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About Jon
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1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
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Drew Opts Out
2006-11-09 17:48
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

So much for the quiet offseason.

News flash on Inside the Dodgers: J.D. Drew has taken a look at all the money out there in baseball land and decided that he can get more than $33 million for three years, and has opted out of the remainder of his Dodger contract.

Some people will think Drew deluded, though despite all the flack he gets, he was the fifth-most productive right fielder in baseball last year (ranked by Value over Replacement Player), according to Baseball Prospectus. There are plenty of teams out there desperate for offense, and with a new Collective Bargaining Agreement recently sealed between owners and players, there's wide speculation that teams are ripe to spend.

Some may also be offended, though it's just business. Lack of loyalty is a two-way street in baseball.

Though I'm surprised by the move, this was always a possibility. I still don't agree that this makes the Dodgers' contract with him a liability - the team made the deal it needed to make, got a top-flight outfielder for a two-year, $22 million deal, and ends up with $11 million more per year (through 2009) to spend. But spend it the Dodgers must. The top outfielder on the current roster is Andre Ethier.

The happiest man about Drew's decision might be Cubs third baseman Aramis Ramirez. Sure, it's one more hitter to compete with on the market, but it's also one more level of need (desperation?) that the Dodgers now possess.

Drew is free to return to the Dodgers, but it doesn't seem likely that they'll feel like having Drew extract more dollars.

Comments (317)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2006-11-09 17:52:21
1.   ninjavshippo
I just heard about this on am570 about 30 minutes ago. What does this mean for our outfield? Anderson/Ethier/whatever's left of Jayson Werth? Even if we do re-sign Nomar, I don't like the idea of him in the outfield, and Kemp didn't inspire too much confidence last year (in limited action).
2006-11-09 17:53:55
2.   Curtis Lowe
If Drew would have opted out sooner would the Dodgers have had more interest in the pusuit of Matsuzaka?
2006-11-09 17:58:00
3.   bhsportsguy
2 Doubtful, I think now the sky is the limit for two of the following:

Aramis Ramirez
Carlos Lee
Alfonso Soriano
Barry Zito
Jason Schmidt

Actually Nomar now comes back into the equation if he is willing to switch positions.

2006-11-09 18:04:26
4.   bhsportsguy
This means that L.A. like Philly can boo freely whenever Drew plays at Dodger Stadium.
2006-11-09 18:05:09
5.   Uncle Miltie
I posted this in the other thread:
I don't want Nomar back. Nomar is 33, his body is breaking down and he's going to demand a 3 year deal. JD Drew was the one guy you could count on to get on base. You could pretty much pencil him for .300/.400/.500. Ned likely won't bring back Drew. I think the Dodgers seriously need to consider trading for Sheffield now because I don't see any other hitters on the market who can replicate Drew's production. We aren't getting Soriano unless Ned wants to spend $17+ million on an average defensive corner outfielder. Carlos Lee is a DH in the making. Drew opting out really complicates the situation because now the Dodgers have even more holes to fill. They now need two big bats and a top of the rotation pitcher. This is going to have a negative impact on our farm system.
2006-11-09 18:05:35
6.   jakewoods
does he really think hes going to get a 5 yr deal for 50+?

actually in this market
he prob will

well now the dodgers can save that 10 mill a yr and put it towards zito and ramirez

and play kemp in rf

2006-11-09 18:05:38
7.   GoBears
Awww, rats. I was really thinking that keeping Drew for 3 more at $11M per was turning into quite a bargain, especially since he stayed healthy this season, and really, last year too, (given the flukiness of the injury he did suffer).

Unfortunately, Drew also apparently thought he was too much of a bargain.

Rats.

2006-11-09 18:05:58
8.   StolenMonkey86
Jon, actually I see Drew opting out as an indicator that Ramirez will be less likely to be signed, because now there are 2 spots in the outfield to be filled.

Any thoughts to having Nomar and Loney, one in right and one at first?

2006-11-09 18:06:34
9.   StolenMonkey86
6 - who plays center?
2006-11-09 18:09:01
11.   bigcpa
Would be nice to have Abreu right about now.
2006-11-09 18:09:19
12.   StolenMonkey86
I say no way on Sheffield. He's old and just coming of an injury.

But on the other hand, the possibility of watching him fight in the dugout with Jeff Kent might be worth it, especially for the Dodger Blues guy.

2006-11-09 18:14:05
13.   Benaiah
10 - I think that we are going to sing a different tune. There is no free agent replacement for Drew at that price, and while this could be good for either Kemp or Ethier I don't think it is good for the Dodgers. I am skeptical that Ned will sign an OBP guy to replace Drew and that was the strength of our offense last year. I think we should use Ethier and Kemp in the corner outfield spots and go for a CF and a 3B.

All I can say is: Not Juan Pierre in CF.

2006-11-09 18:15:45
14.   Benaiah
Jon, I think ultimately this makes Depo's contract smarter than ever. He got a top 10 MVP vote getter, who was injury prone, to sign a 2 year contract. I would prefer to have had him for 3 more years, but this is still a win in my book.
2006-11-09 18:16:24
15.   Bluebleeder87
say it aint so!!, i'm so heart broken!
2006-11-09 18:17:08
17.   Curtis Lowe
There is a very simple solution for all this.

Sign Zito, Soriano and Gary M. Jr. Trade Repko for some bullpen help and let Ethier and Kemp fight for Right field supremecy.

2006-11-09 18:18:49
18.   StolenMonkey86
14 - and you have to give Grady Little a lot of credit for resting Drew as much has he did; no DL trips at all.
2006-11-09 18:19:15
19.   GoBears
Am I deluded to think he might agree to stay. Maybe for a token raise or an extra year? No harm in looking elsewhere.

And shoot, we brought back Odalis Perez as a free agent immediately after his contract ran out.

If Colletti really doesn't want him back, then I think Colletti is nuts. I can't believe that he'd let Drew go out of spite, just because Drew was a DePodesta signing. That'd smack of way too much insecurity (especially after a year on the job and all the kudos for the playoff appearance).

There's no way Colletti's doing better in the FA market for OFers, (please, no Luis Gonzales), and I even doubt that the $11M (or a little more) could be better spent at another position than on Drew. If I had to choose straight up between Drew and Schmidt/Zito, I'd take the guy who plays every day. Yes, the team seems to NEED pitching more than hitting, but really, all it needs to do is outscore the opposition, whether it's 7-6 or 2-1.

2006-11-09 18:19:19
20.   Yu-Hsing Chen
We would do Bobby Abreu for Hong Chih Kuo ;) deal or no deal!! we even throw in Carl Pavano and pay his money!!:P
2006-11-09 18:20:52
21.   bigcpa
14 Well for us it both a safe 2-year contract and a risky 5-year contract.
2006-11-09 18:22:28
22.   Jon Weisman
8 - You could be right. I was thinking that Colletti might grab Ramirez and trade a 3B.
2006-11-09 18:22:58
23.   sanchez101
I'd rather have Luis Gonzales or Moises Alou on a one year contract rather than Carlos Lee or Alfonso Soriano on some overpriced multi-year deal. And I've never been fond of either Gonzo or Alou.
2006-11-09 18:23:36
24.   DodgerfaninNY
Does this mean the Dodgers now suddenly become very interested in Pat Burrell? Ace middle reliever Mark Henrickson would look great in a Phillies uniform.
2006-11-09 18:23:39
25.   Uncle Miltie
I can't wait to see how Boras/Drew spin this one. If he signs with an East Coast tell, he'll say that he wanted to be closer to home. What's he going to say if he signs with a team like the Chicago Cubs?
2006-11-09 18:25:26
26.   Jon Weisman
16 - will be deleted forthwith.
2006-11-09 18:25:40
27.   bigcpa
I love how the guy is villified as overpaid for 2 years and you read this on the wire...
The Red Sox, Mets, Rangers, Tigers, Orioles, Angels, Mariners, Astros and Padres are among the teams that figure to be interested.
2006-11-09 18:26:09
28.   Bluebleeder87
Drew is free to return to the Dodgers, but it doesn't seem likely that they'll feel like having Drew extract more dollars.

this "christian boy" is all about the money & i swear if the Dodgers get him back i'll be the first to bombered them with negetivie posts!!

2006-11-09 18:26:37
29.   Benaiah
25 - The Cubs don't believe in OBP, so that is unlikely. On the other hand I don't think any team could use him more than the Cubs.
2006-11-09 18:27:56
30.   Bluebleeder87
26

sorry Jon i didn't mean any disrespect

2006-11-09 18:28:38
31.   dkminnick
Drag. I'm surprised and sorry to hear this, but his agent is Boras, right?

I liked JD as a #2 or #3 hitter - putting a big banger (I want Ramirez) between him and Kent would have us pretty well set offensively.

Please Ned, let's replace him (or re-sign him) through free agency. Has Soriano said he wants to go back to the infield, or did he end up liking the outfield okay?

Until this, I thought Ramirez and Zito (Schmidt's too old) would be enough. Now we need those two and Soriano.

2006-11-09 18:29:24
32.   Uncle Miltie
24- didn't think of Burrell. He is a very good offensive player, but his defense is atrocious. He's also guaranteed something like $27 million over 2 years. That would still be a lot better than giving multi year contracts to Soriano @ $17 million per year or Carlos Lee $15 million, though. Like others here, I'm concerned about replacing Drew's high OBP. I don't want to see the Dodgers acquire a free swinging power hitter like Joe Crede.
2006-11-09 18:30:04
33.   GoBears
15, 16 Easy on the bold, there, BB. You're entitled to your opinion, but shouting is unnecessary.

Plus, I can't for the life of me fathom your disdain for Drew. No, he's not ebullient or overtly intense, but that doesn't mean he doesn't work his butt off. And you've always declared yourself a fan of great defense, andt Drew is the best defensive outfielder I can remember in Dodger Blue for years and years (Bradley was good too). That he seems effortless shouldn't be held against him. In fact, wasn't that one of the things you liked about Izturis - that he just seemed so smooth and effortless in his efficiency? Neither guy is "Web gem" machine, precisely because they don't have to make spectacular plays to compensate for bad jumps or routes. Drew was also everything Izturis wasn't on offense. OBP-riffic, great baserunner, line drives...

Feh. I hope he comes back, and especially that Colletti tries to make that happen.

