If Bradley and Ledee are allowed to play every day than that eliminates 2/3 of the Jasons from the outfield and turns our team into something halfway decent. I realize that we probably won't win the division, but I wouldn't mind winning a couple of games and making it interesting.

In two weeks we could have Bradley and Valentin, which in our current state will probably be our #3 and 5 or 6 hitters. This is the ideal lineup (though unlikely due to Tracy's opinions on the matter).
Perez (until he cools off)
Choi
Bradley (Bradley could be moved to 4th to keep up the L/R alternation)
Kent
Werth
Valentin
Phillips
Ledee
Izzy/Robles

Evidently I thought we were playing in the AL, this is what I meant
Perez (LF/3B)
Choi (1B)
Bradley (CF)
Kent (2B)
Werth/Ledee (RF/LF)
Valentin(3B)
Phillips(C)
Izzy/Robles(SS)

Half the team can play multiple positions, so I am sure it could be worked out. While the above lineup isn't great at least it has the possibilty of scoring runs up and down the lineup as opposed to Grabbo-Repko-Pitcher like last night.

Is anyone here? Can I blog for the leadup homer?

Jon is sneaking in the game chat early to beat the heat.

Yeah... Bradley and Valentin should help our line-up a lot. Not sure if I'd have Choi bat 2nd (I'm fairly certain his good numbers at 2nd are simply because that's where he usually starts and if he batted in a different spot he'd do just as well), but line-up order doesn't matter that much so yeah. Hopefully Bradley and Valentin can give us some hope.

(I'm now in the depression stage)

Tracy, DePodesta and McCourt will be guests on KFWB's Dodger Talk at noon today.

Tracy and DePo together... hmm. It'd be nice if somebody would ask them a controversial question...

Minor League Update
Statistical summary format is AVG/OBP/SLG for hitters and ERA/IP/K/BB for pitchers.

Las Vegas 51s (AAA):
The 51s won 7 - 4 over Tucson.

The 51s two top hitters, Brian Myrow and Norihiro Nakamura, each homered in the contest. Nakamura went 2 for 4 with a double, a homerun, and 2 runs scored (.290/.351/.576). Myrow went 2 for 3 with a homerun, a walk, 2 runs scored, and 2 RBIs (.284/.401/.529). Second baseman Willy Aybar went 1 for 4 with a run scored and an RBI (.301/.362/.443). Left fielder Henri Stanley went 1 for 4 with a run scored (.281/.356/.506). Stanley, a 27 year old left-handed outfielder, is not a prospect, but he could provide some value by replacing Grabowski on the major league team.

Wilson Alvarez started the game and pitched another inning of relief in his third rehab appearance. Alvarez allowed 1 hit and 1 walk while striking out 2 (2.35/7.2/9/2). Alvarez's last appearance was on July 9th, so he may still need to work his way up to regular appearances before rejoining the Dodgers. Left-hander Eric Stults pitched 4.1 innings of relief, allowing 4 runs (all earned) on 7 hits and 4 walks with 2 strikeouts (5.25/24.0/20/11). The performance was Stult's worst since joining the 51s. Twenty-five year old right-hander Alfredo Gonzalez and 27 year old right-hander Mike Neu combined to pitch 3.2 scoreless innings of relief to finish the game. Gonzalez pitched 1.2 innings, allowing 1 walk while striking out 2 (4.62/39.0/22/21). Neu pitched the final 2 innings for the save, allowing 1 hit while striking out 2 (3.57/35.1/28/29).

Jacksonville Suns (AA):
No game scheduled.

Vero Beach Dodgers (High-A):
The Dodgers crushed Clearwater 14 - 3.

The Dodgers had 24 men on base in the game (17 hits, 5 walks, and 2 errors). Every Dodger starter reached base at least once, and only center fielder Jamie Hoffman and left fielder Anthony Raglani were held hitless. Hoffman went 0 for 4 with a walk (.226/.242/.226). Hoffman was a third base prospect last year but was moved to center field due to the Dodgers minor league depth at third base. Raglani went 0 for 3 with 2 walks and 2 runs scored (.284/.389/.436). Shortstop Tony Abreu went 3 for 6 with a double, a triple, 2 runs scored, and 3 RBIs (.324/.349/.443). Abreu was just selected as the Dodgers' Minor League Player of the Month for June. In June, Abreu compiled a batting line of .453/.467/.593 in 20 games and 86 at-bats. Second baseman Jimmy Rohan went 3 for 6 with 2 doubles, 2 runs scored and 3 RBIs (.271/.308/.365). Rohan has received limited playing time as a 21 year old backup middle-infielder. Right fielder Matt Kemp continued his hot hitting, going 3 for 5 with a double, a run scored, and 2 RBIs (.290/.328/.593). Since June 1st, Kemp has raised his batting average from .254 to .290. Twenty one year old third baseman Cole Bruce went 3 for 5 with a homerun, 2 runs scored and 2 RBIs (.286/.339/.510). Bruce has had limited at-bats on the season between Columbus and Vero Beach. First baseman Cory Dunlap went 2 for 5 with 2 doubles, a run scored, and an RBI (.278/.375/.373). Twenty-three year old catcher Edwin Bellorin went 1 for 2 with 2 walks, a triple, a run scored, an an RBI (.272/.308/.385). Twenty-four year old designated hitter Mayke Cabrera went 2 for 4 with 3 runs scored an an RBI (.281/.384/.292). Neither Bellorin or Cabrera are considered prospects.

Starter Brian Pilkington pitched well, but was not dominating, allowing 2 runs (both earned) on 4 hits (2 solo homeruns) and 2 walks while striking out 2 (3.90/57.2/35/9). Reliever Justin Simmons pitched 1 inning, allowing 1 run (earned) on 2 hits with 1 strikeout (3.58/37.2/33/19). Reliever Mark Alexander finished the game, pitching one scoreless inning with 1 walk and no strikeouts (1.67/43.0/64/17). At 24 years old, Alexander appears ready for a promotion to Jacksonville.

Columbus Catfish (Low-A):
The Catfish won 6 - 3 over Greenville.

Second baseman Travis Denker provided the big blow, with a 3-run homerun in the 1st inning. Denker's homerun was his only hit in 5 at-bats (.285/.400/.513). Denker's 18th homerun on the season moved him into 4th place tie in the Sally League homerun race. Recently promoted right fielder Sergio Pedroza went 2 for 5 with a run scored (.375/.444/.375). Third baseman Blake Dewitt went 1 for 4 with a walk and a run scored (.270/.319/.422). Shorstop David Nicholson went 3 for 5 with a run scored (.263/.315/.335). Left fielder Lucas May went 2 for 4 with a double, a homerun, and 2 runs scored (.234/.271/.362). Twenty-year old May was an 8th round draft pick in the Dodgers 2003 draft and was primarily a shorstop coming into this season.

Twenty-one year old right-hander Zachary Hammes picked up his 6th start of the season. Hammes pitched 6 scoreless innings, allowing 6 hits and 3 walks while striking out 4 (4.50/56.0/44/41). Reliever Liam O'Flaherty allowed 3 runs (all earned) over 1.2 innings pitched (3.68/7.1/8/6). Twenty year old O'Flaherty was signed as an undrafted free agent in 2002 out of Australia. Brandon Weeden got the save in his first relief appearance. Weeden was extremely impressive, pitching 1.1 perfect innings with 3 strikeouts (5.13/79/70/27). Weeden's career has stalled since joining the Dodgers organization in the Kevin Brown trade. At 21 year ols, Weeden is on his second trip through the Sally Leagu. Hopefully a move to the bullpen can get things going for him.

Ogden Raptors (Rookie):
The Raptors won 8 - 4 over Helena.

Designated hitter David Sutherland went 3 for 5 with a double, 2 runs scored and an RBI (.449/.524/.517). The extra-base hit is just Sutherland's 4th on the season, but it is his second in two days. Right fielder BJ Richmond went 2 for 5 with a run scored and an RBI (.304/.392/.435). First baseman Jason Mooneyham went 2 for 4 with a homerun, a walk, and 3 RBIs (.217/.309/367). Yesterday, Rob of 6-4-2 linked to a good human interest story on Mooneyham's big league ambitions (http://www.sltrib.com/sports/ci_2859533). Shortstop Juan Rivera went 0 for 6 with a run scored and a strikeout (.282/.364/.346). Second baseman Jesus Soto went 1 for 4 with a run scored and an RBI (.306/.343/.649). Third baseman Russell Mitchell went 1 for 3 with a double, 2 walks, and a run scored (.320/.343/.649). The walks are really nice to see, as they are only Mitchell's second and third walks in 97 at-bats with the Raptors.

Starting pitcher Cory Wade struggled over 4.1 innings, allowing 4 runs (3 earned) on 9 hits (3 solo homeruns) and a walk with 3 strikeouts (3.86/16.1/12/20). Twenty year old right-hander Jordan Pratt pitched well in relief to earn the win, allowing just 1 hit and 1 walk over 2.2 scoreless innings, while striking out 6 (0.59/15.1/22/4). Pratt was the Dodgers 5th round pick in the 2003 draft out of Central High School in Oregon. Prior to this season, Pratt had struggled for 2 years as a stater in Ogden. The Pioneer League is notoriously tough on high school pitchers due to the high density of college talent. This season, all of the Dodgers top high school pitchers are starting their professional careers in the Gulf Coast League. Reliever Jonathan Meloan pitched a perfect 8th inning with no strikeouts (2.57/7.0/11/2). The Dodgers are using Meloan out of the bullpen due to the high number of innings he pitched with the University of Arizona. After this season, he could go back to starting, although he does project well as an overpowering reliever. Ramon Troncoso pitched a scoreless 9th to finish the game, allowing 1 hit and 1 walk with 1 strikeout (2.38/11.1/12/2).

GCL Dodgers (Rookie):
The GCL Dodgers continued to struggle, losing 4 - 1 to the GCL Marlins.

The Dodgers managed 9 baserunners in the game (8 hits and 1 error), but stranded 7. Catcher Kenley Jansen accounted for the Dodgers only run with a solo homerun in the 5th inning. Overall, Jansen went 2 for 4 adding a double to his homerun (.333/.333/.545). Jansen's two extra-base hits were the Dodgers only two of the game. Third baseman Josh Bell went 2 for 4 with a strikeout (.316/.361/.456). Center fielder Jeremy Brown went 1 for 3 with a strikeout (.286/429/.286). Brown was sent back down from Columbus once Pedroza joined the Catfish. Shorstop Ivan DeJesus went 1 for 4 (.269/.296/.308). Designated hitter Eduardo Perez went 0 for 4 (.311/.415/.422).

The best news of the evening was that reliever Jose "Jumbo" Diaz made his first rehab appearance with the Dodgers. Diaz is recovering from offseason Tommy John surgery. Prior to his injury, Diaz was hitting up to 99 mph with his fastball. In the game, Diaz started and pitched 1 perfect inning, striking out 1 (0.00/1.0/1/0). Relievers Miguel Sanfler, Jon Haldis, and Kalen Gearhart combined to allow 4 runs (3 earned) over the final 8 innings. Sanfler allowed 1 run (earned) over 4.1 innings on 3 hits and 2 walks with 3 strikeouts (2.04/17.2/17/8). Haldis allowed 1 run (unearned) over 1.2 innings on 1 hit with no walks or strikeouts (3.38/2.2/0/1). Gearhart allowed 2 runs (both earned) over the final 2 innings on 4 hits (1 homerun) and a walk with 1 strikeout (6.43/7.0/4/5).

Someone should call in to find out why Tracy hates Choi and to find out where Tracy and Saenz are registered.

"Hey Trace, you ever think playing Choi (via the pinch hit) once a week is actually hurting his development instead of helping it?"
"Hey DePo, you ever gonna make Tracy start playing Choi every day?"

5 - Dealing with visiting relatives starting tonight ... and so it goes.

Jayson Werth remains a big concern. He repeatedly lets fastballs right down the middle go by, especially first-pitch fastballs with runners on. Last night with the bases loaded, Hawkins gave him cheese just begging to be hit. He let it go.

When the bases are juiced, you have to anticipate a fastball like that, especially on the first pitch. He has done it numerous times this season. Other pitches that are ripe to crush, he fouls off or completely misses. Then he fishes for outside pitches a la the old Beltre.

I don't know if it is a "sophomore jinx" or if he's not 100% or if 2004 was a fluke. But he looks terrible. And their whole OF is just horrid. I am so glad to hear Bradley is returning. I agree that Ledee should be back out there. Tracy seems afraid to extend him, though.

0-2 pitches going for HR's, especially to featherweights like Viqzuel, are just inexcusable. I remember thinking, "Okay, you'd better not give him anything good." Houlton could not have placed that ball any better if it had been on a tee.

13 - Agreed... I could not believe Werth looked at the first 2 pitches. I groaned, but could have easily forgiven the transgression if not for the fact it has become routine. Add to the fact that he struck out in his previous at-bat on a slider in the dirt.... uuurggh!!!

10 -- Repko will be jealous.

Werth, not Houlton, and not Kent, was the goat last night. They put up a graphic that his 16 HRs last year was third-highest among rookies. Scoreboard guy, stop living in the past.

From where I sat, Schmoll appeared to be, uh, this must have been a hallucination, overwhelming. It was nice to see. He was pitching against the Giants, however.

If Jon has in-law business this weekend, he should put up all 3 game chats now.

The readers of DT should flood the show and try to get a couple of questions in.

The questions that absolutely have to be asked are:

Why doesn't Choi play more, and why bother pinch hitting him when he seems to not do well at all in that role?

Why is Erickson on the roster?

Why does Grabbowski start over Ledee?

#18: I would skip the last question and go straight to "Why is Grabowski on the roster?"

Random Dodger game callback

July 15, 1947

In an historic season filled with revolutionary changes and great success, the Brooklyn Dodgers really stunk on this particular Tuesday getting swept at Ebbets Field by the woebegone Pittsburgh Pirates, 12-4 and 9-3 before a crowd of over 25,000 people. The losses dropped Brooklyn's record to 48-34, still good enough for first place by 2 ½ games over the Boston Braves.

Harry Taylor got knocked around for the Dodgers in the first game, giving up seven runs in just 2 innings of work. Rex Barney, Hugh Casey, and George Dockins tried to stop the bleeding, but the Pirates salted the game away when Wally Westlake belted a grand slam off of Casey in the seventh. Westlake drove in seven runs in the first game.

In the nightcap, Joe Hatten was the sacrificial lamb for the Pirate hitters. He gave up all 9 runs in just 3 2/3 innings of work, including a 2-run homer to Pittsburgh's Jimmy Bloodworth. The Dodgers stranded 15 runners in the nightcap, 24 for both games.

1947 would be an historic year for the Dodgers, this dismal performance notwithstanding. It was, of course, the year that Jackie Robinson broke into the majors, ending decades of de facto segregation in the sport. In his rookie year, Robinson, playing first base for the first time in his career, batted. 297 with a .383 OBP. He led the NL in stolen bases with 29. Meanwhile, the Dodgers would win the National League pennant with a 94-60 record. Robinson would win the first ever Rookie of the Year award in the majors. (There was just one awarded in 1947 and 1948.)

But the season started out roughly when Commissioner Happy Chandler suspended Dodgers manager Leo Durocher for the season for his association with gamblers. Clyde Sukeforth filled in for two games (and went 2-0) before Branch Rickey brought back his old friend, Burt Shotton to manage the team. The Dodgers would lose to the Yankees in the World Series in seven games. The Dodgers lost the first two at Yankee Stadium, but rallied to take two of three at Ebbets Field.

Returning to Yankee Stadium, the Dodgers won Game 6 by a score of 8-6 before losing Game 7, 5-2 as Joe Shea pitched five innings of shutout relief to close it out.

Besides Robinson, the Dodgers had quite a powerful offense. The double play combination of Eddie Stanky and Pee Wee Reese had a tremendous year. Reese led the NL in walks with 104 and Stanky had 103. Reese put up an OBP of .414 while Stanky had a .373 OBP. The Dodgers didn't have much power as Robinson and Reese tied for the team lead in homers with 12.

