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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Farewell, Shav Glick
2007-10-20 20:55
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

A legend at the Times passes on. One of the definitive sportswriters of the 20th century, and to my knowledge, one of the most generous in spirit.

He wrote his first bylined story, for the Pasadena Post, when he was 14. By the time he was assigned the racing beat at The Times, he was 48, had already spent 34 years covering other sports -- less three years for Army service during World War II -- and was gaining renown as a golf writer.

"In 1969, I was suddenly thrust into racing," he recalled a few years ago. " I had no background in racing as such."

And yet Glick and motor racing went together like biscuits and gravy. So taken with it was he that he made sure he covered the entire spectrum.

He was as likely to be at a sprint car race in Ventura as at the Indianapolis 500. He covered short tracks and super speedways, road racing and drag racing and midget cars. He was fascinated by unlimited hydroplane racing and, once in the dead of winter, went to La Crosse, Wis., to get a story about stock cars racing on ice.

In the 37 years he covered racing -- he was 85 when he retired in 2006 -- he had won more awards than some good drivers win races. He even had one named for him, the Shav Glick Award, given annually by sponsor Eagle One for distinguished achievement in motor racing by a Californian. The winners, chosen by a panel of sportswriters and public relations directors, represent various areas of racing but have one thing in common: Glick wrote often about each of them. ...

* * *

I also want to wish Sons of Steve Garvey a happy first birthday. Well done, kids.

Comments (181)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-10-20 22:02:37
1.   bluecurtain
Thanks for the acknowledgement of Shav. I was fortunate to be able to meet him at a young age in the press room at Ontario (you know LATimes.com, that big "unknown" racetrack in your pic of Shav in his obit) and saw him many times at races over the years. He always had time to say hi and really was interested in what he was covering.
2007-10-20 22:12:35
2.   Bob Timmermann
You expect the photo morgue people to know stuff like that there was a big racetrack in Ontario.

Next we'll see a photo of Sandy Koufax in an unidentified football stadium.

2007-10-20 22:13:44
3.   Marty
There is no photo morgue people anymore. The library staff has been decimated over the years.
2007-10-20 22:18:46
4.   Bob Timmermann
Which is why it was a good thing that they never hired me.
2007-10-20 22:19:27
5.   Dodgers49
Was Cashman ever mentioned as a serious candidate to run the Dodgers?

Cashman Stands Alone but in Control

>> The Yankees were eliminated by the Angels in the first round, but Cashman took until the end of the World Series to decide whether he wanted to return. With other attractive jobs open — including one with his favorite childhood team, the Los Angeles Dodgers — Cashman accepted a three-year, $5.5 million contract from the Yankees. <<

http://tinyurl.com/352gov

2007-10-20 23:58:34
6.   Greg Brock
R.I.P, Shav Glick.

Now, let us talk about the football coach who will not fade away. The Steve Lavin of football. Please, A State, Oregon, and Southern Cal...Defeat this man and put me out of my misery.

This is Steve Lavin all over again.

2007-10-21 00:20:32
7.   bhsportsguy
6 Here's the thing, if, and its a big if, Cowan stays healthy enough to put up 20-24 points a game, their defense might be good enough to win a few of those games.

Of course, this could change next week but Pat Cowan and Coach Walker hold Karl Dorrell's future in their hands.

2007-10-21 00:34:05
8.   MJW101
As long as there are GMs like our Ned veterans and their agents will have no worries about jobs or lengthy contracts.
2007-10-21 09:16:29
9.   Bob Timmermann
I will have to respectfully disagree with Mr. Brock as I don't think you should ever actively root for your team to lose a game.

Expecting a positive to necessarily from a negative outcome is very chancy.

It's also no fun.

This was similar to people here rooting for the Dodgers to lose more games so they could would have a better draft pick.

2007-10-21 09:32:33
10.   Icaros
9

It wasn't for a better draft pick, it was to ensure not losing our pick when Ned signs Glenallen Hill to play RF.

2007-10-21 09:42:44
11.   Bob Timmermann
So, only in the case of a Glenallen Hill signing?
2007-10-21 09:59:34
12.   Jon Weisman
And now, Max McGee passes on ...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/nfl/10/21/obit.mcgee.ap/index.html

2007-10-21 10:07:16
13.   Bumsrap
For the sake of conversation:

Maybe the Dodgers could trade Colletti for Cashman.

Larussa could go to the Yankees and Torre to the Cards.

Little could follow Tracy to the Pirates.

Dodger Manager candidates: Rick Monday, Erik Karros, Oral Hershiser, ?

2007-10-21 10:11:44
14.   Greg Brock
9 That's not a very fair analogy. One draft pick does very little to help a professional baseball team.

I realize people don't think it's smart to root against your own team in the short term to bring changes that will help the team in the long run. I understand why people don't think it's loyal. I just disagree.

2007-10-21 10:18:52
15.   Bob Timmermann
14
I respectfully disagree with your respectful disagreement.
2007-10-21 10:30:07
16.   Marty
I think I've stumbled into a Mac n Tosh cartoon.
2007-10-21 10:48:13
17.   Jon Weisman
The Torre example reminds us that a team doesn't need to have a disastrous season to fire their coach or manager. If you're hoping that the next coach or manager will be an intelligent choice (like replacing Lavin with Howland), you might as well hope they make that regardless of what the team's record is, and have fun along the way.

