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About Jon
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1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
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Wrung Out To Dry
2007-07-23 10:38
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

Despite my not beginning it until 11 p.m. Sunday, this week's National League West report on SI.com's Fungoes ended up being a fairly beefy one, led by informing the world of the Dodgers' tattered pitching staff.

Injuries and ineffectiveness have pulverized the once-formidable Los Angeles Dodgers pitching staff to such an extent that three pitchers have started and relieved in the same week.

The Dodgers have been a pitching punching bag ever since July 4, when starters Hong-Chih Kuo and Randy Wolf met up with Jason Schmidt on the disabled list. Reliever Chin-hui Tsao compounded the problems by joining bullpenmate Yhency Brazoban on the DL on July 15 -- a day after Tsao gave up a grand slam that propelled the Dodgers into a 12-inning, 193-pitch endurance-fest in San Francisco and undermined any rest built up over the All-Star Break.

Perhaps most discouraging, All-Star closer Takashi Saito hasn't entered a game since Wednesday because of soreness, which Saito fears might be a revival of spinal cord issues that plagued him during his final three seasons in Japan, according to Dylan Hernandez of the Los Angeles Times. Saito is scheduled for an MRI today.

As a result, if you've ever been looking for a team that would be nifty enough to use its starters as relievers on the days they're scheduled to throw in between outings, the Dodgers have collapsed into that paradigm. ...

Reading on, you'll see a chart that shows that Dodger relievers have averaged 66.4 pitches per day since the All-Star break.

Also noteworthy, for those of you who like to look ahead, is this peek at the stretch-run schedule:

Jockeying for first place with the Dodgers for weeks now, the Padres have played two fewer games then their Los Angeles rivals. In the final three weeks of the season, the Dodgers are off on three consecutive Mondays -- Sept. 10, 17 and 24. San Diego also has Sept. 10 off, but then closes with games on 20 consecutive days -- including a four-game trip to end the season in Milwaukee, against a Brewer team currently trying to fight off the Chicago Cubs for the NL Central title. If Milwaukee has clinched by then, it could be a cakewalk for the Padres, but if the Brewers need the wins, the Padres could have a rough final hurdle for the playoffs.

The Dodgers finish their season against the team that loves to hate them, San Francisco Giants -- but in Los Angeles.

In addition, the piece offers a few more tidbits from around the division. Take a look.

Comments (165)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-07-23 10:51:07
1.   regfairfield
Responding to D4P's one Series win every 30 years is good.

But, one playoff win in 19 years is quite bad. Only three teams that have existed for that long have done worse, and the Dodgers are tied with Texas and Colorado in that level of futility.

2007-07-23 10:53:51
2.   ToyCannon
For those who are into the HP series this article by Rany of BP is classic
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=453

If you can't read it here is one blurb that Dodger fans and HP fans will surely enjoy.

"Odalis Perez = Peter Pettigrew
Pettigrew convinced everyone he was dead, then ingratiated himself into the Weasley household as an ordinary pet rat before his true colors as a Death Eater were exposed. Perez convinced everyone in LA his career was dead, then ingratiated himself into the Royals rotation as an ordinary veteran innings sponge. As his ERA approaches six, it is becoming harder and harder for him to escape detection as someone working for the Dark Lord."

2007-07-23 10:54:17
3.   El Lay Dave
The Dodgers' next three off-days are 7/30, 8/6 and 8/20. The schedule is not providing much relief either in the near future.
2007-07-23 10:54:58
4.   D4P
But, one playoff win in 19 years is quite bad

Agreed. The Dodgers's post-season performance since 1988 has been pathetic.

2007-07-23 10:56:18
5.   TellMeTheScoreRickMonday
"Reading on, you'll see a chart that shows that Dodger relievers have averaged 66.4 pitchers per day since the All-Star break."

I know that's a typo, but it sure does seem like we have used 66 pitchERs per game since the All-Star break.

2007-07-23 10:57:54
6.   Dodgers49
Dodgers notebook: Kemp presses for full-time job

>>> Matt Kemp's torrid second-half start could mean the 22-year-old becomes more of a mainstay in Manager Grady Little's lineup. <<<

### Little said he resisted the temptation of using Lowe longer Sunday because "we need him much more for six or seven innings on Wednesday." ###

http://www.dailybreeze.com/sports/articles/8655337.html

2007-07-23 11:00:31
7.   El Lay Dave
If Saito does end up DLed, having last pitched on the 18th, he misses the Houston (42-56) / Colorado (49-49) road trip and the Giants (41-55) series. If he has to rest the arm, that might not be the worst stretch of games for it.
2007-07-23 11:03:28
8.   regfairfield
If Saito goes on the DL, Meloan has to come up, right? What else could the team do? They wouldn't place Eric Hull into any high leverage situations, would they?
2007-07-23 11:03:47
9.   TheBigGrabowski
I'm finally back in front of a computer since Dodger Thoughts day, but I just wanted to say thanks to Jon and everyone that was there, I had a blast. BryanF and I actually went to high school together, so it was very odd walking up to the meeting point and seeing him there. Small world.

I am the one who asked about the statue, and I have to say when McCourt said he thought it should be of the fans, I started laughing until I realized he wasn't joking. I was a little embarrassed about that.

Overall a great time and the pictures look great!

2007-07-23 11:06:14
10.   Jon Weisman
5 - LOL. I'll fix, thanks.
2007-07-23 11:14:49
11.   blue22
8 - Betemit or Abreu for Dotel?
2007-07-23 11:16:57
12.   Who Is Karim Garcia
@ thebiggrabowski

dude, I heard you laughing at McCourt. I thought he was kidding to though, funny!

oh and thanks for getting me hooked on the dugout.... funny.

