we seem to have a continuing problem with our trainers and physicians

I made this comment late last night in the previous thread, but it's actually more relevant here:

Don't know if anyone else mentioned this, but Will Carrol (Under the Knife on BP) reports that Cesar suffered a big setback in his rehab. He wonders if it might not just be a case of CF-itis, but anyway says no Cesar before mid-June.

Jon, you are right on about Furcal, the Dodgers have to allow his body the opportunity to get right. A week or two without him now is well worth it if it means he comes back stronger.

Personally, I'd add Jeff Kent to the list of Dodgers who need more than two days off. He hasn't looked right to me since he got hit in his triceps. I don't think he needs as much time as Furcal to recuperate but I'd bite the bullet and sit him too at least through this weekend's series. We need both of them at 100% if we are going to do anything this year.

Rafael Furcal is such a marshmallow.

Sometimes he's a toasted marshmallow.

2

Don't forget about his terminal case of BB-itis.

6You don't walk off the DL

Now we get a Google ad for a doctor who specializes in repairing scapulas.

That's what I think. It seemed like a very odd specialty.

7

Or the DR.

[9] or venezuela, apparently.

I know that I personally have no such scrupples about taking several sick days in a row. Hangnail? Sick day. Sniffles? Sick day. Dyspepsia? Sick day.

Perhaps that explains why they're major league ballplayers and I'm a lowly mouse-jockey... But at least I'm a mouse-jockey without lingering performance-decreasing ailments.

8 - I fractured my scapula diving for a ball in softball 15 years ago. Weird coincidence.

11 - The commenter so nice, they named him twice.

I think a big batch of amphetamines would make everybody feel better.

13 - New Dodger slogan: Think Greenies

10

For the record, I knew he wasn't Dominican. The joke just worked better that way, and sometimes that's what is most important.

i knew you knew! i just wanted to chime in, and close the loop.

Loop, dude.

Loop.

But like many of us, we don't goto the doctors until it is too late. In the back of our mind, we think injuries will naturally heal sooner or later. Ballplayers think no differently.

lemurs, man, lemurs.

18

Speaking of that, I was surprised to see a message from Kaiser in my email Wednesday, the day after I took a cholesterol test. They sent me a link to the results (I had to log in obviously). I'm almost below the Mendoza line!

My cholesterol level and Rafael Furcal's batting average are nearly identical!

Derek Lowe might be another Dodger who "thrives while hobbled." Evidently, he actually pitches better when he's tired than when he's at full strength, because he throws harder at full strength (and gets less sinking action in the process).

This is what I don't understand about the "man up, nancy boy!" crowd...

For the sake of argument, an injured Furcal is no better than a healthy Oscar Robles right now. If you are going to get similar production from them, let Furcal get healthy. It will help the team more in the long run.

21 - I've heard that speculated, but I need someone to show me the proof.

As far as Kent goes, he isn't acknolwedging any discomfort - not that I'm saying he would - so it's harder for me to speculate about whether he needs rest or is just in a bad slump. He certainly looks weak at the plate, though he smoked a line drive in the ninth last night that could have helped the Dodgers toward a miracle rally.

22 - exactly. It's like, well, Pedro Martinez after 120 pitches is no more effective than ...

24 Even more confusing is that Little is being so careful with Drew.

So, where's the part when Otto and Henson ask the trainers for comment?

20 LDL or HDL? ;-)

27

HDTV

The last time I got my cholesterol level tested, about three years ago, it was in the 200s.
Since then, I've solved the problem - by not getting my cholesterol checked again.

I believe I've documented my cholesterol battles sufficiently in the past.

In May 2004, the bad was in the 200s. Following a bitter reduction in hamburger and candy bar consumption and an increase in instant oatmeal, I knocked it down to 130 in May 2005.

I'm due to see if it was a fluke.

My total cholesterol used to be in the 150's when I was caught up in the low fat craze. I really used to be into fitness. But since I started eating more fat and protein, it has been 180-200. But I'm not worried, because my HDL is about 85.

52 HDL
128 LDL
385 OBP

30 I know instant oatmeal is very convenient, but the old fashioned slow cooked oatmeal is better for you. Much lower in glycemic index (speed at which it is converted to blood sugar).

Also the drop in cholesterol was achieved through the good efforts of the American pharmaceutical industry since it didn't seem to matter what I ate.

34 - Better living through chemistry, or PEDs?

32

385 OBP

That was yesterday's thread, Bob. We've finished boasting about our "baseball" exploits for the time being.

By the way, I'm slugging around .525 this week.

