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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
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11) commenting under the obvious influence
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Obscure but Memorable Dodgers: 2000s Edition
2008-01-10 08:54
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

Here's a list of everyone who has played for the Dodgers in the 2000s, courtesy of Baseball-Reference.com.

Shawn Green is the leader in games played for the Dodgers this decade, with 798. The team's active leader is Jeff Kent, with 400.

In two seasons, Rafael Furcal has played in 297 games, good for second on the active list and 11th on the decade list. (Close behind Furcal are Andre Ethier (279), Russell Martin (272) and Nomar Garciaparra (243).) With only an expected 324 regular-season games remaining in the oughts, Green should be able to hold his lead, unless the Dodgers trade for someone like Adrian Beltre (737).

I'm particularly fond of the bottom of the games-played list – so fond, in fact, that I put the bottom at the top when I did my search. Four players were in one game for the Dodgers this decade: Scott Mullen, Bryan Corey, Mike Judd and Adam Melhuse. Jamie Arnold and Trever Miller were each in two games, and Einar Diaz, Koyie Hill, Robert Ellis and Brian Johnson each played three games.

Can you believe Lance Carter only pitched in 10 games for Los Angeles? Didn't it seem like a lot more?

Take a trip down Recent Memory Lane by clicking above to look at the entire list. Who's your choice for Most Obscure but Memorable Dodger from the 2000s? Jose Flores? Masao Kida? Mike Rose? Dare I say … Buddy Carlyle?

Comments (251)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-01-10 11:03:27
1.   Bob Timmermann
Jason Schmidt has pitched the same number of games as Brian Falkenborg.
2008-01-10 11:06:29
2.   ToyCannon
Derek Thompson, he gave us a huge lift and then his career was done.
Norihiro Nakamura gets a special mention for being memorable but he wasn't obsure. Isn't he the reason why we had little faith that Saito would be even worth talking about. Just another old Japanese player past his prime.
2008-01-10 11:08:24
3.   Jon Weisman
1 - But Schmidt has more homers.
2008-01-10 11:08:31
4.   Xeifrank
2. Not sure about that, but what I remember Nakamura for his his knack for hitting line drives into the first base dugout. If the first base dugout territory was in fair play, he would've been a keeper. :)
vr, Xei
2008-01-10 11:08:53
5.   Humma Kavula
When somebody rewrites/updates Dave Frishberg's "Dodger Blue," I propose that the part that goes "and Juan Marichal was a Dodger, too / Even he wore Dodger Blue" should become a Greg Maddux reference.
2008-01-10 11:12:40
6.   GoBears
Can you believe Lance Carter only pitched in 10 games for Los Angeles? Didn't it seem like a lot more?

Boy, you're right about that. I wonder how often he got up in the pen, leading the likes of us to howl and moan, and we forgot that he didn't actually come in very often.

2008-01-10 11:14:44
7.   Humma Kavula
Would Bob vote for #150 on this list?

Does 132 Games Played automatically disqualify one from the designation as "obscure?"

Because the name "Hiram Bocachica" is sure memorable.

2008-01-10 11:18:17
8.   wireroom
Kevin Beirne for me. I have no recollection of that guy playing. Maybe I was on vacation?
2008-01-10 11:20:07
9.   Humma Kavula
Ya know, not to be the voice of depression, but looking at the ten players that got into the most games for the Dodgers in the 2000s likely tells you all you need to know about the Dodgers in the 2000s (so far).

1. Shawn Green
2. Adrian Beltre
3. Alex Cora
4. Cesar Izturis
5. Paul Lo Duca
6. Mark Grudzielanek
7. Eric Karros
8. Jeff Kent
9. Olmedo Saenz
10. Dave Roberts

2008-01-10 11:22:32
10.   Jon Weisman
7 - Hiram might not be obscure enough, but you could make a case for him.

I have to say, as time passes, Eric Stults might end up being the winner. And frankly, you might be able to make a case for Edwin Jackson someday if his career doesn't pan out. His major-league debut will always stick with me.

Funny that Tom Goodwin and Juan Pierre are back-to-back on the list. And then comes Hee Seop Choi.

2008-01-10 11:22:58
11.   bigcpa
I think we can all thank Carter, Baez, Hendrickson and Lugo for giving Ned some necessary on-the-job training. I'm still a bit floored that he signed arguably the best FA hitter and pitcher this offseason and made no future-damaging trades.
2008-01-10 11:23:31
12.   Eric Enders
Definitely Dennis Springer.
1) Gotta love a knuckleballer.
2) He pitched in only five games, yet managed to give up a historic home run.
3) His roots in the Dodger organization date back to 1987.
2008-01-10 11:24:06
13.   fanerman
Derek Thompson only played in 4 games? He was a good player. At least for those 4 games.
2008-01-10 11:24:22
14.   Eric Enders
By the way, color me surprised to find that Ethier has played more games than Martin, since they were called up from Vegas within a few days of each other.
2008-01-10 11:24:47
15.   CanuckDodger
Joe Sheehan is chatting at BP, and he says that he expects Pierre to be the Dodgers 2008 LF and that Kemp and Ethier will platoon. I am really quite curious to know how many DT people believe that is going to happen. Think of this like a poll, if you will.

Oh, and after explaining why he thinks giving up a whole lot of pre-free agency talent for Santana may be a bad idea, Sheehan says he expects one of the L.A. teams to trade for Santana. Like I suggested in a comment yesterday, it seems like if Sheehan can conceive of a bad move for the Dodgers to make, he just assumes the Dodgers are going to go ahead and do it.

2008-01-10 11:26:47
16.   wireroom
I have this view of Bubba Crosby as a lifelong Yankee for some reason. Everytime a Yankee game was on TV and I was watching, that guy would be in the game.
2008-01-10 11:28:03
17.   oklahomadodger
Does Pierre hold the Dodger record in the 2000's for consecutive games played?

I found it interesting that Loney and Kemp had played more games than Gonzo, I know he just got here last year but it seems like he's been here forever.

2008-01-10 11:29:36
18.   CanuckDodger
14 -- Catchers don't pinch hit on their off-days, while Ethier always seems to get into games he doesn't start -- whether it is to pinch hit, or he comes in as a defensive replacement.
2008-01-10 11:32:17
19.   Eric Enders
2 "Norihiro Nakamura gets a special mention for being memorable but he wasn't obsure. Isn't he the reason why we had little faith that Saito would be even worth talking about."

Yes. In the first-ever mention of Saito on Dodger Thoughts, Jon wrote: "This year's Norihiro Nakamura, pitching side. A 36-year-old (on Valentine's Day) pitcher with a 3.82 ERA in Japan last season doesn't excite."

2008-01-10 11:33:56
20.   Humma Kavula
I am really quite curious to know how many DT people believe that is going to happen.

This is all conjecture. Just one guess for your poll.

I think the Opening Day outfield will be Pierre, Jones, Kemp. The plan will be leaked: Pierre will be sharing time with Ethier. The way this will work is that Pierre and Ethier will start about the same number of games. Pierre will finish most games that he starts and will also come in to finish Ethier's games, to keep his streak alive.

That will be the MO for about a month, I'm guessing. Around the first of May, if Kemp or Ethier slumps, Pierre's playing time will increase. I won't make a prediction beyond that.

I'm a huge Kemp fan, but none of us knows what his walk rate will mean for his long-term success. A month-long slump in April could happen, and if it does, I think we'll see some Pierre-Jones-Ethier outfields.

