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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

First Injury of 2006 - Ethier
2006-03-07 17:00
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

Dodger outfield prospect Andre Ethier jammed his shoulder in a first-inning dive during the Dodgers' 3-1 exhibition victory over St. Louis today, according to The Associated Press. Dodger manager Grady Little had hope that the injury was not "very serious."

No immediate word yet on how Joel Guzman did in his left field debut, though we at least know from the boxscore he wasn't charged with any errors. I'd mention how some Dodgers did at the plate, but it's already making me uncomfortable that people are putting too much weight into exhibition statistics, particularly now when players are just getting loose.

Update: Guzman done did swell, writes Faran Fagen of MLB.com.

Guzman was tested in the first inning on a shallow fly ball, which he tracked down and caught one-handed with the sun in his eyes. Later in the game, he snared a line drive that sliced toward the left-field line with a backhand grab.

"You can't ask for too much tougher conditions," Dodgers manager Grady Little said. "The sun was right in his face, and the wind was blowing. And he handled all the plays he was supposed to."

Comments (258)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2006-03-07 17:15:24
1.   Bob Timmermann
Baez pitching now for Puerto Rico in the WBC.

Federico Baez that is.

2006-03-07 17:17:54
2.   bill cox
Serendipity time;usually I come to these proceedings so late in the thread that I can't get into the flow.Lo and behold here's an opportunity to get in on the ground floor with an asinine comment.
Uh....don't choke!
Actually I just want to sound the horn of James Freakin' Loney.My dream scenario:one of the hordes of fragile infielders goes down.Nomah moves to say third,Loney gets a callup and has a Rookie of the year season in helping the Dodgers deep into the post season.
Ethier is picking up where Bradley left off anyways.
2006-03-07 17:19:35
3.   Jeromy
Sorry to the hear news about Either. I hope that he will be o.k. I've jammed, separated, and dislocated my shoulder doing various things, and it isn't a fun feeling. I really need to stay off of ladders.
2006-03-07 17:39:43
4.   Robert Daeley
3 You aren't Mel Gibson in Lethal Weapon are you?
2006-03-07 18:00:58
5.   thinkblue0
someone on the official dodger board is saying Repko plays Gold Glove defense and has the best and most accurate arm in the MLB....oy
2006-03-07 18:44:20
6.   franklin
and the First "Truth Serum" Quote of 2006-

"I kind of get nervous if I don't give up any runs..." -- Jeff Weaver after allowing a pair of three-run homers in the first inning of an 11-3 loss to the San Francisco Giants. (source AP)

2006-03-07 19:13:43
7.   natepurcell
i hope ethier's shoulder isnt anything serious.
2006-03-07 19:32:55
8.   Steve
Project BROTheR meets the Dodger Injury Conversion Chart. Nothing good can come from this.
2006-03-07 19:41:36
9.   D4P
Speaking of the Dodger Injury Conversion Chart, the country club I worked at in undergrad (named Shadow Hills Country Club) used to host a tournament called the Shadow Hills Invitational Tournament.
2006-03-07 19:55:45
10.   scareduck
5 - Official Dodgers board? The cool kids left there years ago.
2006-03-07 19:56:32
11.   scareduck
8 - translation of BROTheR?
2006-03-07 19:59:02
12.   Vishal
i think it's Boot-Repko-Off-The-Roster?
2006-03-07 20:01:47
13.   natepurcell
which probably wont happen.
2006-03-07 20:02:45
14.   natepurcell
laroche and loney are having the best spring trainings so far.

.................. and repko.

2006-03-07 20:12:17
15.   King of the Hobos
Don't forget Sele. Sele and Repko look like they're becoming Erickson and...Repko (Romano if you like). That can't be good for the roster.
2006-03-07 20:13:01
16.   Andrew Shimmin
The only good that can come from Repko's spring is that maybe he'll be packaged with Choi for a OF who isn't trash. Colletti seems to like trading two players at once.
2006-03-07 20:16:34
17.   natepurcell
sele isnt going to make the roster no matter how good he pitches.
2006-03-07 20:19:32
18.   Blu2
16 Do the Giants have an old outfielder they can hornswogle Ned into trading for? (Yeah, I know, don't end a sentence with a preposition...)
2006-03-07 20:21:05
19.   Steve
We here who run Project BROTheR (Dr. Steve and his evil henchman, Mini-Steve) remember last year's spring training, and will wait for more than nine at-bats to send back the nuclear reactor parts.
2006-03-07 20:22:01
20.   natepurcell
how exciting is this lineup? Las vegas DT roadtrip!

2006 las vegas 51s

C russ martin
cf andre ethier
3b andy laroche
rf joel guzman
1b james loney
lf delwyn young
2b willy aybar
ss ramon martinez II

2006-03-07 20:26:33
21.   Icaros
Can't Repko play SS for the 51s?
2006-03-07 20:32:07
22.   Steve
He's not scrappy enough to be a Las Vegas 51s shortstop.
2006-03-07 20:33:41
23.   D4P
19
Man oh man, I hope I'm Mini-Steve...
2006-03-07 20:39:33
24.   Sam DC
Ouch -- in the WBC game, RSA pitcher Jared Elario just wild pitched a runner from second to third, and then wild pitched him home. Canada 7 - South Africa 4. Seventh inning.
2006-03-07 20:48:44
25.   Sam DC
So South Africa is down 7-5 in the bottom of the seventh, no outs, man on second, number 2 hitter at the plate. And, we get, all together, yes, a bunt.

Ah yes, baseball is back.

2006-03-07 20:59:34
26.   ToyCannon
So no one gives Repko a chance of becoming a decent 4th outfielder? He can play all 3 positions and play them well and he might learn to mash lefties. Last year was his 1st at the major league level and left alot to be desired but why is he being completely written off? Just because he's scrappy doesn't mean he should just be discarded. If he can turn into Ryan Freel he has value and if you look at Freel's history he has a chance to do just that. I know we have more glamorous prospects but I don't understand the vitriol directed at him.
2006-03-07 21:02:10
27.   natepurcell
hildalgo to the dodgers?

greg miller and joel guzman for barry zito?

some of the reports from mlbtraderumors.com

not that i believe any of it, but something to talk about.

2006-03-07 21:02:29
28.   Icaros
So no one gives Repko a chance of becoming a decent 4th outfielder?

Not me.

He can play all 3 positions and play them well and he might learn to mash lefties.

Actually, he plays those positions quite poorly, according to my own observation and those fancy defensive metrics Jon posted a couple weeks ago.

2006-03-07 21:02:54
29.   Sam DC
Since its just me, DC Watch. Boswell has a new column up; semi-unabomberish. LAT -- he says that Lerner's in the lead.

He also quotes Frank Robinson, waxing a bit poetic about Dodger Stadium: "'I hope our new ballpark sets a new trend and doesn't just follow one,' said Robinson. 'When Dodger Stadium arrived, I think it was the first big league park that looked out into the landscape -- at the [San Gabriel] mountains.'"

http://tinyurl.com/ggzk2

2006-03-07 21:03:37
30.   Sam DC
OK, not just me anymore by the time I got my comment written. Apologies.
2006-03-07 21:05:36
31.   Steve
Mini-Steve wants to know why we would trade two major leaguers for the Texas League Player of the Year (himself 24) if he is going to be sent to the minor leagues in favor of a banjo hitting 25 year old ex-shortstop with no plate discipline and limited defensive abilities.
2006-03-07 21:07:15
32.   natepurcell
because i want the LV 51s to win the PCL championship and be the highest scoring team EVER.
2006-03-07 21:09:09
33.   Icaros
31

Because sometimes even a banjo can play the most beautiful music.

