Baseball Toaster Dodger Thoughts
Help
Jon Weisman's outlet
for dealing psychologically
with the Los Angeles Dodgers
and baseball.
Frozen Toast
Search
Google Search
Web
Toaster
Dodger Thoughts
Archives

2009
02  01 

2008
12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

2007
12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

2006
12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

2005
12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

2004
12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

2003
12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

2002
09  08  07 
About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Outfield Shopping
2006-11-01 09:00
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

Whether as a stopgap while the Dodgers wait for Matt Kemp to develop, or as insurance against a slump by Andre Ethier or an injury to J.D. Drew, the Dodgers are shopping for an outfielder.

Below are the 50 top outfielders in baseball, based on 2006 EQA by Baseball Prospectus. No, this doesn't factor in defense, but if defense were all the Dodgers were worried about, the team would just resurrect Wilkin Ruan or something. Okay, I exaggerate, but I do think we can make the assumption that unless the team acquires a power-hitting third baseman like Aramis Ramirez, the team wants above-average offense in its outfield. (If the Dodgers do get Ramirez, then the team might be content to pursue cheaper and/or in-house options in the outfield.)

I've included all three outfield positions in this group, though if the Dodgers were to acquire a slow-footed or clumsy left fielder, it could force Ethier or Drew into center – which is a risk. Ethier doesn't have great range, and Drew, though he has expressed a desire to play center in the past, maybe shouldn't be forced to cover too much ground either.

Age provided is the player's age on April 1, 2007. Contract information came from Cot's Baseball Contracts, ESPN.com and Rotoworld.

Big Names, Big Contracts
OutfielderAge2005 EQA2006 EQAContract guarantees
Manny Ramirez34.331.352$78M through '10
Carlos Beltran29.265.328$92M through '11
Vladimir Guerrero31.337.321$28M through '08*
J.D. Drew31,323.306$33M through '09
Pat Burrell30.302.301$27M through '08
Johnny Damon33.294.295$39M through '09
Magglio Ordonez33.293.286$45M through '09*
Brian Giles36.328.283$18M through '08*
*Team must buy out future year(s)

Any acquisition from this group, even assuming the other team would consider it, would involve multiple young Dodgers. There is talk that Philadelphia would be more eager than the rest to unload Burrell's salary, in the manner that Bobby Abreu was to the Yankees earlier in 2006. (Drew, who is expected to decline the opt-out provision of his contract, is included in the list for comparison.)

Recently Arrived in a Big Way
OutfielderAge2005 EQA2006 EQAContract guarantees
Grady Sizemore24.297.315$22.95M through '11*
Jason Bay28.327.315$16.5M through '09
Rocco Baldelli25---.299$3M through '08*
Carl Crawford25.294.296$11.75M through '08*
David DeJesus27.289.286$12.8M through '10*
*Team must buy out future year(s)

Younger group, same idea. These gents wouldn't go cheap, because their long-term contracts are modest and/or their futures are so bright.

Newbies/Late Bloomers
OutfielderAge2005 EQA2006 EQAContract guarantees
Chris Duncan25---.313Team option
Matt Holliday27.287.310Made $500,000 in '06
Ryan Church28.287.308
Josh Willingham28.285.298TO/made $327,000 in '06
Marcus Thames30.243.296Made $342,000 in '06
Alex Rios26.267.294Made $354,000 in '06
Brad Hawpe27.258.293Team option
Andre Ethier24---.288Team option
Matt Diaz29.261.286Made $330,000 in '06
Nick Markakis23---.284TO/made $327,000 in '06

These guys make so little money that there is little incentive for their teams to trade them. The possible exceptions include players like Thames and Diaz, who are old for this group and could possibly be had for multiple younger players, and Church – so far I can't find contract information on him. (Ethier is included for comparison. You look at Ethier's age and overall 2006 performance, and while he won't hit .340 anytime soon, I wouldn't panic that he's a pan flash.)

Vets with One Inexpensive Year to Go
OutfielderAge2005 EQA2006 EQAContract guarantees
Jermaine Dye33.290.328$6.75M through '07
Juan Rivera28.267.304$2.025M through '07
Vernon Wells28.274.303$5.6M through '07
Casey Blake33.268.297$3.75M through '07
Mike Cameron34.287.295$7M through '07
Eric Hinske29.272.286$5.625M through '07

The salaries in this group are modest enough, relative to their production, that they figure to stay put. Cameron might be the most overpriced, especially considering his age, but don't hold your breath for a San Diego-Los Angeles trade.

Vets with One Expensive Year to Go
OutfielderAge2005 EQA2006 EQAContract guarantees
Bobby Abreu33.305.316$15M through '07*
Andruw Jones29.302.302$13.5M through '07
Ichiro Suzuki33.293.296$11M through '07
Adam Dunn27.311.289$10.5M through '07*
Jim Edmonds36.308.286Cards have $10M 2007 option
Torii Hunter31.284.283$12M through '07
*Team must buy out future year(s)

Jones or Dunn might be available in a salary dump. Maybe Hunter as well, though the Twins just picked up his 2007 option in recent days. The beat-up Edmonds is probably on the verge of becoming a free agent, with the Cardinals very possibly buying out his 2007 option.

Somewhere in Between
OutfielderAge2005 EQA2006 EQAContract guarantees
Raul Ibanez34.291.302$11M through '08
Jacque Jones31.271.280$9M through '08

Ibanez has been solid enough the past two seasons – he sort of fits the babysitter profile, and could be procured if the Mariners try to rebuild. Jones is cheaper but not much of an impact player.