2008-01-10 11:44:59
21.   ToyCannon
15
Sounds like a good poll. Mind if I use it?
2008-01-10 11:48:07
22.   CanuckDodger
21 -- Of course I don't mind. I'm kind of surprised we haven't been talking more about this lately, at a time when there is not really any Dodger news to talk about. Possibly the topic is just too depressing.
2008-01-10 11:52:36
23.   fanerman
15 I have a little more faith in Colletti than I had before the off-season. I hold out hope (perhaps foolishly) that the strong majority of the outfield time will be given to Ethier/Jones/Kemp.
2008-01-10 11:54:02
24.   bigcpa
I find it hard to believe that Torre will use Pierre as a defensive replacement simply to maintain his GP streak. Imagine a catcher scoring from 2nd on him to tie or win a game. Plus how impressive will 1,000 straight games be for a part-time player? If Ethier & Pierre are both on the roster March 30 I predict the streak ends in April (and no one cares other than OBP Juan's agent and his mom).
2008-01-10 11:54:09
25.   JL25and3
Lance Carter makes the Medieval Weapons Maintenance Team, along with Lance Painter.
2008-01-10 11:56:20
26.   ToyCannon
Probably because it is just conjecture until we see how it unfolds. With a new manager everything is just a wild guess as to how he will operate. No one doubts that the
Kemp/Jones/Ethier outfield is the best configuration. The question is does Juan Pierre's contract trump Ethier or Kemp's skill. I think Torre and Ned need to win so they will put the best lineup out there.

It would not surprise me to find out that Pierre's agent has quietly already asked to be traded. Pierre is no idiot he knows that Jones is in CF and he knows the talent that Kemp and Ethier have.

If Ned does trade Ethier for relief help then it will validate the opinion that Joe Sheehan and Christina Karl have for Ned. That would be depressing.

2008-01-10 12:00:15
27.   Eric Enders
"chris (chicago): Rank these third baseman long term: Zimmerman, Alex Gordon, Ryan Braun, Andy LaRoche, and Evan Longoria.

Joe Sheehan: Zimmerman (man, he's about to have a year), Longoria, Braun, LaRoche, Gordon.

I might flip the last two because I'm not sure the Dodgers won't screw up with LaRoche. There are a ton of good young third baseman, huh?"

2008-01-10 12:00:15
28.   Eric Enders
"chris (chicago): Rank these third baseman long term: Zimmerman, Alex Gordon, Ryan Braun, Andy LaRoche, and Evan Longoria.

Joe Sheehan: Zimmerman (man, he's about to have a year), Longoria, Braun, LaRoche, Gordon.

I might flip the last two because I'm not sure the Dodgers won't screw up with LaRoche. There are a ton of good young third baseman, huh?"

2008-01-10 12:01:21
29.   Sagehen
Koyie Hill ... I remember when he was to be the "catcher of the future" after LoDuca. It seemed so short sighted to trade him and LoDuca at the same time. Why trade our needed young catcher for a one year rental? That Steve Finley trades looks pretty good now.
2008-01-10 12:01:34
30.   Sagehen
Koyie Hill ... I remember when he was to be the "catcher of the future" after LoDuca. It seemed so short sighted to trade him and LoDuca at the same time. Why trade our needed young catcher for a one year rental? That Steve Finley trades looks pretty good now.
2008-01-10 12:02:24
31.   Eric Enders
Man, I hate that moment, the split-second when your mouse-clicking finger has a little involuntary spasm and you know you're about to make a double post, but it's too late to stop and there's nothing you can do about it except sit and watch it happen.
2008-01-10 12:03:52
32.   TheBigGrabowski
He's already been mentioned, but I liked Derek Thompson a lot. If I remember he pitched really well, but never ended up getting a big league win. I think the bullpen lost at least one game for him.
2008-01-10 12:05:58
33.   cargill06
26- look what happened in september of '07 in colorado. the dodgers had a must win double header and the veterens showed up to the park and LaRoche's name was on the line-up card that supposedly was the root of a lot of the clubhouse tension. The vet's believe they need to be in the line-up to present the best oppurtunity to win, and Torre knows that. Torre was signed here mostly to manage ego's and unfortunately to manage those ego's I believe Pierre would get a lot more starts than he deserves.
2008-01-10 12:06:23
34.   Eric Enders
Derek Thompson is not obscure. A player cannot be obscure if you clearly remember not only him, but also his girlfriend.
2008-01-10 12:10:08
35.   CanuckDodger
26 -- I too think a trade request has been made by Pierre or his agent. Pierre is no doubt hoping to be an MLB regular beyond the length of his Dodger contract. If Pierre is the Dodgers' everyday LF for the next four years, he is going to look historically bad compared to his peers, other LF's, and it isn't like he looked really good when his peers were CF's.
2008-01-10 12:14:01
36.   Indiana Jon
34 He must be obscure to me then. Who was the girlfriend?
2008-01-10 12:15:20
37.   Jon Weisman
34 - He may not be obscure, but he will be. And obscure doesn't mean completely forgotten. It's not as if I can't remember The Other Mike Ramsey.
2008-01-10 12:16:11
38.   Indiana Jon
Diamond Leung has the famed Beimel and the little Ishii's video up on his site today. Must be slow times for Dodger fans.
2008-01-10 12:16:21
39.   Disabled List
20 The plan will be leaked: Pierre will be sharing time with Ethier. The way this will work is that Pierre and Ethier will start about the same number of games. Pierre will finish most games that he starts and will also come in to finish Ethier's games, to keep his streak alive.

I absolutely hate this playing streak of Pierre's. It's turned into a sacred cow that can't be infringed upon, even though it's hurting the team. I would never wish for an injury on a player, but a mild turned ankle for Pierre, just enough to keep him off of it for a day or two, would do wonders for the Dodgers. A stomach virus or a good hangover would do the same thing.

2008-01-10 12:18:05
40.   Indiana Jon
38 I take that back. Seems to be the same guy, but without the little ones.
2008-01-10 12:19:38
41.   Dodgers49
15 Sadly, my feeling is that if Juan Pierre is still on the team on opening day he will play every day. And we will likely see a Kemp/Ethier platoon in right field.

But I really have high hopes (or maybe it's just a dream) that Juan will be traded by then.

2008-01-10 12:20:33
42.   ToyCannon
39
Yes, Little should have benched Pierre in May for one game and been done with the foolishness.
2008-01-10 12:21:11
43.   East Coast Dodger
Does anyone else think that the difference between Pierre and Ethier will be smaller than the difference between Nomar and LaRoche? Especially considering the defensive impact of third base vs. left field. Third base is where we should channel our energy toward making Ned and Joe see the light.

Not that I actually want Pierre to play. I'm just sayin' there may be a bigger fish to fry.

Note that I'm not taking into account other options at either position, like Young in the outfield and Abreu at third.

2008-01-10 12:21:19
44.   still bevens
Derek Thompson also made the roster in MLB 2006 for the PS2, I believe.
2008-01-10 12:23:01
45.   cargill06
ned... octavio dotel, go get him
2008-01-10 12:23:45
46.   cargill06
45. oops he signed already
2008-01-10 12:24:39
47.   cargill06
46. wait no he didn't... ha what a mess i am
2008-01-10 12:25:12
48.   fanerman
39 Pierre's streak is the best shot we have of him leaving the Dodgers early. If the streak wasn't around, he may not have a problem with being a 3.5th outfielder. But it seems like he does. So hopefully a trade will happen.

Yeah, it's shooting the moon. But it seems logical to think that Pierre wants to keep his streak going and clearly he's going to have to share time if he stays here.

2008-01-10 12:26:42
49.   Kevin Lewis
Couldn't we solve all of this by having Pierre and Repko shagging fly balls near each other. That is an injury waiting to happen
2008-01-10 12:29:07
50.   Johnny Nucleo
Derek Thompson and Cody Ross for me. Cody Ross is a little less obscure because he's gone on to be an everyday player, but I'll always remember how he had that big power outburst (2 HR, 7RBI) and was then DFA'd.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-01-10 12:30:29
51.   ToyCannon
43
Not I, but I'm the last person standing who thinks Nomar has anything left.
2008-01-10 12:33:07
52.   cargill06
too bad boras isn't Pierre's agent so he could get him to opt out for more money... but seriously i wonder if pierre does have an opt out clause
2008-01-10 12:33:45
53.   fanerman
43 In terms of playing time, Nomar gets injured a lot so there's always a possibility for playing time. LaRoche has a higher ceiling than Ethier so I think there's an assumption that he'll overtake Nomar eventually anyway. Pierre doesn't get injured and wants to play EVERY day.

