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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
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Abreu Promoted
2007-05-22 13:37
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

The Dodgers have called up Tony Abreu, reports Ken Gurnick of MLB.com - an announcement on a corresponding roster move is still to come.

Thanks to Dodger Thoughts commenter Brian Y for the quick alert - and for Silverwidow to notice that Hong-Chih Kuo has been moved back to the AAA Las Vegas roster on Dodgers.com. (Of course, that site temporarily had Abreu as a pitcher, which would be interesting.)

Abreu has a .397 on-base percentage and .500 slugging percentage for AAA Las Vegas.

Update: It's official: With only five games in the next seven days, the Dodgers have sent Kuo down to reduce their pitching staff to 11.

Comments (321)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-05-22 13:42:55
1.   silverwidow
Kuo is listed as inactive on Dodgers.com. He's been moved to the Vegas roster.
2007-05-22 13:44:35
2.   underdog
I'm glad to see Abreu get a shot, as he tore it up in spring and hasn't really relented during the AAA season. Now if only he'd bring Kemp with him. ;-)

If LaRoche is sent down, I hope it doesn't tweak his confidence much. He seems pretty mellow about things and I'm sure the Dodgers staff would talk to him but you don't want to see another disgruntled young 'un. (Unless a trade is pending? Or, as you suggest, the pitching staff is reduced) At any rate, Abreu could be an improvement on Betemit and LaRoche, so why not.

2007-05-22 13:45:02
3.   Brian Y
2. What would be the point of having Abreu AND LaRoche on the team? Are we going to be playing LaRoche in LF or something somenights? I understand sending down Kuo but I would have brought up Kemp and sent down LaRoche also.

Also Gurnick says Abreu is a switch hitter. I swear I thought he was strictly a RH batter.

2007-05-22 13:45:10
4.   underdog
Ah. Or Kuo.

Hm. He didn't get much of a shot. I wonder if they think he's still a little "off" or something.

2007-05-22 13:45:37
5.   underdog
3 It's possible they're not done making moves...
2007-05-22 13:46:31
6.   Joshua Worley
My wife pointed out to me that Abreu was listed on the roster on dodgers.com about half an hour ago, but I couldn't, and still can't figure out where the heck he's going to play!
2007-05-22 13:47:48
7.   Jon Weisman
Clever to check there.
2007-05-22 13:48:42
8.   Brian Y
5. Also if it's Abreu's time can we DFA Ramon Martinez yet? I would rather see Tomas Perez at this point. Or Wilson Valdez again. Chin-lung Hu anyone?
2007-05-22 13:48:49
9.   bhsportsguy
1 You mean I did all this work and all someone did was check the website.

Okay, lets see, who has options.
1. Chad
2. Hong-Chih
3. Tsao
4. Broxton (okay, just kidding)
5. Saito (now I am really kidding)
6. Ethier (uhh nope)
7. LaRoche

Straight out DFA
1. Rudy Seanez (don't see it until Yhency comes up)
2. Ramon Martinez

Safely attached to the team
1. Martin
2. Lieberthal
3. Nomar
4. Kent
5. Furcal
6. Betemit, only because he has trade value.
7. Saenz
8. Gonzalez
9. Pierre
10. Clark
11. Lowe
12. Wolf
13. Penny
14. Tomko
15. Hendrickson
16. Beimel

If I had to guess, I would say Hong-Chih, with all the off days, they probably feel that their pitching depth is okay for now.

As for the 40-man roster move, when they DFAed Valdez, they effectively opened up one spot on that roster, otherwise they could put Repko on the 60-day DL and do it that way.

2007-05-22 13:48:59
10.   underdog
How about Abreu at 2nd, Kent at 1st, Nomar on the bench/at 1st/at 3rd, and .... aiieeeee... my head hurts. Just wake me when the team is set.
2007-05-22 13:49:21
11.   Kevin Lewis
What are the odds he is starting tonight?
2007-05-22 13:50:10
12.   Hallux Valgus
dodgers.com has Abreu listed under Pthcers, so at least one of the kids is getting his shot at the rotation (smiley emoticon)
2007-05-22 13:50:33
13.   Jon Weisman
10 - Very interesting to consider that this might be the way they give Nomar more rest and improve the infield defense.
2007-05-22 13:50:55
14.   Hallux Valgus
jeez, I miss my firefox spell checker- "Pitchers"
2007-05-22 13:51:31
15.   Brian Y
I guarantee Abreu will start tonite.
2007-05-22 13:51:47
16.   silverwidow
11-Very high. I imagine he'll get plenty of time at 3rd.
2007-05-22 13:52:10
17.   ToyCannon
As someone in my office just said "great another two hitter, the whole team consists of two hitters"
2007-05-22 13:52:32
18.   Joshua Worley
Um ... can Abreu maybe play center field?

A man can dream, right?

2007-05-22 13:52:48
19.   bhsportsguy
Let's see Loney has seen Valdez, Kemp, LaRoche, Kuo (if only for a week) and now Abreu promoted ahead of him after his hot spring.

Bigbie too but I think he was in AAA just as a real emergency option.

I wonder how this is playing out in his mind?

2007-05-22 13:53:22
20.   paranoidandroid
I didn't see this coming. Abreu is an interesting move.

Short term, we go to 11 pitchers with the off day Thursday.

Long term, we might be ready to make a bolder move. Things do need to change. Perhaps Ned has a trade going involving Betemit, Valdez, a pitcher, and an outfielder for Glaus?

2007-05-22 13:53:36
21.   Eric Enders
Well, a roster change certainly appeared necessary, although Abreu would have been my third choice for a guy to call up from Vegas. With LaRoche also on the roster, the only way the move makes any sense is if they plan on using Abreu as a utility man who plays most of the time, a la Ryan Freel. Giving Furcal an occasional day off. Giving Kent an occasional day off. Giving Nomar a much needed day off by having Abreu play second so Kent can play first. Giving LuGo an occasional day off by having Abreu play third so LaRoche can play LF.

I would have preferred that they just DFA Tomko and call up Kemp, but this move is better than no move, I guess.

2007-05-22 13:54:24
22.   Doctor
Maybe a dumb question, but is Tony Abreu and Etanislao Abreu the same guy? Baseball cube has 2 listings splitting off circa 2006. Not bad numbers, actually.
2007-05-22 13:54:30
23.   Daniel Zappala
How about Abreu playing CF next year?
2007-05-22 13:55:10
24.   bhsportsguy
9 Actually, based on my figuring, I do think Kemp would have been just a good a choice as we could play four outfielders, maybe that will happen soon but the list of players I think Kemp can replace easily (I mean not trading Pierre) gets shorter.
2007-05-22 13:55:11
25.   paranoidandroid
20

Rather than Betemit, LaRoche would be wanted by Toronto I would think.

Maybe Andy was getting showcased?

2007-05-22 13:55:24
26.   Eric Enders
22 Yes they are the same guy. Baseball Cube pages cannot always be trusted. (Either that, or Matt Kemp is a heck of a two-way player.)
2007-05-22 13:55:33
27.   Xeifrank
it's possible that Guo is getting sent down to get work as a starter and save us from Tomko? The "what iffs" are endless.
vr, Xei
2007-05-22 13:55:43
28.   bhsportsguy
22 Yes and no, he is not related to Bobby Abreu.
2007-05-22 13:56:07
29.   paranoidandroid
24

You are a very smart man. A very smart man indeed. Do you have Ned's phone number? I'll pitch in to rent a billboard.

2007-05-22 13:56:10
30.   paranoidandroid
24

You are a very smart man. A very smart man indeed. Do you have Ned's phone number? I'll pitch in to rent a billboard.

2007-05-22 13:57:02
31.   Brian Y
I really dont care what we do as long as we improve our Defense. We all knew going into the season this was one of the worst defenses we have had.

Kent is a liability at 2B because of his range.

Nomar is a liability anywhere other than 1B because of his injuries.

Wilson Betemit/LaRoche were horrible this spring with the glove.

Gonzo and Pierre have the weakest arms out there.

Ethier has a strong arm but makes a lot of mistakes in the OF and his accuracy.

Martin- didn't foresee his struggles but oh well.

2007-05-22 13:57:16
32.   Jon Weisman
27 - Agreed.
2007-05-22 13:58:59
33.   Eric Enders
31 What struggles? Martin has been one of the better defensive catchers in the league, the occasional throw into CF notwithstanding.
2007-05-22 13:59:09
34.   regfairfield
Terrible move. Doesn't solve our lack of outfielders, brings up a guy well before he's ready (and forces either him or LaRoche to sit on the bench), and possibly starts burning up option years to soon.

If a minor leaguer has an average driven line and a .420 BABIP, he will not find any long term success in the bigs.

2007-05-22 13:59:23
35.   Joshua Worley
27 --- I sure hope so. I think Kuo just needs to start, whereever he is. Don't call him back up until you're ready to put him in the rotation.
2007-05-22 13:59:35
36.   Sam in SC
well, a team with three shortstops needs balance . . . maybe three third basemen brings that to the roster.
2007-05-22 13:59:51
37.   ToyCannon
Abreu Bio
http://tinyurl.com/2oauww
2007-05-22 14:00:01
38.   bhsportsguy
27 I think he will start, you can only send out Spike Lundberg so many times plus Joe Mays got his walking papers as he wanted to go try catch on somewhere else.

