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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
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Looking to Japan
2007-11-07 07:20
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

The Dodgers plan to bid for 32-year-old Japanese free agent pitcher Hiroki Kuroda, "a control pitcher with a fastball in the 95-mph range who projects as a middle-of-the-rotation starter," according to Tony Jackson of the Daily News:

Kuroda considered coming to America a year ago before ultimately signing a four-year, 1.2 billion yen contract (about $10 million U.S.) to remain with the Carp. But that deal included an escape clause after the first year, which Kuroda chose to exercise.

Because he is officially a free agent, Kuroda is exempt from the posting system that cost the Boston Red Sox $51.1 million up front last winter simply for the right to negotiate with Daisuke Matsuzaka, whom they eventually signed for six years and an additional $52 million. Kuroda, whose talent is comparable to just about any free-agent pitcher on this year's market, is expected to command a three-year contract worth between $21 million and $24 million.

Dodgers general manager Ned Colletti declined to comment on his club's intentions because he wasn't sure how baseball's anti-tampering rules might apply to this situation. But the Dodgers are expected to have plenty of competition, with the Seattle Mariners rumored to be the early favorites to land the pitcher.

Teams can begin negotiating with Kuroda on Nov. 14. Phone messages left for Joe Urbon and Steve Hilliard, the agents from San Diego-based Octagon Baseball who are representing Kuroda, were not returned.

Kuroda is 103-89 with a 3.69 ERA in 11 seasons, all with the Carp, and he has a remarkable 74 complete games in 244 career starts. He is said to favor Seattle because pitching to countryman Kenji Johjima, the Mariners' primary catcher, would make for an easier transition. But the Dodgers also have a prominent Japanese player in closer Takashi Saito, who is said to have a close friendship with Kuroda. Saito also is an Octagon client.

One wonders whether the Dodgers will have any interest in another Japanese free agent, 30-year-old outfielder Kosuke Fukudome, who OPSed .963 last season before having his season curtailed by surgery to remove bone fragments in his elbow. Fukudome was the 2006 Central League MVP.

* * *

Josh Wilker of Cardboard Gods wraps up his "Yazmobile" series with a whopper of a finish. If you want to see great literature in the making, keep checking out Wilker's site.

Comments (129)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-11-07 07:31:48
1.   Bob Timmermann
I've heard the Cubs connected with both players and Kuroda most frequently.
2007-11-07 07:34:27
2.   Xeifrank
is Fukudome available this year or next?
vr, Xei
2007-11-07 07:37:12
3.   uke
figured out what NPUT is... slow, but I got it.
2007-11-07 07:37:40
4.   D4P
Kuroda, whose talent is comparable to just about any free-agent pitcher on this year's market, is expected to command a three-year contract worth between $21 million and $24 million.

If there's a lot of competition for him, I'd have to think he'll "command" more than that.

2007-11-07 07:44:37
5.   Bob Timmermann
2
Fukudome is a free agent this year.
2007-11-07 07:44:50
6.   bearlurker
Apologies if this already has been discussed, but I just read Ken Rosenthal's column in which he writes that the Dodgers are a possible destination for Troy Glaus.

Seems like an awful idea to me, give me Arod or Laroche, accept no substitutes.

http://tinyurl.com/38lgoh

2007-11-07 07:45:01
7.   Bill Crain
Apparently Timmermann is still crying out:
"I am not a number. I am a free man."

LogikReader is Number 2 at the moment. How soon will Frank Robinson be telling Bob,
"I'm the new number 2"?

No worries, Frank won't be wanting any information... by hook or by crook.

It takes a village.

2007-11-07 07:45:43
8.   Bob Timmermann
5
http://www.japanball.com/news.phtml?id=11009
2007-11-07 07:46:20
9.   bearlurker
Shouldn't Ned know how the anti-tampering rules apply? If I was Ned, I would have said no comment or nothing at all.
2007-11-07 07:46:41
10.   PadreJeremy
The Kai Igawa signing alone should make teams shy away from these Jap pitchers. Even Matsuzaka was overpaid.

If you really want to consider signing a Japanese pitcher, his market value is really only half of what everyone seems to say it is.

Id rather have a minimum salary rookie pitcher with the 8 million for this guy going towards a Arod contract or to pay another team to take Pierre.