51 I think Nomar can slug .400 and OPS .750. Maybe. Does that count as believing he has something left?

2008-01-10 12:37:25
54.   TheBigGrabowski
How bad was Nomar defensively at third base?
2008-01-10 12:39:53
55.   Humma Kavula
24 I hope you're right. I will believe it when I see it.
2008-01-10 12:41:13
56.   Dave G
Brian Falkenborg was mentioned, but I think he's memorable just because of his name. Norihiro Nakamura too, if only for the memorable bon mot, "We Don't Need a Norihiro," one of the more inspired DT headlines I remember.

But the one that jumps out at me, a la Lance Carter, is Mike Venafro. Only 17 games in 2004? I couldn't believe it was that few. I remember him making some big outs against Helton and Bonds that year as we won the division--seems like he had a lot more appearances than that.

2008-01-10 12:43:48
57.   Ken Noe
Check out McKay Christensen after he came over from the White Sox in 2001: 28 games, .327/.400/.429/.829. I knew their was a reason I liked the guy.
2008-01-10 12:43:54
58.   East Coast Dodger
53 Okay, but disregard injuries and assume each would play 162 at each position. Does the difference between the expected performance of Pierre and Ethier more affect how many games the Dodgers win than the difference between the expected performance of Nomar compared to LaRoche?
2008-01-10 12:47:13
59.   cargill06
i'm most excited about how much better our line-up is going to be with martin in the #2 hole. speed, pop, makes contact, and has a good ability to go the other way. He is the ideal #2 hitter in my opinion
2008-01-10 12:48:08
60.   cargill06
59. oh ya and walks a lot
2008-01-10 12:52:33
61.   Eric Stephen
Barring injuries, I believe Kemp will have the most PAs among Kemp, Ethier & Pierre, and that if there is any type of platoon it will be in LF between Pierre and Ethier.

Also, even though Pierre has a string of five straight 162-game seasons, his consecutive games played streak only stands at 434, because he only appeared as a pinch runner (a streak no-no) on 6/3/05.

2008-01-10 12:56:01
62.   ImprobableImpossible
You think that when Maddux goes to Cooperstown in six or seven years it will be difficult to remember his brief stint in blue?

I can't remember off the top of my head one play Rickey Henderson made as a Dodger.

2008-01-10 12:59:16
63.   Ken Noe
Do we know enough about Torre with the Yankees to make a tentative judgment about the outfield? I seem to remember some NY visitors around the time of the hiring suggesting that he liked set lineups, and that a job lost was a hard one to get back. Was there a JP-like player in his Yankee past?
2008-01-10 13:03:55
64.   Eric Stephen
62
I'll remember Maddux for 4 reasons:

1) The 68-pitch, 8 IP, 1-0 ESPN Sunday night game vs. Schmidt (Russell Martin walk off in the 10th!)
2) The welcome aboard 6-inning no-hitter in Cincinnati (I was at Oggi's in Carmel Mountain Ranch and I kept checking my phone for updates since they inexplicably didn't have the game on TV)
3) He helped rid us of Izturis
4) He started the playoff game I attended that year

2008-01-10 13:06:04
65.   still bevens
63 Thats not 100% true. See: Damnon, Johnny.
2008-01-10 13:06:21
66.   Humma Kavula
This is reading tea leaves, but...

In 2005, Tony Womack played in 108 games, 351 plate appearances, for the Yankees.

On the other hand, he gave Melky Cabrera a job when it is likely that he could have gotten off clean by running more famous names out there.

2008-01-10 13:06:49
67.   still bevens
Little typo there. Guess I have a penchant for typing borderline rule 1 violations.
2008-01-10 13:07:16
68.   Eric Stephen
63
Womack and Knoblauch spring to mind as out of place LFers.
2008-01-10 13:08:24
69.   cargill06
63- don't remember what happened with kenny lofton in NYY, I think they signed him to a deal and he never started and he thought he was going to be the starter
2008-01-10 13:10:36
70.   ToyCannon
He didn't play Kenny Lofton as much as Kenny would have liked.
He played Womack much to much.

62
Maddux was money every game I went to until the playoffs. Nothing like a Maddux game, fast and furious.

2008-01-10 13:10:47
71.   Ken Noe
63 I went back to read Jon's post at the time of the hiring. Given today's discussion, it's worth reviewing. Most of the Yankee observers he spoke with in essence pointed to JP as a starter: he likes vets and he likes speed. Jay Jaffe did provide some hope in that he'll sit a vet who isn't producing. But overall, unless NedCo moves JP in the off-season, he probably starts until summer. My best is that he's moved at the deadline.
2008-01-10 13:10:58
72.   Humma Kavula
65 In fairness to Torre, what's he supposed to do with Damon? Dude is in the second year of a four-year deal and makes even more than Pierre does. And Torre still gave Melky more AB than he gave to Damon (slightly).
2008-01-10 13:11:15
73.   ToyCannon
See what happens when you don't refresh during the lunch hour.
2008-01-10 13:12:40
74.   Ken Noe
67 I can't spell today to save my life. I think I have Seasonal Spelling Disorder. Or I'm still shaking from starting class again yesterday.
2008-01-10 13:16:19
75.   D4P
I can't spell today to save my life

t-o-d-a-y is the correct spelling.

You live.

2008-01-10 13:17:01
76.   Eric Stephen
I have no recollection of one of Mike Venafro's 17 appearances for the 2004 NL West Champions. A true LOOGY, he logged a total of 9 IP in those 17 appearances, and only faced one batter (say it with me in slo-mo, Principal Rooney) NINE TIMES.
2008-01-10 13:17:21
77.   fanerman
58 The chances of Nomar playing 162 games next season is lower than the chances of the Dodgers trading Pierre. I don't see how you could compare the Nomar-LaRoche/Pierre-Ethier problems without taking into account that Pierre is an iron man and Nomar is nearly the opposite.

I think the question of which is the bigger disparity depends on whether Nomar has something left. I guess I'm with TC in that I think he can still has something left.

The uncertainty of the Nomar-LaRoche situation (their performance and health) gives me more hope for LaRoche. Nomar can get injured. LaRoche will hit eventually. I have faith in Torre that he'll see that LaRoche is the better player and play him. LaRoche isn't exactly a Cal Ripken either. So maybe it's not a bad idea to have another 3B.

Pierre-Ethier is the bigger problem because everybody knows what Pierre is going to do next season if he plays. And everybody has a pretty good idea of what Ethier can do, too. And yet, people are talking about Pierre playing 162 games in LF.

2008-01-10 13:18:26
78.   fanerman
77 Okay maybe people aren't talking about Pierre playing 162 games in LF. But talking about Pierre playing 1 game in LF is already completely insane.
2008-01-10 13:19:16
79.   Ken Noe
75 You know, most dissertation defenses are open to the university community.
2008-01-10 13:20:07
80.   LogikReader
Speaking of "consecutive streaks," I'd like to know how many consecutive posts we have made in the offseason with at least a mention of Juan Pierre. It has to be at least 3.
2008-01-10 13:20:54
81.   LogikReader
I believe I mean comments in posts
2008-01-10 13:22:27
82.   cargill06
let's just say pierre does play 162 games in LF and bats 8th, yes his numbers are godawful for a LF but .280-.300, 80-90 runs and 40-55 sb for a #8 are pretty good. although, i'd love to see 'dre every day in LF. pierre is well above average of any #8 hitter... now paying $45 million for a #8 hitter that's another topic another day
2008-01-10 13:26:02
83.   Eric Stephen
82
National League #8 hitters collectively hit .255/.325/.379 in 2007, a higher OPS than JP (.684).

But, even if Pierre was an above average #8 hitter, Ethier would be way more above-averager, so to speak. :)

2008-01-10 13:26:04
84.   cargill06
82. ps like i said before if pierre hits 8 he will get pitched around more and get a few IBB, his OBP won't look as ugly
2008-01-10 13:27:08
85.   ToyCannon
At some point it has been the topic every day.
2008-01-10 13:27:56
86.   D4P
You know, most dissertation defenses are open to the university community

My favorite DT posters:

1. Ken Noe
2. Daniel Zappala/GoBears
4. oswald

2008-01-10 13:29:36
87.   cargill06
83. could you tell me where i can look at on baseball-reference.com to look at stats for the average #1,#2 hitter for example
2008-01-10 13:31:45
88.   Eric Stephen
87
http://tinyurl.com/2ul464

You can also click on the main page, on "batting splits" (just above the standings for each league).

