http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/story/10145755

1-2 K swing and a miss

2-2 gb to second

1-2 gb to third

5IP 3H 1ER 1BB 10K 1HR

To harken back to the last thread, I'm not sure why, but Traxler's name really sticks out in my mind as a guy I remember from my childhood. I don't really have any memories to back it up, just that the name is engrained.

6th inning:

0-2 K swing and a miss

2-2 curveball K swing and a miss

...at this point, the announcer catches up and agrees -- 12Ks.

2-0 gb to 2nd

6IP 3H 1ER 1BB 12K 1HR

That is if you are using the new style Gameday.

My favorite Offerman moment, though, was when Tommy had him bunt ahead of the pitcher. That was awesome. I'll go on retrosheet and try to find the game.

Nice reminder above, btw, Jon. I hope people do have fun with the rivalry while remaining civil. Though you may be preaching to the choir here. The potential culprits are probably already there and drinking, but hopefully it'll be a fun, civil game in which the Giants are smacked.

I'm looking at a 15 year run with 13 playoff appearances, 7 pennants, and 4 rings....effective last season.

I'm referring specifically to your argument with the Dodgers' system teaching players new positions because there are good players with long and rich contracts "blocking" them at the positions they were drafted for.

Is that really an unusual practice? Isn't it more typical for teams to have prospects who are blocked by major league players? Isn't it sheer luck when a grizzled veteran fades just at the moment a shiny prospect is ready to take his place? Isn't the norm really the situation the Dodgers are in now, with prospects who might be ready when the players in front of them are still worth keeping?

Eventually the logjam breaks either via injury, or via a trade involving either the veteran or the prospect...or by one or the other player learning a new position. In fact, isn't the new-position option the best one to pursue if you have a lot of good prospects like the Dodgers have? You increase your ability to respond to more different situations that way.

To look at a specific case, I don't think Juan Pierre's contract will require Grady to play him if a bonafide better replacement should emerge from the farm system, like Kemp. Contract or no, if Pierre becomes expendable, he will be expended, maybe not for high value, but for something. But if Pierre produces, I'll be glad that the Dodgers tried to teach Kemp, Loney and whoever new positions so they could be in the same lineup.

The Dodgers' trade of Konerko stands out as the worst example of a "blocked" player being dumped in favor of a mediocre veteran. But for every Konerko/Karros situation, there are probably five situations in reverse, where a veteran was allowed to leave to make way for a prospect who couldn't cut it. How much better off would the Angels be now if they hadn't let Troy Glaus leave? At the time, not re-signing him was applauded. Dallas McPherson was ready. Except it didn't work out that way. While Glaus has had a series of good seasons with lots of home runs, the Angels have been playing banjo hitters at third base.

Anyway... just curious if Canuck or someone can enlighten me with facts on these points.

I would let Nate and others more familiar chime in (but hey I can read Baseball America and John Sickels as well as they can) since they have 5 years before Kershaw even has to be protected on the 40 man roster, my hunch is that he stays at Great Lakes for the whole year.

I suppose if he just becomes a monster and he is truly dominant (4.3 K/BB ratio, 14 K/9 innings notwithstanding), he could go up to the California League.

He is 19, and though its possible that sometime while he is 20 he could be in Jacksonville, I just think they will be real cautious in his development.

So tonight, as I attend my first game of the year, I will think of those Giants fans and how respectful they were to a couple of LA boys, and try to show that we can be just as hospitable. And just as brutal with our heckles. NO MERCY!!!!! GO DODGERS!!!!

http://tinyurl.com/29nq88

It fails to mention the threats, the cheating, the extortion, the breach of contract and that no one has ever been sorry to see him go.

So often I felt like I was the only one, and I didn't know any Koreans who cared about baseball.

He essentially picked Repko over Ross.
Not smart in foresight.
Not smart in hindsight.
Just not smart.

If nothing else, this puts yet another nail in the coffin of "character." And it highights the opposite sort of player, who is adored by fans and media, but is an extra-special jerk in the clubhouse. Garvey, anyone?

Phil Mickelson?

The first major league game I attended was in Anaheim and it was Alex Johnson Bat Night.

I guess I was just an impressionable youth.