21-year old righthander Ralph Branca was the ace of the staff, going 21-12 with a 2.67 ERA. Hatten was 17-8 and Casey was 10-4 in relief and had 18 saves.

Despite the pennant, Rickey knew he needed to retool his team somewhat. He had some players, like outfielder Dixie Walker, who were uncomfortable playing with Robinson. Walker was sent to Pittsburgh in the offseason. Stanky was traded to Boston. This enabled the Dodgers to move Robinson to second base, a better position for him and allow a backup catcher named Gil Hodges take over first base. And another catcher in the minors, Roy Campanella, seemed ready for a callup. And outfielder Duke Snider probably deserved more playing time in center field.

Durocher would return in 1948, but there were to be many more changes in the borough of Brooklyn that year.

Thanks to the NY Times, BaseballReference.com and Retrosheet

people PLEASE call in. i'd love to hear some good questions asked. especially regarding choi.

Yes. Anybody in socal with a phone. Please please.

I won't be able to hear the interview, will someone post a link or a transcript after it is over?

#23: KFWB has a web broadcast linked from their website, http://www.kfwb.com/.

"...like outfielder Dixie Walker, who were uncomfortable playing with Robinson."

Now that's an understatement. As I read the history, Walker tried to lead a players' refusal to play.

(Werth) repeatedly lets fastballs right down the middle go by, especially first-pitch fastballs with runners on.

The Todd Zeile school of hitting.

Yet Walker eventually returned to the Dodgers as a coach.

This joint appearance has a whiff of desperation about it. Not that desperation isn't called for.

28 - maybe even acceptance so they can expound upon realistic goals and objectives for the rest of this season and next.

10 - I think the Ja(y)sons Club should throw a big bachelor party for Tracy... it's the least they can do.

26 - The Todd Zeile school of hitting.

Now I remember who my least favorite Dodger of the near-past is...

Need to post for the cycle... sorry!

#9 - Sign me up as the first member of the Jumbo Diaz fan club. What's his ETA? 2009? I'll be waiting.

I was at the game yesterday, and I thought Kent's shot in the 9th was gone, but the air at Dodger Stadium push it back. Maybe Werth should take a couple days off, because he is not hitting the ball. Also D.J. Houlton should've thrown some pitch off the plate and not down broadway to Vizquel. Hopefully these 5 loses in a row are wake up call to them and maybe when Bradley and Valentin come back, they will be back in the geoove of things, like they were in the start of the season.

expound

Sadly, I suspect that exposition will be at a minimum.

But it doesn't matter. I'm taking the kids to go see Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. Sitrick & Co. will have to find me some other way.

Is it Werth It?
Tracking down the travails of the Dodgers struggling outfielders:
July 6
9th inning, Strikes out against Dan Miceli of Colorado
July 7
1st inning, Walks against Joe Kennedy of Colorado
2nd inning, Grounds into force play against Kennedy
4th inning, Strikes out looking against Kennedy
6th inning, Walks against Marcus Carvajal
9th inning, Strikes out swinging against Brian Fuentes
July 8
2nd inning, Strikes out swinging against Roger Clemens
4th inning, Walks against Clemens
6th inning, Flies out against Clemens
8th inning, Grounds out against Dan Wheeler
July 9
1st inning, Strikes out swinging against Roy Oswalt with two on
4th inning, Strikes out looking against Oswalt with runner on
6th inning, Flies out to center with runner on
7th inning, Strikes out swinging against Chad Qualls with two on
July 10
2nd inning, Grounds out to third against Brandon Backe
4th inning, Strikes out swining against Backe
6th inning, Grounds out to catcher against Backe
July 14
2nd inning, Strikes out swinging against Jason Schmidt with runner on
4th inning, Walks against Schmidt
6th inning, Strikes out swinging against Schmidt with runner on
7th inning, Strikes out swinging against LaTroy Hawkins with two runners on

34 - Definitely in denial!

Houlton should have thrown his pitch down North Broadway, which has a lot of curves in it, rather than South Broadway which is pretty straight.

#33: Diaz was signed as an amateur free agent in 2001. Last year at age 20, he dominated Low-A competition in Columbus before being promoted to Vero Beach. His

Diaz (2004 A): 2.12 ERA with 59 Ks, 12 BBs, and 1 HR in 34.0 IP.
Diaz (2004 A+): 1.64 ERA with 15 Ks, 5 BBs, and 0 HRs in 11.0 IP.

Assuming he gets back to form and stays healthy, 2008 or 2009 seems like a good estimate. It could be a little sooner since he's a reliever.

36 - Some one in L.A. should call and ask Tracy...

exactly, i posted on here months ago that i do not understand why Werthless is in there all the time with no problems and choi can't play. i mean what gives.

36 - So a young player had a bad 21-at-bat stretch, with an especially high number of strikeouts. Many are arguing that there are fundamental flaws in his approach at the plate, such as taking too many good pitches to hit. However, this young player has shown the potential for some power in the past.

Sounds like a description of Choi just as much as Werth. Shame on JT for giving one the benifit of the doubt and not the other, but shame on a few posters here for arguing or implying that Werth should be benched while Choi should be allowed to develop by playing every day (especially given the current state of the outfield versus the infield). For the record, I would be for starting both players.

A non-Korean should ask the Choi question. I would more than love to do so myself, but if you heard last night on Dodger Talk, I made my piece known to A Martinez....

Jibin from Buena Park

I have to admit that I thought Werth would come around and perform at least as well as last year... what really burns me is Tracy's apparent capriciousness on the subject. He lets the Jasons continue to suffer; but Choi, oh no, he doesn't handle that arm angle well... what's up with that?!

Apropos of nothing: Team Depo is headed off to London and Prague for the next week. Tell ya what - I'll take this lousy Dodger juju with me, and dump it over the North Atlantic. I'll come home next Sunday night to a 9-game winning streak. Or something.

Any LA-ers sign up to call yet? Us out-of-towners are very curious.

42 - shame on a few posters here for arguing or implying that Werth should be benched while Choi should be allowed to develop by playing every day (especially given the current state of the outfield versus the infield)

I think you have misinterpreted the intent here... as have you, everyone is really questioning Tracy's unabashed biases and preferences with no good supporting arguments either way.

Also realize that we have fewer outfield than 1B options. We can stick a few different players at 1B, but not in the OF. That's got to be the reason Werth can be allowed to slump: no alternatives. Whether benching Choi is right or WRONG, we have a few other guys that can play there, too.

42 & 47 - they should both be benched...let's play a lineup of just 6 players

DEREK LOWE WATCH.

When will he win another game for the Dodgers?

as soon a a few more come off the DL

50 - soon after he gets to the 5th inning

DEREK LOWE WATCH.

When will he win another game for the dodgers?

It will take flawless defense to have a chance.

I was more attracted to the "Is it Werth it?" pun than anything else.

54 - that pun wasn't werthy of comment

Wonder if Depo supplies Tracy with the stats to generate his lineups and in-game strategy or Tracy uses his own program. Obviously it's not the same program or stats being used.

55 - No pun intended?

56 - Correct... Tracy uses his post game statements and rationales from the previous game to construct the current games lineup.

58 - I meant to add that's why no understands them.

Dodgers vs. Noah Lowry
Izturis 0 for 5
Kent 1 for 3, HR
Saenz 0 for 3, 2 K
Weaver, 0 for 2, 2 K
Werth, 1 for 2, HR, K

Giants vs. Derek Lowe
Alou, 0 for 4
Cruz, 5 for 22
Durham 4 for 15
Feliz 1 for 4
Matheny 1 for 4
Sanchez 1 for 12
Snow 2 for 6
Tucker 6 for 16, 1 HR
Vizquel 6 for 23

Must... resist... posting... for... cycle... twice...

Alrighty, Jim, let's hear your Choi rationale...

60 - so what you are indicating is that Choi won't start cause he has no history with Lowry and will thus be unfamiliar with his pitching style, and further that Werth will bat cleanup cause he is clearly the most successful against him

Improvement of Repko? Giving him at-bats? Then why do you pinch-hit for him in the 8th inning?

60 - and that Izturis will bat leadoff cause he is due...and Robles needs a rest cause he is so tired from running the bases

"No, I want guys to be in the clubhouse hugging each other."

63 - Hopefully will provide direct proof of my theorem on the JT Lineup Choosing Method in post #58.

Any updates on the KFWB chat?

So far only a question about the field sight line? My feeling is that the callers are screened to ask Mickey Mouse questions... and then A Martinez asked a question rather than fielding another call

i say someone call in, pose a mickey mouse question until you're on the air and then ask your real one.

20 minutes... and 1 question

Questions to get one's self on air:

"Jim, how is it that you are able to squeeze so much out of the lineups you are given?"

"Jim, how great is a guy like Repko to have around the clubhouse?"

"Jim, how bad does it hurt to see Bradley go down to injury after he apparantly turned his life around and became a model citizen?"

...and so on...

70 - nice try...that is why they delay their broadcasts

Would that be conceivable that you could do something like that?

I've been on record to say....

How much do they delay them by?

BTW did anyone just hear the ridiculous start to his answer by Tracy. It was so long and convoluted I can't even remember or imitate it.

I have no idea what Tracy is talking about right now.

Wow.... Tracy is talking about moving Jeff Kent to first base permanently...

Any Choi questions on the KFWB chat yet?
I guess they're screening all the calls very carefully.

The chat is just another public relation effort to keep us interested and they will not field any REAL CALLS.

its a 5 to 7 second delay at the least, sometimes more

77 - I'm not sure I entirely disagree with the move... we might even get Kent to extend another year or two.

Depo is just waiting for Dodgers to fall out of the race so that he can start selling and fire Tracy probably at end of season. It's just taking so long because SD keeps losing also.

Somebody just called Jeff Weaver our ace.

82 - I'll assume that is not a direct quote from the KFWB chat...

Will there be any questions on the young man from South Korean?

It's better not to talk about questions that deal with the vicinity of the subject of the nature that best represents the issues.

--Sign Jeff Weaver to a long-term contract?? What the?

--Tracy: Jayson Werth is up there.. HUGE JAYSON WERTH fan... he's going up there... he's not having a lot of fight in him... what is your input on that?

Well, you have to keep in mind like we were talking about earlier... back on the 2nd of march by AJ Burnett... this guy was a key component winning last year. Jayson werth has been running up an uphill battle since injury. As easy it is to like to think to come back from minor leagues and pick up left off year ago, the likelihood, one in a MILLION as evidenced by the fact when unfortunately he counted for 4 runs... all the things Werth is dealing with is mechanical... there is no one that is "paining" more than Werth when they walk Antonio Perez is intentionally walked.... Werth is not 29,30,31... he's 23 but one of the more experienced guys on the team.

haha funny... they're talking about all the Jasons on the team

Tracy has very short memory with certain players but he has very long term memory with other players. Is he schizophrenic maybe?

Also Depo is so great at talking from both sides of him mouth. I think he might be in the wrong line of work.

All J's... wow... how great... I can be on the team because my name starts with a J.

This conversation is insulting to true fans.

I'm not sure what all of you were expecting from this "conversation"

Tracy is an excellent excellent manager... Wow....

it's easy to look back... this guy should be playing first... Tracy is doing well...
DePodesta is doing well... McCourt puts his money in his mouth.... I think they're doing a good job.... long-term perspective... a little bit of a challenge... this isn't.... this is Los Angeles....

Sounded like Jim Tracy's son

Tracy probably spends hours before each game going through all different permutations in order to come up with a lineup that will confuse the other team.

During games, Tracy cannot adjust or make changes if things do not go according to his pregame scenario.

I'm expecting at least one real question.

Why does Tracy use "hell of a lot" so frequently? I'm surprised that TV and Radio lets him say that so often.

Heart surgery? I think a heart surgeon could do better than Tracy.

what a waste of time on the air (complete fluff). Someone needs to get DT an hour a week on KFWB for some intelligent baseball discussion. I'd look forward to Fearing Blue's "State of The Farm" segment.

See Post #9

Jon's posting everything really early with visiting in-laws. Somehow it doesn't impress your mother-in-law to excuse yourself for several hours to chat with people on a computer about baseball.

96 - its okay, as he gets older, he will find nothing impresses your mother in law, so he might as well chat online about baseball

92 - its PR fluff, don't expect any more than that...you don't seriously believe they are going to tell the mass media who and what and when, do you?

Do you really think that Depo and Tracy respect each other or actually despise each other? This year's roster moves and game strategy totally conflict each other's philosophy. If Depo continues to get the players that play according to his philosophy, then he needs to get a manager who will have the same philosophy. Tracy is more retro and old school which does not mesh well with Depo.

"Despise" is a pretty strong word. They may disagree, but neither person says anything bad about the person publicly. DePodesta doesn't second-guess Tracy in public and Tracy doesn't complain about DePodesta either.

I think they are just two guys who work together. They may part ways, but I doubt it will be like Bill Russell or Davey Johnson leaving.

McCourt just said "It's all about fans". If that's the case, don't we deserve better product unless McCourt WON'T or CAN'T pay to put better product.

Well, the chat is finally over and I can't seem to remember anything they said.

101 - We may "deserve" better product, but you can't argue completely that he did not try to put together a winning team... it's the injuries.

103. I guess for this year, we can use "injuries" as excuse. Curious to see what will happen this off season.

That darn McCourt should pony up the money to make JD Drew, Milt, Odalis, Cesar, and Valentin bionic men. Then he would show the LA fans that he really does want to put a better product on the field, regardless of money.

101 - I don't mean to defend or condemn McCourt...but...

WON'T? it may be a bit much to expect the Dodgers to have been prepared for the rash of injuries they have faced to date

CAN'T? don't buy into the LA Times' writers constant belittling of McCourt's finances...they don't know any more than we do about his holdings

I think we lost the first game of the season to SF and then went 12 - 1... maybe we can start the second half the same way (optimism dashed with a bit of denial).

107 - we didn't have Repko in CF on opening day, for example

Since I can't watch tonight's game, the question is:
Do I bother to record it on my DV-R to watch late tonight?

Tomorrow afternoon, I will be checking to see if the Curse of Jason Ellison still holds up.

Happy Friday, all. Well, sorta. Over the AS break I was really missing the Dodger games, and wondering if I was optimistic or masochistic for it. But last night's game? Ouch. (Not sure where I fall on the 5 stages, currently...resignation, maybe.) I was at the As game watching Harden toss a perfect game up to the 8th inning, and following the Dodgers game on my cell, but of course the cell didn't explain things like Penny being thrown out. I had to read last night's game thread this morning for those details!

Speaking of being at last night's As game, I get very nice seats through the radio station I work for - section 120, row 16, right along the third base line. I have someone to go to tonight's game with, but I have an extra ticket available for Saturday's game and for Sunday's game. Is anyone interested? Vishal? Berkeley Doug? The ticket(s) are free. (And for the prurient-minded, no, I'm not trolling for a date. :P Well, unless it were Bob, but he's in SoCal.)

One of the reasons, by the way, that I'm thrilled to see Harden, Haren, and Blanton doing so well is because I keep hoping that'll make Beane willing to trade Zito to the Dodgers. (I certainly wouldn't mind us getting Harden or Haren, but Beane isn't going to give up either of those two.)

It must have been the gigantic red fanny pack, Christina?

Baseball America just released their mid-season prospect rankings. It's an subscription article, so I'll just give the higlights.

Stayed about the same:
Joel Guzman (#6 overall)

Moving up or into the top 100:
Chad Billingsley (#7 overall)
Jonathan Broxton
Andy LaRoche (#12 overall)
Russell Martin
Justin Orenduff
Chuck Tiffany

Moving down and possibly out of the top 100:
Edwin Jackson
James Loney
Greg Miller

Of the 10 Dodgers prospects mentioned in the article, only Chuck Tiffany and Greg Miller are not with Jacksonville. Wow.

111 - hee. Your impressive recall of Dodgers history, your sense of humor, and the way you write do not begin to make up for the giant red fanny pack.

However, your cat, on the other hand, does.

Guys, let me explain how it works for a woman.