I'm always a day late and three Euros short.

The longer you're married, you tend to have fewer ABs but a homerun every time.

37

Really? I figured someone as tall as you could see over today and into tomorrow.

So I suppose I shouldn't link this story from MLB.com on The Griddle:

http://tinyurl.com/psexf

40

LOL. The headline is the best part.

28 - HDTV

OT, but I was wondering if anyone had any advice for a DirecTV user looking into HD with Tivo?

We had a topic?

Not related to your cholesterol levels nor Rafael Furcal's finger.

Good thing Izturis is on the mends.
vr, Xei

40 Oh, bleah. I haven't scored a game in years, but doing it with a PalmPilot or equivalent? That's just asking for carpal tunnel syndrome.

I used to draw vertical lines for innings and horizontals for players in spiral notebooks while listening to Vin and Jerry on KFI.

Alex Belth wrote a great article on once and future Yankee Stadium.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/alex_belth/04/27/new.stadium/1.html

45

Not according to Will Caroll. He says Izturis is still a ways off from returning.

>>>Steve Henson of the Times wrote that Furcal has been getting better - sort of:<<<

Also at the bottom of that article is an interesting response from Navarro after Little talked to him about pitch that was not blocked and allowed runners to advance.
"There isn't a catcher in baseball who can block a 94-mph fastball that's out of the strike zone like that one," he said.

I don't think Little wants to hear that from a 22 yr old rookie catcher.

I don't think I want to hear that from any catcher.

49 - A little effort and form would've been nice, even if it didn't get blocked.

At least he isn't Angel Pena...yet.

Is the site refreshing slow for anyone besides me?

Interesting article that's not linked at The Griddle. But I'll wager that Bob breaks down and ends up linking it.

I learned how to keep score from my best friend's mom, of all people. She was fanatical about it and never left a Dodger game early. Even when she knew she'd be stuck in Dodger stadium traffic with 3 obnoxious teenagers for the long ride back to Calabasas. In retrospect I wonder if that says something about the mindset of a person who keeps score. It certainly speaks to determination and single-mindedness. I always loved the fact that she never left early. I don't see her using a palm pilot to keep score though, or wanting to. The scorecard and program are such a large part of the score-keeping experience.

No problems here. How refreshing.

I have personally viewed Bob's scorebook. What's most interesting is how he draws a small portrait of each player next to his respective name in the lineup. A nice touch, indeed.

scoring etiquette query:

do you color in the diamond on all runs scored, or just home runs?

57 I do all runs, makes it much easier to find runs scored.

57 gcrl

All runs as regfairfield said.

I just complete a diamond to show a run scored and then write the number of the run in the center.

I don't draw small portraits of the players. I actually make lithographs.

MLB.com changed the headline on the article to:
"New software makes scoring fun again"

You mean it wasn't fun before? Why the heck did I drag that scorebook with me wherever I went?

"New software makes scoring fun again"

Isn't this the sort of thing that belonged in yesterday's thread?

61 Bob Timmermann

It looked cool when you carried it in your briefcase.

I don't own a briefcase.

Maybe you should get one. :)

Bob, where do you get your scorebooks from?

I found some perfect ones at Sportmart six or seven years ago that had tons of space, and didn't waste room by giving 20 spots in the batting order, but I haven't seen them since?

Where can you get a good scorecard from?

I use a Bob Carpenter Scorebook.

You can order them at
http://www.bcscorebook.com/

And I think Bob Carpenter himself (the Nationals TV announcer) handles a lot of the orders himself. At least when I got one last year, he told my brother in the press box in St. Louis that I had ordered one from him.

Good thing he only sells scorebooks.

I've been using the scoresheets that came with the Pursue the Pennant dice game I bought back in '87 or so. They work well enough.

Via Baseball Primer, there's this from Kevin Kennedy on Fox Sports.

http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/5542626

"I read the other day that Washington's John Patterson is going to miss a start with soreness in his forearm. Several pitchers have had a similar complaint this season. I don't know whether these guys are spending too much time in the weight room or they're simply reporting every little ache and pain."

"I would never question another man's injury, but I know that guys years ago seemed to tough it out more and often refused to come out of the lineup. Maybe they feared for their jobs then because they didn't have long-term contracts and guys who went on the DL sometimes never came off ... at least not with the same team. But there's a big difference from being hurt and just sore, and playing through pain. When we had the A's Eric Chavez on our XM show the other day he told us that he flat-out loves to play and wants to be in the lineup. He feels it's his responsibility as the leader of the team and he will continue to play through pain whenever necessary. Look at Cal Ripken, Jr. Do you think he never had pain or minor injuries during his great consecutive game streak? Ripken obviously felt an obligation to play. He wasn't about to come out of that lineup."