And I was only half-serious about Garvey. While I was crushed as a kid to find out that he wasn't an all-around superhero (egads- Sutton was right?!), I also don't think he was a destructive force - just sort of aloof. But what do I know?

Many of us have colleagues on both sides of this contrast. I have some with whom I get along very well on a social level, but who drive me absolutely insane in meetings, and others with whom I'd never want to share a meal, but whose contributions in meetings and other professional endeavors I value.

I'm pretty sure none of it matters for how well players perform on the field, but it's important also to recognize that character isn't just one thing.

I doubt Sheffield is either the angel the writer portrayed him as or the demon LAT perceives him to be.

IIRC, wasn't there a Sports Illustrated article during Sheffield's time with the Dodgers that essentially said he was a changed man after he got married (to a gospel singer I think)? That was what now, three teams ago where he wore out his welcome? Eventually, baseball writers are going to have to drop that, "he's a changed man" angle.

Sheffield is what he is: a great ballplayer who happens to be a jerk. Barry Bonds is the same way, but the Giants have (smartly?) isolated him and catered to his demeanor.

I would like to know, provided Sheffield gets elected to the Hall of Fame, what hat does he wear?

Vonnegut, peace be upon him, said "you are what you pretend to be." Stipulating to that, actual derangement is not substantively different from creating a deranged persona.

i can't believe the coaching staff hasn't caught what Russell Martin is doing wrong & correcting it

I should be getting Sheffield's book in the library soon and I'll review it on the Griddle.

Don't most lefties who pull all the time ground out to second when they fail to put the ball in the air?

Are there other players in the HOF whose hats don't have logos (apart from guys who played back before the hats were logo-ed)?

Watching Nomar and Pierre I thought, "bad! Wear down the opposing pitcher!"

http://tinyurl.com/39th3f

Bulls-107
Heat-89

its sailing on him. going behind the runner and second basemen.

It could be one of 2 things IMO.

1) His elbow is flying of when he throws the ball.

2) He's looking @ Kent when he's throwing the ball. they tell you to throw the ball at the bag not @ who ever is gonna catch it. I could be wrong.JMO.

But I'll bet it would be the Marlins.

Well, that could have been a lot worse

Thanks for the link. Looking through it trying to find other logo-less players, I came across Nolan Ryan with a Rangers cap.

http://tinyurl.com/2j65tf

Does anyone know if this was a request by Nolan that the Hall of Fame chose to honor? Personally, I think his time with the Angels or Astros was more indicative of his career.

LA was actually his stop that most combined tenure and consistent performance. I just don't see him wearing an LA cap though.

How about he just not make it altogether.

If he gets a logo, my guess would be the Marlins too.

Hence, Dave Winfield had to be a Padre and Gary Carter had to be an Expo on their HOF plaque.

Should be interesting.

But that's just a guess.

Sold.

I think Eric Enders' point about heroes and heals is well made, but can't we start assessing shades of gray once Sheffield retires?

Does 31 get retired when Piazza gets in, even if he wears a Mets cap? How about a catcher's helmet turned backwards (no logo)?

Oh boy, this argument again! I think he has to go in as a Dodger. I really, really, really think so.

He can have the Mets cap as long as his likeness on the plaque has the mustache and mullet combo from the LA days.

I wonder why Sheffield seems to have so much more animus directed at him than I think Darryl Strawberry ever did and I would say he's the only Dodger player I have actively disliked and I still actively dislike him and dislike him more than anyone else who has ever played baseball.

I dislike him in an actual sense, not in a Russ Ortiz/Frank Robinson way.

it must have been a "sweet" deal.

That's not the argument I'm bringing up. I'm not debating what team Piazza should go in under. I want to know about the Dodgers retiring his number.

Do the Dodgers really have that policy? That's the first I've heard of it. Is Jim Gilliam the only exception then?

When Lisa Simpson asked why, the man running the preserve said, "Sometimes, some elephants are just jerks."

However, there are lots of HOFers who played for the Dodgers who don't have retired numbers. It's a matter of how long the player was a Dodger.

It's not like Juan Marichal's number is retired. I doubt Greg Maddux will have a #40 hanging up in the pavilions later.

Arizona is down 6-3 however.

Quick self-correction

I remember that episode [chuckling]

Someone has to be "first" don't they?

1) Andre Ethier (left arm)
2) Andre Ethier (right arm)

Do they other ones matter?