2007-07-23 11:20:36
13.   silverwidow
8-Yes, Meloan will almost certainly get the call. It's cool that he might make his debut in his hometown, too.

I just wish he hadn't given up a solo HR yesterday.

2007-07-23 11:21:38
14.   regfairfield
11 I'm trying to block out that possibility.
2007-07-23 11:23:00
15.   TheBigGrabowski
12 I couldn't help it. It just came out, and then I realized no one else was laughing. Awk-ward.

Oh the dugout is amazing, along with Dodger Thoughts, I check it everyday.

2007-07-23 11:25:45
16.   blue22
14 - I'd probably do Abreu for Dotel, possibly Hu for Dotel (how long is Saito out for?), but not Betemit for Dotel.

I'd be content to get Dotel, while keeping the future LaRoche-Hu-Betemit-Loney infield intact.

2007-07-23 11:30:03
17.   Curtis Lowe
If Betemit can play a good 2nd base I'd do an Abreu for Dotel + someone else.
2007-07-23 11:32:20
18.   blue22
17 - I bet KC would give you Angel Berroa, but only if you promised to give him a good home and walk him every day.
2007-07-23 11:33:52
19.   Curtis Lowe
Since Dotel would possibly leave via Free Agency after this season what type of draft pick compensation does he look like?
2007-07-23 11:38:04
20.   bryanf
12,15 Yeah, statues of the fans is a terrible idea.

It turns out I've seen the dugout before (http://tinyurl.com/3y4xc6) but now I will check it every day. :)

2007-07-23 11:42:06
21.   Robert Daeley
If there is to be a statue of a fan, I'd nominate Alyssa Milano. ;)

Statues must be approached with caution. Done wrongly, they can curse entire franchises:

http://blogging.la/archives/2004/03/wayne_gretzky_must_die.phtml

2007-07-23 11:43:12
22.   silverwidow
Kemp-for-Ian Snell rumors have begun to surface.

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6485

2007-07-23 11:47:05
23.   bryanf
What we don't need to do: trade anybody for Octavio Dotel. If ever there were somebody who is not the answer to the Dodgers' problems, it would seem to be Dotel (or maybe Roberto Hernandez?). We have answers within the organization and we need to call up Meloan now to make sure that we don't need to make a move. However, if we are going to make a move, I'd rather get a mediocre starter/"innings eater" than a reliever. See previous comment about most relievers being inconsistent and unreliable".
2007-07-23 11:47:30
24.   Bob Timmermann
22
Ian Snell? He's from Delaware.

Delino Deshields was from Delware.

2007-07-23 11:47:49
25.   ToyCannon
I would trade Ethier for Snell. I'm a big fan. Pittsburgh could use a few things we have. If they are willing to deal Snell I think we could match up.
2007-07-23 11:48:08
26.   underdog
21 So, there's a sort of limitation of statues? {duck}

19 That's a really good question - was just wondering that myself. If the Dodgers could also get a high draft pick out of it, I could see added benefit. Otherwise, the prospect of having nothing to show for a trade doesn't appeal to me. I know Dotel doesn't appeal to A's or Yankees fans, either, but he's been good otherwise, especially if he's not asked to be a closer.

2007-07-23 11:48:20
27.   dodgers82
I am a faithful Dodger fan, not really into technicalities and terms of baseball, I love the sport and even more the team, after seeing Loney drop that ball off his glove, I ask, can Dodger management please make it a requirement for all outfielders to wear sunglasses during day games? I'm in the Marine Corps, outfielders without shades is like our commanders sending us on a night mission without NVG's (night vision goggles).
2007-07-23 11:49:04
28.   Jon Weisman
We really need to get Meloan and/or Hull up as soon as possible to get their feet wet, and see what they can do over the course of a few games - as opposed to a one-game trial - before we do anything rash at the deadline. It's imperative.
2007-07-23 11:49:54
29.   underdog
(But I agree with Bryan above, I'd rather the Dodgers just give guys like Hull and Meloan a chance - they're cheap, they're ours, and they wouldn't cost us anybody in a trade.)

I like Ian Snell, too. I don't like the idea of trading Ethier though, because after this year who else do we have to man the outfield besides Kemp and Pierre? I guess they could resign Gonzo for one more year but... I'd rather have Ethier. Can't we trade them like Hu or Abreu and some scrappy veteran instead?

2007-07-23 11:51:01
30.   bhsportsguy
BHSportsguy (Los Angeles): Hi Kevin: Are you hearing anything about Kyle Blair, have not heard anything since the draft, second question, has Hu emerged as the biggest surprise this year for the Dodger's farm system?

Kevin Goldstein: Hu has been a big surprise, but I might call James McDonald the biggest surprise. Totally off the radar going into the year, but great numbers and equeally impressive scouting report. Blair is going to need somewhere around a million dollars to sign, and with the down signing bonuses this year, will the Dodgers try to go for it?

My followup would be, if teams knew that Blair wanted 1st round money to sign, why wouldn't they pick him there.

Logan White did it once with LaRoche, a million would be a lot over slot but given that you can never have enough pithcers, if they can sign him, would you pay it?

2007-07-23 11:52:55
31.   blue22
28 - If Saito is out for any significant length, I think that makes LA a lot more desperate for Dotel. LA could add Meloan to go along with Seanez, Broxton, and Saito. But if Saito is going to have to sit out for a few weeks, you may have to go outside the organization.