2006-03-07 21:10:49
34.   Bob Timmermann
The news accounts say that Hidalgo wants to go play in Japan.
2006-03-07 21:13:20
35.   Steve
When I think of Repko, all I hear is the soundtrack to Deliverance.
2006-03-07 21:33:42
36.   sanchez101
I can't believe this, but Repko isnt as bad as people (Steve) here claim. His defense is good by some measurements; he was rate of 107 in CF last year according to BP, not bad considering it was three seasons since moving to the outfield. As a hitter, PECOTA sees Repko settling in as a league average hitter by 2007/2008. A .260 EQA with above average CF defense can be very useful (Willy Taveras was the regular for a world series team). The problem is that he's not (and probably wont be) terribly usefull to the Dodgers, and the danger is that he is overused because because of his percieved "intangables".

I see the logic behind packaging him with Choi, Choi's underrated while Repko is probably overrated. But not to the Giants, watching Choi morph into an Asian Big Papi in the bay area would be among my worst nightmares.

2006-03-07 21:39:19
37.   Andrew Shimmin
To my untrained eye, Freel looks to have out hit Repko at every minor league level, while being about the same age, on the way up. He didn't stick with the big team till he was 27. If Repko goes back to the minors for a couple of years, I'd be willing to have a look at him then. But he won't. He'll make the roster. Like Lance Carter.
2006-03-07 21:44:42
38.   Steve
36 -- even if all that were true, it would only make Project BROTheR more timely
2006-03-07 21:44:47
39.   dsfan
26

I give Repko maybe a five percent chance of evolving into a decent reserve outfielder.

The Freel comp is a long reach. Freel is a pretty good 2B to go with decent OF skills. He's also faster. And he probably has a better track record of getting on base.

Why do I give Repko even a 5-percent chance?

For one, he can hit a decent MLB fastball over the wall.

Two, major league personnel deem him a decent CF.

Third, he took a few unpredicatble leaps forward in recent years. Maybe he somehow takes a few more. Three years ago, I doubt many folks would've given him a five percent chance of doing what he did last year.

2006-03-07 21:45:47
40.   oldbear
Last year was his 1st at the major league level and left alot to be desired but why is he being completely written off?

Repko never produced in the minor leagues. Nothing in his past shows he has the skills make it in the MLB's. He's a free swinger without power.

2006-03-07 21:45:52
41.   FirstMohican
There're rumors going around about Repko. Apparently - and you didn't hear this from me - apparently he can jump over... a car.
2006-03-07 21:53:03
42.   Steve
Two, major league personnel deem him a decent CF.

That takes it down to 2.5%

2006-03-07 21:55:39
43.   natepurcell
re 40

to be fair, his 2004 season between AA and AAA was pretty good for a CFer.

2006-03-07 21:58:04
44.   oldbear
As a hitter, PECOTA sees Repko settling in as a league average hitter by 2007/2008.

Link me. A league average OF'er?

Repko's 2005: .221/.281/.384- .665 OPS
Repko's 7yr: .270/.323/.426 .749 OPS

What could Pecota possibly be basing this on? I assume a league average OF'er OPS'ed around .800 or so. Repko will never sniff .800 or ever .750...at least nothing in his past would suggest he would.

2006-03-07 22:01:38
45.   oldbear
45. Three years ago, I doubt many folks would've given him a five percent chance of doing what he did last year.

.221/.281/.384--He shouldnt have been in the major leagues with numbers like this.

2006-03-07 22:04:11
46.   natepurcell
.221/.281/.384--He shouldnt have been in the major leagues with numbers like this.

a lot of players have crappy first years and go on to have decent careers.

im not saying repko will, but hes only 25ish.

2006-03-07 22:07:13
47.   FirstMohican
45. You forgot the most important stat: 8 HR... and he's FAST.

Besides, he's on track to be average in 2008, give him a break.

2006-03-07 22:07:18
48.   King of the Hobos
He did have a decent 2004 season. And hit a lot of homers in the AFL that season

Any chance we can trade him for Jason Restko? He's like Repko, but a better hitter, a 1B, and has a "st" instead of a "p"

2006-03-07 22:07:27
49.   natepurcell
jon meloan, dodgers 5th round pick, pitched the 9th inning today. did well, scoreless inning with 2ks.

he needs to improve his control if he wants to make the bigs though. he was "effectively wild" here at uofA last year. He has decent stuff though. great knuckle curve.

2006-03-07 22:09:23
50.   Steve
With Pierre and Taveras using up outs like tissue paper, I would guess that a league average OPS out of CF is about .720. But this is no different than the absurd argument that Jack Wilson is "worth" 20 million dollars. Just because other teams put crap out there doesn't mean you compound the problem.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2006-03-07 22:14:25
51.   Brendan
32. natepurcell
because i want the LV 51s to win the PCL championship and be the highest scoring team EVER.

Well what's the record?

2006-03-07 22:20:18
52.   dsfan
Juane Pierre was a key memmber of the Marlins team that won the 2003 WS over an opponent whose payroll was three times larger. His bunt single that led off Game 1 was a huge play, setting up a one-run win. I hope we're not saying Repko's upside is Pierre-like.
If he becomes a decent reserve OF who can spark a team now and then, while bouncing between 3A and the majors, that seems more likely.
2006-03-07 22:22:47
53.   regfairfield
52 A home run or a normal single would have also been a huge play.
2006-03-07 22:23:04
54.   Steve
I hope we're not saying Repko's upside is Pierre-like.

Ummmmmmm...yeah. Perish the thought.

2006-03-07 22:26:55
55.   Johnson
41 Look - I know a lot of us don't like the guy, but trying to run Repko down in the crosswalk is just beyond the pale, man.
2006-03-07 22:27:57
56.   jujibee
For all of the posters who cherish the name Choi, I find it hard to understand why there is so much bashing on Repko. At least he hustles and plays the game hard. I know what you'll will say, that's what we need a hustler and a gamer.....but isn't that a step up form a tree at first base with a long swing?? Give me numbers or whatever you want, I like Repko's attitude and on field hustle. At least he brings some excitment.
2006-03-07 22:29:36
57.   regfairfield
Going by on base percentage the following center fielders could have also had a huge play in the 2003 World Series:

Carlos Beltran
Jim Edmonds
Brad Wilkerson
Bernie Williams
Jose Cruz Jr.
Steve Finley

Pierre's highly batting average dependant self actually had a decent OBP that year.

2006-03-07 22:30:22
58.   regfairfield
56 In the end effort really means nothing.
2006-03-07 22:30:33
59.   ToyCannon
Can anyone tell me the song that was playing at the end of Scrubs for the 09:00 show. TIA

Not to many CF are posting an OPS of 800 these days. Not using OPS+ but normal OPS I show only 3 NL centerfielders in 2005 with an OPS > 800 (Griffey, Jones, Edmonds) and only 6 > 750(Clark, Wilson, Wilkerson). Wouldn't surprise me at all if Repko is used in a platoon with Lofton for him to post a 725-750 OPS. I figure him for a guy who can smack lefties but this is strictly subjective from observing him. I know his splits don't show any difference but I think it was a small sample size of 102 at bats against lefties. Last year he did post an OPS > 750 in 3 months and an OPS < 600 in the other 3 months so he does have the ability the real question is his consistency and being a 1st year player I think we should be giving him more of a chance then just dismissing him because JT played him to much last year in the corners.

2006-03-07 22:30:56
60.   Steve
You spelled it wrong...that's

e..x..c..r..e..m..e..n..t

2006-03-07 22:33:35
61.   natepurcell
At least he hustles and plays the game hard

huh? choi doesnt hustle and doesnt play hard? I mean, just because choi isnt running in zig zag lines to the baseball like your 1 yr old golden retriever, doesnt mean he doesnt have "heart"

2006-03-07 22:34:13
62.   Eric L
56 Tree with long swing - above average ML hitter last year. (110 OPS+)

Hustler - Far, far below average ML hitter last year (76 OPS+).

2006-03-07 22:35:12
63.   dsfan
Pierre was a bad player last year. Sure, he's way too BA dependent. Sure, he's now overpaid.

