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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

How Many Rookies Tonight?
2006-06-02 16:30
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

Don't know yet at press time ...

* * *

Tonight's Game

Comments (653)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2006-06-02 16:38:31
1.   Greg Brock
Well, Jon established the Over/Under at 3 1/2, and I'll take the over. Kemp, Martin, Ethier, and Guzman at third.
2006-06-02 16:42:47
2.   JoeyP
Definitely over.

I'll go with Kemp, Martin, Guzman, and Aybar.

2006-06-02 16:43:57
3.   natepurcell
this is my lineup

furcal
kemp
nomar
drew
aybar
ethier
guzman
martin
seo

2006-06-02 16:44:43
4.   sanchez101
under.

Ethier, Guzman, Martin

I think he'll Grittle will play Lofton today with Kemp playing against the lefty tomorrow.

2006-06-02 16:45:34
5.   Greg Brock
Whoah, Nate goes 5 rooks deep. You, sir, are a man.
2006-06-02 16:49:31
6.   sanchez101
3. I cant tell you how happy that lineup would make me
2006-06-02 16:54:49
7.   natepurcell
jered weaver looks pretty good. he looks exactly like his brother but pitches differently. his fb is 90-93 with a more deceptive delivery.
2006-06-02 16:59:14
8.   Linkmeister
Prime Ticket via Oceanic Cable seems to think the game starts right now, but Gameday thinks otherwise. Who's right?
2006-06-02 17:00:34
9.   Andrew Shimmin
He's got to be taller and skinnier than Jeff. The gun was off while I was watching, so I couldn't tell how fast he was. But I agree that he's looking pretty good.
2006-06-02 17:00:46
10.   Greg Brock
Yesterday's replay is on now
2006-06-02 17:01:21
11.   Andrew Shimmin
8- It's a 7:40 start time, out here. So, two hours and forty-ish minutes before game time.
2006-06-02 17:04:20
12.   Marty
7 Does he look like he just passed the bong?
2006-06-02 17:07:56
13.   Linkmeister
10, 11 Ah. That explains the tv sked's shorthand. Thanks.
2006-06-02 17:08:48
14.   Greg Brock
Look for the (R) in the game description. Denotes a replay
2006-06-02 17:10:45
15.   DXMachina
I'll take the over. I think it's going to be four. I don't think Grady will play Kemp against the righty.
2006-06-02 17:12:18
16.   natepurcell
Does he look like he just passed the bong?

always to the left, right Marty? :)

2006-06-02 17:13:40
17.   natepurcell
15

grady isnt tracy, he played kemp against a righty last night and tonight's righty isnt that much better.

2006-06-02 17:15:20
18.   Andrew Shimmin
With the way Weaver is scowling, my guess is that he isn't too big on sharing.
2006-06-02 17:17:14
19.   Andrew Shimmin
17- Well, if Lofton is going to play, it ought to be against a righty. Even though Kemp and Ethier have played well, I don't think Lofton's lost his spot altogether.
2006-06-02 17:17:22
20.   natepurcell
scott kazmire lite update from one of his coaches:

Kiker is in Milwaukee today for a workout with the Brewers. Had a workout in Texas that took his name out the hat for their first round pick. Also worked out for braves and didn't do as well as he had hoped there, Braves are out, Rangers out. Dodgers still considering him at 26 and 31.

2006-06-02 17:18:31
21.   Linkmeister
14 You've never seen Oceanic's on-screen program guide. It gives about eight letters worth of description, and parenthetical info isn't part of it.
2006-06-02 17:19:39
22.   DXMachina
17. But I also don't think he'll sit both Cruz and Lofton two nights in a row.
2006-06-02 17:19:52
23.   Greg Brock
21-

Not only that, but their planes crash all the time.

2006-06-02 17:19:56
24.   Bob Timmermann
Does Oceanic have a Channel 815?
2006-06-02 17:22:49
25.   confucius
22. I hope he saves Cruz for the Lefty. That way Drew or Ethier can get a day off. Drew needs to rest that shoulder anyway.
2006-06-02 17:25:13
26.   bhsportsguy
From Dodgers.com

The under wins but Grady does keep doing things like putting Guzman in the 4 slot.

Furcal, SS
Lofton, CF
Garciaparra, 1B
Guzman, 3B
Aybar, 2B
Ethier, LF
Cruz, RF
Alomar, C
Seo, P

2006-06-02 17:26:04
27.   bhsportsguy
I meant the lineup is from the site, the comment is mine.
2006-06-02 17:26:21
28.   natepurcell
lineup

Furcal, SS

Lofton, CF

Nomar, 1B

Guzman, 3B

Aybar, 2B

Ethier, LF

Cruz, RF

Alomar, C

Seo, P

2006-06-02 17:26:30
29.   Bob Timmermann
After Garciaparra, that is one freaky lineup.
2006-06-02 17:26:41
30.   Marty
Lofty will light a fire under Guzzy tonight.
2006-06-02 17:27:39
31.   Greg Brock
Plays Alomar and kills the over. Whatta jerk.
2006-06-02 17:27:47
32.   Marty
Figgins just made a great play in center, allowing Hudler to make my headache worse.
2006-06-02 17:28:25
33.   confucius
Wow, that lineup sucks. Drew and Martin need a day off, but not on a day I have tickets!!
2006-06-02 17:29:49
34.   Linkmeister
24 Now that's funny. I'll double check. Prime Ticket is 228; ABC HD is 936 (You'd think they could have negotiated a tie-in, right?).

815 is a music channel called "Retro-Active," which (from a very brief listen) sounds like electronica-metal.

2006-06-02 17:30:59
35.   confucius
I'm going to close my eyes and pretend I am watching Nate's lineup.
2006-06-02 17:31:13
36.   bhsportsguy
Maybe if you hit a home run you get the next game off.

33 - I agree with you, I'll be there tonight also.

2006-06-02 17:31:23
37.   D4P
I expected to see Alomar, but not to see Guzman batting cleanup. But, given that group of 9 players, I guess Guzman makes as much sense there as anyone else.
2006-06-02 17:32:38
38.   natepurcell
I dont mind alomar is playing but kemp should be playing. stop sitting him every other game.
2006-06-02 17:32:56
39.   confucius
37.
Yeah, you know Saenz will get that start against the lefty on Sat.
2006-06-02 17:33:39
40.   Steve
It's madcap. It's wacky. I love it.
2006-06-02 17:34:13
41.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Guzman in the 4-hole? Whoooo!
2006-06-02 17:34:33
42.   Greg Brock
Okay, now over/under on Guzman's LOB number tonight...I'd put it at 5 1/2...And take the over. Strikeout City, USA on curves away...Shades of a young Dominican appendectomy victim.
2006-06-02 17:35:56
43.   confucius
What is their record when Alomar starts, like 1-11??
2006-06-02 17:36:25
44.   natepurcell
42

1-4 2b 2ks

2006-06-02 17:37:08
45.   Steve
I love that someone went over to the Dodger blog and used the nickname Joel the Destroyer.
2006-06-02 17:38:32
46.   natepurcell
45

maybe it will pick up

the bull
the buffalo (sorry Bob)
the destroyer

we need more!

2006-06-02 17:39:53
47.   D4P
At this point, I'm only comfortable with

Joel the Slight Discombobulator

2006-06-02 17:40:38
48.   D4P
Willy "The Pedestrian" Aybar
2006-06-02 17:41:00
49.   Sam DC
Hey Steve - it was clear from my correction in the last thread that I was libeling Andrew with the Nancy Grace thing, not you, right?

Miltie -- wasn't that big brawl against Seattle but at Dodger Stadium? I ask 'cause I was at such a brawl, sitting right by the bullpen. I got a ball that day signed by everyone in the pen, including Rick Dempsey and he got himself ejected the very same day! (That's got to be worth something, right?)

2006-06-02 17:41:14
50.   Bob Timmermann
46
Speak not of the "buffalo" unless you put it in quotes.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2006-06-02 17:42:19
51.   Sam DC
Nationals-Milwaukee, Gameday has a pitcher of Royce Clayton and it says "In Play-Run Scoring Play," so apparently something is on the frits at MLBAM.
2006-06-02 17:42:35
52.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
46 - Wasn't Mondesi nicknamed "Buffalo?"
Then again, are buffaloes native to Hispaniola?
2006-06-02 17:43:03
53.   Steve
Well, libeling Andrew is ok, I guess. :)
2006-06-02 17:43:28
54.   Greg Brock
Joel the Rearranger would be more appropriate at this point, methinks. Actual destruction is needed before one can be a destroyer. Heck, I'll even give him Joel the Slight Damager.
2006-06-02 17:46:12
55.   Ryan Jerz
How many Dodgers have made their startig debut in the 4 slot?
2006-06-02 17:47:27
56.   Linkmeister
55 Jimmy Wynn?
2006-06-02 17:48:16
57.   Bob Timmermann
Unless there's a zoo, I doubt there is a buffalo or a bison on the island of Hispaniola.

I can't wait to get home to have my gnuburger.

2006-06-02 17:48:55
58.   Steve
You backsliders. It's Joel the Destroyer, and Joel the Destroyer is as it will be.
2006-06-02 17:49:53
59.   Andrew Shimmin
49- Hey! I thought you were libeling Steve, too. I think it's funnier if directed at Steve, but, then, I would.

Confession: I've been watching some Becker, lately. I don't hate it. It's not good, sure, but at two in the morning, it's not too bad. Sort of a proto-Curb Your Enthusiasm. . . No? Alright. Still.

2006-06-02 17:52:33
60.   Sam DC
No wait a minute, sorry, and that anyone -- anyone -- cares, but it was Eric that watched only H networks. He's the NancyGraceophile. Which is after all the funnients option out of the lot of you.

Is there some sort of baseball game on tonight?

2006-06-02 17:53:03
61.   Greg Brock
Actually, Becker and Curb have a lot in common.

1) They're both about humans
2) They both happpen on Earth...Of the present
3) Ted Danson's rug
4) Dolph Lungren is in neither of them.

Yup, that's about it.

2006-06-02 17:53:03
62.   thinkingblue
When will Little realize, CRUZ CAN'T HIT RIGHTIES!!!!!!!!!!!! Also, Kemp>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Cruz.

Bad move.

2006-06-02 17:58:02
63.   Andrew Shimmin
58- Hi, my name is Steve, and, while I seem to have a plank in my Grady-loving eye, I'd like to speak to you about the JtD-doubting speck in yours. Do you have a minute?
2006-06-02 17:58:40
64.   Zak
Wait, the short annoying guy on Becker is NOT Dolph Lundgren??
2006-06-02 17:59:58
65.   thinkingblue
by the way, has anyone noticed that pitchers are getting and unusually large amount of fastballs past Aybar these days?
2006-06-02 18:02:05
66.   Andrew Shimmin
61- I'm not going to defend Becker, and it's entirely possible that what I like about it is mostly a function of being giddy with sleep deprivation. But the miserable people being surly and cruel to each other--well, it's familiar; I don't know.
2006-06-02 18:02:51
67.   Steve
63 -- Becker-lover! Becker-lover!
2006-06-02 18:03:23
68.   Greg Brock
Weaver the Younger is absolutely dealing right now. Seven K's through 5 1/3
2006-06-02 18:04:27
69.   thinkblue0
you really can't defend Becker....but then again, I don't think anyone can defend stuff like will and grace either...but whatever, personally I don't see how anyone finds any sitcoms that are on tv funny.
2006-06-02 18:05:58
70.   Greg Brock
67-
Hey, any excuse to stare at Nancy Travis's gams is fine by me. Plus, the blind newsstand guy was great in PCU. Favreau, Piven, Spade, Jessica Walters...what a cast. PCU, I salute thee.
2006-06-02 18:06:55
71.   sanchez101
69. then you need to watch the office
2006-06-02 18:08:40
72.   regfairfield
Apparently Angel baseball involves pitching, hitting, defense, and base running.
2006-06-02 18:11:56
73.   Greg Brock
Hey Sanchez...Dwight's speech might be the funniest thing I've seen on TV since GOB wanted to sell bees on Arrested Development. "BLOOD ALONE MOVES THE WHEELS OF HISTORY! WE MUST NEVER CONCEDE CONTROL OF THE MOTHERLAND!"
2006-06-02 18:13:22
74.   regfairfield
How do these team meetings that magically turn the team around work:

Scoscia: Hey guys, stop swinging at everything.

Team: Oh, that's what we've been doing wrong!

2006-06-02 18:14:38
75.   Andrew Shimmin
70- Right! I forgot about that. The Nancy Travis, Cheryl Hines parallel. Except, with Becker, he doesn't get the girl, which seems the more realistic situation. I love CYE, but, really, would that guy be married to Cheryl Hines? Alright. Absolutely the last word on the matter, from me.
2006-06-02 18:16:39
76.   sanchez101
73.
perhaps my favorite quote ever:
"would you rather be loved or hated?
Scott: "I want people to hate how much they love me"
2006-06-02 18:17:40
77.   thinkblue0
71-

one of my friends (BJ Novak) is on that show. But I don't consider it a sitcom really...much like I don't consider Curb Your Enthusiasm a sitcom and that's the funniest show ever.

Just the real sitcoms like Friends, Will and Grace, Everybody Love Raymond...I just don't get how anyone finds that stuff funny.

