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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

After All This, Won't You Give Me a Smile?
2008-05-28 14:40
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

UntitledSo, have you ever sung the lyrics to "London Calling" by the Clash as if you were the Chris Farley character, Matt Foley?

The ice age is coming, the sun is zooming in
Engines stop running and the wheat is growing thin
A nuclear error, but I have no fear
London is drowning - and I live in a van down by the river

* * *

Dodgers at Cubs, 5:05 p.m.

Comments (489)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-05-28 14:43:39
1.   Eric Stephen
So much for Pee Wee today. I guess this from Gurnick was only speculation on his part:

"After Delwyn Young's pinch-single in the ninth inning Tuesday night, Torre might feel compelled to give Young a start at his former position of second base if Kent is unable to play Wednesday."

And I love that SNL skit. Back when laughing during the skit was cool, before Jimmy Fallon ruined it!

2008-05-28 14:45:27
2.   JoeyP
It'd be nice if Torre would try bunching his best hitters at the very top of the lineup:

Martin
Ethier
Kemp
Loney
Dewitt
Pierre
Maza
Hu
Lowe

2008-05-28 14:46:21
3.   cargill06
derek lowe will start to catch fire, starting tonigh as the dodgers win a close one 4-2.
2008-05-28 14:46:36
4.   D4P
I'd really like it if Maza stopped hitting second

Seriously: even if you are dense enough to think that Pierre has to bat leadoff, what kind of mania drives managers to believe that

Pierre, Maza, Ethier, Martin, Loney, Kemp

is better than

Pierre, Ethier, Martin, Loney, Kemp

2008-05-28 14:46:47
5.   Bob Timmermann
Torre might feel compelled

The subjunctive and imperative mix together in a unholy marriage of verbs.

We need gpellamjr to tell us what mood that sentence was in.

2008-05-28 14:46:52
6.   Xeifrank
lat'd.
Martin but no Kent i see. Last night the abyss of Pierre, Maza, Hu, Ardoin, Kuroda and Sweeney went a combined 1 for 17. All those players including Kemp and Loney had a negative "offensive" WPA. 6 of the Dodgers 12 plate appearances with an above average leverage index were from the "abyss" group. Maza's single was in that group. The non-abyss group was 4 for 15 with four walks, and was also 1 for 6 in above average leverage situations, but with three walks.
vr, Xei
2008-05-28 14:51:33
7.   Eric Enders
Heh. That song's my ringtone right now. Even though I don't know anybody in London. Not even the Ontario one.

Other songs in Chris Farley's fictional oeuvre:

Bruce Springsteen:
"Is a dream a lie if it don't come true?
Or is it something worse that sends me
Down to a van by the river
Though I know the river is dry"

Neil Young:
"Down by the river, I shot my baby
Down in a van by the river,
Dead, oh, shot her dead."

Richard Marx:
"I swear I left her in a van by the river
I swear I left her safe and sound"

2008-05-28 14:56:21
8.   kinbote
Apologies to Radiohead:

"I jumped into [a van by] the river and what did I see?
black-eyed angels swimming with me
a moon full of stars and astral cars
all the figures I used to see
all my lovers were there with me
all my past and futures
and we all went to heaven in a little [van by the river]."

2008-05-28 15:00:07
9.   kinbote
Strange typo in this piece on Kershaw from Rotoworld:

If there's no other opening, Kershaw could be sent back to the minors to help converse his arm and limit his innings.

http://tinyurl.com/6bzzpa

2008-05-28 15:01:09
10.   Eric Enders
I tend to be of the opinion that Kershaw's arm can do anything it wants to, even converse.
2008-05-28 15:01:41
11.   Eric Enders
He's like Mark Fidrych except he doesn't need the ball.
2008-05-28 15:02:18
12.   D4P
Richard Marx:
"I swear I left her in a van by the river
I swear I left her safe and sound

Hadn't thought of that song in a long long time.

2008-05-28 15:02:47
13.   Eric Stephen
Billy Joel says hello:

"In the middle of the night
I go walking in my sleep
From the mountains of faith
To the van down by the river so deep"

2008-05-28 15:03:40
14.   KG16
also LAT'd:

87 - soon, LaRoche will be taking grounders at second, Kent will be on the DL and all will be happy.

Trust in the Ch-i

2008-05-28 15:03:52
15.   Fallout
Jon---Today, it was an honor to interview Scully. In a few years, it will be a feather in your cap. Congradulations...
2008-05-28 15:04:29
16.   Eric Enders
12 That was my favorite song when I was 14. Don't tell anybody.

Actually, I still like it.

2008-05-28 15:06:01
17.   D4P
16
I liked it too. I'm gonna listen to it.
2008-05-28 15:06:34
18.   68elcamino427
2

How about this?

L-Ethier
R-Martin
L-Loney
R-Kemp
L-DeWitt

And ... I live in a van down by the river, when I'm not in the basement:)

2008-05-28 15:08:26
19.   Humma Kavula
Perhaps this is a good time to say that I live in Van Cliburn, down by the river.
2008-05-28 15:08:47
20.   kinbote
Don't see too many vans nowadays.
2008-05-28 15:09:11
21.   Xeifrank
Today's win probabilities for the Dodgers:

My Simulator: 35.03%
LV Hilton SB: 40.00%
AccuScore: 36.00%

vr, Xei

2008-05-28 15:09:12
22.   D4P
I saw Van Cliburn play a concert in Portland, not far from the river.
2008-05-28 15:09:39
23.   sporky
Cory Wade is 25 today!
2008-05-28 15:10:33
24.   Jon Weisman
23 - And Kirk Gibson is 51!
2008-05-28 15:11:24
25.   underdog
I'm wearing Kershaw Converse brand sneakers and they make me feel I can do anything mythological!

I think one reason Pee Wee did not get a start today may have to do with them still being a little worried about his defense at second with a ground ball pitcher like Lowe on the mound. Of course, that's assuming the ground ball pitcher Lowe is the one that shows up today and not the line drive and fly ball pitcher that has shown up too often the past month. Maza hasn't looked too bad at the plate, either. Still, be nice to see them squeeze DY in there somewhere soon.

Did I mention (today) that the team misses Furcal? Just thought I'd say that (again).

2008-05-28 15:11:27
26.   Gilberto Reyes
2 Maybe the Dodgers should try batting the pitcher 8th like the Cardinals and Brewers do? The way Hu has been hitting and the horrible team RISP stat lately, they should be willing to try anything to break out of this funk.
2008-05-28 15:11:49
27.   kinbote
I could be wrong, but I believe Juan Pierre learned how do that little push bunt over third base by practicing on a van down by the river.

(That's it for me. Night all.)

2008-05-28 15:13:54
28.   sie0174
Isn't game time 5:05 pm?
2008-05-28 15:14:01
29.   underdog
26 I was thinking that, too, as much as I hate to admit Tony LaRussa could have a good idea about anything. And in general I'm not in favor of it... but right now, why not?

Argh, I have a meeting at 4 today. Guess I'll be watching this one on delay later on.

2008-05-28 15:15:16
30.   underdog
28 - Indeed it is. 5:05 start, on ESPN2. And still, I'll have to watch it on delay via Tivo.
2008-05-28 15:16:32
31.   madmac
18 I aways figured you the El Camino type
2008-05-28 15:17:55
32.   Eric Stephen
16
I always liked the much sappier Marxist songs "Right Here Waiting" and "Hold on to the Night".
2008-05-28 15:18:45
33.   bhsportsguy
I wonder if Fred Wilpon's good friend will be in New York on Friday.

From Riverside Press-Enterprise game story from last Sunday.

Kershaw, who talked with Sandy Koufax before the game, said he was no more nervous than in any of his minor league starts and described it as "a pretty solid performance."

2008-05-28 15:19:42
34.   Gilberto Reyes
29 I'm not a LaRussa fan either but the odds are really stacked against the club tonight. Cubs are playing well. Zambrano is their ace. Dodgers are not hitting. And look at the guys in our lineup! Desperate times take desperate measures.
2008-05-28 15:19:43
35.   Eric Stephen
21
Wow, those numbers seem low. I guess that's what we get facing Big Z.

I'm going to give my Dodger win probability as well. I'm setting it at 100%.

In fact, if the Dodgers don't win tonight, I'll buy a Juan Pierre t-shirt.

2008-05-28 15:20:54
36.   Bob Timmermann
35
If you buy the Juan Pierre t-shirt, you will also have to put on a catcher's mask and dance the can-can.
2008-05-28 15:22:02
37.   Xeifrank
29. Batting the pitcher 8th is not Tony LaRussa's idea. I am not sure if that's what you were implying or not. But he does deserve some credit for having the guts to actually do it. vr, Xei
2008-05-28 15:22:18
38.   Jon Weisman
I like the picture on Tony Jackson's blog, but I can't remember my screen name or get in to comment on it.
2008-05-28 15:23:33
39.   underdog
37 - That's more what I meant. I knew he didn't invent the concept. But is the one to really embrace it lately. What would be better is to have Furcal back and have 1-8 that is all pretty solid. Which we've only had a few times this season but could have again soon, by gum!
2008-05-28 15:25:46
40.   underdog
38 - I somehow remembered my Typekey log in and was able to comment. In fact, I asked Tony a question and he was kind enough to answer it. Here it is:
>>
Hi Tony,
Do you think the Dodgers are getting close to the point where they'd DFA Mark Sweeney and replace him with Andy LaRoche? I know they are (finally!) trying LaRoche at 2nd and 1st to give him more spaces to play with the big club (and DeWitt can play 2nd in a pinch, too). LaRoche is ready to contribute, especially with Kent struggling and hurting, and Mark Sweeney, as great a career as he's had as a pinch hitter just seems done. Do you think that sort of move is coming?

Thanks and happy travels.
May 28, 2008 10:30 AM
Tony Jackson said:

My guess is that move will come only when they feel they can get Andy a significant number of ABs up here. They do NOT want him coming here and sitting around. <<

2008-05-28 15:26:17
41.   GMac In The 909
Am I the only one who thinks Torre's daily lineup shuffle for the first several weeks of the season has played a role in the team's inconsistency?
2008-05-28 15:26:50
42.   Jon Weisman
A Dodger Thoughts Ticket Exchange Thread success story:

http://wiens-world.blogspot.com/2008/05/dodger-game.html

2008-05-28 15:26:59
43.   D4P
I'm sure I liked the sappiest Richard Marx songs at the time, but the "edgier" stuff (e.g. "Hazard" and "Should've Known Better") has better stood the test of time.
2008-05-28 15:32:17
44.   bhsportsguy
41 I don't think so, unless you subscribe to the theory of protection. I think guys are just happy to be playing everyday and where they bat doesn't really matter.

This team has had problems all year hitting against right-handed pitchers, their hot streak came during a stretch where they played a lot of lefties.

2008-05-28 15:32:35
45.   Eric Stephen
42
Great pictures, and cool story. Were those ToyCannon's seats?
2008-05-28 15:35:19
46.   bhsportsguy
45 They look like ToyCannon's seats especially shots of the bullpen.
2008-05-28 15:35:42
47.   D4P
Actual question asked by one of Depo's readers:

My question is: Are all other organizations utilizing these advanced statistics? I can't imagine that there are some that are ignoring things like FIP, BABIP, ISOP, etc., when they provide so much explanation behind the appearances of less-inclusive statistics (such as AVG, ERA, etc.)

Without giving any names, are there front office guys out there that are just completely ignorant to new-age stats?

2008-05-28 15:38:34
48.   KG16
off topic basketball question: should the Spurs be considered a dynasty? They've won 4 titles in 8 years, and three of the last five, but none back to back. I think they've lasted long enough to be considered a dynasty, but I'm not sure if back-to-back titles should be a requirement. Or at least consecutive trips to the finals?