2006-11-09 18:31:50
34.   Benaiah
31 - I bet Ramirez will get a bigger contract than Drew, but I think Drew will ultimately be more valuable over the next 3-5 years. His OBP is so much better than anything out there right now, although his power has seemingly gone down a bit in Blue.
2006-11-09 18:32:21
35.   LAT
Loyalty is a two way street but didn't he give us some mid-season nonsense about how the opt-out clause was only intended to protect his family if they didn't like LA but having been here for two years they have become part of the community yada yada yada and so he would not opt-out? Didin't he say this or am I immagining it?
2006-11-09 18:33:30
36.   DodgerfaninNY
What figure does Boras have in mind for Drew? 4 yrs./$60 mil?
2006-11-09 18:33:31
37.   Benaiah
What do you guys think Ned's opinion is on OBP? Is he a big fan or batting average, or do you think he gives more credence to OBP and SLG?
2006-11-09 18:36:03
38.   Yu-Hsing Chen
37 hard call right now, but the Dodgers did get on base a lot while hitting very few HRs this year, of course i kinda doubt that was by design.
2006-11-09 18:37:13
39.   Benaiah
A little off topic, but if you watch The Office, definitely definitely watch it tonight. Great episode.
2006-11-09 18:38:37
40.   Bob Timmermann
35
Maybe JD Drew and his wife decided that Pasadena was no place to raise a child. They were upset that on New Year's Day, it was hard to find a place to park on Colorado Blvd.
2006-11-09 18:40:24
41.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Hm. I'll be honest - I forgot about the opt-out clause.
Now that I'm over the initial surprise, a few thoughts:
1. This certainly frees up a good chunk of change for '07, doesn't it? Of course, it'll take a bigger chunk of change to sign a decent FA.
2. I agree with the take that DePo's gamble worked out well.
3. BB87, it speaks poorly of your character to crack on Drew's faith.
4. Given that Drew is a Boras client, as is Gagne, I can see a small upside in case we want either back - there's no fear of the unknown when dealing with Boras. Some teams go out of their way to avoid Boras clients, especially during the draft, because Boras is who he is. The Dodgers know what they're getting.
5. Boy, the team's power problems are even more pronounced now.
2006-11-09 18:41:04
42.   StolenMonkey86
31 - Soriano has said he's especially proud of his defense in the outfield, and that actually probably raises his value. Basically, he's better than Ethier in the outfield, but worse than Kent at second base.

Sori's career rate2:
2B: 94
OF: 107
Ethier: 95
Kent: 100

Sori's Career Zone Rating:
2B: .806
OF: .876
Ethier: .872
Kent: .824

2006-11-09 18:43:21
43.   Robert Daeley
"He led the club in RBIs. You just don't snap your fingers and find another player like that," Dodgers general manager Ned Colletti said on a conference call. "He wants out, he can have out. He's moving on, we're moving on. We'll find players who like playing here. If he doesn't want to be here, he has the right to leave, and he's exercising that right."

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-dodgers-drew

2006-11-09 18:44:38
44.   Bob Timmermann
So where will Drew end up? Boston?
2006-11-09 18:45:08
45.   MMSMikey
Colletti Does not sound happy

....
"He led the club in RBI. You just don't snap your fingers and find another player like that," Dodgers general manager Ned Colletti said on a conference call. "He wants out, he can have out. He's moving on, we're moving on. We'll find players who like playing here. If he doesn't want to be here, he has the right to leave, and he's exercising that right."

While Colletti refused to say he was angry, his feelings came through during a 30-minute conference call.

"I hang onto my feelings," Colletti said. "You try to use some diplomacy right now."

"The last time I spoke with him, we had a nice conversation," Colletti said. "I don't really need to (speak to Drew) at this point."

But the GM also said: "I know J.D. is a spiritual guy and a man of his word. I guess he changed his word. You learn never to be surprised when you're dealing in this arena. People change their minds. People change their word. They move on."

2006-11-09 18:45:15
46.   StolenMonkey86
I see the Dodgers sacrificing a bit of OBP for a lot of SLG. I would, and I don't think it's so terrible to consider. Colletti has the power to sign the big free agents, as we saw last year, so bring me Alfonso Soriano.
2006-11-09 18:47:05
47.   Bob Timmermann
46
Wasn't "Bring Me the Head of Alfonso Soriano" a movie with Marlon Brando in it?
2006-11-09 18:47:42
48.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
"I know J.D. is a spiritual guy and a man of his word. I guess he changed his word."
C'mon, Ned, don't be naive. Drew's contract was his word, and he lived up to it just fine.
2006-11-09 18:48:06
49.   MMSMikey
he better not end up in anaheim somehow.
2006-11-09 18:48:08
50.   Robert Daeley
Ned said this later in that same story:

"It opens up payroll, certainly, for the next three years," he said. "It doesn't change the options out there. There's only one more player out there, one we're not going to pursue. It does change how much money we have."

Is he talking about Barry Bonds?

Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2006-11-09 18:49:04
51.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Not sure about Soriano - I know he had a great season, but it was his walk year, and pursuing him seems like a serious "buy high" move.
2006-11-09 18:50:03
52.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Is he talking about Barry Bonds?
I took it to mean he was speaking about Drew himself.
2006-11-09 18:50:32
53.   MMSMikey
yeah, i think he meant drew as well.
2006-11-09 18:51:20
54.   jujibee
I think what upsets me about this the most is how a guy who had a decent, but not spectacular year, walks away from one of the most storied franchises in sports that was going to pay him 33 million over the next 3 years. This sport has really gone into the tank in respect to playing the game for the game.

That being said, we have to move on, and I don't think renegociating with Drew for what would have to be more money is the answer, but we do have a few holes to fill in the outfield. I'm not impressed with anyone on the FA market in particular, and our farm isn't quite where it needs to be for supplying an immediate replacement, although Kemp for a whole year intrigues me. I'd explore some trade options if I were Ned. Once promising prospect and now disgruntled player Ryan Church might be had pretty cheap. Another option might be Crawford, albeit more expensive than Church, would most likely be a top run producer on this team.

2006-11-09 18:53:06
55.   franklin
After Drew's surprise, I would be amazed to not see Moises Alou in left field next year with Ethier, Kemp and Kenny Loggins splitting time in CF/LF???
2006-11-09 18:53:27
56.   blue22
44 - I think Boston (replacing Nixon) or Toronto (who went hard after Giles last year, and is likely to trade Wells).

Cleveland could be a possibility too, as apparently they were in the running for Sheffield before dealing for Kouzmanoff for Barfield.

2006-11-09 18:53:56
57.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
This sport has really gone into the tank in respect to playing the game for the game.
This is a business - period.
And it always has been.
2006-11-09 18:54:02
58.   Robert Daeley
52 Ah, right, of course. Must just have been me projecting. ;D
2006-11-09 18:54:03
59.   franklin
whoa, clearly been at work too long

55 ...Kenny Lofton...

2006-11-09 18:54:34
60.   Jon Weisman
54 - And the Dodgers signed Gagne fair and square, and he injured himself on the job, and given the opportunity, after all the joy Gagne had brought, the Dodgers decided to walk away from him as well.

It's not pretty, but it's just how it goes.

2006-11-09 18:55:18
61.   thinkblue0
Is he talking about Barry Bonds?

most people think I'm crazy, but it wouldn't shock me in the least bit if Colletti at least put effort into landing Bonds.

Can you guys imagine what would happen if Bonds was a Dodger? I think my head might explode simply because we'd be in the twilight zone.

2006-11-09 18:55:19
62.   Robert Daeley
"with Ethier, Kemp and Kenny Loggins"

Naw, he hasn't been the same since Footloose. ;)

2006-11-09 18:57:17
63.   blue22
So LA needs a CFer and a RFer (Ethier is a LFer, pure and simple).

Minimal options on the FA market. Does LA go after Andruw Jones or Vernon Wells now?

2006-11-09 18:58:02
64.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Immediate thought about the possibility of Bonds as a Dodger: Because of the curving OF corners, you can hide a bad - or immobile - outfielder at Dodger Stadium.
2006-11-09 18:58:04
65.   Uncle Miltie
48- here are some direct quotes from Drew
"I don't plan on (using) it," he said Tuesday. "I've enjoyed my time living in Los Angeles. That's what it was there for – to make sure (wife) Sheigh and I didn't come all the way across the country (from their native Georgia) and get stuck in a situation we didn't like."
"You know what – I don't think so," said Drew, who also has a limited no trade clause. "Ultimately it's my decision, and we're happy where we're at. We love our house in Pasadena. My wife is happy. She's made a lot of friends in our neighborhood and with the other players' wives. That's really the thing that was nerve-wracking about it (free agency) for me.

"At some point, you make those commitments and you stick to them."

Colletti has a legitimate reason for being upset. Drew had the right to opt out. The problem is, he didn't tell the Dodgers that he was going to this do far enough in advance where they would have more time plan on looking for alternatives. Drew/Boras come out look like jerks here much the same way Carlos Boozer did a few years ago when he reneged on his verbal agreement with the Cleveland Cavilers. Boras/Drew didn't break any rules, but they do come away looking like people you wouldn't want to deal with in the future. It's a shame that Boras is such a prominent agent. I guess he didn't take business ethics in college. This honestly shows me that Boras/Drew care about nothing besides money. I don't expect loyalty in baseball, but I still think it's wrong what Boras/Drew did.

If the Orioles offer him enough money, I'd expect to see him playing in Baltimore next season. Drew's character has been questioned many times.

2006-11-09 18:58:07
66.   DodgerfaninNY
Do you think Loney to RF is a serious consideration? It's probably easier to find a first baseman than a right fielder.
2006-11-09 18:59:09
67.   doppelganger
I'd expect Colletti to try to sign gary mathews/lofton/roberts and a high profile pitcher, probably zito.
2006-11-09 18:59:24
68.   Bob Timmermann
65
That will be the last time JD Drew and Carlos Boozer are ever compared at the same time.
2006-11-09 19:00:15
69.   dkminnick
34 - Yes, I would have liked to have them both. Maybe we still can.

42 - Thanks. If Soriano would be happy in the outfield, we should consider him.

Ethier, Kemp (CF), Soriano, Werth, Anderson in the OF.

2006-11-09 19:01:31
70.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
65 - Frank McCourt is now praying he won't suddenly be struck blind.
2006-11-09 19:05:36
71.   3upn3down
I've said this here before, but now I'll scream it.

WHY ISN"T ANYONE TALKING ABOUT CARLOS LEE?

We need this guy bad.

2006-11-09 19:06:13
72.   dkminnick
Wouldn't it be beautiful if Drew had to take less money somewhere else? Bring back collusion!
2006-11-09 19:08:25
73.   StolenMonkey86
51 - he's had consistent power, and it's easier to go yard in Dodger Stadium than RFK. Besides, I think the NL transistion may have helped - not to mention that his division is easier to hit homers off of (Oakland and Anaheim had pitching, Atlanta, New York, Philly did not). The NL West is going to be a little tougher, but balancing that with DS factors, I think he'd be all right.

His OBP is probably also a function of that. Given the Giants are losing Schmidt, the Dbacks probably aren't gonna have anyone impressive besides Webb in the rotation, and the Rockies may not hold up, I'd expect about a .280/.343/.550 with 40 HR out of Sori in LA (compare to .277/.351/.560 with 46 HR in DC).

2006-11-09 19:09:50
74.   blue22
71 - Carlos Lee is overrated IMO (he's never OPS'd over .900 for instance). He's a good hitter, but not someone I feature as a centerpiece of an offense (read: 5 years at $12-15M per).
2006-11-09 19:09:54
75.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
71 - Dunno about Lee. He'll be 31 at the '07 ASB. Then again, so will Drew.
But Lee will want mad money. If he'd take what LA was to pay Drew - $33MM over three years - then sure.
2006-11-09 19:10:59
76.   natepurcell
crap. this isnt good. one more friggin hole to fill. so much for doing only one or two things.
2006-11-09 19:11:39
77.   StolenMonkey86
72 - It might not require collusion really. To quote Tim Harford (of "The Undercover Economist" fame), "Never attribute to conspiracy what can easily be explained by incompetence."