Miller will probably go back as a starter sometime, there will be at least 2-3 guys in AAA who can start on short notice plus we still have Chad here in LA.

2007-05-22 14:01:36
39.   Eric Enders
34 "brings up a guy well before he's ready"

Umm... no.

Unless you think Martin, Ethier, Kemp, LaRoche, Loney, and Billingsley were all also brought up "well before they were ready." Because all of them were brought up at the same point in their careers as Abreu -- with a couple of months or less of Triple A under their belt.

2007-05-22 14:03:09
40.   ToyCannon
34
What was Loney's BABIP last year?
2007-05-22 14:03:27
41.   bhsportsguy
34 But nothing solves our lack of more productive outfielders short of moving one of them. Even bringing up Matt Kemp wouldn't mean Luis or Juan getting less time unless they are not physically able to play and by that I mean healthy not just declining or stagnating skills.

The more I think about it, the idea of Jeff playing first and Abreu playing second sounds like it could be something that we could see shortly like in 5 hours.

2007-05-22 14:03:32
42.   Brian Y
33. I'm more than specifically mentioning his errors than the way he has handled the pitching staff and so forth. He is just making more errors this year which is increasingly hurting our pitchers by having to pitch with a man on 3rd rather than 2B because of some of his wild throws. No doubt he is a stud defensively but this year has been an abberation to this point.
2007-05-22 14:04:15
43.   Joshua Worley
I think we need to see what else the Dodgers do, and how they use Abreu before making a judgement on the move.

It is very puzzling, though, and doesn't seem to help them where they need the most help, in the outfield.

2007-05-22 14:04:23
44.   regfairfield
39 They had far better track records than Abreu. Abreu's regressed batting line is .274/.337/.416 in a hitters park, pretty much right in line with his career numbers. If he's allowed to play all year, he'll be pretty terrible.
2007-05-22 14:04:38
45.   Brian Y
42. I should really look at my post before I hit submit. That's some bad grammar there hehe.
2007-05-22 14:05:31
46.   D4P
So, which problem is Abreu expected to address?
2007-05-22 14:05:35
47.   regfairfield
40 .404 but he had a ridiculous line drive percentage to go with it.
2007-05-22 14:05:57
48.   Joshua Worley
I've got it!

Abreu is going to be our DH for the remaining AL road games!

2007-05-22 14:05:58
49.   ToyCannon
I find it funny that we spent the previous thread debating how the kids are blocked and then they bring up the one kid no one even mentioned even though he has outhit all the namebrand kids.
2007-05-22 14:06:15
50.   regfairfield
Whoops. Loney's regressed line had him hitting .350 last year.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-05-22 14:07:26
51.   bhsportsguy
39 But only LaRoche was brought up for a non-injury related move. (I guess Chad was kind of a combination injury and reach to find someone who could start with Tomkos, Seos and Perezs of the world move).

Other than that, I think LaRoche had more AAA at bats than the others but memory serves that Martin, Ethier, Kemp and Chad were doing really well at the time of their callups (Chad's pitch counts notwithstanding) and Loney was called up first out of spring when Nomar was hurt. Only LaRoche had a month or so of so-so stats before his promotion.

2007-05-22 14:07:29
52.   underdog
Yeah, I actually think Abreu is more ready (readier? readiest?) than you may think, reg. Although, yes, I would like Kemp and Loney up as well. I do think this move is only one of several (or at least one more) to come, and is better than nothing.
2007-05-22 14:07:45
53.   trainwreck
Well I am just going to wait for the other shoe to drop because I have no idea why we are doing this.
2007-05-22 14:07:59
54.   ToyCannon
44
If you don't mind can you explain how you came up with that line.
2007-05-22 14:09:20
55.   regfairfield
54 Turn his BABIP into his line drive percentage +.120. Assume all the hits that were lost were singles. This drops his BABIP from .420 to .332.
2007-05-22 14:11:18
56.   Doctor
Play well, get promoted.
2007-05-22 14:12:13
57.   Brian Y
53. I'm with you. I hope the other shoe that drops is benching Pierre for a few games and giving Kemp a shot. Or a trade. SOMETHING!! We need power and some sort of clutch hitters.
2007-05-22 14:14:06
58.   Bumsrap
Wherever Abreu plays it is a move in the right direction. The thing about change is that it is hard to get started but once it starts to happen it is hard do keep up with the desire for more of it.
2007-05-22 14:14:22
59.   Curtis Lowe
55 - Are there any cases where this conversion is evident with real world production?
2007-05-22 14:14:49
60.   bhsportsguy
55 Just wondering, how close does that projection equate in actual performance? Not trying to be smart (really), I like all the stats and analysis but it seems that BABIP is one where it gets used more to point out negative traits than positive ones.
2007-05-22 14:14:54
61.   regfairfield
56 That's my argument. Abreu isn't playing any better than we expected, his weaker hits are just finding holes.
2007-05-22 14:15:10
62.   Jon Weisman
57 - Do you see any other shoes dropping today, short of maybe a trade?

There is an explanation for the move already - with an off day coming up, Kuo goes down to get more work, and the Dodgers add a bench player/spot starter. So I don't know if there's anything else to wait for.

It might mean that Betemit will firmly be a pinch-hitter for a while, but that's not intrinsic to the move.

2007-05-22 14:16:05
63.   Hallux Valgus
by the by, I haven't seen it mentioned today, but tonight is Stitch N' Pitch Night at Dodger Stadium:

"Stitch N' Pitch brings together two American traditions — Baseball and the NeedleArts. Come to a ball game and knit, crochet, embroider, cross-stitch and needlepoint. Sit among friends, family and colleagues and cheer on your favorite Baseball Team."

And you thought there couldn't possibly be a worse idea than Disco Demolition night.

2007-05-22 14:16:07
64.   Hallux Valgus
by the by, I haven't seen it mentioned today, but tonight is Stitch N' Pitch Night at Dodger Stadium:

"Stitch N' Pitch brings together two American traditions — Baseball and the NeedleArts. Come to a ball game and knit, crochet, embroider, cross-stitch and needlepoint. Sit among friends, family and colleagues and cheer on your favorite Baseball Team."

And you thought there couldn't possibly be a worse idea than Disco Demolition night.

2007-05-22 14:18:29
65.   DodgerBakers
Kemp update: Kemp is 1 for 4 with a hit by pitch, but he just gunned down a guy at the plate to complete a double play.
2007-05-22 14:18:38
66.   D4P
64
It was mentioned in 63
2007-05-22 14:19:14
67.   regfairfield
59 It's a quick calculation, but it works. Baseball Prospectus has further research on the subject.

Here's Abreu last year:

.290/.345/.394, .331 BABIP, 20% Line drive percentage.

Abreu is showing the expected improvements in power from aging and moving to a better hitters park, but right now he's got almost the same batted ball types, he's just finding holes 10% more often.

2007-05-22 14:19:33
68.   Jon Weisman
63 - Actually, I think that's a really good idea. A ballpark is a great place for that, and if it gets the womenfolk out, so much the better. Certainly better than a riot.
2007-05-22 14:19:42
69.   Marty
Yes, beer and knitting needles. That's a good combination.
2007-05-22 14:20:06
70.   dzzrtRatt
Ned Colleti is starting to remind me of David Chase, and the recent Dodger roster moves are like the current season of "The Sopranos." Intriguing, but where is this going? How's it going to end?
2007-05-22 14:20:46
71.   Doctor
61

I dont know- he was beating the ball in ST, havnt seen any of the 51s games, but the top level stats look pretty solid to me. 18 XBHs in 39 games, so its not a bunch of seeing eye grounders. Well see.

2007-05-22 14:20:55
72.   Curtis Lowe
70 - Bloodbath?
2007-05-22 14:21:06
73.   Bumsrap
Ned is sending mixed messages if he is trying to say play well and you get promoted. Loney played well last year and in Spring and he was demoted. Kemp was doing well and got hurt hustling after a ball and has not been brought back up.

Nomar's ability to hit singles with risp and his fan popularity make it more difficult to move him out of Loney's way. I would take my chances with Nomar in left, Kemp in CF, Loney at first for a couple of weeks.

2007-05-22 14:22:04
74.   underdog
I think that's a swell idea, too. I know my g/f would be more into going to baseball games if this were part of the setting. Beer and knitting needles are only a bad combination if it's men who have them both. I don't worry about women in baseball stadiums.
2007-05-22 14:22:27
75.   Jon Weisman
70 - :)
2007-05-22 14:23:16
76.   Marty
It just seems too similar to Lawn Dart night.
2007-05-22 14:23:20
77.   kinbote
70 - i think tomko is going to get whacked.
2007-05-22 14:23:21
78.   trainwreck
I am guessing they want another look at Abreu and only want to call up Kemp or Loney if it is for good.
2007-05-22 14:25:36
79.   underdog
Nomar in left? You're kidding, right? I know Gonzo isn't much out there and I want Loney up, too, but...
2007-05-22 14:26:42
80.   Bumsrap
Stitch N' Pitch Night -- Someone could win an award for that--Best female sports executive or something like that. Simmers missed that today.
2007-05-22 14:27:50
81.   underdog
Colletti: "Grady, there's something I got to confess---What are you doing?"