But you're right, first things first, get Meloan up here right now!

2007-07-23 11:53:37
32.   ToyCannon
Relief pitchers with lousy peripherals are inconsistent and unreliable. Relief pitchers with solid peripherals aren't nearly so shakey. The idea is the same, get someone with a solid skill set not someone skating by because of lucky strand rates.
2007-07-23 11:57:48
33.   Ken Arneson
26 FWIW, I liked Dotel when he was in Oakland. His struggles were mostly just before he needed to go under the knife.
2007-07-23 11:58:40
34.   D4P
32
I've been trying to figure out whether Dotel's peripherals are good or bad.

The good/decent:

11.14 K/9
2.60 BB/K
1.42 G/F
1 HR/10.5 innings

The not so good:

1.48 WHIP

2007-07-23 12:02:01
35.   bryanf
OT, but if you haven't read it, it's a good read: http://tinyurl.com/3ymjdx (linked to from FJM)
2007-07-23 12:04:46
36.   regfairfield
27 Rick Monday, is that you?

22 Wow, that's actually a somewhat reasonable rumor. Don't know if I'd do it given the lack of power in the organization, but it seems like a pretty reasonable offer.

2007-07-23 12:06:01
37.   bryanf
32 Add in injury history though, and I'd rather not see Dotel in [Dodger] blue. I always liked him, but I just don't think it's a good trade for us right now.
2007-07-23 12:18:41
38.   ToyCannon
34
They are good. The WHIP is inflated because of the high h% which is at 36% for 2007. He should be around 30% but he's not someone I'm interested in unless the price is cheaper then what's been bandied about. If it is D Young then I might consider the deal only because of the questions about Saito. He will do a fine job but I think Meloan can do the same thing, I'm just not sure I'd base my season on it so I can understand Ned looking for help given Saito's current health.
If Ned had confidence in Meloan he'd already be here so maybe with Saito's problems he will be forced to give him a shot and hopefully he'll prove that he is the guy and Ned can turn off his phone with the Royals unless Grienke's name comes up.
2007-07-23 12:26:00
39.   blue22
38 - I'm guessing from your post you'd rather trade D Young than Abreu?
2007-07-23 12:38:03
40.   natepurcell
I can't believe the Pirates are making Ian Snell available.
2007-07-23 12:40:27
41.   El Lay Dave
According to Cot's Baseball Contracts:
Ian Snell p
1 year/$0.408M (2007)
re-signed 3/07
1 year/$0.33M (2006), re-signed 3/06
drafted 2000 (26- )
ML service: 1.088

Snell is 25 years old and has improved every year. If I understand that service time part correctly, I think he won't even be arbitration-eligible this off season. I can't imagine the small-market Pirates trading this guy except for a very high price (talent and contract control), which I think Kemp is.

I like Snell, but only if Ned can swindle Dave Littlefield - not outside the realm of possibility I suppose.

2007-07-23 12:41:12
42.   Vishal
i would LOVE to have greinke. i saw him pitch in oakland once. he has a 95MPH fastball and a 65MPH curveball. he made some hitters look absolutely silly. incredible talent.
2007-07-23 12:43:38
43.   Robert Daeley
26 "So, there's a sort of limitation of statues?"

I doff my cap to you, sir. Well played!

2007-07-23 12:47:00
44.   TellMeTheScoreRickMonday
27 That was Kemp who dropped the ball to let in the tying run, not Loney
2007-07-23 12:51:58
45.   natepurcell
I wish wasn't so attached to our young players because Ian Snell is legit and would be awesome.
2007-07-23 12:53:41
46.   Bob Timmermann
45
http://www.delawarebaseball.com/
2007-07-23 12:54:13
47.   Suffering Bruin
Did you know that Scott Boras has his own set of coaches to train his clients? And this the teams that employ his clients don't like this?

I didn't know this. http://tinyurl.com/2crc8t

2007-07-23 12:55:19
48.   regfairfield
45 Plaschke would probably run him out of town, sadly. Between his "Snell doesn't do that" attitude towards the media and his recent death threat incident, he'd get eaten alive in LA.
2007-07-23 12:55:28
49.   Jon Weisman
45 - I can't trade Kemp for Snell. With Kemp's power and ability at age 22, I'm sorry, but that is just too rare for the Dodgers to give up. We have to find a different way to improve our starting pitching.

I feel like trading Kemp for Snell would be like trading a 22-year-old Vladimir Guerrero for someone who isn't Pedro Martinez ... know what I mean?

2007-07-23 12:56:32
50.   Jon Weisman
45 - You, of all people, posting this link? I suppose you think this is something out of the Universal Baseball Association.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-07-23 13:03:05
51.   screwballin
49 I feel the same way. This could be a rare talent we're glimpsing, so I just cringe every time I see his name associated with a trade.

Not even Loney gives me the same response, although seeing his swing every day makes you realize why he's so highly regarded.

2007-07-23 13:09:20
52.   Suffering Bruin
I cannot imagine Loney or Kemp being involved in any trade talks unless we get somebody very good in return who will be with us for a very long time. Yeah, I know, Josh already said as much but I like the answer so much I'm adopting it as my own.

What, you think I read this site for original ideas? I count on Jon, Bob, Greg, Icaros, Vishal... etc. to grant me the wisdom that impresses other friends and colleagues. I thought that was what the web was for.