2008-01-10 13:37:07
89.   ToyCannon
I think Bob Timmerman should do a seminar at the library where he teaches us how to get the most out of baseball-reference.
I still haven't figured out how to get a selection of players between 35-39 who meet a certain criteria. You can sort by age but I haven't seen where you can select by age.
I did learn when selecting by height to use inches.
2008-01-10 13:38:00
90.   cargill06
83. thanks, and looking at that it would be fair to say if Pierre is batting 8th, his OBP would jump at least .020 points, that would get him to a .351 obp that looks a lot better than .331
2008-01-10 13:38:20
91.   natepurcell
When on the team ZIPS at BTF, what does the av,fr,vg under the defensive spectrum for each player mean?
2008-01-10 13:40:18
92.   East Coast Dodger
83 The numbers help my perspective - thanks. So if Pierre OPSs .685 and Ethier would've OPSed, say, .800, how many wins does that difference translate to for the Dodgers? I think, considering defense, that an equal margin (or maybe even a smaller margin) at 3rd base makes a bigger difference in team wins.

Perhaps what I am really saying is that I'm more scared of what Nomar will do than I am of what Pierre will do. First-half Nomar last year was pretty much the worst regular in the majors.

I am comforted by the fact that it is pretty clear that Nomar would be benched quickly, while I am not at all confident that Pierre would be.

2008-01-10 13:42:49
93.   Dodgers49
69 63- don't remember what happened with kenny lofton in NYY, I think they signed him to a deal and he never started and he thought he was going to be the starter

As I remember it the Yankees signed Lofton to be their leadoff man. But Kenny didn't have a good spring training and when the season started Torre dropped him to the bottom of the lineup. Kenny, being a veteran player, was shocked that Torre would use spring training stats to make that decision. Their relationship went downhill from there.

2008-01-10 13:43:16
94.   ToyCannon
Wilkin Ruan - you can never have enough of those guys. You miss him so much you keep bringing him back.
2008-01-10 13:44:41
95.   Eric Stephen
89
TC, in the Play Index section, on the left side of the page you can select age ranges via dropdown boxes (it's on the bottom, just above "reset form")
2008-01-10 13:48:14
96.   cargill06
93- so there you go if Torre doesn't like what he sees from JP there could be a very similar situation with what happened with Lofton in NYY
2008-01-10 13:55:38
97.   Dodgers49
96 But then what if Juan has a great spring?
2008-01-10 13:57:37
98.   cargill06
than may god have mercy on our soul
2008-01-10 13:59:38
99.   Eric Stephen
93 ,96
Didn't injuries have a lot to do with Lofton's playing time too? Just looking at his game log, it looks like he was on the DL twice in 2004. He did only start 70 games, so perhaps he had lingering issues most of the year. Incidentally, 41 starts were batting leadoff (29 batting 9th).
2008-01-10 14:05:42
100.   Eric Stephen
According to the Baseball Cube, Lofton hit .170/.212/.319 in spring training 2004 for NY.

He also hit .159/.196/.182 for the 2006 Dodgers, but turned out to be OK for that team.

Juan Pierre hit .393/.397/.464 in the 2007 spring.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-01-10 14:06:34
101.   GMac In The 909
98 I'm in the camp that believes we all do not share one soul.
2008-01-10 14:07:55
102.   Dodgers49
99 Didn't injuries have a lot to do with Lofton's playing time too?

That may well be true also. But the thing I remember most is that Kenny was really upset with Torre over losing his leadoff spot at the end of spring training. So much so that when Sheffield sounded off about Torre he only got one additional vote that I'm aware of. Guess who?

2008-01-10 14:12:37
103.   ToyCannon
95
Gracias

Nomar has had 4 strange 1/2's.
2006 - 1st half - best hitter on the team
2006 - 2nd half - lousy hitter, injured but had two key home runs in Sept
2007 - 1st half - worse hitter on the team and just about in baseball on the road. At home he had BA but still little power
2007 - 2nd half - his power comes back and he nudges himself back into 800 OPS territory but then is injured again. He still doesn't come close to his 2006 1st half level

If healthy I think he is the 3rd baseman but I also think he really will have to produce to keep his job. Given how poorly he performed for much of the year his leash will probably be short and given how injury prone he is, it will just be a matter of time before LaRoche gets the shot. Hopefully this time LaRoche will have taken care of his back when his time comes.

2008-01-10 14:13:20
104.   Eric Stephen
More Lofton/Torre stuff here:

http://tinyurl.com/2tqt85

>>Lofton said he knew early with the Yankees that things weren't going to go well. He said he was told during New York's season-opening trip to Japan that he wasn't ready to hit leadoff.

"I've never heard that before in my life," he said. "You get in and out of games in Spring Training, you have guys who hit .500, then .200 during the season. It was tough to hear that, it shocked me. It was my 14th year.<<

2008-01-10 14:14:13
105.   bhsportsguy
103 Check your email.
2008-01-10 14:14:39
106.   El Lay Dave
Could the most obscure but memorable end up being K/Guo? Hong-Chi's 45 appearances put in him Kelly Wunsch-land (or Terry Mulholland), and he's still under 100 innings, but, oh the bat flip!

How about Kevin Elster? Only 259 PAs, but he does know how to christen a ballpark.

2008-01-10 14:16:39
107.   Eric Stephen
Even more Lofton/Pierre connections here:

http://tinyurl.com/2mazb4

"After watching speedy Juan Pierre spark the Florida Marlins to a World Series victory over the Yankees, New York owner George Steinbrenner signed Lofton to a $6.2 million, two-year contract..."

The circle of life, my friends.

2008-01-10 14:19:34
108.   Dodgers49
104 It was tough to hear that, it shocked me. It was my 14th year.

Yep, it was his comment about how shocked he was that stuck with me.

2008-01-10 14:20:11
109.   stopthebeachballs
I'm not sure why, but I love Jon's idea of "Obscure but Memorable." There seems to be no reasonable way to arrive at an answer, since it seems to be based on which game you attended six years ago, or whose name you enjoy most (the latter being my preferred criteria). Falkenborg, Koyie Hill, and Nakamura are my favorites, but the other name that stood out to me was Tyler Houston. I know, probably not obscure enough, but 21 SO in his 65 AB (vs. 2 BB)! I didn't remember him struggling that much. Anyway, the Long Beach native gets my vote.
2008-01-10 14:20:22
110.   MollyKnight
35 days until pitchers and catchers report...
2008-01-10 14:21:59
111.   Eric Stephen
108
Yeah, if Torre has the stones to shock someone in their 14th year, it will be no problem dealing with someone in their 8th/9th! :)
2008-01-10 14:23:02
112.   Eric Enders
In possibly the only offseason signing to involve three different hooved mammals, Alex Cabrera (which means goatherd in Spanish) has signed a deal with the Orix Buffaloes.
2008-01-10 14:23:25
113.   ToyCannon
I'm always dismayed when a decision is made based on spring training if health isn't involved.
2008-01-10 14:23:31
114.   El Lay Dave
9 The most pitching appearances, by far, is Gagne. The second-most, by a greater margin, is Giovanni Carrara.

The top-10 pitchers in games started:
1 Odalis Perez 120
2 Derek Lowe 101
3 Brad Penny 98
4 Kevin Brown 94
5 Kazuhisa Ishii 86
6 Hideo Nomo 85
7 Chan Ho Park 69
8 Jeff Weaver 68
9 Darren Dreifort 58
10 Andy Ashby 44

2008-01-10 14:24:18
115.   paranoidandroid
110 A beautiful post! You deserve a beer on me for that one. I have reason to get excited! I can do one more month, but not much longer. 35 days is very doable.

For those of you who are season ticket holders, I just got off the phone with the ticket department and if you pay your invoice by Jan 11th, you can go to the stadium Jan 26/27 to see what seats are available for an upgrade.