Grady: "Getting my wine in position to throw in your damn face!"

2007-05-22 14:28:15
82.   Hallux Valgus
68, 74
actually, it looks to be fairly successful. Josh Rawitch said they had 500 people last year and 1000 this year.

I guess it beats the time my g/f spent the entirety of the All Star game in Denver trying to find Beanie Babies for her nieces.

2007-05-22 14:28:17
83.   Bumsrap
I realize Nomar in left would count as an offensive weapon for the opposing team but he said he would play anywhere if he could just hit singles for Dodgers home games.
2007-05-22 14:28:48
84.   Jon Weisman
Not since we kept comparing the Dodgers to The Office has anything seemed so right as comparing them to The Sopranos.

It's entirely possible that Abreu is just a temporary recall until they go back to 12 pitchers. Like the Angels have done with Brandon Wood.

Not everything is meant to be analyzed like the duck by the swimming pool ...

2007-05-22 14:28:52
85.   PDH5204
Maybe there is no end to this, I mean, a designed and intended end implies the rational, but maybe we're just irrational and/or stupid?
2007-05-22 14:29:31
86.   ToyCannon
While contemplating if this is a solitary move or just the beginning of a cascade of events that will change the Dodger landscape I have a quick poll for everyone.

If you could remove one starting Dodger who would it be. We have so many options that it is not obvious who the number one candidatee would be:
1. Pierre / Kemp
2. Tomko / Billingsly
3. Gonzo / Kemp
4. Tomko / Kuo
5. Nomar / Loney

How many other 1st place teams have this many candidates for upgrade?

2007-05-22 14:29:42
87.   ToyCannon
Billingsley
2007-05-22 14:29:53
88.   Disabled List
19 Let's see Loney has seen Valdez, Kemp, LaRoche, Kuo (if only for a week) and now Abreu promoted ahead of him after his hot spring.

I wonder how this is playing out in his mind?

I hate to lose Loney, but it would be much better for his career now if the Dodgers traded him. There is a mental game here, and the combination of being blocked and seeing his teammates getting called up must be killing him. Especially if the Abreu move was made with the intention of giving Nomar a few days off here and there.

The Dodgers crushed him by not giving the roster spot that he felt he earned after last season and this spring. Now he's not hitting well, and Abreu gets called up ahead of him, even though it's the guy who's blocking Loney that might be headed to the bench. That's brutal.

2007-05-22 14:31:28
89.   underdog
Close call between 1, 2 and 3 for me. Can I try them all and see which one I like best? 4 and 5 sound good, also.
2007-05-22 14:31:48
90.   ToyCannon
Sorry that was not a vote for Billingsley just an attempt to spell his name correctly.
2007-05-22 14:32:46
91.   PDH5204
88 Not just Loney, since if I were Kuo, I too would welcome a trade to some team with even a wisp of a clue on what it means to manage a baseball team.
2007-05-22 14:33:10
92.   ToyCannon
89
I don't think Kemp can play CF and LF but he might be able to approximate the coverage of our current disposable duo.
2007-05-22 14:33:20
93.   Bumsrap
90 --Kind of a loose chad thing.
2007-05-22 14:33:51
94.   ToyCannon
88
Boo Hoo
2007-05-22 14:34:47
95.   underdog
I think you guys are maybe being a little too cynical here? Not that I don't understand where it comes from...

92 I think he could play both at the same time and be better than those two, yeah. Oops, sorry, now I'm being cynical. ;-)

2007-05-22 14:34:51
96.   jasonungar07
Tomko should have already been whacked, but like Phil, probably won't do anything about it.
2007-05-22 14:35:38
97.   3upn3down
Just one? I'll go with option #1!
2007-05-22 14:36:27
98.   Jon Weisman
86 - I'm most interested in 1).
2007-05-22 14:36:30
99.   DodgerBakers
Ghame over in Tacoma. 51's win 8-6. Brazoban gets the save and Loney does well going 2-4 with an RBI.
2007-05-22 14:37:07
100.   Joshua Worley
86 ---

11111111111111111111111111111

I hope that doesn't violate rule 8.

In case that isn't clear, I go with 1, Kemp for Pierre.

I don't think Gonzo is worth worrying about at the moment. He has the best OPS of any Dodger outfielder. He's a good candidate to get worse as the year goes on, but there are bigger holes in the OF.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2007-05-22 14:38:27
101.   Greg Brock
Today, in order to fix the offense, we'll call up...

{Shakes Magic 8-Ball}...

Abreu. Go get 'em, kid.

2007-05-22 14:39:16
102.   El Lay Dave
86 - "If you could remove one starting Dodger who would it be."

I'd do # 1. Little / Colletti might make the other moves on their own in due course anyway.

2007-05-22 14:39:26
103.   DodgerBakers
I vote to bring up Kemp over Pierre, too. But I think we have a better shot of either Kuo or Billingsley in instead of Tomko, which I'd also be happy with.
2007-05-22 14:39:40
104.   ally
this may be a dangerous question for a new poster to ask but has there been any discussion about Loney's 2006 possibly being a little flukey. I mean regardless of his BABIP, there really wasn't anyhting the previous three years in the minors to suggest he would suddenly put up a 900+ ops was there? Did he really figure it all out last year at the age of 22 and his lack of success this year is mental due to the disappointment of not making the big team or was last an anamoly and the 700 ops he's posting this year who he really is?
2007-05-22 14:39:50
105.   Joshua Worley
101 ---

They should have come up with "All signs point to Kemp" in the 8-ball

2007-05-22 14:42:01
106.   Jon Weisman
104 - If this isn't JoeyP in disguise, we've found his new best friend. :)

There are some who feel that way, but I think more feel that his minor league career holds up better than people say, especially considering his age and the times he was hurt.

2007-05-22 14:42:37
107.   Greg Brock
104 We'll never know, will we? Adrian Gonzalez is basically James Loney, and he's worked out pretty well for the Padres.
2007-05-22 14:43:03
108.   Jon Weisman
104 - Most importantly, welcome and please don't be shy about offering what you think might be minority viewpoints. ToyCannon and CanuckDodger, among others, have helped this place thrive by keeping us on our toes.
2007-05-22 14:43:17
109.   jasonungar07
I meant to say, Ned, like phil.

I would like to see Kemp replacing Gonzo. Thats my vote. RBI opportunities are not his fault, but dude has 4 more than Juan for five and is 39.

2007-05-22 14:43:29
110.   The Blue Legend
Does Nomar have a no trade clause in his contract?

I'm really eager for the Dodgers to just let the kids play and get away from the aging vets.

2007-05-22 14:44:09
111.   Disabled List
94 Boo Hoo

Not sure what you were getting at with that, but if you think Loney is just being a whiner, and that his frame of mind should have no impact on his performance on the field, then you're deluded. Athletes are human beings, not machines. It would be nice if they performed free of emotional clutter, but often, they don't. That's life.

And we'll be the ones crying in a few years when Loney is starring at 1B for another team, and Nomar is enjoying his retirement.

2007-05-22 14:46:09
112.   The Blue Legend
Fielding the line up below by next year will help us get to where the Brewers are at

1B Loney
2B Abreu
SS Furcal
3B. LaRoche
LF Kemp
CF Pierre
RF Eithier
C Martin

2007-05-22 14:47:30
113.   bhsportsguy
104 Not dangerous at all.

I think there was a little of that doubt there but he did perform at that level all year plus he had a nice few games in September and even showed some poise in the post-season. And then he backed it up with a nice spring training.

There were reports from scouts in early 2006 that liked Loney more than Joel Guzman (not Dodger scouts, unnnamed scouts in BP reports).

Which is the real James Loney, well he has time on his side, his production in the low minors was never that bad, he just always had that nagging power question but he is only 23 as of a few weeks ago and unless you are just a large guy like Prince Fielder or Ryan Howard, power usually takes some time to develop.

But to give you a short answer, yes it was talked about a lot last year and it took Loney's full year to bring a lot of people over to his side.

2007-05-22 14:47:55
114.   regfairfield
110 Yep.
2007-05-22 14:48:15
115.   Jon Weisman
Josh Rawitch just said that Kuo's option to AAA is official.

Nothing else expected to come today.

2007-05-22 14:49:25
116.   Greg Brock
It just seems like a totally random call-up. LaRoche came up to play third, because Betemit is a bag of terrible. Makes sense.

Nomar is OPSing under .700, so you'd figure Loney would get a call up to play some first. But no, they call up Abreu, who has a lower ceiling than LaRoche and doesn't play first or the outfield. Loney isn't hitting a ton in AAA, but neither was LaRoche when they called him up.

Again, it just seems totall random. Neither rhyme nor reason.