Owning a cat - 5 points
Owning a cat with medical problems - 10 points
Taking said cat to a multitude of doctors, asking around for advice about said cat, etc. - JACKPOT

Er, I should post about something Dodger-related. Let's see, a few days ago I saw a poster wondering why women would take Edwards over Choi. I can't explain that one, since I myself would personally take Choi before any other Dodger on the roster. Damn you, JT, for reducing my Choi-viewing time so severely. Sigh.

this is from the BA chat when someone asked manuel why he picked billingsley over cain.

John Manuel: Thanks Chris. Billingsley and Stewart are probably the two players I went out on a limb the most for. I am on record as being a big Matt Cain fan but I couldn't ignore the torrent of scouts praising Billingsley anymore. The secondary numbers tell a different story, Cain's command has gone backward just a tad this year (not that I'm off the bandwagon), while Billingsley has made excellent progress, throwing quality strikes and really shoring up the biggest weakness he had. He's got power (up to 95 consistently), two breaking balls that at times are plus pitches (the slider's made real progress), a solid changeup and he's learning to pitch. His upside is scary, and it's why I think he's the best pitching prospect in the minor leagues not named Felix.

so everyone can just stop putting billingsley into any trade proposals now okay?

112. Can you give us the rankings for the others like Broxton, Martin, etc.

Do we have the most players in the top 100?

115 - does this ruin your double-super secret plan?

Once Bradley and Valentin are back, how about the following lineups:

VS. RHP:
Izturis (SS) (There's really no use fighting it.)
Choi (1B)
Kent (2B)
Bradley (CF)
Valentin (3B)
Werth (LF)
Repko (RF)
Phillips (C)

VS. LHP
Izturis (SS)
Perez (3B)
Kent (2B)
Bradley (CF)
Saenz (1B)
Werth (LF)
Phillips (C)
Repko (RF)

Hee Seop Choi does well when he bats second, when he starts at 1B, and when he faces RHP. Let's give him the opportunity for the trifecta. At least neither of these two lineups would be embarassing to run out on the field on a daily basis.

115. Can we just put billingsley into our rotation next year.

118. How about Ledee replacing Werth/Repko against RHP?

I still don't understand why Grabowski is on the team. He should not be on the freakin team! Much less starting! I really don't understand it. It's incredibly frustrating. He starts over Choi? O.K. maybe Choi can't hit left handed pitching well. Well, Grabowski can't hit any kind of pitching. He's hitting .165! He's horrible. I hope tracy puts Edwards in left, perez at 3rd, and starts choi at first. But I know he won't, because he likes to mess with my head. He wants to see how far he can push me with his dumb decisions before I run onto the field on $2 tuesday and strangle him ( you know,just a little). End of rant. sorry guys, I was at the game last night and left incredibly frustrated, apparantly it hasn't gone away.

118 - use your RHP lineup against all comers, except Kent at 1B and Perez at 2B

120 - I'll second that.

121-not to mention Grabowski drove in the first run last night

121. I feel your pain and frustration. This year there has been a lot of decisons that just does not make any sense. Thank God, we have this chat site to keep us sane.

124- the giant's first run also came in on his error.

120 - I'll third that. I'd prefer Ledee in instead of Repko - Werth I'm more willing to give a chance to. I think he'll go on another home run tear as soon as Steve calls him the New Grabowski again.

125- I agree, thank goodness for this site.

126 - so he was 1 up and 1 down...how did Werth do last night?

and on Werth vs Repko, I'll take Repko, he is better defensively

125. I've been watching less and less of the Dodger games this year and instead following this chat site which is infinitely more enjoyable than watching the games.

If anyone wants my cat in order to woo Christina, I can rent her out.

132. Do you have a dog, too? What kind?

I live in an apartment, so just a cat. Whom I'm betting is sleeping on the floor right now in front of a fan.

Bob, do you prefer cats over dogs as pets?

133- I think this heat here in southern cali these days only ads to my frustration.

#116: They only specifically broke down the top 25, of which we have three in the top 12. The rest were listed in various categories (rising, falling, graduating, etc.)

By the way, where's the love for Travis Denker?

more good news on dodger property, luke hochevar wont he roger clemens award for best pitcher in college. yipee!

http://www.clemensaward.com/05winner.html

fearing blue,

BA hates denker, i know it. it sucks. i asked a denker question in the chat and he didnt even answer me.

dont worry, denker will prove all of them wrong and become better than joe morgan.

I like cats personally because I don't want to have a pet I have to take for a walk.

But I appreciate dogs too.

#122: Yuck. Kent looks like he may be worse defensively at 1B than Choi and Perez is definitely worse defensively at 2B than Kent. Additionally, by any evaluation method available, Choi is a better hitter against RHP than Perez.

137 - wonder how much more Boras will want because of that...

#138: I came close to asking a Denker question myself, but by the time I read to the end of the chat, it was done. How can you not like a 19 year old middle-infielder with tremendous plate discipline AND power? They probably don't like his "tools". It's unfortunate that the Dodgers can't promote him to Vero since Player of the Month, Abreu, is blocking his path.

#141: Hochevar certainly will not come cheap and this doesn't help. Fortunately, the Dodgers have a little bit of a leverage in that don't really care if he signs this year. He's already thrown 140+ innings for Tennessee and there's no need to rush him with our system so stacked already.

this is true, BA rates very highly on a players tools than performance when it comes to prospects in the low minors.

maybe they dont like that he is like 5'9 or something. other than that, he must have tremendous batspeed to generate so much power and a great batting eye. oh well.

140-you may say yuck, but MoneyBall values OBP much more than defensive prowess

3 prospects in the top 12, you certainly can't complain about that. When was the last time a team could make that claim? The nearest I can remember would be Texas, with Texeira, Blalock, and Pena; which certainly worked out OK for them.

I presume they didn't previously have Navarro in the top 100, as he was not listed with those dropping. Either way, not a bad guy to have as the 10th to 15th best prospect in the organization.

The three guys listed as falling out of the top 100 are three guys that most teams would still love to have. All three of them have pretty high upside, if they can find a way to stay injury-free for 12 consecutive months.

Take out LaRoche, Guzman, and Billingsly. Given the depth the system has, why not trade 2 of whoever else someone wants for an Adam Dunn? Or add in a couple of the ever-so-coveted an "major league level youngster" like Werth, Brazoban, or Perez, and call it good. We get hitting, and keep the A prospects.

While on the subject of young guys, has Kuo pitched since the arm incident from a couple weeks back? Is he assumed to be fine?

#145: Moneyball is about exploiting inefficiencies in the marketplace to effectively win with lower resources. Recently, defense has been undervalued, which is why the A's have targetted players like Mark Kotsay. Moneyball does not say anything about relative evaluations of OBP vs. defense.

Statistics on the other hand have shown that a player's defensive contribution is on average worth about half as much as a player's offensive contribution (with the ratio obviously varying by position).

All that being said, the problem with your fielding lineup is that it's worse offensively AND defensively.

129= Werth showed a great deal of potential the entire second half of last season. That's more than I can say for either grabowski or repko. And despite his recent slump, werth's numbers are still better than both of the outfield jasons.

Werth= .244/.322/.400 .722 OPS
Repko= .222/.304/.333 .677 OPS
Grabs= .165/.230/.282 .512 OPS

But if scrappyness in your thing, then who am I to stand in the way?

kuo pitched once, then they had thier all star break. AA games resume today, i assume kuo will pitch again sometime this week.

#146: The Diamondbacks have 3 players in the top 20 (Stephen Drew, Carlos Quentin, and Conor Jackson). The Angels and Tigers each have 2 in the top 25. It doesn't look like any other team has more than 1 in the top 25.

#90-
Yeah that was a silly call. In fact, that entire PR gig was kind of silly. I think everyone is dissapointed that there weren't better/more questions.

Caller: "I am sick and tired of so-called Dodger fans criticizing every move you guys make..." [reading his lines from a notecard?]

JT: [agrees with caller, then starts incoherant ramble about a 'heart-surgeon' analogy given to him when he started managing]

"Would it be ridiculous for me to be giving a surgeon advice when he is performing a heart surgery? of course it would..."

[ then relates it to how he knows the team best and how he shouldn't listen to the advice of a heart-surgeon...]

*Ouch. i would really be offended if i were a heart surgeon.*

if BA rated justin upton, he would have been in the top 25 as well, so the dbacks would have 4 in the top 25. pretty darn good.

although, they dont have one pitcher that makes any kind of list.

i would trade a pitching prospect for one of the dbacks hitting prospects.

147 - absolutely. Note that the As also dumped defensive liability Byrnes, who murders LHP, off on Colorado and replaced him with Payton, who admittedly has hit RHP better than Byrnes over the course of his career, but is also a significant defensive upgrade.

Byrnes had the nasty habit of doing exactly what Grabs did last night - scoring a run with his bat, and then giving it right back with his glove. Which is why Beane severely reduced his playing time, and shipped him away as soon as he had Kots signed.

At what level are the DBacks hitting prospects. If they are at AAA, they're playing in Tucson, which I think is THE hitter's park of the PCL.

#146 - Skimming through the old BP's on my desk, here are some impressive top-3's from recent past, along with LA's:

2005...

* LA: 7-Guzman, 20-Billingsly, 34-Aybar
* Anaheim: 4-McPerson, 5-Kotchman, 16-Weaver
* Oakland: 9-Barton, 26-Swisher, 29-Meyer,

2004...

* LA: 6-Jackson, 22-Gutierrez, 25-Loney, 33-Miller
* Anaheim: 14-Kotchman, 18-Mathis, 19-McPherson
* Milwauke: 4-Fielder, 9-Weeks, 20-Hardy

2003...

* LA: 39-Thurston, H.M.-Loney
* San Fransico: 8-Williams, 13-Foppert, 19-Ainsworth
* Cleveland: 4-Martinez, 6-Phillips, 20-Hafner

2002...

* LA: none in top 55!!
* San Diego: 3-Burroughs, 11-Tankersley, 12-Peavy

Conclusion: LA has certainly shown a nice progression from turning one of the worst systems in baseball into one of the best. And with LaRoche added into the mix, I would go out on a limp and say that next years pre-season rankings will show LA among the top 2 or 3 systems in the game, again.

At what level are the DBacks hitting prospects. If they are at AAA, they're playing in Tucson, which I think is THE hitter's park of the PCL.

quentin and conor jackson are. but they both have produced significantly in the lower levels both have awesome k:bb ratios and OBP.

140.
I think Kent ought to get credit for making several 1B plays while at 2B.

In fact, right now Kent is the best defensive player on the field... although Robles did a nice Izturis impression last night... And NOBODY said anything about the bad bounce from the Kent throw into Robles' crotch. Youch--even if it just got tendon.

I'm just hoping tonight we don't lose phillips for throwing his helmet at the ump when he goes for a tucker popup bunt.

#156: I'm hoping for #1 next year. Anaheim is the team ahead of us this year and they've "lost" their top 2 prospects. Casey Kotchman has regressed significantly to the point where people are questioning whether he'll ever be a major league first baseman. Dallas McPherson has been graduated to the majors and will no longer be ranked as a propsect. They still have a great minor league system, but I'd say ours is better.

107--I'm fairly certain Repko started in LF on Opening Day due to Werth's injury. I think he hit a two-run HR. I was there and am picturing it now, unless I'm hallucinating.

BTW, whoever asked if Tracy is schizophrenic because of memory problems, they are not a symptom of schizophrenia. Sorry, but it is one of my pet peeves that schizophrenia is thought to be the same thing as having multiple personalities (which are very, very rare, by the way) or having mood swings. Those three things are all separate disorders.

our positional guys match up very well with the angels. but what separates the two farms is our incredibly deep collection of high cieling pitching talent.

they have santana and weaver.

also, if we continue to suck we will get a top 10 pick in next years draft. maybe then we can get that high cieling polished college hitter i always wanted.

160-I could be wrong, it has to happen some time you know...but I think the bums only scored one run opening day? I'll have to look at the scoreboard tonight for that Repko HR...it was his first major league hit, and everytime he comes up, they remind us of it

Repko played left in the home opener. Can't really tell the difference between him and Werth anymore anyway.

Werth has a moustache

Are you sure it's not a fake? It may be Tracy pulling a Bobby Valentine and putting Repko up in Werth's uniform.

Opening Day lineup for Dodgers
Izturis SS
Choi 1B
Drew RF
Kent 2B
Bradley CF
Valentin 3B
Ledee LF
Phillips C
Lowe P

Repko batted second in the home opener and homered in the first inning off of Rueter. But that was a week later.

That lineup went
Izturis SS
Repko LF
Drew RF
Kent 2B
Bradley CF
Saenz 1B
Nakamura 3B
Phillips C
Weaver P

Werth is a lot taller than Repko.

Repko wears platforms.

And dyes his hair.

Repko moves his arms when he runs. Werth runs like Molly Shannon's character did in "Seinfeld". Or Raquel Welch too.

Repko has the freakiest looking picture on Gameday. Yes, even more so than the Goggles Gang.

171 -- An honor he's taken from dearly departed Cody Ross.

Anyone know who is being sent down if Izturis comes off DL today?

173 - Not Scott Erickson.

Not Jason Grabowski

Trying to guess the starting lineup and the batting order these days is the most exciting part of Dodger games. Also, trying to guess who stays on the roster and who gets sent down is pretty interesting too.

Tracy sure keeps us guessing on his next moves!!!

Anyone interested in starting a contest to see who can guess the lineup most correctly?

Earlier it was stated that's it likely that Osoria is going to the minors.

179. Erickson must be moving up to being a closer soon.

One man's guess
Izturis SS
Robles 3B
Kent 1B
Phillips C
A Perez 2B
Werth RF
Repko CF
Chen LF
Lowe P

May God have mercy on us all.

im sure this has been discussed, but i thought kuo's career is over? someone mentioned above that he is pitching? whats really going on?

if we trade weaver now and save 4 million or whatever he is owed this year, wouldnt that conceivably go towards next years budget? wishful thinking?

Y'know, I think we've been going about this wrong, Steve. I actually think that DePo should sign some sort of statement, in his own blood or whatever, that Erickson is safe for the rest of the season from being sent down.

Then maybe Erickson would stop making sacrifices to the Dark Father each night in exchange for one Dodger after another being injured so that there continues to be a place for him on the roster.

I mean, really, how else do you explain what happened to Wunsch?

181. That seems most logical. But you never know with Tracy what logic he will use tonight. We should put best infield defense as possible considering it's Lowe pitching.

I guess our outfielders must be pretty bad when they all bat at the bottom of the lineup.

183. The way this season has gone, it wouldn't surprise me if Erickson stays on the roster through rest of this season. He might even get a chance to close one game for us before end of this season.

I'm in:
Izturis SS
Repko LF
A Perez 3B
Kent 2B
Saenz 1B
Werth CF
Phillips C
Edwards RF
Lowe P

My hope of Robles seeing any starting time are low.

186. If Tracy has any common sense, he should keep playing Robles until he stops hitting. Wow, that's new one. Edwards in RF. Maybe, it should be Edwards in LF, Repko in CF, Werth in RF.

Izturis, ss
APerez, lf
Kent, 2b
Saenz, 1b
Phillips, c
Werth, rf
Repko, cf
Robles, 3b
Lowe, p

for what it's worth....

188-maybe Robles bats second and the rest move down one....

Then maybe Erickson would stop making sacrifices to the Dark Father each night in exchange for one Dodger after another being injured so that there continues to be a place for him on the roster.

If I were a McCourt critic, I would be pointing out that McCourt is too cheap to admit this mistake, and even eat $200,000 to have Erickson hit the bricks, rather than waste my time talking about Adrian Beltre or Shawn Green.

Considering this white chalk or whatever the hell Depo called his extra money is being unused, Navarro needs to pan out or the Shawn Green trade looks horrible. He would have been a HUGE upgrade over Werth and Co.

Is Depo little gun shy this year after getting so much negative criticism from last year's mid season trade?

#183-

That is the best Erickson theory i've heard... but shouldn't Erickson have sacrificed Gio and Duaner instead of our lefty-guy!? Or are those two unacceptable?

Izturis
Repko
Kent
Saenz
Perez
Werth
Phillips
Edwards
D.J. Houlton in Lowe's Uniform

Repko hits second to bunt. Phillips drops because Saenz plays. No Robles because he is lefty.