I don't follow UCLA football closely enough to have an opinion on Dorrell, so maybe I shouldn't even talk about this. But you'd think that the Lavin/Howland example would tell Guerrero that he shouldn't wait for a collapse by the team to have the best available coach. If it's Dorrell, he should stick by him. If there's someone out there that's better, Guerrero should go after him regardless of whether an interception gets returned for a touchdown in the final minute.

2007-10-21 11:00:41
18.   Bob Timmermann
I hear that if Dan Guerrero called Walt Harris that Walt would take the call.
2007-10-21 12:05:52
19.   Greg Brock
17 Now you're just making sense. That's not how we do business.

But seriously, the last three games are against Arizona State, Oregon, and Southern Cal. This situation is going to take care of itself. My rooting interests matter none. 7-5 is the probable outcome.

2007-10-21 12:13:45
20.   trainwreck
19
And even in the worst case scenario and he keeps his job, there is no way that he will have a winning record with next year's team.
2007-10-21 12:23:41
21.   Reddog
Would Logan White make a good Dodgers GM?

My theory is that Colletti and Little are going to be gone after next season, and I think Logan White might be a logical candidate to lead the Dodgers.

2007-10-21 12:31:24
22.   Jon Weisman
The converse to 17 is that if you have a dim view of the coach/manager, there's not enough reason to think that the person who hired that coach/manager will choose better the second time around. The hiring of Howland could be a fluke.

As much as I came to dislike Jim Tracy in 2005, I never rooted against the Dodgers, and that was with a different GM in charge.

2007-10-21 12:43:15
23.   Bob Timmermann
22
For example:
Lloyd McClendon --> Jim Tracy (leaving out Pete Mackanin)
Jerry Narron --> Dusty Baker (leaving out Pete Mackanin)

Buddy Teevens --> Walt Harris

John Robinson --> Paul Hackett

And most of us know that pretty much no USC fans liked Pete Carroll's hiring.

And Joe Torre was not expected to do much as Yankee manager.

And this doesn't apply to sports. It applies to all types of personnel decisions. How many times have one of us worked with someone who probably seemed great on paper and then turned out to be terrible or vice versa?

2007-10-21 12:58:28
24.   Greg Brock
22 Correct. The next coach may very well be bad. But this current coach is bad. Sticking to Coach A because hypothetical Coach B might be worse seems risk-averse in the extreme.

The next guy might be a poor coach. The current coach is a poor coach.

2007-10-21 13:16:47
25.   goofus
Making it real easy to understand... If I were in Death Row waiting to be hanged, and the Warden offered to flip a coin, heads I get the gas chamber, tails I get a pardon, what do you think I'd say????
2007-10-21 13:19:49
26.   Bob Timmermann
But I'm going to be hanged, why would I get a gas chamber option?
2007-10-21 13:24:41
27.   Dodgers49
I didn't necessarily want to see Joe Torre fired but I think that even if he felt the Yankee's offer was an insult he would have been better served by not publicly saying so. Because a lot of people are just not going to be able to see $5 million to $8 million as being insulting.
2007-10-21 13:37:36
28.   yankz
27 I think reasons Torre felt insulted, in order:

1. The incentives clauses
2. Only one year
3. The pay cut.

He called the offer "generous" and acknowledged that he won't make that much money running another team. FWIW, the NY press is, for the most part, very much on his side.

2007-10-21 13:41:01
29.   Jon Weisman
24 - Not arguing with that, but if you're stipulating A, you don't need to lose games to get to B. Again, the last 63 seconds of yesterday's game shouldn't - and probably didn't - change Guerrero's opinion of A. Or anyone's, except perhaps that of the L.A. Times.

Howland and Harbaugh are arguably good examples of firing until you get the right guy. Again, I'm not arguing with firing Dorrell or not - I have no opinion. But if the issue is that Dorrell needs to lose X number of games in order to get fired, and that's the only issue at play, then the problem runs deeper than Dorrell.

The ideal situation would be a) you get the head coach you like and b) the program is attractive enough that talent is still interested in coming. At Stanford, we seem to have a) but not b). You probably shouldn't want to copy us.

I would root for the Bruins while simulatenously rooting for the pursuit of excellence at coach. Dorrell has already lost to Utah and ND. He already has the spotty track record. Either he's going to win out, in which case, you're stuck with a coach you don't like but compensated with a Rose Bowl victory, or he's going to lose even though you're rooting for UCLA, in which case you're stuck with a disappointing season but on your way to the new coach.

Long story short (too late), there's little to nothing to be gained from regretting victories.

2007-10-21 13:42:07
30.   Jon Weisman
27 - Yeah, the sense I get is almost everyone gets what the Yankees' offer meant. If it wasn't insulting, it was at a minimum a relative emasculation.
2007-10-21 13:44:41
31.   Jon Weisman
29 - Look at the Dodgers. Did losing games get the Dodgers any closer to benching Pierre or committing to the kids? Management believes what it wants to believe.

Those who were anti-Depo in 2005 or anti-Little/Colletti in 2007 who might have rooted for the Dodgers to lose so that they would get fired ... have they been rewarded? Debatable.

2007-10-21 13:48:15
32.   Josh Wilker
This is off-topic, but last night in the ninth inning, Red Sox fans were chanting "Let's go, Gahn-yay!" He seemed to be galvanized by it and mowed the Indians down in order. He also looked a little less homeless, beard-wise.
2007-10-21 13:48:43
33.   trainwreck
It is true that the problems with UCLA football run deeper than Karl Dorrell, but the information out there is that UCLA is willing to pay for a proven coach this time.
2007-10-21 13:59:32
34.   Vishal
i'm really glad i didn't watch the cal-ucla game yesterday. my roommates' television may not have survived.
2007-10-21 14:15:15
35.   Greg Brock
31 The threshold for firing Dorrell is higher than it is for most other coaches. He's young, he's affable, he's an alum, and he's a Terry Donahue acolyte. And the elephant in the room that we like to pretend doesn't exist.
2007-10-21 14:23:12
36.   Bob Timmermann
35
I think the elephant in the room isn't that big of a deal.

