It could be Martin, but I hope a year or two from now he has competition from Billingsley, Loney, Kemp, LaRoche, Broxton, Stults or Meloan.

For this year, I would have voted for Saito. Literally, the smiling "face" we see in almost every win.

He had another rookie-type outing, a bit rockier than his last. Went 5 innings, gave up 3 runs, ran lots of counts full, threw about 645 pitches, but worked out of a lot of jams and showed some good stuff. I'd say unless he really truly implodes (or gets hurt), he'll be in the Nationals rotation the rest of the year.

Sadly, he struck out twice dropping his season OPS to 1.111. :(

(crumples up photo of Jack Fimple and tosses it in the crash)

----

As I posted at end of prev. thread, I got serious deja vu from the Tomko quotes this morning. Yes, he's got great stuff. Why is it such a surprise that he still stinks? Great stuff doesn't translate into consistent command, putting the pitches in the right place, or into having emotional control.

When you see the poll on the ESPN site and it lists Nomar, Grady Little, Martin, Penny, and Scully, you get the sense they were looking for someone from this year's team. If you were conducting a poll that takes into account the past, and includes those who had a major impact and were the "face" of the organization to the public, Tommy Lasorda has to be near the top of that list.

Andy LaRoche should be back for Vegas in one of the next games this week.

http://tinyurl.com/2ka52f

BTW, the fact that the Mets choice appears to be Reyes as opposed to Wright is surprising. I would have gone with Wright hands down.

I agree with that. Back in 2004 or so, pre-trade, the consensus pick would be Paul LoDuca, if leaving out broadcasters.

By the way, I've always wondered what the DodgerThoughts reaction was to that trade when it happened. I won't have time to delve into the archives, anyone got a summary?

"ESPN.com's SportsNation has convened a panel of 64 experts -- writers, bloggers, and a former player -- to give their picks for which current player, manager, owner, or mascot is the "face" of each of baseball's 30 franchises."

Kudos for a good choice; Vin was the easy way out.

At this point, would Lasorda qualify as a "mascot" of sorts?

If you ordered a pizza to the bullpen, what chance would anybody have of getting a slice after Jon Broxton got at it?

http://sports.aol.com/mlb/story/_a/saito-stands-out-with-humility-intact/20070815182409990001

................................

And congrats to Wes Parker! He was my favorite player.

We'd listen to the game with Vin & Jerry on KFI. After the post-game show, Dave Hull, the Hullabalooer, would come on the radio, and Wes would stop by to visit with Dave after the game. In between records, they'd chat about the game, and tell "groaners" that were sent in by listeners.

Any current players that might knock someone off the at list? Orlando Hudson is dynamite with the glove.

Also, Scott Rolen has the same rate2 as Ozzie Smith, who BPs system ranks as by far the greatest defender of all time. Rolen still needs to go through a decline phase, so it probably won't last, but I'm pretty sure that they just handed the thing to Brooks Robinson without giving it a second thought.

I really think you're missing it. Tommy is famous for bleeding Dodger blue. He loves the Dodgers and he's always telling everyone about it. That's what made him the face of the organization in the 70s and 80s.

DH: What formal samurai training do you have?
TS: You probably know, but carrying a real sword in Japan is illegal.

Actually, the questioner probably didn't know it was illegal, but you would never embarrass someone, even just a reporter.

Later we may have found out he was mean spirited compared to his public persona but that shouldn't lessen what he did as a manager from 74-78.

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6616

Interesting that someone said Tommy brought up tons of kids, he did begin to replace them in the early '80s, usually a year at a time, and while Fernando and Sax and Hershiser and Guerrero were good if not great players, and he won in 1983, 1985 and 1988, those teams were very different than his first group, primarily because free agency was now entrenched in the game.

After Tommy won his second title, two things happened, the farm system aside from a few players, went kaput and Fred Claire began to bring in veteran players to fill holes.