2007-07-23 13:13:14
53.   Jacob L
Following the Dodgers is a funny thing. A year ago this time, we were all (or at least most of us) urging Neddy to throw in the towel at the trading deadline, with the team a good chunk of games out of playoff position. This year, the team is in the driver's seat, but doesn't look like they can close the deal as presently constituted. That is to say, without a miraculous recovery for at least three of Wolf, Kuo, Tsao, and Saito, I don't think this group will make the playoffs.

Now, having been chastened by last year's experience, I'm not going to say that Ned should chuck this hand, and work for the future. Even if last year had never happened, you've got to double down on a team in first place, don't you? I mean 1 or 2 decent, as opposed to world beating, pitchers ought to be enough.

The only thing the same, from last year to this, is that if the price for winning now is any of our top youngsters (and who's on that list is open to debate), I'm ready with the torches and pitchforks.

2007-07-23 13:14:06
54.   blue22
49 - Yeah that has a real Delino4Pedro feel to it. Kemp as the awesome prospect, but perhaps with a "fatal flaw" (Kemp's shaky OF play or plate discipline; Pedro's physical stature) that makes management doubt the breathtaking talent. Snell is the more established yet still young player that you can almost convince yourself will help your team more than the player going out the door.

So who is Jody Reed in this scenario?

2007-07-23 13:15:21
55.   Greg Brock
I finally saw the Sheffield interview for RealSports.

Holy cow!

2007-07-23 13:17:41
56.   Jon Weisman
53 - Not that I need to explain this to you, but this is about when I break out my annual speech about "you're always trying to improve yourself, no matter what." Throwing in the towel had an unnecessary negative connotation. People need to understand that recognizing what your franchise building blocks are is not throwing in the towel.
2007-07-23 13:18:20
57.   Eric Stephen
55 The Sheffield / Andrea Kraemer back-and-forth about whether or not Sheffield took steroids almost made my head explode.
2007-07-23 13:19:01
58.   goofus
Jim tracey would love to get Olmedo, and he'd probably swoon to get Nomar who could probably hit cleanup for him. There's our offer.
2007-07-23 13:19:53
59.   Eric Stephen
54 Eric Gagne is Jody Reed, although the parallels kind of break down when you realize he took more money in Texas, plus he got the closer title.
2007-07-23 13:21:56
60.   still bevens
54 I think everyone is forgetting all the great diving/sliding catches Kemp has made in the past three weeks and only remembering his recent gaffes. The gaffes are mental issues and the great plays are all sheer athleticism. One is here to stay, the other cant be permanent. At least I hope not.
2007-07-23 13:23:56
61.   weatherman
47 - Not unbelievable, but quite remarkable. If the Dodgers never sign another Boras player, I would not complain. On the one hand it makes sense that an agent, with quite a bit invested in his stable, would want to ensure that his players were performing at the highest level. On the other hand, each team ought to be able to establish a specific team culture. What this does is create a team that exists outside of the context of what we all understand as Major League Baseball. Team Boras simply leases out its players to the different teams, dictating pitch counts and batting styles. Where does this end? I envision contracts wherein managers are told that such-and-such a player must bat either 4th or 5th in the lineup or throw only these three types of pitches. Unsettling.
2007-07-23 13:24:27
62.   regfairfield
54 The difference is that Delino was a player with several obvious flaws that would have been revealed if we had the data we have now 14 years ago.

Snell is a much better player than Delino ever was.

2007-07-23 13:24:36
63.   underdog
MLB.com has more on trade winds blowing:
http://tinyurl.com/2afcjx

Never mind what it says about the Dodgers, which isn't anything new to anyone here, but the part about the Giants had me scratching my head a bit:
"The San Francisco Chronicle reports that the Giants could be interested in the White Sox' Mark Buehrle, who recently signed to a four-year extension. The Chronicle also mentioned Buehrle's teammate Jose Contreras, the Royals' Odalis Perez and Florida's Dontrelle Willis, assuming the Marlins decide to make Willis available. As far as hitte[r]s, Mark Teixeira's name continues to surface and he could be enough enticement for the Giants to give up left-hander Noah Lowry."

Huh. Are the Giants under some weird impression that they are still a contender this year? Shouldn't they be selling veterans, not acquiring them? Seems odd.

2007-07-23 13:25:04
64.   Daniel Zappala
47 Amazing. Wow. Would anyone deal with a young player represented by Boras after reading this?
2007-07-23 13:25:25
65.   Jacob L
56 Let me put it this way, I did not, under last year's circumstances, like the idea of renting Greg Maddux, setting aside what we gave up. I was wrong about that.
2007-07-23 13:27:39
66.   blue22
60 - I can't say I've been impressed with Matt Kemp's OF play. He takes circuitous routes to balls, and has that one-handed grab. He obviously has tremendous speed and athleticism, but he gets bad jumps. And I've felt this way about him long before he dropped that ball yesterday, and I also don't feel that he shouldn't be allowed to play centerfield. But, the fact is, at this point in his career, he's a pretty poor outfielder. I just hope management doesn't make any knee-jerk decisions based on that. Focus on what he can do, not what he can't.
2007-07-23 13:28:06
67.   Suffering Bruin
Three pitchers that Baseball Analysts (as of 7/18) say could make sense for the Dodgers (salaries in parentheses):

Roy Oswalt ($13 mil.)

Jose Contreras ($9 million)

Dontrelle Willis ($6.45 million)

Who do you give up? Do you give up anybody?