Ty Willingham was fired at Notre Dame and UCLA sent Walt Hazzard and Larry Farmer packing.

2007-10-21 14:23:24
37.   Dodgers49
35. And the elephant in the room that we like to pretend doesn't exist.

That elephant didn't save Willingham.

2007-10-21 14:24:53
38.   Dodgers49
36. Bob is just so much faster than I am. :-)
2007-10-21 14:26:08
39.   Greg Brock
36 Notre Dame took quite a few hits for firing Willingham.
2007-10-21 14:26:22
40.   Bob Timmermann
36 37
Of course we could be thinking about different elephants.
2007-10-21 14:34:39
41.   trainwreck
The elephant in the room contributed to KD's hiring, but I do not think it means much now.

He is the most well liked person in the athletic department, that is why he has a lot of pull. Plus, the football program is doing better academic wise.

2007-10-21 15:09:17
42.   Daniel Zappala
I think the whole problem is that people are too obsessed with football. These are kids playing a game, most of whom will not do this as a career. Of all the football teams in the country, UCLA is hardly alone in having an up-and-down season this year. It's what makes the game interesting to watch -- it would be boring to just have USC, ND, Michigan, and LSU win out every year.
2007-10-21 15:19:49
43.   Bob Timmermann
42
Don't tell Bill Plaschke that. He only wants the "traditional" powers to win every year. Or else the game is no fun.

It's similar to the argument about how the World Series this year would not be worth watching since it might not have "traditional" powers.

Because:
1) we don't want fans to think that their local team has no chance to win.
2) we don't want TV viewers not to watch playoffs or bowl games that because they don't have the "traditional" powers.

I am unsure how you become a traditional power in any sport. Apparently you get this bestowed on you. Because none of the "traditional" powers ever were at point in their existence when they had no championships.

2007-10-21 15:28:11
44.   Dodgers49
39. 36 Notre Dame took quite a few hits for firing Willingham.

As well they should have. Notre Dame had never fired a coach in the middle of his contract (not even Gerry Faust ). They got the genius the Notre Dame Alumni Association wanted. And he only has Karl Dorrell to thank for not starting this season 0-7.

2007-10-21 15:30:34
45.   Bob Timmermann
44
To be precise, Notre Dame has Karl Dorrell to thank for not starting the season 0-8.

If Navy can't beat Notre Dame in two weeks, they will never beat Notre Dame ever. Until the end of time.

2007-10-21 15:33:18
46.   Vishal
42 oh yeah, i'm sure usc fans were absolutely bored to tears during their 33-game win streak or whatever it was.
2007-10-21 15:36:33
47.   MikeB
46 Rest assured, we were not bored, complacent or disinterested.
2007-10-21 15:40:14
48.   Bob Timmermann
46
34 game-winning streak!
2007-10-21 16:02:08
49.   Vishal
48 i didn't bother looking it up. i knew it was 33 or 34, and i didn't want to overstate it.

my point was that as fans, you want your team to win every game (greg brock notwithstanding), no matter how good or bad the team is in general. obviously, the rest of us would find it boring if the same teams won all the time, but the fans of those teams wouldn't. i would absolutely love for cal to boringly win out every year. leave it to the other teams to have "interesting" games :)

2007-10-21 16:10:10
50.   Bob Timmermann
49
I'm sorry that Cal is not a "traditional" power and accorded the same rights and privileges that other teams bearing that moniker get.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-10-21 16:38:08
51.   MikeB
50 . . . or Occidental College (Eagle Rock) which is completely ignored by the pundits at the LAT.
2007-10-21 16:39:06
52.   Vishal
50 i wasn't addressing the traditional/non-traditional divide, merely the assertions of boringness associated with victory.
2007-10-21 16:40:41
53.   Daniel Zappala
I was of course speaking as a fan of college football in general -- as I am of baseball in general -- that the game is always better when different teams have a chance to win each year.

I of course would have loved Stanford to win every game while I was there (we at least beat Cal nearly every year), and right now I would love to have BYU win every game. But honestly, even as a fan of those two programs, I would be bored to tears if they won every game for 20 years running. At some point, my desire to see the sport flourish and remaining interesting would kick in and outweigh my desire to see my team win.

2007-10-21 16:42:00
54.   Daniel Zappala
52 The boringness doesn't come with victory, week in and week out, as a fan of a particular team. It comes as a fan of the sport in general, wanting to see a large selection of teams having a chance to win.
2007-10-21 16:50:01
55.   Dodgers49
45. 44 To be precise, Notre Dame has Karl Dorrell to thank for not starting the season 0-8.

Thanks. I knew I should have checked rather than depend on the old gray cells. :-)

2007-10-21 17:08:31
56.   dzzrtRatt
50 Cal is a "traditional" disappointment to any alums older than about 24. The idea of Cal as a force to be reckoned with for more than one year in a row is one I'm not used to yet. A Cal fan goes game to game. If we lost almost every game but managed to beat Stanford or USC, that was a good season. It used to be very exciting whenever Cal was ranked, much less ranked in the top 10. In the past 10 years or so, it seems like we've had a few shots at the Rose, but something always happens to screw it up.