191 -- like I said...

192-I don't think DePo cares what we or the media think...any GM who does, could not function as a GM

193 - there's a reason why making deals with the devil is dangerous. There's always that catch...

1. Drew
2. Choi/Saenz Platoon
3. Bradley
4. Kent
5. Green
6. Valentin/Perez Platoon
7. Phillips
8. Izturis

looks so nice.

198 -- yeah, until you get to 9.

Steve, you owe me a new keyboard. LOL

200 -- Actually that lineup looks good until you get about to 4, but my earlier comment makes the point a little more starkly.

Hard to imagine but if we lose tonight we are only .5 game up on SF. We could drop into 4th place by tomorrow.

201 - at least Beltre wasn't included too, that time.

If the Dodgers lose tonight, they will fall into 4th Saturday. That's because I'm going to the game.

The Dodgers will struggle to score 2 runs off of Brett Tomko and will lose when Lance Niekro hits a bases-loaded triple to left.

203 -- Or did you mean Beltran?

Whenever the next collective bargaining agreement deadline is, and we lose a season and a half, those two contracts will be about 75% of the reason, with Magglio Ordonez good for another tenner.

Schmoll and no Sanchez, that is fine with this cowboy. I'd be happy if old Duaner never saw the green grass again. Maybe the Reds could use him! haha.

I'm guessing that Erickson is somehow involved in a bet. DePodesta bet somebody, maybe Logan White or Billy Bean, that he can keep Scott Erickson all the roster all year, and the winner gets $50.

205-Magglio's contract is all incentives, so its not nearly as bad as the others.

whats wrong with 9 in that lineup?? you are forgetting about your man's white talc.

No extra money if Shawn Green is getting paid $1 million a win share.

But I agree, Ordonez's contract is nowhere near as bad as Beltre's. Too bad we couldn't get Adrian to sign with us for that amount.

the problem with 9 in the lineup is that it's Josa Lima. Or Scott Erickson. Or Pat Mahomes.

what are we getting now for 10 million other than great trade gossip with the saved money?

#212 - Derek Lowe and Dioner Navarro.

We get to not pay Shawn Green $16M. And we get Dioner Navarro. Those things are worth $10M combined, easy.

212 -- We are getting the pleasure of not wasting it on Derek Lowe instead of Shawn Green. Really, it's fantastic. That's why DePodesta is "my man." Or something like that.

212 - stubbs, eventually that $10 million will be used for someone who's worth it. Just because we have the extra money doesn't mean we should spend it immediately for the sake of spending it. But when the right deal comes along, it'll sure be nice to have that money handy.

215 -- I miswrote that. It should have said

"We are getting the pleasure of wasting it on Derek Lowe, instead of not wasting it on Shawn Green."

Proceed.

215 -- I miswrote that. It should have said

"We are getting the pleasure of wasting it on Derek Lowe, instead of not wasting it on Shawn Green."

Proceed.

Nope, that's not what I meant either. Shawn Green makes me so angry, I can't think straight. Somebody else explain it, because I can't.

211-how do u figure? we only saved 6 million on green. we would still have Lowe just no money to spend now. im sure no one here will agree, but we arent trading for anyone better than Shawn Green right now, plus green wouldnt have cost us any prospects save for Dioneer Navarro. Dioneer Navarro wouldnt come close to netting Adam Dunn.

Christina-
Shawn Green's contract was up this year before the Dbacks extended him, so this is a one year thing.

http://tinyurl.com/brd9w

Hey folks- this kind of defies description but I thought I'd share.

stubbs - that didn't mean that, at the time the decision was made to ship Green off, that DePo didn't feel that during the course of THIS season there would be something better to use the money that we would otherwise have spent on Green for. Instead the money could have been used at midseason to get that "one last piece" for a run at the playoffs. That's why it's nice to go into a season with some cash left to play with rather than having spent it all before the season for the sake of spending it.

Of course, as we all know, injuries have severely screwed up the plan for this season.

223-true, hindsight is 20/20 but there were plenty of people who were skeptical while it was happening.

224 - and just because some people were skeptical at the time, doesn't mean that they were right.

Do you really think that this season, as it has gone, would have been significantly salvaged by having Green on the roster? After all, your proposed lineup - leaving aside the problem of who we would have pitching - includes two power bats who are currently injured. So even if we had Green, that isn't the line-up we'd be seeing actually being put out on the field. So the one-year retaining of Green would be, really, wasted money.

224 - I don't know what that means. What does people's impressions of the deal have anything to do with the value of the deal itself?

IOW, we're still better off having that money in reserve for a deal that will help 2006.

222- !!!

226-just that it wasnt a clear cut no brainer and as it turn out, we would have been better off imo having Shawn Green and less flexibility this year than Dioneer Navarro and 6 million to spend right now.

226 - I think stubbs is arguing that because of the way this season has gone, we made a mistake in not keeping Shawn Green, and that had we known beforehand how the season would go, we would have kept Shawn Green, and that therefore the people who were skeptical at the time were right.

I disagree with all three points.

227-that i agree with, we should be dumping right now for 2006-Saenz, Weaver, Alvarez??,whoever. Id venture to say that an expiring Shawn Green right now would be worth at least Dioneer Navarro if we were dumping him now.

229 - but why? Again, your lineup is not what we would be seeing out on the field. We're not going to make the playoffs this year, barring a ridiculous run on our part and a nuclear meltdown on San Diego's. Could Green have made such a significant difference that we'd make the playoffs, and more than that, the World Series rather than an early first-round exit?

I find it unlikely.

Green instead of Werth this year would have been a significant upgrade...can anyone here calculate?

Would the Dodgers have signed Drew if they planned on keeping Green?

233 - you're ducking my question, stubbs.

I think Shawn Green is better than 6 million in "Wiggle Room" and Dioneer Navarro. If your theory is that having the prospect and money is better to make adjustments midseason, i disagree. In this sellers market, u arent getting a better bat than Shawn Green for 6 million (lawton, Wilson-none of these types are better), plus u are giving up prospects to add someone now, which cancels out Navarro. Plus u have Green the whole year rather than this mythical addition after the break.

But again, keeping Green would in all probability kept us from Drew and Lowe, not to mention Navarro (etc).

I loved Green as a Dodger, but his contract was an astonishing albatross, especially considering his diminished play in recent years.

why couldnt we have signed Lowe and Drew with Green? I dont buy this. Only thing signing Green costs us is the wiggle room now.

236 - one more time. Would we have made the playoffs, let alone deep into the playoffs, if we had Green this season? Remembering that in your proposed lineup, we'd still have Bradley and Drew on the DL?

If not, then keeping Green this season really doesn't matter, for all that he's a better bat than Werth. 2005 is a bust in any case.

Could we have signed them with Green? Perhaps.

Would we have? I doubt it -- that would have significantly boosted payroll past $100 million. If you're not taking payroll into account, why not re-sign Beltre, keep Green, AND get Drew?

I'd love that lineup, but it's not remotely feasible.

#236: Green's production is inflated by the BOB and Dodgers' pitching. Green has a .785 OPS on the road and an .817 OPS against teams not named the Dodgers. And on the money side, the choice is essentially between Odalis Perez and Dioner Navarro for $16 million or Shawn Green and Pat Mahomes for $16 million. I'd take Perez and Navarro.

The Angels are an interesting case study vs. the 2004 Dodgers. They're pacing for 96 wins but with 14 Red Sox/Yankees games on the horizon. So call it 93 wins. Publicly Stoneman is standing pat, but to me this team is due for an early bounce. I figure the WC comes from the East and plays CHW. So the Angels could conceivably face the Red Sox and Yankees back-to-back. They've got to be a big starter and a big bat away from pulling that off. But of course Stoneman doesn't want to "blow up a winning clubhouse."

WARNING: Extremely long post ahead.

Since the beginning of the season I've been trying to understand how good the Dodgers really are. Injuries throughout the year have obviously masked their true talent level. Thus the important question is, "What is the difference between the performance we've received and the performance we should have expected?". In order to address this question in the past, I've used a WARP-based (Wins Above Replacement Player) DL analysis. This approach is a good estimator, but it has two key problems. First, it doesn't take into account the quality of our actual replacements. Second, it doesn't take into account how much time a player is expected to contribute for. For instance, while J.D. Drew's injury timeframe this year will exceed reasonable expectations, nobody should have expected him to play 155 games.

Now, onto the approach. First, for each fielding position, I estimated expected playing time based on PECOTA projections and health history. Second, I estimated expected performance at the position based on PECOTA projections, historical performance, and adjustments for platoon splits. Last, I compared the expected breakdowns to the actuals. I'll go through the numbers position-by-position. The format for each performance line is Playing Time %: Player - AVG / OBP / SLG ( OPS ). This analysis does not include Pitchers, Designated-Hitters, and Pinch-Hitters, so the cumulative numbers do not match up with the team's overall numbers. At the end, I'll give a comparison of actual playing time vs. expected playing time for each of the players referenced.

Catcher Actuals
77.2%: Jason Phillips - .250/.300/.398 (.698 OPS)
13.9%: Paul Bako - .250/.362/.300 (.662 OPS)
8.9%: Mike Rose - .148/.233/.185 (.418 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .241/.302/.367 (.669 OPS)

Catcher Expected
75.0%: Jason Phillips - .255/.315/.395 (.710 OPS)
20.0%: Paul Bako - .230/.310/.330 (.640 OPS)
5.0%: Mike Rose - .240/.325/.315 (.640 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .249/.315/.378 (.693 OPS)

Catcher Analysis
The Dodgers have been getting slightly less production from catcher than expected. Primarily this is due to Jason Phillips mildly underperforming his expectations. Additionally, Mike Rose has done very little offensively, though his at-bats are limited. Paul Bako has exceeded expecation for performance, but has missed his playing time projection.

First Base Actual
62.0%: Hee-Seop Choi - .250 / .330 / 490 (.820 OPS)
28.8%: Olmedo Saenz - .333 / .400 / 634 (1.034 OPS)
4.7%: Jeff Kent - .538 / .667 / 769 (1.436 OPS)
2.0%: Jason Phillips - .000 / .000 / 000 (.000 OPS)
1.7%: Norihiro Nakamura - .167 / .167 / 167 (.333 OPS)
0.8%: Jason Grabowski - .333 / .333 / 333 (.667 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .280 / .358 / 525 (.883 OPS)

First Base Expected
65.0%: Hee-Seop Choi - .260 / .350 / 490 (.840 OPS)
30.0%: Olmedo Saenz - .310 / .375 / 600 (.975 OPS)
5.0%: Jeff Kent - .276 / .341 / 498 (.839 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .276 / .357 / 523 (.880 OPS)

First Base Analysis
The Dodgers have been getting expected production from first base. Hee Seop Choi has mildly underperformed expectations, but that has been balanced out by Olmedo Saenz's performance. As should be apparent to anyone not named Jim Tracy, Jason Phillips, Norihiro Nakamura, and Jason Grabowski should never be allowed anywhere near the first base bag. Additionally, unless it's due to injury concerns, it doesn't make sense to move Kent to first base fulltime, as the Choi/Saenz platoon has been one of the few bright spots in the Dodgers lineup.

Second Base Actual
88.6%: Jeff Kent - .295 / .367 / 505 (.872 OPS)
9.8%: Antonio Perez - .394 / .459 / 515 (.974 OPS)
1.4%: Oscar Robles - .200 / .200 / 200 (.400 OPS)
0.3%: Norihiro Nakamura - .000 / .000 / 000 (.000 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .302 / .373 / 500 (.873 OPS)

Second Base Expected
80.0%: Jeff Kent - .276 / .341 / 498 (.839 OPS)
15.0%: Antonio Perez - .270 / .340 / 390 (.730 OPS)
5.0%: Oscar Robles - .285 / .335 / 335 (.670 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .276 / .341 / 474 (.814 OPS)

Second Base Analysis
Jeff Kent's offensive performance has been the highlight of the Dodgers season so far. Additionally, Perez has made some significant offensive contributions while resting Kent at second base. Second base is one of two positions where the Dodgers have exceeded expectations.

Shorstop Actual
80.5%: Cesar Izturis - .275/.322/.338 (.660 OPS)
14.2%: Oscar Robles - .412/.474/.471 (.945 OPS)
4.5%: Antonio Perez - .294/.333/.294 (.627 OPS)
0.2%: Jose Valentin - .000/.000/.000 (.000 OPS)
0.2%: Mike Edwards - .000/.000/.000 (.000 OPS)
0.2%: Norihiro Nakamura - .000/.000/.000 (.000 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .293/.342/.351 (.693 OPS)

Shortstop Expected
95.0%: Cesar Izturis - .280/.325/.365 (.690 OPS)
5.0%: Jose Valentin - .230/.305/.440 (.745 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .278/.324/.369 (.693 OPS)

Shortstop Analysis
Cesar Izturis' injury has been a bigger problem defensively than it has been offensively. Of course, that's both the good news and the bad news. The good news is that Oscar Robles and Antonio Perez have been able to match and even exceed Izturis' projected performance. The bad news is that Izturis' projected performance is only a .690 OPS. Overall, the shortstop position has met expectations offensively.

Third Base Actual
31.2%: Antonio Perez - .314 / .386 / 441 (.827 OPS)
26.1%: Mike Edwards - .287/.333/.379 (.712 OPS)
22.2%: Jose Valentin - .190/.369/.317 (.686 OPS)
9.6%: Olmedo Saenz - .273/.314/.394 (.708 OPS)
7.3%: Norihiro Nakamura - .125/.192/.208 (.400 OPS)
3.7%: Oscar Robles - .154/.154/.154 (.308 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .258/.340/.366 (.706 OPS)

Third Base Expected
60.0%: Jose Valentin - .240/.315/.450 (.765 OPS)
30.0%: Antonio Perez - .285/.350/.410 (.760 OPS)
5.0%: Olmedo Saenz - .245/.335/.425 (.760 OPS)
5.0%: Oscar Robles - .285/.335/.335 (.670 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .256/.328/.431 (.759 OPS)

Third Base Analysis
Coming into the season, the platoon of Jose Valentin and Antonio Perez was expected to be reasonably productive. Expecting a .759 OPS from third base is not very good, but it is a heck of a lot better than a .706 OPS. Unfortunately, injuries to Perez and Valentin have never allowed the platoon to operate as expected. Additionally, even before his injury, Jose Valentin was performing well below his expectations against right-handed pitching. Offensively and defensively, Antonio Perez has been the best option at third base in Valentin's stead. Thus, it is surprising to continually see Mike Edwards penciled into the starting lineup instead.

Left Field Actual
35.8%: Ricky Ledee - .254/.310/.398 (.708 OPS)
22.2%: Jayson Werth - .254/.329/.338 (.667 OPS)
18.8%: Jason Grabowski - .145/.197/.290 (.487 OPS)
14.8%: Jason Repko - .235/.291/.412 (.703 OPS)
7.4%: Mike Edwards - .269/.269/.423 (.692 OPS)
1.1%: Chin-Feng Chen - .250/.250/.250 (.500 OPS)
0.0%: Antonio Perez - .000/.000/.000 (.000 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .232/.287/.367 (.654 OPS)

Left Field Expected
65.0%: Jayson Werth - .255/.335/.470 (.805 OPS)
25.0%: Ricky Ledee - .265/.335/.415 (.750 OPS)
10.0%: Jason Grabowski - .235/.295/.395 (.690 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .256/.331/.449 (.780 OPS)

Left Field Analysis
The deepest, darkest hole in the Dodgers lineup has been left field. Jayson Werth's broken wrist in spring training has led to a potpourri of replacements in left field. Ricky Ledee and Jason Repko have provided decent performance, but a .708 or .703 OPS is definitely not what the Dodgers were hoping for from a corner outfielder. Additionally, whether due to the injury or due to sophomore regression, Jayson Werth has only managed a .667 OPS in left field since coming off the disabled list. If the Dodgers decide to fill any offensive position through trade or a free agent signing, it should be left field.