Arbitration Eligible
OutfielderAge2005 EQA2006 EQAContract guarantees
Reed Johnson30.263.300Made $1.425M in '06
Michael Cuddyer28.269.300Made $1.35M in '06
Milton Bradley28.290.292Made $3.2M in '06
Emil Brown32.291.287Made $1.775M in '06
Wily Mo Pena25.267.287Made $1.25M in '06
Austin Kearns26.271.286Made $1.85M in '06

These guys are in line for fairly major salary jumps. Johnson and Cuddyer improved greatly in 2006 – were those flukes? Bradley, believe it or not, ended the year with a higher EQA than Ethier (though Bradley played in fewer games). I'm thinking he's not headed back this way, however. Brown's been bumping around so long, he was a reserve for me when I was still playing Strat-o-Matic in the 1990s. Pena is on the rise with Boston. Kearns … maybe.

Free Agents
OutfielderAge2005 EQA2006 EQAContract guarantees
Barry Bonds42.343.343Made $18M in '06
Alfonso Soriano31.286.305Made $10M in '06
Moises Alou40.314.304Made $6M in '06
Carlos Lee30.276.302Made $8.5M in '06
David Dellucci33.302.296Made $950,000 in '06
Gary Matthews Jr.32.268.295Made $2.3875M in '06
Dave Roberts34.284.286Made $2.25M in '06
Frank Catalanotto31.289.285Made $2.7M in '06

Finally, here are the guys who don't require the Dodgers to sacrifice anything but money and draft picks (and in one case, peace in our time). Note the big difference in salary relative to the similar EQAs.

Where do the Dodgers go from here? I'm not sure. All I know is, there are very few cheap options to improve the outfield, and a lot of teams to compete with.

Comments (151)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2006-11-01 10:28:58
1.   Bluebleeder87
i'd sink or swim with our present outfield & go after Aramis Ramirez but as i type this i don't feel very good about our home grown outfield options Matt Kemp really needs alot of work out there hopefully he'll turn a corner.
2006-11-01 10:31:06
2.   Chyll Will
Hilarious! Sheffield has burned so many bridges, it's a wonder his mind has any leverage with his mouth.
2006-11-01 10:35:50
3.   Bluebleeder87
i'm also wondering were Mike Piazza will end up? i'm sure he'll start his DH career this upcoming baseball season a Yankee?
2006-11-01 10:37:01
4.   Rocc
I think that BP is wrong, the Rays have Rocco under contract in 2007 for 750 K and 2 MIL in 2008. That's less than 3 MIL, if my math is right. It may be only a difference of 250 K, but that's no small potatoes.

And if Crawford maintains his knack for improving stats every year, he'll be a 25/50 guy in 2008.

2006-11-01 10:37:40
5.   Bluebleeder87
I like Ethier in Left & Drew in right
2006-11-01 10:38:41
6.   Steve
Off topic, but Bill O'Reilly thinks the Times' sports page is "pretty good." So there you go.
2006-11-01 10:47:26
7.   caseybarker
What about available first basemen? It may work out that Loney plays RF. I don't know how good he is at that position, and that would also mean that Drew is a CF which may not be feasible.
2006-11-01 10:54:21
8.   D4P
I heard a rumor that O'Reilly appreciates the fair and balanced coverage from reporters like Plaschke and Simers
2006-11-01 11:02:46
9.   Rocc
6. Bill O'Reilly likes phone sex and harassing interns. He'd fit right in at ESPN
2006-11-01 11:03:29
10.   Rocc
8. DOES NOT COMPUTE! ERROR! ERROR!
2006-11-01 11:05:37
11.   Sushirabbit
9. That would be hilarious to see O'Reilly and Kruk going at it. And I can see HR pontificating. It might actually be funnier.
2006-11-01 11:07:17
12.   Jon Weisman
4 - According to Cot's, Baldelli is
07:$0.75M, 08:$2.25M,

But maybe they're wrong.

Either way, in this context, I would call $250K small potatoes.

2006-11-01 11:08:02
13.   50 years a Dodger Fan
Don't take this as a slam against Drew, but how feasible would it be to trade him for a player who can match his offense AND play centerfield? (Closest match I can think of is Milton Bradley but we know that isn't going to happen.) Granted we'd have to sweeten the trade and maybe extend the player's contract (Andruw Jones?), but if it solves a problem or two for us, why not?
2006-11-01 11:08:05
14.   Jon Weisman
O'Reilly talk here? I don't think that's necessary.
2006-11-01 11:08:16
15.   Bluebleeder87
9

the two faces of Bill O'Reilly fair & balanced by day, sexual beast by night!

2006-11-01 11:08:46
16.   Bluebleeder87
14

sorry Jon for taking the bait

2006-11-01 11:10:35
17.   D4P
O'Reilly talk here? I don't think that's necessary.

Nor is it sufficient

2006-11-01 11:10:47
18.   Bluebleeder87
13

your idea works for me.

2006-11-01 11:12:21
19.   regfairfield
13 Unless you believe Gary Matthews Jr. can slightly improve on this year, it's impossible. The only center fielders with a .900 OPS were Carlos Beltran and Grady Sizemore, and they aren't going anywhere. Even so, Drew had a higher on base percentage than both of them.
2006-11-01 11:17:44
20.   Sushirabbit
13 I like it. You know, thinking about it, if it were up to me, I'd also like to limit our senior-development. So as much as I like Edmonds and think he'd work in a Lofton like way, I'd rather get somebody 30 years old or younger.
2006-11-01 11:18:29
21.   regfairfield
I suppose I should mention Andruw Jones and Vernon Wells (whoops). Jones is a 10/5 player, so I don't think he's going anywhere, while Wells will require a ton of talent for one year of service.
2006-11-01 11:20:18
22.   Sushirabbit
13,19,20

Yeah to 20, and Jones looks like he's losing his speed a bit.

2006-11-01 11:21:35
23.   Jacob L
I don't have any strong feelings on potential outfield upgrades, but I did want to wish everyone a Happy Fernando's Birthday (with hat-tip to 6-4-2's daily birthday listings).

Its like a second day of Halloween, for the Orthodox.