2007-05-22 14:52:45
117.   Jon Weisman
116 - Betemit is easier to bench than Nomar from the Dodgers' standpoint, but they can rest Nomar by having Kent play first and Abreu second and also improve the infield defense. Abreu gets chosen over Loney because he's the hotter hitter. There's your reason, even if it doesn't rhyme.
2007-05-22 14:52:53
118.   trainwreck
My best guess is that this is just temporary until Kuo can take Tomko's spot. They felt like they should go with a positional player, because the offense stinks so bad, but they do not want to call up Loney or Kemp until they can keep them up permanently. Abreu then becomes the next player in line.
2007-05-22 14:53:32
119.   overkill94
Seems that Abreu's promotion is just a reward for him doing so well in AAA so far this year. Starting a week from today, the Dodgers have 16 games in a row without a day off, so I'm assuming a reliever will be called back up for that. If Abreu does happen to get hot during his time up, it's possible LaRoche gets sent down instead, but this extra hitter is most likely just a week-long thing.
2007-05-22 14:54:12
120.   Disabled List
116 Abreu has a higher BA and more hits this season than Loney. I think it's been established by now that those are among the few statistics that Ned Colletti bothers to look at.
2007-05-22 14:57:41
121.   The Blue Legend
118. I agree. When they finally bring up Loney and Kemp it's going to be for good. As frustrated as they might be they should know that their time in AAA is almost over. I just want them to be ready to make a splash right away.
2007-05-22 14:58:01
122.   Greg Brock
117 If Kent moves to first for a couple of games, that makes sense. I don't like it, at all, but it's not ridiculously stupid. And at this point, I'll take it.

I didn't want to re-sign Nomar, especially for two years, but I didn't think I'd despise his presence as much as I currently do. But he sells jerseys and appeals to certain demographics and is a very nice guy, and that's all that matters.

2007-05-22 15:01:10
123.   The Blue Legend
As much as i like Nomar and respect him, we're not the kind of team that needs to rely on him for attendance. We'll get fans to the stadium regardless of whether Nomar is here or not. We really should be thinking of trading Nomar and opening up 1B for Loney. I'm sure we could get something of value for Nomar. At this point all he has going for him is his past success.
2007-05-22 15:03:18
124.   Eric Enders
123 Contractually, we can't trade Nomar. We're stuck with him for the next year and two-thirds.
2007-05-22 15:04:15
125.   Doctor
keep in mind Nomar was the team's best hitter last season, so its not exactly all smoke and mirrors.
2007-05-22 15:04:34
126.   Brian Y
I can almost surely bet that Abreu coming up is a showcase and that at least 2 of the 3 (LaRoche, Loney, Abreu) will get traded in the next few weeks.
2007-05-22 15:05:25
127.   blue22
123 - "No trade clause" + "local boy/hometown hero" + "twins and new wife at home" = "Nomar in LA for the length of his contract"
2007-05-22 15:05:48
128.   Brian Y
I can also guess that Betemit will not be traded because Ned likes his ability as a PH.
2007-05-22 15:06:32
129.   trainwreck
126
I won't let you frighten me. Instead, I will be optimistic and think nothing so stupid will happen.

Ignorance is definitely bliss.

2007-05-22 15:07:01
130.   The Blue Legend
if we have some kids that are almost ready to play 3b why would we be willing to trade for an injury plagued player like Troy Glaus? Iknow he has a lot of power but I don't think he is the answer.
2007-05-22 15:08:07
131.   Joshua Worley
125 --

Drew was a better hitter than Nomar last year. Furcal and Kent were better if you compare them to positional averages.

2007-05-22 15:09:04
132.   bhsportsguy
If this cheers anyone up, our AL cousins have their share of contractual issues.

Mr. Anderson has 23 million on his contract through 2008 (11 in 2007, 12 in 2008), it is full no-trade contract because he a 10-5 player (10 years service time/5 continuous years with the same team), and he has a 3MM buy out at the end of 2008.

Of course this deal was made back in 2004 when Garrett got a 4 year extension plus option/buy out for 2009.

Not saying that we don't have our problems but don't think that all GMs don't have a deal or two that they would reconsider.

2007-05-22 15:09:36
133.   trainwreck
Furcal was definitely our best player last year.
2007-05-22 15:10:18
134.   D4P
But he sells jerseys and appeals to certain demographics and is a very nice guy, and that's all that matters

I think SABR-types tend to limit their conception of a GM's duties to putting the best team on the field, where "best" refers to scoring the most runs and giving up the fewest. In reality, however, GMs also have to take into account which players the fans will pay to see and which they won't. The team that will sell the most tickets isn't always the team that will win the most games.

Not that I'm saying anything new here.

2007-05-22 15:11:12
135.   Humma Kavula
For what it's worth, Nomar is about average among 1B in RC/27:

http://tinyurl.com/3asdgs

Just how much is that worth? Seriously, somebody explain, please...

2007-05-22 15:11:19
136.   Brian Y
129. Allow yourself to not be frightened but definitely look at the ethical reasoning behind A)Keeping Loney at AAA and keeping Nomar for TWO YEARS, B) LaRoche coming up when Nomar should've slid over to 3B allowing Loney to play and C) Abreu coming up when we still have LaRoche at 3B and the rest of our IF's are healthy.
2007-05-22 15:11:33
137.   Greg Brock
If we lose tonight and fall behind the Padres and D-Backs, at least I don't have to hear the "We're in 1st place, so it can't be that bad" chorus.

No that I want us to lose. I don't. I'm just tired of that line of reasoning.

2007-05-22 15:12:24
138.   Brian Y
As soon as you find some logic behind these moves I may change my viewpoints on my thinking that 2 of those 3 will be traded.
2007-05-22 15:12:49
139.   Humma Kavula
134 Also not saying anything new, but I'd thought that the studies showed that winning games was the best way to drive attendance.
2007-05-22 15:13:13
140.   Greg Brock
134 When, my friend, have the Dodgers ever had problems putting fannies in the seats?

The Dodgers draw 3 million plus like I get heartburn. That is to say, consistently and without missing a beat.

2007-05-22 15:13:55
141.   silverwidow
Per ItD:

Pierre
Furcal
Nomar
Kent
Martin
Gonzo
Ethier
Abreu
Wolf

2007-05-22 15:13:58
142.   Bob Timmermann
Just to see if I can:

Front office positions < > on field positions.

2007-05-22 15:13:59
143.   The Blue Legend
How did Nomar gain so much clout in such a short period of time. You'd think he's been a franchise player who's been here all his career. Just remember how things got sour in Boston when things didn't go his way.
2007-05-22 15:14:20
144.   Brian Y
Also if it brightens anyone's day, it seems as if Ned is trying to build a team to win THIS YEAR which isn't all that bad. But the question is, "at what cost"?
2007-05-22 15:14:42
145.   bigcpa
135 THT looks wrong. ESPN has Nomar at 4.4 RC/27 which is down in Adam LaRoche territory where you'd expect it. Morneau should be 6.7 vs. the 4.7 here.
2007-05-22 15:14:50
146.   Bob Timmermann
137
How about
"We're in first place! What a country!"
2007-05-22 15:16:29
147.   PDH5204
95 Are we? Kuo earned his spot last year and instead of starting the spring with him penciled in as a starter [his job to lose], we put him into this absurd and ridiculous competition with Hendy and Tomko. Absurd and ridiculous because Tomko is who he has always been and it's a little bit late in the day for that tiger to change his stripes. Re Hendy, well, those here so fond of the new math ought to see the point, since the last 3 starts are the regression to his historic mean that the new [and old] math says was and is a given.

So Kuo was forced to compete and concealed an injury so as not to be declared out of the running by default. And then our team management has the unmitigated gall to blame him for not speaking up. Why? So he can be like Kemp and play well only to have an injury lead to more time in AAA with no recall in sight? The Kemp fiasco only proves the wisdom of what Kuo tried to accomplish.

And we have a single spare outfielder by trade, which means that we cannot ever protect a 1 run lead late by inserting two better fielding and throwing OFs into LF and CF in place of the single is a double LuGo and Pierre. What sealed the deal for me was the run that Kuo gave up last series. Kotchman was sent home on a shallow pop fly to CF and he scored. What more need be said?

That's the "without a clue" here, I mean, here I thought that we were going to upgrade Hendy with Schmidt [so Schmidt, Penny, Lowe, Kuo, and Bills] but instead we added "veteran presence" in Wolf and gave up any pitching improvement whatsover by adding the weak fielding and throwing LuGo and Pierre to the OF. I'd really like to have Ned and/or Grady explain that one, as it makes no sense whatsover to me, I mean, what was the point of upgrading the pitching when we were just going to give it all back with singles into doubles and slow as molasses scoring from 3rd on a shallow pop fly to CF.

Wolf otherwise makes no sense, since it was only for two back to back years [2001-2002] that he's ever had a season ERA under 4.00 [his career ERA stands at over 4.00]. Apparently, management believed that neither Kuo or Bills could post an ERA under 4.00 for the year [or else believed that Wolf could somehow magically revert to 2001-2002 and never mind 99, 00, 03, 04, and his injury history]. What makes it even worse is that if the thought was that Kuo may not hold up, well, has Wolf held up recently? I suspect that the thinking was, Wolf is a strikeout pitcher, and so he might help with LuGo and Pierre in the OF, but then again, Kuo too is supposed to be a strikeout pitcher. And given Kuo's own injury history, maybe otherwise better for us that if he has to blow his arm out once and for all, that he does so for us and not AAA Las Vegas.

In sum, the only team with worse player management than us is the Colorado Rockies [with the Texas Rangers a close 3rd].

2007-05-22 15:18:18
148.   Brian Y
147. I would like to also nominate the Cincinnatti Reds and Washington Nationals.
2007-05-22 15:19:14
149.   Joshua Worley
So the three-way platoon thingy at third begins, I guess.