Obviously, the Tedford years have been unprecedented in my experience, but I still can't quite bring myself to believe it will be more than an episode in Cal history, rather than a permanent turnaround.

2007-10-21 17:09:12
57.   MikeB
Occidental's regular season consecutive win streak reached 32 with a win over long time traditional rival Pomona Pitzer on Saturday.

From latimes.com (the best they can do for small college football)

Occidental 31, at Pomona-Pitzer 15: Justin Goltz completed 25 of 38 passes for 271 yards for the Tigers (6-0, 4-0), who knocked off the Sagehens (2-4, 1-3) in a SCIAC game and extended their regular-season win streak to 32 games. Occidental used a 24-0 second half to erase a 15-7 halftime deficit, taking the lead for good on Neil Martin's 24-yard field with 2:01 left in the third quarter.

http://www.oxy.edu/x7535.xml

2007-10-21 17:23:46
58.   Bob Timmermann
Oxy and Pomona have the longest continuous rivalry on the West Coast I believe.

Cal and Stanford started earlier, but took some years off. And they also played rugby for a while instead of football.

2007-10-21 17:28:26
59.   Bob Timmermann
Pomona and Oxy have played every year since 1895.

Cal and Stanford first played in 1892, but played rugby from 1906 to 1914 and didn't playe either from 1915-1918.

2007-10-21 17:33:49
60.   Andrew Shimmin
From my inbox:

If any player steals a base in the 2007 MLB World Series, Taco Bell is going to give (1) free Crunchy Seasoned Beef Taco to every person in America. Redemption details to follow.

http://clicks.on32.com/cts/click?q=2;19417;GKUM5dIzy4251RIYBIXqnSa6en7FK7cr

2007-10-21 17:36:58
61.   D4P
60
Poor cows. Why should they be killed just because someone steals a base?

Humans are schmucks.

2007-10-21 17:40:30
62.   Bob Timmermann
They don't kill cows to make beef. They kill steers.
2007-10-21 17:42:19
63.   Andrew Shimmin
61- Unless the redemption details are that Taco Bell hunts down each and every American and stuffs a Crunchy Seasoned Beef Taco down his throat, how many cows are really going to die over this? If everything at Taco Bell was free, I don't think I'd start eating there.
2007-10-21 17:42:27
64.   D4P
Poor steers. Why should they be killed just because someone steals a base?
2007-10-21 17:44:00
65.   D4P
If everything at Taco Bell was free, I don't think I'd start eating there

You would if they put one in your WalMart.

2007-10-21 17:44:37
66.   Andrew Shimmin
When ever Bob goes on a correction bender, I wonder if it's because there are an inordinate number of errors, in a given thread, or if we're always this lax, and he's just letting it slide.

Then I go get a cup of mixed nuts. I'm easily distracted.

2007-10-21 17:47:30
67.   MikeB
Taco Bell and stolen bases . . . leads to (the) runs.
2007-10-21 17:52:14
68.   trainwreck
There can't be that much steer in a Taco Bell taco.
2007-10-21 17:55:06
69.   Bob Timmermann
66
My father was a dairy farmer before he moved out to California and was really big on correcting his children about the difference between steers and cows.
2007-10-21 17:56:53
70.   Bob Timmermann
The taco costs 77 cents according to the ad. And you have three hours I believe on one of two days to pick it up.

So you can imagine that there might be a line.

I can figure out everyone's opportunity costs. Mine are $300 per hour! Unless there's something good on TV.

2007-10-21 18:02:30
71.   Gen3Blue
The announcers are surprised no relievers are up. But I look and Lugo is up.
Double play? Yup.
2007-10-21 18:10:57
72.   Andrew Shimmin
When inflation brings the price of tacos up to $1.00, the hundred tacos for a hundred dollars episode of The Simpson will be sadly dated.
2007-10-21 18:19:06
73.   Izzy
Since calling someone a jerk is apparently within board rules, I will officially and publicly call the San Francisco Chronicle reporter who uhhh "released" his story on Paul Byrd yesterday, a jerk. Jerk.

I feel better now.

2007-10-21 18:43:42
74.   D4P
World Series preferences:

1. Rockies in 4 over Red Sox
2. Rockies in 7 over Red Sox
3. Rockies in 5 over Red Sox
4. Rockies in 6 over Red Sox

I guess my preferences are not monotonic.

2007-10-21 19:51:11
75.   MSarg29
That's the Julio Lugo we all know and love.
2007-10-21 20:00:10
76.   jasonungar07
Doing the worse thing possible at such efficent speed, well done Blake. That was Nomar like. The 3b coach Skinner was Donnelly like...
2007-10-21 20:04:26
77.   El Lay Dave
76 If Donnelly had been coaching third, Lofton wouldn't have been held, Manny would have thrown him out and somehow Franklin Gutierrez would have sped around and been out at home also, five feet behind Lofton.
2007-10-21 20:06:33
78.   MSarg29
77 - Thats good
2007-10-21 20:09:50
79.   El Lay Dave
Pedroia says thanks for bunting the runner to third, but I'll score him without a productive out.
2007-10-21 20:59:42
80.   KG16
So, do we root for the Red Sox and all of our old friends? Or for division rival and young team extraordinare Colorado?

I think I have to root for Colorado because they have the most former Long Beach St players. Granted, they have one, and the Red Sox have none.