Amazing. It doesn't occur to Kennedy at all that these minor aches and pains might affect performance.

And how long has it been since the free agency era started?

67 That does look amazing.

I just don't know if I could drop 35 dollars on a scorebook.

And how long has it been since the free agency era started?

30 years.

The history of baseball is built on layers upon layers of torn rotator cuffs, ruptured ACLs, and empty beer bottles.

23 It seems to me that Kent looks a lot different now at the plate than he did before he was first hit in the arm. On those rare stretches when he slumped last year, he seemed to swing and miss a lot more than he is now, an issue of not seeing the ball well and/or his timing being off. This current stretch seems to be more of a case of lack of strength in my opinion, lots of lazy fly balls. As you intimate, Kent is the prototypical old school baseball player who will play through any pain. I just am worried we could have a Shawn Green situation where machismo interferes with common sense and an injury is not immediately acknowledged or adequately addressed. Of course, you're also right that this is all just speculation. I was just wondering if other fans share the same concern or just chalk Kent's struggles up to the ups and downs of a long season.

72 - "I just am worried we could have a Shawn Green situation where machismo interferes with common sense and an injury is not immediately acknowledged or adequately addressed. "

Believe me, I have the same worry.

The ScorePad program is pretty cool. Of course it costs anywhere from $39 to $169. I learned how to keep score when I was about 7 or 8 years old, when my mom was one of the official scorekeepers for our little league. It's ironic that this software came out now because I am working on my own score keeping software program. Of course mine will be free, but it won't have all the bells and whistles like the spray charts and the eye appealing graphics. When it's ready I will have to run it by Bob to get some suggestions and comments. vr, Xei

Scorebooks should always have lots of spaces to write in the names of pitchers.

11 and 12-man bullpens have made 6 or 7 pitcher games quite common.

I believe the Giants used 9 players in the #9 spot yesterday.

I usually ordered new scoresheets from Strat-o-Matic every year and would just bring one to a game. I'm a packrat normally - it's strange I didn't care about saving them.

I didn't start buying scorebooks until my mother passed away in 1993 and I realized that a lot of the things I did in life had no record of them happening.

But I'm saving up my "Tribute to My Old Scorebook" for a later time. When I've tried to write it, it ends up sounding like Johnny Cash's "Ragged Old Flag".

I have a PDF that I found on the web somewhere and modified a bit that I use to score with. Just print a few out and head to the game with a clipboard. Not quite as impressive as the ones Bob uses, but it does a good job, has little boxes to keep pitch count for each PA, and has rarely failed me on pitching/hitting slots. I'd be happy to forward it on to anybody who wants it.

Xei, if you have a Mac version of your scoring program I'd be happy to beta it!

When I was younger, I kept track of pitch counts. But I found it to be more trouble than it was worth especially if I was with someone.

Fortunately nearly every stadium keeps track of pitches now on the scoreboard. If there's a particularly long batter-pitcher sequence, I will note it.

I think James Loney had a 11 or 12 pitch at bat against Mike Remlinger.

It was a technical draw as Loney reached first on an error by Edgar Renteria.

69 Kevin Kennedy: I would never question another man's injury, but I'll question it right now.

80 - Yes, you're an adept translator.

a lot of the things I did in life had no record of them happening
Reminds me of the Bill James essay, in one of the Abstracts, discussing a man from his hometown. When he died, he was forgotten - not because he was forgettable, but because he left behind no statistics.

82

All I've got are scorebooks and cholesterol test results.

Here's what I wrote yesterday:
Does anyone think there's a correlation between Rafael Furcal's lack of production and his weight? He weighed in at 195 in spring training. I believe he weighed between 175-180 pounds last year, so he may be 15 pounds overweight. I think a lot of it has to do with the knee surgery he had before spring training. It is probably preventing him for doing rigorous workouts. So far this year, he hasn't hit a lick, but he is showing tremendous patience. He is seeing 4.43 pitches per plate appearance and his walk rate so far is the best of his career. The thing I'm very concerned about is Furcal's lack of power. He regularly produces (around) 50 extra base hit seasons. This year, he only has 2 extra base hits (both doubles). I think he is covering up an injury that is affecting him at the plate and in the field (with his footwork).

I guess Mariano Duncan agrees with me regarding Furcal's footwork. The Dodgers need to rest him for a week and start Oscar Robles, not Lucille II, in his place.