2006-06-02 18:17:57
78.   D4P
73
"Bees?"
"Beads"
"Bees?"
"Beads"

"Buzzzzz....."
"He's back on bees again"

2006-06-02 18:18:20
79.   sanchez101
75. I agree. No way Larry David gets a girl like her, although he does have plenty of cash. Its funny to me because George Kostanza always seemed to be dating girls beyond his league.
2006-06-02 18:19:54
80.   Greg Brock
Two favorite Quotes:

"Well, it's Thursday, but Dwight thinks it's Friday, so that's what I'll be working on this afternoon."--Jim

"If all those women stay in that office too long, they'll all get on the same cycle...Wreak havoc on our plumbing."--Dwight

2006-06-02 18:23:29
81.   Brian Y
45. Yeah that was me. I figured JtD was a bit too much for Josh Rawitch to handle at this point. A few more Joel the Destroyer comments and I'll start incorporating JtD into the lingo :)
2006-06-02 18:27:42
82.   Steve
Absolutely the last word on the matter, from me.

A likely story. It's a good thing Will and Grace got cancelled, or you would still be raving about it to this day. Not to mention My Mother the Car

2006-06-02 18:39:37
83.   Linkmeister
82 (Showing my age here):

What about "Car 54 Where Are You?"

2006-06-02 18:44:17
84.   Greg S
A point I've been wanting to make and now seems as good a time as any...
Eddie Murray deserves a little credit. He got fired by the Indians last year and they started hitting the day after. People blamed him (and still do) as if his years of working with those kids wasn't the reason they were hitting; his leaving was. Ridiculous. But if he gets all the blame, doesn't he deserve a lot of credit for a team full of rookies and old timers that is leading the NL in runs?
2006-06-02 18:47:10
85.   sanchez101
I think Murray doesnt get credit because he doesnt speak to the press. This is just another reason to like him, but I dont think you can give him "all" the credit.
2006-06-02 18:47:46
86.   Greg S
Not all the credit. How bout a little?

AND...
Murray worked with Nomar all winter and spring on how to play first base (a position where Eddie has played more games than anyone in the history of the sport). Nomar has been nearly perfect. Coincidence? Nobody remembers but Murray was on the Angels and worked with Erstad on his move from Center to First. Result: Gold Glove. Coincidence?

2006-06-02 18:49:47
87.   D4P
Nomar has been nearly perfect

I hear this a lot. Yet Nomar's Rate2 at 1B this year is a below average 94. Why is it that so many people "perceive" that Nomar has been great at 1B when the stats suggest otherwise?

2006-06-02 18:51:26
88.   Greg S
87
Ummm watching him?
He's been excellent and I find it hard to believe that anyone who has been watchin all year would disagree.
2006-06-02 18:51:31
89.   Steve
This just in from the newswire:

Oliver Perez is still terrible. All you fantasy baseball owners can re-waive him again.

Now back to your regularly scheduled Becker Marathon.

2006-06-02 18:52:47
90.   Steve
one of my friends (BJ Novak)

I just watched the one last night where he sets fire to the building with his pita. I think he wrote it. Good stuff.

2006-06-02 18:53:00
91.   D4P
88
Yet the people who calculate the Rate2 stat do so by "watching him," don't they? In fact, don't they watch every single play he makes/doesn't make?
2006-06-02 18:53:30
92.   kegtron
Is Matt Kemp's nickname set in stone? If not, how about M. Bison after the Street Fighter character.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Bison

2006-06-02 18:54:30
93.   Bob Timmermann
Scott Erickson in to relieve in the 8th for the Yankees with a 2-run lead with one out and one on:
Hits Conine with a pitch
Gives up a double to Matos score a run
Intentionally walks Roberts
Farnsworth comes in to replace him.
2006-06-02 18:55:19
94.   Sam DC
Farnsworth tryng for a little redemption in Baltimore -- in with bases loaded, one run lead, botom of the 8th, 1 out, Mora up.
2006-06-02 18:57:57
95.   Andrew Shimmin
Doesn't Rate2 count on a player getting a statistically average number of chances? So, if fewer balls are hit to the position than are expected, that player's Rate will be artificially low, even though he hasn't done anything wrong? Fielding stats are tricky, necessarily, but still.
2006-06-02 18:58:39
96.   Icaros
92

Yes! I was going to say that yesterday but figured no one above 35 would get it.

I didn't even think about the M standing for Matt.

Perfect.

2006-06-02 18:59:58
97.   D4P
95
I'm not sure, but if you're right, then that would certainly cast doubt on the stat. But doesn't the term "Rate2" suggest that it is a "rate" stat that shouldn't depend upon the number of chances?
2006-06-02 19:02:25
98.   Bob Timmermann
Does anyone want to drop by Bronx Banter after the Orioles tied the game up against the Yankees and the Red Sox just went ahead of Detroit on a 2-out, 2-run homer by Youkilis in the 9th?
2006-06-02 19:04:27
99.   D4P
98
Sure, let's go. We can tease them about the Frieze. (A little thing I like to call the "Frieze Tease")
2006-06-02 19:04:53
100.   Linkmeister
98 I dunno. You think it's safe?
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2006-06-02 19:06:25
101.   Andrew Shimmin
BP's definition of Rate2:

http://tinyurl.com/leoor

Well, that settles it. . .

2006-06-02 19:06:51
102.   Greg S
All I know is that Nomar has one error all year and that I've watched him range to both sides well and throw well. If there's a stat out there that says he's not playing well, that stat is in serious question. Is there really anybody out there that believes that he has not exceeded expectations defensively?
2006-06-02 19:07:00
103.   kegtron
96

The movie came out not too long ago and the cartoon still gets aired on cable.

Street Fighter II is probably my favorite arcade game ever. I was unstoppable with Guile. I could never do that handcuff move though.

2006-06-02 19:07:19
104.   sanchez101
97. no, rate just refers to the fact that its per 100 games. You shouldnt be suprised that people think he's a good 1B because he does look great out their. More to the point, fielding stats arent exactly the most reliable stats, according to rate2 Repke was an excellent CF last year. According to other metrics he was the worst in baseball.
2006-06-02 19:09:10
105.   Bob Timmermann
99
An architectural expert informed that the thingee in Yankee Stadium is not even a frieze.

It's a fascia.

Needless to say, I was horrified that I had wasted all that self-righteousness.

2006-06-02 19:15:26
106.   Sam DC
Damon caught stealing second to end the top of the ninth, tie game w/Jeter at the plate - but then he wasn't b/c turns out the ball wasn't in Roberts' glove.

Scored a CS, E4.

2006-06-02 19:15:45
107.   Andrew Shimmin
97- If it were just actual number of chances fielded cleanly, then it would Fielding Percentage. Nomar's F% is a stellar .997. His range factor is 10.21, which would make him the 6th rangiest 1B in the MLB today, if he qualified.
2006-06-02 19:20:44
108.   D4P
I was horrified that I had wasted all that self-righteousness.

I'm sure you have some left...

2006-06-02 19:24:33
109.   xaphor
[92] Do we really want Kemp named after a guy beaten by Van Damme in a beret?
2006-06-02 19:27:16
110.   Andrew Shimmin
Kent's Rate2 is 119. So, he's probably taking more of the balls hit to the right side. There is (if I'm right about Rate2, which I wouldn't mind anybody confirming, were he so inclined) a zero-sumness about Rate2, so it would make sense. Also, regfairfield was writing about this the other day and speculated that Nomar's heigth might be limiting his fielding. That wouldn't be necessarily obvious while watching, since you'd blame the guy who threw over his head, instead of Nomar for being short. But the end result would be the same.

Still, Nomar has looked might good.

2006-06-02 19:27:33
111.   sanchez101
I am firmly in the anti-bison/buffalo camp.
2006-06-02 19:28:36
112.   Andrew Shimmin
That preview box does what, again? Sorry.
2006-06-02 19:31:54
113.   Greg S
Guzman is fond of the word "definitely"
2006-06-02 19:34:57
114.   Underbruin
110 - Yeah, good point. Doesn't Furcal seem to have a lot of throwing errors this year, despite a reputation as an excellent SS? He had 15 errors all of last season (though admittedly that was by far his best year) throwing to the 6'3", left-handed Adam LaRoche (I would imagine reaching for throws to be simpler as a lefty as you're not worrying about putting your back to the runner). Right now he's on track for 33, his highest total ever. Not that errors are a good mark of how well a player is actually fielding, but perhaps one might be able to contribute at least part of the rise to this fact?
2006-06-02 19:36:06
115.   Underbruin
Oh, and I'm glad there'll be no pressure on Joel Guzman in his first career start in the majors. Batting 4th isn't considered important or anything, right?
2006-06-02 19:36:32
116.   D4P
Count me among those who did not expect the Heat to defeat the Pistons, though I'm glad they did.
2006-06-02 19:40:44
117.   underdog
Hah. I like Vin Scully talking about the "children are here" - wasn't sure if he was referring to the players on the field or kids in the stand.

Yeah, Guzman batting clean-up, a little, uh, surprising? Should be interesting. Is Drew aching again, or just getting a rest?

2006-06-02 19:41:18
118.   Marty
That doesn't seem like a bad 1-6 for Philly. I wonder why they are not scoring runs. Or at least I think Vin said they aren't scoring many so far.
2006-06-02 19:41:18
119.   sanchez101
im glad the pistons lost, im not so happy that the heat won
2006-06-02 19:42:55
120.   Marty
I'm happy for Shaq. I was sorry to see him go. I think he was the one that had to move on, but it was too bad. Plus the Lakers got nada for him.
2006-06-02 19:43:18
121.   D4P
Steve Lyons would like that HR.
2006-06-02 19:43:34
122.   JoeyP
Utley says "Seo long" to that 84 mph heater.
2006-06-02 19:44:29
123.   D4P
120
Yeah, I'm happy for him too. It was an unfortunate situation. Ideally, Shaq and Kobe could have coexisted and Shaq could have stayed for less money. But that obviously didn't happen.
2006-06-02 19:45:57
124.   Bob Timmermann
119
Ahh, the problems of the zero sum game nature of sports.
2006-06-02 19:46:59
125.   JoeyP
What sucks is that Shaq signed for less money to stay in Miami.

Kupchak got killed in that trade in taking back Brian Grant's contract. Should have kept Shaq and let him play out his final year in LA, with Kobe understanding that it would be completely his team afterwards. Kupchak isnt the best manager of people. Jerry West could smooth egos much better.

2006-06-02 19:47:59
126.   thinkblue0
sorry to see shaq go? He got lazy and fat and sat out numerous games...trust me, in about two years when the Heat are STILL paying him like 20 mill per they're going to be regretting it.
2006-06-02 19:48:48
127.   Underbruin
Dunno if you're here, but Miltie - that game with Karros you mentioned in the '1/3rd through the season' thread was a tie when he hit the triple... I believe it was in the bottom of the 9th or 10th inning, though I don't remember exactly. I was at the game with some friends, but we left right after he didn't score (several of them had to be 'taken home' so to speak). We get out to the car and listen to the Giants win on the radio. Not a fun ride home.

This is L.A. baseball!

2006-06-02 19:49:50
128.   thinkblue0
125-

it's sad, but most of the GM's in the league have no idea how to work the salary cap in the NBA...if anything, Kupchak should have taken back like two or three expiring contracts instead of Grant. Getting Grant was the worst possible thing he could have done.

You've got guys like Thomas sending Davis to Toronto for Rose who stinks...when he could have just let the contract run out and had 15 more mill this offseason....ten steps beyond illogical.

2006-06-02 19:50:01
129.   JoeyP
when the Heat are STILL paying him like 20 mill per they're going to be regretting it

Shaq's making slightly more than Kwame Brown is. He signed a 3yr 30mils extension with the Heat.

2006-06-02 19:51:09
130.   Uncle Miltie
Don't question Grits' lineup. He knows what he's doing.

He's playing Cruz to keep him fresh. Good idea.

Guzman in the cleanup spot really shows a lot of confidence in him.

None of this will probably matter though since Jae Seo is starting (hopefully for the last time as a Dodger)

2006-06-02 19:51:09
131.   sanchez101
125. he had to brian grant's contract back to make the deal work salary-wise. everything thinkblue0 said is precisely true, i turned against shaq when he suddenly decided to get into shape after he got traded and then did everything he could to trash the lakers after he leaving. Back to the real ballgame ...
2006-06-02 19:51:43
132.   capdodger
Why not drop one down on this guy? He doesn't look like he could field a bunt all that well.
2006-06-02 19:52:17
133.   Steve
How did Ryan Franklin not crack this rotation?
2006-06-02 19:52:31
134.   sanchez101
129. you're off by two years and $70 million
2006-06-02 19:53:02
135.   kegtron
109

Excellent point, but he was so sick in the video game and cartoon that I'm willing to dismiss that fact. His scissor kick and flying flaming move were unstoppable even if you tried to block them.

2006-06-02 19:54:22
136.   thinkblue0
131-

having to make the salaries work is always a problem...but when your'e trading shaq, get odom and butler and then just a bunch of contracts that are expiring...then you can go right out the next year and spend that money on good players...instead, theyr'e still hampered with Grant's money.

Rollins made a couple nice plays there....let's hope guzman leads off next inning with a hit.