Morris is mowing down the boys like dry grass.

hmm...

Matt Morris doesn't scare me like Barry Zito scares me or Matt Cain when he's throwing his A game.

I'd take some unearned runs

exactly, you save a couple of pitches that way. :o)

And the bean doesn't count against your WHIP

And the retaliation would give the Dodgers some baserunners

Just make sure Jeff Kent is still wearing the older model helmet

Still 5 minutes left in the 2nd.

I hope this is Phil's last road game he coaches for the Lakers.

Kobe is in now. Phoenix has Diaw, Stoudemire, Nash, Marion, and Barbosa. Not exactly a recipe for success.

I hate Jim Buss and Mitch Kupchak.

...for the Lakers, of course

If the score for tonight's game continues, I'll then have to enjoy my overly cocky Giants fan co-worker give me shit about the game, and talk about how great the Giants are doing now. Giants fans are notoriously overly cocky and overly morose depending on the situation - their team is either horrible and should be embarrassed, or the best team in baseball. So I can't wait hear the perspective tomorrow.

And yes, Daniel, that is the line-up for the Lakers at the moment. I don't have much confidence in that group, except for Odom.

Good thing I don't also work with a Suns fan.

Lakers, Dodgers...Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue.

If the score for tonight's game continues, I'll then have to enjoy my overly cocky Giants fan co-worker give me a hard time about the game, and talk about how great the Giants are doing now. Giants fans are notoriously overly cocky and overly morose depending on the situation - their team is either horrible and should be embarrassed, or the best team in baseball. So I can't wait hear the perspective tomorrow.

And yes, Daniel, that is the line-up for the Lakers at the moment. I don't have much confidence in that group, except for Odom.

Good thing I don't also work with a Suns fan.

His triangle system, and Kupchak's adherence to drafting those type of system players instead of athletes..haa made the Lakers not only a medicore team, but a team that isnt very fun to watch.

Phoenix is just slicing up a slow unathletic Laker team on the offensive end.

Or a San Jose SaberCats fan (I assume).

But isn't Kobe at least partially to blame for the limbo? Everything that has happened since Buss gave Kobe the big bucks has been predictable.

It was over the weekend.

Throw in the horrid Butler for Kwame deal, and the team just doesnt have it. Bringing in Phil's done nothing but dig into the pockets for the Buss's whom dont want to go over the luxury tax as is.

I just hope you aren't a Strike Team fan. Vic Mackey is the one good TV option remaining tonight.

it was so awesome they even made a youtube of it.

You think Damon has a better arm than Pierre?

If only it were that good. But it weren't: they also got saddled with Brian Grant's contract.

I don't know but that made me chuckle.

They also compounded how bad a trade it was by giving up Butler for Kwame.

Fans were getting a little edgy, thinking the five-year, $44 million contract the Dodgers gave Pierre could've been used for the big bat the team lacks.

Since that time, however, Pierre has bounced back, putting the skeptics to rest and putting his bat to use.

"Absolutely not, I haven't changed a thing," said Pierre, after being asked if he had been doing anything different in the past week. "I've been a little more aggressive going after pitches earlier in the count, but other than that I think the ball is just finding some holes."

Your mind reading is a little off. I'm basing my desire to trade Lowe on his current value (at its peak) and his emotional ties to the ESPN feud, which could result in a good deal from the Yankees.

I've read that NY has built up a good farm system recently, and I would love to steal some of their eggs.

We don't do that Oakland thing

their system isnt amazing, its pretty top heavy with hughes and tabata leading the charge. they have alot of intriging arms outside of hughes with maybe Betances reaching hughes status in 3years or so.

I have said this before but it is the most difficult league to come back from.

The Lakers were fortunate in 1996 to be in a position to sign Shaq and trade Vlade for Kobe. Normally you cannot do that.

Think about it, the teams that are doing well had to really crash and burn and not just for one year.

The Bulls have not sniffed the Finals since Jordan, Pippen and Phil left in 9 years ago.

It took Detroit 13 years to come back.

San Antonio needed a few No. 1 picks to get Robinson and Duncan.

Boston, Philly, Houston, we are still waiting.

The Lakes won their titles for the decade and they may not win another until a whole new team gets here. But it won't due to trading Kobe because those deals just are not made in NBA.