2008-01-10 14:24:54
116.   ToyCannon
That is how you get a Scott Erickson in your opening day rotation or a Rudy Law as your starting CF or a Mariono Duncan as your starting 2nd baseman.
2008-01-10 14:27:08
117.   Eric Enders
Will there ever be a contest for Obscure But Memorable Dodger Thoughts Poster?
2008-01-10 14:29:22
118.   ToyCannon
114
Check out Carrara's ERA+ as a Dodger compared to everywhere else. Unbelievable.
2008-01-10 14:30:19
119.   paranoidandroid
113 On the other hand, when a guy like Loney hits almost .500 and you send him to AAA, you have to wonder what it will take to get a shot.

He is much different from just a hot spring hitter in that he proved himself ready in a call-up situation in 2006 and had led the Pacific Coast League in hitting to boot.

I guess hot springs won't sway Ned.

Did Billy Ashley ever hit in the spring?

2008-01-10 14:31:31
120.   kinbote
When I looked at that list, my first thought was: Jim Tracy sure loved Alex Cora, didn't he? It's really one of the great love stories of our time or of any time.
2008-01-10 14:35:37
121.   El Lay Dave
118 Yeah, I'd noticed that before. Sample size is only 64 non-Dodgers appearances vs. 249 but still.
2008-01-10 14:36:42
122.   paranoidandroid
120 Cora was a great glove and would have lost shortstop and any hope of starting in the majors to Izzy but second base opened up when we sent Karros and Grud to the Cubs for that "juicy" power-sitting catcher.

Yes, power-sitting. In a hot tub. In a mansion.

2008-01-10 14:37:46
123.   El Lay Dave
71 It should be noted that the Yankee observers were commenting immediately after Torre's hiring, which was, of course, well before there was a new starting CF in town.
2008-01-10 14:38:20
124.   Eric Enders
122 Or, even, better, in a moving Hummer while buzzed on prescription meds.
2008-01-10 14:41:30
125.   dzzrtRatt
My "Obscure but Memorable Dodger" for the 2000s is none other than Orel Hershiser, who pitched in a few games in 2000 according to the list. I have no recollection of that at all. Looking at the stats, I can see why. 1-5, 13.24 ERA, 2.27 WHIP.

If you want true obscurity, then I'd give the award to Ron Coomer.

With all these guys, it's hard to keep in mind that if we had played any of them in high school, we'd probably have been in awe of them. Even Mike Judd pitched in one major league game, which puts him in an exclusive club.

2008-01-10 14:42:10
126.   cargill06
120. what about Olmedo and the post game mean?
2008-01-10 14:42:15
127.   Sushirabbit
117, Molokai? :-) Or Steve, >sniff<.
2008-01-10 14:42:36
128.   kinbote
Is it too late to vote for Onan Masaoka? I remember him coming out of nowhere [AA probably], having good stuff, and then disappearing.
2008-01-10 14:43:43
129.   paranoidandroid
I was happy to see Mike Rose hit his only home run in one of his only games. I don't think he played in the bigs anywhere else after that. I'll go check.
2008-01-10 14:44:52
130.   cargill06
126. replace mean with meal... it may make more sense that way
2008-01-10 14:45:52
131.   silverwidow
Diamond Leung has some new notes...

Rudy Seanez is waiting for an offer from the Dodgers, but it hasn't arrived yet.

Wilson Valdez will officially be gone in a couple of days.

Colletti will be playing in Nomar's charity soccer game. Nomar himself can't play due to his contract.

2008-01-10 14:46:20
132.   kinbote
125 Orel got booed walking off the mound after his last appearance as a Dodger. It was at Dodger Stadium and I remember being ashamed at how little our fans understood about the situation that was playing out in front of them.
2008-01-10 14:48:30
133.   Black and Blue
RIP Sir Edmund Hillary
2008-01-10 14:49:21
134.   paranoidandroid
Mike Rose seems to be in the Rockies system now. He got 9 at-bats with STL in 2006 and 2 at bats with Oakland in 2004.

He of course was on that very talented 2005 team that sometimes featured Jason Phillips at first base (hitting clean-up) and Jason Grabowski in left.

2008-01-10 14:50:39
135.   cargill06
someone talk to me about john lindsay, 30 HR last year in 454 AB's
2008-01-10 14:53:30
136.   silverwidow
135 He's a 30-year-old journeyman. Those stats mean nothing.
2008-01-10 14:54:15
137.   El Lay Dave
135 31 years old this month. Last season was his first appearance ever as high as AAA.
2008-01-10 14:54:48
138.   fanerman
Since no one has actually mentioned him explicitly, I think we all should take a moment to appreciate the contributions of Jason Grabowski. What other obscure but memorable Dodger has a Principle named after him?
2008-01-10 14:55:20
139.   cargill06
30 HR's are 30 HR's, maybe he found some of Lo Duca's "magic potion"
2008-01-10 14:56:05
140.   regfairfield
I vote Tom Wilson for his awesome batting stance and for not being any worse than Brent Mayne or David Ross.

84 I might as well make a macro out of this, but there is no evidence that hitting eighth gives you more unintentional walks.

This is what happens when Jon doesn't write NPUT.

2008-01-10 14:56:30
141.   paranoidandroid
I think Fred McGriff will be an obscure Dodger because he ended a storied career here. Those who knew him as the clutch hitter he was, will obscure his time with LA as it was so forgettable.
2008-01-10 14:57:21
142.   silverwidow
139 Tell that to Mitch Jones, who destroyed AAA, then completely flopped in Japan.
2008-01-10 14:59:20
143.   El Lay Dave
Since there was a brief foray into Steely Dan thoughts yesterday, happy 60th birthday to Donald Fagen today.
2008-01-10 14:59:21
144.   paranoidandroid
[135,136,137] Sounds like someone Billy Beane will get his hands on soon.

P.S. McGriff spent a few months sitting in the Tampa dug out in 2004 before retiring. We weren't his last stop, just his last payday.

2008-01-10 14:59:46
145.   fanerman
141 The Crime Dog still put up a 99 OPS+ in his year here. He also went on to play a little longer in Tampa Bay (in 2004).
2008-01-10 15:00:36
146.   paranoidandroid
140 Last Dodger catcher to homer in the post season? Tom Wilson.
2008-01-10 15:00:36
147.   Eric Enders
133 Oh man, that sucks. What a delightful human being he was.
2008-01-10 15:01:06
148.   Humma Kavula
142 I still would have liked to see Mitch Jones get a shot at the majors. I know it's 99.99% probable that he'd have stunk. But it would have been fun to root for him...

Have you met Mitch Jones
Someone said as we shook hands
He was just Mitch Jones to me....

2008-01-10 15:01:28
149.   ToyCannon
2005 might give us more obscure Dodgers 10 years from now then any previous season. Mike Edwards, Mynow, Grabowski, Rose, Philips...
The roster looks like an expansion team and I thought we were going to be contenders. Especially after that hot start.
2008-01-10 15:02:57
150.   paranoidandroid
145 That would be Crime Dog Poop for his LA year.

I actually wish he'd hit number 500 before he hung it up.

Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-01-10 15:03:03
151.   ToyCannon
139
Meet Phil Hiatt
2008-01-10 15:03:03
152.   fanerman
149 Whenever I think of Mike Edwards (which isn't often), I remember that Jim Tracy would often describe him as a "kid" even though he was like 28 or something in 2005.
2008-01-10 15:04:17
153.   Jon Weisman
Three more NRIs, per Tony Jackson: Matt Riley, Alfredo Simon and George Lombard.

http://www.insidesocal.com/dodgers/archives/2008/01/dodgers_invite.html

2008-01-10 15:04:52
154.   ToyCannon
It was cool that Depo gave all those career AAA players a shot in the majors and a chance for a pension.
2008-01-10 15:05:26
155.   Eric Enders
And Edwards then followed Jim Tracy to Pittsburgh. It took him like 11 months to go from being one of DePodesta's undervalued sabermetric players to Jim Tracy's personal valet.
2008-01-10 15:05:49
156.   fanerman
153 Wasn't George Lombard a perennial Braves prospect a long time ago?
2008-01-10 15:07:05
157.   paranoidandroid
149 Valentin hit two homers in the first week of the season. And finished with two homers. We got more out of Bill Mueller.