2006-06-02 19:56:03
137.   Steve
Way to get out of the way of that pitch down the middle, David Bell wannabe
2006-06-02 19:56:18
138.   Underbruin
125 - I don't know if I agree - if there is one thing that I can imagine could completely ruin a team, it is an unhappy Shaquille O'Neal mailing it in for an entire season while Kobe stews and the two take potshots at each other even more often in the media.

Though I don't think the trade was a good one, it's hard to succeed with other GMs when they all know you have to unload a player. Remember, there were significant rumblings that Kobe was going to leave the Lake-show to sign with the Clips last season. We don't know how much of that was Kobe grandstanding or whatever, but just imagine if he's been getting more and more upset all season long. I think the team did the right thing, because honestly, for the long-term health of the franchise you're better off with Bryant than Shaq.

The latter might have actually allowed for a better Laker team the past two seasons, but like thinkblue says in 126 the Big Fella wanted an awful lot of money for an awful long time, and as dominant as he can still be at times it's clear he has lost a step, and lacks the work ethic to prevent losing more. He's been in better shape with the Heat than he was for LA's last two seasons (something I doubt would have happened if he stayed with the Lakers), and he still looks slow. He's one of the strongest players in the game but gets by on brute force only, while he used to couple it with explosiveness and skill (just ask Ben Wallace - there's no way he makes that Game 5 block on 2001 Shaq).

2006-06-02 19:57:07
139.   gpellamjr
"Body fat or no, Rowand strikes out." Vinny is great.
2006-06-02 19:57:13
140.   Bob Timmermann
132

The Dodgers are afraid to bunt after Steve sent each player a threatening letter. It's a trick he learned from some of his friends in the Ontario Mafia.

2006-06-02 19:57:36
141.   sanchez101
136. thats a good point, i think the lakers were to concerned with timing their cap relief with the right year. the real problem with the deal was not demanding dwyane wade, if your trading shaq you should demand just about anything you want.
2006-06-02 19:58:15
142.   kegtron
Shaq signed a 5 year, 100 million dollar contract last year.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2122716

2006-06-02 20:01:38
143.   Uncle Miltie
141- Miami was not going to trade Wade, Dallas was not going to trade Dirk, the Pacers were not going to trade Jermaine O'Neal. Laker fans are blaming the wrong person. How about Jerry Buss? He decided that he didn't want to go over the cap anymore.
2006-06-02 20:02:03
144.   capdodger
140 Hmm... Could be. But............this..............guy's...........follow..........through............is........so............long.
2006-06-02 20:02:31
145.   sanchez101
i think Aybar, Martin, and Ethier need to have a little talk with Guzman about taking pitches
2006-06-02 20:02:37
146.   JoeyP
My fault. Shaq did take a pay cut. I thought for sure that he was making less or deferring some of that money though. I suppose if the Heat win the title, it'll be worth it even with Shaq making 20mils to play 20 minutes a nite at age 37.
2006-06-02 20:02:43
147.   Underbruin
131 - Well now I think that's unfair. He didn't really trash "the Lakers" so much as Kobe (who you could argue is the face of the franchise, but still...). I think he still holds a lot of respect for Phil Jackson, and really did like playing in Los Angeles (on his way out of town he took out a full spread color ad in the LA Times thanking the LA fans for their support, a very classy gesture in my mind).

I think he simply fell victim to believing the jokes coming out of his mouth - "MDE: Most Dominant Ever" and whatnot - and believing that the only way he could stay in LA without feeling like a 2nd-banana was if the organization showed their support of him with a humongous contract that would have had the unfortunate side effect of retarding the growth of the franchise for years to come.

2006-06-02 20:03:40
148.   natepurcell
with guzman, broxton, and kemp, we might have the biggest set of prospects EVER.
2006-06-02 20:03:41
149.   Bob Timmermann
Jimmy Rollins needs 11 more assists to tie the alltime record for assists by a shortstop in a game!

The record is 103 years old!

You can do it Jimmy!

2006-06-02 20:04:53
150.   King of the Hobos
145 Maybe Ethier shouldn't be a member of that talk
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2006-06-02 20:04:58
151.   Uncle Miltie
Guzman needs to watch Aybar at the plate. It's called being patient.
2006-06-02 20:05:35
152.   JoeyP
16 pitches for Madson in 2ip.
At least Ethier hit the ball in the air.
2006-06-02 20:06:23
153.   D4P
We swing here 0-0.
2006-06-02 20:06:24
154.   Underbruin
142 - Correct. Shaq is the highest-paid player in the NBA this season, and makes up just under 1/3rd of the Heat's entire payroll.
2006-06-02 20:06:32
155.   Uncle Miltie
didn't see 145
2006-06-02 20:06:35
156.   sanchez101
143. I dont think it that Buss doesnt want to go over the cap, its that in the NBA you just cant throw money at free agents every winter like the Yankee's do. If a KG or a LeBron became a free agent and the Lakers were allowed to sign him, Buss would, but he cant.

Why are we making easy outs here? Dont they know this is Ryan "i was demoted to the bullpen but then my teamates got injured" Madsen?

2006-06-02 20:08:40
157.   Aug C
What's up with Joel being handed the cleanup spot? Dude really hasn't proven anything to anybody at this stage.
2006-06-02 20:10:18
158.   sanchez101
how has Seo stuckout Rollins twice? did rollins loose a bet?
2006-06-02 20:10:18
159.   JoeyP
Any team can go over the salary cap if they want. It all depends on whether the owner wants to pay Luxury Tax or not.

Mark Cuban is in effect trying to buy an NBA ring with his collection of awesome bench players.

There's good spending when it comes to going over the cap. And bad spending with Thomas/Knicks.

2006-06-02 20:10:50
160.   capdodger
157 Someone has to do it?
2006-06-02 20:10:51
161.   Underbruin
Though whoever bemoaned the Brian Grant contract is right on target - sheesh. The man is making over $16 mil a year, is the 10th highest paid player in the NBA (he earns more than Kobe does), and had just under 3 points per game this past season. Admittedly, the Lakers are paying "only" 15.5 of that 16+, with the Suns snagging him off of waivers for the rest.
2006-06-02 20:10:54
162.   Steve
I keep thinking that the phillies are suddenly going to finally admit that Jimmy Rollins was just a big practical joke, and that Charlie Manuel is actually Ed McMahon
2006-06-02 20:11:18
163.   gpellamjr
Hey Bob, I could look this up, but I'm a grad student, so that's just now what I do. What's the actual strikezone according to the rulebook?
2006-06-02 20:12:27
164.   Marty
When it comes to basketball, I'm like the baseball fans who say "it's not my money, so who cares". I doubt I'll ever keep up on the contract machinations that have to be utilized in the NBA.
2006-06-02 20:12:46
165.   gpellamjr
163 That should be: "...so that's just not what I do."
2006-06-02 20:13:43
166.   Marty
Utley seems to have figured out the crafty Seo...
2006-06-02 20:15:59
167.   sanchez101
159. part of the problem is that MVP-calibre players never really reach free agency in the NBA anymore, so its not as if they can just spend money on the lastest star like the Yankees. Also, they are limited to only having a Mid-Level exemption when they are over the cap, meaning they can only spend ~$5million on free agents in a given offseason, again nothing like how it works in baseball.
2006-06-02 20:16:06
168.   capdodger
Must. Throw. Strikes. Idiot.
2006-06-02 20:16:31
169.   Steve
Korean Jeff Weaver, you are officially The Weakest Link. Goodbye.
2006-06-02 20:17:02
170.   capdodger
See what happens when you have to throw a fat pitch because you're in the hole?
2006-06-02 20:18:40
171.   thinkblue0
every time Seo pitches I like him less and less....can't throw strikes, gets himself into trouble etc etc.
2006-06-02 20:20:20
172.   Andrew Shimmin
The STRIKE ZONE is that area over home plate the upper limit of which is a horizontal line at the midpoint between the top of the shoulders and the top of the uniform pants, and the lower level is a line at the hollow beneath the knee cap. The Strike Zone shall be determined from the batter's stance as the batter is prepared to swing at a pitched ball.

http://tinyurl.com/gpocy

2006-06-02 20:20:34
173.   Underbruin
159 - Not only can most teams go over, almost every single one do. This year every team but Chicago, Atlanta, and Charlotte were over the salary cap, which is currently set at $49.5 million.

Question: would Chicago be considered the early-2000s 'Oakland' of the NBA, with the 3rd-lowest payroll and a hard-fought 1st round exit to a 'big-market' team? Discuss. =P

2006-06-02 20:20:52
174.   Underbruin
173 - "does," not "do"
2006-06-02 20:20:55
175.   Jon Weisman
Irony: Criticizing a hitter for being impatient after his second career at-bat.
2006-06-02 20:21:24
176.   Gen3Blue
Vin again tonight! what a pleasure.
2006-06-02 20:22:09
177.   LAT
Sam, who are the Washington Greys?
2006-06-02 20:22:48
178.   capdodger
Will the Dodgers get a hit this inning?
Film at 11.
2006-06-02 20:23:22
179.   Marty
177 Was that a Negro League team?
2006-06-02 20:23:50
180.   thinkblue0
this lineup out there is pretty bad....
2006-06-02 20:24:05
181.   natepurcell
Irony: Criticizing a hitter for being impatient after his second career at-bat.

this is dodger thoughts, anything is fair game!

2006-06-02 20:24:14
182.   Steve
Can it get any lamer than being shut out by Kirk Saarloos?
2006-06-02 20:24:17
183.   JoeyP
Dodgers putting up little fight the first time through the order.
2006-06-02 20:24:18
184.   Underbruin
-Note- I am now switching to talking exclusively about baseball because apparently I have cursed the Dodgers with the inability to hit by all my basketball talk.
2006-06-02 20:24:26
185.   Gen3Blue
Wow- Our line-up is bizarre
2006-06-02 20:24:43
186.   Marty
Vin gets to mention his boyhood idol, Mel Ott.
2006-06-02 20:26:21
187.   sanchez101
182. getting shutout by Ryan Madsen?
2006-06-02 20:26:35
188.   Underbruin
179 - Yes. It was also the name of a Confederate North Carolina heavy infantry regiment during the Civil War (name choice accidental irony or clever word play?)
2006-06-02 20:26:53
189.   capdodger
Bronx Cheer for a baserunner.
2006-06-02 20:27:27
190.   JoeyP
Would that be considered losing your concentration?
2006-06-02 20:27:49
191.   Underbruin
And Seo breaks up a perfect game!

... Who had that one?

2006-06-02 20:28:22
192.   Steve
I have every confidence that we will get to Ryan Madson. Probably now. The Grabowski Principle is arguably in effect.
2006-06-02 20:28:33
193.   Underbruin
Question - Grabowski principle coming into effect?

One can only hope.

2006-06-02 20:28:36
194.   thinkblue0
Furcal just pulled an Izzy....hit it directly at the second baseman...
2006-06-02 20:29:03
195.   Underbruin
192 - Beat me by 11 seconds.

Then again, you did invent it.

2006-06-02 20:29:28
196.   Sam DC
Grays -- Others know the history way better than I, but I think actually it was a Pennsylvania Negro league team, the Homestead Grays, but they took some kid of part residence in DC. When the Expos moved here, many wanted to call them the Grays in honor of that team and the negro leagues in general.
2006-06-02 20:29:38
197.   Steve
Except that the Grabowski Principle has nothing on the Fur-kel Factor.
2006-06-02 20:30:55
198.   Underbruin
197 - FireRafaelFurcal.com?
2006-06-02 20:31:08
199.   JoeyP
Madson did shut out the Mets for 7 innings earlier in the season. He's been known to get lucky from time to time.
2006-06-02 20:32:52
200.   thinkblue0
something tells me bluetahoe won't be raving about seo on the board tonight....
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2006-06-02 20:32:55
201.   Andrew Shimmin
Is it a save situation yet? I want Gagne, now.
2006-06-02 20:33:02
202.   JoeyP
Ryan Howard is one bad man.
2006-06-02 20:33:05
203.   das411
and BOOM goes the dynamite!
2006-06-02 20:33:37
204.   sanchez101
odalis should be warming up just about now
2006-06-02 20:33:40
205.   Underbruin
... When the bases are empty and Gameday says "In play, run-scoring play" it can mean only one thing - a grounder back to the pitcher followed by 7 consecutive throwing errors, of course.

Oh, you mean he hit it out?

Mine was much more interesting.

2006-06-02 20:33:45
206.   regfairfield
Such a mighty wallop.
2006-06-02 20:34:13
207.   capdodger
It's wheels fall off time.
Grady, yank this turkey, he's done.
2006-06-02 20:34:33
208.   Steve
"Bill" "Ing" "Sley"

"Bill" "Ing" "Sley"

2006-06-02 20:34:47
209.   Underbruin
... Strike 205 from the record, please. My Gameday was lagging or something (or I was just being an idiot), didn't think anybody was on.
2006-06-02 20:34:57
210.   das411
Ahhh so that's what Odalis Perez looks like.

Payback for last night, anyone?