That combo did not produce the success of Tommy's first decade as manager and while the names were impressive, the team began to look up at the Braves and Giants.

Tommy will always be a face of the Dodgers to many who live outside of LA as well as to those of us whose team was that 1974-1981 Dodgers like me, but when I think of the Dodgers today, I don't picture Tommy as the face of the team anymore.

Fake.

http://65.61.134.78/alumni/news/default.asp?newsid=373013&show=detail&bhcp=1

To clear the roster,
Cut Hendrickson, Tomko and
Names that end in "z"

Rudy Seanez too?

From a Press Release:
Parker...will be recognized for the honor at Dodger Stadium on August 29.
http://www.sportsfeatures.com/index.php?section=pp&action=show&id=42011

{runs}

And oldest brother Don, Jr. played at Stanford before transfering to a little local school. Look at him now:

http://www.smcnt.com/buford.php

I like how Tony Jackson's gamer this morning was basically a clarion call for the promotion of James McDonald. If even the mainstream media is climbing on board this bandwagon, perhaps it actually has a chance of happening.

All aboard!

Even so, I think Abreu still needs a lot of work and should be playing every day for Vegas until he advances his plate discipline beyond Shea Hillenbrand levels.

And he got into a Rose Bowl to boot.

I don't think I've ever seen such a climb before from a prospect not on anyone's radar. Canuck had him ranked 15th, but from 15th to Shea would still be an amazing climb.

Hence, in 2007 (and to some degree 2006), the Dodgers have been conbuilding. Retending. Promoting a Billingsley, bringing in a Schmidt. Hey, if they've got the money...

It's a bad strategy if all you're doing is bringing in costly free agents like Claire and Malone tried to do while neglecting the farm system. But focusing on the farm system doesn't necessarily preclude bringing in free agents.

Look at the Yankees. All of a sudden, they're playing better and getting major contributions from Cano, Hughes, Chamberlain, Cabrera, Betemit. They were on the verge of looking old and bloated just a few weeks ago, it seems, but they've managed to retool while in flight. There is no reason the Dodgers can't do the same or better, if our GM stops hiring wastes of space like Tomko.

All four are guys you should remember.

Stubborn guy, that zax.

MLB Free Agents (11):
Hernandez, Seanez, Tomko, Wolf, Lieberthal, Hillebrand, Kent, Martinez, Saenz, Sweeney, Gonzalez

To be determined (6):
Hammes, Hamulack, Houlton, Hull, Megrew, Tsao

I can see Wolf maybe going for hometown discount 1 year deal again and it will be up to Kent to decide what he wants to do regardless of whether he hits his plate appearance incentive.

As was discussed in another thread, McDonald, Hu, Orenduff, Xavier Paul, Ramon Troncoso and Wesley Wright are the players that should be added to the 40 man roster before the Rule V draft.

Chamberlain has pitched 7 innings, Hughes is just now back from his injury and yes, Wilson has played well but I think he had a much bigger impact last year on the Dodgers than this year with the Yankees.

The Oktoberfest in Cincinnati is called Oktoberfest-Zinzinnati.

At least Vin doesn't ask if people drink Huedepohl Beer in Zinzinnati.

I remember Zachary as being important for for the Dodgers but I can't remember why. I'll have to check out retrosheet to see if it will ring a bell.

Zoilo Versalles--somehow I'd count that as a 'Z'--was a Dodger for a year or two, wasn't he?

Zoilo Versalles, ?...

Gosh, this is harder than it should be. Without cheating, at least.

Next year, just from my memory, Elbert, Dewitt and Meloan would have to be added to the 40 man roster.

BTW, next year could see the Dodgers have half of their 40 man roster comprised of players from their system. I am not counting Ethier and Brazoban in that count.

Now about those Dodgers players with last names starting in "Q"... Brooklyn and LA, there are only two. (Hey, that rhymes.)