2005 became a joke. Injuries hurt us the most, but we weren't deep at all. DePo had some bad contracts to unload (Ishii, Green) and we simply couldn't fill the gaps with what was available.

But he did manage to bring back Odalis with a nice three year contract. Did he sign with anyone for 08 yet?

2008-01-10 15:07:07
158.   ToyCannon
Matt Riley once one of the hardest throwing LHP prospects in baseball. Now just a loogy and not a very good one. Scott Elbert, please do not become Matt Riley.
2008-01-10 15:07:22
159.   El Lay Dave
133 He and Tenzing Norgay were the first.

I wonder if Hillary and Norgay ever met Don Walsh and Jacques Piccard?

2008-01-10 15:08:36
160.   ToyCannon
156
Yup, he should provide what Choo Freeman gave us in 2007.
2008-01-10 15:09:28
161.   regfairfield
28 He's way underrating Alex Gordon. I'm expecting big things from the guy this year. He was the number one prospect for a reason.

139 This year's minor league home run leaders were Craig Brazell, someone named Davis, Val Pascussi and Rick Ankiel. Old guys that have no hope of having a useful career (yes I'm including Ankiel in that) can destroy the minors without being of any use in the bigs.

I do personally like the idea of calling those guys up in September and using them off the bench. They wouldn't play long enough for anyone to know how to pitch to them, and they might end up cranking a few home runs before they're done.

2008-01-10 15:14:24
162.   Eric Enders
161 In your paragraph 2 you say there's no possibility of those guys being useful in the bigs, and then in paragraph 3 you go on to describe how they could be useful in the bigs.

I see what you're saying, but painting all AAAA players with the same "he'll never hit in the majors" brush is kind of silly. There are too many counterexamples, from Jack Cust to Hank Sauer to Mike Easler to Ken Phelps to Olmedo Saenz to you name it.

2008-01-10 15:16:05
163.   regfairfield
162 I meant sustained success. Jack Cust gets an exemption for having absurd plate discipline and never actually getting the chance he deserved.
2008-01-10 15:19:04
164.   regfairfield
I'd also like to throw in votes for Venafro, McKay Christensen, and Wilkin Ruan.
2008-01-10 15:21:14
165.   Humma Kavula
He's probably too well-known, but could Jason Repko be the obscure-but-memorable Dodger?

As I recall, he hit .400 or something crazy in spring training, I think, '05... I recall arguing with JimBilly4 over the percentage chance that Repko would be a star.

129 games of 74 OPS+... Limited to 69 games in '06... injured all of last year... will he even be on the team this year?

2008-01-10 15:23:10
166.   regfairfield
165 He'll definately be on the team. We only have seven outfielders on the 40 man, someone will get hurt at some point.
2008-01-10 15:27:51
167.   fanerman
I never quite understood why McKay Christensen didn't get much of a shot. He came in and hit really well. Maybe it was BABIP-inflated (I have no idea), but he didn't play at all after his brief stint.
2008-01-10 15:33:44
168.   Black and Blue
159 Hillary and Walsh both attended the Explorers Club Centennial Dinner in 2004. http://tiny.cc/L0gAZ Would be interesting to know if Piccard was there. You'd obviously have to go back a few more years for Norgay to have met them.

Hillary was an extraordinary man in every sense. No doubt we in New Zealand lost our favourite son today.

I'm biased of course but I think "We knocked the bastard off" is the best sporting quote ever. (Hope that survives the rule 1 test.)

2008-01-10 15:39:00
169.   Brent is a Dodger Fan
I have a few ways of looking at this:

1) Players who are memorable for their whole careers, and in 2015, it'll be hard to believe they played on the Dodgers: Wells (7 games), Maddux (12 games), Alomar (21), Henderson (30), Mueller (32). Of course, with how fresh the 2007 and 2006 seasons are in our memories, we can recall the contributions Maddux and Wells made, even the controversy about Wells being given more rope than he should, perhaps. But I contend that by 2015, we won't be able to recall much that any of those players did in Blue.

2) Pitchers who were memorable because of their performances, who will seem obscure because they played relatively few games. Scott Erickson (19), Aaron Sele (28) & Jose Lima (38). Of course, Lima will always be remembered by me for his shutout of the Cards in the playoffs, but mostly, we'll remember these three because of what they represented (scraping the bottom of the barrel).

3) Joel Guzman. Played in 8 games for the Dodgers, he's memorable because he was such a highly touted prospect and was traded. He'll seem obscure in a few years if he never does anything in the bigs.

2008-01-10 15:40:44
170.   silverwidow
I just checked the 40-man roster and Wilson Valdez is nowhere to be seen.
2008-01-10 15:40:54
171.   Lexinthedena
Tom Wilson had a totally awesome batting stance!

Mike Kinkade is a good one...I remember being upset that he didn't get more playing time....

Gawd....Dodger baseball since 1988 is so depressing....The one mitigating factor is the sense of humor it has bred among die-hard Dodger fans...

P.S- Jason Phillips looked like MC Search...

2008-01-10 15:41:08
172.   regfairfield
169 I don't know about the last one, I still vividly remember all of our can't miss prospects who missed since I was about 10.
2008-01-10 15:42:13
173.   regfairfield
171 I love that Kinkade is tied for the Dodger single season hit by pitch record in only 150 at bats.
2008-01-10 15:45:15
174.   ToyCannon
Roberto Petagine, I'll be forever convinced that he would have had a productive career and was just born 10 years to soon.

Add Mr. Berrora to Mr Enders list.

Andrew I do think you painted much to broad a brush this time. To many players just needed an opportunity that they never got.

2008-01-10 15:45:53
175.   Eric Enders
I still vividly remember all the prospects who missed, too, so I don't think those guys will ever be obscure for me. I even remember the hot prospects who never even made it for a cup of coffee, like Adam Brown, Mike White, Dan Opperman, Erik Sonberg...
2008-01-10 15:46:54
176.   Jim Hitchcock
127 yeah, I miss Steve...but we all know the life of a starting lawyer is not his own.
2008-01-10 15:47:25
177.   regfairfield
174 You're probably right, I went overboard in the point I was trying to make. Some of those guys should be given a chance, but Lindsey and Brazell are not among them.
2008-01-10 15:48:43
178.   delias man
Grabowski bought me a Pacifico once. Will always be the top of my list.
2008-01-10 15:50:13
179.   El Lay Dave
168 Bertrand Piccard, who was there and was the first to circumnavigate the globe in a balloon, is the son of Jacques Piccard.

I was fortunate enough to meet Norgay once, though I was only eleven year old and therefore unable to form a meaningful question to ask him. I do remember being impressed to see, in the flesh, a living person that had accomplished a memorable and historic feat. This being only a couple years after watching Armstrong and Aldrin on the moon, human firsts were a big deal.

2008-01-10 15:50:55
180.   Humma Kavula
169 Poor Aaron Sele. Bottom of the barrel? What more could he have possibly given the Dodgers than 100 innings of league-average ball? He was even kind enough to separate that league-average ball into a bunch of good starts and a bunch of bad ones, if I recall correctly. He did his job and earned his money.

Look, I'm not really an Aaron Sele fan. But the rotation in 2006 was messed up. Who made the third-most starts? Billingsley, with 16. Fourth-most? Sele, with 15, and Tomko, with 15. Billingsley we know. But Sele, in 103.3 innings, had an ERA of 4.53 (ERA+ of 99). Tomko had an ERA of 4.73 (ERA+ of 95) in 112.3 innings.

Maybe we'd call Tomko the bottom of the barrel, too, but in 2006, one was on an $8million/2 contract and the other was an NRI (I think), but their performances were about the same. He did his job.

2008-01-10 15:52:08
181.   regfairfield
180 Yeah, Sele was pretty much a miracle. A half season of Sele and Maddux gave us another number one starter.
2008-01-10 15:53:26
182.   Eric Stephen
171 Jason Phillips looked like MC Search

And ironically, Phillips didn't very often get to 3rd base. Very nice call!