2006-06-02 20:35:20
211.   Sam DC
It's probably me -- this is the first game I've managed to be free and awake for in a good while.
2006-06-02 20:35:30
212.   Underbruin
... You know what, just... I'm going to take a break. Sheesh. I'm worse than Seo.
2006-06-02 20:36:51
213.   Marty
That thing growing on Rowand's chin looks really stupid. Makes him look like he's drooling.
2006-06-02 20:38:02
214.   capdodger
Even the outs are loud.
2006-06-02 20:38:20
215.   Steve
Morneau hits it out to break up Kirk Saarloos's shutout.
2006-06-02 20:39:02
216.   Steve
Gloves should not make clanking sounds.
2006-06-02 20:39:06
217.   Gen3Blue
Almost time to stick a fork in the turkey course and bring in the Pork(er).
Can we play Izzy part time?
2006-06-02 20:39:36
218.   Aug C
That was Offerman-esque
2006-06-02 20:40:06
219.   JoeyP
Jon's comment earlier about Lofton's defense.
Uh, yeah.
2006-06-02 20:40:23
220.   Steve
Fur-kelman.
2006-06-02 20:40:41
221.   LAT
196. Thanks. I was changing channels and came across the Nat's-Brewers throw-back game. The Nat's are the Greys today.
2006-06-02 20:41:11
222.   Andrew Shimmin
216- Anybody could see that that error was Nomar's fault for being short. It's cut and dry, really.
2006-06-02 20:42:35
223.   JoeyP
Thank goodness for Jimmy Rollins.
2006-06-02 20:42:56
224.   Underbruin
222 - Heheh.
2006-06-02 20:44:54
225.   capdodger
[Voice="Church Lady"]
Well isn't that no longer special...
[/Voice]
2006-06-02 20:45:34
226.   JoeyP
Marco Scutaro is the Jason Phillips of the Oakland A's. Macha is Tracy. 2b is 1b.
2006-06-02 20:45:37
227.   thinkblue0
Don't you usually want your #4 hitter protecting your #3 hitter? They're just going to pitch around Nomar to get to Guzman....
2006-06-02 20:46:19
228.   thinkblue0
un-freaking-believable....what in god's name is he stealing for when we're down by three runs.
2006-06-02 20:46:22
229.   das411
LIEBERTHAL!
2006-06-02 20:46:34
230.   Steve
Well, Andrew you got your wish, because as soon as I went into my Grady swoon, he pulled a Tracy and killed a perfectly good inning.
2006-06-02 20:47:23
231.   LAT
Lofton must of had a brain-fart stealing then.
2006-06-02 20:47:35
232.   natepurcell
why do you (try) steal there?
2006-06-02 20:47:38
233.   JoeyP
Why's he running in front of Nomar when were down 3 runs? On a 2-0 count.
2006-06-02 20:48:02
234.   Steve
Madson hasn't thrown a strike in a week and a half, so let's steal the base he's about to give us anyway.
2006-06-02 20:48:33
235.   thinkblue0
great...we should have bases loaded and no outs.....
2006-06-02 20:48:35
236.   capdodger
My god... Get a guy on and this guy's control is shot.
2006-06-02 20:48:38
237.   trainwreck
Oh my god...
2006-06-02 20:48:44
238.   King of the Hobos
Joel walks! That's almost as good as a homer for him
2006-06-02 20:48:51
239.   Steve
Actually, now that I think about it, he's probably given Lofton the green light, and now all he has to do is bench Lofton for a week and take it away.
2006-06-02 20:48:51
240.   Underbruin
Nah - Lofton's trying to light a fire under Guzman by allowing him to hit without the added pressure of RISP.
2006-06-02 20:49:14
241.   natepurcell
walkin guzzy
2006-06-02 20:49:14
242.   regfairfield
Bring Guzman's isolated patience to .333
2006-06-02 20:49:33
243.   Aug C
Nice... Vinnie just called out Guzman for not seeing any pitches last night or in his first AB tonight while commending him for doing so tonight.
2006-06-02 20:50:11
244.   D4P
Somehow, I don't think the phrase "Just another walk for Guzman" is really gonna take off.
2006-06-02 20:51:23
245.   capdodger
Inconsistient release point?
2006-06-02 20:51:32
246.   thinkblue0
nice hit by Aybar! Should be tied, but I guess I'll take it...
2006-06-02 20:51:49
247.   D4P
The Pedestrian!
2006-06-02 20:52:02
248.   Aug C
WILLYYYYYYYY
2006-06-02 20:52:03
249.   capdodger
And Steve Lyons smiles broadly.
2006-06-02 20:52:12
250.   JoeyP
Dont hurry back Mueller.
Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2006-06-02 20:52:16
251.   Underbruin
"What? You mean I'm Ryan Madson?
... Aww, crud."

Boy am I glad KLoft tried to steal there and lit a fire under young Willy Aybar.

2006-06-02 20:52:25
252.   Sam DC
OK - I'll take credit for that too.
2006-06-02 20:52:33
253.   sanchez101
the kiddy corp strikes again!
if it wasnt for the veteran, the game would be tied
2006-06-02 20:52:34
254.   Gen3Blue
Hey--before we couldn't hit this guy. You got to try to run on him or take some pitches--something worked.
2006-06-02 20:52:35
255.   Andrew Shimmin
239- Yes! Vengeance and grudge bearing; is that really too much to ask for? What's so great about peace, love, and understanding?
2006-06-02 20:53:52
256.   capdodger
254 I'm going to put my money on the latter. Taking what Madson gives has been far better than running wild.
2006-06-02 20:54:00
257.   das411
Ahhh Aaron Rowand, gotta love this guy! Good thing we got rid of that bum Lofton...
2006-06-02 20:55:22
258.   thinkblue0
is it me or do we seem to not catch the breaks on those bloop hits? Seems like other teams get them all the time, and they always catch them against us....
2006-06-02 20:55:41
259.   sanchez101
So far Repko, Lofton, and Cruz have looked like rookies should be playing their positions
2006-06-02 20:56:03
260.   trainwreck
Put M. Bison in!
2006-06-02 20:56:16
261.   Steve
Like I had no doubt that we could get to Ryan Madson (Kenny Speed notwithstanding), I continue to have no doubt that we will continue to do so.

On the other hand, the Korean Jeff Weaver is not done yet, and the only four hitters in the Philadelphia lineup are coming up.

2006-06-02 20:56:45
262.   Underbruin
254 - I gotta go with 256 on this one. A CS on your 2nd baserunner of the game gets you rattled? More likely the Dodgers just remembered this guy can't stay in the strike zone, getting two walks before Aybar's double on a 3-1 count.
2006-06-02 20:57:43
263.   LAT
260. You called it!
2006-06-02 20:57:45
264.   regfairfield
We really need make Grady forget the double switch.
2006-06-02 20:57:57
265.   Bob Timmermann
Odalis's appearance bodes ill for Seo's stay in the rotation.
2006-06-02 20:58:01
266.   Uncle Miltie
Lofton is an idiot.

Great move by Grits to take out Seo Seo and also bring in Kemp.

2006-06-02 20:58:25
267.   JoeyP
Excellent pre-emptive managing by Grits!
Seo doesnt have it tonite.

Good move to bring in OP.

2006-06-02 20:58:29
268.   Underbruin
Hey, the $10 million middle reliever!
2006-06-02 20:58:45
269.   Greg S
You guys are rough. Lofton gets the first hit of the game. He hadn't been caught all year. The walks came AFTER. It was run and hit and could have just as easily ignited a rally. Geesh. The guys hitting above .300 and has been stealing bases and he's hated.
2006-06-02 20:59:05
270.   LAT
Memo to Odalis:

This is your opportunity to get out of the pen.

2006-06-02 20:59:14
271.   natepurcell
grady loves the double switch and seems to have had enough of seo and cruz.
2006-06-02 20:59:18
272.   das411
Chase! Utley!!!!
2006-06-02 20:59:33
273.   Underbruin
Who'd Little take out to bring in Kemp? Gameday hasn't listed it yet.
2006-06-02 20:59:47
274.   natepurcell
why didnt you take the million utley!??! why!?!?
2006-06-02 20:59:52
275.   thinkblue0
269-

it's because it was a stupid move. There's no need to risk getting a CS when you're already down by three runs with maybe the hottest hitter in the game at the plate. It's completely illogical.

2006-06-02 21:00:04
276.   Underbruin
271 - Oh, thanks.
2006-06-02 21:00:08
277.   D4P
As poorly as Seo Seo as pitched this season, Odalis has been even worse.
2006-06-02 21:00:21
278.   thinkblue0
I'm assuming we'll have Odalis hitting this next inning...can't imagine a long reliever coming in for an inning.
2006-06-02 21:00:26
279.   ddger
Can Perez pitch an outing without giving up a run?
2006-06-02 21:00:46
280.   Gen3Blue
I was amazed at the attack on Lofton, who any stat would show one of our better players.
2006-06-02 21:01:09
281.   Greg S
275
It's not illogical. You just don't agree with it. There's a difference.
2006-06-02 21:02:05
282.   JoeyP
You guys are rough. Lofton gets the first hit of the game. He hadn't been caught all year. The walks came AFTER.

Actually Madson had walked Jay Seo the inning before. You NEVER run in front of your best hitter. Its just beggin for the bat to be taken out of Nomar's hands (even if successful). Also, running when you're down 3 runs...Stupid.

2006-06-02 21:02:16
283.   ddger
Time for Perez to make a meaningful contribution tonight.
2006-06-02 21:02:24
284.   thinkblue0
no, it's illogical. Stealing there makes no sense because it doesn't do us any good. The risk isn't anywhere near worth the reward.

It was proven by the fact that Aybar should have had a three run double instead of a two run double.

2006-06-02 21:02:34
285.   Greg S
The top scoring team in the NL down 3 in the 4th. Not exactly time to go into safet mode.
2006-06-02 21:03:26
286.   Greg S
284
Proven that it was an illogical move by the result?
Uhhh. Ok.
2006-06-02 21:03:52
287.   trainwreck
DFA...DFA...DFA
2006-06-02 21:03:58
288.   regfairfield
282 Maybe, maybe it's defenseable if your down in the count, but certainly not 3-0.
2006-06-02 21:04:07
289.   das411
Ok Steve, the first two of our four are on base, what will OP do with the other two?
2006-06-02 21:04:40
290.   ddger
Perez is not helping his case right now.
2006-06-02 21:04:41
291.   Andrew Shimmin
280- If you mean top 10, then I agree.
2006-06-02 21:04:50
292.   LAT
Memo to Odalis:

You are blowing your chance to get out of the pen.

2006-06-02 21:05:11
293.   thinkblue0
286-

I'm not proving it by the result, I'm proving it by how the game is played. JoeyP said it best

Actually Madson had walked Jay Seo the inning before. You NEVER run in front of your best hitter. Its just beggin for the bat to be taken out of Nomar's hands (even if successful). Also, running when you're down 3 runs...Stupid.

The risk FAR outweighs the reward in that situation...not to mention even if he was successful it would have taken the bat out of Nomar's hands so they could go after the rookie on deck.

2006-06-02 21:05:39
294.   thinkblue0
286-

I'm not proving it by the result, I'm proving it by how the game is played. JoeyP said it best

Actually Madson had walked Jay Seo the inning before. You NEVER run in front of your best hitter. Its just beggin for the bat to be taken out of Nomar's hands (even if successful). Also, running when you're down 3 runs...Stupid.

The risk FAR outweighs the reward in that situation...not to mention even if he was successful it would have taken the bat out of Nomar's hands so they could go after the rookie on deck.

2006-06-02 21:05:44
295.   Greg S
288
Don't make the same mistake Vinny did.
It was a 2-0 count. Otherwise he couldn't have been caught.
2006-06-02 21:05:59
296.   sanchez101
Perez is going to need a dp here
2006-06-02 21:06:06
297.   Sam DC
Man - Nationals are up 10-4 going into the bottom of the ninth. Stanton brought in, gets two outs, gives up a double to Damian Miller. Robinson pulls him.

???

2006-06-02 21:07:27
298.   JoeyP
Thank you umpire.
OP needed that.
2006-06-02 21:08:19
299.   Underbruin
285 - But that's the point. Stealing there is a play that makes much more sense if in a close, late game, where 1-run can be the difference maker. Instead, you either a) quite possibly take the bat out of the hands of our best hitter even if it's successful; b) possibly score a run that you might not have gotten (though the 4-5-6 hitters are the next to bat); c) get thrown out shortening the inning and reducing the possible number of runs your best hitters will be able to bring in.
2006-06-02 21:09:27
300.   regfairfield
There's the Odalis I remember.
Show/Hide Comments 301-350
2006-06-02 21:09:27
301.   Sam DC
Pujols up with a chance to end it in St. Louis, bottom of the 11th.
2006-06-02 21:09:27
302.   Gen3Blue
Nice curve.
But if there is one thing good Coletti might bring from the Giants, I don't think there will be a lot of pitching contracts like Driefort and Perez.
2006-06-02 21:09:58
303.   Greg S
299
In my opinion, when you are a team that can score runs, you treat a 3-0 game in the 4th exactly like you treat a 0-0 game in the 4th. Nomar being our "best hitter" is silly. The lineup is stacked with hitters right now.
2006-06-02 21:10:30
304.   Sam DC
301 Backwards K.
2006-06-02 21:10:38
305.   capdodger
Madson throws rather hard, but becomes very wild from the strech. Surely the scouting report should show that. And if that's the case, and the best hitter on the team is up, it's better to take what he gives you.

It's like the Bradley bunt last year that caused such discord. Risk vs. Reward and thinking two moves ahead.

2006-06-02 21:10:42
306.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Now, why bring OP in to such a high-leverage situation as this? Does Grittle have OP pegged as the designated "long man?" I'd rather relief pitcher selection be decided by the pitcher's quality, and not how many innings you think he can throw.
2006-06-02 21:11:17
307.   JoeyP
The lineup is stacked with hitters right now.