"The face of the Reds franchise in 2007 is without a doubt utility infielder Juan Castro. He sucks. And the Reds have sucked for a long time. There is little redeeming about Castro as a player, just as there is little redeeming about a Reds franchise that seems adrift these days, with no clear plan of how to pull themselves out of the mess that has been the past seven years."

He pitched for a lot of teams. For a long time.

What'd he do to the rest of his name?

If all Abreu can be is a bench player on the Dodgers since they have Jeff Kent, then thats fine. Thats his role.

At no time should the bench be a place to stash crappy veterans.

Every single player on the 25 man roster should be a good player ideally. Playing time will figure itself out.

I thought I was the last person alive (other than Wes and Dave) who still remembers the "groaners."

If Boog Powell was one of the Alou brothers, would he be "Boogaloo"?

If Brooks had no money, would Brooks rob his son?

Goaltender Gordie Howe lost a bet to Bobby Hull and had to buy him dinner. Gordie suggested that Bobby bring along his young son. So, seated around the dinner table, we had the father, the son, and the goalie host.

Ugh. Commenter's name removed to avoid embarrassment.

OFs:
Kemp, Ethier, Young, Paul, Gonzalez

INFs:
Abreu, LaRoche, Kent, Loney, Martin, Furcal, Hu

C: Martin, Lieberthal

Pitchers:
Penny, Lowe, Billingsley, McDonald, Orenduff

Relievers:
Meloan, Broxton, Saito, Beimel, Hendrickson, Hull

I'm not a big believer in having guys 'develop' at the AAA level, nor am a I believer in penny pinching on service time issues since the Dodgers have a huge payroll.

Guys to dump:
Nomar, Pierre, Saenz, Lucille, Hendrickson, Tomko, Hillenbrand, Seanez

He came in to face Dale Murphy, who fouled out. Then came Bob Horner, who struck out. Zachry then got Gerald Perry to ground out.

The Dodgers took the lead 7-6 in the 9th only to see Steve Howe blow it when he gave up a 2-run walkoff homer to Bob Watson. The loss appeared to be a crusher for the Dodgers faint pennant hopes and the Braves fans were going nuts.

The Braves increased their lead over the Dodgers to 6 1/2 games with that win.

After that day, the Dodgers went 28-20 to win the division while the Braves stumbled home at 17-28.

And you also listed Hendrickson twice. Once as a member of the bullpen, and once as a dumped player.

I honestly don't understand your fascination with Orenduff.

http://tinyurl.com/3bnpdb

vr, Xei

but he is tomko-like against left handed batters.

Two quick UCLA notes, Christian Ramirez was practicing with the 3rd string offense today at RB. Pat Cowan will be out for several weeks so if MBT plays at Stanford, you better hope its a blowout or just to kneel down for a victory.

Now, if you can name all the guys whose last name started with "X"...

Okay, that's an easy one.

But there is documented known suckiness from Orenduff...at a lower level. Until he can get over that hump against left handed batters and develop a pitch to neutralize them, he shouldn't really be a rotation candidate.

Were you at practice? If so, how did Ramirez look?

If he can get the flyballs under control, he'll be a good pitcher. If he doesn't he'll go to Vegas next year, put up a six ERA, and get removed from any plans the Dodgers may have for him.

I was thinking last night that he may really be a capable bullpen guy as he was working out of Tomko's bases loaded no out mess. I just looked up his splits this year and his ERA is 2.70 with a strikeout per inning as a reliever. He also did well at the tail-end of last year coming out of the bullpen. It is getting to the point where it may be more than just a small sample size.

I also like that there is no bona fide backup first baseman. I suppose Kent would be it and there are a couple others who could certainly do it in a pinch - someone like Young.

royals- lincecum
rockies- miller
drays- chamberlain
pirates- longoria
mariners- kershaw
tigers- hochevar
dodgers- ????

