe. This game was payback for all our freaky comebacks.

How amazing would a Choi 5-for-5 game winner have been to the Hee-Seop chants?! Dang dang dang!!

2005-04-26 22:16:42
233.   LAT
Bears, you are absolutly correct that the Dodgers did not owe Green any curtesy and it does'nt even need to be said that both of us would rather have the $$$ than the respect. But getting rid of Green's contract and acting with class are not mutually exclusive and it only reflects badly on the Dodgers when players they want are considering offers from other teams and the Dodgers. BTW, these problems are not limited to Green. Cora, Beltre, Porter and even Fernando would say the same.
2005-04-26 22:18:27
234.   Eric L
Wasn't the justification for saving $4 million on the Green deal was that it went towards Derek Lowe's contract?

Aside from Werth being injured, where were the Dodgers going to play Green if he stayed?

2005-04-26 22:21:10
235.   Eric L
LAT,

If it was only the Dodgers who were acting "classless", I would be worried about what you are saying. I assume that most of the Dodgers (since quite a few aren't homegrown) were unwanted at some other point in their careers.

2005-04-26 22:21:21
236.   Steve
As long as we're talking about Green (and everyone knows that I would have rather had a ham sandwich than Green), it was six million that the Dodgers saved, not four. Carry on as you were.
2005-04-26 22:21:51
237.   LAT
What did tonight do to Choi's numbers from last night. I think he moved his avg. like .30 pts.
2005-04-26 22:24:03
238.   Bob Timmermann
And the White Sox finally lost! The Athletics rallied from 7-4 down to win 9-7.
2005-04-26 22:26:36
239.   LAT
Bad news: Dodgers lose, lead down to 1/2 game.

Good news: Dodger Thoughts posts back above 200--must be that Time mag. article!!!

2005-04-26 22:38:41
240.   Aug C
Plaschke article up already... unfortunately, he has a point. Dodger Stadium never had obstructed view seats before. I still hate him though.
2005-04-26 22:40:14
241.   Bob Timmermann
However, an earlier comment indicated that the Dugout Level seats had an obstructed view.
2005-04-26 22:57:22
242.   bigcpa
Choi went from .200 to .260 tonight... 13-50. A hit in the 9th would have put him at .280! .260/.339/.420

In 6 days of 8-20 his avg is up 93 points.

2005-04-26 23:09:59
243.   Landonkk
pardon me for not reading through all posts and i apologize if this was discussed (doubt it), but why not Schmol as a candidate for a #5. I know he is shutting down righties and is perfect for the role he is in, but the guy has been lights out for a while now. Wasn't he starting in A and AA last year and shutting everybody down? Lefties included?
2005-04-26 23:15:02
244.   LAT
Having put my firm in row CC and having sat there last night watching Plaschke interview people, I have to say his article is on the money. (no pun intended)
2005-04-26 23:21:17
245.   Eric L
re #243

Schmoll has started a grand total of 1 game in his professional career, at Ogden (Rookie level) in 2003.

He has pitched in a total of 72 games in his career.

2005-04-26 23:44:21
246.   Jim Hitchcock
And this guy wanted to be Commissioner of Baseball:

http://tinyurl.com/8ojxt

2005-04-26 23:47:20
247.   Strike4
Wow, Plaschke disses the seating additions. Who wants to worry all game about an unseen line drive foul ball coming at you? I seem to remember old Dodger p.r. about no obstructed view seats. Guess that's over. Old Muni in Cleveland had the flat first deck where you contended with structural poles and fans' heads, plus you were a mile from the field. If I remember, Fenway and Yankee Stadium have some obstructed views too, well away from the field.
2005-04-26 23:54:46
248.   Landonkk
re #245

well that aswers that..

still like the guy.

2005-04-27 00:09:43
249.   Eric L
Schmoll was a starter in college, but I think that Vin (or maybe Steiner) said that he wasn't very good, and his stats back this up.

He started fooling around with the sidearm delivery and did a lot better his senior year (this is all from memory, so I'm sorry if I'm incorrect on this).

I don't want to step on Mr. Enders' Schmoll fact of the day, but I thought I would throw this little factoid out there..

In 84.2 innings (Vero and J-ville), he didn't allow at homerun.

2005-04-27 00:12:08
250.   Eric L
"A homerun" that should be. I should have added a "last year" as well. I guess this is my brain telling me that I should go to bed....
Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2005-04-27 00:52:15
251.   bokonon42
L.A. Times reporting that Gagne could be back in less than two week's time. (last item)

http://tinyurl.com/2ldan

Also says that Antonio Perez could be back in about three weeks. Will the Dodger's really go with 12 pitchers all season? Wasn't that just a stop gap till Gagne and Alverez recovered? If they go back to 11, which three pitchers get the boot?

2005-04-27 06:45:34
252.   adamclyde
Hey folks - first time poster here... long time dodger fan. I'm now out here in the pre-1957 home of the dodgers. Question about a post very early in this thread - does anyone know if the MLB.com Audio Pass is a Vin Scully broadcast, or some random announcer from MLB? Worth subscribing to if it is Vin.

Bummer about last nights game. If we get 11 hits again tonight, we'll win. All praise for Choi.

2005-04-27 07:26:56
253.   Daniel Zappala
The Audio Pass is the Dodgers radio broadcast. Sometimes in the early innings Vin Scully is on, but usually it is their other radio announcers (Steiner, Monday, sometimes Al Downing).
2005-04-27 08:46:27
254.   Im So Blue
If you choose the MLB.com Audio for KFWB (Dodger home station), you'll get Vin for the first 3 innings. It's a simulcast with TV.

Vinny does all home games, and road games in the NL West. He usually doesn't go on the road trips to the Midwest or East Coast. Last year he made an exception for the Dodgers' first trip to Boston.

The other radio announcers are Charley Steiner, Rick Monday, Al Downing and Steve Lyons.

More info at: http://dodgerthoughts.baseballtoaster.com/archives/17148.html

2005-04-27 10:11:34
255.   Stefan
Does anyone have an explanation for the booing of Green this week? I'm a D-Backs fan/blogger, so I'm biased, of course, but Green had some great seasons (and a couple not-so-great ones) for the Dodgers, was a solid community guy, and didn't want to be traded. I'm totally mystified here.

By the way, Green isn't getting paid $16 M this year; it's $10.5 M -- he renegotiated that part, too.

We're not keen on that Green extension, given the D-Back-ian logjam at RF and 1B, but I think it's safe to say that we'll get our money's worth out of the $500,000 we'll pay out of our own pocket for Green in 2005.

2005-04-27 11:25:46
256.   Jim Hitchcock
Does anyone have an explanation for the booing of Green this week?

Simple. A certain percentage of attendees at sporting events are classless boobs. They think it's neat to boo.

Green, OTOH, always had class to spare. I doubt it bothers him that much. One would have to learn to expect that kind of thing.

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