Doesn't change the past. In 2003 and 2004, he was a good player for low salary (sub $2.5 million). His durability was exceptional, and that has extra value for a low-payroll team playing in brutal heat. You can assume the Yankees wish Pierre had sat out the 2003 World Series. OPS-plus is nifty. So is a World Series title. And it was pretty funny watching the Flying Frenchman agitate the bloated Yankees.

2006-03-07 22:36:12
64.   Steve
Tree with long swing -- tall Asian.

Hustler -- Short, white guy with beard.

Any questions?

2006-03-07 22:38:02
65.   jujibee
and here we go.. bring on the numbers. Keep in mind Repko is 2 years younger than your beloved Hee Seop. I'm simply stating that for all the Choi praising like he's the next coming of Christ, the Repko bashing should be mute and non-existant.
2006-03-07 22:38:40
66.   Steve
No credibility -- hasn't been paying attention -- time to move on.
2006-03-07 22:40:12
67.   natepurcell
choi be with you jujibee.
2006-03-07 22:40:13
68.   Steve
Since I brought it up, I'll bring up another subject. Is Aybar going to make this team? And if not, why not? And if not, isn't he the one to go in a package with Choi?
2006-03-07 22:42:28
69.   Eric L
65 Choi essentially has about 1/2 year more professional experience (in the US) than Repko. Really, their age difference isn't much of an issue.
2006-03-07 22:42:53
70.   ToyCannon
Why do you have to bust down one player while praising another. I'll take the big tree anyday but I don't need to trash Repko in the same paragraph to make a case for him. I'm tired of defending Choi but it is very easy to do so because the arguements against him have as many holes as his long unorthodox powerfull swing.
2006-03-07 22:43:16
71.   oldbear
56. At least he brings some excitment.

The Dodgers scoring runs brings me excitement. This prevents me from supporting Repko.

2006-03-07 22:44:04
72.   natepurcell
i personally dont think aybar is going to make the team. I think its because robles is more reliable at SS, 2b and 3b then aybar. Aybar is only 22/23 and he didnt exactly light vegas on fire last year. if he goes back to vegas to join the premier prospect team, it wouldnt be the end of the world.
2006-03-07 22:45:13
73.   dsfan
68

I'm an Aybar backer who sees almost no chance of him making the team -- barring injuries.

2006-03-07 22:45:44
74.   regfairfield
May this hopefully prevent a 300 comment post.

http://dodgermath.com/?p=277

2006-03-07 22:46:01
75.   Jon Weisman
59 - The Long Road - Eddie Vedder singing. I have a version of it from the "Dead Man Walking" soundtrack that's different, but it's a great song.

56 - I really can't let this go. This has nothing to do with Repko. Show me one instance where Choi didn't hustle on a play. Show me one example of him not playing hard. Show me one example of Choi not having a great attiude.

Three home runs in a game? Fans chanting his name, fans who have never heard of this website? I'll take that kind of excitement.

And once again, the phony strawman is brought out - that Choi supporters think he's the second coming. No, we just think he's adequate - but some people aren't even willing to concede that - they're too busy praising a certifiably below-average outfielder.

2006-03-07 22:46:23
76.   jujibee
Again, I'm not saying Repko is better than Choi, I'm simply saying it is hard to take the bashing of one sub-par player with a grain of salt and listen to the praise of another sub-par player, something that is apparent with this saber-minded board. And Nate, I agree with your comments a lot, but this is one matter that I disagree with you on, Choi's upside.
2006-03-07 22:46:30
77.   Steve
I think that's true, but it seems unlikely that his market value would improve markedly from where it was after last year, especially if he is lost in the Las Vegas shuffle. It may be one of those cases where you like what you have, but you like what you can get better.
2006-03-07 22:48:04
78.   Steve
I fear that if Mueller was injured, Aybar would come up, but Robtinez would play third.
2006-03-07 22:48:18
79.   dsfan
72

I just hope that if Aybar is in Triple-A, he plays every day. I get the sense he's more comfortable at 3B, but if LaRoche is there, that's out.
Willy, by the way, has been awful since the MLB season ended -- brutal in winter ball, and so far, zilch in the exhibitions.
Sure, these exhibitions are of little value, but with the WBC thinning the ranks, it's a good opportunity, and someone in Aybar's position probably needs to get going.

2006-03-07 22:49:30
80.   Icaros
I had a dream last night about the baby Choi in his little manger, but this tree talk got me thinking, perhaps Choi could get some side work as the Stanford mascot.

Didn't the current tree get fired for public intoxication a few weeks ago?

2006-03-07 22:49:43
81.   Eric L
70 The Choi debate is silly. And like you are saying, what does not liking Repko have to do with liking Choi?

Any argument in support of Repko should have to do with his contributions as an outfielder. Is he the best option for 4th outfielder or is there someone else on the team who may do better?

Same thing with Choi. Is he the Choi/Saenz platoon better than Nomar? Is there a spot for Choi on the team? Is he the best option as a left handed pinch hitter? Etc, etc.

Anything else is really just noise.

2006-03-07 22:50:04
82.   Steve
Is DeWitt a second baseman or a third baseman?
2006-03-07 22:50:38
83.   ToyCannon
75
Thanks, I knew someone on this board would know the song. My wife is always amazed at what info I gleam from a baseball blog. In another minute I'll amaze her again.
2006-03-07 22:50:46
84.   dsfan
I still see Martinez as a non-candidate. He's a dead body in the field, no power at the plate, can't work the count, strictly utility fodder, and that's only if someone gets hurt.
2006-03-07 22:51:09
85.   oldbear
Not to many CF are posting an OPS of 800 these days. Not using OPS+ but normal OPS I show only 3 NL centerfielders in 2005 with an OPS > 800 (Griffey, Jones, Edmonds) and only 6 > 750(Clark, Wilson, Wilkerson)

I guess I was spoiled by Milton Bradley and thus have higher expectations. Bradley OPS'ed .786 in 2004 and OPS'ed .834 in 2005.

So at least 7 NL CF'ers OPS'ed above .750. If there are only 16 teams in the NL, it would seem to me league average CF'ers would need to at least be at .750 or above. Anything less would mean you have a below average player in CF. If Repko OPS's .720 and he's like the 13th best CF'er out of 16, that still isnt good. Ideally you'd strive to have the very best player at each position. And at the very worst, be above league average.

2006-03-07 22:51:39
86.   jujibee
75..I didn't see the hustle when the Dodgers played the Cardinals last year. I have nothing against Choi, only against a lot of people giving him a more than his deserved credit while a rookie, who made his share of mistakes, and by no means is better than Choi right now, gets bashed like he was the second coming of FP Santangelo.
2006-03-07 22:51:54
87.   ToyCannon
82
2nd baseman starting this year. A smart move if he can handle it. He was a HS SS but then who wasn't.
2006-03-07 22:52:11
88.   natepurcell
Is DeWitt a second baseman or a third baseman?

he played 3b all last year but in instrux, he played a bunch of second. it seems they may be shifting him to 2b because of laroche. in HS, he played SS and the reports say he could move to either 2b or 3b when he was drafted.