Center Field Actual
53.9%: Milton Bradley - .299/.347/.513 (.860 OPS)
31.0%: J.D. Drew - .330/.462/.638 (1.100 OPS)
11.9%: Jason Repko - .262/.311/.333 (.644 OPS)
3.2%: Jayson Werth - .300/.417/1.200 (1.617 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .303/.380/.547 (.927 OPS)

Center Field Expected
80.0%: Milton Bradley - .285/.355/.490 (.845 OPS)
10.0%: J.D. Drew - .285/.410/.515 (.925 OPS)
10.0%: Ricky Ledee - .265/.335/.415 (.750 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .283/.359/.485 (.844 OPS)

Center Field Analysis
Dodgers center fielders have performed well beyond expectations, although primarily at the expense of right field. Prior to his injury, Milton Bradley's offensive performance was exceeding expectations, though only by a bit. While filling in for Bradley, J.D. Drew hit his stride offensively, thus making right field look worse than it actually is. The injury to Ricky Ledee has also been damaging, forcing the Dodgers to turn to Jason Repko and his .644 OPS. The bright side is that Repko has proven adept at manning center field and has shown offensive flashes suggesting he will be a highly valuable 4th outfielder for years to come.

Right Field Actual
51.1%: J.D. Drew - .259/.381/.449 (.830 OPS)
23.4%: Jayson Werth - .221/.299/.338 (.637 OPS)
16.0%: Jason Repko - .192/.311/.404 (.715 OPS)
5.7%: Cody Ross - .200/.238/.250 (.488 OPS)
3.3%: Jason Grabowski - .200/.333/.200 (.533 OPS)
0.5%: Ricky Ledee - .000/1.000/.000 (1.000 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .233/.345/.394 (.739 OPS)

Right Field Expected
75.0%: J.D. Drew - .285/.410/.515 (.925 OPS)
15.0%: Ricky Ledee - .265/.335/.415 (.750 OPS)
10.0%: Jayson Werth - .255/.335/.470 (.805 OPS)
100.0%: Team Total - .279/.391/.496 (.887 OPS)

Right Field Analysis
As mentioned above, the performance in right field has been primarily hurt by J.D. Drew's move to center. Additionally, while playing right field early in the season, J.D. Drew was struggling offensively. With his injury history in mind, J.D. Drew was never expected to play every game, but over the course of this season, Drew's playing time will certainly be below any reasonable expectations. As in center field, the injury to Ricky Ledee as the expected 4th outfielder has led to a grab bag of AAAA players manning right.

Cumulative Actual
Team Total - .269/.342/.427 (.769 OPS)

Cumulative Expected
Team Total - .269/.343/.450 (.793 OPS)

Cumulative Analysis
Giving up .024 points in OPS is hard for any team to swallow. As just a quick example, St. Louis has an OPS .026 higher than San Diego and they have scored roughly 10% more runs. Adding 10% to the Dodgers run total of 387 would put them at 425 runs scored vs. 426 against, a .500 record before considering the losses due to pitching and defense. Obviously, this is not a precise analysis, but it should give a pretty good sense of what we're missing. Additionally, with just a few breaks in the opposite direction, the Dodger could have easily exceeded even these fairly conservative expectations.

Playing Time Comparison, Actual / Expected
Jason Phillips: 79.2% / 75.0%
Paul Bako: 13.9% / 20.0%
Mike Rose: 8.9% / 5.0%
Hee-Seop Choi: 62.0% / 65.0%
Olmedo Saenz: 38.3% / 35.0%
Jeff Kent: 93.3% / 85.5%
Antonio Perez: 45.5% / 45.0%
Oscar Robles: 19.2% / 10.0%
Cesar Izturis: 80.5% / 95.0%
Jose Valentin: 22.4% / 65.0%
Norihiro Nakamura: 9.5% / 0.0%
Mike Edwards: 33.8% / 0.0%
J.D. Drew: 82.1% / 85.0%
Milton Bradley: 53.9% / 80.0%
Jayson Werth: 48.8% / 75.0%
Ricky Ledee: 36.3% / 50.0%
Jason Grabowski: 22.8% / 10.0%
Cody Ross: 5.7% / 0.0%
Jason Repko: 42.7% / 0.0%
Chin-Feng Chen: 1.1% / 0.0%

#242: In GM speak, "I don't want to mess with a winning clubhouse." means "I don't have any more money and I don't want to give up my prospects".

#243: If I ever recover enough energy, I'll take a look at pitching and defense. But, since I'm moving in a week, it might be a little while before I get there.

Eyes are blinking. Nice effort FB on putting together all that info.

The Tim Redding/Darrell May era in New York will likely not last very long.

The defensive part will be interesting since I think the Dodgers defense in LF has been almost as bad as the offense.

Another homerun for Denker so far tonight. He's 2 for 2 with a double and a homerun so far. Take that BA!

Home run Ken Griffey Jr. I really like the year he is having.

I propose we anoint Fearing Blue with the reverential title of Most Supreme Numbers Cruncher :)

Another homerun for Denker so far tonight. He's 2 for 2 with a double and a homerun so far. Take that BA!

BA needs to give denker some love or else they suck a lot.

Grins. Or at least the Croix d'Abacus.

Per Rotoworld: Izturis activated and Osorio (Sp?) was sent down.

Preston "RBI MACHINE" Wilson doubled in the go-ahead run in Milwaukee. Too bad DePo and McCourt didn't love Dodger fans enough to pick him up.

Fearing, you should start your own blog. As great as they are for DT, I think they deserve a place outside of the comments--there's no reason why you can't just link from here to a stand-along blog in the same way as Tom Meagher's old 4OF project.

And that way, you could get Hardball Times or BPro to start paying you for some of this stuff.

WWSH

#248: Ok Bob, here is the defensive breakdown. I used BP's Rate2, which is a rate statistic for Fielding Runs Above Average. A Rate2 of 100 is average. The delta between the Rate2 and 100 is how many Fielding Runs Above Average the fielder allows over 100 games. I estimated Rate2 projections for players who did not have a PECOTA projection.

C Actual
77.2%: Jason Phillips - 91 Rate2
13.9%: Paul Bako - 108 Rate2
8.9%: Mike Rose - 63 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 91 Rate2

C Expected
75.0%: Jason Phillips - 90 Rate2
20.0%: Paul Bako - 100 Rate2
5.0%: Mike Rose - 85 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 92 Rate2

1B Actual
62.0%: Hee-Seop Choi - 95 Rate2
28.8%: Olmedo Saenz - 81 Rate2
4.7%: Jeff Kent - 100 Rate2
2.0%: Jason Phillips - 100 Rate2
1.7%: Norihiro Nakamura - 100 Rate2
0.8%: Jason Grabowski - 100 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 91 Rate2

1B Expected
65.0%: Hee-Seop Choi - 99 Rate2
30.0%: Olmedo Saenz - 90 Rate2
5.0%: Jeff Kent - 96 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 97 Rate2

2B Actual
88.6%: Jeff Kent - 92 Rate2
9.8%: Antonio Perez - 88 Rate2
1.4%: Oscar Robles - 88 Rate2
0.3%: Norihiro Nakamura - 100 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 90 Rate2

2B Expected
80.0%: Jeff Kent - 100 Rate2
15.0%: Antonio Perez - 94 Rate2
5.0%: Oscar Robles - 96 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 99 Rate2

SS Actual
80.5%: Cesar Izturis - 104 Rate2
14.2%: Oscar Robles - 100 Rate2
4.5%: Antonio Perez - 100 Rate2
0.2%: Jose Valentin - 100 Rate2
0.2%: Mike Edwards - 100 Rate2
0.2%: Norihiro Nakamura - 100 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 103 Rate2

SS Expected
95.0%: Cesar Izturis - 104 Rate2
5.0%: Jose Valentin - 98 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 104 Rate2

3B Actual
31.2%: Antonio Perez - 92 Rate2
26.1%: Mike Edwards - 82 Rate2
22.2%: Jose Valentin - 84 Rate2
9.6%: Olmedo Saenz - 86 Rate2
7.3%: Norihiro Nakamura - 99 Rate2
3.7%: Oscar Robles - 99 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 88 Rate2

3B Expected
60.0%: Jose Valentin - 94 Rate2
30.0%: Antonio Perez - 94 Rate2
5.0%: Olmedo Saenz - 85 Rate2
5.0%: Oscar Robles - 96 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 94 Rate2

LF Actual
35.8%: Ricky Ledee - 91 Rate2
22.2%: Jayson Werth - 100 Rate2
18.8%: Jason Grabowski - 94 Rate2
14.8%: Jason Repko - 100 Rate2
7.4%: Mike Edwards - 100 Rate2
1.1%: Chin-Feng Chen - 100 Rate2
0.0%: Antonio Perez - 100 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 96 Rate2

LF Expected
65.0%: Jayson Werth - 101 Rate2
25.0%: Ricky Ledee - 96 Rate2
10.0%: Jason Grabowski - 94 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 99 Rate2

CF Actual
53.9%: Milton Bradley - 114 Rate2
31.0%: J.D. Drew - 108 Rate2
11.9%: Jason Repko - 118 Rate2
3.2%: Jayson Werth - 101 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 112 Rate2

CF Expected
80.0%: Milton Bradley - 106 Rate2
10.0%: J.D. Drew - 104 Rate2
10.0%: Ricky Ledee - 92 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 104 Rate2

RF Actual
51.1%: J.D. Drew - 103 Rate2
23.4%: Jayson Werth - 110 Rate2
16.0%: Jason Repko - 101 Rate2
5.7%: Cody Ross - 118 Rate2
3.3%: Jason Grabowski - 101 Rate2
0.5%: Ricky Ledee - 212 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 106 Rate2

RF Expected
75.0%: J.D. Drew - 104 Rate2
15.0%: Ricky Ledee - 98 Rate2
10.0%: Jayson Werth - 98 Rate2
100.0%: Team Total - 103 Rate2

Cumulative Actual
Team Total - 97 Rate2

Cumulative Expected
Team Total - 99 Rate2

Fielding Runs Above Average Actual = -18.32
Fielding Runs Above Average Expected = -7.43
Additional Runs Allowed By Replacements = 10.89

Adding in the defense takes the imaginary run differential to 425 RS and 415 RA, a .512 winning percentage. No matter how much Bob eggs me on, I am going to wait on the pitching.

Re: 257

Well, I guess Phillips really is as bad defensively as he looks.

WWSH

Christina, you know I love ya, but your talkin outta both sides. If I understand your point (which I may have messed up) getting rid of Green was productive because it freed up $6M to make a mid-season deal. But then you suggest keeping Green would not have helped because with all these injuries the season is too far gone. So what does Frank do with the $6M? Because for $6M we are not getting anyone who could salvage the season. (Not that anyone could) Thus, the $6M will go unspent and into Frank's pocket. I would rather have kept Green if that's the case. I am not interested in helping Frank make more $$$.

As for the others who say its Green's $6M or no Odalis or Lowe. Payroll sits at $88M. We were promised a $100 payroll which Frank is clearly reneging on. If Frank kept his word, it could have been done with money to spare.

I acknowledge that what could have been done and what should have been done are not viewed the same. But had they wanted to it could have been done.

Finally, am I the only one who is furious that Frank promised $100 and has not lived up to it or am I just too impatient and others are giving him until July 31 to see if he honors his word.

257- You've confirmed my long-held belief: Ricky Ledee is the greatest right fielder of all time.

#256: WWSH, thank you for the compliment. I have considered starting my own website. I even thought about applying to take over Fourth Outfielder now that it no longer has a writer. But, I'll be starting graduate school in September and I don't want to start a website until I'm sure I have time available to do it well. Fortunately, my degree will be in Operations Research and I'll be doing my thesis on baseball player evaluation. Hopefully, that will allow me to contribute some more interesting ideas in the future. Be on the lookout for something next season! :)

It's a moot point to me. Green would be on the DL.

Gonna watch this one on the DV-R. Have fun!

I had to go to my three-year-old's birthday party. Priorities.

The same people who whine about who Choi hits homeruns off of completely ignore that if DePodesta would get off his rear end and fire Erickson, Shawn Green is in the dumper. He plays in a hitting friendly park with an unbalanced schedule of no-talent hack pitching staffs in the National League West (especially ours). Like a certain hated Korean, he has two good weeks and then disappears for weeks at a time. Choi and Saenz combined have 12 win shares and are being paid 1 million dollars. Green has 11 (which would have been about 6 if he still had to play here) and would have been paid 16 million. In 2007, Arizona fans are going to be after Moorad with pitchforks and knives for giving Green that pension year when all their superstars are ready to come up, and Green is still playing crappy defense (Choi's defense -- were you people even watching last year?), and generally being the Giovanni Carrara of first basemen, vulturing cheap homeruns off of middle relievers and washed-up hasbeens.

Shawn Green is crap. Expensive, mediocre garbage. He isn't worth the time you waste on him, and meanwhile, real, live, kicking. anti-DePodesta arguments slip by you like shadows in the night.

#260: Defensive statistics have serious issues with small sample sizes. Ledee has essentially played 1 game worth of innings in right field, thus the ridiculous Rate2 :).

Re: 259

I'd much rather we spend our money well than be committed to mystical payroll targets. Should DePo really be just hunting around for bad contracts to take on just to get to 100 mil?

Also, if we want to get into semantics about the 100 mil figure, it's questionable to just assume we'll get the insurance payment for Dreifort's salary. I vaguely remember a legal dispute over the insurance on Kevin Brown's contract, which I think had to be settled either inside or outside of court.

There are also benefits payments to take into account for payroll, which Jon's calculations don't include.

Also, although it's theoretically possible that DePo could have been more aggressive in pursuing someone like Radke, or Beltre, by assuming the presence of Dreifort's insurance payment, the problem with committing to larger contracts this last off-season is that it doesn't take into account arbitration and free-agent raises for following seasons. Fearing's previous numbers showed that we don't have a huge amount of room next year when Penny's extension and arb-raises are taken into accout--it would have been even more tight had we pushed payroll higher this season with a Beltre signing or a 10 mil/yr contract to Clement this last winter. And we would be suffocating if we hadn't traded away LoDuca and Mota, who were both due serious money before DePo traded them.

WWSH

#259: I think this is a case of what your definition of is is. Major league baseball calculates payroll including player benefits, which are approximately $8 million / year. Thus, by major league baseball's calculation, our payroll is around $96 million, leaving $4 million for mid-season acquisitions. If our president says he's going to cut our deficit in half by providing a budget that doesn't include half of our expected costs, I have to let DePodesta slide on this one.

LAT - I don't recall any specific promise that the payroll would be $100 million (or greater), merely that McCourt would keep the payroll in the same general neighborhood and not severely cut it.

Of course, it's quite possible that I missed or forgot about an interview or quote that he made -- if so, I'll stand corrected if you can provide the link. But providing payroll specifics or promises has never been McCourt's MO.

Injuries aside, do you feel he's skimped on the payroll this year? I remember at the beginning of the year quite a lot of people being fairly happy with the general financial status of the Dodgers, since they had expected in the high $80s and had a bit of a buffer that they were expected to use during the July deadlines (again, this was assuming the team was more competitive). They still might. Of all the things to be pissed about, this strikes me as one of the weaker arguments: McCourt and Depo have spent quite a bit of money in their various deals.

Our payroll is $30 million too high. We still waste money like it grows on trees.

Re: 267

Thanks for the info on benefits. I didn't realize it was as much as 8 mil/yr. Thought it was more like 4 mil/yr. Man, that really doesn't leave much breathing space.

BTW, following my own post, although I don't think DePo should be going around throwing money away just to get to magic 100, I also wouldn't mind if he found a way of absorbing a bad contract for good value in return.

WWSH

#267: Or rather, let McCourt slide on this one. Additionally, I'm fine with McCourt wanting to run the team as a business. Longterm, profits and growth are going to help the team, whereas piling up dept (a la the Diamondbacks) would only hurt us.

Preston Wilson hit a homerun in his first at bat with the Nationals. The Washington Post today identified the last Expo/Nat to homer in his first at bat with the team. Any guesses? (It's an old friend, unless it's "the other" of an old friend.)

Wilton Guerrero!

#270: I got the benefits number from Hardball Dollars (http://www.hardballdollars.com/). They estimate $7.55 million in yearly benefits costs for each team.