How quickly LaRoche seems to have fallen out of favor.

Maybe I'm overreacting, but man I feel jerked around by this bizarre Dodger management.

2007-05-22 15:19:41
150.   regfairfield
148 Seattle Mariners, Baltimore Orioles
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2007-05-22 15:19:43
151.   ally
all he has going for him is his past success.
well isn't that the only thing every struggling player has going for him?
why is loney's one great year in triple a an indicadtor that he is going to get hot and produce more than nomar, the rest of this year, yet nomar's previous 5000 big league at bats not an indicator that he will eventually get hot and put up at least similar numbers to his career norms. and no i'm not saying he can win a batting title but i would think he could at least give us the 870 ops he gave us last year. now if your'e argument is loney could give us close to that for ten million less, than that might be the case
2007-05-22 15:20:14
152.   jasonungar07
Ned to FSW: We need another van commercial the natives are getting restless.

FSW commercial director: Who, any ideas?

Ned: Kent, Pierre, Gonzo or Penny for starters

----cuts to morning meeting at TV station in front of dry erase board----

FSW crew: Kent, maybe we go with a Motocross theme.

FSW commercial director: good I like. Make it happen number 1.

FSW pleebs: Pierre we go with rappers.

FSW pleeb in the back: how bout we get Tom Goodwin to pull him over?

FSW commercial director: now your thinking. If Goodwin can't do it where do we go?

FSW pleeb in the back next to other guy: I can ask my people if Wesley Snipes is available?

FSW commercial director: ok, on to Gonzo, any ideas?

FSW pleeb by the speaker phone: How about something playstaion related? His kids jump out from the back of the van playing Metal Gear or something?

FSW commercial director: Maybe even go with Gonzo himself trying to get Furcal to go 15-17. We can tweak this, now on to Penny.

FSW pleebs: How about chicks with blogs?

FSW commercial director: That's crazy talk.

2007-05-22 15:20:18
153.   Brian Y
150. Damn your good, I forgot about Bavasi up there and the idiots in Baltimore.
2007-05-22 15:23:18
154.   Brian Y
151. I would have an argument that I'd rather have paid $27Mill a year for Soriano than that same amount for Nomar, Gonzo, and Pierre.
2007-05-22 15:24:45
155.   underdog
147 I think you're being a little harsh on the signing of Wolf. While he's not going to be fantastic every time out, he's generally going to be pretty solid, and sometimes great. I actually think that signing was a bargain. It's keeping Tomko in the rotation that I don't understand.

But then again I may have missed something; I only read the Clif's Notes version of your posting. ;-)

2007-05-22 15:29:22
156.   ally
154. if it was 27 million for the next three years i might agree with you, for the next eight not so much. with the glaring exeption of the pierre deal i will say that i think most people would agree the one good thing about ned's free agent deals have been the short amount of years
2007-05-22 15:30:09
157.   DodgerBakers
147. I would like to nominate the Royals. See the case study that is Billy Butler
2007-05-22 15:31:13
158.   bhsportsguy
Okay, I am stumped, while its true LaRoche hasn't exactly started off blazing, he only has 3 hits since coming back from Florida and he has not driven the ball at all, playing Tony Abreu at 3B doesn't really solve anything, its his worst defensive position and he the only player that has less power than him is Pierre.

Now Grady, though I find is Southern charm engaging, is not Mr. Explain the Reasoning behind moves like these so hopefully someone will talk to someone who can.

I mean really, this isn't a whole lot different than the Izzy/Lugo experiment at 3B.

2007-05-22 15:32:14
159.   ToyCannon
Wow it didn't take long for the hysterics to kick in.

Ben Sheets has been very average this year until his last two starts. Will be interesting to see if he really has found his strikeout pitch again. Not exactly an easy matchup for Abreu the 1st time around.

2007-05-22 15:32:17
160.   bigcpa
156 Except that he supposedly offered Gonzalez 2 yrs.
2007-05-22 15:32:33
161.   Greg Brock
154 The Gonzalez signing wasn't a problem. It's a one year deal, and if he stunk the joint up, Kemp would play over him. His production hasn't been ideal for a corner guy, but I have no real complaints.

Plus, Nomar and The Player have enough salary to sign Soriano.

2007-05-22 15:33:30
162.   Hallux Valgus
Could adding Abreu for a short stint and then sending him back down to bring back Kuo (as has been suggested) just have to do with adding him to the 40 man roster in place of Valdez? Admittedly, I'm not well-versed in the rules regarding such things.
2007-05-22 15:33:53
163.   Brian Y
156. Why not 8 years? By the time Soriano's deal elapses his deal will look like a bargain compared to some others. Heck, even Arod's $25M/year looks decent to me right now.

Besides, Soriano doesn't get paid $27M a year which makes it a moot point but if he were to have been paid $27M a year I could guarantee he would have taken a 4yr deal.

2007-05-22 15:34:15
164.   Greg Brock
Wow it didn't take long for the hysterics to kick in.

To whom do these hysterics belong? Are you talking about calling up Abreu?

I need clarification.

2007-05-22 15:35:37
165.   regfairfield
162 There's no reason to do that. All it does in the end is burn up one of his option years when he gets sent down. Plus, the Dodgers can't add anyone to the 40 man roster, like maybe Larry Bigbie, or Kelly Stinnett if Martin gets hurt, without exposing someone else to waivers.
2007-05-22 15:36:54
166.   DodgerBakers
163, 161. Do you really think that Soriano would be that much better than Nomar and The Juan who shall not be named? Maybe it is just that I think Soriano is heavily overrated.
2007-05-22 15:37:10
167.   Humma Kavula
If anything, Nomar's past is an indicator of what he's likely to produce. Some people look at him and see a player with declining skills whose remaining talents are masked by the fact that he is injured so often. He is still capable of great things -- witness the first half of last year -- but injuries and time are taking their toll on him.

Same thing, only opposite, with Loney. He is so young, and showed such marked, continual improvement, that his past indicated during spring training that he might -- might -- be a better performer than Garciaparra this year. It is hard to know what to make of his performance in AAA this year -- it may be an indication that the guesses about him during ST were wrong, or it may be something psychological, or it may just be a meaningless slump. Nobody knows.

I don't know if I agree that Nomar's done -- he's my favorite player and I like watching him play for my team... and it was great to see his first half last year. Still, I recognize that not re-signing him and playing Loney at first would have given the team many more options at (a) likely little or no cost in wins, and (b) some but not huge cost in marketing potential.

Where people are frustrated, I believe, is the deference given to veterans over the prospects. Past performance -- no matter how long ago -- counts more than potential future promise. Maybe that makes for a better team today, but maybe not, and it certainly is not a good recipe for long term success. Even the Yankees, who could spend more on veterans than anyone, couldn't keep it up.

I'm happy for Abreu and I hope he makes the most of his chance up here and sticks. That said, like others, I don't understand why he gets the nod instead of Kemp.

2007-05-22 15:38:21
168.   Reddog
Whatever happened to Larry Bigbie? He had a great spring training and should have made the club. Is he at Las Vegas, and if so, how's he doing? Couldn't he be a help to our outfield?
2007-05-22 15:39:44
169.   regfairfield
168 He's putting up a great, massively unsustainable line in Vegas. He wouldn't be any real help to our outfield, except maybe as a fifth outfielder.
2007-05-22 15:39:56
170.   bhsportsguy
165 Actually, they can by just putting Repko, who is not expected to play this year at all, on the 60-day DL.
2007-05-22 15:40:08
171.   Xeifrank
147. I agree with you about the rotation and everything that went on. The silver lining with regards to Guo and Billingsley to a lesser extent is that by not starting them out in the starting rotation we are keeping their young arms (and Guo's case brittle) from throwing too many pitches in their first full year as a starter. I am ass-u-ming that Guo and or Billingsley will be given the opportunity in the starting rotation sooner or later. As long as one of them makes a start by the 2nd week in June, I will not go too crazy. Yes, I'd like them to both be in the rotation now, but can see some good by keeping their innings pitched limited this season. vr, Xei
2007-05-22 15:40:20
172.   ToyCannon
164
Those claiming that were the worse run organization in baseball.
2007-05-22 15:40:54
173.   bhsportsguy
169 He's gone by the end of the month or whatever his deal says. Though, if he has no takers, maybe he plays out the year in Vegas.
2007-05-22 15:41:51
174.   Hallux Valgus
165 I kind of figured. But they have to make a spot for Abreu anyway, right? And that spot is the Valdez spot.
2007-05-22 15:42:27
175.   blue22
173 - maybe he plays out the year in Vegas

I could think of worse ways to spend my summer. What do minor league players get paid?

2007-05-22 15:42:30
176.   ally
163. okay then let's just say that i wouldn't want to be paying soriano 18 million for his 36 and 37 year old seasons. like nomar, he's an impatient hitter with no real defensive position and one of his main assets speed is not likely to be an asset by the time he is that age.
2007-05-22 15:43:10
177.   Jon Weisman
I guess it beats a DT T-shirt.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/fan_forum/am/2007/index.jsp

2007-05-22 15:43:13
178.   Greg Brock
172 Yeah, that's silliness. I don't like our GM, and I don't understand what's going on with many players, but we're still in very good shape, long term.