Which is to say, maybe everyone will think he's going to break again, and 20 homers isn't impressive enough - it may be a ceiling after the wrist injury.

2006-11-09 19:11:52
78.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
FWIW, Soriano also will be 31 at the ASB. I thought he was younger.
2006-11-09 19:13:05
79.   LAT
48. I think Ned definitly has a right to be mad. Drew's is legally entitled to leave but he does profess to be a man of his word and he represented that he would not be opting out. It appears Ned relied on that representation and planed his forthcoming off-season based on JD comments. I think Ned's relance was reasonable and justified. J.D. is not in breach of his contract but it is a lousy thing and Ned is entitled to be pissed.
2006-11-09 19:14:25
80.   ninjavshippo
68
well, unless we get a glimpse of JD's overwhelming chest hair in the near future
2006-11-09 19:15:27
81.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
Vernon Wells, anyone? Apparently, Toronto is looking to deal him.
2006-11-09 19:16:32
82.   Bluebleeder87
I'm concerned about replacing Drew's high OBP.

are you concerned replacing his made of glass body!!????

2006-11-09 19:17:27
83.   Jon Weisman
79 - I can understand Ned being upset, though I wouldn't overplay the "no time to prepare" angle. Ned had to work much more quickly last year. And certainly, if Ned didn't consider the possibility that a Scott Boras client would spring this, then that is a bit naive.

I'll tell you who had better get indignant. The McCourts. I seem to recall them going back on their word around this time last year - and that wasn't the only time they weren't above board.

2006-11-09 19:17:30
84.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
80 - Reminds me of Lefty Gomez's line about Charlie (King Kong) Keller: "He wasn't scouted; he was trapped."
2006-11-09 19:17:46
85.   StolenMonkey86
Lee never topped 100 strikeouts, but on the other hand his ISOPatience is going to be about .060. What makes him less attractive is that he doesn't have the speed, and he's a bit of a defensive liability (career Rate2 of 98 in left field, ZR of .858 in left, compare to 107 and .876 respectively for Sori).
2006-11-09 19:17:56
86.   ninjavshippo
82
games played last 3 yrs

145, 72, 146.

not exactly a glass body. also, please see rule 6.

2006-11-09 19:18:51
87.   Jon Weisman
146 games last year, Bluebleeder. At some point, the ranting grows tiresome.
2006-11-09 19:18:55
88.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
82 - He's coming off a career high in games played, you know.
2006-11-09 19:20:13
89.   Vishal
i have visions of drew wearing sonoran red with his brother...

i also have a feeling we get soriano and stick him in right field. probably at around $12-14 per.

furcal, soriano, nomar/loney (nomar switching in and out with loney betemit at first and third, loney switching with nomar and kemp), kent, ethier, kemp, betemit, martin isn't a terrible lineup.

add zito to the rotation, and a good bullpen arm and i'm happy.

2006-11-09 19:20:53
90.   twerp
Beyond the $$$--if it's possible to get beyond it--could Drew want to go to AZ to play with his brother? Does that make any sense for the Snakes?

60 Colletti apparently has closed the door on Drew, and he's justified doing it. But he hasn't closed it on Gagne...has he? The Dodgers walked away from a $12Mil option but hope to bring him back for much less, I understand? Or have they indicated they don't want him at all?

At least folks who didn't like Drew won't have him to kick around anymore. (Seems like some former president said something like that once)...

2006-11-09 19:21:15
91.   ninjavshippo
89

i like the sound of that plan, but i expect zito to command huge money, maybe more than we're willing to spend.

2006-11-09 19:22:36
92.   natepurcell
I would sign Alou to one year deal. his defese is atrocious but the man can still hit and get on base his OPS+ the last 3 years:
2004: 128
2005: 141
2006: 132

I would make a run at soriano as well. have a 4 outfield rotation of kemp, soriano, ethier and alou will be productive.

i am pretty made at Drew All that talk was just a bunch of BS.

2006-11-09 19:23:08
93.   Bob Timmermann
89
It's Sedona red.
It's Sonoran gold.

Sheesh, everybody knows those colors! They're part of my Crayola box of 2056 colors!

2006-11-09 19:23:15
94.   Vishal
[83] do you mean better not get indignant? because if the mccourts were, it would be hypocritical.
2006-11-09 19:24:03
95.   blue22
92 - nate, I'm surprised you're in for Soriano. He's looking for 7 years, 6 minimum.
2006-11-09 19:24:32
96.   ninjavshippo
the production looks good, but the health the last 2 yrs does not. that and he's bad for clubhouse chemistry because no one will want to high five him.
2006-11-09 19:24:37
97.   Vishal
[89] oh yeah, duh. i've been to sedona. i knew that.

on the other hand, i never had a crayola box bigger than 64.

2006-11-09 19:24:43
98.   natepurcell
I still think Colletti should make the smart move and offer arbitration to Drew. He knwos he wont accept and we will defnately get a high pick for losing him.

Colletti cant let his emotions cloud his judgement on this situation.

2006-11-09 19:24:55
99.   StolenMonkey86
Wells would be an ok player with decent power, but really lacking in OBP. His defense in center would be nice (Rate2 of 99, ZR of .905, both career) but the problem is he would not be enough. A team like St. Louis, who already has Pujols, might be in better position to go after him to succeed Edmonds.

If you're willing to sell the farm and kill the fatted calf, there's always going for Andruw Jones. Asking price probably starts at Broxton, Kuo, and Kemp.

2006-11-09 19:25:22
100.   natepurcell
95

losing drew changes alot of things.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2006-11-09 19:25:37
101.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
93 - Odd thing is, the soil in Sedona is somewhat orange-ish.
http://www.redstonetours.com/images/sedona.jpg
2006-11-09 19:26:47
102.   natepurcell
Wells is a player i wouldnt trade for since we wouldnt have assurance of resigning him. hes a free agent after this year so just go after him when hes available on the open market.
2006-11-09 19:28:02
103.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
99 - Career line of 288/336/492/828.
For a good CF, that's more than OK.
2006-11-09 19:28:06
104.   StolenMonkey86
100 - John Madden is a Dodger fan! :)
2006-11-09 19:28:38
105.   ninjavshippo
103

it is "more than okay," but at what price? that's the rub.

2006-11-09 19:29:02
106.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
102 - That lowers his trade value even more, doesn't it?
2006-11-09 19:29:26
107.   ninjavshippo
104
that surprises me, considering he's from pleasonton. geographically, i'd expect him to be an A's or Gigantes guy.
2006-11-09 19:29:32
108.   Jon Weisman
94 - yes, not indignant
2006-11-09 19:29:38
109.   Bluebleeder87
87

i'm sorry, i'll try & let it go if anything this could be a good thing for the Dodgers.

2006-11-09 19:30:16
110.   blue22
99 - Andruw won't be that expensive since he's in the last year of his deal. He's got 10-5 rights, which would be a bigger hurdle.
2006-11-09 19:30:26
111.   Bob Timmermann
The 2056 color Crayola box has eight different versions of burnt umber I believe.
2006-11-09 19:30:35
112.   Vishal
[99] i'd rather keep broxton, kuo, and kemp. if it were just broxton and kemp, or maybe kemp and miller or someting, sure. but 3 solid young players is too much.
2006-11-09 19:30:44
113.   natepurcell
If Colletti has a creative bone in his body, he needs to showcase it this winter by filling our holes and not butchering our stable of high cieling young players.
2006-11-09 19:31:10
114.   ninjavshippo
109
it's nothing personal, pal. i just get all the screaming talking head stuff i can handle from my tv.
2006-11-09 19:32:05
115.   GoBears
Wow - that quote from Colletti is distressing. And I don't just mean about its implications for Drew as a Dodger. I've thought a lot of things about Colletti's qualities as a GM, but petulant and naive were never among those things. Drew had a 2 year contract, with an option for 3 more. He opted out. Fine. Let him test the market. To consider it a betrayal is ridiculous. To declare that the team will make no effort to re-sign him is adolescent, self-destructive, and well, amateurish Personally, if I owned the team, I'd fire any GM who saw the world that way, and made public statements that dumb. Perhaps he was just caught by surprise, but if he didn't see fit to backtrack on those statements pretty quickly, I'd ride him out of the GM's office on a rail.

GSfRB has it exactly right - Drew's "word" was his contract. He might have changed his mind, but he didn't break his word. What he said in an interview was meaningless.

Moreover, this says nothing at all about Drew's love for the game, blah blah blah. He'll just love playing the game in a different city. If you think being willing to play for a different team is a sign of low character, then you're confusing loyalty to team (and why should he have any?) with loyalty/dedication to craft/game. Free agency should have killed that delusion decades ago. Pre-FA players weren't loyal - they were indentured servants.

2006-11-09 19:33:10
116.   jujibee
I mentioned it earlier, but here are some stats:

BA/SLG/OPS

Church in 196 AB, .276, .526, 892 with 10HR

Drew in 494 AB, .283, .498, .891 with 20HR

If I remember correctly, Church is not a happy camper and looks comparable to Drew (smaller sample size, but comparable nonetheless).
Go get him Ned...Oh, and he's from Santa Barbara and might actually like playingfor the Dodgers, apparantly one of Ned's criteria.

2006-11-09 19:33:14
117.   Uncle Miltie
89- Soriano already turned down a 5 year/$75 million deal from the Nats. He's going to get $16-18 million on this market.

I'd pass on Lee. He has the body of a 40 year old (think Frank Thomas, not Steve Finley). He's not a tremendous athlete either. His speed is actually a bit above average. Still I don't expect him to stay in the field for the life of a 5 year contract. Definitely a future DH.

Soriano just isn't going to be worth what he's going to be paid. I like his athleticism, which means he should age well, but I don't think he's one of the top 7-8 players in baseball --- that's how he's going to be paid.

Pat Burrell was suggested earlier. He has 2 years left on his contract for around $27 million. He isn't worth the money, but it's a short term deal. The Phillies would like to clear some money/a position for Soriano. Picking up Burrell would fine if he doesn't require top prospects.

Vernon Wells is apparently looking for a Carlos Beltran-like extension. That's why the Blue Jays are looking to deal him. Jim Edmonds' option will almost certainly be picked.

I'm praying that Ned doesn't get snookered into thinking that Gary Matthews Jr. is now an elite player at the ripe age of 32.

2006-11-09 19:34:09
118.   twerp
98 GM Nate, shrewd suggestion. If for some reason Drew did accept, the hole he'd leave is filled, short-term.

Then Ned could work on trading him, right?

2006-11-09 19:34:46
119.   natepurcell
115

you dont feel betrayed one bit by drew? Honestly, i wouldnt be that mad if he didnt, all year, say he loves it here and wont opt out.

thats the thing. if you keep telling people one thing and you do another, its going to rub people the wrong way.