Plus, the Red Sox winning would only make ESPN even more intolerable because the entire off season would be about how the Yankees can improve to overtake the Red Sox.

2007-10-21 21:05:47
81.   Bluebleeder87
80

I'm definitely rooting for the Rox.

2007-10-21 21:11:45
82.   Suffering Bruin
Rockies. Most definitely the Rockies.
2007-10-21 21:12:59
83.   yankz
82 Agreed, for obvious reasons!
2007-10-21 21:24:11
84.   Vishal
rockies for sure.
2007-10-21 22:04:11
85.   Bob Timmermann
The Rockies have one old friend in Matt Herges.
2007-10-21 22:18:34
86.   Linkmeister
Rockies.

It was a difficult afternoon here; Mom wanted the Sox, I wanted the Indians.

2007-10-21 23:24:19
87.   dzzrtRatt
The Rockies are missing out on a lot of good theme songs. Like this one from Motown/Doobie Brothers, perfectly captures the bittersweet nature of the World Series as the end of the season:

I know you're leavin me behind
I'm seein you darlin for the very last time
Show a little tenderness before you go
Please let me feel your embrace once more

Take me in your arms and rock me, rock me a little while

We all must feel heartache sometimes
Right now, right now I'm feelin mine
I've tried my best to be strong, but I'm not able
I'm like a helpless child left in a cradle
Before you leave me behind let me feel happy one more time

Take me in your arms and rock me, rock me a little while

I'm losin you and my happiness
My life is so dark I must confess
I'll never, never see your smiling face no more
I'll never, never hear your knock upon my door
Before you leave me, leave me behind
Let me feel happy one more time

Take me in your arms and rock me, rock me a little while...

And this plea for a 7 game series by B.B. King:

Rock me baby, rock me all night long
Rock me baby, honey, rock me all night long
I want you to rock me baby,
like my back ain't got no bone

Roll me baby, like you roll a wagon wheel
I want you to roll me baby,
like you roll a wagon wheel
Want you to roll me baby,
you don't know how it makes me feel

Rock me baby, honey, rock me slow
Yeah, rock me pretty baby, baby rock me slow
Want you to rock me baby, till I want no more

2007-10-21 23:44:46
88.   dzzrtRatt
Forget the tacos...

http://tinyurl.com/22t2sz

2007-10-21 23:48:20
89.   Greg Brock
Go Rockies!
2007-10-22 06:33:37
90.   Ken Noe
89 Colletti sort of agrees: ""Danny and Clint were patient with the development of their players," Colletti said. "You tie that to what we're trying to do, and it's why we try to stay the course.

"Our young players are not at the stage of Holliday and some of their other players, but the Rockies waited a while for those guys to get there. You can't usually get that overnight."

2007-10-22 06:57:09
91.   Terry A
90 - It probably speaks to how irrationally large and intense my dislike of Colletti has grown, but I was gnashing my teeth at his "told-you-so" tone regarding the Rockies in that Times column.

Right, Ned. You saw the Rockies at midseason and thought they'd be special. Because you're prescient like that. And that's why you thought you'd block Loney with a couple years of Nomar. And signed Pierre through the next appearance of Halley's Comet. Because you can spot special talent.

Also, that photo of Lasorda whispering in Colletti's ear is exceptionally creepy. Wormtongue!

P.S. -- Go Rockies.

2007-10-22 07:09:40
92.   Ken Noe
91 I've been hoping that the Rockies' success would have an effect on the LA front office and its winter decisions. Maybe it will. Its going to be a long winter of worry though.
2007-10-22 07:48:04
93.   Bumsrap
ASU = #4

Ned also snuck in that the core of the Rockies home grown youth were not rushed out of the minors, had at least 3 years of MLB experience, and were about 27 years old.

The Dodgers core of home grown youth range from 19 to 25 years of age and have 0 to 2 years MLB experience.

The Dodgers are still missing that core of ages 27 to 32 players with 3 or more years experience.

2007-10-22 08:07:30
94.   Ken Noe
VT = #8

All I want for 2008 is no stupid trades of kids, no new long-term contracts to block them, and no more foolish extension of veteran contracts. If he's willing to "wait" for the kids and be the "new" O'Dowd rather than the old one, I will be content next year. Of course I'd also like to see A-Rod :-)

2007-10-22 08:25:29
95.   Daniel Zappala
ASU #4 is pretty ridiculous. Just because a team goes undefeated, and they happen to be in the Pac-10, they get a pass, regardless of how easy their schedule was? And of course, Boise State or Hawaii won't get the same consideration. Whatever. Have a playoff already.
2007-10-22 08:27:35
96.   Bumsrap
94 - I would be okay with trying to get a couple of players closer to age 27 like Ian Kensler in exchange for Abreu and Kent.

I have some interest in Jason Bay but I admit that maybe I shouldn't.

2007-10-22 08:33:34
97.   Kevin Lewis
I have never wanted a team to lose more in the World Series than the Red Sox right now. I hope Colorado comes out and pounds it to them.
2007-10-22 08:36:38
98.   regfairfield
93 It tends to happen when the best players you draft for 10 years are Alex Cora and Jason Repko.
2007-10-22 08:37:43
99.   Bumsrap
95 - The thing about ASU is that Denis Erickson is their new coach and so far is making a difference. While ASU does not have much experience in the top 10, Erickson does.
2007-10-22 08:38:36
100.   D4P
While ASU does not have much experience in the top 10, Erickson does

Yep. Erickson has Been There Before™.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2007-10-22 08:40:26
101.   Bumsrap
98 - That and trade Mike Piazza and Paul Konerko(sp) etc.
2007-10-22 08:42:54
102.   Bluebleeder87
It's gonna be interesting watching the Rockies after a long lay over, I hope it wasn't counter productive that they beat the Snakes so easily. If anything there pitchers will be pretty strong & there defense shouldn't suffer at all, there bats is what I'm worried about, we'll see.
2007-10-22 08:45:08
103.   Bluebleeder87
104

Newscorp is a dark cloud in DodgerTime line history.