2006-03-07 22:53:15
89.   dsfan
IIRC, Dewitt started out at 3B and was pretty unreliable there, which factored into his move to 2B.
If Mueller gets hurt, I'd give Aybar a shot, then LaRoche.
2006-03-07 22:54:04
90.   Steve
They say we're young and we don't know

We won't find out until we grow

Well I don't know if all that's true

'Cause you got me, and baby I got you

Babe

I got you babe I got you babe

They say our love won't pay the rent

Before it's earned, our money's all been spent

I guess that's so, we don't have a pot

But at least I'm sure of all the things we got

Babe

I got you babe I got you babe

2006-03-07 22:54:55
91.   Steve
What happened to Denker? What happened to that 6'6, 130 lb. guy that we had playing first base at Ogden last year?
2006-03-07 22:55:29
92.   Jon Weisman
86 - What did you see?
2006-03-07 22:55:34
93.   regfairfield
86 At this point, I'd rather have Santangelo in his "prime", that man could walk like no ones buisness.
2006-03-07 22:56:08
94.   natepurcell
to add, during instrux, dewitt and hu developed quite a chemistry playing 2b and ss together. They became really good friends off the field and went to sushi all the time together.
2006-03-07 22:56:46
95.   Eric L
85 To be fair, FP was a pretty decent player prior to the year he spent with the Dodgers. He had a couple of years with an OPS+ over 100 and played multiple defensive positions.
2006-03-07 22:56:50
96.   ToyCannon
86
Yikes, ignore everything I said. My sort was all messed up and my numbers blow chunks.
2006-03-07 22:57:48
97.   natepurcell
IRC, Dewitt started out at 3B and was pretty unreliable there, which factored into his move to 2B.

thats not really accurate. hes being moved because of laroche infront of him. He was as reliable there as any other prep 1st yr 3b.

steve-
sutherland will probably go to single A columbus this year and proceed to hit 2 homeruns during the whole year.

2006-03-07 22:58:22
98.   ToyCannon
I meant to refer to 85
2006-03-07 22:59:03
99.   Eric L
And I meant to refer to 86.
2006-03-07 22:59:13
100.   Icaros
I don't know much about him and am too lazy to look it up. Can this DeWitt hit?
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2006-03-07 23:00:16
101.   regfairfield
100 So far, not a lick, but he's only 20.
2006-03-07 23:02:23
102.   ToyCannon
91
If they move Dewitt to 2nd then we have the following depth:
Aybar - AAA
Abreu - AA
DeWitt - High A
Denker - Low A or do they move him now to the outfield and let him play in high A?

The above is just a guess.

Are you referring to Cory Dunlap? If so, he had a very crappy season and is just not developing the power he needs if he's going to be a major league 1st baseman. His luster really lost some shine.

2006-03-07 23:02:25
103.   Icaros
101

Thanks. I'll pray for him.

2006-03-07 23:02:36
104.   oldbear
86. I didn't see the hustle when the Dodgers played the Cardinals last year.

Hard to 'hustle' when Scott Rolen is plowing into you. Why not credit Choi's heart for not taking a dive and just standing there? If we're to make up reasons for liking Repko, lets make up some for liking Choi. He did hit a 3HR in the one game the Dodgers beat the Cards in at Busch. Capped a pretty large rally.

Repko played OF and OPS'ed like .670 as a starter.

Choi played 1b and OPS'ed like .820 as a starter.

Sure Choi has more experience than Repko, but Choi was also pretty good right when he came up to the Big leagues. He didnt distinguish himself much with the Cubs, but he sure played well with the Marlins. Repko just doesnt have the minor league history to be optimistic about.

You are confusing 'propping up Choi/bashing Repko" with optimism/pessimism.

People here are optimistic about Choi putting up numbers. Pessimistic about Repko putting up numbers. Has nothing to do with style of play. Has everything to do with prior history of each's accomplishments.

2006-03-07 23:03:26
105.   Steve
Beltran reached .750 didn't he? I mean, separate from the issue that he got paid a gazillion dollars to equal Brady Clark.
2006-03-07 23:04:15
106.   Steve
David Sutherland. I remembered his name in the interim.
2006-03-07 23:04:16
107.   natepurcell
from june 1st to the end of the season last year, dewitt hit:

AVG 0.309
OBP 0.358
SLG 0.478

320AB 9hr 24bb 49k

why june 1st? the first two months of the season, dewitt was given the wrong contact lenses and he couldnt see the ball at night time. he also had bruised ribs in may which put him in a massive slump. when he was finally healthy and could actually see the ball, he hit really well. Callis, Manuel, Sickels and others peg a laroche style breakout season for dewitt next year. they really like his raw power and BA rated him as the best hitter for average in our system.

2006-03-07 23:07:28
108.   Uncle Miltie
Watching Aybar walk was about the only exciting thing that happened last year. Watching Repko misjudge flyballs is not exciting.
2006-03-07 23:07:50
109.   Uncle Miltie
Unless you are an opposing player.
2006-03-07 23:08:26
110.   Steve
My wife cried for a month with bad contacts until she finally forced the eye doctor to give her the prescription she wanted. She didn't have spheroids whizzing at her either. I can believe that.

Beltran didn't reach .750. But Dave Roberts did!

2006-03-07 23:08:41
111.   natepurcell
i think they will keep dewitt at 3b next year to give denker one more shot at 2b at vero.
2006-03-07 23:08:43
112.   Icaros
107

Even better. I'll expect him to be the next Chase Utley.

2006-03-07 23:08:57
113.   regfairfield
107 So did he hit like .000 the first two months?
2006-03-07 23:09:02
114.   ToyCannon
100
So far he's more then held his own so I'm not sure what 101 is talking about. He's a number one draft pick and when drafted was considered the best HS hitter in the nation. He has since been outhit by several other HS players taken in the same draft but he has done just fine. He's moving up the ladder at a decent pace for his age and was promoted to high A last year and proceeded to knock the snot out of the ball but in a very limited sample size of 31 at bats. This was at the age of 19. A line in low A of
283/333/428 in 481 at bats followed by
419/438/619 in 31 at bats in High A is not "not a lick" by any stretch of the imagination.
2006-03-07 23:10:13
115.   natepurcell
112

thats actually what im hoping. dewitt was rated as the best pure prep hitter in the 2004 class as well. Although billy butler seems to have taken offense to that.

2006-03-07 23:11:48
116.   natepurcell
He has since been outhit by several other HS players taken in the same draft but he has done just fine.

besides billy butler, which prep hitter has out hit him from the first 3 rounds?

2006-03-07 23:12:21
117.   jujibee
When I'm wrong you can all laugh at me. Like I said, Choi is better than Repko right now, however the optimism/pesimism is not well waranted in my opinion. I think Choi should be bashed just as much as Repko. I see no optimisim in either player thus far, and certain not a one game flash where I can say that this guy is going to be good. Kevin Elster hit 3 homeruns opening day at Pac Bell, whoopty do. I know this is a subject that has been beat to daeth so I'm gonna end it with a have a good night gentlemen.
2006-03-07 23:13:01
118.   Steve
mmmmmm...Chase Utley...Dare to dream. If only we had a Ramon Martinez to platoon with him.
2006-03-07 23:14:06
119.   natepurcell
to answer my question, neil walker maybe. I dont think walker will stay at catcher though.
2006-03-07 23:15:20
120.   regfairfield
114 I just looked at his .253/.294/.383 line and drew that conclusion, ignoring his 32 PAs in high A. I forgive myself for not realizing he can actually hit.
2006-03-07 23:16:46
121.   natepurcell
I just looked at his .253/.294/.383 line and drew that conclusion

when did dewitt put up that line? you might have looked at repko's stats.... zing!

2006-03-07 23:17:18
122.   Andrew Shimmin
117- Do you have a favorite Night Stalker episode?
2006-03-07 23:17:45
123.   Steve
So what is this line?