Sample size.

2006-06-02 21:11:50
308.   Steve
The reason you don't steal is because the extra base is meaningless, except in arbitration.
2006-06-02 21:11:53
309.   Underbruin
303 - "The lineup is stacked with hitters right now."

Umm, that's even more reason not to run there. You have a lineup stacked with hitters and you're taking the chance that you're giving away a free out, or at best taking the bat out of the hands of the guy who OPSed, what, like 1.000+ for the month of May?

2006-06-02 21:12:52
310.   ROC
Just when I realize Grady had sat all of last night's HR hitters, in comes Kemp.

I fully expect Odalis to get out of this with his "personal" catcher.

2006-06-02 21:12:52
311.   regfairfield
Well played, Odalis.
2006-06-02 21:13:22
312.   JoeyP
Good job OP.
2006-06-02 21:13:29
313.   D4P
Odalis lowers his ERA to 6.05.
2006-06-02 21:13:33
314.   ddger
IF Perez can give us 3 shutout innings tonight, I think he deserves to take Seo's spot in rotation. But that's a big "IF".
2006-06-02 21:13:35
315.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Well, well.
Maybe OP has turned a corner.
2006-06-02 21:13:41
316.   Greg S
Okay. So then there is never a good time to steal.
Didn't realize that Depodesta ruled the baseball world.
2006-06-02 21:14:05
317.   thinkblue0
309-

couldn't have said it better myself.

2006-06-02 21:14:34
318.   regfairfield
316 No, there is, but they are few and far between.
2006-06-02 21:14:35
319.   capdodger
303 Down 3 in the 4th isn't the same as 0-0 in the 4th no matter how much you want it to be. It just isn't. Nine men have been put out, and only two-thirds of the game remains. Look at the win expectancies.
2006-06-02 21:14:36
320.   D4P
According to Gameday, all 13 of Kemp's ABs thus far have come against righties.
2006-06-02 21:14:39
321.   spacebrother
307

I think the operative phrase is "right now."

2006-06-02 21:15:21
322.   thinkblue0
316-

no one is saying that. I don't need to repeat what everyone has said but their arguments make sense and are based on common sense. A steal in that situation was completely detrimental to the inning.

Stealing is fine...you just better make sure you're the type of player who can make it the vast majority of the time or else you're hurting your team.

2006-06-02 21:16:15
323.   Uncle Miltie
This is the Odalis I remember. Anyone else notice that he's gaining velocity. His fastball is sitting in the high 80's and his changeup has good movement on it. I think he's finally covering from the effects of the WBC. Hopefully, that last inning gives Odalis a little more confidence in himself and Grits a littl more confidence in Odalis.

Kemp is a freaking beast. Grits is a genius!

2006-06-02 21:16:21
324.   Greg S
I'm not saying I would necessarily have run Kenny if it were my call. Just saying it's not that crazy. Kenny runs. That's his game. He succeeds at it. It create havoc for the pitcher and it's part of a rally. I'm not going to give Kenny a red light. Certainly not because we're down by 3 in the 4th or because our "best hitter" is up.
2006-06-02 21:16:23
325.   trainwreck
M.Bison crushes all that are before him.
2006-06-02 21:16:28
326.   Icaros
Bison, M.
2006-06-02 21:16:30
327.   towerofpower
looks like kemp just solidified his position on the roster
2006-06-02 21:16:30
328.   thinkblue0
Kemp needs to start playing on a daily basis to see what he's capable of...
2006-06-02 21:16:38
329.   Bob Timmermann
The Cardinals-Cubs started two hours before the games in Oakland and Seattle, which are both over.

The Cubs and Cardinals have used 15 pitchers.

The record for an extra-inning game is 18.

2006-06-02 21:16:43
330.   das411
Damn, that kid is a beast!
2006-06-02 21:16:44
331.   D4P
The Bison ties it up.
2006-06-02 21:16:44
332.   LAT
Just another HR for Matt Kemp
2006-06-02 21:17:03
333.   capdodger
Way to go Kemp!!!
2006-06-02 21:17:36
334.   regfairfield
Such a mighty wallop.
2006-06-02 21:17:47
335.   LAT
Cruz Jr has played his last inning for a while.
2006-06-02 21:17:59
336.   ddger
From now on, Kemp should start instead of Cruz.
2006-06-02 21:18:06
337.   natepurcell
the stampede of the buffalo!
2006-06-02 21:18:22
338.   JoeyP
Nice to have a CF'er with some pop.
2006-06-02 21:18:22
339.   Steve
or Lofton. or Drew.
2006-06-02 21:18:33
340.   Gen3Blue
thats a bit of a bold statement." He has always been considered the no. 1 prospect in the organization." Baseball America sure didn't know. But I'm happy.
2006-06-02 21:19:00
341.   Greg S
"Stealing is fine...you just better make sure you're the type of player who can make it the vast majority of the time or else you're hurting your team. "

Hmmm. Like a guy who hadn't been caught since last year and had the longest string of steals without being caught in the league? Can't think of a guy like that.

2006-06-02 21:20:02
342.   ddger
As each day passes, Kemp is further distancing himself from Guzman as our top prospect.
2006-06-02 21:20:05
343.   D4P
Steiner's reaction to Kemp's 2nd career HR was just slightly different from Vinny's reaction to his 1st.
2006-06-02 21:20:26
344.   capdodger
316 OOO.... A Depo jibe. Very original.

But seriously, there are situations where a steal is a great idea, like close-late situations where one run is the game (to tie or win). The point is that when you're down more than one run, the risk/reward equation doesn't lean in favor of trying to steal the base.

2006-06-02 21:20:40
345.   D4P
342
I don't even think Guzman is second on that list.
2006-06-02 21:21:10
346.   Andrew Shimmin
Win expectancy gain for a successful Lofton steal: 2.2%
Win expectancy loss for a CS: 8.3%

I don't love win expectancy numbers, but it looks like the gain for a successful steal in that situation has been, historically, pretty small.

2006-06-02 21:21:13
347.   Underbruin
317 - Thanks.

316 - I'm actually not as much against the steal as some of the people in here (especially not with a guy like Lofton, who still seems to be able to almost will himself safe sometimes). I actually like being a bit more attacking on the basepaths in late innings in close games, as I mentioned earlier.

However, I do think that being down by 3, with your pitcher struggling heavily, in the 4th inning with the red-hot #3 hitter up to bat and ahead in the count, and a lineup that has been remarkably good at scoring runs and getting on base (1st in the NL in OBP, if I remember Jon's summary post from earlier correctly), there's very little that suggests attempting a steal is really the right play.

And the shot at DePo is a bit unfair. He doesn't rule the baseball world. He rules the whole world. [Insert evil laugh here]

And with that, I'm off for the night. Go Dodgers!

2006-06-02 21:21:20
348.   Greg Brock
Watching the kids play is too much fun. Standings be damned, I wanna watch the future play every game. This is an absolute blast.
2006-06-02 21:21:20
349.   thinkblue0
341-

SIGH....I was replying to your comment that was something to the effect of "so it's never the time to steal?"

Lofton made a bonehead move there, that's all there is to it...stealing in that situation is a remarkably bad move no matter who the man on base is.

I have no problem with Lofton trying to swipe bags as long as it isn't ruining a potential rally and taking the bat out of our best hitter's hands....

2006-06-02 21:21:41
350.   Brendan
the pain of 2005 season is starting to slip away. I love these kids!!! (Cue Nambla joke)
Show/Hide Comments 351-400
2006-06-02 21:21:42
351.   trainwreck
Oh god, Tell Me When To Go has hit Dodger Stadium.
2006-06-02 21:21:47
352.   thinkblue0
do we need to send Furcal another memo not to slide head first?
2006-06-02 21:22:11
353.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Remember last year's criticism that the Dodgers farm system was overrrated because, hey, where were the players?
I don't want to go too far out on a limb, but those players may have arrived.
2006-06-02 21:22:18
354.   alex 7
dangit, I was about to say that this was a better steal situation.
2006-06-02 21:22:24
355.   Bob Timmermann
I believe the earlier vote on ending the Choi debate also precluded debate on DePodesta.
2006-06-02 21:22:27
356.   Underbruin
Apparently Rafael Furcal doesn't read Dodger Thoughts comments.
2006-06-02 21:22:28
357.   Disabled List
I gotta say, as far as nicknames go, "M. Bison" is waaaaay better than just plain old "Bison".

Props to whoever came up with that modification.

2006-06-02 21:22:37
358.   Steve
Very original.

You have to admit that it's more original to argue that Kenny Lofton should get thrown out in front of the heart of the lineup facing Ryan Madson.

2006-06-02 21:23:00
359.   JoeyP
Since Furcal just stole 2nd, if Madson is smart he'll just walk the hottest hitting guy in the league and face the rookie with 2outs.
2006-06-02 21:23:09
360.   underdog
What about Furcal stealing?

Nomar just drove him in.

Meanwhile, this Kemp fella, I think he has some power.

2006-06-02 21:23:12
361.   alex 7
good baserunning.
2006-06-02 21:23:18
362.   capdodger
341 For example... I don't mind that steal. Since there are two outs, if Furcal gets nailed there, Nomar starts with a fresh slate, and it takes a hit to score a run instead of two.
2006-06-02 21:23:25
363.   das411
Who is this Garciapasomething kid?
2006-06-02 21:23:50
364.   Steve
Hi Charlie Manuel!
2006-06-02 21:24:33
365.   D4P
I don't listen to other team's announcers, so I don't know the answer to this question: is there a bigger homer than Charlie Steiner? The guy acts like every Dodger run is akin to Gibson's HR.
2006-06-02 21:25:02
366.   Greg S
All I'm saying is that if it's ever okay for Kenny to steal, then it's okay there. You can say down 3-0 in the 4th is different and it is. But what SHOULDN'T be different is your approach to the game. 10-0, yes. 3-0 in the 8th yes. But you are now watching the reason you don't change your approach down 3 in the 4th. Let Kenny be Kenny and play his game until you're worried. I wasn't worried. Nobody should have been.
2006-06-02 21:25:14
367.   ddger
It's little early for Nomar to be getting base hits. I thought Nomar only gets hits after 6th inning.
2006-06-02 21:25:21
368.   underdog
Joyeux Jo-el!

Hit n' rbi!

2006-06-02 21:25:38
369.   Nick Iyengar
It's very early for this kind of speculation, but if Ethier continues to be a legitimate producer, and if Kemp is already ready for MLB and up for good (both big if's, granted) ... the Dodgers are going to have a glut of OF talent.

In this situation, you have Drew, Lofton, Ethier, Kemp, Cruz Jr., Repko, Ledee, and Werth...not to mention Guzman. Obviously, a number of them are currently hurt and/or injury prone, but I can't help wondering if we'll be able to trade off people like Repko, Cruz Jr., or Werth (if he ever gets healthy) and get a boost in the rotation.

What's the sense of how much guys like Repko, Werth, and Cruz Jr. could bring in a trade?

2006-06-02 21:25:39
370.   LAT
Man this offense just keeps scoring runs. Its the anti-2003 Dodgers.
2006-06-02 21:25:57
371.   Steve
Keep making that throw home, A-Row.
2006-06-02 21:26:02
372.   regfairfield
365 Hawk Harrelson, the Braves guys, 2/3rds of the league.
2006-06-02 21:26:08
373.   Gen3Blue
I don't think Lofts steal attempt killed a rally. It seems we scored two runs after.
2006-06-02 21:26:25
374.   JoeyP
360. Its probably dumb, but at least with 2 outs you're not killing a potential big inning by getting caught.

However, once Furcal made it to 2nd with 2 outs, the Phils should have just gave Nomar an IBB. I dont agree with stealing in that situation either, but Madson was dumb enough to let the Dodgers get away with it by pitching to Nomar with 1st base open.

2006-06-02 21:26:29
375.   Steve
das, what in the world is Manuel thinking?
2006-06-02 21:26:31
376.   underdog
To quote The Who, the kids are all right.
2006-06-02 21:26:47
377.   Gen3Blue
I think its a minor matter that should have been dropped long ago.
2006-06-02 21:28:16
378.   ddger
Grady must like to play hunches. He must have gotten a good feeling about Guzman batting cleanup tonight or he had a dream last night.
2006-06-02 21:28:20
379.   Bob Timmermann
Whatever anyone thinks of Lofton's steal attempt, I think it has to be balanced against Charlie Manuel keeping Ryan Madson out here when he's being beaten from pillar to post right now.
2006-06-02 21:28:35
380.   das411
375 -
2006-06-02 21:28:47
381.   Steve
Everybody should be willing to agree that at least it wasn't Oscar Robles.
2006-06-02 21:29:12
382.   JoeyP
Just take your walk Willy!
2006-06-02 21:29:46
383.   Uncle Miltie
Just another walk for Aybar...

He really got screwed a couple pitches ago but drew the walk anyways. Guzman is looking good tonight.