2007-10-22 08:47:05
104.   El Lay Dave
Go Rockies.

88 A month later, Alexson looked into doing another promotion, this time for the White Sox, and was told that Lloyds now wanted 18 percent of total sales, since the team had played so well two years earlier.

Doesn't Lloyds know there are much better predictors than "what they did two years ago"? Some one needs to put their actuaries in touch with sabermatricians - that was easy money for the insurance company!

2007-10-22 08:58:58
105.   kinbote
UO = #5 [which is also semi-ridiculous]

i'm definitely rooting for colorado, but i think boston beats them. the difference in the series will be starting pitching, with colorado not quite able to match up against beckett/schilling/dice-k.

boston in 6.

2007-10-22 08:59:20
106.   El Lay Dave
2 The caption has been updated, apparently.

I used to read the Times sports page religiously in the early 70s. I remember always seeing the "Shav Glick" byline on the racing stories and being intrigued by the name. Am I old if I have too many memories of what others might term a bygone era?

2007-10-22 09:17:38
107.   Bluebleeder87
105

I don't know who's gonna win but Colorado has great D & there righty lefty power arms are very formidable I'm suspecting Francis will keep the BoSox off balance, I say the Rox win.

ps I'm sorry but Dice-K doesn't impress me much.

2007-10-22 09:19:02
108.   Bob Timmermann
The first place I checked had Boston as a -240 favorite to win the World Series.

Such betting lines are for entertainment purposes only.

2007-10-22 09:22:56
109.   D4P
Such betting lines are for entertainment purposes only

Doesn't the word "betting" bely the phrase "entertainment purposes only"...?

2007-10-22 09:24:25
110.   wireroom
I think Boston in 6. With Schilling and Beckett, you at least have a pretty good idea of what you are going to get. For the Rox, I think they hit better than the Indians, but after Francis, they have an unproven young power pitcher prone to wildness and Josh Fogg doesn't scare me much. Both clubs have excellent defense. It may come down to a close play or two though.
2007-10-22 09:37:02
111.   Jon Weisman
If only I had been betting. I'm 6 for 6 in picking the postseason series this year for SI.com.
2007-10-22 09:41:03
112.   Bluebleeder87
110

I see your logic WireRoom (makes sense) but if there young pitchers aren't intimidated by the big stage look out, they have electric stuff when there right. Manny Ramirez is probably the worst LF'd in the game today & I'd give the nod to Tulo over Lugo VERY EASILY.

2007-10-22 09:41:03
113.   Bob Timmermann
111
Instead, Jon, in order to make money, has hired out his children to me in order to help clean my apartment.

They really haven't been doing a good job.

2007-10-22 09:45:41
114.   Bluebleeder87
I don't think the AL has a spacious out field like Colorado right? I'm trying to think of one but I can't.
2007-10-22 09:50:28
115.   regfairfield
112 If you're going to play that game, Mike Lowell is light years ahead of Atkins and J.D. Drew is much better than Hawpe.

Boston caught the ball far more often than Colorado this year, though a lot of that can be attributed to park factors. I'd say they're about equal defensively, with Boston having a massively superior pitching staff.

2007-10-22 09:56:56
116.   Bluebleeder87
111

at least I got one right, I picked the Rox to make it all the way.

2007-10-22 10:00:21
117.   Bob Timmermann
114
Detroit has a very spacious outfield. It's 420 to center there and 370 and 365 in the power allies.
2007-10-22 10:04:55
118.   old dodger fan
94 VT at #8 is ridiculous. They have only played 1 good team all year and they lost by 41 points. Crushing William & Mary shouldn't even count. The next 5 weeks we will see how good they are. I'm rooting for them but they have not proved anything yet.
2007-10-22 10:16:34
119.   El Lay Dave
117 "power allies" - Manny and Ortiz? Holliday, Helton, Hawpe and Atkins?
2007-10-22 10:20:11
120.   Bob Timmermann
119
Think more in terms of World War I.
2007-10-22 10:22:14
121.   wireroom
112 I am not saying that the Rockies young pitchers can't come up big, but if I had the choice between those guys and Schilling and Beckett, I am taking the proven pitching.
Manny had played pretty good this postseason too. Shortstop is very important in a series like this, and I can for sure see Tulowitski being a deciding factor over Lugo. If the Rockies can somehow get to Schilling or Beckett, they have a real good chance.
2007-10-22 10:40:13
122.   Ken Noe
111 I'm not convinced of it either--our lead RB is banged up and the QB situation is a muddle--but I remain hopeful. We'll see what happens with BC Thursday. But mostly I was just representing the east coast, where the PAC-10 is simply a late-night phenomenon.
2007-10-22 10:56:29
123.   old dodger fan
122 I am a California native living in VA so I see both sides. My 2 favorite Div I football teams are UCLA and VT.

My favorite BB teams are the Dodgers and the Nats although my support for the Nationals is lukewarm.

I think Tyrod Taylor will be an excellent QB but he will take some licks this year. Hopefully he's ready for BC.