283/333/428

2006-03-07 23:17:56
124.   regfairfield
I got that from PECOTA, they're listed as his 2005 A stats. Is it wrong?
2006-03-07 23:18:00
125.   sanchez101
I dont remember Dewitt being considered the best pure hitter entering the 2004 draft. He was among the best, but I remember the consensus being Chris Nelson - he was compared to Gary Sheffield.
2006-03-07 23:18:31
126.   regfairfield
Those would be his equivelant stats. Now I apologize for my ignorance.
2006-03-07 23:18:34
127.   Steve
122 -- Good times, good times.
2006-03-07 23:18:40
128.   Icaros
I wasn't around when it happened, why did the Braves trade Andy Marte for Edgar Renteria?
2006-03-07 23:19:01
129.   Steve
What are equivalent stats?
2006-03-07 23:19:03
130.   natepurcell
remember when we selected utley in the 2nd round of the 97 draft? and then he went to UCLA.. cool huh!
2006-03-07 23:19:23
131.   ToyCannon
119
Doesn't matter if Walker stays at catcher or not, both Walker and Butler have done more so far with their careers. I think Dewitt might be able to surpass Walker but Butler is going to be an offensive force that will wreck havoc upon the AL.JMO
2006-03-07 23:19:37
132.   Steve
128 -- Sick of winning.
2006-03-07 23:19:51
133.   Eric L
121 If it was Repko's line, it would be an improvemnt from last year.
2006-03-07 23:20:11
134.   dsfan
Nate,

Not that it matters, but DeWitt was pretty unrelable as a 3B with Columbus. I'll try to get some numbers for 2004, but in 2005 he made 22 errors in 109 games at 3B. He had 267 total chances -- .918 fielding percentage. Buzz was he didn't have the greatest actions for 3B, better off at 2B. Pretty irrelevant now -- he profiles as a decent 2B who can hit.

2006-03-07 23:20:58
135.   sanchez101
123. Ya, he had a good second half and was hot in a short stint in Vero Beach, but he isnt a great prospect yet. He may be in a couple months, and I like his chances, but lets not get ahead of ourselves. He might be the best prospect who isnt quite a good prospect yet.
2006-03-07 23:21:56
136.   natepurcell
equivalent stats are what PECOTA thinks dewitt would have hit in the majors.
2006-03-07 23:23:33
137.   ToyCannon
129
Take the basic line and then adjusted for league and park.

125
Just using what BA said when we drafted Dewitt.

2006-03-07 23:24:21
138.   Steve
135 -- Just so you know, there was no commentary to 123 -- I'm just confused about who hit what where.
2006-03-07 23:25:35
139.   Steve
That's two different answers. Why would I care what PECOTA thinks DeWitt would hit in the majors at 19?
2006-03-07 23:25:52
140.   natepurcell
re 131

i agree about butler. Hes going to be an absolute beast. the royals are going in the right direction with a 3/4 combo of gordon and butler.

too bad grienke is an absolute headcase though.

2006-03-07 23:26:10
141.   King of the Hobos
Any chance that Butler can actually play LF? The Royals already have Huber at DH, unless he's better at 1B than I remember. Even if Butler is the better hitter, at least Dewitt can field the ball better than his grandmother
2006-03-07 23:27:08
142.   natepurcell
So what is this line?

283/333/428

those are dewitts numbers from his SAL season.

2006-03-07 23:27:34
143.   regfairfield
BP's definition:

EqOBP, or Equivalent On Base Percentage, is calibrated to an ideal major league with an overall EqOBP of .340. While a major league hitter's equivalent stats should not differ substantially from his actual numbers, a minor league hitter's equivalent stats undergo translation and may differ significantly. Equivalent stats also account for park effects.

2006-03-07 23:28:48
144.   natepurcell
re 134

i realize that dewitt wasnt that great defensively at 3b, but that is not the reason they are testing dewitt out at 2b. usually, 3b prospects drafted out of HS dont fare very well defensively in their first year or two. the most notable cass of this is chavez.

2006-03-07 23:31:21
145.   sanchez101
140. Call him names all you want, but Grienke would look good in Dodger blue. Is their some way we can trick Baird into taking Repko and maybe Tomko or Carter for Grienke? If he wants to play hardball, Ill let him have Tomko and Carter.
2006-03-07 23:33:23
146.   natepurcell
last week, i wanted to trade for grienke. Now i dont think thats such a good idea due to his mental healthy problems. hopefully he gets his stuff straighten out, he has a world of talent.
2006-03-07 23:33:59
147.   Brendan
Just for the record I want to remind everyone that Choi hit his three home runs in a 4-3 Dodger Sunday win. He also hit 2 HR in the friday game before with a walk off HR to win that game 6-5.

the Dodgers needed all 5 of his home runs to win those two games.

2006-03-07 23:36:20
148.   King of the Hobos
Dewitt has played 2B in exhibition, so I'd guess the organization views him as a 2B this season. No idea what that would mean for Denker, although there should be plenty of open spots for him. After Dewitt, Hoffman, and Pedroza, Vero doesn't look to have much of a lineup
2006-03-07 23:36:25
149.   Steve
So DeWitt at 19 would be...2005 Beltre?
2006-03-07 23:36:36
150.   ToyCannon
Agreed, he needs a change of scenery and I'd love for Ned to take a chance on him. They need so much we could offer plenty without giving up any jewels. They did trade Beltran for Teahen, Buck, and Wood which is just about worthless.
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2006-03-07 23:37:43
151.   Steve
Yes, bring me the head of Zach Greinke for Repko, Choi, and Aybar. Make it so.
2006-03-07 23:39:10
152.   Steve
And you guys better be ready to bring on the prospect talk for a while, because my second kid of the night just threw up. I think only the first one because of the Choi debate.
2006-03-07 23:39:31
153.   natepurcell
where would we put greinke?
2006-03-07 23:40:08
154.   ToyCannon
Doesn't that mean that eventually you will also be throwing up:)
2006-03-07 23:41:49
155.   King of the Hobos
The Royals don't have Redman for the next 6-8 weeks, so they could probably use a pitcher. We just need to provide any pitcher that is better than Mike Wood, that can't be too difficult. We could even add in Repko, Carter, and the money to pay for their salaries
2006-03-07 23:43:31
156.   King of the Hobos
153 That seems to be the problem, as he can't handle going back to AAA. I'm not sure he could handle the bullpen. Just give him Tomko's place in the rotation, so we can pay a middle reliever $4 mil a year
2006-03-07 23:43:43
157.   Steve
154 -- Probably around June 1!

153 -- What do you mean where would we put Greinke? Where do you think we would put Greinke? Don't go all Jim Tracy on us now! ;)

2006-03-07 23:43:52
158.   Andrew Shimmin
151- Any team playing Doug Mientkiewicz over Matt Stairs won't want Choi. But maybe an Izzy, Repko combo? Plus Odalis? And money?
2006-03-07 23:44:26
159.   sanchez101
153. If he can be had for 50 cents on the dollar, we can find a place for him.

What exaclty are his "issues". All ive heard or read is that he's frustrated with how his career has gone thus far and is questioning his desire to continue. Id feel the same way if I were playing for KC.

2006-03-07 23:45:40
160.   natepurcell
just that, our rotation is pretty full. By full, i mean full with high contract players and the only low contract player (seo) deserves to be in the rotation based on his performance last year.

the reason zack left royals camp was because he was going to be sent down to AAA.

2006-03-07 23:46:41
161.   dsfan
I don't know about Greinke, but I do like the idea of targeting certain GMs and constantly talking trade with them just because you're bound to get something good.
The list should included Baird, Bavasi, Minaya, Bowden and the Hicks/Showalter cadre. I'm not trying to be smart alecky -- this should be part of the GM 101 textbook.
2006-03-07 23:46:41
162.   natepurcell
his issues= bi-polar or something along those lines.
2006-03-07 23:47:11
163.   Steve
Izturis for Greinke! Yes!
2006-03-07 23:48:00
164.   natepurcell
the royals are a good team for choi. maybe choi, aybar, orenduff can get greinke.
2006-03-07 23:48:03
165.   dsfan
Anyone would have issues after being pegged as the savior for that franchise.
Of course, didn't the mighty Royals sweep the Dodgers last year?
2006-03-07 23:49:17
166.   Steve
Of course, didn't the mighty Royals sweep the Dodgers last year?