2006-06-02 21:30:02
384.   das411
379 - Bob, now do you see that it wasn't all Gavin Floyd's fault?
2006-06-02 21:30:02
385.   Greg S
I just can't decide who the best of the Rookies is.
2006-06-02 21:30:18
386.   sanchez101
what happened? i leave the game for 10 min and Dodgers take the lead. Did Guzman hit a homerun?
2006-06-02 21:30:43
387.   Sam DC
380 -- LOL

JA10PWFA

2006-06-02 21:30:47
388.   JoeyP
Madson is still in.
Wow.
2006-06-02 21:30:51
389.   Steve
386 -- The Buffalo roam.
2006-06-02 21:31:13
390.   Bob Timmermann
Guzman hit a home run, but he's on second base now because he heard that Steve Lyons said it would be better to stop there.
2006-06-02 21:31:18
391.   gcrl
365
what 372 said. even bert be home blyleven is a bigger homer than steiner, but in an "aw shucks" kind of way, so it's not as annoying as skip carey or the hawk.
2006-06-02 21:31:25
392.   capdodger
Huh... The sum total of Win Exp. falls from .573 to .572 when the home team steals second with two outs in the bottom of the 5th in a tie game. That's fluky.
2006-06-02 21:31:57
393.   Brendan
we have to have a game where all the kids start. Nate's lineup would be perfect.
2006-06-02 21:32:01
394.   Steve
Bob just made me drop my computer.
2006-06-02 21:32:42
395.   Sam DC
Josh Hancock -- rookie pitcher I think -- batting for St L with the bases loaded in the bottom of the 12th. 1 out. Eckstein on deck.
2006-06-02 21:32:50
396.   underdog
Having a glut of outfielders isn't such a bad "problem". It also hopefully keeps the team from making a bad trade. Werth, we don't know if he's going to play again, and it's certainly looking unlikely this year anyway. Cruz has some value to the team, he may have value to another team, too, tho they wouldn't get much for him in a trade. I'll welcome Repko back when he's healthy again, too. Then they can decide about Cruz and Ledee and Kemp. Ethier looks here to stay. Again, not a bad problem to have.

Meanwhile, I think we'll be seeing Gagne tonight...

2006-06-02 21:32:52
397.   natepurcell
386

the buffalo felt like grazing tonight.

2006-06-02 21:33:21
398.   Gen3Blue
I'm an idiot for not noticing, but what was Drew doing on the bench. No Kent and Drew's a luxury pinch hitter? I guess we have so much offense we didn't need him.
2006-06-02 21:33:24
399.   Greg S
392
So perhaps if there's a wild pitch in that situation the runner should stand pat.
2006-06-02 21:33:42
400.   towerofpower
and to think, we still have laroche and billingsley waiting in the wings
Show/Hide Comments 401-450
2006-06-02 21:34:03
401.   LAT
Drew on Deck was just to screw with Charlie Manuel's head.
2006-06-02 21:34:18
402.   Bob Timmermann
Hancock isn't a rookie. This is his fifth season in the majors.

And he's on his fourth team.

2006-06-02 21:34:41
403.   Steve
And Drew was on deck? Sorry, Andrew, I'm swooning again. Last year that was Grabowski every time.
2006-06-02 21:34:46
404.   underdog
400 Don't forget Ben Kozlowski!
2006-06-02 21:34:47
405.   LAT
Oops, I guess not. Grits really intended to take out OP after one iining. I wonder why?
2006-06-02 21:35:00
406.   Bob Timmermann
Pitcher #16 coming into the game in St. Louis as Ryan Dempster is relieving Eyre with 2 outs and the bases loaded and Eckstein up.
2006-06-02 21:35:08
407.   sanchez101
the bull joins the buffalo
2006-06-02 21:35:36
408.   Sam DC
Hancock doesn't get to be on our All Pitchers Who Can Hit team.
2006-06-02 21:35:37
409.   gcrl
395
somewhere ozzie smith is smiling
2006-06-02 21:35:46
410.   Greg S
398
His shoulder is still a little sore.
2006-06-02 21:36:31
411.   Disabled List
Three innings away from Gagne time?
2006-06-02 21:36:38
412.   ddger
Boy, Grady doesn't have much confidence in Perez. But all of Grady's moves have turned out golden tonight.
2006-06-02 21:37:24
413.   Steve
Perez probably could have handled Bellenino, but I never complain about seeing the Bull.
2006-06-02 21:37:26
414.   Bob Timmermann
Al Hrabosky believed that Hancock was taking every pitch so he wouldn't hit into a DP.
2006-06-02 21:37:28
415.   Nick Iyengar
396 Yeah, I don't consider it a problem, I just like to consider the possibilities
2006-06-02 21:37:51
416.   Steve
I guessed wrong. Bellerez.
2006-06-02 21:38:12
417.   ddger
I like seeing Broxton pitch in a close game for a change.
2006-06-02 21:38:15
418.   Sam DC
414 I was actually wondering that -- he can have another tryout for the team.
2006-06-02 21:38:22
419.   das411
WOAH, check out Madson's line right now!! Quick!
2006-06-02 21:38:23
420.   LAT
Going to the 13 in St Lou
2006-06-02 21:39:10
421.   ddger
Broxton, Baez, Saito, Gagne tonight?
2006-06-02 21:39:14
422.   capdodger
399 Nope. For one, you're (possibly intentionally) missing how small of a difference that is. It's one in a thousand.
Secondly, the run expectancy probably increases.

The thing about win expectancies is that it's emperical. It just means that one in thousand more home teams lost in the latter situation vs. the former.

2006-06-02 21:39:44
423.   Steve
419 -- I think it was more likely that he would get to 5 HRs than 5 Ks.
2006-06-02 21:39:54
424.   lakerican
I will continue saying we will trade Cruz and Baez. I don't know but something inside of me is telling me is the ...

Braves.

2006-06-02 21:39:56
425.   Bob Timmermann
Going to the 13th in Chicago.

The Cardinals are now racing with Saint Louis U, which is playing Cal State Fullerton now in the NCAA tournament.

Titans lead the Billikens 3-0 after 5.

2006-06-02 21:40:39
426.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
OP in line for his first win since great lizards roamed the earth.
2006-06-02 21:40:45
427.   Steve
421 -- I expect we'll see all of them, but I have a sneaking suspicion that it will somehow be Beimel v. Abreu and Howard.
2006-06-02 21:41:13
428.   D4P
Just one inning for Broxton...?
2006-06-02 21:41:40
429.   Steve
Now this...this seems like Lucille Time
2006-06-02 21:42:05
430.   Greg S
I hope (and half expect) we'll see Gagne in a non-save situation.
2006-06-02 21:42:25
431.   regfairfield
426 April?
2006-06-02 21:42:59
432.   capdodger
The fans in the stands are probably going to boo if the Dodgers score another run.
2006-06-02 21:43:16
433.   Steve
431 -- Scott Erickson wasn't on the roster in April.
2006-06-02 21:43:43
434.   LAT
I hate when Vin tells a story like that about the opposing pitcher. I really want to root against him.
2006-06-02 21:43:44
435.   regfairfield
JASFA
2006-06-02 21:43:52
436.   das411
432 - Time for that four run save rule then!

427 - Please?

2006-06-02 21:44:04
437.   Andrew Shimmin
426- I don't care if it's not true. That was funny.
2006-06-02 21:44:45
438.   D4P
Geoff Geary's photo is perhaps the smallest in Gameday history.
2006-06-02 21:44:49
439.   LAT
434. I meant to say "It impaires my ability to root against him."
2006-06-02 21:45:31
440.   King of the Hobos
Eric Riggs stole home at Vegas, although as best as I can tell, it was part of a double steal. Delwyn Young also went deep for the second game in a row. Izturis, however, had another 0-3 night
2006-06-02 21:45:44
441.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
426 - April, probably. But to OP, must seem like eons have passed.
2006-06-02 21:45:58
442.   Greg S
Did you see the pitch Kemp just laid off?
He's already improved.
2006-06-02 21:47:11
443.   Greg S
Well...
2006-06-02 21:47:26
444.   Bob Timmermann
Odalis Perez won in relief in San Francisco on May 14.
2006-06-02 21:48:21
445.   capdodger
Alomar is like molasses in January.
(Comparison not valid at Fenway Park.)
2006-06-02 21:48:32
446.   LAT
Pujlos at bat in St Louis. Luna on first otherwise you have to start giving him the Bonds walk. Bottom 13.
2006-06-02 21:48:41
447.   Steve
We need to start talking about dropping Fur-kel-man to the Izturis spot.
2006-06-02 21:49:30
448.   Uncle Miltie
This is the inning I'm worried about
2006-06-02 21:49:44
449.   LAT
Pujlos flies out
2006-06-02 21:50:23
450.   das411
Hmm, a Rollins single off of Baez, isn't there a technical term for that?
Show/Hide Comments 451-500
2006-06-02 21:51:41
451.   gcrl
expected?
2006-06-02 21:52:31
452.   capdodger
450 SOP?
2006-06-02 21:53:10
453.   Greg S
Crazy Rollins! Running down 2 runs in the 7th!
2006-06-02 21:54:05
454.   Steve
Crazy Rollins! He could have been there two pitches later and Sandy Alomar is catching!
2006-06-02 21:54:06
455.   LAT
Grits, use a short leash here
2006-06-02 21:54:11
456.   das411
And now ladies and gents, I present the patented Bobby Abreu Clutch GIDP!
2006-06-02 21:54:20
457.   trainwreck
Baez thinks if I cannot get a save then no one will.
2006-06-02 21:54:39
458.   Disabled List
Baez must think it's already the 9th inning.
2006-06-02 21:54:47
459.   LAT
Use the hook now!!!
2006-06-02 21:54:51
460.   kegtron
Is anyone even warming up?
2006-06-02 21:54:53
461.   Steve
450 -- I believe he's looking for words that begin with the initials G.P. But Baez is sort of a walking Grabowski Principle.
2006-06-02 21:55:03
462.   Gen3Blue
Who the hell is pitching.
2006-06-02 21:55:21
463.   capdodger
Was this really worth whatever we gave up for this?
2006-06-02 21:55:21
464.   ddger
Baez needs to hold this lead so we can get to Gagne.
2006-06-02 21:55:29
465.   kegtron
Jesus H. Christ
2006-06-02 21:55:34
466.   Greg S
When Baez goes wrong he goes really wrong. Get him out of there.
2006-06-02 21:55:38
467.   Uncle Miltie
We just got Baezed
2006-06-02 21:55:47
468.   D4P
Too bad Broxton can't throw more than 11 pitches...
2006-06-02 21:56:11
469.   das411
Does anybody else think Chase Utley has earned the nickname "The Destroyer" tonight?

462 - And why does he not have any arms??

2006-06-02 21:56:19
470.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
I see a pattern in Grittle's use of the bullpen: Starter goes 6, maybe 7; then one pitcher per inning for the next three (or two) innings.
Doesn't that seem like a high pace for the relievers?
I would look up games/innings pitched and all that to see if my theory holds weight, but I'm at work and my work computer sucks.
2006-06-02 21:56:38
471.   Steve
This is where we get lots of excuses regarding BABIP and bloop singles and arm angles and adjusting to a new league and look what we traded him for anyway.

Commence...now.

2006-06-02 21:56:40
472.   natepurcell
and up the relief totem pole broxton goes.
2006-06-02 21:57:14
473.   ddger
What a meltdown! When Baez blows it, he really knows how to do it in a big way just like he did in San Diego.
2006-06-02 21:57:41
474.   Disabled List
OP should've been left in to pitch the 6th. The pitcher's spot was due up first in the bottom of the inning, so Broxton was wasted an inning too early. Bull should've been brought in for the 7th, Saito for the 8th.

Little thinks he's Tony LaRussa tonight.

2006-06-02 21:57:58
475.   capdodger
471 There's no defense against the base on balls.
2006-06-02 21:58:09
476.   trainwreck
How's Tiffany doing?
2006-06-02 21:58:14
477.   Greg S
Seriously. GET HIM OUT OF THERE.
2006-06-02 21:58:14
478.   LAT
Neither Nomar, the kids nor winning can camouflage what a bad deal Baez is. In fact, if we lose this game it will be due to the two worst trades of the off season: Seo and Baez.
2006-06-02 21:58:28
479.   Brendan
what is grittle waiting for?
2006-06-02 21:58:38
480.   das411
So the key to negating the Phillies starters is to get into the LAD middle relief (= past Broxton)?
2006-06-02 21:58:59
481.   Bob Timmermann
I think Baez wants to get this game to Tim Hamulack.
2006-06-02 21:59:09
482.   scareduck
Greg Miller's my boy.
2006-06-02 21:59:59
483.   das411
Oh but Cholly Manuel would have left him in! Enjoy this "mediocre" managing, it's still a step or two up from "horrible".
2006-06-02 22:00:15
484.   D4P
Baez' WHIP in that game was undefined.
2006-06-02 22:00:16
485.   LAT
Nice work Baez you didn't get a single out while giving up two runs and loading the bases
2006-06-02 22:00:26
486.   Steve
Hesitating to make a point that I have made several times already, Danys Baez isn't...any...good.
2006-06-02 22:00:37
487.   natepurcell
not even one out baez? 1 little, measely out? couldnt even do that.

YOU ARE DEAD TO ME.

2006-06-02 22:00:42
488.   Greg S
Boy, for a minute I thought Baez might get an out.
2006-06-02 22:00:57
489.   Disabled List
Item in the paper tomorrow that would make me happy:

Transactions: LA (NL) - Baez, DFA

2006-06-02 22:01:01
490.   Brendan
How did he ever get a save against the Yanks and Red Sox?
2006-06-02 22:01:29
491.   D4P
486
Are you saying 41 saves isn't...any...good...?
2006-06-02 22:01:39
492.   Steve
487 -- It took until now? Where have you been?
2006-06-02 22:02:51
493.   Bob Timmermann
Baez is just on notice with me.