For the record, I don't consider the Lakers three-peat to be a dynasty because it wasn't a long enough run. I'd say the Bulls in the 90s (though given the turn over in personnel between titles 3 and 4, it's questionable) and the Lakers in the 80s were the last true NBA dynasties.

2008-05-28 15:39:52
49.   bhsportsguy
47 And his answer:

There is no doubt that virtually every organization looks at a lot of analysis. Though I referenced FIP in this post, it served more as a confirmation of what our scouts were telling us.

2008-05-28 15:40:39
50.   Bob Timmermann
The Stuarts were a dynasty despite an interruption in their reign.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-05-28 15:42:12
51.   Eric Stephen
47 ,49
Was that our Nate?
2008-05-28 15:42:23
52.   D4P
49
Depo's diplomatic. He knows full well there's plenty of GMs out there who have no idea what FIP or BABIP or IsoP are.
2008-05-28 15:43:02
53.   D4P
51
I don't think so. That nate's blogs didn't look like something our nate would be running.
2008-05-28 15:43:18
54.   KG16
47 - this will likely get me in trouble, but how, exactly is BABIP a better stat than AVG?

I really don't understand the point of BABIP, other than stacking the deck for guys who strike out a lot, what's the point. I think I've made the argument more than a few times that a strike is the second (or third) least desirable outcome of a PA (behind double plays and triple plays, which are so rare as to not be statistically significant), so what is the advantage of removing them from the analysis? Why not remove GIDP? Or Line drive caught?

2008-05-28 15:45:07
55.   bhsportsguy
48 If the Lakers win a title or two to bookend the decade, are they a dynasty?

Probably not since they did not win a playoff series in 4 years.

2008-05-28 15:47:02
56.   KG16
55 - I'd agree on that point. Now, moving forward from this year, if the Lakers manage to win 3-5 titles in the next 6-8 years, I think we could call them a dynasty, but I don't think you can count the 00-02 three-peat
2008-05-28 15:48:36
57.   fanerman
54 BABIP related to line drive percentage and other batted ball data helps tell if a player has been lucky or unlucky. For example, if BABIP is really high for someone with a low line drive percentage, there's a good chance a lot of bloop singles and weak ground balls are finding holes. Those things usually even out with time, so it helps figure out whether a player is playing over his head or vice-versa.
2008-05-28 15:50:44
58.   Eric Stephen
48
I'd give dynastic status to both the Spurs and the Lakers. The Spurs were longer term, but the 4 titles in the Duncan era really solidifies them. Also, since drafting Duncan the Spurs have a .707 win % in the regular season (58 win average) over 11 seasons. For reference, Magic's Lakers averaged 60 wins in his first 12 seasons (.726 win %).

The Lakers get the dynasty status because of the 3 peat (only MN Lakers, 59-66 Celtics, 90s Bulls, and the 00-02 Lakers have done it), plus they made the finals in year 5 of that run.

2008-05-28 15:51:53
59.   D4P
57
Right. The idea is that hitters have control over striking out, but much less over what happens to the ball after they've put it in play. The latter is influenced much more by "luck" than the former.
2008-05-28 15:53:33
60.   Eric Stephen
55
I think of this Laker team as separate from the 3-peat years (how much do I owe Pat Riley for using that?), but I do enjoy the possibility of a 4th title in 9 years (same as the Spurs even though they've been solid all 9 years).
2008-05-28 15:53:47
61.   bhsportsguy
52 How can you say that?

Sure, its more than likely that GMs (including the Dodgers) don't have Dewan's Fielding Bible on his desk or favorite links to BaseballProspectus.com and the like on his computer. Ned did say in a chat that there our people on his staff that do statistical analysis but did not go into detail of what they do and he also said it is all part of the process used to review players.

In fact DePodesta's answer seems to indicate that his mention of a certain stat only confirmed what the Padre's scouts were reporting not that they relied on one or the other more heavily.

I also would like to believe that if DePodesta is going to blog and take questions about the general state of the game, he would not just give a polite answer, he could say something like, I can't speak for other organizations, I only can speak for what I know the Padres use.

A couple of writers from Baseball Prospectus in the last few years have noted that there is not much in terms of analysis that is not commonly known in the business. Again, how it is used or if it used is a different question.

2008-05-28 15:56:51
62.   Daniel Zappala
Now that brings back memories. Midnight Oil was the musical guest for the night of that SNL skit. I have an LP of "Red Sails in the Sunset" around here somewhere...
2008-05-28 15:57:06
63.   D4P
How can you say that?

I refuse to believe that Ned knows what VORP or BABIP or FIP mean. Witness:

''Do I use VORP?" Colletti said, referring to one such sabermetric tool, Value Over Replacement Player. ''I may be using it and not even know it, and if I am, it's nobody's business. There are a lot of different criteria in judging players. I think I use, um, esoteric qualitative mathematical review times five. That's one of them."

2008-05-28 15:59:42
64.   KG16
I really don't like the use of the term "luck" when discussing the strategic decisions of teams (putting the shift on, holding a runner, playing double play depth) and the defensive skill of players in the field. To me, that's not luck, that is one player/team/manager imposing his will on the game. That is entirely different than something completely outside the purview of "luck".

Luck, to me, implies something that no one on the field has control over... a ball getting stuck in the tarp, a fan reaching out and taking the ball off the field of play, a pigeon being exploded by a Randy Johnson fastball.

But a guy getting to a ground ball, or making a diving stop, or making a great throw, is not luck, it is skill; just as a guy hitting the ball is a skill.

2008-05-28 15:59:46
65.   Eric Stephen
63
I think Ned was just being flippant with that response and you're taking him too literally.
2008-05-28 16:01:21
66.   bigcpa
42 Thanks for reminding me! I have a pair of snazzy seats for 6/20 vs Indians to unload if anyone wants to venture to the ticket thread.
2008-05-28 16:02:29
67.   KG16
64 - That is entirely different than something completely outside the control of a player on the field and within the purview of luck.

Fixed, sorry, two thoughts at once is not so good for typing

2008-05-28 16:02:36
68.   regfairfield
64 But it's not a skill if a ball is barely fielded or hit a foot out of the defenders range.
2008-05-28 16:03:03
69.   fanerman
64 What I'm saying is that a batter does not have 100% control over what happens to a ball after he hits it (unless it's a home run). He may have some control over it but not all of it. Sometimes ground balls find holes and sometimes fielders make great plays. Pop-ups sometimes fall even if they're mostly caught. Just because there is skill involved doesn't mean there is not chance.
2008-05-28 16:05:38
70.   Bluebleeder87
by the way Jon I LOVED your Vin Scully story, I lived that story vicariously thru you like somebody else mentioned.
2008-05-28 16:05:56
71.   silverwidow
Ned got flippant when asked if Loaiza would accept an outright assignment to Triple-A.
2008-05-28 16:07:06
72.   regfairfield
71 I can't see him doing that. He'd do well somewhere like Petco.
2008-05-28 16:08:10
73.   Eric Enders
Every single team does stats analysis of some type or other. Politically, you have to do it if you're a GM. Nobody wants to be seen as completely ignoring stats. Having a stats guy, at the very least, leaves one less possible excuse that can be used to fire the GM. But in some organizations the poor stats analyst has zero influence -- he's only around so the GM can say in interviews that the team uses statistics. I remember reading a quote from Ozzie Guillen last year where he says his front office delivers him all these binders full of statistical reports and he drops them directly in the garbage can.

In other organizations (i.e. Red Sox), there are multiple stats people and they are highly influential, and the GMs are sometimes statistical analysts themselves to some degree.

Also, having a stats analyst doesn't necessarily mean you have a sabermetrician. I've heard that at least a few teams have statistics-degree types who can put together a good resume, but who have little actual knowledge of the key concepts of baseball analysis.

2008-05-28 16:09:13
74.   KG16
69 - agreed, but it seems wrong to discount the skill/strategy of the defense when weighing the outcome of the offense.

The same goes for pitching vs. hitting, I've still yet to understand why strikeouts are good for pitchers but not bad for hitters. You can't say a guy striking out is simply bad luck and therefore shouldn't count, when there was obviously skill on the other side in throwing pitches that induced a hitter to swing at a ball or not swing at a strike.

2008-05-28 16:11:53
75.   Jon Weisman
Dodgers to bid on 2013 All-Star Game.

http://tinyurl.com/4xd6na

2008-05-28 16:12:32
76.   regfairfield
74 Because that kind of thing balances out in the end. You face good defenses and you face bad ones. Yes the skill of the defense factors in, but since the difference between the best and worst defenses is converting 3-4 percent more balls in play into outs, having to play against a great defense 19 times instead of six makes a very small difference in BABIP.
2008-05-28 16:14:03
77.   Xeifrank
It is my feeling that debating whether or not an NBA team is considered a dynasty or not is one of those dull minutiae, often bantered around by day time sports talk show hosts when they have nothing better to talk about. I also liken it to HOF consideration talk. zzzzzzz for me. vr, Xei
2008-05-28 16:14:44
78.   Eric Stephen
74
It's not that the strikeout was bad (or good) luck, it's that a strikeout is completely in the realm of responsibility for both the batter and pitcher.

It's the balls in play stuff that are subject to outside factors (i.e. fielders). BABIP doesn't use strikeouts (or HR or BB or HBP) because all the responsibility for those events belonged to both the pitcher and batter.

2008-05-28 16:15:15
79.   Bob Timmermann
Now the Hans. That was a dynasty!

The Ptolemies weren't bad either.

2008-05-28 16:15:26
80.   KG16
68 - it's not a skill for a hitter to recognize that with a runner on second that there is a hole open on the right side so he's going to try to go the other way, particularly since the statuesque Jeff Kent is playing second?

It's not a strategic decision to set the infield at double play depth or to put the shift on, or to hold the runner? And it's not skill for a hitter to adjust to those strategic decisions?

Sorry, I'm just skeptical by nature.

2008-05-28 16:15:30
81.   Eric Enders
If they just awarded the 2010 game, how long will it be before the 2013 game is awarded? The story makes it sound like none too soon. Which means more penny-pinching in the draft for the foreseeable future.

I sure hope it was worth losing Kyle Blair to get the stupid All-Star Game. Heck, by 2013 he could be pitching in the thing for some other team.

2008-05-28 16:15:47
82.   Eric Stephen
77
What is there was a TV show centered around NBA dyansties and/or HOF talk? :)
2008-05-28 16:17:31
83.   fanerman
74 Because BABIP tends to have large denominators (or needs it to be meaningful), it doesn't necessarily discount the defense as much as it assumes everything averages out in the long run, over hundreds and hundreds of at-bats.
2008-05-28 16:18:36
84.   silverwidow
I am strongly behind the Trade Lowe campaign. He's not coming back and might block our young pitchers down the stretch.
2008-05-28 16:18:53
85.   Bob Timmermann
The Carringtons were not a dynasty in my book.
2008-05-28 16:19:19
86.   regfairfield
80 It is, but whether or not you hit it to Jeff Kent or out of his range isn't. Something like "hit a ground ball to the right side" is mainly on the hitter. "Hit a ball 10 feet in front of the centerfielder is luck.

And even if you could constantly hit it to the worst defender, it would make a difference, but not a really big one. Last year, Kent missed 13 more plays than the average second baseman, so you'd get one more hit every 11 games if you could constantly hit the ball in Jeff Kent's direction. That assume some one is perfect at that sort of thing, which no one can be.