Followed by a mighty lot of commentary about how "in the race" we were

2006-03-07 23:49:26
167.   regfairfield
160 Is this confirmed? Are the Royals really incompetent enough to send their best pitcher to AAA?
2006-03-07 23:50:01
168.   Steve
164 -- Get Izturis in there! Geez. Orenduff and Izturis for Greinke. Done.
2006-03-07 23:50:52
169.   ToyCannon
No one seems to know his issues, it is all guesswork. So far I've heard:
1. He doesn't want to pitch anymore
2. He doesn't want to pitch for KC anymore and is tired of them messing with his delivery when he was quite successfull before they got ahold of him.
3. Was told he'd be pitching in AAA no matter what he did in ST and then became agitated and left the team.

I'm betting on number 3 because KC is just stupid enough to do something like that and that is something that would trigger the kind of response he had. He's an independant thinker and if KC is trying to teach him a lesson he just might be saying something Jon won't let us print.

2006-03-07 23:50:52
170.   Steve
Then keep Aybar and trade him and Repko to Pittsburgh for Craig Wilson.
2006-03-07 23:51:22
171.   natepurcell
steve, we need to save izturis for our major deadline deal.

izturis to bowden for patterson.

2006-03-07 23:51:37
172.   sanchez101
168. Im sure we can find a place for Repko in that deal.
2006-03-07 23:52:43
173.   ToyCannon
164
They have Sweeney, Huber and probably Butler in a year, so how are they a good fit?

They don't need Izzy, they already have their own version of a GG SS who can't hit by the name of Blanco. The guy is a whiz with the glove.

2006-03-07 23:54:02
174.   natepurcell
re 173

they need to trade sweeney. baird should have traded him last deadline if he wasnt pulling a lamar and asking for the moon. I would stick butler in left, have huber and choi play 1b/dh

2006-03-07 23:56:31
175.   sanchez101
Hey, if Baird likes guys like teahan, berroa, and other Oakland prospects, maybe he'll like Ethier. KC is short on corner outfielders, now and in the future. That would help justify the Milton Bradley trade.

Ethier, Carter (what team cant use a veteran presence in the bullpen), Repko and Izturis. Is their anymore crap we can send to KC.

Seems like Jackson and/or Tiffany would be pretty good trade bait for Greinke right about now.

2006-03-07 23:56:48
176.   natepurcell
a middle of the order of gordon-butler-choi-huber has potential.

hopefully they pick the right college pitcher in this years draft. I think it would be good for baseball if the royals somehow manage to get back on track.

2006-03-07 23:57:27
177.   Steve
How the Royals still have Sweeney and the D-Rays still have Huff are mysteries of the highest order. Well, not really.
2006-03-07 23:57:54
178.   natepurcell
if we still had em, i would offer jackson AND tiffany for greinke right now.
2006-03-07 23:58:47
179.   ToyCannon
I agree that is what they should do but we are talking the Royals a team who gave Harvey two full seasons of at bats. I doubt if they see any value in Choi. If Depo was around I think he'd be able to engineer a 3 way with Oakland/KC/LA since KC seems to like to deal with Oakland.
2006-03-07 23:59:02
180.   natepurcell
then i would take greinke, guzman and martin and offer that to the marlins for miggy!!
2006-03-07 23:59:13
181.   Steve
Ethier is the central figure to Project BROTheR. He's not crap!
2006-03-08 00:01:50
182.   ToyCannon
Of course this is a waste of time since Ned value makeup and Grienke's makeup has taken a dump and taken him out of our firing range. Curious to see which team will take a chance on him. Oakland - Jose Cruz, Jairo Garcia or Nick Swisher all by his lonesome.
2006-03-08 00:03:58
183.   natepurcell
lol, the cards had someone by the name of Skip Schumaker playing for them today against the dodgers.

lets trade for him!

2006-03-08 00:07:31
184.   sanchez101
That sounds like the scrappiest name ive ever heard. My guess he's 5'7'', can barely throw, has a peg leg, but gives full effort every play, even when he's on the bench. Of course he has a goatee(sp?), as required by law.
2006-03-08 00:11:04
185.   Steve
Ned needs to get rid of his makeup and that stupid ring.
2006-03-08 00:12:22
186.   oldbear
Are the Royals really incompetent enough to send their best pitcher to AAA?

33 Starts
5.80 ERA
1.13 HR/9
2.61 W/9
5.61 K/9
1.56 WHIP

This guy is the Royals best pitcher? They must be horrible.

Orenduff and Izturis for Greinke

I think Orenduff is better than Greinke right now. And Orenduff is only 6months older. Sure Greinke was in the majors last year, but he was getting bombed. Also, the only thing that stands out numbers wise about Greinke in the minors is his low bb/9. He's not a big strike out pitcher, and he also gives up home runs. He's just not a dominant pitcher.

Stay away from Greinke would be my advice. I have more confidence in Orenduff pitching for the Dodgers than Greinke.

Izturis for Greinke would be a substraction by substraction. They both at this point have little value, other than hype. Greinke's being his high draft status, Izzy's being his GG/All Star label.

2006-03-08 00:13:03
187.   natepurcell
PR vs panama on espn. they just showed the old maid and his grey hair. he has a lot of grey hair..... and a lot of fat.
2006-03-08 00:13:35
188.   Andrew Shimmin
173- Isn't Angel Berroa supposed to be their starting SS? Man; thank Choi I wasn't born in KC.
2006-03-08 00:14:41
189.   natepurcell
are you just saying that because greinke was a prep pitcher and orenduff a college pitcher?
2006-03-08 00:14:54
190.   Steve
Baez for Greinke. Done.
2006-03-08 00:17:33
191.   oldbear
i would offer jackson AND tiffany for greinke right now

I'd keep both. Jackson and Tiff could just as easily get blasted at the mlb level as Greinke does. If Greinke was a great talent, he'd have better K/9 numbers and a much better HR/9 numbers.

Those numbers tell me he's not missing enough bats, and when the ball is put into play its absolutely crushed.

The only good thing I see out of him is his low bb/9. But there's more to pitching that just that.

2006-03-08 00:20:01
192.   natepurcell
you give up on young pitchers way too easily.
2006-03-08 00:22:07
193.   oldbear
189. I'm saying that because Orenduff's K/9 and HR/9 are alot better than Greinke's.

And that nothing stands out about Greinke's game other than his good bb/9.

I dont really think pichers that rely on their defense are that valuable. Especially pitchers that wind up giving up the HR ball so frequently. Thats how I see Greinke.

Maybe Greinke picked up to much expertise from Lima.

2006-03-08 00:22:34
194.   natepurcell
wow saenz is only 5'11? i thought he was a lot taller then that.
2006-03-08 00:26:36
195.   oldbear
you give up on young pitchers way too easily

No. I tend to not give any credence to wherever a player is drafted. And you see it alot in baseball. Players that are 1st rounders get special treatment even if they arent good (cough..repko..cough..loney..).. I think the hype for these young pitchers comes from where they were drafted.

I dont care about the draft spot, so I dont care about the hype/scouts projections/ either.

2006-03-08 00:28:18
196.   natepurcell
bruce chen is pitching for the panama team? what the???
2006-03-08 00:32:01
197.   natepurcell
i wwould offer some rebuttals but its late, im tired, and i dont feel like arguing over something this insignificant. maybe someone else can respond.
2006-03-08 00:33:43
198.   regfairfield
This is all unconfirmed, but if the stories are true, the Royals did break Greinke, by doing things like telling him to throw nothing but fastballs for the first three innings. Plus that game where they left him out there to give up 11 runs couldn't have helped him.

Keep in mind his minor league numbers come from when he was 19 and 20.Greinke still has a lot of room to improve.

2006-03-08 00:38:02
199.   natepurcell
maybe im just too fond of greinkes 2.15 minor league era and career 5.3 k:bb ratio
2006-03-08 00:41:46
200.   sanchez101
Oldbear - you'd keep Jackson because Greinke was already getting pounded at the major league level? Are we talking about the same Jackson?