2008-01-10 15:55:48
183.   gentega
Trying to touch several different decades: Pat Perry; Dave Patterson; Andy Messersmith II(ie his second time around with the Dodgers, after losing the use of his pitching arm) and a guy who played in the World Series and then never got another shot: Jim Barbieri (1966 as I recall).
2008-01-10 15:55:52
184.   Eric Enders
Both Russell Martin and Chad Billingsley claimed to have learned a great deal from Sele in Las Vegas in early 2006, so to me that alone pretty much justifies his existence.
2008-01-10 15:57:40
185.   Humma Kavula
182 Humma Kavula's least favorite Dodgers of the past three years:

1. Julio Lugo
2. Juan Pierre
3. Jason Phillips

2008-01-10 15:58:50
186.   gpellamjr
Speaking of obscure Toms Wilson...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=iwY5o2fsG7Y

2008-01-10 16:06:27
187.   El Lay Dave
186 I met him once at a wedding reception some years ago. I asked him no questions.
2008-01-10 16:16:00
188.   Humma Kavula
Off topic: The rains last weekend have brought the ants into our kitchen. Anybody got a good exterminator?
2008-01-10 16:18:36
189.   Lexinthedena
182- He he he...
2008-01-10 16:22:12
190.   Jim Hitchcock
188 Raid.
2008-01-10 16:23:17
191.   Eric Enders
Maybe people already know this, but one of the other 3rd Bass members, Pete Nice, lives in Cooperstown where he is a baseball historian. He has a book out called "Baseball Legends of Brooklyn's Green-Wood Cemetery."
2008-01-10 16:25:02
192.   Humma Kavula
190 Tried that first.
2008-01-10 16:25:56
193.   Marty
Put a half cup of sugar in a saute pan and put it on the counter. When it's full of ants, transfer the pan to the stove and caramelize em.
2008-01-10 16:27:10
194.   Eric Enders
193 And serve chilled.
2008-01-10 16:27:20
195.   Xeifrank
188. Yeah Raid (#190), securing all your sugary items in sealable bags and spraying the outside of your house too worked well for me in the past. I would save your money on the exterminator for the really nasty bugs/rodents. vr, Xei
2008-01-10 16:30:34
196.   D4P
Taro Ant Killer. Non-toxic, and works like a charm.
2008-01-10 16:31:21
197.   Lucklesspedestrian
167
McKay Christensen came to Vero Beach in '02 competing for the CF job. He started out on a tear, 2 triples in one game I recall. But shortly after his torrid start, in a game I attended, he was picked off at first and later he missed a sign. From then on, Tracy didn't give him a shot, he was enamored with Dave Roberts. If I recall, Christensen did have a fine spring, but he was out of options and Mets picked him up. He never did make it back to the show for any length of time. Last I heard he was selling real estate in Utah and teaching ski lessons to Zappalla's kids in his spare time.
2008-01-10 16:33:02
198.   Lexinthedena
3rd Bass thoughts...love it...

"Ay yo I came from Cali where they hooped it they hooped it!"

2008-01-10 16:35:54
199.   Howard Fox
188 any spray with ammonia in it
2008-01-10 16:37:50
200.   Eric Stephen
191
To quote Johnny Carson, "I did not know that."

That's pretty cool, and obscure, even more so perhaps than Squiggy being such a baseball nut.

Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2008-01-10 16:38:54
201.   Jim Hitchcock
193 That Marty sure knows good eatin'.
2008-01-10 16:46:51
202.   El Lay Dave
193 Is there a wine to pair with that?
2008-01-10 16:53:53
203.   Humma Kavula
http://www.chefdepot.net/chocolateants.htm
2008-01-10 16:54:24
204.   Jason in Canada
My favorite most obscure Dodger is Tim Hudson.

Or at least he was for the two or so hours when that bay area newspaper had falsely reported him traded to us.
2008-01-10 16:58:09
205.   Gen3Blue
Is this accurate? Cody Ross only had 2 HR. I wou7ld have swore he had more in one game.
Oh well, I guess this is how legends grow!
2008-01-10 17:02:39
206.   Jacob L
I imagine its way too late to make any original submissions for Obscure Dodgers: 2000 Edition. That being the case I'll throw my support behind the following candidates:
1. Onan Masaoka - I was hoping that having another Hawaiian pitcher would right the wrong of Sid Fernandez
2. Norihiro - A DT favorite with a funky swing.
3. Mike Edwards - along with Jason Phillips, it wasn't his fault that Tracy kept playing him.
2008-01-10 17:03:21
207.   Jacob L
RIP Sir Edmund Hillary and Mayor Johnny Grant.

Death makes strange bedfellows.

2008-01-10 17:05:05
208.   Jason in Canada
188 Good Housekeeping would suggest wiping your surfaces with white vinegar.

I did that once and it seemed to work.

2008-01-10 17:12:45
209.   Jacob L
188 Make a solution of boric acid (a mild toxin with no danger to people or pets), sugar and water. Saturate some cotton balls and place them in your problem areas. With any luck, they'll carry it back to the nest and poison the queen. Boric acid can be found at most drug stores.
2008-01-10 17:12:54
210.   Daniel Zappala
188 I used Terro and it worked great.
2008-01-10 17:13:46
211.   Lexinthedena
A Minnesota news paper is reporting that the Mets are getting close to trading their farm for Santana...
2008-01-10 17:14:49
212.   Joe Pierre
When I read names like Green, Beltre, Kent, Furcal, Ethier, Martin, Garciaparra and their games played for the Dodgers in the past 8 years, I'm just reminded how fast the time is flying. Brian Falkenborg is the most obscured but memorable for me, but I must admit I once got him mixed up with Kyle Farnsworth of the Yankees. I once thought I remembered him pitching for the Dodgers, but it was Falkenborg who I was thinking of.
2008-01-10 17:15:16
213.   regfairfield
211 Does the farm include Fernando Martinez? If it doesn't, it's probably a great trade.
2008-01-10 17:16:22
214.   Lexinthedena
213- I think that is the sticking point...Twins want Martinez..Mets want to give up Gomes instead...
2008-01-10 17:21:52
215.   Dodgers49
61 Also, even though Pierre has a string of five straight 162-game seasons, his consecutive games played streak only stands at 434, because he only appeared as a pinch runner (a streak no-no) on 6/3/05.

Can someone explain the logic whereby a pinch hitter is considered to have been "in the game" but a pinch runner is not.

2008-01-10 17:22:08
216.   Yu-Hsing Chen
Not really obscurse because he did set a record simply by reaching the major I guess. and was a pretty famous prospect for awhile.. but...

Chin-Feng Chen.

more memorable than what he did on the field that's for sure. (at least in the US. he's destroying the league back home these days. best win share / OPS guy )

As for Tony Womack, actually the Yankees brought up Robinson Cano just a month into the season. but Womack still ended up getting some playing time the rest of the way because a. Cano struggled out of the gate and more importantly b. Bernie Williams was falling off a cliff and the 4th OF was ... Bubba Crosby ouch.

2008-01-10 17:24:13
217.   Lexinthedena
*Gomez
2008-01-10 17:25:10
218.   Jon Weisman
215 - I can't.
2008-01-10 17:28:47
219.   neuroboy002
216 Why was Chin-Feng Chen not given a chance to start? Could he not hit major league pitching? What was his liability?
2008-01-10 17:29:20
220.   Lexinthedena
For all of their spending, the Yanks always seem to have one really below average position on their roster...was LF for awhile...now it's 1B...
2008-01-10 17:32:55
221.   Lexinthedena
219- I know that by the time he was in the high minors, the organization had lost much of their earlier excitement about him...
2008-01-10 17:37:05
222.   Gen3Blue
There is something wrong with Cody Ross's statistics at Baseball Reference.
2008-01-10 17:39:33
223.   Eric Enders
215 A pinch hitter always affects the game in a material way, whereas a pinch runner may not. Also, if you're going to try to make a mockery of the game by having an injured player extend his streak with a token appearance, it's usually much easier for a hurt guy to pinch run than pinch hit. (Unless it's a leg injury.)

It's pretty dumb, though. Either you played or you didn't. It's stupid that there are two different sets of games played rules, one for streaks and one for everything else.