2008-05-28 16:19:32
87.   KG16
86 - what about the House of Windsor?
2008-05-28 16:19:47
88.   KG16
87 - sorry, that was meant for 85
2008-05-28 16:20:02
89.   bhsportsguy
I think there is another reason why LaRoche or DeWitt will get some at 2B.

From Tony Jackson's blog (about 10 minutes ago)

Tony Abreu had season-ending surgery today, and the fact that ISN'T the lead item to this blog post should tell you where he stands in this organization. Anyway, they hope he can be back in time for winter ball back in the Dominican. ..

2008-05-28 16:20:51
90.   bhsportsguy
89 Sounds like they are doing something dirty, of course I meant get some time at 2B.
2008-05-28 16:20:56
91.   Eric Enders
"it's not a skill for a hitter to recognize that with a runner on second that there is a hole open on the right side so he's going to try to go the other way, particularly since the statuesque Jeff Kent is playing second?"

Actually, no, it's not. If you read interviews with hitters, you'll always hear that it's impossible to place the ball with that degree of precision. By swinging late, you can make a general attempt to hit the ball to the opposite field, but you have no way of controlling whether it becomes a grounder to the first baseman, a soft fly to right, or a single through the 2B hole. That part of it is luck.

Perhaps the key tenet of sabermetrics is that many things in baseball which are commonly believed to be the result of skill, are actually the result of chance.

2008-05-28 16:22:36
92.   Eric Enders
89 I thought Morganna was retired.
2008-05-28 16:22:49
93.   Eric Stephen
90
Well, they have to go longer than 90 feet to get to the bag at 2B; they should get something for it! :)
2008-05-28 16:23:54
94.   KG16
86 - perhaps I wasn't clear enough, it's not so much about hitting it to the worst defender (otherwise every right handed hitter against the Dodgers would be trying to pull the ball to left), but recognizing where the hole are in the defensive alignment and "hitting it where they ain't" as a once great hitter use to say.

Pin point accuracy is impossible, agreed, but it seems to me that too much is dismissed as a matter of "luck" to make any sort of statistical analysis meaningful.

2008-05-28 16:24:07
95.   bhsportsguy
92 Raise your hands if you know Morgana outside of classic TWIB highlights.
2008-05-28 16:24:23
96.   Bob Timmermann
High school softball hijinks from the LA Times:

Crenshaw scored three runs in the top of the seventh inning and tied its City Invitational championship with Lincoln, 4-4, at UCLA's Easton Stadium.

The title will be decided using the International tiebreaker, with a runner starting on second base.

Crenshaw's big inning came with a run in, one out and the bases loaded; a pop-up to first was the second out of the inning, but the ball was dropped; the runner at first base took off to second base and Lincoln played it like a force play. The runner from third and the runner who started from second both scored. The runner who began the play at first base tried to advance to third but was thrown out.

Again, that was all on one play. But two runners scored, and that was good enough fro Crenshaw.

Through eight innings, it's still tied at 4-4.

Softball does have the infield fly rule?

2008-05-28 16:24:52
97.   Jacob L
75 About time, but I'd say there's little chance the Dodgers will get the All Star Game only 3 years after Los Angeles of Anaheim.

Speaking of which, many of you will recall that I throw a party for every All Star Game, with a menu based on the host city (Brats for Milwaukee, nouveau wine country cal cuisine for last year in SF, etc). New York this year will be great. I'm thinking, as opposed to the obvious dogs or pizza, that I'm going to go all Jewish with corned beef, blintzes, kugel, etc.

Next year for St Louis, I can come up with something (I'm sure Bob can help). But what'll I do for Anaheim in 2010? What is a typical Anaheim or Orange County food? Carl's Jr? Help me out, guys. Then hopefully in 5 years you can help me with the far more interesting question of what to serve for LA.

2008-05-28 16:25:28
98.   Bumsrap
Off the top of someones head:

What player best represents early detection of greatness through the use of new age stats that otherwise was perhaps unimpressive by traditional stats?

Who are the top five players that have good new age stats that don't have good traditional stats?

2008-05-28 16:26:34
99.   Eric Stephen
97
Maybe Mexican food for SoCal?
2008-05-28 16:26:37
100.   Jacob L
98 Youkilis.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-05-28 16:27:11
101.   bhsportsguy
97 Banh Mi sandwiches to salute Little Saigon in Westminster, boysenberry pies from Knotts Berry farm to start.
2008-05-28 16:27:12
102.   Bumsrap
97 - Bear Country Jamboree Burgers
2008-05-28 16:27:51
103.   Jacob L
99 I can count on zero hands the number of times I've had good Mexican in Orange County, but that's kind of indicative of the problem. Besides, I'm saving fish tacos for the inevitable San Diego All Star Game.
2008-05-28 16:28:34
104.   Jacob L
101 Winner. I forgot all about Vietnamese food.
2008-05-28 16:29:39
105.   KG16
91 - there's some more control a hitter has besides swinging late, the nature of the swing also has something to do with it. Is he rolling his hands over (likely a ground ball), upper cutting (likely a fly ball), stepping into the swing or reaching for the ball? All of those things have an effect on how the bat hits the ball and thus how the ball travels into the field of play.
2008-05-28 16:29:45
106.   Eric Stephen
98
I'd say Pat Burrell and Bobby Abreu are underrated given their traditional numbers.
2008-05-28 16:30:15
107.   Bluebleeder87
84

I'm right there with you bro but what kind of players can we snag for a guy like Lowe?

2008-05-28 16:31:00
108.   Eric Enders
98 I take issue with the premise. New-age stat is a loaded, not to mention undefined, term. Is OBP a new-age stat? And if so, why are we calling something that Allan Roth and Branch Rickey invented 60 years ago "new age"?

Also, in general, the differences between traditional stats and sabermetric ones are not extreme enough to turn a "good player" into a "bad player." It's all about degrees. Everybody knows Jim Rice was a good player, he just wasn't as good as his traditional stats would indicate. Likewise, everybody knew Bobby Grich was a good player, he was just much better than his traditional stats would indicate.

2008-05-28 16:31:04
109.   regfairfield
105 And no one is disputing that. Hitters can control the general trajectory of the ball, but hitting it where they ain't is near impossible.
2008-05-28 16:31:13
110.   Bob Timmermann
97
For St. Louis you would have to serve toasted ravioli.

Except it's not really toasted, but actually deep-fried. But it sounds better to say toasted.

Actually any type of Italian food.

2008-05-28 16:31:17
111.   bhsportsguy
104 Especially the sandwiches, pho is served in other places but I believe the OC was the home of the original Lee's Sandwiches.
2008-05-28 16:31:41
112.   Eric Stephen
107
Maybe Healthcliff Slocumb.
2008-05-28 16:31:52
113.   blue22
98 - Adam Dunn, certainly not the next coming of Dave Kingman or Rob Deer, has a career .301 eqa against a career .249 batting average.
2008-05-28 16:33:01
114.   Jim Hitchcock
92 Her assets are still working for her.
2008-05-28 16:34:21
115.   Eric Enders
105 You are, of course, correct, but none of those things give the hitter control over where he hits the ball.

If they did, hitters would bat 1.000 all the time. Why does the "skill" component only apply on a hit and run? Why can't the hitter in a normal at-bat say to himself, "Hey, there's a big gap out in right-center field, I think I'll hit it there for a double?"

The reason is that hitters cannot control the spot to which they hit the ball.

2008-05-28 16:34:25
116.   Jacob L
110 Thanks. That's along the lines I was thinking.

111 I actually had a Banh Mi for lunch today.

All Star Games I want to see, for purely culinary related reasons -

Philadelphia
Miami
Kansas City
San Diego

2008-05-28 16:34:39
117.   Eric Stephen
113
I would have included him -- especially since he is seemingly hated by the Brennaman family, and others -- but even Dunn's biggest detractors will acknowledge he hits a lot of homers.
2008-05-28 16:35:15
118.   underdog
By trading Lowe we'd also be giving up the first round draft pick we'd get for losing him to free agency. I'm just sayin'. Plus if the Dodgers are still in the thick of a playoff race I don't see them trading him anyway.
2008-05-28 16:35:28
119.   Bob Timmermann
Jacob,
Start working on your toasted ravioli
http://ericsfood.blogspot.com/2005/03/toasted-ravioli.html
2008-05-28 16:35:29
120.   Xeifrank
97. Also having lots of relatives in the nearby St Louis area, I'd suggest you serve Chicken & Dumplings and home-made ice cream.
vr, Xei
2008-05-28 16:35:57
121.   Eric Enders
For St. Louis you could just have it catered by Steak 'n' Shake.
2008-05-28 16:37:02
122.   Bumsrap
108 - Reading what Torre and Bowa have been saying regarding the Dodgers slump, that hitters are not shortening their swings with two strikes, are not manufacturing runs due to inexperience, etc. which sabermetric stat would best indicate who was doing what they wanted their hitters to do? Seriously, I want to better understand.
2008-05-28 16:37:06
123.   Bob Timmermann
Frozen custard would be the dessert of choice for St. Louis.
2008-05-28 16:37:14
124.   Eric Stephen
I've never had a Vietnamese sandwich, but now I'm hungry.
2008-05-28 16:37:22
125.   Jacob L
119 That's obscene. And kind of tasty looking.
2008-05-28 16:37:42
126.   blue22
113 - A homerun hitter, sure but one strikes out way too much, struggles to hit .240 and can't field his position to save his life. He's a top-25 hitter in the major leagues.

Jack Cust and Pat Burrell both finished in the top-25 in the ML last year despite hitting .256 (though I'd guess Cust's ops+ was higher).

2008-05-28 16:38:42
127.   Jacob L
124 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B%C3%A1nh_m%C3%AC
2008-05-28 16:39:07
128.   Bob Timmermann
Jay Bruce walked in his first at bat. He's up to six straight times on base to start his career.

He's one away from Ted Cox's record of 7.

2008-05-28 16:39:18
129.   blue22
118 - Would Lowe accept arbitration if he finishes the season with an ERA around 5.00? He'd get a 1-year deal for $8M minimum.
2008-05-28 16:39:33
130.   KG16
I didn't say the skill component only applies to a hit and run, it was just the example that I used. I think a lot of guys got to the plate, scan the defense and then try to figure out where to hit the ball to get extra bases.

Again, I fully agree that a hitter can't control where he hits the ball with pin point accuracy. That doesn't mean where they end up hitting the ball is pure chance. There are a multitude of variables in what is, ultimately (in my view at least) a multi level competition of skill, strategy, and talent. Luck plays a role, but I would posit that it is a smaller one than the other three.

2008-05-28 16:41:37
131.   bhsportsguy
124 K Sandwiches
7604 Linda Vista Rd
San Diego, CA 92111
858-278-8961

Never been there but got some good reviews on Chowhound.com

2008-05-28 16:42:47
132.   Eric Stephen
131
I'll have to try that this weekend. Thanks.

And thanks for the low down too, Jacob L in 127 .

2008-05-28 16:43:52
133.   regfairfield
130 Name a modern player you think excels at hitting them where they ain't.
2008-05-28 16:45:07
134.   fanerman
130 I'm no expert, but I think that making contact is hard enough that most hitters would just try to find a pitch they can hit and then try to hit.
2008-05-28 16:45:24
135.   fanerman
it.
2008-05-28 16:45:35
136.   bhsportsguy
133 Wee Willie Pierre.

Duck.

2008-05-28 16:46:21
137.   madmac
119 Walt Jocketty sugests using beef ravioli
2008-05-28 16:46:26
138.   Marty
Banh Mi Che Cali in San Gabriel is the best Banh Mi place I've been to.

There are not too many good Mexican joints in OC, but there are tons of good taco trucks. There are lots of good Salvadoran Pupusa joints in OC too.