2006-11-01 11:21:55
24.   Rocc
11. Pontificating? I think I may need a dictionary. However, I'd love to see Kruk try to eat a full-sized Bill O'Reilly whole. I hear that Kruk's lower mandible unhinges to enable him to consume mass quantities of food.

12. I think that he has to get a few performance incentives to get the full 2.25 MIL next year. I wish I could consider 250 K to be small potatoes, rather than yearly income.

15. He can team up with the guy that hosts "The Insider"(used to be on EXTRA) and become the most terrifying sexual devients in America.
---

Unless DePo takes over as GM in SD in the next 2 years, I've got to turn my NL allegiance to the Dodgers(mainly due to you DT guys & Collett's trades with my beloved Rays). You guys are terrific when boredom at work sets.

2006-11-01 11:24:16
25.   D4P
24
Gee, why do you like Colletti's trades with your Rays so much...?
2006-11-01 11:24:17
26.   Jacob L
24 Wait a sec, you want to root for the Dodgers so you can continue to follow the baseballing exploits of the likes of Toby Hall and Mark Hendrickson? Am I getting that right?
2006-11-01 11:25:58
27.   jakewoods
why not trade broxton for sheffield?

u get a proven 40 homer bat for cheap and the bullpen should be fine with brazoban back.

2006-11-01 11:28:07
28.   D4P
why not trade broxton for sheffield?

Let me count the reasons...

2006-11-01 11:28:54
29.   regfairfield
27 Because I'm pretty sure Sheff would "let a few go by him" if he got sent over here. Plus, I'm generally not over protective of the bullpen, but the Dodgers have a bullpen consisting entirely of Saito if we lose Broxton.
2006-11-01 11:30:42
30.   LAT
why not trade broxton for sheffield?

Don't get me started. . . yet, again.

2006-11-01 11:32:37
31.   D4P
Not to mention

Broxton >>> Brazoban

2006-11-01 11:33:09
32.   Rocc
25. I dunno, really. I think I need to go Baseball Fanatics Anonymous.

26. No, it's because you guys are hilarious when it comes to poking fun of players like that.

2006-11-01 11:35:52
33.   LAT
I havn't thought this all the way through (that is my chicken way of avoiding what I'm about to get) but what about Alou.

Negitives: Old and injured

Positives: Still hits for average and power. You might get him for cheap. You make Kemp the starting CF at the begining of the season. If he struggles you move Drew to center and and Alou to right. If Kemp is playing well then Alou is a very good PH off the bench. Again this all assumes you could get him fairly cheaply, say $3.5M or less with incentives.

I'll take my lumps now.

2006-11-01 11:37:38
34.   Steve
I will have to get Bill O'Reilly's review of the column Bill Plaschke is not going to write about Guillermo Mota.
2006-11-01 11:40:27
35.   Marty
33 Alou has chemistry issues. Mainly the chemistry he applies to his hands, causing no one to want to high-five him, making for bad team chemistry. It's a slippery slope. And I mean slippery.
2006-11-01 11:40:29
36.   Bluebleeder87
Unless DePo takes over as GM in SD in the next 2 years, I've got to turn my NL allegiance to the Dodgers(mainly due to you DT guys & Collett's trades with my beloved Rays). You guys are terrific when boredom at work sets.

i don't know but i think i'm insulted my your last piece [still scratching head]

2006-11-01 11:42:56
37.   D4P
I heard a rumor that Kenny Rogers is the only guy who will "high-five" Moises Alou
2006-11-01 11:45:19
38.   Bluebleeder87
31 Broxton >>> Brazoban

if we keep both i will definetly like our Bullpen next year.

2006-11-01 11:51:00
39.   heato
is it old news that Mota won't be available for the first 50 games next year?
2006-11-01 11:51:59
40.   Sushirabbit
34 Steve, it was a mistake, we were all really refering to the great character actor, Robert (not to be confused with Baba) O'Reilly... ya know, the "Colony" and all that. He was even on Cheers!

Sorry, Xei Frank. :-)

2006-11-01 11:54:16
41.   bhsportsguy
39 I don't think so since it just got released today. You do wonder if MLB knew about this before the playoffs and did not release it until today.
2006-11-01 11:54:41
42.   Sushirabbit
So, along with my other silliness and to take the heat off LAT. Does anybody want Jeff Weaver? ? ?

He's a proven Champion now...

Doesn't Lowe have ADD?

2006-11-01 11:58:27
43.   jakewoods
with the farm system the dodgers supposedly have they can take some prospects and make some package deals for some proven talent. for a bat and a pitcher.

you dont want to end up like the angels. hording prospects who never amount to anything.

2006-11-01 11:59:35
44.   Bluebleeder87
42

the Cards like 'em, he did well for us also.

2006-11-01 12:08:50
45.   Rocc
43. Yeah, I've heard enough of Brandon Wood's alleged "greatness". Didn't we hear that about D-Mac when he was supposedly going to make Angels fans forget about losing Glaus?
2006-11-01 12:11:05
46.   stopthebeachballs
33

I don't mind the idea of Alou. Now that his dad is out as the Gints manager, there's no necessity for him to go back. Plus, the owner (Magowan?) said he wanted the team to get younger.

I'll take some lumps, too.