2006-11-09 19:36:26
120.   StolenMonkey86
110- I don't know; 2 years of 40+ HR, a ton of gold gloves in center, .100 ISOpatience, and the scary thing is that Atlanta offense will still be fine without him. He's the kinda guy you'd want to keep as a franchise player, but that may not happen.
2006-11-09 19:36:44
121.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
117 - Burrell would work. Phillies fans are close to riding him out of town on a rail, so he might come cheap. And, he's a short-term investment - those are good.
2006-11-09 19:36:47
122.   natepurcell
118

if he accepted, then thats one less hole to fill. Why trade him? Keep him one one year at 11-13mil and wait for next years free agent market of wells and jones.

Drew accepting arbitration because no one else would offer him his massive contract would be the best case scenario for us. as much as i care for the first round pick from drew, i want his production on the big league 2007 dodgers team more.

2006-11-09 19:37:28
123.   GoBears
At least folks who didn't like Drew won't have him to kick around anymore. (Seems like some former president said something like that once)...

Actually, he wasn't yet a former (or even current) president at the time.

2006-11-09 19:37:51
124.   Benaiah
Bluebleeder, here is the list of qualified outfielders with a higher OBP than Drew last year:
Manny Ramirez
Jason Bay
Bobby Abreu

with a higher OPS:
Manny Ramirez
Jermaine Dye
Carlos Beltran
Matt Holiday
Vlad Guerrero
Jason Bay
Alfonso Soriano
Grady Sizemore
Vernon Wells
Brad Hawpe
Carlos Lee
Andruw Jones

And this is with Drew having his worse year since 2003. How you could think that he was bad for the team is beyond me.

2006-11-09 19:38:02
125.   Nolan
Few thoughts:

1) I think, long run, this is great for us. Drew has not even been that great on a per AB basis and, over two years, certainly hasn't done a lot in the way of accumulating...His power drop is worrisome at least and is probably related to the multiple leg injuries he has suffered. I do think it hurts us for next year but, beyond that this is a good thing.

2) Colletti got caught with his pants down and threw a tantrum - what a leader.

3) Though, as I said, I am glad that Drew opted out, I'm worried that we're giving Colletti a lot of money to play with. This year's FAs are weak and few are worth long term contracts. Matsuzaka would have been the best option but that ship has sailed. Soriano is probably the next best bet but he's neither a superstar nor likely to come at an even mildly reasonable price. Lee is one of the most overrated players in baseball, never having posted a .900 OPS. Zito's peripherals have gotten worse ever year for the last three seasons. My guess is that Colletti will break the bank on Zito - we'll see what the contract is before I pass final judgment.

2006-11-09 19:39:16
126.   Dark Horse
115-How do you know Drew's "word" in this case wasn't something he said to Colletti personally? I think Ned has every right to feel betrayed, and does a good job of balancing that against a need for diplomacy. I don't see 'petulance' there, merely a fair-handed response to a player's decision. The notion it's something Colletti should be "run out of town on a rail" for is preposterous.

Anyway, it's not such a big deal. I've liked JD, but think he's as easy to over- as to underrate.

2006-11-09 19:39:58
127.   das411
Willy Aybar for Burrell would have been done by now...

but how high will youse all go for Carl Ca-rawford??

2006-11-09 19:41:15
128.   StolenMonkey86
116- intriguing. Frankly, I'd see him as an upgrade in center, but I don't know how much power he'd put out. He's 28 and hasn't played that much, but this could be a diamond in the rough.

That said, don't count on Colletti doing it.

2006-11-09 19:41:26
129.   blue22
127 - Elbert and LaRoche? Need another player in there?
2006-11-09 19:42:21
130.   StolenMonkey86
127 - "Ah cahn't dew it, Captian. We need mower POWER!"
2006-11-09 19:42:39
131.   Bluebleeder87
115

I'll ask you this how many teams has he played for?? & how many teams/& or players REPECT HIM!!?? please reply back.

2006-11-09 19:42:47
132.   Vishal
i agree that colletti does sound petulant and immature to react this way, but it's perfectly reasonable to expect and hope for some degree of loyalty from one's employees. yeah, they're on contract and free agency has bred somewhat of a "mercenary" ethos in sports, but i don't see how it's fundamentally different than other employment relationships where the employer wants to retain its talented workforce and treats it well, and the employees reward good treatment with some degree of company loyalty. that's not always how it works out, nor should it always be like that 100% of the time, but there's nothing wrong with hoping to establish mutual understanding and loyalty. in fact, i think it lowers transaction costs and probably generates some sort of capital, difficult to quantify as that may be. something like chemistry :)
2006-11-09 19:44:38
133.   StolenMonkey86
Crawford is young, but has never had more than 40 walks in a season. Given the number of PA's he gets, that's not good.
2006-11-09 19:44:40
134.   natepurcell
what are the chances Alou can give a team 400ABs of 125+ OPS next year?
2006-11-09 19:45:16
135.   Nolan
132 - This talk of loyalty is complete BS. The Dodgers have certain contractual rights. So does Drew. Both sides agreed to incorporate these rights into their contract. These are very sophisticated actors. There's just no moral component here.

And, Colletti sounded and acted like a fool.

2006-11-09 19:46:24
136.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
I'll ask you this how many teams has he played for??
Three - the same number as Paul Lo Duca.
2006-11-09 19:46:38
137.   blue22
Anybody getting ill thinking about Gary Matthews Jr patrolling CF next year in LA?
2006-11-09 19:46:40
138.   GoBears
119. Nope, not one little bit. I learned a long time ago never to attach any value to "promises" made in the media. Must be an occupational hazard from studying politics for a living.

Before I saw Colletti's quote, I figured, "OK, good for him. Let him check the market, and then make an honest effort to convince him to stay. If he gets offered crazy money, so be it, but you can't deny him the right to look." For Colletti to damn him for wanting to look is absurd. For Colletti to have believed that he would resist the temptation to look, especially as a Boras client, was naive. If Colletti really wanted to deny Drew that right, he could have negotiated a buyout on the option. "We'll trade you $5M to cancel the opt-out." Maybe what Colletti is feeling is not betrayal, but embarrassment. Should be, anyway.

2006-11-09 19:47:00
139.   dkminnick
I find Ned's emotional response to be refreshing. It's interesting, at least.

I get tired of meaningless media-speak. Nice when some reality breaks through.

2006-11-09 19:47:16
140.   Uncle Miltie
but how high will youse all go for Carl Ca-rawford??
LaRoche (since Ned questions his character)/Betemit, Broxton, any pitching prospect in the farm not named Elbert/Kershaw, and my future first born.
2006-11-09 19:47:18
141.   Vishal
[115] how many runs or wins does respect count for?
2006-11-09 19:47:18
142.   Benaiah
131 - 3 teams and I have no clue who respects him. Who cares who respects him? Ty Cobb was a horrible horrible person, but I bet it was great to have him on your team. Babe Ruth played for 3 teams in his career, what is your point?
2006-11-09 19:47:20
143.   Bluebleeder87
And this is with Drew having his worse year since 2003. How you could think that he was bad for the team is beyond me.

i can see you're point, but if i were a G.M. i'd stay very very far away from his fragile body.

2006-11-09 19:47:50
144.   King of the Hobos
Colletti seemed to be hesitant to negotiate with Boras in the past, and I doubt this helps. When he was quoted saying he probably wouldn't bid on Matsuzaka, I figured Boras had a lot to with it. I also would rule out Zito because of Boras, as well as possibly Maddux and Gagne. That means Schmidt or options like Igawa and Mulder.

As for the OF, anyone know if Dellucci can play CF anymore? He didn't play there last year, but had played there sporadically for awhile. Team him with Repko and you have a decent CF that's at least somewhat patient. I also like Church. Then add a corner OF who can mash, and we're goo.

2006-11-09 19:47:57
145.   Nolan
137 - Whoever gives Gary Matthews, Jr. a large contract will have made the biggest mistake of the offseason.
2006-11-09 19:49:11
146.   blue22
145 - LA does need 2.5 OFers right now...
2006-11-09 19:49:44
147.   Bob Timmermann
144
With Rowand's injury, one would think that if the Phillies wanted Dellucci to play center, he would have.

Unless they REALLY liked Shane Victorino.

2006-11-09 19:50:29
148.   StolenMonkey86
146 - LA already has 3.5; do they need 6?

Uh oh, that was Kenny Lofton's number.

2006-11-09 19:50:44
149.   Vishal
somebody brought it up earlier, but repko for church! make it so.
2006-11-09 19:51:15
150.   Bluebleeder87
and my future first born.

well if anything atleast that made me laugh & that's why i love Dodger Thoughts.

Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2006-11-09 19:51:57
151.   StolenMonkey86
149 - you know, it could work given the mindset of Jim Bowden.
2006-11-09 19:52:19
152.   Nolan
146 - Both Nomar and Kemp will post better seasons that Matthews next year. No doubt.
2006-11-09 19:52:31
153.   Bob Timmermann
The Rutgers-Louisville game is coming down to the wire! It has BCS title game implications.

Which seems really weird.

2006-11-09 19:53:12
154.   GoBears
126. My point about the implications for Colletti is not that he shouldn't feel betrayed (because, as you say, we don't know what was said behind closed doors). My points are that (1) if the only "promise" he heard was that quote that Miltie reproduced, then he should not feel betrayed; and (2) EVEN IF he feels betrayed, it showed terrible judgment to convert his personal disappointment into a team policy decision. To close the door on Drew is just dumb, at least publicly. Whatever Colletti was feeling, he should have said "his contract gave him the right to opt out. I hope we can convince him to stay for a fair price, but if we can't, we can't." That he whined about betrayal and threw a fit was evidence of poor leadership and judgment. THAT brings his qualification for the job into question.
2006-11-09 19:55:25
155.   Vishal
[135] absolutely not. these are people, not automatons. they have relationships with each other. they interact. drew is more than a contract and a performance, and colletti is more than someone who pulls levers. ned is understandably disappointed, when all along it seemed like he would be able to count on drew staying, based on the signals drew was giving. of course the opt-out was a possibility that he should have kept in the back of his mind, so i will agree that colletti's foolish for acting out, but not not for being disappointed.
2006-11-09 19:56:00
156.   blue22
148 - I consider Ethier the only OFer that should be starting next season (he's the .5 out of the 3 starting spots, but that's just a little joke).

I'm just not counting on Kemp to be ready for a full season in the bigs next year. And I'd rather him play fulltime in Vegas, than split time with Lofton or Roberts or whichever little popgun Ned signs to play CF.

2006-11-09 19:57:15
157.   Nolan
155 - Sure, Ned can be disappointed. Who cares? Does that mean that Drew shouldn't have acted the way he did? Of course not. There are a whole heck of a lot of players who get released - that they are disappointed has never mattered to one GM, nor should it.
2006-11-09 19:58:48
158.   Vishal
c'mon rutgers!
2006-11-09 19:59:40
159.   Robert Daeley
156 I'm interested on seeing Kemp's readiness coming out of the Dominican winter league; he might be more ready than we thought.
2006-11-09 20:00:26
160.   Yu-Hsing Chen
Victorino is a top prospect on the Phillies, and he did work out pretty well.