And you need to get your own blog and make your own lists.

2006-06-02 22:02:54
494.   Steve
In fairness, Saito now gets to pitch against the Pony League Phillies.
2006-06-02 22:03:08
495.   natepurcell
492

being cautiously optimistic he could turn it around.

2006-06-02 22:04:04
496.   das411
And a SCRAPPY dribbler up the line by Rowand! Thank you Danys Baez!!!
2006-06-02 22:04:24
497.   Bob Timmermann
And the Cubs take the lead on an Olney from Walker.
2006-06-02 22:05:17
498.   LAT
Cubs go up 5-4 in top 14
2006-06-02 22:05:45
499.   Greg S
Baez should beat up a water cooler and scream at Grady.
2006-06-02 22:06:32
500.   Steve
496 -- And you wanted Beimel. We'll take care of you. At least Jackson would be gascanning in AAA for meal money.
Show/Hide Comments 501-550
2006-06-02 22:06:48
501.   Disabled List
Not a stellar evening for Colletti pitching acquisitions. Seo and Baez are the suck.
2006-06-02 22:06:57
502.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
Vin just said these were the first inherited runners Saito's allowed to score.

At least we've got an out now.

Man, this stinks.

WWSH

2006-06-02 22:07:05
503.   Andrew Shimmin
You have to love a Dodger fan blog where a known and noisy Phillie fan can draw not so much as a gentle chiding, but the one guy who sticks up for the Dodgers' starting CF gets an earful for three innings. Not that he deserved less, but still.
2006-06-02 22:07:38
504.   D4P
Baez' ERA went from 2.30 to 3.95.
2006-06-02 22:07:56
505.   capdodger
499 That's reserved for pitchers who actually get an out before giving up five run.

Pitchers who don't get beaten up by the water cooler.

2006-06-02 22:07:58
506.   das411
500 - At least [Gavin Floyd] would be gascanning in AAA for meal money.

Argh Rowand, where was the face-sacrificing tackle of Old Man Alomar there??

2006-06-02 22:08:06
507.   Gen3Blue
Don't worry. We'll do something. We are so good we can rest our million dollar baby outfielder.
2006-06-02 22:08:34
508.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
If Saito can stop the bleeding, it's still just three runs, and we still have three frames against the Phillie pen.

WWSH

2006-06-02 22:09:16
509.   Bob Timmermann
1. The Dodgers still bat three more times.
2. The Dodgers will blow leads at times. So will other teams. It happens.

But you can close the book on Baez as 5 runs score without him retiring a batter. His ERA went up to 3.95.

2006-06-02 22:09:18
510.   natepurcell
we can come back from 3 runs. lofton and nomar get on and guzman hits it out. simple.
2006-06-02 22:09:57
511.   LAT
499. I think you meant Grady should beat up Baez and Baezshould scream at the water cooler.
2006-06-02 22:10:54
512.   Tommy John
Baez should be repatriated
2006-06-02 22:11:09
513.   Greg S
509
He didn't just blow that lead. He went all the way with it.
2006-06-02 22:12:29
514.   Gen3Blue
Looking at the first 3rd of the season I find it hard to find a role for Gagne. We are usually leading by six or losing by six by the last couple of innings.
2006-06-02 22:12:32
515.   Disabled List
Don't know what to say abut Saito there. I know it's not an easy task when you're handed a bases-loaded, no-out situation, but all 3 inherited runners came around to score.

At least he stranded his own runner. His ERA for the evening is a nice 0.00.

2006-06-02 22:12:38
516.   LAT
509. True Bob, but the blown leads keep coming from the same lousy deal.
2006-06-02 22:12:45
517.   capdodger
511 Or possibly Baez should scream while Grady beats him with the water cooler.
2006-06-02 22:13:11
518.   Chiron Brown
491 You think if we tell the Phils about all Baezs' saves last year they'll give back the 5 runs?
2006-06-02 22:14:07
519.   scareduck
509 - Can't Baez Me Outs.
2006-06-02 22:14:40
520.   Bob Timmermann
I was speaking of blown leads as being attributed to one person. I'm just thinking of them as an inevitable part of the game.
2006-06-02 22:14:41
521.   Vaudeville Villain
Not a pretty start to the bottom of the 7th.
2006-06-02 22:15:06
522.   LAT
517. Yep. thats the right combo.
2006-06-02 22:15:23
523.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
Thinking about it, although Grittle should have had a shorter hook, or let Brox go two, I still give him credit for being reasonably flexible, and letting the kids play. And I think after tonight he'll make the Bull our 7th inning man.

As for Ned, the Ethier trade has been brilliant, but I doubt he expected Ethier to give this much production. I still think the Seo trade was reasonable, as badly as Seo has pitched, and as good as Duaner has been for the Mets. So the two balance each other out.

The Baez trade really was indefensible, though, and all these kids are to Logan White's credit, so I guess Ned doesn't deserve much credit at all. His best free agent signing, Nomah, was also a target of DePo, so I don't think he gets much credit there. That being said, Ned's let Little play the kids, which is nice. Maybe they'll save us from Baez's fiasco.

WWSH

2006-06-02 22:15:59
524.   LAT
Cubs win. 5-4
2006-06-02 22:16:36
525.   Aug C
510-
Thanks a lot for jinxing it. It obviously would have happened if you hadn't explicitly predict it.
2006-06-02 22:16:51
526.   das411
Well everybody, just think, tomorrow you'll get to see a full afternoon's worth of SAL FASANO!!!!

503 - Noisy am I, huh? I would imagine Cub Town on a night Todd Walker drops an 0 for 7 from the cleanup spot would be quite a lot noisier than I am...

518 - Ehh, can we give you back David Bell instead?

2006-06-02 22:18:01
527.   D4P
Least Popular Dodgers of All-time

1. Jeff Kent
2. Danys Baez
3. Tom Niedenfuer

2006-06-02 22:19:06
528.   natepurcell
526

I honestly cant wait for Fasano. Fasano is the reason I wish we would play the Phillies in more then 2 series this year.

2006-06-02 22:19:27
529.   Greg S
527
Replace Kent with Carlos Perez and you've got something.
2006-06-02 22:19:47
530.   natepurcell
Thanks a lot for jinxing it. It obviously would have happened if you hadn't explicitly predict it.

.....ooops?

2006-06-02 22:19:51
531.   Gen3Blue
We would be better off carrying 9 or ten pitchers than twelve. When you have people on your roster you have to use them. We have Hamulack and Baez. When we had twelve we also had Carter.
2006-06-02 22:20:10
532.   LAT
527. Gary Shefield
2006-06-02 22:21:37
533.   kegtron
527.

Jason ______

2006-06-02 22:22:52
534.   Vaudeville Villain
Philly closer Tom Gordon's stats:

ERA: 1.57
WHIP: .96

Hopefully we can get to their set up man, whom I can't seem to find.

2006-06-02 22:23:21
535.   Disabled List
Baez' 2.30 ERA going into tonight was a joke. I remember that none of the 4 runs he gave up in that 9th inning in SF a few weeks back were earned, but he couldn't get an out that day either.

And his new 3.95 ERA really doesn't even reflect how truly awful he's been.

2006-06-02 22:23:41
536.   das411
Argh, I hate when I am an inning early on my Abreu choke predictions!
2006-06-02 22:24:39
537.   Greg S
Couldn't get an out on that Sunday in San Diego either. When he's bad he's very very bad.
2006-06-02 22:24:42
538.   Disabled List
527

Darryl. Delino.

2006-06-02 22:24:49
539.   Bob Timmermann
527

I don't know where to begin at pointing out how wrong that list is.

First of all, the list does not have Darryl Strawberry on it.

The list also doesn't have guys like Don Stanhouse or Dave Goltz.

I don't think anything Jeff Kent has done in his life can earn the same level of vituperation as Strawberry deserves.

Strawberry told people that he hoped L.A. would all burn down during the riots of 1992. Around the same time that his brother, an LAPD officer, had been injured on the job.

Kent is not a drug addict. He's not a criminal. He's not a pathological liar.

2006-06-02 22:24:57
540.   capdodger
535 Was that the time he made a throwing error and then gave up a couple runs, or was that a different outing?
2006-06-02 22:25:03
541.   Vaudeville Villain
Arthur Rhodes does seem to have quite a few holds for Philly. Hope springs eternal.
2006-06-02 22:25:07
542.   JoeyP
I took a break from this game to watch the end of the Cubs-Cards...

Box score says it all.
Danys Baez my word.

2006-06-02 22:25:59
543.   Chiron Brown
Baez was gotten for one reason, to put pressure on Gagne to re-sign for a reasonable amount. Because Baez can't pitch his way out of a wet paper bag, if Gagne can pitch remotely well, that ploy will have blown up in Ned's face. I wouldn't be surprised if Gagne is pitching now to show every other team that he still can. I doubt he has any desire to stay here.
2006-06-02 22:28:44
544.   Greg S
So will Gagne throw the top of the 9th?
2006-06-02 22:29:03
545.   Gen3Blue
Pitching has gotten so crazy. We used four pitchers to get to the seventh. I can't help think it has something to do with getting too lazy to train starters. We seem to routinely give up on guys who are 21 years old and make em relievers.(or trade them) Imean all of baseball.
2006-06-02 22:29:05
546.   das411
Hmm, has anybody ever seen this Olmedo Saenz fellow and 2005 Carlos Baerga in the same place at the same time...?
2006-06-02 22:29:21
547.   Gen3Blue
Pitching has gotten so crazy. We used four pitchers to get to the seventh. I can't help think it has something to do with getting too lazy to train starters. We seem to routinely give up on guys who are 21 years old and make em relievers.(or trade them) Imean all of baseball.
2006-06-02 22:29:21
548.   Andrew Shimmin
526- Noisy insofar as you don't hide your allegiance. Not objectively noisy. Also, I suffer from compulsive alliteration syndrome. It's really rather sad.
2006-06-02 22:30:18
549.   LAT
543. As twisted as that analysis is, I think it has some merit.
2006-06-02 22:30:37
550.   capdodger
Hmmm. The 7-hole is a little bit like a phone booth or VW Bug. Jam as many clowns in as you can.
Show/Hide Comments 551-600
2006-06-02 22:31:13
551.   Chiron Brown
On the plus side, a ninth inning rally could give Gagne his first win of the year.
2006-06-02 22:32:27
552.   Greg S
Doesn't Alomar look like a guy who SHOULD hit some home runs?
2006-06-02 22:32:49
553.   Vaudeville Villain
Alomar!
2006-06-02 22:33:01
554.   kegtron
The old timers chip in.
2006-06-02 22:33:20
555.   capdodger
Kemp TIme!!!
2006-06-02 22:33:57
556.   kegtron
C'mon M. Bison!
2006-06-02 22:34:11
557.   das411
548 - Only non-objectively when it's this particular matchup :)

Whoever brought up the idea of a player-manager a few days ago clearly had in mind Chase Utley calling for pitching changes in situations like this, right?

2006-06-02 22:34:25
558.   kegtron
Darn.

Gagne's cmoing in.

2006-06-02 22:35:02
559.   Vaudeville Villain
Kemp hit that one pretty hard.
2006-06-02 22:35:03
560.   natepurcell
ah, good pitch to hit and he hit it hard but right at rollins. oh well.
2006-06-02 22:35:30
561.   LAT
No commercial intermission tonight. Like the old days.

Vin seems happy to see him.

2006-06-02 22:35:30
562.   kegtron
*coming
2006-06-02 22:35:50
563.   Ryan Jerz
At least now we have that guy with the in-between ERA Jon mentioned earlier today?
2006-06-02 22:35:51
564.   Greg S
chills when Vinny says that.
2006-06-02 22:36:20
565.   Disabled List
I'm pumped now. If only we were leading.

Stupid Baez really ruined this game.

2006-06-02 22:36:47
566.   trainwreck
Ewwww.
2006-06-02 22:37:20
567.   capdodger
Welcome Back Gange. Don't suck.
2006-06-02 22:37:56
568.   das411
And The Bearded One returns!
2006-06-02 22:38:16
569.   JoeyP
Sandy Alomar's CERA
Dionner Navarro's CERA
Russell Martin's CERA

One of these doesnt belong.