2006-11-01 12:15:10
47.   Rocc
46. So he's going to retire the entire line-up?
2006-11-01 12:19:26
48.   DodgerfaninNY
I believe there's talk in Cincy that Adam Dunn could be had. I once read in Baseball Prospectus that he would fit perfectly in Dodger Stadium because he doesn't hit alot of doubles, which the stadium tends to take away. I always wondered why the Dodgers were always near the bottom of the league in that catagory. As for his defense... let's just hope he hits alot of home runs.
2006-11-01 12:24:22
49.   Rocc
48. Yup, Dunn could be had for a pitching prospect or 2 from what I've read.
2006-11-01 12:32:10
50.   Bluebleeder87
49 for a pitching prospect or 2 from what I've read.

i'd pass if i were the Dodgers

Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2006-11-01 12:46:48
51.   StolenMonkey86
49 - Kuo and Beimel is my highest offer
2006-11-01 12:48:03
52.   bigcpa
50 You'd pass without even knowing which prospect they want? Would you have passed on Ryan Howard a year ago too?
2006-11-01 12:55:24
53.   Bluebleeder87
Dunn is a K machine & it won't be healthy for me to be yelling @ the T.V. or venting on DodgerThoughts plus i hear his D is very bad
2006-11-01 12:59:56
54.   blue22
Acquiring a guy like Dunn (big masher, big contract, waiting to be a DH) would require floating either Ethier or Loney in trade proposals.

If either guy would bring back a decent young starter (or in the Dunn trade of course), I'd go for it.

2006-11-01 13:01:07
55.   Rocc
52. Do not say Ryan Howard, please. The Rays were allegedly offered Ryan Howard and Ryan Madson in 2005(when Howard was blocked) for a recovering Rocco Baldelli.
2006-11-01 13:03:46
56.   stopthebeachballs
I'm not sure about Dunn. Between the K's and the HR's, he's going to kill a bunch of rallies.
2006-11-01 13:06:20
57.   Bluebleeder87
i have to resist eating any more candy but i'm looking at the plastic jack 'o lantern & i swear it's calling my name! my little nephews are evil i tell ya!
2006-11-01 13:13:04
58.   Daniel Zappala
43,45 So I guess it is OK to quote LA Times sports writers when they spout nonsense about the Angels, just not when it is about the dodgers? :-)

To be fair, Dallas McPherson has a total of 360 at-bats in the majors, and has been hurt. If he hadn't been hurt, it is possible the Angels wouldn't be so worried about letting Glaus go. Likewise, if Kotchman hadn't been out with mono all year (how freaky is that?), the two of them could have given the Angels the power they needed and proven wrong this nonsense about Angels prospects never panning out.

Don't forget, the Angels are at the top of the heap with regard to pitching prospects that turn into great major pitchers. There is every reason to believe Kendrick and Wood will have bright futures with the team, and Mathis and Napoli are still in the picture. Then there's Kendry Morales and Kotchman, one of whom will end up at first.

I would hardly put the Angels in the class of teams that can't produce from their farm system.

2006-11-01 13:13:16
59.   sanchez101
When did this talk of signing Aramis Ramirez come about, and more importantly, why does anyone think it makes any sense? I saw Buster Olney in his "blog" yesterday claim that the Dodgers should sign him because the Dodgers don't have any young thirdbaseman.

What ever happened to Andy LaRoche, or for that matter, Wilson Betemit? Betemit hit 18 homeruns in less than 400 AB's last year, to support a .200 ISO, and hit .281/.344/.505 against RHP last year. If he can't hit lefties, then platoon him with Saenz until LaRoche is ready. Betemit was only 24. Dodger fans are down on him because he didn't look great for 175 AB's in Dodger blue ... so what. Atlanta fans weren't too happy to see him go, and they saw much more of him than we did.

2006-11-01 13:13:19
60.   Bluebleeder87
56

how about his poor D?

2006-11-01 13:16:28
61.   Bluebleeder87
59

i see your point about Betemit but man his Difence made me mad at times

2006-11-01 13:23:07
62.   gibsonhobbs88
I wouldn't mind Andruw Jones in center. At 29, he still has several productive years left and he still plays a great centerfield. Someone like Edmonds basically fills the gap for a year or two at the most until Kemp proves he's ready.

As to the poster in a previous thread that mentioned about Eckstein. I wish I had a team with about 7 or 8 of players with his heart and grit. I was happy he got MVP, he is the poster boy for the Anti-Juicing campaign. BTW, Selig couldn't even pronounce his name right at first, he had to have David whisper it into his ear.
What a buffoon!!!

2006-11-01 13:23:16
63.   sanchez101
The way I see it the Dodgers have three young hitters they need to break in, and all need to produce offensively in order for the team to compete: Kemp in CF, LaRoche at 3B, and Loney at 1B.

I think the best way to bring a young player in is to 'block' him with a decent starter who can be easily moved out of the way, but is good enough to start for a while if the prospect needs some time. This essentially happened with Navarro and Martin, and Jose Cruz and Ethier.

Betemit fill that role in front of LaRoche (and I think Betemit has a decent future, like Navarro).

In regards to Loney, I would sign a decent MI, like say, Craig Counsell (and perhaps a righthanded platoon partner), so that if Loney isn't quite ready you can play Kent at 1B, and once he is, Loney moves up, Kent moves over, and Counsell improves our bench.

For Kemp, we may have that player already in Jason Repko, but it would probably be best to either platoon him with a lefthanded CF or bring in a decent veteran with one year left on his contract (Mark Kotsay? Maybe even Lofton?) that can be easily sent to the bench or another team once Kemp figures out how to translate his AWESOME minor league performance to the majors.

I think this would solve the Dodgers offseason issues in regards to position players without having to soend to much, allowing for maximum effort and dollars going towards upgrade/depth in the rotation.

2006-11-01 13:25:43
64.   sanchez101
62. Boras is talking about Jones getting a monster, Beltran-type contract. I don't think his defense is really as good as it used to be.

I'd rather package Kemp and Elbert for Vernon Wells if Ned wants an impact bat in CF.