I'm not confident in the direction we're going, but we're not a disastrously run franchise.

2007-05-22 15:43:39
179.   regfairfield
174 I think they do by the next rule five draft (could be wrong there). But by then we should lose several guys to free agency.
2007-05-22 15:45:09
180.   Humma Kavula
I, for one, do not believe that a prospect fire sale is about to take place.

I hated all of the prospect trades that Colletti made last year, but there's one thing that unifies the players that Colletti gave up: their stock had fallen.

You can't say that about LaRoche or Abreu or Kemp or Hu or even Loney.

FWIW, you CAN say that about Betemit, whose stock is at its nadir... and while I can't speak for the rest of DT, and while it would depend on the trade, I don't think I'd be too sorry to see Betemit go.

2007-05-22 15:45:16
181.   DodgerBakers
177. Um, actually, I'd rather have the DT T-shirt.
2007-05-22 15:45:25
182.   bhsportsguy
Actually to get to Greg Brock's point about attendance, sure 3 million is just about guaranteed but here's another thing, recently, KCAL or Channel 9, the station that shows the broadcast tv games for the Dodgers put up billboards all over So. Cal with the two superstars of the Lakers and Dodgers.

And who are they, Kobe and Nomar. Now they are not posing together but nice little shots of those two and something like best sports in LA written underneath.

And as those of us who have been to games since he has been a Dodger, no one gets more love from the crowd than Nomar.

I have no idea how that plays out in personnel decisions but it must mean something.

2007-05-22 15:45:26
183.   Brian Y
166. I can't even find reason to justify the JP signing when A) we have Raffy at leadoff and B) had options in CF with Ethier, Kemp, Werth, and Repko.

And yes, Soriano would have been a better option to watch in LF than Gonzo and we would have still have had speed.

SS Furcal
C Martin
LF Soriano
2B Kent
1B Loney
CF Kemp
RF Ethier
3B Betemit

Is it that much worse? If Loney didn't work out there was also cheap FA options that have performed pretty well such as Carlos Pena. But hindsight is always 20/20.

2007-05-22 15:45:45
184.   underdog
172 Yeah, I've been tapping my foot and pointing quietly at the sign for DT rule #6 on that one but no one's listening. ;-)

I really think people are reading too much of this. Abreu can help the club now. They will probably send him back down when they need an extra pitcher. When Kemp and/or Loney get The Call, they probably want it to be for the long term and not a temporary false alarm. I hope Abreu does well, while I do wonder a little bit about LaRoche now.

2007-05-22 15:45:48
185.   DodgerBakers
177 Or was that sarcastic?
2007-05-22 15:48:13
186.   Brian Y
176. Hence the whole justification of my point being that I would rather have paid $27M for Soriano than $18M/8years. I would rather have paid $27M for 4-5yrs. :)
2007-05-22 15:48:24
187.   ToyCannon
Even if we don't understand the move I still get excited when a kid comes up and plays his 1st game. Wish I was going tonight but I purposely stayed away from the Sheets game.
2007-05-22 15:48:45
188.   Jon Weisman
185 - No, for what it was worth, it was sincere.
2007-05-22 15:49:09
189.   underdog
177 How about Alyssa Milano in a Dodger Thoughts t-shirt?
2007-05-22 15:49:13
190.   Humma Kavula
I'll be there tonight. I will cheer for Tony Abreu.
2007-05-22 15:49:18
191.   bigcpa
It appears that Abreu hits slightly better from the left side (.762 ops vs .692 ops in 2006). So maybe he and LaRoche still platoon and Betemit stays on the pine. We'll know tomorrow night vs. Capuano.

Betemit is now at .200/.346/.450 vs. LHP with an 18% bb rate. IMO a Betemit/LaRoche platoon would be the 4th best bat on the field.

2007-05-22 15:49:49
192.   Greg Brock
Small sample size granted, but LaRoche's OPS is higher than:

Nomar
Pierre
Ethier
Furcal
Betemit

2007-05-22 15:49:55
193.   bhsportsguy
Hu and until today, Abreu, are among the players that would need to go on the 40 man at the end of the 2007 season to protect against the Rule V draft.
2007-05-22 15:50:39
194.   ally
186.okay gotcha, i still don't think soriano should be in arod territory but yeah that makes more sense than 138/8.
2007-05-22 15:51:35
195.   bhsportsguy
192 But that's because of the walks and good plate judgment is one thing but that can't be your only good thing.

Again, not saying that Andy deserves more than 40 odd plate appearances but I do think his stat line is misleading.

2007-05-22 15:52:15
196.   Brian Y
194. Yeah 8 yr contracts in general don't make me happy. The whole point of this was saying I'd rather take my chances with Loney, Kemp, and Soriano than Nomar, Gonzo, and Pierre. I don't think anyone in their right mind would say NO to that switch.
2007-05-22 15:52:23
197.   Fallout
185 DodgerBakers

Jon wouldn't think of breaking rule #7.
Maybe you need to tie your shirt at the bottom? (as pictured on the left)

2007-05-22 15:54:02
198.   DodgerBakers
189. Still no. The only attraction to me winning that contest would be to go to a Dodger game in presumably good seats.
2007-05-22 15:54:15
199.   Greg Brock
195 His only good thing is better than whatever Nomar, Pierre, and Betemit have to offer.

Furcal and Ethier, different story. And sample size matters. And OBP isn't the only thing. All points granted.

He's still been better than Nomar, Pierre and Betemit.

2007-05-22 15:54:26
200.   Xeifrank
The Brewers are the team that needs to call up their AAA minor league thirdbaseman. He's one of the best minor league mashers and they are weak at 3B. vr, Xei
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2007-05-22 15:55:36
201.   DodgerBakers
196. I see you're point, but I'd rather take my chances with "just" Loney and Kemp over Nomar, Gonzo and Pierre. I guess I'm just not that much of a Soriano fan.
2007-05-22 15:55:46
202.   Greg Brock
195 If his walks were singles and his batting average was .390, you wouldn't have any problems with him.

Again, not arguing. But numbers are numbers.

2007-05-22 15:56:09
203.   Kevin Lewis
177)

Should I be ashamed if I entered the contest just for the free seats? I could care less if I met her. Although, I can think of many other Dodger fans I would not want to sit near.

2007-05-22 15:57:41
204.   Bob Timmermann
203
See if I ever sit next to you now.
2007-05-22 15:57:57
205.   bhsportsguy
A different but perhaps equally controversial topic but this column sums up what I think MLB should do about PEDS and the Mitchell investigation a lot more elegantly than I could ever say.

http://tinyurl.com/2ag5an

2007-05-22 15:58:25
206.   Kevin Lewis
204)

I know (shaking my head in shame)

2007-05-22 15:58:34
207.   Brian Y
201. It was more of me just saying we could've had the prize FA bat available this winter and been spent the SAME as we did over the winter but we would have been better off than what we did spend that money on.
2007-05-22 15:58:38
208.   blue22
Geez, why all the angst against pretty girls who know their baseball?
2007-05-22 15:58:50
209.   Jon Weisman
203 - Go for it.

189 - That couldn't hurt.

2007-05-22 16:00:12
210.   bhsportsguy
202 Agreed, its kind of like the argument if Loney hit more homers and if he had sliced his doubles by a third and hit a few more homers, how that would change the mind of a lot critcs about his power.

See, we can meet at some middle ground.

But can you explain today's move without a magic 8 ball?

2007-05-22 16:00:19
211.   Brian Y
203. I will gladly get you the best seats possible for 10 games if I can sit next to her for 1 game. I would trade any of ya lol.

I mean do you know who that is? In my best Tony Danza voice..it's "SamanTA"

2007-05-22 16:01:50
212.   Fallout
117 Jon Weisman
I don't know how good Abreu's defense is but your reason sounds good to me. When you lead the league in errors and have a rose bush planted at second you might try to improve that.

On the other hand he could be showcased for a trade.

2007-05-22 16:02:06
213.   Greg Brock
But can you explain today's move without a magic 8 ball?

Ask again later :-)

2007-05-22 16:03:28
214.   bhsportsguy
I need some verification, this is a repeat of Izzy and Lugo from last year or am I just stressing out.
2007-05-22 16:04:28
215.   PDH5204
155 I don't "hate" Wolf, and I'm not saying that he has no value, but with Kuo and Bills, what was the point? Kuo and Bills come cheaper than Wolf and I have a hard [read "impossible"] time imagining that both of them would post a season ERA over 4.00 [Wolf is now at 3.9-something or other].

It seems to me that the team management has the mindset of, you two guys did good in an emergency last year but never mind how well you actually performed, it was just an emergency and so all bets are off and you get no credit for last year's service. And so I don't understand why it was Wolf over Bills and why Kuo was made to compete with Tomko and Hendy rather than both being given their jobs to lose.