You could also do an Al Pastor spit and carve the pork right off the bone for great tacos.

2008-05-28 16:46:45
139.   Eric Stephen
133
I'd guess Ichiro.
2008-05-28 16:47:27
140.   underdog
129 He's been one of the most reliable starters in the league before this season, for past 4 seasons. Reliable, durable starters are hard to come by and expensive. I can't see him accepting that, personally unless he really does tank the rest of the year.
2008-05-28 16:47:28
141.   KG16
133 - I'll have to think about that, unfortunately I don't watch much baseball other than the Dodgers these days, and even that seems to be limited to a couple times a week.

Also, I think you are completely missing my point, but since I have a motion that I should have been working on for the last hour, I don't have time to get back into it.

2008-05-28 16:47:35
142.   regfairfield
136 If you mean that seriously, Pierre's PrOPS is scary accurate to his actual OPS.
2008-05-28 16:47:55
143.   Daniel Zappala
When I think of Italian food, I do not think of St. Louis. Furthermore, toasted ravioli is not an Italian dish.
2008-05-28 16:48:15
144.   Eric Enders
122 I would doubt there's a stat that addresses that specific issue. You could look at two-strike batting average or two-strike OBP, but the sample sizes would likely be too small to draw definitive conclusions.

But really, it's apparent to anyone who's watching the games that Torre and Bowa are full of you-know-what. The Dodgers' young players as a group walk far more than the older players do. If anyone lacks patience, it's Kent, Pierre, and their ilk.

Also, players who shorten their swing with two strikes tend to do things like hit weak ground balls. I don't know for sure, but I doubt that players who do shorten their swing hit any better with two strikes. All it does it prevent you from hitting a line drive, and line drives are the foundation upon which batting average is based. The Cubs announcers yesterday noted that Aramis Ramirez is leading the league in BA with two strikes, even though he never shortens his swing.

Torre's quote is just something you say when you have to offer an explanation for why something is happening and there's no good explanation. "I don't have a clue" wouldn't be an acceptable answer for a manager to give. Neither would "random chance." So they make up nonsense of this sort.

2008-05-28 16:48:22
145.   Xeifrank
Heck, even in slow-pitch softball it's difficult to hit the ball where the fielders aren't. There are usually four outfielders, which cuts down on open space in the outfield. It's easy to hit line drives, but many of them go right at a fielder. In baseball where the pitcher often throws 95mpb, with the ball curving 1 to 2 feet, often starting out on a trajectory right at your head, it is difficult to hit the ball hard and with precision. BABIP, and the components of LD%, GB%, FB% are a very good measure of whether or not a batting average is luck/unlucky based.
vr, Xei
vr, Xei
2008-05-28 16:49:13
146.   Xeifrank
145. That was a very respectful post. :)
vr, Xei
2008-05-28 16:49:17
147.   regfairfield
139 Ichiro constantly exceeds his PrOPS, but I'd guess that's because of his skill at infield hits.
2008-05-28 16:50:30
148.   bhsportsguy
142 Nope, sorry, this may not be a day for sarcasm.
2008-05-28 16:50:55
149.   Eric Stephen
Also, despite Lowe's 5.03 ERA, his FIP is (tied for) his lowest as a Dodger:

2005: 4.10
2006: 3.72
2007: 3.97
2008: 3.72

He's the primary reason I will not have to purchase a Juan Pierre shirt!

2008-05-28 16:51:11
150.   fanerman
Where does one find PrOPS data?
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-05-28 16:51:17
151.   LoneStar7
116 whats good to eat in K.C.'s stadium?
2008-05-28 16:53:23
152.   regfairfield
150 Hardball Times.
2008-05-28 16:53:27
153.   Eric Stephen
151
I'm guessing he meant ribs and/or BBQ of Kansas City, not necessarily Kauffman Stadium.
2008-05-28 16:54:24
154.   Jacob L
153 That is correct.
2008-05-28 16:55:35
155.   Eric Stephen
154
And if San Diego ever gets an all-star game, mix it up with the fish tacos...get some shrimp, salmon, maybe even lobster if the budget allows.

Also, crab quesadillas are great.

2008-05-28 16:56:52
156.   Eric Enders
Arthur Bryant's is, I believe, the most famous K.C. barbecue. It's good, but I like Gates better. Gates also sells their sandwiches at the stadium now, which perhaps means they've jumped the shark a little bit, I don't know.
2008-05-28 16:57:32
157.   LoneStar7
ah I see, I would imagine you could better bbq around Atlanta than k.c...but I've never been to Kansas or much of the midwest so i wouldn't know.

Just read from Jackson that Abreu had season ending surgery, such a weird story he is

also, on a random note, I quite like this think blue t.v. with Eric Karros

2008-05-28 16:57:36
158.   PDH5204
78 "it's that a strikeout is completely in the realm of responsibility for both the batter and pitcher."

No, the catcher must record the out. To take just the one example:

"Mickey Owen recollects the infamous 'dropped third strike' this way:
'9th inning, Yankees vs Dodgers, 2 out Dodgers leading 4 to 3. Henrich at bat. No-one on base. 2 strikes on the batter. Casey pitches a curve ball I signaled for. Henrich struck out. I missed the ball. Henrich reached first base on my error. Yankees then scored 4 runs. Dodgers lose to yanks 7 to 4.'

And the umpire must also call the third [and other] strike[s]. In this respect, re the Rays' April 26 game versus the Red Sox, well, there isn't a Rays fan who saw the pitch who doesn't believe that Navarro took strike three. Except it was called a ball. Navarro then singled and Iwamura then homered, and Clay Bucholz went from being up 1-0 to being a 1-2 loser, and that because the umpire called a taken strike three, a ball.

2008-05-28 16:58:53
159.   Eric Stephen
(Royals SS) Tony Pena's OPS+ this season is 7.
2008-05-28 16:59:53
160.   Gilberto Reyes
128 Jay Bruce lined out to center. Ted Cox's record is safe!!!
2008-05-28 17:00:34
161.   Bob Timmermann
143
Mr. Garagiola and Mr. Berra would like to have a word with you, Daniel.
2008-05-28 17:01:28
162.   Bob Timmermann
160
Ted Cox now opens up a bottle of champagne to celebrate. The same one he drinks every time a rookie doesn't get on base seven straight times to start his career.

I hear that his career was cut short by a drinking problem.

2008-05-28 17:03:03
163.   Marty
I would love to go to KC for BBQ.
2008-05-28 17:03:19
164.   Gilberto Reyes
162 Ted Cox must be a fan of the 1972 Miami Dolphins.
2008-05-28 17:05:43
165.   Eric Enders
Chris Berman just dropped a "heart and soul" reference on Russell Martin.
2008-05-28 17:06:22
166.   Bluebleeder87
I really hope Lowe pitches a good game today.
2008-05-28 17:07:41
167.   Bluebleeder87
from that camera angle the air in Chicago looks really healthy, I wonder if it's just the camera or what?
2008-05-28 17:08:56
168.   Jacob L
155 In fact, people wanted me to have crab for SF last year, and it was nixed for budgetary reasons.
2008-05-28 17:09:56
169.   Bluebleeder87
You know what though, I like Berman when he does those "Say it ain't Sosa" & stuff like that, call me a child but I get the giggles just thinking a grown man actually sat down & thought of those...
2008-05-28 17:11:16
170.   bhsportsguy
168 So is this year pastrami, thin crust pizza, pricey small dishes of food or just hot dogs from cart?
2008-05-28 17:11:46
171.   Bob Timmermann
Soon Juan Pierre will have the nickname of "Camera Eye."
2008-05-28 17:11:52
172.   Jacob L
Rabbit. Loose.
2008-05-28 17:13:12
173.   Eric Enders
171 Perhaps that means Daniel Craig will shoot him.
2008-05-28 17:13:13
174.   Jacob L
170 I am leaning toward an all Jewish menu, but its hard to decide.
2008-05-28 17:13:34
175.   Bob Timmermann
170
Will the choice of drinks be Mountain Dew or crab juice?
2008-05-28 17:14:32
176.   Jacob L
175 Who wants a cosmo?
2008-05-28 17:15:42
177.   LoneStar7
shouldn't juan have been running there
2008-05-28 17:17:14
178.   fanerman
For some reason our office gets Maxim. Maxim just named Chris Berman the worst sportscaster (I'm guessing on TV right now). Chip Caray was 2nd. Joe Morgan was 3rd. They gave a shout-out to firejoemorgan.com

I don't understand how Bill Walton is in the top 10. I find him oddly refreshing.

2008-05-28 17:17:31
179.   emiller
Unfortunately ESPN is blacked out where I live so I'm stuck with Bob Brenly on WGN, the joys of local black outs! Rare day I'm disappointed I miss out on Berman. Also, Maza should be nowhere near the top of any major league lineup.
2008-05-28 17:18:02
180.   Jim Hitchcock
176 Hey, that sounds pretty good. And good for the urinary tract!
2008-05-28 17:18:44
181.   Bluebleeder87
the Cubbies back-stop has a cannon from what I've heard.
2008-05-28 17:22:46
182.   Bluebleeder87
So we would loose a 1st round pick if we were to trade D-Lowe? forget that lets just keep him then.
2008-05-28 17:24:01
183.   LoneStar7
thats weird im watching it on kcal 9, but espn2 here in LA is just showing espnews, not that I would watch the game on espn anyway, but why is blacked out there.
2008-05-28 17:24:55
184.   Bob Timmermann
ESPN cannot show midweek games that conflict with a local broadcast.
2008-05-28 17:26:29
185.   Jacob L
And with that scoreless inning (albeit with 3 baserunners), Lowe has gotten his ERA under 5. Baby steps.
2008-05-28 17:26:50
186.   Bluebleeder87
To me it seemed like Lowe was leaving the ball up a bit but he did induce plenty of grounders.
2008-05-28 17:28:42
187.   Bluebleeder87
this is a good day for one of our young studs to have a break thru game...
2008-05-28 17:30:24
188.   MMSMikey
this is getting disturbing, nect time anyone gets on base just bunt, right away. nice cut there by the way, james.
2008-05-28 17:31:39
189.   Bluebleeder87
mmmm, the sweet taste of nectar.
2008-05-28 17:32:19
190.   fanerman
Another walk for Matthew.
2008-05-28 17:32:23
191.   StolenMonkey86
good AB for Kemp, especially laying off that slider on the outside corner
2008-05-28 17:33:12
192.   StolenMonkey86
well DeWitt can't ground into a double play.
2008-05-28 17:33:26
193.   ucladodger
It was a good Ab, but that slider was a strike. Just too bad we cant do anything other than a walk or a single.
2008-05-28 17:33:40
194.   MyTummyHurts
189 it's natures candy!
2008-05-28 17:36:16
195.   Bluebleeder87
Kemp's on base average is .358 I dig it. Somebody must be working with him cause he has been more selective out there.
2008-05-28 17:40:48
196.   Linkmeister
184 Which doesn't explain why ESPN2 is not showing me the game out here. Last I looked, KCAL9 is not a local station.

Prime Ticket is showing me Tigers-Angels, probably a repeat of yesterday's game.

2008-05-28 17:42:54
197.   PDH5204
196 We are probably "borrowing" the LA feed.
2008-05-28 17:44:59
198.   LoneStar7
oh Charlie..."Juan Pierre, the hardest man in the national league to struck out"
2008-05-28 17:45:34
199.   Jacob L
Well, that strikeout should put Juan Pierre's OBP below 350. My official complaining about Juan Pierre moratorium is over.

Unless he gets on base next time up.