I think the Dodgers could land Crawford for Kou + Broxton or something along that line. but would it really be a good idea? they should consider.

2006-11-09 20:01:01
161.   Bluebleeder87
155

i'm glad someone else sees things like i do

2006-11-09 20:02:12
162.   Benaiah
158 - The Rutger's kicker missed a short field goal to win the game, only to have a defensive offsides give him a second chance that split the uprights. Ha. Talk about a costly mental error.
2006-11-09 20:03:54
163.   ninjavshippo
wow.. in 13 seconds, the big east is officially out of the BCS title picture. i really can't see rutgers getting in over the 1 loss teams. not that i'm saying it's fair, but that's the way i see it shaking out...
2006-11-09 20:04:02
164.   Benaiah
160 - Personally, I wouldn't make that trade. Two young arms with significant success on the major league level for a player who has (so far) refused to play the position we need him at and will soon be a free agent. Crawford is a stud, but we already have a great leadoff man.
2006-11-09 20:04:59
165.   DodgerfaninNY
The book '3 Nights in August' by Bizz Bissinger (author of Friday Night Lights) describes a series between the Cards & Cubs in 2003. In it, he infers (and you get the feeling he got this from LaRussa) that while you marvel at his ability, Drew is nothing more than a souless automaton. Drew has admitted he has no great love for baseball, he just does it because he is so good at it. I always felt it probably wasn't a great idea to have a guy like that as the highest paid player on your team.
2006-11-09 20:05:08
166.   Benaiah
Ha the fans prematurely rushed the field.
2006-11-09 20:05:33
167.   ninjavshippo
164
I agree. The asking price for pitching keeps going up, so it would take a more than crawford for me to make that deal.
2006-11-09 20:06:29
168.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
So, it's Rutgers vs. Michigan/Ohio State for the title, then?
See you in Glendale!
2006-11-09 20:07:26
169.   Bob Timmermann
If I had to hear Chris Fowler say "On the banks of the Raritan" one more time, I was going to lose it.
2006-11-09 20:09:45
170.   blue22
164 - I'd trade Kuo (elbow could blow at anytime), Broxton (reliever!), and Betemit/LaRoche for Crawford or Vernon Wells.
2006-11-09 20:10:05
171.   Bluebleeder87
moving on, i think Soriano is a big name for the Dodgers no? also a big pitcher like Zito or Schmidt.

ps i hope Drew doesn't sign for a NL team because i will boo him like i'd boo'ed no other player.

2006-11-09 20:10:49
172.   Vishal
hahah, rutgers is NOT going to make the title game, even if they're undefeated, sorry.

besides, i think wvu beats rutgers anyway.

2006-11-09 20:10:50
173.   bigcpa
Can someone point me to the Colletti quote? I'm not seeing it.
2006-11-09 20:13:10
174.   ninjavshippo
172
agreed, their schedule is a veritable who's-who of patsies.

UNC, illinois, ohio, howard, s. florida, navy, pitt, uconn, louisville.

left to play: cincy, syracuse, wvu.

2006-11-09 20:13:28
175.   Bluebleeder87
170

that kind of sounds pretty good.

2006-11-09 20:13:42
176.   bigcpa
Can someone please direct me to the Colletti quote re: Drew? Thanks.
2006-11-09 20:14:19
177.   bigcpa
Darn toaster, I reloaded 3 times before that double double.
2006-11-09 20:14:41
178.   Benaiah
I don't think Gary Matthews Jr. will replicate his stellar 2006, but I don't think he is going to be paid 8 figures either. He is a fantastic CF, he has a good career ISOpower (~.150), a decent ISOpatience (~.075). His BABIP was high (.348), but nothing like Ethier's during his hot streak (.380+). All in all, I think he might give you around a 800 OPS, with great defense, at one of the most challenging defensive positions. Lets just say that Carlos Lee is probably going to be a worse deal in the long run.
2006-11-09 20:15:05
179.   overkill94
160 I would make that trade and then immediately throw a parade. The guy's got incredible speed and emerging power...and he's only 25. Basically, he's the next Soriano with less power but more speed.
2006-11-09 20:15:52
180.   Nolan
178 - His D is overrated (according to Neyer).
2006-11-09 20:16:27
181.   still bevens
176 From Rotoworld, not sourced to anything:

"He wants out, he can have out," GM Ned Colletti said. "He's moving on, we're moving on. We'll find players who like playing here. If he doesn't want to be here, he has the right to leave, and he's exercising that right." The Dodgers learned Monday that Drew was considering giving up the $33 million he's owed over the next three years, but they still weren't expecting it to happen. "You learn in this business never to be surprised," Colletti said. "I'm surprised how it came down. Everything we had heard, everything that had been written led us to believe the player loved being here."

2006-11-09 20:16:51
182.   ninjavshippo
179
well i hope you've got a hat that fits my enormous head, because our bullpen would be mighty thin, and they could probably use my patented odalis offspeed spin-ball.
2006-11-09 20:17:09
183.   willhite
I think that when Drew made those comments about staying he believed them. I also think that Boras changed his mind because that's what Boras does.

This move will have a huge domino effect on next year's team. We now need to replace one of our best players in a weak free agent market and I'm betting that as mad as Ned is at JD he's ten times as mad at Boras. This will probably lead to no Gagne, no Zito and no other Boras client, at least for 2007.

2006-11-09 20:18:21
184.   das411
We actually do like Victorino a lot, want Rowand with Burrell while we're at it?

171 - Welcome to Philadelphia bluebleeder87!

Rocc, are you around? What are your (and everyone else's, of course) thoughts on a straight Billingsley for Crawford deal?

And does anybody know if #25 (or 24 if he wants to go retro) is available for the Dodgers these days?

2006-11-09 20:18:39
185.   CanuckDodger
I anticipated that GoBears, and, frankly, other Drew lovers, were going to start spitting at Colletti for completely justifiably showing his anger at Drew. GM's need to do this when players act dishonorably. Drew's "contract is his word"? Nonsense. Anybody who thinks Colletti went into the off-season without having a conversation with Drew about his intentions is clueless. At that time Drew could have said "I won't make a decision right now," and that would have been within his rights, but Colletti's reaction tells us that Drew told him he was NOT going to opt out. Screw Drew, and I applaud Colletti for saying as much too. It's the Hochevar crap all over again, and we all know that the puppet-master pulling the strings in both cases was Boras, so a pox on his house as well.
2006-11-09 20:18:44
186.   blue22
182 - The offseason is the perfect time to restock that bullpen.

So long as Broxton is throwing out of the pen, he's tradebait as far as I'm concerned.

2006-11-09 20:20:07
187.   blue22
Does Tampa need a 3B?
2006-11-09 20:22:16
188.   twerp
122 If he accepted a one year arb deal, trade him when and if possible during the year for blindsiding the team--if and only if you could get equal value.

If not, play him, see what happens, move on..Be the moveon-er, not the moved-onee

Agreed about his accepting arb being best case.

2006-11-09 20:22:30
189.   jakewoods
i cant believe rutgers may be playing for a national title.
2006-11-09 20:22:40
190.   natepurcell
Does Tampa need a 3B?

Nah, they have longoria and maybe even guzman. they really dont need anymore positional prospects.

2006-11-09 20:22:52
191.   GoBears
Hard for me to believe that anyone who questions Drew's character, passion, whatever can promote Soriano as an answer. This is the guy that threatened to sit out the season if he had to play outfield? When he's widely acknowledged to be a dreadful 2bman? I'm not saying yay or nay on Soriano, just that character is not a reason to like him.
2006-11-09 20:23:05
192.   ninjavshippo
i was just reading a little wiki on our favorite player agent and thought this was interesting...

"After four years in the minor leagues, during which he never made it above Class AA, he retired due to three knee surgeries. The Cubs paid Boras' tuition to attend law school at the McGeorge School of Law, University of the Pacific. He also holds a doctorate in industrial pharmacology, and during his law career, he specialized in medical litigation."

sounds like a smart enough guy, but if i had known the cubs were willing to pay for law school tuition for AA washouts, i would have spent less time on madden 2005 and more time fielding ground balls.

2006-11-09 20:23:54
193.   willhite
184

We'll take Burrell if you'll eat half his contract and take Tomko's contract off our hands.

2006-11-09 20:24:30
194.   das411
187 - If Miltie has his way and picks up Upton in the Crawford deal, then yes. Yes they do. Not even Evan Longoria can play two positions at once.
2006-11-09 20:25:05
195.   ninjavshippo
193
wow, that would be outstanding. while we're at it, we want cheesesteaks for all DTers and a signed allen iverson jersey.
2006-11-09 20:25:22
196.   blue22
190 - Forgot about Longoria. That stinks. Guess it's pitching or bust.

You could make a similar offer up to Toronto for Wells, but you'd have to overpay to keep him away from Houston or Texas next year.

2006-11-09 20:26:21
197.   Greg S
Drew has too few home runs for his power, too few stolen bases for his speed, too little playing time for his age, too little accomplished for his talent. That makes him hard to watch as a fan. But his numbers will be missed and will have to be replaced. Can that be done with $33M? Probably. Will he be healthy for the next three years? Probably not. All in all, good riddance to a guy like that who doesn't want to be here.
2006-11-09 20:26:41
198.   Bluebleeder87
184

i swear 411 i don't boo former Dodgers i'm just not like that, but this guy just really REALLY! made my heart boile today.

2006-11-09 20:27:02
199.   Benaiah
185 - I don't think that liking Drew as a player would make one more likely to defend his decision to leave your favorite team. My problem is not with Colletti thinking this, or even saying it to Kim Ng in anger. But to say that to the press is unforgivably hotheaded and petty.
2006-11-09 20:27:56
200.   bhsportsguy
Wow - almost 200 comments in a little over 2 hours, guess people have lots to say.

I'm going to watch "The Office" and then I will check in.

Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2006-11-09 20:29:24
201.   Robert Daeley
191 From all accounts, he has been a stellar teammate, popular with his fellow players and fans, so I think that's the wrong example to bring up.

http://tinyurl.com/ygrvmf

http://tinyurl.com/ksf59

2006-11-09 20:30:22
202.   Bluebleeder87
185

i like the way you think

2006-11-09 20:30:55
203.   Greg Brock
So, yeah...I'm gone for a few hours, and Drew opts out and the Scarlet Knights beat the Cardinals.

Dios Mio.

2006-11-09 20:31:24
204.   natepurcell
we should trade for sheff and sign bonds.

har har har har.

2006-11-09 20:33:15
205.   willhite
Any chance Ned's anger stems from the fact that he was planning to use him in a trade? Probably had a whole scenario of player moves lined up and now Drew has ruined it all.

From a strictly business viewpoint, Drew will come out smelling like a rose. I'm betting he signs a contract for somewhere between 50-60 mil, almost double what the remainder of his Dodger contract was worth.