2006-11-01 13:29:39
65.   gibsonhobbs88
56 - I agree. A couple years ago, I would have disagreed but seeing him digress as a hitter over the last couple years, he offers more bad side than good. Defense is poor, too many times where he doesn't put the ball in play. He is like the modern day version of Dave Kingman, low average, high HR, high K rate. I'd pass!! I'd rather get a pitcher, even a mid-tier one like Wolfe or Padilla than go after Dunn.
JMHO!!
2006-11-01 13:35:12
66.   gibsonhobbs88
64 - Strike my earlier comment in 62 since Boras is his agent. Is Edmonds one of his clients as well? I want to avoid dealing with that team-busting agent as much as possible. We've been burned big-time by his clients before (see Dreifort, Kevin Brown, ect..) We need pitching, especially starters so get to work Ned!!:)
2006-11-01 13:35:45
67.   natepurcell
you dont want to end up like the angels. hording prospects who never amount to anything.

Id rather horde then go through pedro redux all over again.

2006-11-01 13:36:08
68.   Bluebleeder87
I'd rather package Kemp and Elbert for Vernon Wells if Ned wants an impact bat in CF.

i guess i'm in the catagory of being over protective of our great rooks but IMO Vernon Wells body screams out i'm gonna get fatter as i get older.JMO.

2006-11-01 13:37:20
69.   natepurcell
and lets not trade kuo pleasseeee. I like him.

matter of fact, lets not trade any of our young players. k, thankzzzzz.

2006-11-01 13:44:28
70.   sanchez101
69. I think Ned understands who he needs to keep and who's expendable. It seems clear that he likes Loney, Kemp, and LaRoche. He understood that Navarro and Aybar, Schmoll and Guzman were expendable, even if they do have nice futures ahead of them. It'd be nice if he could get more value for the guys he trades away, rather than just a bunch of crappy middle relievers, but Im of the opinion that its much, much, much more important to keep the right guys than to get absolute maximum value from the guys you do trade.

I don't think Kuo is going anywhere, power lefthanded starter who make nothing are pretty much untouchable.

2006-11-01 13:45:08
71.   Bluebleeder87
69

agreed let's just throw money @ Schmidt & a power bat.

2006-11-01 14:06:12
72.   D4P
I don't think Kuo is going anywhere

I hope not. I'd rather have Kuo than Zito, especially considering their salaries. But even if they were paid the same, I think I'd go with Kuo...

2006-11-01 14:09:46
73.   natepurcell
has anyone read bill simmons nba preview column? I'll admit it, i laughed about 10 times. and i ususually dont find him funny.
2006-11-01 14:22:10
74.   Bluebleeder87
73

do you have a link nate?

2006-11-01 14:27:11
75.   Bluebleeder87
73

don't tell me you have to be an "insider" i just checked it out.

2006-11-01 14:42:59
76.   Bluebleeder87
73

i take that back i just found the correct link.

2006-11-01 15:02:22
77.   blue22
65 - First off, I believe 56 was being sarcastic (unless that's Steve Lyons).

and this:

the modern day version of Dave Kingman

is thrown out quite often, but it is not very accurate. Dave Kingman was a homerun hitter who strikes out a lot but was also a prodigious "out-maker", with a career OBP of .302. Adam Dunn, despite a career .245 batting average, is a top-25 active OBP guy, ranking ahead of guys like Ichiro, Rolen, and Big Papi.

2006-11-01 15:04:58
78.   Daniel Zappala
I liked the article too, Nate, but I must admit I usually do like Simmons. I don't agree with him all the time, but he is entertaining.
2006-11-01 15:24:28
79.   Bluebleeder87
78

i don't fallow basketball so to me it was a so-so read.

2006-11-01 15:52:30
80.   stopthebeachballs
77

Thanks for catching the sarcasm. The problem with trading for Dunn is then we couldn't talk about wanting to trade for Dunn (one of my favorite hot-stove pastimes).

2006-11-01 15:58:26
81.   StolenMonkey86
61- There really are not many good defensive third basemen. That, and it's a tough position to play. The old kitchen sink measurement, fielding percentage, shows an average around .955 for third basemen over the last few years.

I love how Baseball-Reference lists Betemit at 6-2 155 lbs.

2006-11-01 17:19:42
82.   trainwreck
Elbert is off limits in my eyes, unless I am getting a proven young starter in return. Why trade away our talented pitching prospects when everyone is in need of pitching? I think the best strategy is to keep as much pitching as you can.
2006-11-01 17:46:10
83.   overkill94
Just to finalize the notion that the Mariners aren't after Matsuzaka:

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=MLB&id=776

2006-11-01 17:58:18
84.   Bluebleeder87
82

i like your way of thought

2006-11-01 18:29:44
85.   bhsportsguy
Roy Smith returned to Pittsburgh as Special Assistant.

Jeff Suppan filed for free agency today, 148 players have filed, 45 are still eligible to file.

Seattle Mariners have released a statement taking them out of the Gyromaster's shopping spree.

Rumors that the Giants have contacted Nomar's agent and that Boston is interested in signing Lugo are being tossed around.

There is also a rumor that the Dodgers want to sign Maddux for one year while he wants 2 years.

2006-11-01 18:33:13
86.   trainwreck
2 years give me a break Maddux. He will average 4 innings a start by then.
2006-11-01 18:43:39
87.   StolenMonkey86
86 - I'd give him an option for the second year. I think he could still make it; if he throws slower he'll get more movement, and as long as he can field his position and work quickly he's still something of an asset in the rotation in that regard.
2006-11-01 19:00:03
88.   Yu-Hsing Chen
New York Yankees: offers you Gary Sheffield, 1 year, 13M, much of it differed, and wililng to pay some of it, perfect (albit chatty) stop gap, produced 30+ win shares in 2 of his last 3 years, what would you offer?
2006-11-01 19:01:53
89.   trainwreck
Joel Hanrahan.
2006-11-01 19:03:17
90.   trainwreck
Actually, I heard the Yankees want relief pitching in return. Hendrickson it is!
2006-11-01 19:06:36
91.   Yu-Hsing Chen
90 lol ;) I think Yankees have uses for Toby Hall though, someone the Dodgers certainly don't have much use for.