2007-05-22 16:06:15
216.   El Lay Dave
There might be more interest in the contest if the meeting with Alyssa Milano was at the hotel room rather than the stadium.
2007-05-22 16:07:44
217.   DodgerBakers
208. It isn't against Ms. Milano, I don't hate her, I don't even know too much about her or read her blog. As for the pretty girl part, I believe my wife is the loveliest woman ever and she knows a good bit about baseball too. So I'd rather go with her to a game wearing my new DT shirt.
2007-05-22 16:08:43
219.   Reddog
Is there any chance at this point we could trade Juan Pierre? How about Pierre, and Tomko for Matt Holliday?
2007-05-22 16:09:11
220.   Jon Weisman
214 - Well, what do you mean exactly?
2007-05-22 16:09:33
221.   Jon Weisman
219 - No chance.
2007-05-22 16:10:33
222.   DodgerBakers
219,221.
But I wish!
2007-05-22 16:13:02
223.   Humma Kavula
222 Close your eyes and clap your hands and say, "I do believe in trading Juan Pierre! I do, I do!"
2007-05-22 16:13:51
224.   underdog
219 Now that has to be sarcastic or wishful thinking - I don't think the Rockies are that stupid. They're not going to trade Holliday for anyone, yet alone those two.

214 You're just stressing out.

2007-05-22 16:14:38
225.   bhsportsguy
220 Tony Abreu, he's good player, been solid at every level and if he had started the season at SS for Furcal or was on the team as the backup utility guy, I could understand that.

But on a team with 2 guys who have been playing 3B for a lot longer than he has and who have shown that they can hit the ball out of the park, something this team needs, to bring up Abreu and stick him at 3B just smacks of some sort of going backwards to playing Izzy instead of Aybar or Lugo instead of letting Betemit play everyday.

And Lugo and Izzy had veteran status while they actually had to add Tony to the 40-man roster.

That is what I mean by stressing out, I can't figure out the reasoning to this move.

2007-05-22 16:15:12
226.   Greg Brock
I'll bet that our centerfielder hits a home run before those stupid whales swim back into the Pacific Ocean.

Head toward the ocean, you stupid whales.

2007-05-22 16:15:39
227.   Hallux Valgus
219 The Rockies were the FIRST team to tire of Juan Pierre.
2007-05-22 16:17:49
228.   Humma Kavula
226 I will bet one Dodger Stadium beer that the whale crisis ends -- for better or for worse -- before Juan Pierre hits a home run.

Do we have a bet?

2007-05-22 16:18:11
229.   Jon Weisman
225 - Oh. Well, I certainly don't sense Betemit will play every day anytime soon. But whether Abreu will stick with the team beyond next week, I'm not sure.

Beyond that, I don't see what's so hard to understand about the move. They don't need 12 pitchers. So they call up someone. Abreu's got the high average, so they choose him. I'd choose Kemp, but life goes on.

2007-05-22 16:18:23
230.   bhsportsguy
227 Not too tired to go out and get both Steve Finley and Willy Tavares
2007-05-22 16:18:48
231.   underdog
226 Well at least those whales are now headed in the right direction...
http://tinyurl.com/2bgek3

Hopefully the Dodgers are, too. Otherwise we can resort to banging on pipes.

2007-05-22 16:23:08
232.   ally
if only we had recordings of other juan pierre's and could play them on first base
2007-05-22 16:23:58
233.   Humma Kavula
232 If only we had Juan Pierre on first base.
2007-05-22 16:24:20
234.   Greg Brock
228 No dice, Pal [/Charles Bronson]
2007-05-22 16:25:35
235.   DodgerBakers
Huh. Old friend Jayson Werth hit a homerun today for Philadelphia.
2007-05-22 16:27:02
236.   Jon Weisman
Yet another in-depth post at Screen Jam!
2007-05-22 16:33:03
237.   ally
233. well yeah that was kind of the point
2007-05-22 16:33:06
238.   ToyCannon
229
Maybe, but they started Abreu over the two guys who have a better chance then most on the team to either walk or hit a home run. I'm as confused as BHSportsguy. Other then the fact he once played SS and we know how Ned and Grady like their ex-shortstops the move makes zero sense with Betemit and La Roche already here.

This is why I'm convinced they will trade for a 3b. If they are going to call up Abreu and play him at 3b they are using 3b as the scapegoat for the teams offensive failures and since many 3b are available that is the direction they will end up taking. This feels like the Lugo panic trade or the Pierre panic signing.

If it results in Glaus being our 3b then I won't mind. If it ends with Wiggington being our 3b then I'll hold my breath until I pass out and wake up a Tampa Bay fan.

2007-05-22 16:34:04
239.   El Lay Dave
Grady is on the record that LaRoche might get some time in LF since he's not in a "platoon" at 3B. Perhaps he gets those starts in LF instead of Clark when LuGo gets rested.
2007-05-22 16:36:34
240.   El Lay Dave
then I'll hold my breath until I pass out and wake up a Tampa Bay fan

You may think you'll end up somewhere where Devil Ray fans abound, but you should hope to wake up an Angel fan.

(Of course, our heaven is ruled by the BDITS, but....)

2007-05-22 16:38:23
241.   bhsportsguy
238 Okay now for the real important question, for your Clips (I don't really deserve to call them my Clippers though I shared season tickets a few years ago), who should they pick in the lottery, ESPN is touting Acie Law.
2007-05-22 16:38:55
242.   Kevin Lewis
If Pierre hits one out tonight, I will celebrate by going to the AMPM pavilion tomorrow.
2007-05-22 16:42:07
243.   ToyCannon
240
I'm already an Angel fan so I needed to be more dramatic.
2007-05-22 16:47:46
244.   bigcpa
HR #2 from Werth. HR #1 for Jason Phillips. Someone check what Mike Edwards and Nakamura are doing today.
2007-05-22 16:47:52
245.   ToyCannon
241
How can we discuss this when we won't even know our draft position for another hour?
2007-05-22 16:48:31
246.   trainwreck
I am more excited for the Draft Lottery (and my team is not even in it) than the Western Conference Finals.
2007-05-22 16:49:10
247.   Humma Kavula
When Jason Phillips hit his home run, did he put both hands on his helmet and stare at it, gap-mouthed, like he couldn't believe it -- just like he did all those times he flied out?

Oh, I'm mean.

2007-05-22 16:50:15
248.   trainwreck
Very rarely do one of the top picking teams ever move up. I expect the Clippers to get the last lottery pick and if they do I think they should go with Nick Young to replace Cuttino Mobley. Livingston is way ahead of schedule and may be ready for training camp.
2007-05-22 16:50:50
249.   jasonungar07
http://www.laweekly.com/general/features/the-boras-factor/16440/?page=1

anyone see this??? this is a great read regardless if you agree, disagree etc..

In the eighth inning, newly acquired Dodgers center fielder Juan Pierre drops a deep fly to right center. A run scores, then another, putting the Giants up 5-3. "Well, well, well," says Boras, cackling and looking over at Stillwell, enjoying a moment of what might be considered payback. "J.D. Drew would've caught that ball," he says confidently, leaving no doubt that he has not forgotten the off-season controversy. "You just don't let Greg Maddux leave your building, and you sign J.D. Drew," he says.

2007-05-22 16:51:19
250.   underdog
238 I don't know, I mean, calling up someone from your AAA affiliate is different than trading for someone and all that entails. They did get draft picks for Lugo leaving, but had to give up something for him. The Izturis experiment meanwhile, was a sign of desperationm at third caused by Mueller's injury, and was shortlived. This current muck at third is caused at least in part by Betemit's inability to play/hit well enough to hold the job. I don't mind a little experimenting here rather than making a trade for a veteran third baseman.

I think LaRoche will play some LF (and who knows, maybe that's his destiny) and maybe one of these guys is getting showcased for a trade but for now I'm not reading a huge amount into it.

Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2007-05-22 16:51:24
251.   trainwreck
I should say teams with the best records in the lottery.
2007-05-22 16:51:46
252.   bhsportsguy
If Boston doesn't get one of the first two picks that could set them back for another 5 years.
2007-05-22 16:53:50
253.   Sammy Maudlin
I know this is absurd but how about trading Pierre , Tomko, and Preston Mattingly to the Yankees for Giambi.
2007-05-22 16:54:06
254.   trainwreck
252
I disagree. They need to get rid of Paul Pierce and if they did not get the quick fix they may be more willing to get rid of him. Getting Horford, Brewer, or Yi is hardly something to complain about.
2007-05-22 16:54:26
255.   Humma Kavula
Why would the Yankees do that deal?
2007-05-22 16:54:49
256.   trainwreck
253
You are right, that is absurd ; )
2007-05-22 16:57:27
257.   bigcpa
What makes you think the Yankees can't use a pinch runner? Someday Pierre could steal a big base like Roberts and be a hero.
2007-05-22 17:03:25
258.   William B Williams
Don't let 'em get you down, Sammy! You're still the best there is or ever was.
2007-05-22 17:05:55
259.   Humma Kavula
257 You know, I believe that will happen. Someday, Pierre will steal a big, famous base in a World Series game.

With my luck, it will be for the Yankees. He will be lauded for his supreme speed and basestealing abilities. The Dodgers will be called fools for getting rid of him.

And meanwhile, the Dodgers -- who will be the team that Pierre steals on -- will lose the game on that steal, by a final score of 14-13. Pierre will be awarded World Series MVP, despite going 3-20 with a SB and a CS.