2008-01-10 17:40:32
224.   Eric Enders
222 There is something wrong with Juan Pierre's statistics too.

Or is that not what you meant? ;)

2008-01-10 17:40:49
225.   El Lay Dave
205 222 Are you perhaps confusing him with Dave Ross?
2008-01-10 17:44:35
226.   El Lay Dave
223 What if the PH is announced, then, after a pitching change, is himself pinch-hit for? Is that a material way? And does it count for the consecutive games-played streak? Seems less participatory than pinch-running.

Does Herb Washington have constant consecutive-games played streak of zero?

2008-01-10 17:49:03
227.   Ken Arneson
188 Alameda has ants everywhere, so I get ants a lot. Given that I have children in the house, I try to minimize the amount of chemicals I use to get rid of them. Here's my method, and it's pretty effective:

1. Vacuum up the ants that are already in the house.
2. Figure out what hole they are coming into the house from by where they reappear after vacuuming.
3. Spray a small amount of Raid into the hole.

They almost never come in the same hole again.

2008-01-10 17:53:01
228.   Dodgers49
223. 215 A pinch hitter always affects the game in a material way, whereas a pinch runner may not.

So a guy is announced as a pinch hitter. But, as he is standing in the batter's box awaiting the pitch a baserunner is picked off for the final out. How did he affect the game?

2008-01-10 17:57:03
229.   gpellamjr
226/228 The pinch-hitter doesn't count as having been in the game if he doesn't finish his PA, does he?
2008-01-10 18:06:43
230.   Eric Enders
Rule 10.23(c):
"A consecutive-game playing streak shall be extended if a player plays one half-inning on defense or if *the player
completes a time at bat by reaching base or being put out*. A pinch-running appearance only shall not extend the streak. If a player is ejected from a game by an umpire before such player can comply with the requirements of this Rule 10.23(c), such player's streak shall continue."
2008-01-10 18:06:56
231.   Dodgers49
223 it's usually much easier for a hurt guy to pinch run than pinch hit. (Unless it's a leg injury.)

Which reminds me, I remember some guy hobbling up to the plate in the '88 World Series. :-)

2008-01-10 18:07:13
232.   Eric Enders
Bolding doesn't work anymore?
2008-01-10 18:13:03
233.   Dodgers49
230 A pinch-running appearance only shall not extend the streak.

So what happened in Pierre's case? Was his manager at the time not aware of the rule?

2008-01-10 18:15:25
234.   El Lay Dave
232 It doesn't work when there is a "return" character between them. And thanks for the clarification. It is bizarre that one could PR and score a run, yet that is not a game played for a streak.

Maybe JP can just get ejected in the top of the first of every game.

2008-01-10 18:20:56
235.   Eric Enders
233 Pierre was put in as a pinch runner with one out in the top of the ninth in a tie game. But the batter lined into a double play, and Pierre came out of the game on a double switch so Jim Mecir could come in to pitch.
2008-01-10 18:21:27
236.   El Lay Dave
233 Judging solely from the boxscore, that was a strategic PR. JP pinch-ran for Mike Lowell, who had pinch-singled for Josh Beckett with one out in the top of the ninth in a tie game. The next guy DPed, so the pitcher's spot stay in the nine hole and Pierre was done.
2008-01-10 18:22:56
237.   El Lay Dave
31 seconds and I had a typo (stay vs. stayed) to boot. Bah.
2008-01-10 18:25:02
238.   Dodgers49
234 It is bizarre that one could PR and score a run, yet that is not a game played for a streak.

And after scoring the run he could take the field for the first two outs on defense and then have to leave the game with an injury and his streak is toast.

2008-01-10 18:32:06
239.   Eric Enders
1-1 tie, top of the ninth. With two outs, Bronc Burnett walks and Jack Keefe pinch runs for him. Keefe steals second, then third and then, with two strikes on the batter, steals home with the go-ahead run.

Keefe stays in to play center field in the bottom of the ninth. The first batter hits a ball that looks sure to be a home run, but Keefe makes a leaping catch at the wall to rob him of a homer. The next batter hits a sinking liner to center and Keefe makes a diving catch to rob him of a double. In doing so, however, he bruises a rib and has to come out of the game. The next batter is easily retired and Keefe's team wins the game, 2-1.

The good news: Keefe's team has won the game largely to his own heroics.
The bad news: Sorry, Jack, you didn't really play in this game. Your consecutive games streak is over.

2008-01-10 18:34:16
240.   Lexinthedena
What if the pinch-runner steals a base?
2008-01-10 18:43:15
241.   Dodgers49
239 1-1 tie, top of the ninth. With two outs, Bronc Burnett walks and Jack Keefe pinch runs for him. Keefe steals second, then third and then, with two strikes on the batter, steals home with the go-ahead run.

I love that scenario except for the part about there being two strikes on the batter. :-)

2008-01-10 18:44:23
242.   Lexinthedena
239- I'm dumb...
2008-01-10 19:24:26
243.   Gen3Blue
224 Your right--sorry to be gone so long but thats not what I meant. there is something wrong wit Jp'sstats at every site :0)
2008-01-10 19:36:09
244.   tjshere
239 Were the batters Tip Grizzle and Slow Molasses Smith? Fat Crompton, maybe?
2008-01-10 19:41:51
245.   Greg Brock
Chalk is really effective against ants, because it disrupts the chemicals that they use to communicate. If you can find the hole outside, just draw a chalk circle around it, and they won't come in.

There's actually a special chalk you can buy (from a Chinese company), but regular old chalk gets the job done.

2008-01-10 19:51:27
246.   Terry A
You're making that up, aren't you?
2008-01-10 20:05:35
247.   Sam DC
The chalk thing is true.

I lived in Portland for a year and rented a big old cheap old dusty old house. After a few weeks, we got around to cleaning up all the weird chalk trails around the basement stairs.

INVASION AND MAYHEM FOLLOWED.

IT WAS LIKE THEM II.

Then the landlord told us to put the chalk back and we were free from our angry ant overlords.

2008-01-10 20:10:38
248.   Greg Brock
246 It does sound like something I would make up.

But it's Sam DC vouchsafed! Tis true!

2008-01-10 20:21:07
249.   underdog
We get ants here in SF too, I get 'em really bad sometimes because I'm on the ground floor of a house, with the trash cans in front and the garden behind me. When they do attack, it's usually the cat food dish. what I started doing was get this diatomaceous earth stuff and spread it in a pan, and then put the cat food in that pan. It's safe for cats, it's just like dust for us, but to ants when they walk across it it's like glass. So eventually the stupid ants die and the smart ants avoid it altogether. Of course if you use it in too many places then you have all this dust all over the place, though that's better for ants.

And along with Ken's Raid trick, I even find spraying just 409 or something like that in the hole and along their trails does the trick. Plug up the holes and cracks with caulking too.

Oh and on the obscure Dodger list, of the ones who are likely not going to amount to anything, I like McKay Christensen and Larry Barnes. Thank you.

2008-01-10 20:30:53
250.   Jon Weisman
NPUT
Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2008-01-10 21:21:34
251.   Yu-Hsing Chen
219 I think the issue was several
a. defensive liability: not sure if he could hit like Manny but he sure fields like him, even back home in Taiwan where the competition level isn't exactly out of this world he's still a DH. and they don't have DH in the NL.

b.he didn't hit enough... he show flashs with quick hands and very solid power. but his overall pitch recognition wasn't good enough. it wasn't terrible. but it wasn't good enough. which showed when he got up to the high minors. espically AA. he raked (somewhat ) in AAA, but it's Vegas...

in the end. he was indeed a very promising prospect but really didn't pan out. he had good athletism / very good bat speed and been there in big games (he was and still is routinelee the Taiwan National team's cleanup hitter). there's several possible reasons for that i suppose.

1.Something was fishy with the system : the Dodger system virtually produced nothing in the early decade. NOTHING. name 3 guys from that period who are anything more than utility players... maybe they had terrible luck, maybe their development system was horrific. maybe a good dose of both.

2.Playing for the national team: Chen was virtually playing for team Taiwan EVERY offseason. so his wear and tear was very very significant..

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