Greinke has more going for him than great control, as if that isnt good enough; Greinke's PERA (expected ERA based on peripheral stats) in 2004 was 4.66 when he had a 3.97 ERA, while in 2005 it was 4.63 while posting a 5.80 ERA. That, combined with his .340 BABIP, makes me think that last year was a fluke and he's basically a league average pitcher. I like the chances of a pitcher who can pitch 328 innings of league average ball before his 22nd birthday.

As far as his statistical profile goes, his walk rate is good and his k-rate is around league average. His weakness is fly-ball tendencies. If any pitcher can pitch above his peripherals, its a pitcher a unique as Grienke. But even if he settles in as a league average innings eater, its easily worth a package of B prospects. I mean, we just signed Brett Tomko to a multi-year deal, you can never have enough cheap starters.

Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2006-03-08 00:48:51
201.   sanchez101
I seem to remember Saenz having that much gray hair last year, he just kept his hat on more often, but he really looks like a younger version of my grandpa when he takes his hat off.

Wow, Cora's scrappiness factor just went up a notch for that play.

2006-03-08 00:51:31
202.   Steve
Usually, I just roll my eyes at hyperbolic nonsense like Gene Wojciehowitz's at ESPN, but the fact that Barry Bonds is involved just makes me want to throw a party. Not only does Bonds get relegated to the ashcan of history, but the Giants' "success" over the past decade goes with it, as does Brian Sabean's already embarrassingly over-hyped reputation, and of course, worrisomely, that of our own beloved San Francisco engagement ring bearer. Couldn't have happened to a nicer bunch of reprobates and, yes, battery-chuckers. (D4P, feel free to jump in at some point and give Kent one -- I'm feeling frisky.) That whole team was a wholly owned subsidiary of Merck. Removes all doubt...whose? The real killers?
2006-03-08 00:53:38
203.   LAT
29. Sam, thanks for the update.
2006-03-08 00:55:30
204.   regfairfield
202 To be fair to Sabean, if you go through his trade history at the beginning of his tenure, it's amazingly successful.

Of course, he hasn't made a good move for the last several years, but man was he good when he started.

2006-03-08 00:58:34
205.   Steve
By the way, Wojchiehowitz's piece is just utter, utter garbage. Horrible. I mean how long has it been since anyone at least "wondered if Bonds knew about the working end of a syringe." And his proof of the opposite is a quote from Derrek Lee? Because baseball players never use platitudes to avoid controversy. Please, Gene Wojchiehowitz, lead us horses to water that we might drink.
2006-03-08 01:00:53
206.   natepurcell
i dont like his last name.. too wierd and too hard to spell.
2006-03-08 01:02:23
207.   natepurcell
wow the stadium exploded when that rios ball went over the wall. love the energy in the crowd!
2006-03-08 01:27:11
208.   Brendan
Early Morning Rant:

How in the heck does KC know who will or will not be in their rotation this early in spring training. they have all 5 spots locked up? Is there something in his contract that would be triggered and they don't want him playing? do they have 5 better pitchers?

ESPN just moved ahead in the PR/PAN game "due to time constraints" What?! Mike and Mike in the morning can't be joined in progress? Actually it's seven hours of sportscenter rebroadcast. Stay Classy ESPN.

2006-03-08 01:35:57
209.   oldbear
I like the chances of a pitcher who can pitch 328 innings of league average ball before his 22nd birthday....But even if he settles in as a league average innings eater, its easily worth a package of B prospects.

I just dont like the idea of trading anything for 'league-average' talent. I agree with you I'd rather have Greinke than Tomko, bc there is more upside. But ideally I'd want neither. Is there more upside with the B prospects or Greinke? To me it would depend on how many B prospects we gave up. But talking about giving up Choi or Orenduff? No way. And the whole counting stats before a certain age thing reminds me too much of Beltre.

I prefer quality or at least projected quality. I'm not sure if you can reasonably project more quality from Grienke than Orenduff at this point.

2006-03-08 02:33:38
210.   Andrew Shimmin
League average is nothing to sneeze at. League average, upside, virtually free--sounds like a Korean I know. And for a SP especially, league average means third starter.
2006-03-08 05:31:13
211.   D4P
D4P, feel free to jump in at some point and give Kent one -- I'm feeling frisky

Take that! And that!

Boom! Pow! Ziff!

2006-03-08 05:59:28
212.   Jason Wojciechowski
206 It's not hard: Wojciechowski.

But then, I'm biased.

2006-03-08 06:10:52
213.   Vishal
bruce chen was born in panama. i really like him for some reason.
2006-03-08 07:15:15
214.   Jon Weisman
212 is one of my all-time favorite comments here.
2006-03-08 07:24:14
215.   Sam DC
212 You were always my favorite on Barney Miller.
2006-03-08 07:41:32
216.   Bob Timmermann
201

The gray hair can come fast. I just noticed a big patch of it today.
But I recalled Saenz as having some gray hair last year.

2006-03-08 08:27:50
217.   Marty
As I watch the top of my head get ever shinier I always tell people not to complain about gray hair. At least it's hair.
2006-03-08 08:28:50
218.   jeepseats
Any talk of Orenduff for Greinke makes no sense.
2006-03-08 09:05:31
219.   Jon Weisman
217 - Agreed. As they said in "Wall Street," "Gray is good."
2006-03-08 10:07:05
220.   Colorado Blue
I tried finding more info on the extent of Ethier's injury last night to no avail. Anybody have any new details?
2006-03-08 10:43:15
221.   jasonungar05
next weeks lesson: arm angles.

http://tinyurl.com/mu4pn

"In some cases he struck himself out," Tracy said. "Brad Eldred is going to strike out. But it can't be on a pace to strike out 200-plus times a season."

Tracy would settle for, say, a pro-rated 130 strikeouts.

"That means he puts the . . . puts the ball in play 70 more times. Of those 70, how many does he hit the bleep out of, and what happens to the home run total as a result of that?" Tracy said. "I guarantee that number will come down if he does not walk up there and strike himself out."

2006-03-08 10:51:31
222.   Midwest Blue
Circuitous thinking. I miss Tracy already.
2006-03-08 10:53:00
223.   Sam DC
Olmedo Saenz up for Panama v Cuba -- bases loaded.
2006-03-08 10:54:43
224.   regfairfield
And Brad Eldred was never heard from again.
2006-03-08 10:56:06
225.   Sam DC
223 Ground out to short.
2006-03-08 10:57:16
226.   Curtis Lowe
Did Olmedo sign with a Japanese team? The ESPN announcer said he signed a 20mil contract with some team in the land of the rising sun.
2006-03-08 11:01:13
227.   GoBears
226 Must have meant someone else. Olmedo is still a Dodger.

221 Eldred and Choi will start a support group. Either that or a boy band. A really big boy band, with bad feet and hole-riddled dance moves.

2006-03-08 11:01:40
228.   jasonungar05
"Last year I go up and strike myself out, this year, no strike myself out" -HSC
2006-03-08 11:04:48
229.   DodgerJoe
Does anyone have an update on today's exhibition game vs. Balt?

I see it's 3-1 in the 3rd, but what happened? I know Billingsley started.

2006-03-08 11:09:38
230.   Sam DC
LAT -- I think you need to make a few calls . . .

From washpost chat with Nationals' beat writer Barry Svrluga:

New York Ave: Any rumors on who the owner will be? I read that Lerner was with Bowden the other day. Is he in the lead to own the team?

Barry Svrluga: Lerner is definitely a solid candidate, and he would be the most likely to keep Bowden as the GM. I think we'll be hearing about this sooner rather than later.

2006-03-08 11:12:06
231.   Steve
Now there's an ugly choice. 1) No owner at all or 2) An owner that would keep Bowden as the GM.
2006-03-08 11:14:11
232.   Steve
By the way, Max Gail is in the new show "Sons and Daughters" which I TiVoed but have not watched yet.
2006-03-08 11:22:09
233.   GoBears
232. Was he Wojo? Is that the relevance?