Hall + a reasonable prospect?

2006-11-01 19:11:17
92.   Bluebleeder87
2 years give me a break Maddux. He will average 4 innings a start by then.

i don't mean anything bad by this but the Dodgers trying to sell me that Maddux is a work out freak just rubbed me the wrong way, one can just look at his body & see other wise.

ps Vinnie mentioned that he had a trainer during the offseason & that he worked out very very hard during the offseason, no disrespect Vinnie but you can tell when somebody works out & Maddux does not work out!

2006-11-01 19:22:24
93.   twerp
85 86 IMO, if somewhere in a two-year contract Maddux got to where he couldn't go enough innings as a starter, he'd make a fine reliever--in theory. IF a future HOFer would do that to help his team, Maddux probably would be it.

Mental makeup is a lot of successful relieving. No one has a better mental game than Maddux. Get flustered if put in a tough situation? Hardly. Shake off bad outings? No problem. Have the brains, guile, and knowledge to make it work? You betcha. Bet he could do it...and well, even with somewhat more diminished stuff.

Yeah, I know. Wake up from this dream or whatever it is....

2006-11-01 19:32:32
94.   franklin
86 Given comments from Ned, I'd be surprised if Maddux doesn't re-sign with the Dodgers whether it's for 1 OR 2 seasons. Six innings of Maddux is still better than most of the other available options even with the occasional blow-out.

His LA numbers pro-rated to a full season are 18-9 (I know, I know, wins don't adequately reflect performance--but look 18 wins). I would be amazed if he pulled that off but I wouldn't be surprised if he logged another 13-15 wins and 180-200 innings. Maddux is currently 16 wins from surpassing Clemens as the most victorious pitcher of his generation--I wouldn't bet against him with that as motivation. (Assuming Clemens is finally done with the half-season curtain call act and stays at 348)

2006-11-01 19:34:22
95.   overkill94
Ugh, there was a question on Jeopardy today that was the $400 question in double jeopardy (aka the easiest question of the category) showing Mike Piazza and asking what team he played for between 1992 and 1998. The first guy who rang in said "the Mets", the second guy said "the Jets", and the third person didn't ring in.

The worst part was that Alex Trebeck claimed - after no one wrang in with the right answer - that Piazza started with the Mets, but then went to the Dodgers. Idiots.

2006-11-01 19:42:29
96.   Bluebleeder87
The worst part was that Alex Trebeck claimed - after no one wrang in with the right answer - that Piazza started with the Mets, but then went to the Dodgers. Idiots.

hahaha! i can feel your dislike overkill94, oh by the way i met Alex Trebeck on the Sony lot in Culver city, i worked for Iron Mountain a records management co. the company has a contract with them & i was sent over there to work on some data processing "stuff" very very humble down to earth guy he is.

2006-11-01 19:44:59
97.   trainwreck
What is with the Clippers starting lineup?
2006-11-01 19:46:09
98.   caseybarker
The Jets?! That's fantastic.
2006-11-01 20:22:45
99.   thinkingblue
SI thinks the dodgers will resign Maddux. I think that's a good move, you can count on him starting 30+ games a year, and when you look at other pitchers around, he comes out looking good.

My only concern is what that would mean for guys like Kuo, Elbert, ect. What would happen if the dodgers signed Maddux, and a Matsuzaka/Schmidt/Zito ect? Would that mean Kuo is out of the rotation? Or would it be better for the dodgers to trade Penny, and have a rotation of M/S/Z Lowe, Maddux, Billingsley, Kuo?

2006-11-01 20:23:20
100.   Rocc
Andy Friedman, GM of the Rays, said today on a Radio show that if the Rays trade any of their current vets....it won't be for prospects anymore. It'll be MLB players for MLB players and prospects for prospects.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2006-11-01 20:28:09
101.   trainwreck
At least we won't have to worry about LaRoche to the Devil Rays now.
2006-11-01 20:28:43
102.   trainwreck
Yeah, I will still call them the Devil Rays.
2006-11-01 20:54:18
103.   caseybarker
LaRoche for Niemann!
2006-11-01 20:54:37
104.   overkill94
I don't get it, Yahoo's box score says the Lakers are down 48-40 at halftime, but the broadcast says they're up 49-48 (I just turned it on). Is Yahoo on crack again?
2006-11-01 21:11:45
105.   trainwreck
yes
2006-11-01 21:27:38
106.   D4P
Will the Lakers continue such balanced scoring and "team play" when Kobe returns, or will he come back and take over, with everyone standing around watching him...?
2006-11-01 21:46:01
107.   trainwreck
We will find out possibly Friday.
2006-11-01 22:12:54
108.   D4P
Turiaf leads the way with 23 points in 29 minutes on 8-10 shooting.

Before fouling out...

2006-11-01 22:14:06
109.   trainwreck
Not even Turiaf expected that.
2006-11-01 22:44:07
110.   Rocc
101 and 102. Not sure with Longoria here that we'd ask for LaRoche. You'll still call them the Rays as opposed to what?
2006-11-01 22:56:37
111.   underdog
85 "Rumors that the Giants have contacted Nomar's agent and that Boston is interested in signing Lugo are being tossed around."

I'd be happier if that was reversed.

I like Nomar - I'll understand it if the Dodgers don't resign him for what money he'll probably ask for, but I'd hate to see him go to the Giants. Lugo, on the other hand, they can have.

2006-11-01 23:23:57
112.   trainwreck
110
New owners dropped the Devil from their name.
2006-11-01 23:26:39
113.   Yu-Hsing Chen
The D-rays have a mess in the infield right now. i'm not sure what their going to do .

Also it seems reasonable for them to trade one of Crawford/Baldelli/Dukes, all 3 have value more or less. (or should i say more and more?) Cantu also seems like a trade candidates as is Gomes more or less.