Furcal, SS

Pierre, CF

Kemp, RF

Kent, 2B

Ethier, LF

Martin, C

Loney, 1B

Hillenbrand, 3B

Lowe, P

August 22, 2007

I thought the Dodgers played pretty well last night, despite Tomko. With this lineup they may have a good chance at it tonight.

1. Andrew Miller
2. Tim Lincecum
3. Evan Longoria
4. Clayton Kershaw
5. Luke Hochevar

If this happened last year, the Dodgers would have picked Morris (though he may not be the 7th best player). Morrow, Rowell, Stubbs could all go 6th.

Rowell? really? It seems his large strike zone is going to be a hefty problem for him as he progresses up the minor league ladder.

179

this wasn't really what would have happened...just hindsight a year later on who now, would be the top 7 overall players from the draft.

thats true. Although I've heard from Royal fans defending Moore's honor on the pick that the Royals are not letting Hochevar throw some of his pitches and thats why he is sucking.

I'm not really buying it, he is just homerun prone. I remember watching the CWS back in 2005 and he gave up a HUGE homerun to Matt Laporta...should have seen it coming!

To me, Chamberlain looks soo much different as a yankee now then back in college. He seriously looks like a Clemens clone up on the mound. He seems to have reworked his mechanics a bit and now he just looks spectacular. Longoria is going to be a stud and they are both comparable talents.

I'm a fan of Rowell. Deric has him right now as a top 25 guy and he's only 19. If he can stay at 3b, then he's my guy even more then Snider.

I think thats the wrong Rasmus.

From all accounts, he looks pretty good and they really only have two scholarship players (Markey and Bell) back there right now so he could get some decent playing time, the fact that he is 3rd string (unfortunately that would have Raymond Carter) tells me that they will use these next few weeks to get him ready for Stanford.

Jon, in 3 : "I could choose anyone. It was just my feeling that it should be an active member."

ESPN's "face" web page: "ESPN.com's SportsNation has convened a panel of 64 experts ... to give their picks for which current player, manager, owner, or mascot is the "face" of each of baseball's 30 franchises."

In the end, not all that important.

Like really proven.

don't worry, "we'll make him a dodger in 3 years"....!!!

http://content.cdlib.org/ark:/13030/hb2h4nb4vj/?layout=metadata&brand=calisphere

The Chavez Ravine area looks a little funky on the early maps because some of the "streets" in Chavez Ravine were not officially named by the City of Los Angeles.

Also Chavez Ravine is spread over two pages just because that's how things worked out when the Thomas Brothers were making their grid.

If you send me an e-mail, (check over at the Griddle), I may be able to e-mail you a Sanborn map page.

Sanborn maps were designed to rate fire risk. But since the people living in Chavez Ravine weren't out to buy insurance, they weren't mapped out in detail.

I hope I am equally bored today.

according to Diamond Leung.

Sept. 1st it is, for LaRoche.

If infielder Ron didn't like the results he was getting, would you say he was using the "Ron Brand"?

So now there are at least 3 of us.

On this date in baseball:

1886--Cincinnati outfielder Abner Powell was literally brought down by the dog days of summer. Chicken Wolf of the Louisville Colonels hit a deep drive and Powell took off after it, joined by a dog that had been sleeping by the fence. The dog bit Powell's leg before the outfielder could get to the ball and wouldn't let go as Wolf scored on a game-winning inside-the-park home run.

So, I guess the Wolf and the dog were chasing the same scent? And what a baseball name...Chicken Wolf. Too bad a pig wasn't also involved; then there could have been comments about an inside-the-pork home run.

Also of interest to Dodger fans:

1965--Juan Marichal thinks Johnny Roseboro throws too close to his head returning the ball to Sandy Koufax and attacks Dodger catcher with his bat. The Los Angeles backstop suffers cuts on the head during the 14-minute brawl.

Come to think of it, I guess this was catcher interference of a sort...

OK. I will stop.