And more Nationals fun. One run game and the Brewers just brought in a pinch runner Trent Durrington who was immediately picked off first by Livan Hernandez. Saith Ron Darling "Well, that's about the most embarrasing thing that can happen.")

And an aside, one nice thing about watching the Nationals alot is Brian Schneider. It probably doesn't have too major an impact on game outcomes over the long haul, but a catcher who can throw is fun to watch. We should get one of those.

More fun by Jim Tracy..

3b- Robles
SS- Izturis
1b- Saenz
C- Phillips
2b- Perez
LF- Edwards
RF- Werth
CF- Repko
Pitcher..

Gotta love it when Choi, Ledee, and Kent all sit on the bench... while Scrappy, Izturis, and Edwards are immedially thrust into the lineup...

Izzy and Robles at 1/2... Must be a Jim Tracy fantasy..

Cant wait for the bunts, the caught stealings, the probably 5-1 dodger loss..

Our medical bills were higher this year too.

Re: 268

McCourt originally pledged at his opening press conference to always keep payroll in the top quartile of MLB. I always took this as his real intention, because it was so carefully worded. You don't just say "top quartile" off the top of your head. And I think that's more than adequate--I have no desire to become Yankees West.

I believe he did also make a 100 million pledge for this off-season, partly in response I think to Beltre's leaving. I can't remember, though, if it was as firm as his original promise. I never really cared, though; I always assumed it was essentially PR talk. I don't expect McCourt to be perfectly honest--indeed, considering the press he's gotten, I think it's perfectly understandable for him to lie through his teeth half the time. But that's just me.

Anyhow, I agree with the other posters who see this as a non-issue. The Drew, Lowe, and Perez signings showed that ownership is willing to spend, as does Penny's extension and the drafting of Hochevar. There also seemed to be no money problems with regards to draft bonuses in 2004.

The real issue is whether or not we spend the money wisely. If we only look at raw payroll, then FOX was an ideal owner, despite Kevin Malone occupying the GM chair.

WWSH

273 -- no

275- He was the second Brewer picked off today. It's been a really enjoyable game, since I don't care about the Brewers. Now the Nats lose a runner at the plate.

#276: Someone must have bet Tracy he couldn't put together his worst lineup of the season. Tracy wins!

272 - Mark Grudzielanek.

Re: 261

Well, good luck with graduate school! I very much hope you'll be able to parlay your academic work into stuff you can put on a web-site, but having gone through grad school myself, I certainly understand if you're swamped. Are you going for an MS, or for the whole shebang--a doctorate?

WWSH

Re: 276

I think I'll pass on watching tonight's game. It'll just be too painful.

WWSH

Robles against a lefty! More of that "matchup" love from Tracy.

266 Wayne, I am not advocating spending $$$ for the sake of spending it. (That's what I have children for.) And if we have to remain flexible in anticipation of next year that's ok, but then say that. Instead Frank gives us platitudes as though we are a bunch of idiots. Today on the radio: "Its all about the fans." What does that mean? If Frank thinks payroll is none of our business then have the sack say that. The guy is a used car sales-man who masquerades as a teen-age cheer leader.

267 Fearing, I don't blame Depo for this. I see what he is trying to build and agree with much of it. He went a little fast for my liking but I'm old and don't take to change all that well. But I see it. If the difference is the "benefits" someone, Frank, or Sitrick & Co. needs to explain that. As for the President's budget, just keep in mind what he wants to do after his term expires.

Chad Billingsley, the second best pitching prospect in baseball, is pitching tonight for Jacksonville. You can get the audio link from www.jaxsuns.com. It's almost guaranteed to be more exciting than this lineup.

Joel Guzman also hit a 3-run homerun in the second inning, his 13th of the season.

282 -- nope

#283: Thanks again. I'll be going for a Master's. I'm not patient enough to get a Doctorate.

If it's Delino DeShields, I'm going to hurl. This Shawn Green nonsense has already taken a lot out of me tonight.

So I was typing up a snarky little bit about Hernandez pitching the bottom of the eighth in a one run game with 125 or so pitches already under his belt, when Carlos Lee dumped one into the left field stands.

JOEL THE DESTROYER, SLAYS THE ENEMIES WITH HIS IMMORTAL STAFF OF WOOD!

290 not Delino. Post gives the date as June 6, 1999.

Justin Ruggiano just singled to drive in a run. The Suns are now up 7 - 0!

290 - Did you eat all the basic food colors today, Steve? Will it look like Disney's Wonderful World of Color?

JtD, JtD!

7-0 eh? FB, can you describe how the suns scored 7 runs already?

By the way, for anyone who thinks we are not out of the NL West race, I encourage you to print out tonight's lineup and read it before you go to bed at night.

wow more great news, sutherland hits a double today! isnt that one in 3 games straight already?

Guzman and Young with 3 run jacks each. Ruggiano with rbi single. another run just scored I believe.

By the way, for anyone who thinks we are not out of the NL West race, I encourage you to print out tonight's lineup and read it before you go to bed at night.

i am not even paying attention to the big league club.

#297: Ummm.. bad pitching? It's now 8 - 0 after the Suns batted around in the 3rd.

Three-run homerun by Guzman in the 2nd.
Three-run homerun by Young in the 3rd.
RBI single by Ruggiano in the 3rd.
RBI single by Alvarez in the 3rd.

Going into the bottom of the 3rd now. Billingsley is facing his nemeses, the dreaded Biscuits!

how are labomb and j-lo doing?

Damn. Guillermo Mota.

#299: That's incredible. Just 13 extra-base hits in his first 123 games as a professional, now 3 in his last 3!

304 ding ding ding. If we still had him, he could bat cleanup tonight.

this is cbills day to conquer his wreteched enemy.

Oakland is on fire...

Jay Payton with a 2 run bomb, and Swisher connects as well in the 2nd ip.

4-0 A's already.

269. Our payroll is $30 million too high. We still waste money like it grows on trees

What are you saving it for? The McCourt Family Trust.

I'm fine with McCourt wanting to run the team as a business. Longterm, profits and growth are going to help the team, whereas piling up dept (a la the Diamondbacks) would only hurt us.

Me too, if it translated into lower ticket prices but it won't.

I admit my dislike for Frank is irrational. From a business standpoint he bought the team with OPM, a brillant move. He will raise revenue and reduce expenditures, all great business decisions. He will make tens of millions. Notwithstanding, he is a weenie (who is laughing all the way to el banco.)

One of the Giants homer announcers just said the Dodgers have gotten dramatically better since last night by activating Cesar Izturis from the DL. Sounds like somebody else needs to print out the lineup.

I don't care what he does with it as long as the team wins. If we're not going to give it to guys (ahem) who are not going to help us win, then who cares where it goes otherwise?

I wonder how the Suns lineup tonight would fare against this lineup JT has put out tonight for the big league squad. Might actually beat them.

#312: If Billingsley was pitching, I would give them a fighting chance.

Please don't tell me EI is the Giants guys tonight.

dramatically better since last night by activating Cesar Izturis from the DL

Yeah, we traded Kent for Izturis tonight. That's a good deal.

#311: I agree. McCourt may appear to be a "weenie", but I think he is honestly trying to bring multiple championships to Los Angeles. I never felt that way about Fox.

311 I care because I would rather not see him make more $$$ by putting a losing team on the field. Agreed, if he fields a WS winner I don't care if he does it with minimum contracts all day long.

#314: Extra Innings is the Giants "crack" announcing team tonight. Can the night get any better?

315. I don't think Frank knows a baseball is round. I think he luckily hired the right guy.

Nate, I can't believe you're still holding out hope for Sutherland. In Sutherland's two years in rookie ball, his ISOp was .043. In Izturis' minor league career, his ISOp was .075. Sutherland is a "gawky" 6'6" 215 lb. banjo-hitting first baseman.

316 -- But you know as well as I do he's putting more money on the DL than he is on the field, for good, bad, or indifferent.

#318: I don't think it was luck. McCourt is a smart guy as is his wife who has an MBA from MIT Sloan.

Scrappy Houston gets a ninth inning run to tie the Cardinals -- leadoff pinch hit double, sac to third, sac fly to score the run.

318 -- I'm at a "disadvantage" here. I have no opinion of McCourt whatsoever. None. So a fiery Choi-like defense will not be forthcoming. :)

If anyone is listening to the Dodgers broadcast and hears something about Jeff Kent's status, please share.

trade derek lowe.

Wow. Michael Tucker is a bigtime power threat.

Fearing, will you please finally admit that Derek Lowe sucks?

Nate, part of Billingsley's success tonight could be that he doesn't have to face Delmon Young. Young was promoted to AAA after the All-Star game.

Lowe needs to trade in the sinker for a good spitball.

Nate, I can't believe you're still holding out hope for Sutherland. In Sutherland's two years in rookie ball, his ISOp was .043. In Izturis' minor league career, his ISOp was .075. Sutherland is a "gawky" 6'6" 215 lb. banjo-hitting first baseman.

sutherland is 6'6. izzy is 5'8. projectability!!!

324 - Sore wrist from last night, Unable to take batting practice.

Or a bad spitball. Oh well, at least he's moved the payroll closer to $100 million.

Nate, part of Billingsley's success tonight could be that he doesn't have to face Delmon Young. Young was promoted to AAA after the All-Star game.

but dukes, washington and bankston still own billingsley lol.

#327: Yes, but performance is a spectrum from Sucks all the way to Kicks Ass (not just two buckets). I think Lowe is closer to Sucks, but he's essentially mediocre.

I think I can finally articulate my earlier point:

"Instead of wasting our money on Shawn Green, we waste our money on Derek Lowe. So what's the big deal?"

#330: Banjo hitting first baseman. Print it out and read it at night :)

#321. Fearing, I actually believe its a Bill and Hillary thing. She is the brains behind the operation.

Anyway, I have kicked this dead horse long enough. I'll let it go (for now). At least I feel better now that I vented. Let's see how I feel 9 innings from now.

#333: Billingsley just allowed his first run of the game. Guzman ranged deep behind the bag for a groundball, but his spinning throw was wide of Loney. It should be ruled as a hit.

Lineups tonight
Dodgers - Suns
3b- Robles - LaRoche
SS- Izturis - Guzman
1b- Saenz - Loney
C- Phillips - Martin
2b- Perez - Young
LF- Edwards - Meadows
RF- Werth - Ruggiano
CF- Repko - Weber
P- Lowe - Billingsley

I'll take my chances with quite a few of the guys on the right over their counterpart. It's amazing how much talent there is at AA. I like Broxton and Kuo to matchup in the pen, as well. Granted the big leaguers have the experienc and would probably win, but I think the Suns would give them a game.

Yes, I've turned my attention to the minors.

oh wow i just the lineup for the big league club.

if we take all our top prospects and put them in a agme against that lineup, our prospects would win.

#327: It's all about lowering expectations when it comes to anything Dodgers. Life becomes much easier.

Lowe was bought for his post season performance, not his regular season..

I think DePo thought that if everything was healthy, we'd have enough to make it to the post season.

And the pos season is where Derek Lowe and Brad Penny would give us a fighting chance to win a few games.

*just saw

#124-Even the blind sow gets the acorn occasionally.Grabowski is horrible.Not only that,his old ESPN gamecast photo made him look like John Carradine in "The Grapes of Wrath"He played the apocalyptic preacher Casey.Perhaps Depo keeps him around as an omen for this star crossed season.I wonder if he has a raven or a vulture in his locker.

oldbear.... small sample size. all of that was hogwash by depo to the media.

Billingsley just gave up a 2-out walk to a .103 hitter with a 7-run lead. There should be a fine for that. Suns pitchers lead the league in walks issued (good sign of inexperience), but have allowed the fewest hits (good sign of quality of stuff).

billingsley doesnt seem as sharp as usual.

he only has 2 ks!!!

Meanwhile, for those of you with EI or on the Atlantic Seaboard, remember that Palmeiro goes for #3,000 tonight. He leads off the top of the next inning. As a bonus, you can tune in to see first hand the "See If Adrian Beltre Can Out-OPS Mike Edwards Contest" going on. Edwards is currently hanging in at .703 (or 70 points below Hee Seop Choi) while Beltre flew out lazily to right on a 2-0 count in his first effort, dropping to .704. It should be quite a race to October for those two fellas. Good luck, guys!

If a bunt hits the plate, isn't it a foul ball?

(This just happened in the Nationals game but, apparently, I'm the only one who notice.)

And the pos season is where Derek Lowe and Brad Penny would give us a fighting chance to win a few games.

The cart goes behind the horse.

#346: Jacksonville pitchers are also tied for the league lead in Ks (best sign of stuff).

there should be a separate game thread for the suns game. and i can imagine the number of posts would rival the number of posts for a dodger game.

#347: He just picked up his third K to end the top of the 5th with two men on.

laroche with a lucky hit. i want a homerun from laroche or else his top prospect status drops. no ifs and buts about it!

Let's see how I feel 9 innings from now.

I'm guessing this game is not going to make you or me feel better. Just a hunch.

I thought the plate was fair

349 - noticed - anyhow, it was called a very scrappy sac bunt, moving the runner from second to third with one out. Now Mike Stanton is coming in!

For those of you who are listening to the Giants broadcast, Robles was out "from me to you".

356 -- makes sense, everyone else did too.

but in bigger news, Mike Stanton balked home the losing run before thowing a single pitch.

Ah yes. You work the pitcher for 20 pitches with only one out and you hit and run so he can get out of it with one pitch. That's our Dodgers.

YOu guys did not just lose on a balk!

Why does Tracy think Phillips is a better hitter than Perez?

Izturis and Robles now a combined 5 for 16 in stolen base attempts.

wasnt the big sabermetric thing with lowe is that he is suppose to suppress homeruns and dodger stadium would suppress the rest of the hits?

362 -- It's the RBI/RISP nonsense.

Robles got a horrible jump. He may not have broken for second before the catcher had the ball.

Whats the line tonite on this:

Dodger Caught Stealings..
Dodger Bunts..

We have 1 after the 1st inning..

Whats the line tonite on this:

Dodger Caught Stealings..
Dodger Bunts..

We have 1 after the 1st inning..

TRADE DEREK LOWE.

The only thing that's missing from tonight's game is Jerry hectoring me about how "unlucky" Derek Lowe is.

Choi should have brought Lowe with him for the homerun derby.

Of all the things DePo has done and hasn't done, it is Derek Lowe that is going to bring him down. Follow the pitching staff. Lowe's contract is going to be a disaster to the nth order.

Don't worry, there are still seven more innings. Between him, Tracy, and a gullible media, they'll find a way to blame the defense before the night is out.

derek lowe will not finish his contract as a dodger.

#372: I agree. Fortunately, $9 million for a 5th starter won't bury the team, but it will hurt.

Just think if we had Brad Radke, Matt Clement, and David Dellucci instead of Perez, Lowe, and Ledee. Unfortunately, none of those first guys wanted to sign with us, but maybe we should have thrown more money at them.

i hate the biscuits.

Billingsley has allowed 3 consecutive two out hits, allowing 2 runs to score. Suns still up 8 - 3.

why is billingsley cursed against them?

374 -- How are we going to get out of this one? By the time he's tradable, in at least 2007, he'll be 34 and even worse than he is now.

Re: 364

The sabermetric theory of 4OF was that since Lowe's track record is very stingy with homers, he'd be a perfect fit in DS for the same reason that Dunn is the ideal player for DS. Unfortunately, Lowe has for some reason been giving up HRs right and left--perhaps he's been pitching too aggressively, which would explain his improved control this season. For the sake of that contract, I just hope this HR binge he's allowing is just a one-season aberration.

I'm still okay with the signing. Starting pitching was overpriced, and although small sample sizes make it statistically unprovable either way, I do think there's such a thing as a "clutch" pitcher. And Lowe at least has no history of arm problems, so we could've done worse. I would have rather had Clement or Radke, but such is life.

He can still come out of this game with a good start if he doesn't give up any more runs. Too bad I have no real confidence this lineup can even score 2 runs.

WWSH

Re: 375

We should have offered Clement 10 mil/yr for 3 ys. Such is life...