2008-05-28 17:46:06
200.   LoneStar7
196 where are you? kcal 9 is local isn't it..?
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2008-05-28 17:49:46
201.   PDH5204
196 Honolulu
2008-05-28 17:50:30
202.   PDH5204
201 Sorry, should be 200 and not 196
2008-05-28 17:51:09
203.   LoneStar7
that looked like some good ol' D-lowe
2008-05-28 17:51:56
204.   MMSMikey
we got the heart of the lineup coming up this inning
2008-05-28 17:52:02
205.   bhsportsguy
Hawaii gets screwed anytime there's national broadcast of a West Coast team (Mariners, A's, Giants, Padres, Angels and Dodgers) because it is considered part of their local broadcast market thus if the game is on regular broadcast like KCAL, they will not get the ESPN or ESPN2 feed.
2008-05-28 17:52:12
206.   LoneStar7
202 does kcal normally broadcast to hawaii? if not it should be on espn2...but hawaii's time is so far back maybe its on tape delay or something i dont know
2008-05-28 17:52:26
207.   PDH5204
200 We get the Angels and Dodgers Fox channels [as it were][cable channel 20 for Angels and channel 31 for Dodgers]. But we are "sool" when it comes to games on KCAL.
2008-05-28 17:53:45
208.   bhsportsguy
They are not seeing this game in Vegas either.
2008-05-28 17:54:55
209.   Linkmeister
207 Yup. That states the situation concisely. It wouldn't be so bad if we could get the Dodgers on the radio, but we usually just get baseball on the radio on weekends, and then it's (HORRORS!) the Giants.
2008-05-28 17:55:56
210.   trainwreck
205
{208]
Talk about the short end of the stick.
2008-05-28 17:56:18
211.   Jacob L
Hey, what do we call that thing where somebody on our team hits the ball over the fence, and we get an automatic run?
2008-05-28 17:57:47
212.   bhsportsguy
209 Did I give a correct read of the situation in 205 ?
2008-05-28 17:58:27
213.   Linkmeister
211 Now, now.
2008-05-28 17:58:33
214.   bhsportsguy
209 The Lakers are on the radio in Hawaii aren't they.
2008-05-28 17:58:39
215.   LoneStar7
well, this could be out biggest chance for anything...loney and martin actually put two hits together..lets see what bison can do
2008-05-28 17:59:16
216.   bhsportsguy
Okay Blake now time get your average up with the bases loaded.
2008-05-28 17:59:53
217.   LoneStar7
hope thats just a bruise, well bases loaded should we all turn away?
2008-05-28 17:59:58
218.   Gen3Blue
Darn, I think Martin could have made third.
Darn. Zambro looks good tonight except for the beaning.
2008-05-28 18:00:06
219.   fanerman
Bison takes one for the team! Ron Stilanovich would be proud.
2008-05-28 18:00:16
220.   Linkmeister
212 As far as the Dodgers games go, yes. I don't know about the others. Five or ten years ago when FSN was first on Oceanic Cable we used to see a variety of West Coast teams, but for the past few years it's been Angels on 20 (226) and Dodgers on 31 (228).
2008-05-28 18:00:20
221.   fanerman
219 Against Carlos Zambrano no less.
2008-05-28 18:00:53
222.   LoneStar7
why is blake even thinking about that pitch...
2008-05-28 18:01:21
223.   Vaudeville Villain
178

I like Walton, too. I hope maybe his inclusion was an ironic reference to his crazed hyperbole.

I can imagine him saying something like:
"Bill Walton is one of the top ten worst sportscasters in the history of western civilization!"

I always liked his Doug Christie fanatacism.

"Doug Christie...What skill! What grace!" Or something to that effect. Guy is hilarious.

2008-05-28 18:02:27
224.   bhsportsguy
220 But then, you probably don't care if the Giants are playing on ESPN. :)

OPS goes up, nice going Blake.

2008-05-28 18:02:47
225.   MMSMikey
c'mon hu, a lousy single is all we need.
2008-05-28 18:02:50
226.   fanerman
223 The quote Maxim supplied was: "When I see Boris Diaw, I think of Beethoven and the age of Romanticism."

How can you not like that?

2008-05-28 18:03:00
227.   LoneStar7
wow thats incredible boys and girls, but fortunately for carlos, senior Hu is up to bat
2008-05-28 18:03:07
228.   fanerman
Woot. Come on Hu.
2008-05-28 18:03:10
229.   emiller
Bob Brenly is obsessed with picking Matty off, every time he's been on this series he says he "daydreams" and is easily picked off. Just said should break out their good first to third move to get out of the inning.
2008-05-28 18:03:20
230.   bhsportsguy
That's the first run they have scored with the bases loaded in a while.
2008-05-28 18:03:34
231.   nick
with Hu I'd leave the take sign on til strike 2...
2008-05-28 18:04:31
232.   Andrew Shimmin
I don't care about basketball, but I can't stand listening to Bill Walton. Part of that is the way he sounds: like his tongue weighs six pounds. But I also find him overbearing and smarmy.
2008-05-28 18:04:33
233.   bhsportsguy
I can't believe he went 3-2 on Hu.
2008-05-28 18:04:47
234.   Indiana Jon
178 223 You guys are kidding about liking Walton, right? I would rather listen to Morgan.
2008-05-28 18:05:01
235.   MMSMikey
c'mon, you gotta take a better swing than that, you know you are going to get a fastball right down the middle right there. ugh. 1 run is not going to win this game.
2008-05-28 18:05:28
236.   bhsportsguy
232 So Arizona is taking a page from the Dodgers in terms of putting PVLs on the DL.
2008-05-28 18:06:17
237.   Andrew Shimmin
226- Well, you could pick the nit that he wasn't really a Romantic composer.
2008-05-28 18:07:11
238.   bhsportsguy
Mr. Hu:

We know that some posters have expressed doubt in your hitting abilities (lack of walks and LD %). But you don't have to buy into that analysis my friend, just forget it and swing away.

Your pal,

BH

2008-05-28 18:07:36
239.   fanerman
234 Walton may be a joke but he doesn't take himself seriously. There's no pretension with him. Who else would compare Dwight Howard to Michelangelo's David?

Morgan can be a joke but he's dead serious.

2008-05-28 18:07:51
240.   Vaudeville Villain
One last Walton-ism before I go back to work:

"The added muscle and bulk from pushing that steel and the natural maturation process now enables this grandmaster to regularly accomplish the unimaginable without dragging around excessive bulk and baggage. Most top players get to the point where they truly believe that anything is possible. Most are also governed by gravity, the laws of physics and self-regulating mental control mechanisms. Kobe has left all these behind. The extra strength and stamina have made him a superior 3-point shooter, a most dominant defender and arguably the game's top rebounder."

Awesome.

2008-05-28 18:08:14
241.   LoneStar7
234 I love hearing walton talk about UCLA, his days ther, and his love and respect for wooden. The guy is passionate, loves his school, his life, and his proffesion. Maybe I'm just saying this because I'm a UCLA fan, but I quite like him. But only to give input, not commentate a game.
2008-05-28 18:08:48
242.   fanerman
237 Walton may have intended that the two went together, but that sentence doesn't necessarily imply it.
2008-05-28 18:09:39
243.   Indiana Jon
239 That's why I find it hilarious to listen to Morgan, but I just feel like Walton should talk about games in his own living room. It seems like Walton never talks about basketball.
2008-05-28 18:10:34
244.   Andrew Shimmin
241- Don't you find it a little creepy, the way he talks about Wooden? A little Schrutey, even.
2008-05-28 18:12:27
245.   Indiana Jon
244 I don't think he has much else to talk about. He's talked about Wooden for 250 straight games now.
2008-05-28 18:12:39
246.   Andrew Shimmin
By the way, I'm not talking to BH until he retracts his calumny against Eric Byrnes. Calling him PVL is like calling Jenna Fischer middle-aged.
2008-05-28 18:13:05
247.   bhsportsguy
Last year I attended a screening of the HBO sports documentary on UCLA Basketball and John Wooden at the Bruin Theater in Westwood.

Coach Wooden and several of his former players including Walton were there.

I can't even remember if he spoke at the event but he was on the documentary and the respect and love he has for Wooden is readily apparent.

He also has stated that his most disappointing basketball experience (and Wooden's too) was not winning the 1974 NCAA championship and completing a 90-0 record.

2008-05-28 18:14:42
248.   LoneStar7
244 No, I think Bill truly loves him like a father, and if theres anyone that deserves that kind of respect and admiration its Coach.
2008-05-28 18:14:50
249.   fanerman
245 I'm guessing you didn't hear him at the FIBA Summer games last summer?
2008-05-28 18:15:31
250.   bhsportsguy
246 You mean PVL cannot mean something nice.

I only meant it in the best light but I will retract it. Okay Eric Byrnes tweaks his hammy right when ST begins, plays with for almost two months and waits until both hamstrings are hurt before going on the DL.

That is an accurate representation of what happened isn't it.

Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2008-05-28 18:16:02
251.   bhsportsguy
246 In John Adams time, she would be.
2008-05-28 18:16:20
252.   LoneStar7
D lowe is very quietly being very effective.
2008-05-28 18:16:39
253.   KG16
The problem with Walton is that he use to stutter. Now he doesn't. He's just making up for lost time.
2008-05-28 18:17:13
254.   Doctor
Is InaneSutcliffequotes.com available?

Im going to enter "the league has solved Matt Kemp" and "Kent isn't HOF worthy" in for tonight, and ive only seen 2 innings.

2008-05-28 18:20:01
255.   Andrew Shimmin
250- La la la la la; I'm not listening. . .
2008-05-28 18:21:27
256.   bhsportsguy
255 All right, I'm sorry, I can't drive home with this going on.

I will refrain from ever using PVL with any Arizona Diamondback without expressed permission from Andrew Shimmin.

2008-05-28 18:21:39
257.   Bob Timmermann
Chatsworth will play Narbonne Saturday afternoon at Dodger Stadium for the LA City High School Baseball Championship.

If Narbonne wins, I'm buying a Juan Pierre jersey!

2008-05-28 18:22:30
258.   bhsportsguy
257 Its doubtful Logan White will be present like he was last year when 2 first round picks appeared at that game.
2008-05-28 18:22:45
259.   KG16
I've always been confused as to why a hitter gets credit for an RBI when he walks with the bases loaded. A walk is not an at bat, but rather a plate appearance. Since he walked, he did not bat the ball.

Why, yes, my brain in fried, why do you ask?

2008-05-28 18:23:03
260.   Vishal
the espn guys were talking about jeff kent, and they seemed to think he's not HOF-worthy. maybe he's not a slam-dunk, but i think kent has a pretty solid case. thoughts?
2008-05-28 18:23:21
261.   Indiana Jon
254 I'm blacked out from ESPN and Sutcliffe tonight. I guess I picked a good night to black out.
2008-05-28 18:23:34
262.   Andrew Shimmin
Squee! A perfunctory, and begrudging apology--the sweetest kind!

I'm afraid, though, that I've now lost all respect for you. You gave in, just like that? To an especially (even for me) childish demand? Pretty sad.

2008-05-28 18:23:39
263.   bhsportsguy
259 Think of it as an accounting procedurre.
2008-05-28 18:23:44
264.   Bob Timmermann
Anybody wish to take a guess at who the greatest Narbonne High baseball player was?

He's not active.

And he wasn't very good in the majors.

2008-05-28 18:23:53
265.   Vishal
259 yes, technically it's not "batted" in. but it scored because of the batter.
2008-05-28 18:24:14
266.   LoneStar7
oh great catch juan, of course steiner is a little over excited about the two hes made tonight, but a very good catch nonetheless...charlie makes sure to add "hes a completely different player out there this year"
2008-05-28 18:24:37
267.   natepurcell
from last thread

Canuck and Nate:Jim Callis said in a Baseball America premium content article that scouts are not high on Aaron Hicks bat so he would view him as a pitcher instead of a potential two-way player.