2006-11-09 20:33:37
206.   ninjavshippo
further out of the fringe of possibility, it's too bad a-rod isn't on the move...
2006-11-09 20:34:18
207.   ninjavshippo
205
and beyond the strictly business viewpoint, it just plain sucks to be the one who gets dumped as opposed to the one doing the dumping.
2006-11-09 20:35:15
208.   ninjavshippo
unrelated note: are there a lot of stanford alum around here, or just jon?
2006-11-09 20:35:30
209.   Robert Daeley
Commenter over at Baseball Musings had an interesting thought: "Has Drew misread the Dodgers - did he expect the Dodgers to respond as the Cubs did with Ramirez?"

http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/018429.php

2006-11-09 20:40:29
210.   Bluebleeder87
199

do disrispect, but i love people that are honest with them selfs. i like & respect Ned even more now

2006-11-09 20:40:32
211.   willhite
207

You think you're feeling bad now. How are you going to feel on opening day '07 when you see JD playing center for the Angels?

Arte would just love to stick it to Frank.

2006-11-09 20:41:44
212.   natepurcell
I am intrigued by the mystery of Kei Igawa. I dont think hes going to turn into ishii since his bb numbers are alot better then ishiis when ishii was in japan.

he could be a reliable starter, especially in his firstyear over.

2006-11-09 20:42:09
213.   StolenMonkey86
209 - good call. Drew hasn't quite been carrying the team, so the Dodgers will survive in his absence just fine.

I'd be happy with Nomar, Sori, Schmidt, and Saito. I'd like Gagne and Maddux, but whatever.

Of course, this acutally hurts the Cubs, who are less likely to get Nomar at third like they had as a backup plan, and with the weak market at third base other than Ramirez, pushing the price a little higher.

2006-11-09 20:42:34
214.   Bob Timmermann
208

There is at least one other Stanford alum who posts here, the estimable Professor Zappala.

2006-11-09 20:44:15
215.   StolenMonkey86
From the Dodgers.com article

"There aren't an overabundance of [free-agent] hitters. We'll have to be creative [through trades] or let the kids come from within."

Methinks Ned might be trusting enough of Laroche to let him and Betemit compete for third.

2006-11-09 20:44:29
216.   twerp
123 "At least folks who didn't like Drew won't have him to kick around anymore. (Seems like some former president said something like that once)..."

You replied, "Actually, he wasn't yet a former (or even current) president at the time."

Yeah, I know. Lost '62? governor's race, then had pity party. But I thought the reference would be clear without having to be so literal.

2006-11-09 20:47:04
217.   Bob Timmermann
216
It will only be a matter of time before the fans have someone else to kick around. Such is the nature of sports.
2006-11-09 20:47:14
218.   Fallout
I'm shocked. Everything I had heard, everything that had been written led me to believe the Drew loved being here. :) Well isn't that true?

I guess that he thinks his injury prone history will be ignored. But, I think he's looking at an incentive laden contract if he expects to sign for 5 yrs.

2006-11-09 20:49:18
219.   regfairfield
213 I'm not sure, the stop down from J.D. Drew to Jason Repko is a pretty big one. I'm sure Repko won't be the Dodgers right fielder, but any attempt to replace Drew brings us that much closer to Alfonso Soriano.

While getting out of Drew's contract at this point is probably for the best, what Colletti will do to replace him will leave the Dodgers worse off.

2006-11-09 20:50:44
220.   Benaiah
In the espn article they said that Boras contacted Ned on monday and told him that it was a possibility and that he was notified this morning. Given all of that, you would think that he would be a little less fiery about the decision.
2006-11-09 20:51:15
221.   ninjavshippo
214
ah, okay. the cardinal women basketballers gave my lions a thumpin tonight, apologies to g.w.b..
2006-11-09 20:54:35
222.   GoBears
185. Please. To criticize someone for ignoring an assumed but wholly invented conversation between Drew and Colletti is sophistry. How do you know they had that conversation? How do you know, even if they DID have that conversation, that Drew didn't say exactly what you presume he didn't say? Why take Colletti's version of events at face value? I don't know that Colletti's lying, or mis-remembering, but I'm sure as heck not going to simply assume that Drew promised him that he would not opt out in a private conversation.

Geez, Canuck. Unless you really know something to be true, please don't condemn others for not assuming what you assume. You insult everyone's intelligence when you do that.

Until someone proves to me that Drew reneged on a private promise to Colletti (and not, as Colletti seems to indicate with his own statement, just that statement he made to the press), I won't believe that Drew reneged. And, more to the point, I couldn't care less if a player does renege on a non-binding agreement. If you want security, write it into the contract. This goes for Drew, Gagne, Beltre, or (dare I say it) management. I get just as annoyed when players complain about lack of loyalty by the team. It's blather.

I think losing Drew would hurt the team. I think refusing to talk to him, however, is petty and self-destructive.

2006-11-09 20:59:14
223.   Bluebleeder87
From a strictly business viewpoint, Drew will come out smelling like a rose. I'm betting he signs a contract for somewhere between 50-60 mil, almost double what the remainder of his Dodger contract was worth.

if i had any brain left in my body, even two brain cells i'd stay away from this "christian boy"

2006-11-09 21:00:18
224.   GoBears
216 Fair enough. I was just teasin'. My favorite part about that Nixon quote is that he referred to himself in the 3rd person. Only a couple years before Rickey Henderson made it cool to do so.
2006-11-09 21:03:22
225.   GoBears
223. Gee, BB87, I was sure you promised just a few score comments ago to avoid that sort of attack. Your claims that you mean no offense now ring hollow. Please, cut it out. You don't like Drew. Fine. You don't have to make it personal and bigotted.
2006-11-09 21:03:38
226.   Bluebleeder87
I guess that he thinks his injury prone history will be ignored. But, I think he's looking at an incentive laden contract if he expects to sign for 5 yrs.

talk about blind thinking there it is.

2006-11-09 21:08:26
227.   Benaiah
The espn article also mentions:
"Colletti said he hasn't spoken with Drew since Oct. 6 -- after the Dodgers were eliminated by the New York Mets in the first round of the playoffs.

"The last time I spoke with him, we had a nice conversation," Colletti said. "I don't really need to [speak to Drew] at this point."

Which is to say, even if Drew did say he was planning on staying, that was long enough ago that he had plenty of time to change his mind. And apparently Colletti was warned by Boras earlier in the week.

2006-11-09 21:08:45
228.   Bluebleeder87
225

i'm eating the bait & to be honest i can't help it!! :o) i've read you're post before & i like you please don't take it personal.

2006-11-09 21:12:03
229.   StolenMonkey86
Wait, with the draft picks, how does that work? Does Drew have to be offered arbitration, or offered arbitration by a certain deadline or something?
2006-11-09 21:15:40
230.   Bluebleeder87
this might be a dumb question but i really feel like i have to ask it, who in there right mind will offer D.L Drew a bigger pay day??
2006-11-09 21:18:26
231.   blue22
229 - I guess Drew can be offered arbitration just like, say, Maddux who filed for free agency earlier this week or Gagne, whose option was not picked up by LA(I don't think exercising a player out is any different than a team out, like with Gagne). Drew is most definitely a type-A FA, so 2 picks would be the compensation should he refuse LA's offer of arbitration.
2006-11-09 21:19:49
232.   regfairfield
230 In a market where Alfonso Soriano and Carlos Lee are the best hitters, lots of people.
2006-11-09 21:20:02
233.   Telemachos
230 Dude, seriously, can you lay off the ridiculous name-calling and tired cliches about Drew?

About the news itself, I'm surprised, but so be it -- for some reason I'm feeling generally optimistic in general, so I'll assume Colletti will use the extra $11 million reasonably well and our kids will step it up a notch. :)

2006-11-09 21:20:38
234.   blue22
230 - Here's my list of teams that have a need that JD can fill, and would very likely offer him more than his current deal with LA would have.

Toronto
Detroit
Cleveland
White Sox
Diamondbacks
Red Sox

Red Sox, Toronto, Cleveland, in that order, is my prediction.

2006-11-09 21:26:16
235.   still bevens
I cant see JD surviving Boston. That city would destroy him. I think this board has been relatively good to JD in terms of parsing his stats vs. his reputation, but Boston fans and the media wont be so kind.
2006-11-09 21:26:40
236.   Bluebleeder87
234

the G.M's for those teams are fools just look @ his past to know what you're getting into, & that's the bottome line

2006-11-09 21:26:54
237.   Terry A
My guess is that the arbitration offer is covered in Drew's contract. I want to say when a player has the power to exercise or decline an option, the team is often required to decline to offer arbitration if the player opts for free agency. The Dodgers may have no alternative, and given Colletti's apparent state of mind, they may be unlikely to offer arbitration anyway.

If I may say so, there are a lot of assumptions and aspersions being thrown around with regard to both Colletti and Drew. This is very much a wait-and-see issue; we are short on facts.

And, as a Christian, may I say that calling Drew's faith into question really crosses a line? Colletti came very close to doing it in his comments, and some on this board have been pretty bold with similar accusations. Again, we don't yet know why Drew opted out. We may think we know, but we don't. Not yet.

Be frustrated. Be angry if you're so inclined. But please watch the name-calling and the hostility.

2006-11-09 21:28:38
238.   Bluebleeder87
235

i hope he goes to NY OR Boston.

ps he's a HomeDepo guy by the way!!!.

2006-11-09 21:28:39
239.   thinkblue0
While I'm thoroughly annoyed by this I don't think we're in HUGE trouble.

Sure his shoes are tough to fill, but between free agency and trades we should be okay...and that is without destroying the farm.

We've essentially got enough money to get, say Schmidt and a Soriano type guy. On top of that, some of you brought up the idea of Burrell who would probably come cheap with the Phils possibly chipping in on his salary.

Nate, I really like your idea of Alou. Wouldn't cost much, nice hitter and it gives a young guy a chance to get 150-200 AB's when he's resting. If you go with Alou in right on the cheap, it keeps the money to be spent on guys such as Schmidt/Zito/Soriano/Lee etc etc.

2006-11-09 21:29:04
240.   dzzrtRatt
No matter how you slice it, this is bad news. The going rate for Drew's production is much higher than $11m/yr now. It's brave talk to say, hey, now we've got $33 million to "play with." But it won't buy you as much.

In the long run, if Kemp, LaRoche, Loney etc. pay off, this is very survivable. But this is a blow to a title shot in '07. Not to say Colletti can't replace Drew, but I don't think it's going be nearly as easy as some are making it sound. This probably reduces the budget available to sign a Schmidt or Aramis, as Colletti now starts from farther behind than he was yesterday and will have to overpay for what he thought he already had.

One other observation, this about a growing pattern with Boras clients.

Day 1: Player makes reassuring comment to press about staying with the Dodgers.
Day 2: Boras pulls a switcheroo.

It might hurt the team, I suppose, but I think a two-year double secret probation in dealing with Boras-controlled players would be salutory. At least his free agents. There's got to be a minimum standard of honor in a business.

2006-11-09 21:29:21
241.   thinkblue0
238-

Seriously, it's getting old.

2006-11-09 21:31:22
242.   thinkblue0
This probably reduces the budget available to sign a Schmidt or Aramis, as Colletti now starts from farther behind than he was yesterday and will have to overpay for what he thought he already had.