WWSH

Barry Zito.. after 5, 0 H...
Wouldn't it be nice to have him? But as always, Beane's A's are making a run for the playoffs

I guess Lowe wanted to end the suspense about his losing streak early in the game. See you in 4 days my man! Good luck in your darkhorse bid to catche Milton for most HR allowed!

Dodgers officially suck donkey balls right now.

Groan

Thank you Derek Lowe for rewarding my defense of you around here.

WWSH

Over the last 15 innings, the A's have let 3 men on base...

Lately Lowe has been the opposite of a GB pitcher. Everything goes rocketing off the bat. I realize that he is being more aggressive, but Lowe... you just don't have what it takes to go after hitters. You K/9 can go down as long as your GB/FB ratio stays sky high.

Lowe closing in 2007?

385 -- That's all right. You didn't have much material to work with.

Palmeiro just got 3,000. A double down the left field line.

Re: 387

I wonder if Lowe thinks he should be challenging, because he's pitching in DS. Maybe he had a better approach in hitter-friendly Fenway? Maybe Colby can help him with this.

WWSH

I guess Lowe can be excused in that with this lineup the entire game is like one long inning of pitching. You leave the field and then you have to go right back out.

388 -- closing a Denny's, or what?

Re: 388

That's actually an interesting idea, or maybe insurance for Gagne next season. Yes, yes, I know, Closers (TM) are over-rated, but in the high pressure post-season, I think the conventional wisdom does have a point. Look at what happened to BK against the Snakes in their championship year. Lowe might be a better option than Ghame Over, or if Brazoban is traded, I don't think we can expect Broxton to close next season.

WWSH

If only Shawn Green had been hitting third today instead of Olmedo Saenz, and Pat Mahomes had been on the mound.

Re: 391

Lowe could give up 1 run over 9 innings, and in all due honesty, I'm sure we'd lose 1-0.

I can hear the fans booing at DS. Perfectly understandable. Has attendance started to drop yet?

WWSH

The worst move of 2005... not re-signing Ross Porter. He would have made mention on air as to why Choi isn't starting.

Anyone know where Ross is right now and if he's broadcasting anywhere?

Who's going to call Bob and tell him to skip the first, oh, nine innings?

From the AP story covering the Angels 3-2 win over the Twins today:

New second baseman Bret Boone hasn't helped Minnesota's offense yet. He went 0-for-4 with a strikeout and a double-play grounder and has just one hit in his last 20 at-bats since June 29.

Reaction: You're kidding me. I'm stunned.

I always thought Minnesota was a pretty smart organization, but that was an extraordinarily dumb move.

kuo is in!!!

Kuo pitching for the Suns in the bottom of the 7th.

"DODGERS TAP LOWE TO BE STOPPER" on www.dodgers.com.

This is a most ridiculous headline. Who writes this stuff. Must be self fulfilling quote.

How is Lowe going to be a stopper when he hasn't done it all year?

Zito has a no hitter through 7 innings complete.

Unbelievable. Considering what Harden did last nite

384 - You can't say donkey balls on DT. A suitable replacement would be quadruped cojones.

What's Kuo's velocity look like?

WWSH

LaRoche just made a Beltre-esque barehanded play on a bunt to third base.

399, 400 -- Does us a fat lot of good up here.

#404: They haven't said yet. There have been two quick outs.

Re: 401

What do you expect--the truth on the official site. Then we'd need the same headline every day--WE STINK!

WWSH

Since his last win (including so far tonight) Lowe has gone 33.2IP 24K 52H 9BB 10HR 33R 26ER.

That works out to: 13.9H/9 6.42 K/9 2.4 BB/9 2.67K/BB 2.67HR/9 8.82R/9 6.95 ERA. He makes up for his decent K/BB with absolutely horrendous stats other than that. His H/9 and HR/9 are sickening.

402 -- against Texas.

#406: Time to give up on the big league club. Pick a Dodger farm team and start following them. I'd suggest Ogden since you can go to the home games. They are a much better team than the Dodgers relatively. They have legitimate prospects at C, "1B", 2B, SS, and 3B.

Re: 409

Reminds me of the rut Weaver was in earlier this season. Hopefully Lowe will turn it around.

The season's done, but it'd be nice if we didn't stink so bad.

WWSH

At least tonight Lowe can't blame his defense.

I'm not watching this game or following it on MLB, but I just checked the box score. We've got one hit against Noah Lowry thru four innings?

Not to say Lowe should be taken off the hook for giving up five runs on balls hit in the air. But one lousy hit? This is worse than the drought of '03.

I know that this game was over before it started, but surely Tracy could have pulled the plug earlier. Since Gio is going to allow both of those runs to score (just a guess) Lowe will be credited with tons of extra runs when he probably should have been pulled after the third. Tracy should see the signs, there is a good Lowe (or at least we once thought so) and then there is the Lowe who throws BP out there. And unlike some starters, once Lowe starts to struggle he never gets out of it.

#414: I refer you to post #276.

Kuo throwing low-to-mid nineties. Just threw a devastating change for a strikeout.

3 batters, 3 ks for kuo. with a "devastating change up"

I'm moving back to LA in three weeks; Ogden won't do me any good at that point. If it in fact did me any good at all before.

No more no-no for zito

#416 I thought Werth couldn't play right field.

I thought Saenz was immobilized. Is he playing with a walker?

If Tracy doesn't want to play Choi, then hell, give Jeff Weaver a first baseman's mitt. At least he can run.

Is Kent hurt?

#421 - I thought I heard Vinny say Kent's wrist was hurting tonight. Not positive because I've been paying more attention to the Suns broadcast.

Go Werth!

419 Steve, I bet you are really excited about getting the opportunity to see the Dodgers in person:-). At least tickets should be easy to come by.

Jason Repko, Live!

Paul Quantrill is the punchline to a bad joke. Kevin Towers should be fired for that alone.

Surprising Tracy used Chen and not Choi to pinch hit...

Chad Tracy slams a fly ball that comes down two feet shy of a three-run homerun. Justice only comes to us, never to anyone else.

The only thing good that could come out of this game is Erickson imploding.

The way Dodger luck is going, Erickson will throw a perfect four innings.

More regressing to the mean innings for Erickson. LAT, are you free for picketing in front of the stadium next week?

I think I'm losing it, I actually feel bad for the D's--starting tonight with only one proven major leaguer at a position(Izzy).

Move over, Rover, let Scotty take over...

Peter McGowen doesn't even get dugout club seats.

431 Count me in.

Izturis is useless.

Thank you for participating in tonight's "Lineup Match Game"

The following criteria was used to determine whose lineup was the most accurate to the actual lineup.

1st tiebreaker: Correct players in the actual lineup (1st number in the parenthesis

2nd tiebreaker: Correct players in the actual spot in the batting order (2nd number in the parenthesis)

3rd tiebreaker: Correct positions in the actual position played. (3rd number in the parenthesis)

And now, the results are:

Actual Lineup:
Robles 3B
Izturis SS
Saenz 1B
Phillips C
Perez 2B
Edwards LF
Werth RF
Repko CF
Lowe P

Participants:

181. Bob Timmermann (7)
One man's guess
Izturis SS
Robles 3B
Kent 1B
Phillips C
A Perez 2B
Werth RF
Repko CF
Chen LF
Lowe P

* Sorry Bob, missed out on 2 players

186. Colorado Blue (8,0)
I'm in:
Izturis SS
Repko LF
A Perez 3B
Kent 2B
Saenz 1B
Werth CF
Phillips C
Edwards RF
Lowe P

* in the running until batting order

188. Howard Fox (8,0)
Izturis, ss
APerez, lf
Kent, 2b
Saenz, 1b
Phillips, c
Werth, rf
Repko, cf
Robles, 3b
Lowe, p

* in the running until batting order

194. Steve (8,1)
Izturis
Repko
Kent
Saenz
Perez
Werth
Phillips
Edwards
D.J. Houlton in Lowe's Uniform

* one correct entry in the batting order won it, it would have been better if DJ was pitching tonight instead of Lowe

TONIGHT"S WINNER WAS STEVE, BUT BARELY.

Tonight was tough one to calculate because Tracy really went out to make this unpredictable. This wouldn't be so fun if Tracy wasn't being so unpredictable anyway.

Thanks again for participating. That was fun.

Help--I just saw Lasorda looking dispeptic. Please lord, don't let him get control and trade all our prospects. We might as well just ride this out. Out of all the youngsters, 1 or 2 may emerge and a few prospects may pan. Then if a few fat agents can play a full year, we've got a team.

Reiter coming in. From 14 game winner. To 5th starter. To bullpen. To mop up guy. I actually feel sorry for him. When he shuts the Dodgers out for 3 innings we will know just how far we have fallen.

Wait a minute -- that was DJ Houlton is Lowe's uniform. I demand credit.

I figured they'd let Lowry finish up a shut out...

If there is a Choi, Feliz will hit this one about ten miles.

Just our luck. Erickson gets out of the inning on a HBP-strikeout.

If I wasn't such a masochist I think I would just not watch the Dodger for a couple of weeks and see how things turn out. Unfortunately, I would be curious and end up checking on our ever disappointing move. By the way, barring a comback we will have lost a stellar 6 in a row. This is the second such streak we have had this season (we lost 8 in a row in June). This is the 8th time we have lost 3 games or more in a row (losing streaks of 3 games or more account for 31 of our 49 losses). Meanwhile, since the two big winning streaks at the very beginning, we have only won 3 games in a row twice.

Erickon is just dynamite...

Jason Ellison deserves a fine for striking out against Mrs. Lisa..

I did some dishes, came back, and lo and behold, we have a second hit!

At least Kuo looks like he's back to his dominating self. The velocity will presumably come back with a few more outings. It was irritating to see the current most high profile Taiwanese player be with the Yankees.

WWSH

Choi. Why dost thou smitest me? I call upon thou with mercy, and thou dost not hear.

Choi, why dost thou turn thy angry wrath upon me? I have spoken the Gospel of Choi to the ends of the earth; you have left me forsaken and alone.

But in all things, thy will be done.

Giants announcers make Lowry sound like a stud. They seem to forgot that we're fielding a subpar AAA squad against him.

WWSH

#443: Bob, does this fall under the category of the Curse of Jason Ellison?

Choi is punishing us for benching his namesake for the sake of Mike Edwards. When Tracy of Jimorrah is smitten and Choi riseth from the pine, then Choi will give us blessings unto the endtimes.

WWSH

441 Oldbear, you are right. They showed Reiter warming up and Vin commented on it so I just assumed.

I think this is as low as it gets. Right? Please?

Erickson now with 3 shut out innings...

Regressin to the mean..

Erickson is making a run at Hershiser's scoreless inning streak, I see.

>>When he's ready, however, Kent figures to see a lot of playing time at first base. One of the many reasons for that is the continued spirited play of Antonio Perez, whose best defensive position is Kent's second-base spot.

On Thursday night, Perez had three of the Dodgers' seven hits and stole two bases. Tracy not only praised Perez's .333 batting average, but said he's been impressed with his efficiency executing hit-and-run plays at bat and moving runners over.

However, Tracy indicated that Perez will not be moved to first base, in part because of his size, and the manager seems reluctant to ask Perez to try outfield play.<<

From the Notes on the official site.

This is outrageous--Choi isn't even considered an option anymore at 1B.

Yes, it isn't a surprise, but it still makes me incredibly ANGRY.

With the season done, I think I'd take a last-place finish now to see Tracy get fired.

WWSH

After this game, Giants are 1/2 game behind. This is getting really exciting trying to stay above the Giants.

Is walking Jayson Werth a Grabowski Principle?

Where have I been? Pedro Astacio is with the Padres. Choi on the way up.

At this point the only way for it to get worse would be for Depo to make a disasterous trade like the Mets did last year in a futile effort to get back into it. However, I don't think that will happen. The on field stuff is so bad that at this point I am not worried about it anymore. Who cares if we lose everynight? Who cares if Tracy goes out of his way to construct lineups that are impotent and play poor defense? Who cares if our most expensive pitcher is making me long for the good old days of Kaz Ishii? Who am I kidding, I am broken hearted. God I have to wait 8 months to see baseball again. This year might as well be over.

Hit it out Hee-Seop. Show everyone how much of a dope your manager is!

WWSH

459. Do you follow USC football? We only have to wait couple of months.

Nice AB by Choi. Worked it full and got a walk. Crowd still does the Choi chant. At least they think better of him than our idiot manager.

WWSH

459. Come on Benaiah don't dispair. After tomorrow it will be an exciting nail biter to see if we can catch the Rocks. Then on to the Royals. For good measure, let's see if we can get Lima back for the rest of the season.

Choi and Werth are aboard with walks..

I guess Choi's 7 HR weekend has been forgotten.. As also his 3rd best OPS among Dodger regulars against RHP..

This sounds ridiculous but in his last 11.2 IP Erickson has given up one run. He also has 7 Ks, 5BB, 7H and 0 HR allowed. I assume that this is the payoff for all of the guys he sacrificed to the Devil and I am sure that soon it won't be enough, but he has been somewhat decent lately. That said, take him off the team, it took him a month to get 11.2 IP (and a quarter of that is just tonight).

Look on the bright side, we don't have any errors tonight and Erickson is slowly creeping up and Tracy might be tempted to use him in a meaningful game soon.

We might have something going, if Izzy wasn't on deck. My guess is that Robles works a walk and Izzy GIDP.

WWSH

AZ has bases loaded in SD, top 9

I actually wouldn't mind an Erickson start.

Not becuase I expect him to do well but it is amusing because we can all really get upset and everyone agrees that he should be tossed under a bus. It is one of those occasions where if he sucks, we all expected it, and if he is great then we all feel like lotto winners. Meanwhile, Lowe just gives me heartburn and high blood pressure (I am only 21, I am too young for this!)

That pretty much sums up this game/season

Re: 470

Yep, it really does.

WWSH

I'm looking forward to hearing Tracy's postgame comments on his starting lineup tonight.

So goes Ryne Sandberg's fairly inexplicable prediction that Arizona would sweep the four-game series. Sandberg is seriously hung up on the D-Backs for some strange reason having to do with bias.

51,000 attendence tonight. When will the fans stop coming?

Trying to guess Tracy's lineup is getting more difficult than winning jackpot at Vegas.

If all this losing results in Tracy being fired, Gio/Duaner/Erickson getting released, and Choi playing everyday.. maybe it will be worth it?

If not, this season is a totat waste.

Moneyball talks about the Beane blowing up the A's in May 2002... Later that year they went on to win 20 straight games...

I'm wondering why DePo hasnt blown this thing up yet?

So far this year.. Beane is proving to be the genius, and DePo just average.

It is harder and harder to take this team seriously, but if you love the team its tradition, history and its unique place in baseball-you still follow. However, you can't help but laugh when you see our old friend Shawn Green for the D Backs hitting 288, 15hr, 51 RBI OBP 352 OPS 860 (he leads Beltre in all catagories) In return we have Navarro who some of you say is really behind Martin for ultimate big league catcher, sometimes things don't work out! But I will still follow and still hope.

476. Depo assembled this team so he is going to wait as long as possible before he admits his mistakes.

I actually think it's still too early to see what DePo really wants to do for the season. I saw some comments of his when he said that he wants to see where we're at after the coming 3-4 series or so before he decides on what trading posture to have. Considering how tight the trading market is, we'd probably get better value for someone like Saenz or Izzy if we wait. If the season's done, DePo may then finally persuade Tracy to play Choi regularly and abandon this nonsense of moving Kent to 1B.

WWSH

As Fearing would say "its a small sample size" but Green since All Star break (2 whole games) 5 for 8, 2 BB, 1 HR.

Steve, give me one minute to enjoy it before you bring reality to this post.

I'm glad Green is gone though.

I just wish Trace would play our talented players, and bench the guys that suck.

And do it on a consistent basis.

Firing Tracy and not demanding a more cohesive unit from the top down is a plight against DePo so far.

480 - somebody should be enjoying something.

Izzy with 1 K, 2 foul pop ups to 1st base, and a shallow fly ball to LF...

Please DePo cure us from this nonsense by the deadline.

We are making Tucker an All-Star RF tonight.

483. We shouldn't have rushed to get Izzy off DL. He could have used the extra time for batting practice. Robles was doing more than adequate job of filling in.