That's what Ive been saying all along. If we were to go outfielder, I like Collier a lot. I am warming up to Melville again. Although my dream is that Hosmer drops and Dodgers finally act like a big market team.
With the looming ASG bid, doesn't look like it will happen though...Penny pinch! Penny Pinch!

2008-05-28 18:24:56
268.   Indiana Jon
260 Kent is in easy, even with his attitude.
2008-05-28 18:25:26
269.   Bob Timmermann
259
And yet you don't get an RBI when a run scores when you ground into a double play. And you don't get an RBI if you reach on an error if the official scorer doesn't think that the run would have scored without the error.

I can keep coming up with exceptions until you start weeping blood from your eyes.

2008-05-28 18:26:34
270.   LoneStar7
wonderful pitching there, good stuff
2008-05-28 18:26:59
271.   natepurcell
Does anyone know what happened to Bryan Morris? He hasn't pitched in over 2 weeks.
2008-05-28 18:27:27
272.   Andrew Shimmin
I can keep coming up with exceptions until you start weeping blood from your eyes.

When they passed out superpowers, Bob was at the back of the line. But he still did better than Aquaman.

2008-05-28 18:29:02
273.   bhsportsguy
267 What about Zach Collier?
2008-05-28 18:29:03
274.   max power
255 Congrats on (nearly) legendary status. Toaster Object #999,999
2008-05-28 18:31:49
275.   natepurcell
What about Zach Collier?

I like Collier's bat, I wonder if he can handle CF though.

2008-05-28 18:32:29
276.   Tom Meagher
The game so far makes me want to point something out. For the record, the Dodgers have not had a bad season with runners in scoring position. It's when having a runner on first that they've really scuffled.

The following is not park-adjusted:

Overall: .269/.340/.387, .321 wOBA, .156 $K, .109 $BB, .023 $HR, .307 $H, .0075 IBB/PA, .0109 SH/PA
League: .261/.330/.411, .325, .177/.114/.035/.297, .0075/.0109
NoneOn: .279/.339/.414, .332, .149/.097/.025/.316, 0/0
League: .257/.323/.410, .322, .179/.107/.036/.295, 0/0
1,x,x__: .248/.292/.337, .281, .160/.069/.019/.285, 0/.0446
League: .274/.336/.436, .338, .164/.102/.041/.305, 0/.0358
RISP__: .264/.372/.366, .324, .168/.158/.021/.303, .0279/.0157
League: .260/.354/.395, .322, .179/.136/.027/.297, .0273/.0163
1,y,y__: .293/.341/.423, .331, .194/.095/.028/.341, .0039/.0235
League: .259/.322/.394, .312, .183/.117/.026/.294, .0009/.0203
x,y,y__: .238/.397/.313, .319, .147/.207/.015/.270, .0472/.0094
League: .260/.383/.395, .331, .176/.155/.027/.299, .0512/.0126

So overall they strike out less than the league and have more hits per ball in play and fewer HR. The lack of power is enough to make them below average. With the bases empty, they're getting a lot of hits and are above average. With a runner on first only (1,x,x above), they have been horrible, striking out as much as the league but having a low BABIP, very low walks, and an extreme lack of power. They have also wasted an inordinate number of outs on sacrifice hits.

With runners in scoring position overall, they are basically average. While their edge in K's and BABIP is a tad less than it is overall, they have an above average walk rate that's counterbalanced by a lack of power. Broken down by whether first base is open or not (1,y,y = 2-3 runners on, one on first; x,y,y = 1-2 runners on, none on first), we see that they've been pretty good with first base not open. They're strike zone control hasn't been good, but they've had decent power and a great BABIP. With first base open, they've been quite willing to close it by taking a walk but have not been effective in getting hits, much less extra base hits.

Keep in mind that none of this is at all predictive analysis. I see no reason to think the Dodgers will be better or worse at situational hitting than any other team, and whatever they have done so far is not where the answer would lie if indeed they do have unusual skill.

2008-05-28 18:32:57
277.   bhsportsguy
275 Not enough offense for a corner (which is where BA ultimately projects him).
2008-05-28 18:35:44
278.   Andrew Shimmin
274- Wow. How terribly unfortunate to have that immortalized.
2008-05-28 18:36:19
279.   natepurcell
277

That's true. That's why I really hope Hosmer drops and the Dodgers flex some financial muscle. His bat plays anywhere and he is athletic enough for a corner spot; especially with that rocket arm.

2008-05-28 18:39:33
280.   LoneStar7
whats D-lowes pitch count right now?
2008-05-28 18:40:29
281.   sporky
77. 49 strikes, 28 balls.
2008-05-28 18:40:59
282.   LoneStar7
280 ah 77...thats the second time i've asked right before the update on t.v. lol
2008-05-28 18:41:33
283.   kguy
280 79?
2008-05-28 18:42:08
284.   sporky
267 Do they really punish teams like that for going over-slot?
2008-05-28 18:42:49
285.   kguy
Oops my bad math. Wow- what an efficient Lowe tonight.
2008-05-28 18:43:41
286.   LoneStar7
there we go a break for bison, its up to the solution before we get the black hole
2008-05-28 18:44:18
287.   sporky
Zambrano looks like an anime villain in his Gameday photo.
2008-05-28 18:47:59
288.   Bob Hendley
I'd almost prefer that the Bison didn't get on base, just so I wouldn't have to hear this guy go into his Kemp routine. My ears are bleeding!
2008-05-28 18:49:39
289.   emiller
288 I assume you're talking about Brenly, he's driving me crazy too.
2008-05-28 18:49:40
290.   emiller
288 I assume you're talking about Brenly, he's driving me crazy too.
2008-05-28 18:49:51
291.   Bob Timmermann
288
I can only make eyes bleed.
2008-05-28 18:52:45
292.   LoneStar7
I'm so sick of this black hole, id rather Joe just disperse it through the line up. I don't care if it doesnt make sense, I've never had less confidence in a back half through top of an order.
2008-05-28 18:53:28
293.   D4P
This could be the first game we win while scoring 2 or fewer runs.
2008-05-28 18:54:01
294.   LoneStar7
293 last time we went down right after someone mentioned that lol
2008-05-28 18:54:31
295.   natepurcell
293

stop saying that.

2008-05-28 18:55:32
296.   Bob Timmermann
I think we need to go to Wrigley Field and leave trash cans outside the WGN broadcast booth.
2008-05-28 18:56:27
297.   CanuckDodger
About the draft and Aaron Hicks, it isn't true that all scouts condemn his bat; some appear to be more optimistic than others that he will hit as a pro. The question is, what do the Dodgers' scouts think? If the Dodgers' scouts really believe in the bat, and Hicks is there for the taking at #15, I can't see any justification for not taking him. However, if Logan and his people don't like his bat, fine, skip over him and take Melville, if Melville is still available.
2008-05-28 18:56:49
298.   Tom Meagher
Why does Rick Sutcliffe get to assert that Lowe's command is the best tonight it's been all season? How many of his starts could he have watched?
2008-05-28 18:56:54
299.   Bob Timmermann
Geovany Soto is on my fantasy team!
2008-05-28 18:57:56
300.   sporky
Whee!
Show/Hide Comments 301-350
2008-05-28 18:58:06
301.   Bob Timmermann
Mark DeRosa is not on my fantasy team!
2008-05-28 18:59:11
302.   Uncle Miltie
I think sometimes we take James Loney's defense for granted.

What a difference from Fred McGriff, Jason Phillips, Eric Karros, etc.

2008-05-28 18:59:21
303.   Bob Timmermann
For the record, I have a fantasy league and I'm losing to two 11-year olds. And a 7-year old is keeping pace with me.

And the last time I played fantasy baseball, I quit the league over a dispute over who picked up hot rookie pitcher Cal Eldred.

2008-05-28 19:01:38
304.   natepurcell
297

Hosmer! Hosmer! Hosmer!

2008-05-28 19:02:31
305.   D4P
I don't care about Manny Ramirez hitting 500 HRs.
2008-05-28 19:03:24
306.   PDH5204
276 That's the problem with the numbers, both old and new. Juan is getting the SAC when we and he are fairly certain he was trying to get a hit.

It might otherwise be that, to a certain extent, likely not measurable, that the pitcher "bears down" with a runner on 1st. The disparity re 1st and bases-full is probably owing to the fact that one guy on first does not mean an ineffective pitcher, but the bases full might tend to indicate that fact, at least for this inning.

2008-05-28 19:03:26
307.   Bob Timmermann
Nothing but goose eggs in Milwaukee (there are hits) in the epic matchup of Atlanta's Jo-Jo Reyes and Milwaukee's Jeff Suppan.
2008-05-28 19:04:00
308.   Andrew Shimmin
305- Because he's rich, because you think he used PEDs, or because 500 is an arbitrary number to care about?
2008-05-28 19:04:14
309.   sporky
The Dodgers have the 2nd fewest extra base hits in the majors.
2008-05-28 19:05:37
310.   D4P
Does anyone know if goose eggs really look more like zeros than all other types of eggs...?
2008-05-28 19:06:33
311.   natepurcell
308

D4P does hate rich people.

Actually, I think he's just jealous they are rich for basically not doing anything while he slaves away at his academia.

2008-05-28 19:07:11
312.   Gen3Blue
I know it's frustrating. But the hitting will come around, as teams like the snakes and rocks have eventually found playing their young guys out of nessecity. And our starting depth, ranked in my opinion for effectiveness has Kershaw, Bills, Kou, Kuroda, Lowe, Penny, and Perhaps Scmidt.
Not too shabby. Tonight looks bad for us, but going foward looks real good to me.
2008-05-28 19:07:13
313.   thinkblue88
come on loney,,
2008-05-28 19:07:45
314.   Bob Timmermann
310
Look at the picture sideways and judge:
http://tinyurl.com/aj4ej
2008-05-28 19:09:13
315.   Uncle Miltie
Andre Ethier has turned into an ideal #2 hitter. I noticed that he's been more patient at the plate this year. Sure enough, the numbers back up my claim. His BB/PA is down slightly (.091 last year, .086 this year) but that includes 12 IBB from last year, compared to 0 this year. Where there has really been a marked improvement is in P/PA (3.66 last year, 4.13 this year).

Wow, that was a bad error.

2008-05-28 19:09:14
316.   Bob Timmermann
That play looked fraught with peril for Theriot.
2008-05-28 19:09:17
317.   thinkblue88
woo!! finally, a break for loney
2008-05-28 19:09:34
318.   LoneStar7
well now its up to bison.
2008-05-28 19:10:16
319.   Gen3Blue
Cubbies keep leaving their starters in a bit too long. Oh man, Maury and a dozen others would have scored on that.
2008-05-28 19:10:24
320.   LoneStar7
now would be the greatest time for bison to get a hit after that..
2008-05-28 19:11:52
321.   LoneStar7
man kemp coulda hit that 0-2 pitch
2008-05-28 19:12:00
322.   thinkblue88
talk about nerveracking
2008-05-28 19:12:59
323.   Alex41592
Million Dollar Pitch
2008-05-28 19:13:05
324.   dontraiseplz
man I hating watching this sport sometimes... its like theres a cap at 1 run for us.
2008-05-28 19:13:14
325.   thinkblue88
wow, gotta give it up to zambrano there, dude can pitch.
2008-05-28 19:13:19
326.   Uncle Miltie
That looked like a ball....

I knew that Sutcliffe would bring up momentum if the Cubs got out of the inning.