On the surface I agree...but if you go with an idea like Nate had (Alou) you still replace a good amount of production for significantly less leaving the rest of the money to be spent elsewhere.

2006-11-09 21:33:08
243.   Bluebleeder87
Be frustrated. Be angry if you're so inclined. But please watch the name-calling and the hostility.

you aint gonna change my mind about him, so please spare me, no disrespect to you're fiath but history about the guy is well known.

2006-11-09 21:37:16
244.   Bob Timmermann
I have absolutely no idea why JD Drew's religious beliefs matter one bit to anything having to do with him opting out of the final years of his contract.
2006-11-09 21:38:20
245.   Daniel Zappala
214 Geez, I haven't kept up on DT recently, and my name gets mentioned twice today. For you, Bob, it's Professore Zappalà.

And I think the Angels sign Drew.

2006-11-09 21:38:20
246.   blue22
243 - Sorry pal, that's not what this place is about. Googling "christian boy" and "JD Drew" returns no relevant results, so placing that in quotes is inappropriate. It's mean-spirited, derogatory, and totally out of bounds here.
2006-11-09 21:43:30
247.   LAT
Here is the thing I don't get. Putting aside the issue of whether Drew went back on his word, why wouldn't he approach Ned before opting out. I assume Drew opted out because he wants more years or more money or both. If he thinks he can get 4 yrs for $50M, why not go to Ned and say "I think I can get this on the open market and would rather get it here otherwise I am opting out." At least that way he gives his team a chance to match and doesn't piss anyone off.

Also, although it is pure speculation, I have to wonder whether Boras already has a deal in place for Drew. I know FAs are not allowed to negotiate yet but I am not so naive to think some form of communication between player rep. and team rep. doesn't take place. I have to believe someone let Boras know that if Drew opts out we will give him "x".

I bet Kent is furious about this.

2006-11-09 21:43:53
248.   StolenMonkey86
234 - Don't forget Baltimore. They could use a guy with decent OBP, especially a left-handed guy, especially a guy with a little bit of power who would look good in the 3 spot and take some pressure of Markakis.
2006-11-09 21:44:37
249.   Daniel Zappala
Wow. Bluebleeder, if you care at all about this site and what Jon wants it to be, you'll heed the advice many here are giving you.
2006-11-09 21:44:59
250.   natepurcell
from gurnicks piece

Drew's agent, Scott Boras, said the move was a "business decision" and that Drew would like to discuss a new contract with the Dodgers.

heh.

Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2006-11-09 21:45:50
251.   jujibee
234 The nationals also have a "void" to fill if they loose Soriano, which figures to happen. They might persue him pretty hard to try and cover up the missing 40 bombs left by soriano's departure. I disagree with the Alou signing. The guy is old and his body is getting fragile, as evident by his last 2 years. While his injuries aren't season ending, they are serious enough to consider, especially with his IR list visits increasing year by year. He is 40 years old and a temporary fix that I think would ultimately not pay off. I'd rather give the time to Kemp who might need a season in the majors before he's ready to live up to his potential.
2006-11-09 21:46:00
252.   blue22
247 - I think its as simple as Aramis, Soriano, and Lee all looking at multi-year deals in the $12-17M range, and teams looking like they'll bite. Drew is every bit the hitter they are, and the only plus-fielder in the group.
2006-11-09 21:46:16
253.   LAT
185. It's the Hochevar crap all over again, and we all know that the puppet-master pulling the strings in both cases was Boras, so a pox on his house as well.

Canuck, you better bring a big pox cause I'm guessing its a big freaking' house.

2006-11-09 21:46:17
254.   StolenMonkey86
247 - Don't know with Kent. If you think he's mad that he's already guaranteed for next year, no way, because he doesn't make that kind of money on the open market. As for whether he's mad that the Dodgers don't have Drew, I think if someone decent is put in his place he'll be ok about it.
2006-11-09 21:46:47
255.   Jon Weisman
Bluebleeder, your position is abundantly clear. You're entitled not to like Drew but you've crossed the line in your language far too many times.

You've been asked by me and others to tone it down. If you repeat what you've been saying one more time, I'm going to ask you to take a break from Dodger Thoughts for a week.

2006-11-09 21:47:51
256.   Jon Weisman
253 - That's the biggest laugh I've gotten all day :)
2006-11-09 21:49:06
257.   LAT
252. Agreed. SO why didn't he go to the Dodgers before opting out and say "Aramis, Soriano, and Lee are going to get 12-17M. I want the same will you give it to me? Otherwise I am going to opt out."
2006-11-09 21:52:19
258.   Daniel Zappala
By the way, good job Rutgers. And BYU romped again, 55-7. Sure wish they could take back those close losses to Arizona and BC.

I'm at the point where I root for all teams to have at least one or two losses, except those from the non-BCS conferences, just to mess with the system.

2006-11-09 21:52:22
259.   herman
A Jewish person wouldn't of opted out.
2006-11-09 21:53:04
260.   jujibee
257 Because he's a Boras guy. He's probably going to hold out until a team's offseason plans have fallen through, to the extent that they'll sign him to a deal which allows him to opt out in a couple of years, out of desperation to fill a need. I'd be happy if the Dodgers never dealt with Boras again, but his clients are too many and they're all good. good ridence.
2006-11-09 21:55:09
261.   blue22
257 - I think he was saying all the right things this year because he knew he might be here for 3 more years. But when the market turned, he jumped at it.

He's not an LA guy, for sure, but the market was pretty dry during the 2004 offseason. When the chance to not only get out of LA, but get a raise and almost choose his new destination arises? Well, I can't blame him.

2006-11-09 21:56:28
262.   blue22
259 - Nope, he would've been traded along with 2/3 of his salary for a back up catcher.

Wait, was that out of line?

2006-11-09 21:58:05
263.   StolenMonkey86
262 - personally I don't think so, because we were all thinking about something to say about Shawn Green too
2006-11-09 21:58:49
264.   StolenMonkey86
For the record I am not speaking for the group. I am declaring myself to be a king and using the royal we.
2006-11-09 21:59:48
265.   Terry A
I rebel!

(I was thinking Koufax.)

2006-11-09 22:01:52
266.   Bluebleeder87
241

sorry

2006-11-09 22:04:30
267.   Greg Brock
I am predicting that this thread will not make the cut for "Best of Dodger Thoughts: Pt II"

Just a hunch.

2006-11-09 22:04:44
268.   dzzrtRatt
When I first heard about Drew on KFWB, A. Martinez mentioned the issue of tampering. I suspect he didn't just pull that word out of his hat. Colletti or maybe McCourt probably whispered it to him. We'll see I guess.

Another place I'd hate to see Drew go: San Diego. That's a team that would use Drew optimally b/c of the ballpark. His fading HR numbers don't matter; no one hits homers there. His defense is crucial to their game especially in that big OF. His OBP and situational hitting is the thing they value most.

2006-11-09 22:05:39
269.   blue22
More good news!

http://tinyurl.com/y4obog

2006-11-09 22:06:03
270.   Bluebleeder87
A Jewish person wouldn't of opted out.

i love this site!! :o)

2006-11-09 22:08:03
271.   LAT
Nah, the Green and Drew situations are nothing alike. Green really wanted to stay and Drew really wants to go. The only similarity is neither will dive for a short fly ball.

(Wait, did I really say that).

2006-11-09 22:12:20
272.   StolenMonkey86
268 - so the Padres would set themselves up to not be able to afford a 2B or a 3B without trading pitching?

Interesting.

2006-11-09 22:14:35
273.   Bluebleeder87
272

i really doubt Drew would end up in SoCal.

2006-11-09 22:16:00
274.   franklin
and this just in...

phone conversation overhead following today's conference call from the Dodger Stadium GM's office...

"Hello, Moises? This is Ned.

Yeah, Ned Colletti. Sorry to hear about your dad. Yeah, Giants suck. Anyway, Mo, we've had some unexpected changes here and, well, how would you like to play right field for the Dodgers next year?

Uh huh, uh huh...Speak up, Moises, I can hardly hear you. What's all that noise in the back ground?

Unh, you're at a cock fight? Oh, OK.

Was that 'si, I will play ball' or 'see, I told you he'd call'?

You'll think about it? OK, that's great. Well, then have your agent give me a call as soon as possible after the signing period opens. OK, we'll be in touch."

political correctness disclaimer: enjoying and gambling on rooster combat is an acceptable pasttime in some cultures

But seriously, why not throw $6m at Alou for 100 games in right field. Mix that in with Kemp, Ethier, Lofton, Repko, Werth, and Young(?) and you get similar production without sacrificing prospects. Plus you still have $5m to push towards pitching, another bat or deadline moves. Get Nomar back, give Betemit and LaRoche a chance to fight it out and pray to god that Kent doesn't wash any vehicles during the off/season.

2006-11-09 22:18:12
275.   StolenMonkey86
I really doubt the Padres would ignore their holes at 2nd and third over getting JD Drew when they already have Brian Giles.
2006-11-09 22:20:21
276.   StolenMonkey86
274 - You just had to remind me of Clifford Geertz's "Notes on the Balinese Cockfight."

Incidentally, Geertz just passed away last week.

2006-11-09 22:20:34
277.   CanuckDodger
222 -- You say I am basing my position on an assumption -- that Drew gave his word to Colletti that he would not opt out -- but your position is just as equally based on an assumption -- that Colletti did not have any communication with Drew about his intentions. The difference is that while my assumption is reasonable, yours is not. Even without Colletti's reaction as much as telling us that assurances were given to him by Drew (he talked about Drew's "word," not about contractual formalities), I don't believe any GM would have neglected to have a conversation about a player's intention when the player has to decide whether or not to exercise an opt-out clause. No GM would be that incompetent, not even Jim Bowden. But you are assuming such incompetence, and the thing is, that is very convenient for you, because you have never liked Colletti to begin with, and you are a big Drew fan, so there is the question of bias. I, on the other hand, have had no prejudice either for or against Colletti or Drew. I am not a fan of either of them, but neither have I disliked either one. Of course NOW I dislike Drew, just as I intend to hold a grudge against Hochevar for his dishonorable dealings with regards to the Dodgers.
2006-11-09 22:20:55
278.   twerp
From Dodgers.com:

Colletti said there was no request for a contract extension and sounded as if he had no desire to retain Drew.

"He moved on and we'll move on," he said. "We'll find a player who wants to stay here. Scott broached [the opt-out] and I said if that's what you decide to do ... I'm finished with it.

"In light of what J.D. said at the end of the year, about making a commitment and how much he loved playing here, I was surprised. J.D.'s a man of his word. I guess he changed his word. I think you expect things to be handled in a certain way. Based on what was written at the end of the season, you have to ask yourself, 'How did this happen?

Also from same story.......

Drew, who turns 31 later this month, is no stranger to surprising and contentious decisions. He was the second player taken in the 1997 First-Year Player Draft by the Phillies, but only after protesting that the draft was unfair and warning all teams it would take $10 million to sign him. He held out the entire season and took Major League Baseball to an arbitration hearing over the legality of the draft, but finally re-entered the draft the following year, when the Cardinals made him the fifth overall pick and gave him a four-year deal worth $7 million guaranteed.