Hmm...I want position prospects, especially outfielders. Maybe some other team, then.

I dont understand your infatuation with Turiaf.

I don't think you want to give up on Bynum yet.

78-51, this is an embarrassing playoff game.

Bynum will never be a legit star, but he still has that 'potential' tag--so I'd deal him for someone that loves 'potential'.

Farmer I think will make a good backup PG.

well Tabata is an OF who is only 18 and in the FSL. He projects to be pretty darn good. If the yanks want to build a package around tabata plus two arms i would be willing to listen.

To make it even funnier, Martin should have kicked him in the groin. There's nothing funnier than a groin strike.

they had a day off yesterday so I doubt it, if anything we're getting the loss out of the way early & we'll win the next 2.

But what does the Boss say? If the Yanks get swept again this weekend, they could go into full panic mode.

If Vin Scully signs off and Tom Bergeron walks on, then I'm giving up baseball.

Intriguing. Good outfielder with strong arm or Manny? Power, too, of course, yes?

What two pitchers do you want?

i'm still keeping my fingers crossed hoping we can pull off the win though. One more thing Matt Morris face annoys me right now maybe it's because his winning by being "a crafty veteran"

By the way, I've noticed that Steiner is a lot more subdued on his every-flyball-is-a-home-run this season.

I think someone may have mentioned it to him.

Among the Dodger starters for that game were fresh-faced rookies like Shawn Green, Robin Ventura, Adrian Beltre, Steve Finley, Alex Cora, and Brent Mayne.

this is what goldstein had to say about tabata...

the Good: Plus hitting skills and a mature approach well beyond his years. With outstanding bat speed and excellent hand/eye coordination, Tabata projects through the roof offensively based on what he's already been able to do at such a young age. He's a tick-above-average runner and a solid outfielder with a good arm.
The Bad: While nobody questions Tabata's ability to hit for average down the road, his power projection is a matter of some debate. Some feel that his pure hitting skills are enough to project for plus power, with others are concerned that his smallish frame will limit him to no more than 15-20 home runs annually.
The Irrelevant: In 2006, Tabata hit .261 with the bases empty, and .331 with runners on base.
In A Perfect World, He Becomes: A star corner outfielder, but whether he competes for batting titles or slugging titles is still up in the air.
Gap Between What He Is Now, And What He Can Be: High. Tabata will begin the season in the High-A Florida State League as an 18-year-old. There's no reason to rush him.

Id probably ask for chase wright and George Kontos to go along with Tabata.

I think there is a huge difference between giving up Bynum for Garnett, who doesn't really seem to be available despite all the rumors, and Kidd, who is in the twilight of his career. I'm not sure how much of an impact Kidd can have in his last few years in the league on this Lakers team. If the Lakers could land Garnett for Bynum/Odom package, you'd have to make that deal. I'm just not sure how realistic that is though.

Thanks, and I know.

i agree, that was a perfect position to PH tomoato and have clark take over in LF.

And you would also burn two players (Gonzalez and Saenz). You would need to have Saenz be hitting .800 in that situation.

I agree with you mostly except that I think that Ethier, starting right fielder, gets pinch hit for in that same situation.

Ethier is the longer tenured Dodger. But to paraphrase Kim Etheridge, Luis Gonzalez has 7.35 million reasons he should be hitting there.

who is he with his 295+ career BA?

Kobe is not Magic but he is better than Kareem.

Especially in hindsight?

I don't think Grady Little managed that situation any differently than any other of the 29 managers in the majors would.

Did he run all the way from the dugout? :)

With this ump's 5 ft wide strike zone, it's hard to work the count, but...

Their MLEs the last few years have gone to Vlade Divac, Aaron Mckie, and Vladimir Radmonovic, none of whom are players anybody who watches basketball would tell you were worthwhile investments.

Their drafting has been absolutely terrible, with only Farmar showing any signs of being worthile.

As long as this team stubbornly sticks to its current strategy of sticking Kobe with one above average player, and a roster full of mediocrity, its prospects for the future are not good.

Apparently not

{delete}

Doesn't Kobe's contract essentially dictate that approach?