It would be a shame if Izzy ends up hitting around .250 by end of season when he started out hitting .350

What happened to Tracy's talent for making lineups out of driftwood? I'm not reading much about that anymore.

480 thanks for my minute.

Thank goodness this is finally over.

Seriously, Phillips may be the slowest man to ever put on a pair of cleats. I would pay to see a Phillips-Molina pay-per view 50 yrd dash. My $$$ on Benji

Well when you put out the lineup that we did tonite, there's almost a vindication in the result that transpired.

A 2 hit shut out...

Thats what you get Tracy when you play the minor leaguers, and leave Choi, Kent, and Ledee on the bench.

Finally, it's over. What a nightmare!!

487. Care to predict tomorrow's lineup?

Yeah no surprises tonight. Maybe except Izzy batting 2nd instead of 1st, and Kent out of the lineup with a sore wrist.

At least the 51,000 in attendance got to watch a pitching clinic by Lowry. Who needs a 90 mph fastball anyways?

488 -- You can have the rest of the week. Choi's career is over anyway.

491. Yeah, I'll take a shot at it. . .I predict it will suck.

How'd I do?

492. Is Kent's sore wrist because he missed the throw at 1st last night and it hit him on the wrist.

Green has 5 homeruns against the Dodgers, 7 against the American League, and that tonight was just his third against the rest of the National League. He's hitting .341 against the Padres though.

487: I think Tracy's just making his lineups from reading tea leaves now. Or he might be drawing from a hat or throwing darts...

496. Fair and balanced reporting.

494. Must have missed your earlier post. Can you tell me which one.

Look at #437 for tonight's results.

Steve was winner.

Is it a coincidence that Bonds issues a release that he may not play this year on the same day Victor Conti pleads guilty. Are we all supposed to say, "Please Barry please comeback." Are we supposed to be forget about he whole steroid thing.

He's slugging .700 against the Dodgers, so whatever he's taking to convince himself that the Dodgers did him wrong after $70 million in his pocket, it's working.

Anyone know how many different lineups Tracy has come up with this year. Maybe Tracy is trying to be creative and come up with as many different lineups as possible.

Is it too late to grab a seat on the next ship to Deep Space Nine?

Steve, he's not mad at the Dodgers, its just that Dodger pitching is amung the worst. I think 3 or 4 of those HR's are agasint Lowe-which explains alot. Imagine if the D'Backs were playing the Dodgers tonight.

I think we are all disappointed that the best lineup possible isn't out there. The sad part is that if the Dodgers win, the media will tout Tracy as some sort of genius.

Maybe Iz should be practicing his swing in a rehab assignment? Or did he do that already?

Doesn't the GM have some authority in determining who plays or not since he is acquiring the players and determining who stays on the roster. If so, then why is Depo being so passive.

If Depo continues to get players and Tracy doesn't want to use them and vice versa, then how is this going to work out.

I get all my Shawn Green information from www.shawngreenstinks.com, though it hasn't been updated in a couple of weeks. The webmaster there suggests that Zack Greinke and Scott Erickson have been very kind to him.

How many feel that Tracy will make it through the end of the season.

Sports Center is all over Zito's 1 hitter, no mention of Lowery's 2 hitter.

Just showed Huston/St Louis game. Pujols is such a stud.

JtD is like Pujols, but shortstoppier

508. Steve that's cause Green hasn't given them much material lately.

Tracy's not going anywhere soon (hey, kind of like the team!). To think otherwise is wishful thinking.

Sports Center just showed Dodger, or should I say Giant highlights and didn't even mention it was a 2 hitter.

I thought this caption was funny:

"Cesar Izturis had no problem being dropped to second in the batting order"
http://tinyurl.com/czlw9

If Tracy weren't such a dope, the caption would read *eigth not second.

507... Good points and thats what I cant understand. I really dont think it can work. So i'm interested in how this all plays out in the fall?

From reading Moneyball I thought Beane was the cut throat and DePo even keel, but DePo is just down right passive.

At the very least get a manager in here that plays the best parts that you give him...

499 ddger, I tried, I really did. Then I started getting a headache and couldn't feel my limbs anymore. Its just so taxing to go through the entire line up but here goes:

Izturis SS
A. Perez 3B
Kent 2B
Saenz 1B
Phillips C
Edwards LF
Werth RF
Repko CF
O. Perez P

Final score Giants 4, Dodgers 5. Perez does not get W, pouts and tells media he was told to keep his mouth shut in violation of his First Amendment right.

516 Given his willingness to move anyone, including, high profile players, it hard to call Depo passive. I have to believe there is something else going on, such as Depo doesn't have a problem with JT's line-ups or Frank has issued a edict or something else we don't know about.

518-- But why wouldnt DePo have a problem with Tracy's lineup?

DePo brought in Choi because he OPS'ed .883 for the Marlins over 340 Plate appearances in 2004. We've seen this year what Choi can do when getting regular time.. He can get incredibly hot and carry a team. DePo has to see (since he's a stats guy), that Choi OPS's .820 overall this year when the starting 1st basemen... Thats he's the best 1st base option on the team.

DePo also has to see that Antonio Perez, Ricky Ledee can both swing the bat.

DePo also has to see that Izturis is an out machine, that should never bat in the top of the lineup.

DePo has to see that Repko, Grabs cant hit to save their lives...

DePo has to see that Duaner Sanchez, Carrara, and Erickson serve no purpose on this team..

If we all see it, you're telling me that DePo cant?

I just cant understand how DePo could endorse the moves that Tracy makes. It goes totally contradictory to DePo's sabermetric background.

I fast forwarded through this game. After I saw Tucker's leadoff homer, I figured, "OK, not a good day for Lowe."

DePodesta is not going to put pressure on Tracy to play Choi because Tracy will rat on DePodesta to his friends in the media, who will in turn write retarded Modplaschkers-level nonsense about the "GM running the team" yadda yadda yadda, which will do DePodesta no good, because Tracy is gone after 2006 at the latest, and DePodesta would like to remain as GM of the Dodgers after that, even though Derek Lowe is working very hard to ensure that he will not.

#518: Edict from above sounds about right. Perhaps Sitrick & Co. strongly encouraged McCourt to keep Tracy, both in the offseason and now due to the PR nightmare that would occur if he were let go.

This game wasn't as close as the score would indicate right?

Did anyone at any point after the first inning still think the Dodgers would win?

It's so hard to be a Dodger fan right now...

Responsible parties for Today's loss:

Lowe (70%)
Offense (20%)
Tracy's Lineup (10%)

519 That's my point. It defies logic so it must be something else. Something we don't know about. Although I think Steve and Fearing are probably correct that bad press has a lot to do with it. In additon, even though I don't think he deserves to be fired, there would be little point in firing JT now. It would be viewed as an admission that re-signing Tracy was wrong and one thing this group doesn't do is admit they may have made a mistake.

525 ddger, I think that is a very fair allocation.

Perhaps on Saturday the Curse of Jason Ellison will be reversed. You never know.

Wouldnt the additional wins (from Tracy being fired, bad players being released, good players being played everyday) offset any negative media bashing??

If the Dodgers front office is being intimidated by the media, it truly is a sad time to be bleeding blue.

Parrish the thought that DePo would cower in fear over the printed words of idiots (Simers, Plashcke)...

I cant logically buy the media conspiracy because DePo traded Loduca, and despite the massive bad press the Dodgers have passed 2 mils in attendance faster than anytime before.

The end game is somebody has to "take" Tracy. Tracy is the New Cora. He's so smart, he's so clutch, he's so OPSing .550. It's not so much "Fire Jim Tracy" anymore as "Just Sit Around And Wait For Some Team To Be Dumb Enough To Offer Jim Tracy A Million Five To Bunt Them Into Nowheresville"

I still say it's the Reds, though I am not familiar with the local media there. Would he be able to store as much credit with their reporters as with our credulous yahoos, and therefore be able to survive the next decade of 70 win seasons?

If not, Philadelphia is very close to Ohio. Pittsburgh would be on the list, but they need McClendon to take tickets.

In 1992 and 1993 the Giants had chances to sweep a four game series in L.A.

Each time, Kevin Gross beat the Giants in the last game.

In 1992, Gross threw a no-hitter.
In 1993, Gross won Game #162 to eliminate the Giants.

Right now, Lowe is pitching the worst among our starters. Is it possible that Erickson might get a start and Lowe can work out of bullpen. Can Erickson pitch any worse.

532

yes.

533. Yes to Erickson gets a start or can Erickson pitch any worse.

This dodger season is turning out to be like the Lakers season. Boy, I can't wait till football season.

Feel bad for the season ticket holders this year.

Tonight's loss was really disturbing. I now look forward to reading Fearing Blue's detailed report on our Minor Leaguers each day so that I can have some hope for the future.

Hmm, from checking it looks like the Giants have never swept a four game series from the Dodgers in L.A. Of course, they don't play four-game series all that often, maybe one every other year.

538. Anything is possible this year. Your prediction might come to pass tomorrow.

#522
Perhaps Sitrick & Co. strongly encouraged McCourt to keep Tracy, both in the offseason and now due to the PR nightmare that would occur if he were let go.

What PR nightmare? Jim Tracy has little loyalty among the LA fans. Mostly he's been associated with frustration, sometimes unfairly. The Times might declare it unfair scapegoating, but the Dodgers don't care. It won't affect attendance. If they start winning more games, the flak will die quickly. DePo would have to be pretty certain that the new guy would have an impact. When you fire someone from a prominent job, you always discover that you're be judged by who you name to take their place. If it was Jim Tracy for Orel Hershiser, or Jim Tracy for Lou Piniella, Jim Tracy would be quickly forgotten. If it was Jim Tracy for interim manager Glenn Hoffman and appointment of a "search committee," that would be a "PR nightmare."

535.

At least we kind of knew the Lakers were gonna suck...

As far as I can tell the last time the Giants ever swept a four-game series from the Dodgers in the Dodgers home park was in 1923. April 20-23. The Giants won the NL that year.

However, the Brooklyn Dodgers and New York Giants rarely ever played four-game series. Since the two teams were so close together, they would often schedule 1-game series against each other throughout the season to fill in the schedule in spots.

It will be matter of time before the dodgers are relegated to the last page of LA Times.

540. I dunno Ratt. I agree the fans will focus on the new mananger but until LA wins more games I think the casual fan likes JT. Moreover, the Times would have a field day with it. If I were Frank and Paul, I would just play out the season and encourage JT to start takling to some other teams in the off season. Then if he goes, it appears he left of his choice. Frank and Paul can feign disappointment and everyone saves face. Sitrick points out how they avoided a messy PR battle and convinces Frank to give him a raise. A win-win-win.

I didn't check, but I believe that it's also equally rare for the Dodgers to sweep a four-game series from the Giants in San Francisco. Or for Brooklyn to do it in New York.

I can't fall asleep after tonight's loss. WE DIDN'T EVEN COMPETE TONIGHT. At least we had chances in other games. Tonight, we were out of it by 3rd inning and I had no hope that we can even make it a game. Even though the final score was only 6-0, it felt like 16-0.

If Jim Tracy is the first Dodger manager in 62 years to preside over a Giant four-game sweep in the Dodgers' house, I think the odds on his firing skyrocket. Aside from the atavistic impact on the rivalry, the Giants are just as lousy as the Dodgers right now. The Dodgers have no business lying down for them. This is not the 1962 Giants. It's not even the 1978 Giants. This is a Giant team that is barely presentable. If Tracy can't motivate this team to rise up tomorrow and Sunday and slay the beast, then I think even the Times starts to question his capabilities.

Maybe Salamon Torres will pitch Sunday.

This is a Dodger team that is barely presentable as well.

Tracy would fit in here in Cincy. The local media is more apt to hammer the nutty ownership than managers and coaches.

540-- I've long endorsed Orel Hershiser as a great canidate to become Dodgers manager.

It makes sense on a ton of levels, both from a baseball and media standpoint.

Orel Hershiser is a Dodger history. Bringing him back to the organization as manager could only be written as a positive by the anti-Dodger media.

Second, he's a student of the game. I think he'd be open to DePo's philospies on it.

3rd, as a former pitcher and current pitching coach, I think he'd be better at handling the pitcing staff than JimBo.

Orel Hershiser as Dodger Manager makes so much sense that there's no possiblity that it will happen.

Lloyd McClendon. Now there is a guy who is the anti-Tracy. I love how he throws second base around. He'd handle an Odalis Perez no problem.

Thoughts from the real world: The Dodgers began to stink out the joint long before the
injuries had a momentum of their own. You can make reasonable judgments about this young gm based on his work since last July. A fan of his hiring, I have become a skeptic, and am amazed at how much continuing support there seems to be for him here. $88 mil is still a huge chunk of change relative to the Twins and A's and Injuns and Brewers. Against a storm of public criticisms, I wrote in winter and spring that I really liked what Billy was doing in Oakland, didn't like at all what Paul was doing in LA. The only signing I had any genuine enthusiasm for was Jeff Kent's. He's a pro's pro - but even that good feel was qualified by his age (and the consequent brittleness that comes to all males of that age, no matter previous injury history - Mister McGriff anyone?).
There was a whole string of "what's wrong with Derek?" tonite. Did any of you watch him before October of last year? There's nothing wrong with him - he's essentially the same pitcher he was from May to September.
At the dollars and duration of that semi-insane contract, he was very high risk to disappoint, shaky faith about the Lourdes-like effects of his new home park
notwithstanding.
I see there's gonna be hope when Mister .194 comes back. WHAAAAAAATTTTTT??????
Drew, Perez, Ledee, Alvarez, Don't-Breathe-
Near-Him-Bradley: all extended trips to the DL, and each eminently foreseeable, if not down-right predictable. Once again, no, the gm is not responsible for every ache and pain
- but like any decent insurance actuary, he's responsible for a hard-edged sense of what any collection of bodies with calculable histories is likely to offer. In almost every instance, he overpaid in dollars and days for bodies that have for a long time been labelled, "fragile." The cost is leagues beyond the benefits. He is no Billy Beane, and wishing will not make him so, any more than some of the silly tripe about that so-far modestly-credentialled "juggernaut"
down in Jacksonville being ready to do anything but embarrass itself, night after night, against an even depleted roster like this week's Dodgers', or Rockies' or even Royals and Devil-Rays. For anyone to offer the notion as other than playful jest suggests need for a wide-ranging re-education about the "pitch" of the game at various levels.
Just one more old man's warning to those of you who invest a lot in this enterprise: notice how many of the previous
"can't miss" prizes in the Dodger and Angel organizations are already judged to have gone missing, before even making an appearance.
Let the youngsters actually get to the majors, and play a few full seasons, before hitching your emotional wagon to their "stars" - whatever their long-range brilliance is currently guessed to be.....though I will confess I was a supporter of the notion that this year was a great opportunity for them to at least begin the testing. (Instead, came Jose' and Ledee...)
Just a quick in and out, sufferin' Blues.
I'd be lyin' if I said I was sharin' your pain. I abandonned this ship when the not-quite-ready-for-prime-time-Paulie overhauled it this winter and spring....Be well, young and old, man and woman, pro and anti-whatever!!!! Just resist any temptation to respond with that "20-20 hindsight" hiccup. I said all this stuff, one way and another, in March. As the Ole Perfesser useta
say, "You could look it up!"

Ah yes, those "predictable" wrist breaks again and finger ligaments again. The Dodgers don't need doctors; they need psychics.

#553: I am very comfortable with my assessment of what the Dodgers should have been. I don't think we were ever going to be a .600 team, but I think we could have very easily been a .550 - .575 team and won our division with a reasonable number of breaks.

Fearing, I went back to the "real world" to see the layout. Now they are convinced that Drew is a much bigger bust then Derek Lowe.

Remind me not to go out into the "real world"

#556: J.D. Drew of the 4.9 WARP for $11 million vs. Derek Lowe of the 1.6 WARP for $9 million? If Drew doesn't play another game this year, he'll still be more valuable than Lowe. And that doesn't account for the next 3 years, which look a lot worse for Lowe than for Drew.

But Lowe is a mighty warrior, whereas JD Drew does wussy things like get his wrist broken by a pitch