As a kid, I thought my Dad was moonlighting as Barney Miller. Scary resemblance with Hal Linden (and both were clarinet players). I'm now pretty sure that wasn't true.

2006-03-08 11:24:39
234.   Jon Weisman
The people who had to find something to watch after the demise of "Becker" could well be heartbroken with the following news: The futures of "King of Queens," "Out of Practice," "Still Standing" and "Yes, Dear" are in doubt.

http://theedge.bostonherald.com/tvNews/view.bg?articleid=129469

2006-03-08 11:25:23
235.   Uncle Miltie
Did you guys actually see Greinke in his rookie season?
112 ERA+ almost a 4:1 K:BB ratio 1.16 WHIP as a 20 year old! The guy has amazing talent and he's a very smart pitcher. He can get his fastball up to 95 MPH, but his real gem of a pitch is his big loopy curveball, just like Dave LaRoche's. He'll throw a 95 fastball and then come back with a 55 MPH curve. He's fun to watch.
2006-03-08 11:26:49
236.   Marty
234 That's what I call Must See TV!!
2006-03-08 11:31:14
237.   regfairfield
235 Can he actually throw the 55 MPH curve, or is that just in MVP Baseball?
2006-03-08 11:37:28
238.   Steve
I disagree with a lot of what Dan LeBatard says about Bonds too, but he's closer:

"The latest 'news' on Bonds isn't shocking, revelatory or even terribly interesting."

2006-03-08 11:51:34
239.   Andrew Shimmin
238- The news itself may not be interesting, but the excerpt was. He quit paying his girlfriend's mortgage because he found a new one, and liked her better? Part of his steroid using was using other drugs to mitigate the damage of the 'roids; mitigating drugs included women's fertility drugs? The very greasy detail that instead of actually paying people, regularly and on time, he played lottery fairy, popping up every once and again with a stack of cash?

These things are interesting. Not noble, but they well and truly captured my interest.

2006-03-08 11:55:43
240.   Jon Weisman
The overall story about Bonds is not new, but it's major. And the new book fills in some details about a major story. So in that respect, it's news and somewhat revelatory, regardless of whether its shocking or even terribly interesting.

I would say that I'm interested in the story but that it's not interesting, like a friend (baseball) getting a root canal.

2006-03-08 11:59:49
241.   overkill94
What, no mention of our current spring training home run leader (tied at least) Sandy Alomar? Mueller hit one out also and it looks like Billingsley had a bit of a rough outing today. That's all I can decipher from the Yahoo scoreboard.
2006-03-08 12:03:38
242.   overkill94
Just turned on the Cubs vs. Panama game (tape delayed I'm pretty sure) and got a kick out of the announcers saying that Ruben Rivera should be bunting with no outs and runners on 1st and 2nd. When Olmedo Saenz is one of your top hitters, I don't think you want another one of the actual major league hitters on your squad bunting. Lo and behold, he hit a 3-run homer.
2006-03-08 12:03:54
243.   overkill94
Oops, Cuba, not Cubs.
2006-03-08 12:04:39
244.   underdog
Now it's 8-3 Dodgers, and in addition to Alomar and Mueller, Cody Ross (break up Cody Ross!) hit one out. Yeah, looks like Billingsley gave up all 3 runs, but dunno the specifics.

Poor Cody Ross, a good spring and he probably still won't have a job.

C

2006-03-08 12:09:47
245.   jasonungar05
Corey Patterson took him deep. He hung a curveball. The best part:

Eric Gagne worked a perfect fifth inning, retiring all three batters on 5 pitches. He had one strikeout.

2006-03-08 12:09:59
246.   overkill94
244 Well, if he hits well enough he could pull a Romano and get traded to a better situation. He didn't look too great in his call-up last year, but he had a decent minor league track record before.

I wonder if Gagne already pitched, seems like all the other pitchers today are doing well.

2006-03-08 12:10:28
247.   overkill94
245 Now that's what I call service!
2006-03-08 12:12:57
248.   overkill94
242 I guess this game is live after all, I forgot that Cuba played Puerto Rico yesterday.

Saenz just made a nice play at 3B by the way.

2006-03-08 12:13:18
249.   underdog
245 More good news: Joel Guzman just hit one out.

9-3.

2006-03-08 12:24:14
250.   bhsportsguy
240 - The thing I got out of the SI excerpt is the amount of detail, it appears they had various sources including sworn testimony.

The following are the career achievements of two players as of the end of the 1998 season, one of these players is 28 and the other is 33, my question, were both of these players headed to the HOF?

363 HRs, 9 Gold Gloves, 9 All-Star Games, 4 HR titles, 1 MVP

411 HRs, 8 Gold Gloves, 8 All-Star Games, 1 HR title, 3 MVPs

Ken Griffey Jr. had 48 less home runs than Barry Bonds and he had 5 years on him, if there was anyone who was on track to beat Aaron, it was the Kid. Bonds' career high was 46 and he did that back in 1993. The Kid had averaged over 50 for the past 3 seasons. So while others may argue that Bonds was a sure HOF back in 1998, I don't buy it.

Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2006-03-08 12:26:46
251.   Fallout
The Bonds story is major because it has depth and detail not revealed b4. It has to quiet all but the most stubborn defenders about his use. He has really put baseball in a predicament.
2006-03-08 12:33:02
252.   JROBB
Did you guys see the article about Wells going off on Selig at ESPN. Good read. There is no way he will be a Dodger because the McCourts would be afraid of the PR problems he could bring on them.
2006-03-08 12:35:54
253.   Steve
If Wojchiehowitz really wants to take on a new scandal, why doesn't he write something blasting CBS's absurd strategy for showing next week's tournament on the internet. VIP passes. Please.
2006-03-08 12:37:48
254.   thinkblue0
mlbtraderumors.com is reporting that we could send Joel Guzman and Greg Miller to the A's for Zito. Don't think it'll happen, but an interesting tidbit nonetheless.

Also, it mentions that Miguel Cabrera is on the block. I can't see how they'd even talk to us unless our conversation started with Billingsley and Guzman....

2006-03-08 12:51:51
255.   DodgerBakers
244 and 230
Dodgers win 9-3. Yeah for spring training
2006-03-08 12:59:39
256.   OaklandAs
250 You don't show all of the relevant stats. Through 1998, Bonds had a career OBP of around .420, while Griffey was around .380. That's a huge difference. Bonds also had over 400 SB, while Griffey was 150. If Bonds had retired after the 1998 season, with 400+ HRs, 400+ SBs, .300 AVG, .420 OBP, 3 MVPs with 8 Top 10 Finishes, and 8 Gold Gloves, I think he easily would have made the HOF.
2006-03-08 13:23:20
257.   bhsportsguy
256 - First, the next time any HOF voter mentions OBP as a reason to vote for a player in the HOF will be the first time. I agree that his Power/Speed number and the fact that he along with Griffey were in the top 5 players for the decade with Bonds being the top player for the NL would have been a good argument. But, you would have also had to bring up is post-season struggles prior to 2002 and his team's lack of post-season success.

I don't remember of all Bill James arguments when he raised the HOF first in his Baseball Abstract and then in his book but I do recall that a Level 1 HOF was reserved for someone who could argubly be considered the best ever in his position. In the last 25-30 years, I can think of just a few that have played, Joe Morgan at 2B, Mike Schmidt at 3B, possibly Bench at C and Roger Clemens at P. Barry Bonds made that cut when he started hitting those home runs, he was among Ted Williams, Stan Musial as the best ever LF. If you take his last 5-6 seasons away or taint them, he does not belong with those players even with his great power/speed numbers.

2006-03-09 00:05:00
258.   Brendan
I know it's late to this thread but 400HR and 400 Steals would have put Bonds in the Hall. It's not like he would have stopped playing altogether in 1998. it's likely he would have had 500(Like Griffey) and 500 HR was automatic with 400 steals. Plus 3 MVP's.

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