No, but Kwame's and Odom's do.

i dont understand why you are pinning this on Kobe. Are you saying he should have accepted something less than a max contract? why? When you negotiate a contract for a job offer, wouldnt you want to make the most as possible for the services you provide. And if you are especially good at what you do, your employer should pay a premium to have you in the fold. Sometimes I think you're a communist.

Mitch has been an unmitigated disaster as a GM. And there's no relief in sight. The guy is just terrible.

I noticed we didn't win.

It just seems like the Lakers are wasting valuable resources--sort of like the 90's Dodgers did. I dont think anyone expects NBA titles every season, but they shoudl be better than the 7th/8th seed given their organizational structure and Kobe. Its not like this is a fledgling franchise.

The Mavs can lose Nash, and not skip a beat. Suns can build it up from scratch. The Spurs seem to retool around Duncan each year (although drafting Manu/Parker were steals).

I hope the Lakers (if they are destined to lose) at least dump Phil Jackson and bring in some athletes to run with Kobe and play a more up/down style. I hate watching the triangle.

I don't necessarily know that it does. It just takes more creativity then the Lakers front office has shown in terms of who to add to the roster.

Role players can be good players, it's just that the team is filled with so many players who fulfill no role at all.

Sasha Vujacic is essentially useless. Turiaf is a fan favorite, but contributes little offensively and defensively is a weakness. Smush Parker does nothing aside from occasionally get steals, and generally plays uninspired defense. Luke Walton is Lamar Odom without the driving or rebounding ability. Nearly every player on the Lakers team aside from Brian Cook, Kobe Bryant, and Lamar Odom is lacking a standout skill that would make them useful.

Since I can't see that happening, I wonder what MLB's excuse will be for not enforcing their own rule. This business of taking the champagne back doesn't fly in my view, as the rule states "Any player or person connected with a Club who shall offer or give any gift or reward..." Thus, the mere offering of a gift or reward (whether it's accepted or not) warrants a minimum three-year suspension.

They're particularly annoying when the Lakers are losing.

I can still see the Lakers taking one at home, but that's about it.

I hope the Dodgers come back tomorrow to help erase the sour taste from tonight's action. Night all.

In many ways, they are in a similar contract sitaution to the Lakers. Obviously Houston's big two of T-Mac and Yao is better than Kobe/Odom, but bear with me.

Yao draws in a defense, and Mcgrady draws in double-teams, so what does Houston intelligently do? They surround them with three-point shooters like Rafer Alston, Shane Battier, and Luther Head.

The Lakers situation is similar. Bryant draws double teams, and Odom is excellent at drive and dish. Yet, aside from Brian Cook, this team is terrible at shooting from downtown. It's just bad roster construction.

I agree, but I'm curious to see what excuse MLB will give for not enforcing their own rule.

There is no light at the end of the tunnel. And they still have Radmanovic as well. Gadzooks.

don't fret, boys! you'll get garnett this summer!

I think Garnett is a dream at this point. There is nothing we can offer Minnesota that is of comparable value.

Checked with DeJon Watson, and Elbert had discomfort in his shoulder during a side session. Some test restults are due tomorrow, after which more will be known. But this sounds like nothing. In DeJon's words, "We're being overly cautious."

a bit of good news.

If he wins another MVP, which would make it 3 straight--lock hall of famer.

It's not like the Lakers can pay 4 million of Odom's contract if they trade him. That's the real killer. Salaries have to match within a certain percentage when trading players.

The NBA salary system is a nightmare for teams.

Nash will probably make the Hall of Fame, but it may take a while. It doesn't go out of its way to induct NBA stars.

No need to insult the fine folks of the Hall of Fame like that.

Yesterday I posted that I didn't like Dejesus and you responded but unfortunately I was away. I think there is reason to believe he might improve, but he has demonstrated zero power so far, and only hits for a mediocre average (.281 for his minor league career, .277 last year). He has decent OBP skills (.359 career OBP, .78 ISOpatience), but again a career slugging of .325. He is off to a slow start this year (.256/.326/.333) too, so I still just don't see it.

He is young and Logan White likes him, so that is enough to be hopeful, but he hasn't shown me much yet.

Jon, thanks again for allowing me to post this.

Has anyone done a study of the liklihood of a bad team becoming an excellent team in the NBA vs MLB vs NFL? I think it happens most often in baseball and least often in the NBA but I have not done any kind of study of it.

Anyway, new post up top.