2006-11-09 22:21:03
279.   LAT
I would love it if the Pods picked up Drew he would consume so much of their payroll they wouldn't be able to accomplish much else.
2006-11-09 22:21:43
280.   StolenMonkey86
DodgerBlues promises an update on Drew.
2006-11-09 22:21:45
281.   Robert Daeley
So in the ESPN insider rumor mill, they list several guys the Dodgers are reportedly interested in (Soriano, Zito, Schmidt, et al.). One that I hadn't heard is Rich Aurilia, who was 300/349/518 last year. 23 HR but only 70 RBI in 122 games.
2006-11-09 22:24:52
282.   blue22
281 - I've thought Aurilia would be a tremendous fit in LA, facing lefties as the 3B or 2B (when Kent could shift to first), as well as backup SS.
2006-11-09 22:26:28
283.   LAT
278. Wow it really is Hochevar II.
2006-11-09 22:26:36
284.   CeyHey
Before there is too much panic, let's remember hwo bad everyone said it was going to be last year without Hee Seop Choi
2006-11-09 22:26:56
285.   blue22
280 - Oh baby, that'll be a doozy.

That pic on the homepage is priceless.

2006-11-09 22:27:37
286.   Terry A
"He moved on and we'll move on," he said. "We'll find a player who wants to stay here."

I hear Toby Hall and Julio Lugo are available.

2006-11-09 22:28:06
287.   StolenMonkey86
281 - good. here are my feeling on why I don't want to hear about LA going after Aurilia

1) that .349 OBP is the highest it's been
2) he hit 23 HR playing for the Reds. GABP is a launching pad (Dave Ross hit 21 HR in 247 AB)
3) he's 35
4) he's expensive
5) he has little to offer that Wilson Betemit doesn't
6) Ned Colletti might consider it

2006-11-09 22:28:08
288.   LAT
283. I guess I should say Hochevar was Drew II.
2006-11-09 22:28:16
289.   caseybarker
268 I was just thinking that. I wonder if the Dodgers would bid to keep him out of San Diego.

I guess he would replace Cameron, right.

2006-11-09 22:28:45
290.   StolenMonkey86
ok, take back #4, he only made 1.4 million last year, but still
2006-11-09 22:30:30
291.   Sushirabbit
Who among you makes enough, or loves his employer enough, that doubling your salary (or getting half again as much) wouldn't convince you? Eh? Eh? Wait I just heard the rooster crow the third time... (that's my personal favorite, btw).

Given all the speculation on this, re:260 how do we know that drew or Boras did not contact Coletti?

I hate Boras as much as the next guy (just not as much as BlueBleeder hates me), but (insert blasphemy of desired deity here) another 12-20 million over the next few years would be pretty convincing. And that is Boras' job after all.

That said, I sometimes think the double secret probabition on Boras clients sounds good. I will now lay down my John 3:16 sign. :-)

2006-11-09 22:31:46
292.   CeyHey
what was the reasoning again behind not giving Hochevar the extra 2 million but giving Cruz Jr. and Tomko 6
2006-11-09 22:32:31
293.   LAT
288. No. Hochevar was Drew I.

There that it. Third time is a charm even if it does demonstrate I'm a knucklehead.

2006-11-09 22:32:39
294.   twerp
Revisiting Gagne on Boras:

"He's my agent. I'm not his player."

This as he implied he might take less to stay in LA. Then I understand he backed off.

Guess we'll find out pretty quick just who is who's what. Or who's who. Or who's on third...and should have stayed there. Or something.

2006-11-09 22:35:33
295.   Sushirabbit
It sucks to lose the OBP, but I was always worried about JD Drew getting hurt. For instance I'd say the odds of Kent staying healthy next year are just as good as Drews. I'm for getting younger or signing someone like Edmonds or even Alou (who I'm not really a fan of) to a short term deal and letting the young guys give it a go, or trade for Crawford or Cabrera or both.
2006-11-09 22:35:55
296.   regfairfield
278 So why is Boras the bad guy in th original Drew situation. Drew says it will take 10 million for him to sign, he slips to Philly presumably because of this demand, then the Phillies are upset that he wants 10 million.

I'm not a fan of being able to ask for whatever you want coming out of the draft, but Drew made his intentions clear, and the the Phillies ignored them.

2006-11-09 22:36:26
297.   CeyHey
When JD comes back to play in LA do you think he will just think Bluebleeder is just yelling, "DREEEWWWWW"
2006-11-09 22:36:50
298.   GoBears
222 -- You say I am basing my position on an assumption -- that Drew gave his word to Colletti that he would not opt out -- but your position is just as equally based on an assumption -- that Colletti did not have any communication with Drew about his intentions. The difference is that while my assumption is reasonable, yours is not.

Please review Jon's rule #4. This has become tiresome. I assume nothing about what did or did not happen between Colletti and Drew. Unless someone has videotape, I give zero credence to one person's (or the other's) report of what happened. Therefore I refuse to accept Colletti's public take as the truth about what happened.

But as I've said too many times, to me, the truth of the Drew-Colletti understanding doesn't matter. Even if Colletti's take is 100% true, it still doesn't make his public reaction to it good business, good leadership, or good sense. By saying what he said (no matter what happened behind closed doors), he weakened the team.

2006-11-09 22:37:14
299.   LAT
I've been in and out recently but where has Joey P. been. Hard to believe he hasn't doesn't have an opinion on this.
2006-11-09 22:37:45
300.   CeyHey
first hee seop choi
then j d drew

who is left with a 3 syllable name to chant with with Nancy B

Show/Hide Comments 301-350
2006-11-09 22:38:08
301.   Bluebleeder87
291

i'm not laughing.

2006-11-09 22:38:14
302.   blue22
295 - or signing someone like Edmonds

Dangit! I knew no one looked at my 269!

2006-11-09 22:39:33
303.   Bluebleeder87
but seriously why in the world would J.D Drew do this?? his fragile body & contract could back fire on him JMO.
2006-11-09 22:41:30
304.   LAT
It will be interesting to see some of the players' reactions over the next few days.
2006-11-09 22:41:55
305.   gibsonhobbs88
The bottom line is Boras is sneaky and a back stabber and does not even possess the minimum modicum of honor in doing business. While he may get some of his clients major short term bank, he also burns a lot of bridges for future deals with other clients. I agree with a 2 year ban on signing his free agents. You have to make a stand somewhere and he has burned the Blue on many occasions. He is the Dodgers "Anti-Christ".:) Dodgers will find a way to survive without JD.
2006-11-09 22:44:40
306.   blue22
303 - He will make more money, and (speculation) play for a team that's closer to his desired location.

I promise. For real. Seriously.

2006-11-09 22:45:34
307.   StolenMonkey86
303- Why did Jeff Weaver hold out for the contract he wanted, only to take a 1 year, $8 million deal with Anaheim?

300 - of course there are guys whose names can be chanted:
E-thee-ur
Bet-uh-mitt
Der-ek-Lowe (but Brad Penny doesn't flow right)
Raf-ee-yell

2006-11-09 22:46:09
308.   caseybarker
302 Alright, alright. It's funny how nothing in the body of the article supported the content in the title.
2006-11-09 22:47:32
309.   underdog
So after my soccer game tonight I went to a bar with some of my teammates to hang out. While everyone was yakking at each other, I could barely hear anything above the din of the place so my eyes wandered up to the TV screen above the bartender.

ESPN was on. They were giving us some baseball news. JD Drew appeared on the screen. My first thought was, "Did he hurt himself?" and then, "No, he must have signed on to stay in LA for the rest of his contract."

No, it was, "Drew opts out and becomes free agent." I nearly spit out my beer. Whaaaa---??

Didn't see that one coming.

So while I've never truly loved Drew, I've always felt he was really solid and have defended him here in the past. I think he'll be missed but the bright side is, yeah, the team now has a lot of money to spend elsewhere, and he is more likely to get hurt again then not given his past fragility. But he was certainly healthy this year and very productive, more productive than a lot of people give him credit for. So he'll be missed, and I hope they can find some similar numbers from someone else in the off season.

2006-11-09 22:48:53
310.   Steve
Numb3rs tomorrow night is going to be about sabermetrics. Set your TiVos to fun.
2006-11-09 22:48:54
311.   Jon Weisman
New post up top.
2006-11-09 22:51:02
312.   gibsonhobbs88
Kevin Brown, Darren Dreifort, Hochevar, JD Drew all have one common thread-Boras.
Boras is the Drew guy for the NFL who handles TO and other head cases. All they do is destroy any team chemistry so they can get an extra couple million for the athletic head cases to spend on fast cars, fast women and dope. When has a client for either one of these sharks done anything for the community or given back unless the cameras are going? They are a blight on society.
2006-11-09 22:54:12
313.   screwballin
Wow, the attacks on his Christianity are really out of line. Couldn't it be that his values, more than money, are actually playing a part in his decision? I mean, LA isn't really everyone's cup of tea, you've gotta admit. I know plenty of devout Christians who want nothing to do with this place.

And even if it IS about money, before criticizing Drew, prove your convictions by turning down the next raise you're offered.

2006-11-09 22:54:23
314.   Bob Timmermann
310
That's a repeat.

I actually got an e-mail from Bill James asking me what the show was about and if he was mentioned favorably.

Not that I'm name dropping.

2006-11-09 22:55:24
315.   Bluebleeder87
297

in my own little world i'd like to think so.

2006-11-09 22:57:29
316.   LAT
I have a theory that when you get pulled over by a cop and he is polite you are absolutly getting the ticket. If the cop is nasty he is going to let you off with a warning.

Same is true of Boras' clients. If the player goes on record saying how much they love the team or want to give a hometown discount (Beltre, Gagne Drew) the team is about to get screwed. Officer Boras has his ticket pad out. The best you can hope for is the player says nothing and the fuzz has nothing to prove.

2006-11-09 23:01:02
317.   Jon Weisman
312 - Somehow, I have a feeling that many Boras clients have given back to society and you haven't noticed. I'll start with Gagne and we can go from there.
2006-11-09 23:01:23
318.   CanuckDodger
298 -- I am not arguing for the sake of arguing. There is something else I would rather be doing now, but as long as you keep replying to me with statements that call out for a response, I'm stuck here. Contrary to what you are telling us, you DID assume that a conversation didn't take place that I can't imagine NOT taking place. But aside from that, if your position really were that you don't want to make assumptions on the grounds that you have insufficient information to judge, then you wouldn't have come out blasting Colletti the way you did, because you said that you did not KNOW what communications did or did not take place. You would have reserved judgment if you were really impartial. But like I said, you are anti-Colletti, and have been since say one, and you love Drew. Which is why I saw your attack on Colletti coming.

And Colletti's public response to Drew's actions hurt the Dodgers how? Letting players and agents know that they are expected to adhere to a standard of honor in their dealings with the Dodgers only helps us for the future, and if it takes publicly embarrassing players who screw us to send that message, so be it.

2006-11-09 23:07:11
319.   caseybarker
309 He made you almost spit out beer??!!! Hang him.

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