Hard to figure out what to do with the team, it has so much talent but simply not comming together into anything coherent (guess it doesn't help that they are run by guys who's resume in baseball is winning his fantasy league) I think for a start at least they sign some one people heard of to draw a bigger crowd would help. even declining stars will help put a few more average joes into the seats .... Mike Piazza anyone?

2006-11-01 23:41:16
114.   overkill94
113 They could also use a starting pitcher or two besides Mr. Kazmir.
2006-11-02 00:06:20
115.   Yu-Hsing Chen
114 not many of those guys around though, and I cringe if they sign any more mediocare guys with no particular use but still cost them money. if they are going to sign, at least go for guys that can help their staff in terms of experience and again draw crowds. Gregg Maddux might be that kind of guy, but i doubt he will come to TB.

And let's face it, for Tampa, they are still eons away from contending, if their going to spend on FAs, it better be someone that can help them draw crowds whileing helping with their experiences and abilities. not more inning eaters dozens in a bag guys.

2006-11-02 01:56:52
116.   regfairfield
113 That's the exact same buisness model that lead them to being terrible for 10 years. Why let anyone get expirence when you can bring in Roberto Alomar or some other over the hill vet that won't help in any way.

The Devil Rays were completely clueless until last year, now they are actually rebuilding with a least have a plan.

2006-11-02 06:00:25
117.   bhsportsguy
The latest Free Agent list, the rush seems to be slowing down.

http://tinyurl.com/ybv6vw

2006-11-02 07:17:50
118.   ToyCannon
Don't be dissing the Devil Rays, we'd kill to have Crawford, Baldelli, D Young and Dukes manning our outfield and with Longoria, Upton, Brignac, and JtD(1st) the infield is no slouch. They have more pitching prospects then we do, just not guys you've heard of but this is a team that if they do things right with the new management can have a powerhouse team. Add in the number one pick this spring in Price and with Kazmir/Neiman/Price they will have as exciting a threesome in baseball.
2006-11-02 07:59:25
119.   Bluebleeder87
i havent seen much of him but i hear Crawford is a great outfielder & hitter
2006-11-02 08:46:18
120.   Bluebleeder87
They'd want the sun & the moon for him i bet
2006-11-02 09:03:39
121.   katysdad
The sun and moon, huh?

OK, here's the deal. The Dodgers reactiviate Wally Moon (he retired after the '65 season and is only 76 years old) and acquire Sun-Woo Kim from Cincinnati (along with Dunn; for Tomko, Hendrickson and any other middle reliever).

Bingo: Moon and Sun to the Rays for Crawford.

This GM stuff is too easy!

2006-11-02 09:24:35
122.   Rocc
112. Nothing has been made official about any changes. The GM and VP said it could be the team name, it could a new logo or it could be a change in uniforms. Nothing has been set into motion just yet. However, they have until May to figure it out(by MLB rules)

113. Why do they need to trade one of the CC/Rocco/Dukes trio? Dukes is now at 1B in the AFL and the Rays are hoping that he stays calm until Spring Training to give him a chance at Spring Training for the Starting 1B job. If it's a young player being traded, Upton is the odds-on favorite.

I agree that Cantu is very tradeable right now, which is why it's being thrown around that Longoria will split his time in 2007 between 2B and 3B.

Gomes is doubtful right now, after he had to undergo shoulder "cleaning". Until we see him swinging the bat again, who knows how much power he still has.

The new ownership is a bunch of former NY/Wallstreet Businessmen. They've got Gerry Hunsicker in the front office to basically mentor their young GM and they're very fan-oriented.

Signing a declining veteran is not a smart move, we're not the Cubs...

115. It's funny that you said that they fail to draw crowds, because they lost more games in 2006 than they did in 2005 but had a 20% increase in overall attendance.

I could go on for days about the amount of high-quality pitching prospects that the Rays system has, but it appears that Toy Cannon has mentioned some of the better ones.

119. Yes he is, that's why we plan on keeping him for as long as we can. However, if we end up trading him, it's going to be for an ace-type MLB pitcher. So I doubt he's going anywhere.

2006-11-02 10:42:55
123.   ToyCannon
Update on Meloan from Rotowire:
"Meloan has allowed just one run in 9 1/3 innings pitching for Mesa in the Arizona Fall League. Meloan has also struck out 13 and walked five, this after posting a 1.90 ERA and striking out 91 batters over 52 innings between three minor league levels in 2006. He's likely to see significant time in the Dodgers' pen in 2007, depending on how the bullpen shakes out this offseason. "
2006-11-02 10:58:34
124.   Bluebleeder87
123

so i guess Brazoban will have a boxing partner this up coming spring.

2006-11-02 11:28:39
125.   jakewoods
the dodgers need power. while crawford is a good player hes not a power hitter and it will take billingsley for him
2006-11-02 11:31:53
126.   bhsportsguy
Here is a good link to keep track of free agents and their movement, it is from ESPN.com

http://tinyurl.com/yczqwn

2006-11-02 12:26:18
127.   twerp
Seems like I heard Brazoban's off-speed stuff needs work??? Is the fastball about all he has now?
2006-11-02 12:28:10
128.   bhsportsguy
Buster Olney brought up the obvious point with Mota's suspension. If you look at his stats with the Mets, can all of that be placed at the work of Rick Peterson and getting back together with Paul LoDuca.

And my other thought is how long did MLB know this and why didn't it come out before the playoffs.

2006-11-02 12:29:58
129.   3upn3down
I'm surprised I haven't heard more talk of Carlos Lee.

I think he's highly underated, and would fit in well with the Dodgers.

If we couldn't land Aramis Ramirez, then Carlos Lee would be my second choice.

The only draw back is the position changes it would force in the OF. But I could live with Drew in CF, Lee in LF, and the winner of the Kemp/Ethier battle in RF with Repko serving as the 4th OF (the loser in RF being the 5th).