2007-07-23 13:28:22
68.   Jacob L
63 If I wanted to give Sabean the benefit of the doubt, I'd say he's bidding up the cost for players that his NL West competition actually needs. Not unlike is genius move is saddling us with 5 years of Juan Pierre. But yeah, otherwise I'd say those moves are implausible.
2007-07-23 13:32:41
69.   still bevens
I would imagine we would have to give Texas their native sons back and then some. Meloan, Loney, Billingsley/Kershaw and maybe even someone else for Oswalt. There's no way they part with him unless they get a deal like that.
2007-07-23 13:36:07
70.   regfairfield
67 Why would the Astros trade Oswalt after signing him to a way below market extension? If he actually was available, I'd probably move anyone but Kemp or Bills.

I wouldn't give up anything of value for Contreras or the Train.

2007-07-23 13:37:11
71.   trainwreck
If we could get Ian Snell for Andre Ethier, I would have learn how to do cartwheels.
2007-07-23 13:39:35
72.   Xeifrank
34. Dotel has an extremely high BABIP rate.
vr, Xei
2007-07-23 13:39:58
73.   underdog
69 Sounds about right - especially if you're a certain Dallas newspaper sports columnist. ;-) Oswalt won't be going anywhere.
2007-07-23 13:42:02
74.   blue22
I'd prefer taking a chance on Scott Olsen, but I don't think LA has the right pieces for a deal with the Marlins.
2007-07-23 13:42:04
75.   El Lay Dave
67 Jose Contreras is in decline for a reason; he's 35 - at least. Also his contract runs through '09. No, thank you.

Roy Oswalt: see 69 and 70. 'nuff said.

Dontrelle Willis: just how thorough is a pre-trade physical?

2007-07-23 13:42:20
76.   JoeyP
I'd approve a Kemp for Snell deal.

#1. Dodgers arent going to let Kemp play CF apparently---so his value as a corner OF'er is much lower.

#2. Snell's a young ace, no arm problems--. Snell's essentially IS, what we all hope Billingsley becomes.

Value wise--I think the Dodgers come out ahead in a Snell for Kemp deal. The team can find corner OF offense relatively easily in free agency. Young ace pitching---not so much.

2007-07-23 13:42:56
77.   still bevens
69 Hah maybe I've been thoroughly brainwashed by that guy that I forgot the Astros have a 1B in Berkman. Switch Loney out with LaRoche.
2007-07-23 13:43:48
78.   silverwidow
ROSTER MOVE:

Stults down, Hull up

http://www.beloblog.com/Pe_Blogs/baseball/dodgers/

2007-07-23 13:44:18
79.   Robert Daeley
"Jul. 21 : Snell likely will be fined by Major League Baseball for comments he made after Thursday's game toward a Colorado batter that he thought was stealing signs, reports the Pittsburgh Tribune Review."

Hey, he already fits in!

2007-07-23 13:44:23
80.   natepurcell
77

laroche went to CC in Texas so he's sort of a Native Son.

2007-07-23 13:49:32
81.   Curtis Lowe
78 -

"Good job out there kid, go tell you're minor league buddies all about it."

2007-07-23 13:50:31
82.   JoeyP
78--Interesting, since Stults cant pitch for a few days they option him--meaning they cant bring him back for at least 10 days.

Just bring MeLoan up and be done with it.

2007-07-23 13:51:51
83.   screwballin
66 I can't say I've been impressed with Matt Kemp's OF play. He takes circuitous routes to balls, and has that one-handed grab.

Is catching flies with one hand really that unusual? I'm probably wrong as always, but it seems to me it's the 2-handed catch that's rare.

I agree, though, that his routes need improvement. I think experience will go a long way on that.

2007-07-23 13:52:49
84.   Suffering Bruin
83 I always thought catching the ball with two hands was a bad idea.
2007-07-23 13:53:35
85.   Jack Dawkins
2 Fun read, thanks for the tip. In the unlikelihood that the D's wind up with Dotel, he shall henceforth be known as Cedric in my mind.

I'm probably the last person who was a DT Day to post this, but heartfelt thanks to Jon and BHSportsguy for organizing an outstanding event. Can we put in our requests for next year's session of "Meet the High-Profile Dodger Personality while the motion detector keeps going off?"

2007-07-23 13:54:55
86.   screwballin
84 I know I've heard outfielders say the same thing, and I've seen at least a few drops on 2-handed catch attempts.
2007-07-23 13:54:56
87.   Sammy Maudlin
Greg Miller is listed as tonight's starter in Jacksonville. Happy Birthday Nomar!!
2007-07-23 13:55:41
88.   ToyCannon
Vinny blames it all on Rico Carty. Not that I have the experience Vinny has but seems to me I've seen plenty of old clips where the outfielders caught the ball with one hand.
2007-07-23 13:56:17
89.   Vishal
[52] i'm flattered to be included in such esteemed company.

i think unless we get an oswalt or something out of it, we should hold tight to our key building blocks.

2007-07-23 13:56:40
90.   underdog
Short of Meloan, I think bringing up Hull is the next best move they could make (or, possibly the best move at this moment). Hull's been very consistent at Vegas all year, numbers are particularly impressive given the PCL, and he deserves a chance. Next move should be to DFA Hernandez for Meloan, but we'll cross one bridge at a time.

74 Olsen could certainly be had fairly cheaply right now. They'd just have to give him a - no, not a physical - a mental before they brought him in. ;-)

2007-07-23 13:57:32
91.   ToyCannon
Welcome back Mr. Hull.
2007-07-23 14:00:37
92.   rockmrete
Kemp may not turn out to be a glod glove outfielder, but considering his age and relative lack of experience he should be given some slack for the OJT or be sent to the minors for it. I vote to play him here.
2007-07-23 14:02:33
93.   screwballin
53 That is to say, without a miraculous recovery for at least three of Wolf, Kuo, Tsao, and Saito, I don't think this group will make the playoffs.