2008-05-28 19:13:33
327.   CanuckDodger
304 -- You would have to come up with the money for Hosmer's bonus, because McCourt sure wouldn't.:)
2008-05-28 19:13:44
328.   Kevin P
we look really good at the plate.
2008-05-28 19:14:46
329.   Uncle Miltie
And by ball, I mean that pitch would not have been called a strike for Chad Billingsley.
2008-05-28 19:15:16
330.   Eric Stephen
323
Hopefully the Cubs this will have the same depressing end as Million Dollar Baby tonight.
2008-05-28 19:15:19
331.   LoneStar7
Jb better man up, because no one in that batting order is
2008-05-28 19:19:26
332.   D4P
This is gonna be so exciting if Manny hits a HR.

Not really.

2008-05-28 19:20:28
333.   jujibee
Anyyone know the status of Elbert or Withrow? I thought I'd ask seeing as 2 of our prospect followers who seem to get information that I can't are both on tonight.
2008-05-28 19:21:43
334.   MSarg29
Broxton looked like himself that inning.
2008-05-28 19:22:12
335.   mwhite06
264
Milton Bradley?
2008-05-28 19:22:18
336.   LoneStar7
thats pretty much the definition of "manning up"
2008-05-28 19:22:19
337.   Linkmeister
Well, that was about as good as one can do, Bull.
2008-05-28 19:22:21
338.   Woden325
330 Speaking of depressing, I just finished listening to the Rockies game. At this point, I think Mark TR Donohue is being optimistic about the Rockies.
At least this is an interesting game.
2008-05-28 19:23:29
339.   Woden325
KABC: yes, when I think of fine wine, I think of Tommy Lasorda.
2008-05-28 19:24:31
340.   D4P
Broxton looks to be on his way to mouth cancer.
2008-05-28 19:25:28
341.   CanuckDodger
333 -- Elbert was throwing well, and hard, a few weeks back, and then he had what was a described as a "set back," a bit of arm pain, so that delayed the start of his season, but he is expected to be pitching in games before too much longer. Withrow, it appears, will pitch in Ogden when the Pioneer League gets going in the latter part of June.
2008-05-28 19:26:37
342.   sporky
Mark might get on base!
2008-05-28 19:27:20
343.   Woden325
250 Missed it by that much!
2008-05-28 19:28:15
344.   sporky
342 And he did!
2008-05-28 19:28:50
345.   Tom Meagher
306 I don't understand what your point is at all. If too many of Juan Pierre's bunts go down as SH, that means he is making outs, and the reason the bunt is a good strategy is because it can yield hits; I didn't make any comment about the team's bunting strategy, but pointed out they have had a higher number of outs from SH. I hardly see how Pierre, who has 3 SH, needs to be singled out here.

I'm not clear what you are talking about in the second paragraph. Pitchers do "bear down" situationally, which is why I gave the league averages. With first base empty and runners on 2nd and/or 3rd, pitchers are more likely to give up a walk and less likely to give up a hit.

2008-05-28 19:29:42
346.   jujibee
341. June? Why the long break? He seemed to have thrown well enough last year to be pitching in an earlier league this year. Good/bad news with Elbert. Hopefully he can get it going again a la 2006.
2008-05-28 19:30:51
347.   LoneStar7
338 speaking of depressing, a Hu at bat followed by the rare occasion of Sweeney getting on base, then the realization that Pierre was on deck..
2008-05-28 19:31:08
348.   dzzrtRatt
Okay Sammy, let's party like it's 2003!
2008-05-28 19:32:55
349.   LoneStar7
well its sammy time
2008-05-28 19:33:11
350.   Bob Timmermann
There's already been one 1-0 game in the majors tonight. The Brewers eked one out against the Braves on a 2-out RBI triple by Ricky Weeks in the bottom of the 8th.
Show/Hide Comments 351-400
2008-05-28 19:33:29
351.   nick
it'd be fitting for the Dodgers to finally win one of these in a game without an extra base hit....
2008-05-28 19:33:40
352.   Woden325
347 Ah, yes, I remember the dreaded JP at-bats. But at least he's ... um ... quick?
2008-05-28 19:34:09
353.   sporky
Ken Gurnick is a little late to the party:

>>Torre thinking ahead with Kent out

DeWitt could take turn at second as veteran battles tight back

Although Andy LaRoche is being tested all over the infield at Triple-A Las Vegas, DeWitt has a full Minor League season at second base and said he would have no problem returning to the position if the situation arose and LaRoche returned to play third base.<<

2008-05-28 19:36:50
354.   LoneStar7
351 thats almost like the " less than 2 runs scored" comment, no jinxing please!
2008-05-28 19:38:06
355.   Icaros
Although Andy LaRoche is being tested all over the infield at Triple-A Las Vegas, DeWitt has a full Minor League season at second base and said he would have no problem returning to the position if the situation arose and LaRoche returned to play third base.

Perfect. Do it now, and for the rest of the season, everyday.

2008-05-28 19:39:27
356.   Bob Timmermann
Marlins lead the Mets 6-5 in the 12th after an Alfredo Amezaga homer.
2008-05-28 19:40:13
357.   Uncle Miltie
Boomer must not be watching the game...that ball was clearly going foul.

Boomer=Charley Steiner

2008-05-28 19:40:16
358.   Bob Hendley
That was Loneyesque.
2008-05-28 19:41:06
359.   dzzrtRatt
Monday morning quarterback's thought: Why take out Broxton? He was smokin', and didn't throw that many pitches.

Nonetheless, I believe Sammy will get us out of this with a win. I believe, I believe, I believe...

2008-05-28 19:43:30
360.   Bob Timmermann
You know what Saito should try to do now?

Pick off Matt Kemp!

2008-05-28 19:44:27
361.   Andrew Shimmin
357- Steiner steinered himself on that foul ball, too.
2008-05-28 19:44:42
362.   dzzrtRatt
Oh my.
2008-05-28 19:45:05
363.   Bob Hendley
{ears begin seeping blood}
2008-05-28 19:45:14
364.   Indiana Jon
271 No idea. Mattingly hasn't played in over a week either. Any word on that?
2008-05-28 19:45:16
365.   Uncle Miltie
Fukudome scares me....a guy with great plate discipline against a guy struggling with his command.
2008-05-28 19:45:41
366.   RELX
Saito looks terrible.
2008-05-28 19:46:31
367.   D4P
Nice snag by Loney, but...
2008-05-28 19:46:34
368.   Andrew Shimmin
Boo!
2008-05-28 19:46:40
369.   Uncle Miltie
Oh no :(

Loney is a stud though..probably game over.

2008-05-28 19:46:53
370.   Woden325
Uh oh.
2008-05-28 19:47:22
371.   Indiana Jon
I hope Bob's fantasy team struggles in this at bat.
2008-05-28 19:47:29
372.   Eric Stephen
We need a Beimelian pitch here.
2008-05-28 19:47:39
373.   Bob Timmermann
Texeira would have caught the ball cleanly, ran to first and then run down the line and beaten Theriot to a pulp.
2008-05-28 19:47:40
374.   D4P
What: no "neighborhood play" at first...?
2008-05-28 19:47:54
375.   Eric Stephen
I don't want a Pierre t-shirt!
2008-05-28 19:48:15
376.   D4P
Sutcliffe cares a lot more than I do about Lowe getting the win.
2008-05-28 19:48:30
377.   Disabled List
Listening to that dumb "FUK-u-DO-me!" chant, it occurs to me that if the Cubs were to ever win the World Series, the Cubs fans would even surpass the Red Sox and Yankees fans on the obnoxiousness scale.
2008-05-28 19:48:36
378.   Icaros
Berman is really irritating.
2008-05-28 19:48:44
379.   Uncle Miltie
Saito has no command. Some days you just don't have it.
2008-05-28 19:48:44
380.   dzzrtRatt
What, is he allergic to the strike zone in Chicago?
2008-05-28 19:49:04
381.   Andrew Shimmin
375- You only said you'd buy it, you didn't say you'd keep it. You can send it to the same place they send the t-shirts with the wrong team winning the Superbowl.
2008-05-28 19:49:45
382.   LoneStar7
373 thank you for that bit of humor, that may have saved me from throwing this laptop out my window
2008-05-28 19:49:51
383.   Bob Hendley
Bob should remove himself from making comments at this stage.
2008-05-28 19:50:03
384.   Bob Timmermann
377
The Cubs have won the World Series.

Twice!

We'd survive a Cubs World Series win.

2008-05-28 19:50:31
385.   Eric Stephen
Kemp should have pulled a Ferguson on that one. :)
2008-05-28 19:50:39
386.   Icaros
Berman is so happy right now. He's a Giant lover.
2008-05-28 19:50:41
387.   Woden325
377 Perish the thought.
2008-05-28 19:50:44
388.   dzzrtRatt
Well...if you only score one run, you've got no margin for error. Crap.
2008-05-28 19:50:59
389.   Bob Timmermann
Geovany ...

(shot rings out and body slumps over)

2008-05-28 19:51:37
390.   D4P
Berman is so happy right now. He's a Giant lover

He also loves the 49ers.

2008-05-28 19:51:46
391.   Bob Hendley
Somewhere a 7 year old weeps.
2008-05-28 19:52:05
392.   LoneStar7
377 correct, we made the mistake of believing boston was full of lovable losers..when they were in fact only losers, and abnoxious when they win...same with chicago
2008-05-28 19:52:21
393.   dzzrtRatt
That was a funny image of the Dodger relievers warming up. They looked like blue flamingos.
2008-05-28 19:52:42
394.   fanerman
It's okay. Saito will get out of it. The Dodgers will score in the 10th. Broxton will save it.
2008-05-28 19:53:10
395.   fanerman
Okay nevermind. I just got home.
2008-05-28 19:53:11
396.   JT Dutch
... This has got to be Saito's last batter, whether he gets him or not.
2008-05-28 19:53:13
397.   Woden325
389 Buck up, little camper, suicide is never the answer!
2008-05-28 19:53:26
398.   MMSMikey
i hope derosa ends it now instead of the misery of losing in extra innings.
2008-05-28 19:53:31
399.   D4P
Broxton will save it

...and then the Cubs will protest the game.

2008-05-28 19:53:56
400.   Bob Timmermann
397
It was attempted murder!
Show/Hide Comments 401-450
2008-05-28 19:54:34
401.   dzzrtRatt
It's crazy enough, it just might work.
2008-05-28 19:54:40
402.   Woden325
400 Oh, well that's ok, then.
2008-05-28 19:54:43
403.   Bob Timmermann
The Mets rallied to win on a 2-run double by the Hated Fernando Tatis.
2008-05-28 19:55:25
404.   Uncle Miltie
And the Penn degree will only get you so far...
2008-05-28 19:55:34
405.   fanerman
I said nevermind =(.
2008-05-28 19:57:14
406.   68elcamino427
I wonder if DeWitt could play second and LaRoche could play third?
2008-05-28 19:57:26
407.   NorCal-Dodger
Brox with a Bs last night, Saito with a BS tonight...all this and we have had scored only 3 runs...in 3 games! What could've been.
2008-05-28 19:57:34
408.   Alex41592
Get Kuo up
2008-05-28 19:57:38
409.   LoneStar7
I wish they had shown that replay of loney's stop at least once, rather than sammy missing the bag 4 times : (
2008-05-28 19:57:56
410.   Linkmeister
Rats. Off to cook dinner.
2008-05-28 19:59:32
411.   NorCal-Dodger
Gnats beating the Snakes 2-0 in the 5th...and now we are rooting for the oversized Ogres in orange and black.
2008-05-28 20:00:06
412.   fanerman
Andre Ethier bunting?
2008-05-28 20:00:24
413.   Uncle Miltie
Why would you have Ethier bunt?
2008-05-28 20:01:17
414.   D4P
Martin is hitting .344 in May, but only OPSing 788.
2008-05-28 20:01:27
415.   emiller
It's really hard to believe the way this team has been playing that they are still just 3.5 games behind AZ. It can only get better, right??
2008-05-28 20:02:09
416.   Woden325
I still can't wrap my mind around the fact that Tampa Bay has the best record in the majors.
2008-05-28 20:02:11
417.   LoneStar7
413 I would like to see him keep bunting
2008-05-28 20:02:26
418.   LoneStar7
417 and thats why
2008-05-28 20:02:34
419.   fanerman
414 0 HR's will do that for you.
2008-05-28 20:02:35
420.   Bob Hendley
410 - Sounds hummy.
2008-05-28 20:03:23
421.   dzzrtRatt
Here's our entire offense.
2008-05-28 20:05:29
422.   JT Dutch
414

... This entire team looks as if they're spending their idle hours studying the Walt Weiss guide to hitting.