Bob, I don't want to distract from your story about the incident on the Griddle, but I just saw the video from the Delmon Young bat toss (on mlb.com). Most of the news reports I've read have described it as you did - "a flipping of the bat" (I was envisioning Willie Mays Hayes bouncing his bat off the plate in Major League).

He threw the bat. Hard. And from a pretty good distance.

That kid needs a major suspension for that.

Wow that was pretty hard. Such anger...

85 The video of Young's bat toss is more like a webcam updating every two seconds. I see: Young walks off the left side of the screen, the ump walks off the right side of the screen, and then suddenly the bat is on the plate. Apparently he threw it from a pretty good distance, but from that video it's impossible to judge much beyond that. Doesn't look good for Delmon, though, because he must have been throwing it back towards home plate (instead of just down as I might have envisioned). I agree that it seems like a major suspension is at hand.

I don't know if you guys saw this but I enjoyed reading David Schoenfield's piece on abc7.com about all-time draft busts (through all major sports). Of particular interest is this one, which is hard to argue with:

"53. Bill Bene, Los Angeles Dodgers (No. 5, 1988) No, that's not Billy Beane, the Oakland general manager. This guy was a hard-throwing right-hander who was more wild than Charlie Sheen on vacation in Cancun during spring break. Bene rarely pitched at Cal State Los Angeles, but the Dodgers clocked him at 100 mph and took him over such future big leaguers as Jim Abbott, Robin Ventura, Tino Martinez and Alex Fernandez. At one point, the Dodgers wouldn't let him pitch batting practice to live batters and had him pitch to a department-store mannequin. Career totals in the minors: 18-34, 5.45 ERA, 516 innings, 543 walks, 502 strikeouts."

http://tinyurl.com/lvf4b

Would this ScorePad program be able to update rosters when you connect to dump scored games, etc? Doesn't seem like it would be too hard to set up your own little Gameday at the ballpark, especially if you are in a ginormous hot spot like PacBellSBCATT Park.

First game I tried to score was against the Dodgers. 8-25-95. You've all heard this before.

85 - Good thing everybody uses tiny tiny bats these days. If it had been, say, Ryan Howard tossing his bat...

87 - I saw a better picture than that. The video I saw had Delmon walk off stage right (or is that stage left?), but the ump stayed center. Then you see a bat come launching from off-screen and nail the ump flush in the gut.

88

I never understood that one. Why did they have to use the fifth pick in the draft on Bene?

Who else was going to take him? Seems like he could've been had later on if they wanted to take the gamble.

LA got Ventura 15 years too late.

90

That's the clip I saw. You don't see Young throw the bat, but it comes flying pretty fast.

What I'm impressed most by is that the ump doesn't even seem to flinch.

That's a man who trusts his chest protector.

91 Yeah, they could have taken Bene in the 32nd round even. Ventura would have been nice back then; that one still depresses me.

It's ironic that of the umpire, the broadcaster, and Delmon Young, only Delmon Young was right about where that pitch was. Not to forgive him flinging bats at people.

I like how most of the news reports say he was "flipping" the bat. That looks really bad.

That was the bad old days of the Dodgers and the draft.
From memory: Kiki Jones, Dan Opperman.

96 Makes you appreciate Logan White and company all the more doesn't it? Who was their scouting director back then, Ed Wood Jr?

I use this scoresheet:
http://ericenders.com/images/scoresheet.jpg

I'm very fussy about my scoresheets and finally got tired of not being able to find one to my specifications, so I made my own.

A few years ago I had some printed up and spiral-bound and started selling them on the internet and in a few Barnes & Noble stores. I sold about 1,500 before I got tired of the hassle and quit. The profit margin wasn't enough to make it worth my time in filling orders. Every once in a while I still get an angry/desperate e-mail from somebody who wants one really bad and doesn't want to accept that it's out of print.

The key part of the design, IMO, was that the spiral was on the top, which made it possible for left-handed people like myself to use.

Anyone ready Bill Simmons' recent interview with Malcolm Gladwell? In discussing Isiah Thomas' reign of error in New York, Gladwell made the point that a person who knew literally nothing about basketball would do better than Isiah simply because the non-fan wouldn't trust his gut. Instead, he'd defer to people who knew more than him. The result might be a team comprised of nothing but players from UConn and Duke: Rip Hamilton, Battier, Okafor, etc.
I mention this, because the past Dodgers brain trust would've done far better in the draft had they employed a strategy of doing nothing more than picking players from, say, Arizona State, USC, Texas and Florida State.