I'm honestly just not convinced that San Diego will keep the pace. They have already seen corrections on the early successes of Gonzalez, Meredith and little Giles, among others. And can Young really continue to be THIS good?

2007-07-23 14:04:04
94.   ToyCannon
Hmmm, if my choices are a speedy popgun who takes bad routes or a speedy howizter who takes bad routes I think I might prefer the howizter even before the offense is even discussed but then I'm particular that way.
2007-07-23 14:05:57
95.   Robert Daeley
87 Happy Birthday Pee Wee Reece and Don Drysdale too. :)
2007-07-23 14:08:43
96.   Vishal
i say give kemp some sunglasses and extra coaching/practice time, and throw him in center field. he'll be fine.
2007-07-23 14:09:17
97.   GobiasIndustries
I'm on board with the let's try and acquire Scott Olsen train. He's low risk/high reward and we wouldn't have to give up anyone of future importance, I wouldn't think. This would be just like the Padres picking up Milton Bradley. So far so good with them.....but then again I heard he only really talks to Mike Cameron and no one else.
2007-07-23 14:10:31
98.   jasonungar07
I would never trade Matt Kemp for an arm. Any arm.
2007-07-23 14:14:15
99.   GobiasIndustries
98
Word. Especially not Ian Snell. That's no knock on Snell because he is a good pitcher but I wouldn't make that trade ever.
2007-07-23 14:16:29
100.   Disabled List
I have a hard time believing Snell really is available, but yeah, Kemp really is just too special of a player to trade for a pitcher.

I wonder if the Pirates would go for Betemit and Ethier for Snell. At least we'd be trading from positions of strength.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2007-07-23 14:17:41
101.   Robert Daeley
95 Add Hong-Chih Kuo to the 7/23 birthday list.
2007-07-23 14:19:09
102.   silverwidow
98-I'd trade Kemp for Verlander in an instant.
2007-07-23 14:22:43
103.   jasonungar07
I cant judge what I don't know, I leave that up to you guys who do know....but for me:

un-touchable:

Kemp
Martin
Bills
Broxton

Touchable but wouldnt trade them:
Loney
Ethier
Abreu

2007-07-23 14:25:35
104.   jasonungar07
102 Good for you. Don't try to talk me into it cause it wont happen , LOL. I wouldnt trade Kemp for Santana. Call me dumb, call me nieve, whatever, its my story and I am sticking to it.

Why?

1. injury issues
2. plays one day vs five days.

2007-07-23 14:26:18
105.   bryanf
Interesting that in order to call up Hull they would send Stults down instead of putting Saito on the DL. Maybe that's a good sign for Saito? Or maybe they just had to make a decision in a hurry? It seems like playing with 24 guys instead of 25 isn't the smartest thing if Saito is really down.
2007-07-23 14:33:14
106.   JoeyP
True--They could have DL'ed Saito retro-actively and kept Stults up. Maybe this is a sign the MRI went ok?
2007-07-23 14:34:21
107.   Daniel Zappala
Or it's a sign that they read DT, respect Jon's opinion, and will bring up Meloan when Saito hits the DL.
2007-07-23 14:34:34
108.   Michael D
Can Stultz bypass the 10 day option rule if brought up for an injury? It seems baffling to me that we'd send down a guy that just gave us a few quality innings when that's what we need most, unless we are planning to DL Saito and bring him right back up. Although that would mean no Meloan for the time being.
2007-07-23 14:34:39
109.   Robert Daeley
For sake of completion:

* Hod Ford, 1897 (Brooklyn 1925)
* Paul Chervinko, 1910 (Brooklyn 1937-1938)
* Pee Wee Reese, 1923 (Brooklyn 1940-1957, LA 1958)
* Don Drysdale, 1936 (Brooklyn 1956-1957, LA 1958-1969)
* Nomar Garciaparra, 1973 (LA 2006-)
* Larry Barnes, 1974 (LA 2003)
* Hong-Chih Kuo, 1981 (LA 2005-)

Linked version here:

http://www.trolleydodger.com/2007/07/23/dodger-birthday-day/

2007-07-23 14:36:30
110.   DodgerBakers
87. 95. And happy birthday to me!
2007-07-23 14:38:36
111.   ToyCannon
I'm sorry if I missed this discussion before but I don't recall seeing it.

From the BP quotes section:
"If I'm on a team with a guy, that's something I'll do for him. I've always been that way."
--Marlon Anderson, on letting Brad Penny know he was tipping his breaking ball to the entire league.(Tim Brown, YahooSports!)

I know Brad said someone had told him about the fact he was tipping his pitches but I didn't know it was Marlon. So he was the gift that kept on giving.

2007-07-23 14:40:11
112.   Vishal
[104] i'd like to see data on injury rates for position players vs. pitchers.
2007-07-23 14:40:23
113.   blue22
108 - That could be it. Perhaps they aren't ready to DL Saito just yet, but really needed another arm. They'll be able to recall Stults for his next turn in the rotation if Saito does eventually hit the DL.

But, if Saito isn't DL'd, would Houlton make the next start in Stults' place?

I can't even keep track of who is in the rotation right now. Is Tomko? Hendrickson?