It's really wonderful. He walks through his thinking on his "face of the franchise" pick. And his comments about Bonds are just brilliantly written. Like Jon, Posnanski can really make you doubt yourself as a writer.

Sample: "Then I thought about Alex Gordon, who I think will be an All-Star third baseman. I get the sense people think this has been a disappointing rookie season for Gordon, especially because he was, I think, the almost unanimous preseason choice to be rookie of the year. What happened, though, is he got off to an absolutely abysmal start; I mean he was awful at the plate and in the field. Gordon has a laid back personality -- it's difficult to tell what he's thinking. This is both good and bad -- it's good because he was hitting .161 on May 12, and he was undoubtedly thinking "AARRGH! OH MY GOD! I SUCK! HELP!" So we didn't need to know that. At the same time, he looked so laid back that many fans and outsiders wondered if Gordon was AWARE that he was hitting .161.

"You suck!" a few yelled, you know, as a gentle reminder.

Thanks for the update Eric.

Just wondering, on the heels of his comments regarding not expecting to be a Padre past '09. He's "only" making $4.75M thi season, $6M next season, and an $8M club option in '09.

You can be straight with me. I can take it.

I wonder if Towers will try and go for the old "hometown" discount for an extension beyond 2009. Though, the price would probably be 12+ million a year and Peavy would probably want a 3-4 year deal.

Boring probably not the right word, fast-paced would be the phrase.

If the Dodgers were there, all of their bats would disintegrate under the combined awesomeness of those two Dodger killers.

Apparently, the NL wild card will be vacant this year.

Jake Peavy: 13-5, 2.19 ERA, 175 SO, 164.7 IP, 188 ERA+, team tied for wild card lead
Brad Penny: 14-3, 2.59 ERA, 119 K, 167 IP, 173 ERA+, team 2.5 games behind wild card leader
Brandon Webb: 13-8, 2.63 ERA, 161 K, 184.7 IP, 176 ERA+, team in first place by 3.5 games
Chris Young: 9-4, 2.12 ERA, 130 K, 135.7 IP, 194 ERA+, team tied for wild card lead

At this point, I think they rank
1. Peavy
2. Webb
3. Penny
4. Young

...although it's really going to come down to whoever gets the hottest in September. Penny's best chance to win would be by amassing a somewhat better W-L record than the other contenders. The win he had blown by the bullpen in his last start will not help matters in that regard.

http://tinyurl.com/yr8vc7

At least I hope not!

""Frank was involved in my first appearance as a major leaguer and in my first full game. I came in as a pinch runner for Ken Singleton at second base in the 12th inning of a game against Kansas City. It was my first appearance on a big-league field as a player. I had a feeling of how this was a big stage, different from anything I'd ever experienced in the minor leagues. It was very exciting. Frank, I think, recognized that there might have been some nervousness, so he put on a pick-off play immediately, trying to take advantage of that nervousness. I got back to the base OK, but when Frank tagged me, he gave me a little smile. The batter, John Lowenstein, doubled down the line and I scored the winning run.

"The next day, I got a start. In my first at-bat, the pitcher, Paul Splittorff, had two strikes on me. The next pitch was a fastball that I chopped over the mound. When it got over Splittorff's head, there was a clear lane for that ball to center field. There was nobody in sight. I just knew that the ball was going to bounce into center field for my first major-league hit. All of a sudden, out of nowhere, Frank White came into the picture. He backhanded the ball, jumped up in the air and threw to first for a great play. He threw me out by a millisecond. I ran back to our dugout and Ken Singleton said, 'Welcome to the big leagues. That's Mr. Frank White.' It took me six or seven more at-bats before I finally got a hit."---Cal Ripken Jr.

This may be because the MVP and Cy are voted on by sportswriters while the Gold Gloves are voted on by players and managers.

Then again, Santana in 2006 and Zito in 2002 just had one. I believe Zito was the first starter to win the CYA without having a shutout.