2007-05-22 17:07:31
260.   ToyCannon
Bernie Williams has announced that he is not retired. This is the chance we've been waiting for. I'd like to see Ned sign Bernie to play RF so our outfield could be Bernie/JP/Gonzo and we could call them the "Popgun Trio". Run at your own peril.
2007-05-22 17:07:53
261.   bigcpa
259 There's only one absurd fantasy in that post. The part about us scoring 13 runs.
2007-05-22 17:08:49
262.   ToyCannon
Meanwhile I'm two days behind my project and all I care about is this stupid board.
2007-05-22 17:09:03
263.   Greg Brock
The nice thing about this draft lottery is that there are two legit #1 picks. Woe be the first or second worst team that slips to the third pick.

Noah, Horford, Wright et al. are very nice players, but Oden and Durant are amazing.

2007-05-22 17:10:54
264.   Greg Brock
Greg Oden looks older than Artis Gilmore.
2007-05-22 17:13:04
265.   Humma Kavula
260 Didn't Ken or somebody here on Toaster do a parody of Lewis Carroll -- "You are old, Bernie Williams?" I can't find it on the tubes...
2007-05-22 17:14:18
266.   ToyCannon
The only nice thing about it is if your a fan of someone who gets the one or two pick.
2007-05-22 17:16:23
267.   trainwreck
264
Honestly, he is the oldest looking teenager I have ever seen in my life.
2007-05-22 17:16:45
268.   Greg Brock
That's my point. If you're the worst team in the NBA (Celtics? Grizzlies? Not really sure), it's not the end of the world if you end up with the two pick.
2007-05-22 17:17:01
269.   natepurcell
put me in the "this move doesnt make sense to me" camp.

im trying to figure out but everything goes back to "prospect for veteran trade".

ugh.

2007-05-22 17:17:15
270.   Reddog
I think signing Pierre for 5 years is about the worst signing in our history. No arm, not even gap power, not even a good fielder, an average basestealer. A total drag on the team. For FIVE years.

Can't we just put Matt Kemp in center and use Pierre as a pinch runner?

Or package Pierre with some of our surplus pitching for someone, anyone with some power?

I can't believe we have to see Pierre out in centerfield for 5 years.

2007-05-22 17:18:06
271.   trainwreck
Already hearing rumors that Afflalo will not be drafted. Can't say I am surprised.
2007-05-22 17:19:06
272.   ToyCannon
Julian Taveras for the 1st time in his life is pitching an "interesting" game after more then 3 innings.
2007-05-22 17:19:10
273.   Humma Kavula
270 Worse than Kevin Brown? Worse than Dreifort?
2007-05-22 17:20:13
274.   trainwreck
At least Kevin Brown was good when we signed him. Dreifort does challenge Pierre though.
2007-05-22 17:21:32
275.   Greg Brock
Is anybody else taking the day off to watch the Champions League Final?

{Crickets}

Hello?

2007-05-22 17:22:31
276.   Humma Kavula
On the other hand, Dreifort barely played. Sure, he was a similar drag on the team's resources, but it's not like he was in there pitching below-average innings. All it cost was money.

Maybe Pierre -- precisely because he stays so healthy -- IS the worst signing in Dodgers history.

2007-05-22 17:22:41
277.   trainwreck
I am going to watch it, but I don't have to take the day off to do that.
2007-05-22 17:29:10
278.   das411
So Jayson Werth has more home runs tonight than Dodger 1B Nomar Garciaparra has all season.

Discuss.

(and btw thanks to everybody for the graduation congratulations. Samuel, did you survive the early morning ceremony?)

2007-05-22 17:29:56
279.   trainwreck
Congrats on graduation guys.

I did not even go to mine lol.

2007-05-22 17:30:33
280.   underdog
When is the Champ League final on? I definitely want to see or at least record for later...

I will buy this blog comments section a pitcher of beer if it can refrain for one night from referring to Juan Pierre. Betcha ya can't!

2007-05-22 17:31:29
281.   trainwreck
A pitcher of beer each? Please...
2007-05-22 17:33:56
282.   trainwreck
I believe the final is at 11:00am tomorrow.
2007-05-22 17:34:25
283.   trainwreck
11:45
2007-05-22 17:35:57
284.   Bob Timmermann
There will be a thread on the Griddle for the Champions League final tomorrow.
2007-05-22 17:35:57
285.   trainwreck
ESPN2 is showing it.
2007-05-22 17:36:48
286.   dzzrtRatt
249

J.D. Drew, 2007 = Jody Reed, 1994?

General Manager frustration over failure to sign [Drew/Reed], in part brought about by player greed, leads to disastrous [signing of Pierre/trading of Pedro for DeShields], a mistake with ramifications for years to come.

2007-05-22 17:37:32
287.   Greg Brock
284 You'll never blog alone...
2007-05-22 17:37:49
288.   s choir
280 Wow, that's risky.
2007-05-22 17:38:26
289.   Jon Weisman
218 was deleted for general inappropriateness.
2007-05-22 17:39:00
290.   underdog
288 No it isn't. :-)
2007-05-22 17:39:16
291.   Jon Weisman
286 - Well, signing Pierre is better than trading Pedro, so I think it falls apart a little there. Otherwise ...
2007-05-22 17:39:56
292.   underdog
282 Thanks. I'll set my Tivo tonight. And thus probably avoid the Griddle til later unless I play hooky from work.
2007-05-22 17:40:57
293.   StolenMonkey86
290 - now, will you send said pitcher to us, or at least our greater metro area, or do we have to come find you? That's where it could get riskier.
2007-05-22 17:43:09
294.   underdog
You'll have to find me in the bay area, or next time I'm in LA and can find you - or make a DT outing to Dodger Stadium. It's all moot of course.
2007-05-22 17:43:10
295.   Robert Daeley
270 276 Not even close.

http://www.dodgerblues.com/content/features_trades.html

2007-05-22 17:43:45
296.   underdog
Or I'll send Jon some Schrute bucks to buy y'all a pitcher. Again, I'll happily do it but don't think it's gonna matter.
2007-05-22 17:44:24
297.   Humma Kavula
289 I do hope that I didn't make comment 218.
2007-05-22 17:45:10
298.   Marty
OK, I'll bite. What is the Champions League?
2007-05-22 17:45:23
299.   Robert Daeley
278 Somebody needs to have a facial hair intervention with Jayson.

http://tinyurl.com/35b3cw

2007-05-22 17:47:12
300.   Greg Brock
299 Tournament of the best club teams in European footie.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champion%27s_League

Show/Hide Comments 301-350
2007-05-22 17:48:17
301.   Marty
The Angels are on a tear. They're up 6-1 on Detroit and have hit 4 home runs.
2007-05-22 17:48:46
302.   Marty
300 I should have known.
2007-05-22 17:51:19
303.   trainwreck
I think they give Atlanta first pick.
2007-05-22 17:51:33
304.   Who Is Karim Garcia
Memphis AND Boston out of the top 3.... Jerry West was NOT amused.
2007-05-22 17:52:03
305.   Greg Brock
Football in the groin for the Celtics. And the Grizzlies!
2007-05-22 17:52:25
306.   Who Is Karim Garcia
Portland is the big winner already... they have vaulted up so high already.
2007-05-22 17:52:58
307.   Greg Brock
Somebody take Bill Simmons shoelaces.

I smell 3000 word article which I will not read.

2007-05-22 17:53:05
308.   Jon Weisman
New post up top in 3 ... 2 ... 1 ...
2007-05-22 17:53:34
309.   Who Is Karim Garcia
Football in the groin? Jerry West looks like he took Randy Johnson slider in the groin.
2007-05-22 17:53:38
310.   xaphor
I'll be in front of the tube cheering on the scousers.

By the way Marty, did you hear that Frodo is going to play Iggy Pop: http://tinyurl.com/2pugwj

2007-05-22 17:53:44
311.   trainwreck
Aww that guy's look was priceless.
2007-05-22 17:54:09
312.   trainwreck
Well I was wrong.
2007-05-22 17:54:25
313.   trainwreck
Wow! Portland is going to be awesome.
2007-05-22 17:54:48
314.   Who Is Karim Garcia
PORTLAND.... PORTLAND!
2007-05-22 17:56:04
315.   trainwreck
Durant and Oden make the Western Conference that much stronger.
2007-05-22 17:56:14
316.   Ken Arneson
265 'Twasn't me. I've done a parody or two, but I usually regret it afterwards.
2007-05-22 17:57:32
317.   trainwreck
1. Blazers
2. Seattle
3. Hawks
4. Grizzlies
5. Celtics
2007-05-22 18:00:22
318.   trainwreck
Wait, I may have gotten Memphis wrong.
2007-05-22 18:01:33
319.   trainwreck
No, I was right. Jon Barry was wrong!
2007-05-22 18:05:23
320.   Greg Brock
Somewhere in Boston, there are 250,000 kids with their hats on backwards, getting hammered, screaming in completely incomprehensible English.
2007-05-22 18:10:55
321.   twerp
201. "It was more me just saying we could've had the prize FA bat available (Soriano) this winter and spent the SAME as we did over the winter but we would have been better off than what we did spend that money on."

If I'm not mistaken, good sources have said Ned went after Soriano (and some other FA power bats) but lost out. A couple FAs reportedly didn't want to play on the West Coast...Soriano may have been one.

When the power wouldn't sign and then Drew bolted, that led to Ned-panic and to where the team is now.

2007-05-22 19:23:31
322.   Fallout
321 twerp

His other CF option would have been to sign Roberts to platoon with Repco.

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