2007-07-23 14:41:34
114.   Disabled List
111 I wonder how Marlon's new teammates on the Mets felt about that after he beat them on Saturday.
2007-07-23 14:43:36
115.   still bevens
113 I think its Tomko and Hendrickson. Stults pitched yesterday because Hendrickson pitched in relief earlier in the week and we all know how starting him on short rest can pan out. Either decent, or shockingly awful. Grady decided not to roll the dice again.
2007-07-23 14:48:46
116.   ToyCannon
114
I wonder how they will feel about it when Brad beats them twice in the playoffs.
2007-07-23 14:56:24
117.   Jonny6
Sad story.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19908311/

Vin's crusade for basecoaches to where helmets just picked up some tragic but compelling evidence.

2007-07-23 14:59:45
118.   Michael D
117

Wow he always said one of these days it was going to happen before somebody did something about it. I wonder if they will start that now.

2007-07-23 15:00:30
119.   blue22
117 - Check out the Griddle.
2007-07-23 15:01:52
120.   underdog
117 Y'all need to read the Griddle more often.
http://griddle.baseballtoaster.com/archives/737425.html

Definitely time for base coaches to wear helmets, there's never been enough reason for them not to, imho.

2007-07-23 15:04:15
121.   bryanf
I agree that basecoaches should wear helmets, as Vin has always said...

but then why not pitchers and other infielders?

2007-07-23 15:07:00
122.   The Mootz
It'd be nice if Chad could give us at least six innings tonight and keep his perfect record in tact.

In other news, The Price is Right host search is over. Looks like Carrot Top needs to keep looking for work.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070723/ap_en_tv/tv_price_carey;_ylt=AoqUgKZIODV1EYPlHWlrDIwE1vAI

2007-07-23 15:07:23
123.   blue22
121 - They do wear gloves out there. The pitchers are a bit exposed, but I think it would be too difficult to pitch with a helmet on.
2007-07-23 15:07:26
124.   trainwreck
121
They have mits.
2007-07-23 15:08:23
125.   Robert Daeley
121 Probably because the coaches are often paying attention to other things besides the ball.
2007-07-23 15:08:44
126.   trainwreck
122
Odd choice. Drew will just laugh all the time.
2007-07-23 15:12:06
127.   Bob Timmermann
125
Coaches also are older and presumably not as able to get out of the way as well as younger players.
2007-07-23 15:12:59
128.   bryanf
123 The gloves are for catching the ball right? Yes, I'm a moron. I guess it would probably be hard to play the field with a helmet on...
2007-07-23 15:16:33
129.   goofus
128 No more so than running the bases with helmet on. It's doable and makes a lot of sense.
2007-07-23 15:18:09
130.   goofus
128 No more so than running the bases in a helmet. It's doable and makes a lot of sense.
2007-07-23 15:18:23
131.   Robert Daeley
127 That reminds me of when the Yankees got Don Zimmer the army helmet with the NY logo on it to wear in the dugout after he got beaned by a foul ball. Of course he was sitting on the bench at the time. :)
2007-07-23 15:19:08
132.   Vishal
[122] the best work carrot top has ever done is the commentary track on the rules of attraction dvd.
2007-07-23 15:22:58
133.   El Lay Dave
126 J.D. or Stephen?
2007-07-23 15:24:54
134.   Dodgers49
Here's the lineup: (per ItD)

Furcal, SS
Pierre, CF
Martin, C
Kent, 2B (has reached base in 33 straight games, the longest streak in MLB in 2007)
Gonzo, LF
Nomar, 3B (birthday boy, along with Kuo, Stan Johnston and the late Pee Wee Reese and Don Drysdale)
Loney, 1B
Ethier, RF
Billingsley, P

2007-07-23 15:26:51
135.   Dodger Jack
I consider Loney, Kemp, Bills, Broxton, and Hu untouchable. Not so Ethier or Abreu.
2007-07-23 15:32:25
136.   The Mootz
136. If Abreu gets traded, who's our second baseman when the best mustache in baseball calls it a career?
2007-07-23 15:33:20
137.   The Mootz
135. If Abreu gets traded, who's our second baseman when the best mustache in baseball calls it a career?
2007-07-23 15:38:21
138.   Dodgers49
I'm surprised to see Olsen's name mentioned on Dodger Thoughts as a possible Dodger pickup since Ned says he places a high value on "character."

>>> The Florida Marlins are willing to deal pitcher Scott Olsen after the left-hander's latest off-field incident. The 23-year-old was arrested early Saturday morning and charged with driving under the influence, resisting an officer with violence, fleeing and eluding police officers, according to a Miami-Dade County corrections report.

Last Monday the Marlins suspended Olsen for two games for insubordination and conduct detrimental to the team. Olsen was involved in a skirmish with teammate Sergio Mitre in the tunnel area outside the Marlins clubhouse last Sunday. He was suspended without pay.