2007-10-22 11:03:07
124.   wireroom
You know the Nats used to be the Expos. I love the Dodgers and can't say that I am a fan of any other baseball team, but I always respected the Expos for some reason. I liked the way they played and I liked those goofy uniforms. I miss the Expos.
2007-10-22 11:06:34
125.   D4P
Players to play for the Expos and the Dodgers:

1. Delino!
2. Gary Carter
3. Carlos Perez

2007-10-22 11:06:54
126.   kinbote
124 - plus the ball always made a strange sound when it was hit in their stadium. i never looked forward to our road trips there.
2007-10-22 11:08:24
127.   LogikReader
Mornin' all,

A friend of mine is going to go to a Red Sox bar in West LA to watch some of the World Series this week.

Hey, Red Sox bar? Where are the DODGER bars around LA?

2007-10-22 11:12:21
128.   Jacob L
125
Tim Wallach
John Wetteland
Roberto Kelly
2007-10-22 11:13:42
129.   D4P
128
Suppose we should include Pedro Martinez
2007-10-22 11:16:43
130.   Ken Noe
123 I like UCLA myself: public school, cool unis. Hokies who were Dodgers: Franklin Stubbs, Johnny Oates.

126 Saw three games in the O. Loved the subway and the bilingual vendors. Mais souffle! Otherwise it was a travesty.

2007-10-22 11:18:02
131.   Ken Noe
125 Mike Marshall!
2007-10-22 11:19:04
132.   old dodger fan
I am looking forward to seeing the Nats new stadium. Dodgers will be there in late August.
2007-10-22 11:19:37
133.   wireroom
127 there's the shortstop on Sunset right before Elysian Park. great place with 1.50 beers on gameday.

_126_it was like playing baseball in what they thought a spaceship would look like back in the 70s.

2007-10-22 11:21:11
134.   underdog
This quote from safety John Lynch after the Broncos-Steelers game last night struck me for some reason. Reminds me of something, but I can't quite put my finger on it...

>>"This is an interesting team, because you've got a lot of older veterans, but then you've got a lot of youth. And you fear that you lose those guys [because of injuries], if you don't have success. Because you can talk about 'Hey, we're still in this thing' all you want, but you keep piling losses up, then it's tough to keep spirits up.

"Success lets people know, and particularly the youth in this locker room, that: 'Hey, we're all right."'<<

2007-10-22 11:21:50
135.   old dodger fan
Former Nats with the Dodgers-Esteban Loaiza
2007-10-22 11:21:58
136.   Eric Enders
Marquis Grissom
Derrel Thomas
Manny Mota
Ted Lilly (sort of)
2007-10-22 11:22:27
137.   Eric Enders
Wilton Guerrero!
2007-10-22 11:23:03
138.   Uncle Miltie
Just got my ticket for the Oregon/USC game!
2007-10-22 11:24:17
139.   Eric Enders
Milton Bradley.

Okay, I'll stop now.

2007-10-22 11:24:35
140.   Bob Timmermann
Bob Bailey!
2007-10-22 11:24:54
141.   D4P
138
How are you liking everything so far?
2007-10-22 11:25:51
142.   Bob Timmermann
138
Go Ducks! UCLA's Rose Bowl chances depend upon USC losing another game.

Of course, I'm living the pipe dream that UCLA will win the next four straight games.

2007-10-22 11:26:39
143.   Bluebleeder87
133

I felt like that when my youth baseball team went to San Francisco for a tournament & one of the other teams coaches invited us to Candlestick park.

2007-10-22 11:27:02
144.   Disabled List
Mark Grudzkediknlkznlanek.

I got to visit Montreal this past summer. Beautiful city, friendly people, great sports town. It's a shame what happened to baseball there.

2007-10-22 11:27:32
145.   Uncle Miltie
141- it's awesome. If you wanna hear more about it, e-mail me... oaklachi@yahoo.com

I have to go to class...

2007-10-22 11:33:38
146.   wireroom
143 Never got to visit Candlestick. Maybe I will go for a Niners game before it is torn down. But everyone says that it is a dump.

144 Montreal is a great city! Used to play in a band and we traveled up there once.

2007-10-22 11:38:57
147.   Bob Timmermann
I've been in Montreal once. It was over 100 degrees there.

It doesn't go over 100 there often. The city was not bustling with activity.

2007-10-22 11:39:25
148.   fanerman
College football talk makes me sad. I will go away for awhile.
2007-10-22 11:41:35
149.   wireroom
147 we were there in the early spring and it was frigidly cold. I think everyone hangs out underground there in Montreal..
2007-10-22 11:42:26
150.   old dodger fan
I have been to Montreal twice. I loved it. It is a great city to walk in and visit restaurants and museums. I hope to go back. I saw the ballpark but I was never there during baseball season.
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2007-10-22 11:43:13
151.   Bluebleeder87
146

it is a dump! & there baseball teams aren't that good either cause we creamed all of them!!

2007-10-22 11:45:52
152.   El Lay Dave
Maury Wills
Ron Fairly
Jim Fairey
Mudcat Grant
Ron Hunt

One of my first baseball caps was an original Expos design. Gaudy was huge in 1971.

2007-10-22 11:46:00
153.   Daniel Zappala
142 If UCLA wins out, won't USC by definition have another loss?
2007-10-22 11:47:39
154.   Bob Timmermann
153
The pipe dream is that UCLA beats Wazzu, UA, ASU, and Oregon and then loses to USC.