2006-06-02 22:38:43
570.   LAT
I wish Vin would give us some pitch speeds.
2006-06-02 22:39:00
571.   capdodger
Hmm... It seems our benevolent dictator isn't around. Is he at the game?
2006-06-02 22:39:18
572.   LAT
Nevermind he just said 94mph
2006-06-02 22:40:27
573.   Vaudeville Villain
High was 95 mph, the little stat thing says.
2006-06-02 22:41:18
574.   das411
Gagne's hat...it's so....clean!
2006-06-02 22:41:46
575.   Steve
That fastball to Ryan Howard brought hope. That failed Bugs Bunny curve to Rowand brought panic.
2006-06-02 22:42:27
576.   Andrew Shimmin
571- He was around for 175, about half an hour in to the game. Though that could have been a cell phone post. He's a tricky one.
2006-06-02 22:43:08
577.   Aug C
Isn't Bugs a changeup?
2006-06-02 22:43:44
578.   capdodger
574- Vin just made the same observation.
2006-06-02 22:44:01
579.   Bob Timmermann
I think Jon is in Fullerton because I know he never misses the chance to see Saint Louis U play baseball.
2006-06-02 22:44:01
580.   Vaudeville Villain
Wasn't amazing, but nobody scored. Now let's get some runs.
2006-06-02 22:44:13
581.   Greg S
For the first outing in a year, I'm impressed.
Very good stuff. Just a little over anxious.
2006-06-02 22:44:19
582.   natepurcell
fb 90-95, mostly 91-92
2006-06-02 22:44:29
583.   Chiron Brown
Alright, top of the order, let's get Eric the win.
2006-06-02 22:45:19
584.   Steve
That was fun. The heat was there and the changeups were working and he's just a little off on his release point high. I'm way optimistic.
2006-06-02 22:45:52
585.   Uncle Miltie
Tom Gordon is awesome. I love watching him pitch.
2006-06-02 22:46:00
586.   Gen3Blue
Gangne looked a bit rusty, but with tools to rule again. He has that feeling that if a guy gets on so what.(Saito too). He looks like he can't blow it like Baez or Carter could, not even close.
2006-06-02 22:46:13
587.   Steve
That pitch was nowhere close to the plate, but neither was Fur-kel-man.
2006-06-02 22:46:31
588.   Greg Brock
Boy, Gagne isn't the same without those steroids...Um, I mean, without his workout regiment...Um, nevermind.
2006-06-02 22:46:41
589.   Gen3Blue
Our Multi million lead-off man.
2006-06-02 22:46:59
590.   underdog
Um, dudes, is Chase Utley really 8 for 8 or is that a GameChannel mistake? I missed a few innings of the game here and there... quite a few at bats in general for guys tonight. My MLB audio player crashed twice and now it won't let me log on again - "You have logged on too many times. Please try again later." Grr.
2006-06-02 22:47:26
591.   capdodger
584 - I'm way optimistic.

Stop the presses.

2006-06-02 22:47:39
592.   Brendan
I was at Gagne's last game and I was sure we had seen the last of him. very happy at that inning.
2006-06-02 22:48:11
593.   Steve
Andrew has me fitted for Up With People.
2006-06-02 22:48:19
594.   Brendan
when does lofton get a day off? tight hamstring and all.
2006-06-02 22:48:36
595.   LAT
I'm guessing Odails wants to kick Baez' butt something awful. We know he doesn't suffer his teammates mistakes easily.
2006-06-02 22:48:53
596.   Greg Brock
Wonder why Eric looks fifteen pounds lighter...Must be the camera. Or the lack of HGH...One of those two things.
2006-06-02 22:49:00
597.   Bob Timmermann
If Utley were 8 for 8 that means the Phillies would have sent AT LEAST 74 batters to the plate in 9 innings.
2006-06-02 22:49:26
598.   Steve
Jimmy Rollins brings the comedy.
2006-06-02 22:49:34
599.   Vaudeville Villain
Well, now we've at least got the tying run at the plate. It's not over yet, we've got some power coming up.
2006-06-02 22:49:41
600.   Greg S
Okay. NOW Kenny can stay put.
Show/Hide Comments 601-650
2006-06-02 22:49:58
601.   capdodger
Here is a No Steal Situation.
Nomar is the important run.
2006-06-02 22:50:08
602.   Brendan
596

he could still use HGH. Baseball doesn't blood test and there is no test for HGH with urine.

2006-06-02 22:50:19
603.   Steve
This is, um, quite a moment.
2006-06-02 22:50:37
604.   das411
Tom Gordon, making Phillies fans everywhere reminisce fondly of the ninth inning certainty provided by Jose Mesa.

Grrrrr!!

2006-06-02 22:50:38
605.   ROC
JtD FTW?
2006-06-02 22:51:10
606.   Greg Brock
602--We all know that...It was just a joke.
2006-06-02 22:51:21
607.   D4P
If I didn't know better, I'd be tempted to say that Nomar has been clutch so far this year.
2006-06-02 22:51:34
608.   Vaudeville Villain
Argh, Guzman hits into the game-ending double play.
2006-06-02 22:51:47
609.   Steve
Gack. A Beltre/Mondesi Special. Good pitch by Tom Gordon, and we get what we deserve with Danys Baez.
2006-06-02 22:52:04
610.   Greg S
Hey, that wasn't in the script.
2006-06-02 22:52:05
611.   Greg Brock
Joel the Destroyer...My Rosy Irish Ass...I stand by Joel the Slight Damager.
2006-06-02 22:52:17
612.   underdog
597 Yeah, and I'm just noticing that Sandy Alomar is 3 for 7, so is Nomar, and Lofton is 3-9 -- according to GameChannel and Yahoo. Hah hah. This is hilarious. I want to see extra innings to see if Utley can go "9 for 9". Hah.
2006-06-02 22:52:17
613.   Brendan
I would have used Drew in that situation and not had him leadoff a few innings earlier but what do I know.
2006-06-02 22:52:32
614.   das411
Wow, sorry guys, even I was somewhat disappointed by that ending. Would've been fun to see Gagne bat...

597 - You say that like it would be a bad thing Bob!

2006-06-02 22:52:45
615.   Gen3Blue
I think that was a nasty thing to do to Guz.
2006-06-02 22:53:06
616.   LAT
Thanks Vin. I forgot that in additon to blowing thegame, Baez blew the 7 game DS winning streak.
2006-06-02 22:53:22
617.   underdog
Er... so much for that. Sigh, oh well, Superman's Father just grounded into a double play and... night everyone!
2006-06-02 22:54:17
618.   JoeyP
The Destroyer needs to hit the ball in the air and drive it. 5AB's 5 ground balls so far for him.
2006-06-02 22:54:41
619.   Linkmeister
Hey, I thought this was Hollywood! Who screwed up the script?
2006-06-02 22:54:52
620.   Brendan
606

you should have said steroids, it's a honest mistake.

2006-06-02 22:55:17
621.   Gen3Blue
I hope Guz does Ok-- I've seen careers destroyed thus.
2006-06-02 22:55:36
622.   Greg Brock
The important question: Did Joel Guzman drink from puddles like Vlad used to in the Dominican? Only Vin can answer this question.
2006-06-02 22:55:47
623.   LAT
Baez:

Blows the game
Blows Odalis' win
Blows Gagne's save
Blows the win streak
Blows the chance to move into a tie for first.

That's a whole lotta blowin'

2006-06-02 22:56:16
624.   JoeyP
There's no shame in giving up 8 runs to the phillies. They do have a pretty good offense. I'm surprised Odalis only pitched 1 inning.
2006-06-02 22:56:34
625.   Bob Timmermann
The major league record for plate appearances in a nine inning game is 71.

In an extra inning game (25 innings), the record is 104.

2006-06-02 22:57:44
626.   Uncle Miltie
602- I'm sure he's still using. He can always borrow some from Ryan Klesko. We play the Padres in 2 weeks. Can he wait that long? Otherwise, Bonds can FedEx some "emergency help".
2006-06-02 22:58:07
627.   Steve
Guzman is probably not ready, but it won't hurt to get him in a few situations like that and let him see a good pitcher like Tom Gordon who can make a pitch like that. He'll learn from it. None of what Guzman does matters if we wasn't for the right-handed, trillion-dollar Hamulack wannabe in the bullpen.
2006-06-02 22:58:17
628.   Greg Brock
620-You're absolutely correct.

P.S. When you have a chance, please point out the scientific inaccuracies of Star Wars, and explain how explosions don't really make a sound in space...KILLJOY.

2006-06-02 22:58:55
629.   Brendan
even with those long arms it seems JtD reaches too much. You would think he would be comfortable with his plate coverage. of course that's only two at bats that I have seen
2006-06-02 22:58:56
630.   D4P
I'm surprised Odalis only pitched 1 inning.

Broxton too. The guy threw only 11 pitches.

2006-06-02 23:00:08
631.   Brendan
628

That's all I wanted. ;)

2006-06-02 23:00:13
632.   Steve
Is it true that when a Pittsburgh home game ends early, the fans pay extra for the privilege?
2006-06-02 23:00:47
633.   Uncle Miltie
Tracy would blame the loss on the rookies for not coming through with RISP
2006-06-02 23:00:57
634.   Greg Brock
631-

NERD ALERT...I kid because I love.

2006-06-02 23:01:36
635.   das411
624 , 630 - Hahahaha, Grady Little being criticized for taking pitchers out too soon? What has the world come to?? :-P

See youse all tomorrow for the rubber match. Nate: make sure you wake up early enough to see Salitalian!!

2006-06-02 23:03:44
636.   Steve
633 -- I was just thinking that. Then Mike Edwards would trot out to third tomorrow. Of course, at least Lucille is OPSing, what is it now, 1.100?
2006-06-02 23:04:50
637.   Greg Brock
So, we've seen Kemp, Martin, Ethier, Guzman, and Ethier. If the prospect love continues, when do we see Billingsley called up? I mean, it would really be a shame to pull Seo's 84mph ass out of the rotation, but I think we could survive.
2006-06-02 23:04:54
638.   Steve
635 - das, we're going four, buddy! That's up to two more cracks at what's left of Tampa Bay's bullpen!
2006-06-02 23:05:03
639.   Brendan
Ha! we're all on a dodger web site on a friday night. let he who is without sin cast the first stone. (The fact that I'm discussing urine though does make a point in your favor)
2006-06-02 23:07:17
640.   Steve
If whatever Grady is saying on the post-game show doesn't include the words "Baez" and "DFA" then I really don't want to hear it.
2006-06-02 23:13:27
641.   Uncle Miltie
Rick Monday is bad...he's going over the scores and he says something about the Witness Protection Program and says that not many people saw the game in Tampa, only 94,000...
2006-06-02 23:14:00
642.   natepurcell
guzman's bat looks like a toothpick.
2006-06-02 23:15:12
643.   Uncle Miltie
I remember someone (Steve?) saying that at least Lofton isn't Jacque Jones. Well now, Jacque Jones is outproducing Lofton! Time to hang them up Kenny!
2006-06-02 23:17:10
644.   JoeyP
even with those long arms it seems JtD reaches too much.

JtD's learning curve may be a little steeper than other players bc he's so tall and has a large strike zone. I think he probably feel pressure to not strike out, so you see him reaching for pitches. I may look at Richie Sexson's early career to see how fast he adjusted to the league. There's arent many hitters as tall as Guzman. Larger K zone would seem to make it easier for the pitchers.

2006-06-02 23:27:25
645.   JoeyP
It took Sexson until the age of 25 (in his 7th pro season), before mastering enough of the K zone to be respectable.

And Sexson really only had 1 dominant minor league season (at age 22 at AAA where he hit 31HRs). However, his OBP was never that good in the minors.

I think Guzman's gonna have the same struggles as Sexson, but hopefully he adjusts faster. There's a lot less pressure on a young hitter to produce when he's playing SS, rather than 1st though. I think Guzman/Loney (1 of them) the Dodgers will decide on at 1st, and the other gets dealt.

2006-06-02 23:27:52
646.   Greg Brock
644-
JtD aplogists of the world, unite!
2006-06-02 23:29:48
647.   MartinBillingsley31
Am i crazy or does it seem like the following contracts were unnecessary.
Lofton 3.85 m
Mueller 4.25 m
Baez 4 m
Total 12.1 m
Also we would still have jackson and tiffany to trade with izturis and navarro and maybe someone else for a high priced good starting pitcher that is only signed this year or thru next year, giving us a playoff rotation of lowe, penny, new pitcher, billingsley.
And a lineup of drew, kent, furcal, nomar, ethier, aybar, martin, and the last spot between kemp/cruz/repko.
2006-06-02 23:35:03
648.   natepurcell
Im not too terribly concerned with Joel. His power will come. right now he needs to work on making contact, taking balls, and his swing mechanics. I think Eddie Murray or Manny Mota should have a little batting session with him. he seems to be standing a tad farther from the plate then i would like.
2006-06-02 23:36:30
649.   Steve
641 -- They were so crushed that they lost the closer that had brought them so much success over the past three years that they just stopped coming.

643 -- That sounds like me.

2006-06-02 23:40:09
650.   natepurcell
i like watching that kemp homerun over and over... and over.
Show/Hide Comments 651-700
2006-06-02 23:41:06
651.   JoeyP
I'm not apologizing for Guzman. I just think as a tall hitter, he's going to have trouble at first.

Its a bad dynamic for Guzman (and really all the youngsters that come up). I know they dont want to strike out, bc when a rookie hitter strikes out immediately most will think they are over matched at the MLB level. So that leads to batters reaching for pitches they normally wouldnt, just so they dont K.

IF I was instructing Joel Guzman, I'd tell him that we're only concerned with his hitting for power. That right now we dont really care about the strike outs.

Because honestly as a tall hitter, the K's are gonna be there no matter what. I dont want to see Joel Guzman taking defensive swings up there. I want him swinging hard and lettin loose.

2006-06-03 00:01:18
652.   ddger
Baez will have gone from closer, to setup, to long relief, to minors before end of this season if he continues like this.
2006-06-03 00:28:00
653.   Blu2
Baez will have gone from closer, to setup, to long relief, to minors before end of this season if he continues like this.

Not good enough; add DEAD!

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