This is me using poor logic, but I would surmise that given Olmedo and Carlos are close friends and countrymen, we wouldn't have to pay a premium above market to land him (like we offered with Giles, and did for Furcal).

Anyone else like Carlos Lee?

2006-11-02 12:36:01
130.   Bluebleeder87
Anyone else like Carlos Lee?

he's alright, i rather have Aramis Ramirez the more i say his name the cooler i think it sounds

2006-11-02 12:38:33
131.   das411
Hey Rocc, has there been any talk about a potential Astros offer for CC? I seem to remember hearing somewhere (Sickels?) that he is from the Houston area and the 'stros need all the offense they can get...I guess they don't have nearly enough young pitching to make any deal worthwhile though, do they?
2006-11-02 12:48:19
132.   YANKEES58
I think anybody with a one year contract left that has any value is very likely to be traded by their club or they risk losing them to free agency and get nothing in return. That's the only reason the Yanks are considering picking up Sheffield's option, even though his attitude is just as bad as always, the hope of getting some decent pitching or prospects in return for probably paying a few mil of his contract is worth it.

Sheffield should have knew better than to negotiate his own contract with somebody as shrewd as George Steinbrenner. With nobody to blame but himself for his bad move, he should just shut up and take it like a man!

2006-11-02 13:03:18
133.   Bluebleeder87
132

look DT'ers we have a stray Yankee fan ;o)

2006-11-02 13:14:46
134.   old dodger fan
I would sure love to see us resign Nomar, give the kids a chance at the other positions and add a decent starting pitcher who can give us innings and keep us in games without costing us the sun and the moon. I see that Vincente Padilla has filed. He pitched 200 innings last year, averages just over 6 innings per start and is only 29. I don't know what kind of contract he is expecting but he seems to fit the bill without breaking the bank.
2006-11-02 13:25:45
135.   gibsonhobbs88
130 - While signing Aramis would fill our initial need for power, how many years would it take to land him? Would this block LaRoche from arriving in '08, or does LaRoche just move to 2B as Kent will be gone by then? We have Loney at first and Furcal at SS for the near future. Has there been any new news as to Saito's status with the club? If we enter "Mr. Gyroball's" lottery, would that keep Saito around? This team still has a lot of unanswered questions this year. Not as much as last year, but still some holes to plug.
2006-11-02 13:49:48
136.   blue22
I'm underwhelmed by Aramis Ramirez. He'll hit, but he'll be oh so very expensive. He also plays a shaky thirdbase.

With the in-house options at third being young, cheap, and talented, I think LA can more effectively spend that $15M per year elsewhere.

2006-11-02 15:05:06
137.   Borchard504
Please do not start the Adam Dunn hysteria here again. Reference the thread at BTF, where a guy (11) put into words, exactly the issue with Dunn. Dunn is a $10m white elephant, who needs someone like Lou Pinella to straighten him out.

http://tinyurl.com/sjp53

2006-11-02 15:56:11
138.   dodgriz
Would anyone happen to have Logan White's Minor League Stats? I know he was drafted as a Pitch by the Mariners in 1984.
2006-11-02 16:01:29
139.   StolenMonkey86
137 - Given that, would you say he's off Colletti's list?
2006-11-02 16:06:40
140.   StolenMonkey86
How is Lee defensively anyway?
2006-11-02 16:12:39
141.   dodgriz
140 - 6 errors in 238 Total Chances with 5 assist. Range is a little limited but with 37 Big Flys. I'd take that.
2006-11-02 16:17:01
142.   bigcpa
137 Those are some pretty good firsthand observations. As much as loafing makes it easy to dislike a player (both as a fan and a teammate), it's hard to argue with 40HR and a .380 OBP. If you think the guy will deteriorate rapidly now that he's socked away $25M that's a valid point. But if you can pencil his career .245/.380/.513 line you are getting a $10M player.
2006-11-02 16:47:26
143.   Jim Hitchcock
Apologies for totally off the topic, but...

They fired Steve Lyons?

2006-11-02 16:50:40
144.   blue22
"³" shows no stats, but confirms he was drafted by Seattle.

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/W/Logan-White.shtml

2006-11-02 16:51:37
145.   blue22
144 was in response to 138.

I admit, I just wanted an opportunity to use the hip, hip ³ abbreviation.

2006-11-02 16:54:16
146.   blue22
143 - Fox did. He's still employed by the Dodgers.
2006-11-02 17:29:01
147.   Bluebleeder87
143

FOX is a freaking joke & i really wanna know who the guy is that fired him.

2006-11-02 17:33:05
148.   trainwreck
UCLA basketball starts tonight if anyone wants to watch the game (you have to pay) here is a link...

http://tinyurl.com/ylsaum

2006-11-02 18:14:33
149.   Robert Daeley
142 Again, Great American Ballpark = Homerun Hitter's Heaven. Do not let the inflated numbers distract you. :)
2006-11-02 20:30:10
150.   GoBears
149 Well, actually, no. Dunn's 2006 H/A splits:

Home: .231/.362/.502
Away: .236/.368/.479

So, a little more slugging at home (22 HRs, vs. 18 on the road), but better average and on-base away from GAB. Twice as many doubles on the road. More RBIs at home, but given how close Dunn's splits are, that must be a function of big H/A splits for his teammates.

In fact, if Dunn is to be criticized, it's for NOT taking sufficient advantage of his home park.

Dunn's for real. Don't let the Ks bug you - he'd be an awesome addition.

Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2006-11-03 09:49:19
151.   Rocc
131. Houston doesn't have enough pitching to get Crawford, especially after Friedman said that he's not trading MLB vets for prospects anymore and I don't see Pettite, Clemens or Oswalt being moved to St. Pete. Albers, Hirsch and Patton aren't that great and we'd ask for more than just Pence in addition to those pitchers.

Comment status: comments have been closed. Baseball Toaster is now out of business.