UCLA would finish 8-1 in the Pac-10 and then should have tiebreaker edges over all the other teams as long as USC loses one more game.

Backing in to the Rose Bowl is a UCLA tradition!

2007-10-22 11:48:43
155.   Daniel Zappala
You dream big, Bob. No way UCLA beats Oregon, as long as Oregon doesn't lose any more players to season-ending injury.
2007-10-22 11:49:18
156.   Daniel Zappala
Of course, I wouldn't put it past UCLA to lose to WSU.
2007-10-22 11:50:33
157.   Marty
I have a small degree of hope that USC is getting healthier and can run the table. For once I agree with Plaschke, Sanchez should be the quarterback. But then again, Chow should be the offensive coordinator.
2007-10-22 11:52:51
158.   Daniel Zappala
Chow should be the head coach at UCLA.
2007-10-22 11:53:06
159.   Jon Weisman
157 - I skimmed that column before I realized that it was so typical of Plaschke. Even if Sanchez should be the QB, the rationale Plashcke was using was typical baloney. "He thrived amid the ghosts of Notre Dame!"
2007-10-22 11:53:22
160.   wireroom
152 nothing wrong with the old red white and blue clown hat that was the Expos for a while. that hat made you look like you worked in the local hot dog stand, but I still keep one around just so people can see what baseball once was in the future.
2007-10-22 11:53:23
161.   D4P
Notre Dame beat UCLA which beat Cal which beat Oregon with beat Michigan which beat Notre Dame.

Which brings us back to "Doe".

2007-10-22 11:57:34
162.   wireroom
I like the idea that USC has played a lot of guys in place of injured starters, therefore making them that much stronger down the stretch with that game experience. Having capable players at all positions especially at quarterback is going to help them out a lot.
2007-10-22 12:00:00
163.   BruceR
32 Let's see ... this is Baseball Toaster/Dodger Thoughts and your comment deals with the ALCS and a former Dodger. Don't see where you're off-topic.

Go Rox !!!

2007-10-22 12:00:21
164.   Bluebleeder87
the new SF stadium looks way nice though.

I don't know the Cincy farm system but it sure seems like Baker is gonna have an up hill battle over there.

2007-10-22 12:27:43
165.   MC Safety
164- I have a feeling Joey Votto will get the James Loney treatment. That would be too bad, I like watching him play.

Homer Bailey might be headed down the Mark Prior, Matt Clement and Kerry Wood path as well. How much influence do you guys think Joe Morgan had in Baker's hiring if any?

2007-10-22 13:01:02
166.   Marty
159 Well, I meant I agree with his conclusion. How he got there is another matter. I wanted Sanchez to start last year.
2007-10-22 13:01:04
167.   Ken Noe
Ken Gurnick just up on the official site. Don't look for Hunter or Jones: "One scenario discussed internally is moving Matt Kemp to center field, Juan Pierre to left and targeting a third baseman through a trade." Cabrera and Beltre top his wish list.
2007-10-22 13:09:18
168.   Bluebleeder87
167

I just read it, who would the Dodgers give up to get Miguel Cabrera?? I'm thinking we're gonna have to settle for Beltre judging from Ken Gurnik, his contract ain't all that bad now a days.

2007-10-22 13:10:25
169.   old dodger fan
167 What would we have to give up for Beltre? I assume LaRoche would be part of it. Then what do we do with Nomar? Park him on the bench? That would surprise me.
2007-10-22 13:12:57
170.   silverwidow
Gurnick is the one beat writer for the Dodgers whose opinions are pretty much worthless.

His intolerance for rookie struggles are especially disgusting (read: Andy LaRoche).

2007-10-22 13:15:14
171.   D4P
What would we have to give up for Beltre? I assume LaRoche would be part of it. Then what do we do with Nomar? Park him on the bench? That would surprise me.

LaRoche and Loney for Beltre.

Nomar at first, Beltre at third.

Problem solved.

Give that man (Ned) a contract extension!

2007-10-22 13:15:57
172.   kinbote
i will give serious thought to boycotting the 2008 season if pierre is our opening day lf.

as for nomar, he's currently the only player we have who can back up 1b.

2007-10-22 13:16:50
173.   silverwidow
LaRoche and Loney for Beltre.

I hope this is sarcastic.

2007-10-22 13:18:40
174.   kinbote
gurnick whiffed on the martin question. there are plenty of incentives to locking up a young pre-arb. player. we know so little of success we've forgotten its ways . . .
2007-10-22 13:22:00
175.   Ken Noe
169 Gurnick's take is exactly that Nomar either can be the new Tomato of the bench, or ask for a trade. But he won't be a starter.
2007-10-22 13:32:36
176.   Jon Weisman
166 - I expected there was more integrity to your take on the situation than his.
2007-10-22 13:47:00
177.   StolenMonkey86
171 - Bill Bavasi trading with Ned Colletti. Battle of the Brains.
2007-10-22 14:22:56
178.   Marty
The rare double post by a Toaster blogger up in the right-hand corner.
2007-10-22 14:27:37
179.   Bob Timmermann
178
Servers are hiccuping all over the Centennial State.

I wonder how come it took 25 hours for someone to realize that I had a misspelled word in a headline on the Griddle.

It's been fixed.

2007-10-22 14:31:42
180.   D4P
I wonder how come it took 25 hours for someone to realize that I had a misspelled word in a headline on the Griddle

As of late, misspelled words have been right up your ally...

2007-10-22 14:39:22
181.   Jon Weisman
NPUT

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