2008-05-28 20:06:38
423.   Bob Hendley
He's do! (in honor of Bluebleeder)
2008-05-28 20:07:15
424.   LoneStar7
that was the pitch to hit...dang
2008-05-28 20:08:15
425.   LoneStar7
and then a miss
2008-05-28 20:08:39
426.   arborial
so what happened when Fukudome went to second after the sac fly? ESPN Gamecast said "Fielder's indifference".
2008-05-28 20:09:21
427.   ucladodger
Right now this team is painful to watch on offense. 0 extra base hits in 3 games at Wrigley Field? Thats pretty sad.
2008-05-28 20:10:16
428.   Disabled List
The Dodgers have looked like world-beaters against below-average teams this year, and overmatched against better-than-average teams.

Which, I guess, makes the Dodgers pretty average.

2008-05-28 20:10:34
429.   Uncle Miltie
No Kuo?
2008-05-28 20:10:37
430.   Andrew Shimmin
Nothing could possiblie go wrong, here.
2008-05-28 20:11:44
431.   NorCal-Dodger
Saving Kuo for the Mets?
2008-05-28 20:11:51
432.   Eric Stephen
429
Saving him for all four games against the Mets, so he can go something like 10 IP, 29 K (one popup).
2008-05-28 20:11:53
433.   Andrew Shimmin
Hooray! I haven't heard Lyons say LF was the hardest OF position yet, this year. It's comforting.
2008-05-28 20:11:54
434.   Bob Timmermann
428
The Dodgers swept the Marlins, who have been in first place for much of the year.
2008-05-28 20:12:34
435.   arborial
why do you put in the guy who gives up the most home runs in a situation in which a home run wins the game?
2008-05-28 20:12:34
436.   sporky
When Kansas City gets an XBH, they'll be tied with the Dodgers for fewest extra base hits in the majors.
2008-05-28 20:12:50
437.   Bob Timmermann
430
I'll get the disposable cameras with flashes!
2008-05-28 20:13:08
438.   Eric Stephen
430
Berman's Pink Floyd reference was horriblie unfunny.
2008-05-28 20:13:36
439.   Disabled List
434 Except for them. And I'm still not sold on the Marlins being above-average, really.
2008-05-28 20:14:38
440.   fanerman
439 Why? Because they got swept by us?
2008-05-28 20:14:46
441.   Bob Timmermann
436
The Royals have two XBH tonights. And have scored EIGHT runs.

And are losing!

2008-05-28 20:14:48
442.   JT Dutch
... Wow. A double. Wish the Dodgers could do something cool like that.
2008-05-28 20:15:14
443.   Eric Stephen
This kind of feels like the Odalis-Pujols extra inning game a few years back.
2008-05-28 20:15:26
444.   Disabled List
440 That's actually pretty good evidence for the prosecution.
2008-05-28 20:15:33
445.   LoneStar7
442 you can advance more than one base on a ball put in play?
2008-05-28 20:16:31
446.   Bob Timmermann
I will take issue with Steiner's contention that no one has left.

I would bet my life savings that somebody has left.

2008-05-28 20:16:31
447.   NorCal-Dodger
Giants -6 ...D-Bax- 0
2008-05-28 20:16:59
448.   ucladodger
great
2008-05-28 20:17:02
449.   Icaros
And Berman has an orgasm.
2008-05-28 20:17:12
450.   LoneStar7
I hate this God forsaken game...sometimes
Show/Hide Comments 451-500
2008-05-28 20:17:13
451.   JT Dutch
... Alright. Dodgers back to .500, where they belong.
2008-05-28 20:17:18
452.   Uncle Miltie
Berman is so original!
2008-05-28 20:17:48
453.   dzzrtRatt
Acceptance.
2008-05-28 20:18:16
454.   sporky
Eric! Time to get your shirt.
2008-05-28 20:18:26
455.   fanerman
Has Chan Ho's magic ran out?
2008-05-28 20:19:52
456.   Xeifrank
Abyss: 1 for 16 with 1 walk.
Rest: 6 for 19 with 3 walks.

This using Guo in only low leverage situations (mop up duty) is getting on my nerves a little bit.
vr, Xei

2008-05-28 20:20:04
457.   Bob Timmermann
449
I hear he fakes those.
2008-05-28 20:20:32
458.   Andrew Shimmin
I think we should let Eric off the hook. It was a throw away line--you're not really obligated to buy that shirt.

And I don't say that just because DeWitt is more than halfway to his 300th PA, without obviously collapsing. . .

2008-05-28 20:21:27
459.   Disabled List
The Dodgers really deserve a break one of these days... Actually, no they don't. This team gave millions of dollars to a manager and two lousy centerfielders. The Dodgers are getting what they deserve.

It's the fans that deserve a break. Sigh.

2008-05-28 20:22:27
460.   fanerman
My idea for Eric: a custom Pierre Lakers jersey.

Crossovers are going to be in, and Eric will lead the way!

2008-05-28 20:22:48
461.   sporky
If Kent's non-injury, Abreu's surgery and this series aren't enough to hasten Andy's callup, I don't know what will.
2008-05-28 20:22:55
462.   Indiana Jon
Dewitt is OPSing .469 in his last ten games, the team is struggling to score runs, and Tiffee is a waste of a roster spot. Can we please give Laroche his job back at third base?
2008-05-28 20:23:16
463.   Bob Hendley
Rats.
2008-05-28 20:23:29
464.   dzzrtRatt
They've got to be seriously considering hauling LaRoche's butt up to the majors. They can't buy extra base hits anywhere else. No one's going to trade them Ryan Braun or Dan Uggla.
2008-05-28 20:25:16
465.   Bob Timmermann
I'm still buying a Pierre jersey if Narbonne beats Chatsworth Saturday.

I'll let our out of town guests figure out where Narbonne is.

2008-05-28 20:26:18
466.   Disabled List
Did the Dodgers really get zero extra-base hits in this series? Wow.

Three games, 0 XBH, 3 runs scored, and 2 blown saves.

That is some impressive futility right there.

2008-05-28 20:27:26
467.   Andrew Shimmin
461- He still has to capture Cerberus and steal the Apples of the Hesperides, first.
2008-05-28 20:28:08
468.   sporky
At least this game didn't last long enough to completely obliterate our bullpen. Sigh.
2008-05-28 20:29:32
469.   Eric Stephen
454
The dirty laundry has been ordered.
2008-05-28 20:31:59
470.   Bob Timmermann
Since moving to L.A., the Dodgers longest stretch without an extra base hit is four games.

August 14-16, 1961, one game against the Cardinals and three against the Reds with a doubleheader at the end.

April 27-29, 1962, all against Pittsburgh at Dodger Stadium. And the Dodgers won two of those games.

The last three games of the 1965 regular season and the first game of the 1966 regular season.

The last Dodger team to go three games in a row without an extra base hit played in ...

....

.....

....

....

I'm warning you

....

.....

.....

....

You've been warned

.....

....

Still there?

....

....

1992

2008-05-28 20:32:45
471.   Eric Stephen
469
Alas, no Laker jersey. Here's what I ordered:

http://tinyurl.com/47hype

A complete waste of an MLB.com gift card.

2008-05-28 20:33:16
472.   Jon Weisman
I don't know if anyone's willing to tolerate a bright side, but the team ERA in this series was 1.98. And the starters have been cruising into the seventh inning or later every game for more than a week now.
2008-05-28 20:34:33
473.   Eric Stephen
472
Ahhhhhhh!!! The brightness burns!
2008-05-28 20:35:13
474.   Icaros
The bright side for me is that the Lakers are one win away from making the Finals.
2008-05-28 20:35:26
475.   Bob Timmermann
Lawler's Law in effect in Boston.
2008-05-28 20:36:33
476.   Bob Timmermann
Why in the world did the Celtics foul in that situation?

They had a power play!

2008-05-28 20:36:39
477.   Disabled List
472 A painful loss like tonight's really makes the glass seem half-empty.
2008-05-28 20:37:02
478.   68elcamino427
I suggest a bat bonfire in the parking lot, before the team gets on the bus.
2008-05-28 20:37:25
479.   ucladodger
The thing I've really noticed with this team is that they really don't hit the ball hard (big surprise, right?). Pierre rarely makes good, solid contact. Andre gets good wood on the ball, as does Russ. Loney and Kemp go through streaks and Matt gets his fair share of hits like the one he had tonight. But really, the problem is that when they do hit the ball hard, its just a little line drive over the shortstop or a one-hopper through the hole. Nothing in the air for extra bases. Obviously this isn't the most profound observation in the world, but it is just so frustrating watching this team. Constantly missing fastballs in hitters counts, never pulling the ball with power, and watching Hu punch a 3 hopper to second base for the 8th time in 3 days just kills me.
2008-05-28 20:37:49
480.   sporky
I predict Andy will be called up by the end of the month.
2008-05-28 20:39:33
481.   Icaros
480

You mean by this Saturday?

2008-05-28 20:40:30
482.   Indiana Jon
480 No, I say it's by the end of the week.
2008-05-28 20:41:12
483.   Jon Weisman
NPUT
2008-05-28 20:41:22
484.   Eric Stephen
480
It would probably take a Kent DL stay to make it happen, but I'll go along with that.

I won't commit to any t-shirts however.

2008-05-28 20:46:30
485.   KG16
466 - and yet the Cubs had 5 XBH, and managed to only score 8 runs in the same time. It also doesn't help that the Dodgers hit into 3 double plays today.

I'm still not worried about this team. I'm convinced it's going to click and these guys are going to get hot.

Also, it doesn't hurt that the D'backs have managed to lose 3 of 4; and looking at losing 4 of 5.

2008-05-28 20:53:53
486.   LoneStar7
what was the bet that prompted the bet of buying a juan pierre shirt?
2008-05-28 20:54:32
487.   JT Dutch
472

... The wind was blowing in at Wrigley Field. I would expect the pitchers to have a good ERA under those circumstances.

There is no "bright side" to this team. They've become the Fortune 500 of baseball -- the payroll's a fortune and they're playing .500. It's not even enjoyable to watch the team; they haven't been fun to watch since the season ending series against the Giants in 2006.

Instead of results, we get excuses. The team doesn't want to call up LaRoche because they don't want him to rot away on the bench, yet they are A-OK with letting Young rot away. This organization treats their diehard fans as if they are complete morons, and it's insulting. No offense, but "bright side" my posterior.

2008-05-28 20:56:27
488.   LoneStar7
from baseball tonight..."derrick lee pitched a heck of a game against a good hitting cub team"
2008-05-28 22:18:00
489.   bluesilv79
Zero extra basehits in the past 3 games?Kemp had 2 doubles yesterday. Did I miss something?

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