A year ago, Olsen was involved in a fight with then-teammate Randy Messenger, and he was grabbed in the dugout by former manager Joe Girardi. He also had a pushing match with Miguel Cabrera in the dugout at New York's Shea Stadium. Earlier this season, Olsen was disciplined by the team for making a gesture to a fan in Milwaukee. <<<

http://tinyurl.com/2afcjx

2007-07-23 15:40:13
139.   blue22
136/7 - Betemit?
2007-07-23 15:43:14
140.   trainwreck
The closest to untouchables for me are Bills, Loney, Kemp, LaRoche, and Kershaw.
2007-07-23 15:43:48
141.   bigcpa
136 Our Dustin Pedroia clone Travis Denker will be 23 in 2009 Spring Training. He's playing purdy well in A ball: .305/.382/.452 29 XBH.
2007-07-23 15:46:34
142.   trainwreck
The closest to untouchables for me are Bills, Loney, Kemp, LaRoche, and Kershaw.
2007-07-23 15:49:52
143.   Dodger Jack
135/7: Sure, Betemit could take over for Kent. That assumes that LaRoche is a fit at third (he is in the midst of a hitting surge at Las Vegas). Our real second baseman of the future is not Abreu, but Hu. I hope that LaRoche is putting himself into the untouchable category but I can't (yet) class him with Loney, Kemp, Bills, Broxton, and Kershaw (whom I neglected to incude in my prior post).
2007-07-23 15:50:27
144.   bigcpa
Lots lots of of double double posts posts today today.
2007-07-23 15:50:42
145.   GobiasIndustries
Just got word from a friend of mine that Big game James Loney will be signing autographs at a small sports memorabilia store near my house in San Dimas next week. Anyone live out my way or not that's interested, I'll post the specifics when I have them in the next few days. Also for anyone who likes the Angels......Reggie Willits, Howie Kendrick, and Casey Kotchman will be at the same place a few days later. Again if anyone wants to know, I'll post the details.
2007-07-23 15:51:00
146.   underdog
I wouldn't consider Hu untouchable, though as I've said here before I do like him - but also that he's as highly valued now as he may ever be.

134 Shouldn't Nomar get the day off for his birthday and all?

2007-07-23 15:51:28
147.   overkill94
Hu's value will never be higher, but I'd rather not trade him for only a middle reliever rental.

My "unless we get an offer we can't refuse" guys:
Kemp
Billingsley
Kershaw

My "we better get something good who isn't a rental" guys:
Loney
LaRoche
Ethier

My "it better be a damn good rental or at least a good player under control for a couple years" guys:
Abreu
Hu
Meloan

I'd still let Delwyn Young go for Dotel, but I'm not sure how much interest the Royals would have in him. To give up Hu or Abreu I'd rather get someone with less of an injury risk and more dominant numbers.

2007-07-23 15:52:03
148.   dodgers82
I was wrong.... big typ-O, yes it was Matt Kemp. i stand corrected.
2007-07-23 15:53:22
149.   Daniel Zappala
141 Welcome to the Travis Denker Fan Club. We meet bimonthly. Bob can help you out with whether that's twice a month or every other month.
2007-07-23 15:55:02
150.   Daniel Zappala
I'd appreciate it if someone could draw up some guidelines as to when it is proper to convert a Fan Club into a Marching and Chowder Society. Is it based on membership levels, group activities, or pure whim?
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2007-07-23 15:55:38
151.   jasonungar07
overkill/trainwreck...Broxton?
2007-07-23 15:57:14
152.   trainwreck
151
Broxton would be next on my list, but he is not with those guys because he is a reliever.
2007-07-23 16:02:20
153.   Marty
RIP Laszlo Kovacs
2007-07-23 16:04:31
154.   blue22
I put Broxton in with Loney and Ethier - guys I want to keep, but there's enough opportunity to replace their production at their respective positions to not get overly attached to them.
2007-07-23 16:12:04
155.   El Lay Dave
153 Loved his work on "Paper Moon".
2007-07-23 16:20:09
156.   El Lay Dave
Per Tony Jackson's blog (on the sidebar), Saito's MRI showed nothing. He will rejoin the team during the game tonight, and there is some hope he will be ready to pitch by tomorrow.
2007-07-23 16:24:05
157.   bhsportsguy
I'm glad to be right once in a great while

Late last night I hoped and wrote that Saito was having an MRI to verify that it wasn't his shoulder at all that was the problem.

And according to Tony Jackson -

Saito's MRI showed nothing. He will rejoin the team during the game tonight, and there is some hope he will be ready to pitch by tomorrow. He had an injury similar to this in Japan. This one started with pain over a large area of his back and neck, and it has since subsided to a small, localized area.

Saito told Grady that was exactly what happened in Japan, and the localization of the pain told him then that he was almost ready to come back

2007-07-23 16:28:58
158.   Vishal
[157] i hope that means we're not gonna trade for middle relief now.
2007-07-23 16:32:20
159.   Jacob L
I'm very confident about tonights game. Unlike the Dodgers' record in games I attend (sorry about Thurs night guys . . .), their record in games I follow online with DT during the workday is stellar. Stellar.
2007-07-23 16:34:54
160.   blue22
Johan Santana gives up 2 homers in the first and is down 3-1.

Red Sox got 4 in the first in support of Jon Lester's triumphant return to the mound.

2007-07-23 16:46:48
161.   Jon Weisman
Game thread is open.
2007-07-23 16:56:47
162.   underdog
155/153 - I'm partial to his work on 5 Easy Pieces and Easy Rider, too. What a varied career!

I blogged about it here btw:
http://daily.greencine.com/archives/004133.html

Whew, a relief about Saito...

Okay, it's about game time, eh? Gives me something to do while stuck late at work.

2007-07-23 17:00:44
163.   scareduck
85 - the motion detector was me. Sorry 'bout that.
2007-07-23 17:06:39
164.   El Lay Dave
163 Before you arrived it was Jon, me and Mrs. Dave.
2007-07-23 17:37:57
165.   Gen3Blue
Bills really looks like a guy on the verge of "getting it" regarding starting. With his natual stuff if he "gets it" he could be around a long time. So I feel he should keep starting on a long rope.

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