2007-11-07 07:50:24
11.   LogikReader
OG Number 2 checking in...

Wow, more mating dances for PVL. Well, as long as NedCo has to do something it might as well be trying to load up more mediocre pitching.

Not a fan of the Troy Glaus rumors.

2007-11-07 07:53:08
12.   Andrew Shimmin
Wow.
2007-11-07 07:56:32
13.   Bill Crain
ARONS includes a little-known opt-out clause for the pursuit of Japanese starters.

I'm guessing someone somewhere is even now preparing to post this guy's MLEs. I don't even know which hand he throws with.

2007-11-07 07:57:09
14.   godvls
Hmmm....
2007-11-07 08:00:24
15.   gpellamjr
kkkkk
2007-11-07 08:00:36
16.   Disabled List
Is Fukudome a player or a stadium?
2007-11-07 08:03:12
17.   ToyCannon
10
Saito, Nomo, and Okajima would tend to disagree.
2007-11-07 08:09:43
18.   LogikReader
17

...but let's not forget about Ishii and Arabu. These signings can go either way.

Dice-K is somewhere in between

2007-11-07 08:14:25
19.   therickdaddy
Matsuzaka could explode next year, and I bet he does. It takes a while to get accustomed to new surroundings, occasionally.

By the way, does anyone have any thoughts on Greenspun resigning the same day Torre was hired? Seems strange since Greenspun was the CFO in New York for a while.

2007-11-07 08:25:53
20.   regfairfield
Dice-K is great. A 4.4 ERA at Fenway is a very respectable number (the best pitchers in baseball only project to around a 3.90 ERA there). Combine that with a nine per nine strikeout rate and I don't see how he can be considered a failure by any measure.
2007-11-07 08:26:22
21.   uke
19 - We were discussing the Greenspun issue yesterday but came up with nothing.
2007-11-07 08:31:49
22.   therickdaddy
21 - Thanks. I also see a quote from Penny in today's Bill P column that surprised me. Evidently, Penny thought that the youngsters were tuning Little out.

I'm excited about Torre coming in here. I know we're not supposed to be talking about him anymore, but he got McCourt to pay Bowa/Mattingly 400k each LOL. Insane. And is it true that this is Colletti's last contract year? Yikes.

2007-11-07 08:39:16
23.   Gen3Blue
The D's have had pretty good luck with pitching talent from Japan. I'd be very interested if anyone has looked into how stats translate between the two leagues or what type of pitcher makes the transition best.
2007-11-07 08:40:44
24.   LogikReader
unrelated but:

I still miss how Ross Porter used to call Ishii "eee-shee". As years go by I miss more and more things about Ross Porter.

2007-11-07 08:40:48
25.   Bob Timmermann
16
There is a Fukuoka Dome. But Fukudome doesn't play there.

In Japan "Fukuoka Dome" is pronounced as if it were an English phrase. "Fukudome" however you pronounce each letter.
"Foo-koo-doh-meh"

2007-11-07 08:43:01
26.   Bob Timmermann
244
But Ross was getting pretty close. In "Ishii", you are trying to hold the final vowel sound longer. But a Japanese long vowel sounds very short to American ears.
2007-11-07 08:49:55
27.   uke
24 - Ross Porter is back on the radio. He does some piece on 570am (in LA) everyday around noon (I think). It was great to hear his voice...
2007-11-07 08:54:55
28.   natepurcell
Kuroda sounds intriging. If the Dodgers can get Kuroda for around 3yrs 21-24 mil, I wouldn't be opposed to it.
2007-11-07 08:56:17
29.   D4P
If the Dodgers can get Kuroda for around 3yrs 21-24 mil, I wouldn't be opposed to it

At the very least, he's not likely to be worse than Loaiza for 7 mils.

2007-11-07 08:56:58
30.   CanuckDodger
Just how many starting pitchers do we need? Penny, Lowe, Billingsley, Schmidt, and Loaiza. That's a rotation that costs as much money as the entire payrolls of some teams. I hear people say "We can't count on Schmidt," but unless we know for sure he WON'T be ready by April, surely we have to plan around the fact that with his salary he is in the rotation for sure. We also owe too much money to Loaiza to do anything else with him. So, really, we're set. And if Schmidt is a question mark, obviously he has to be replacable by somebody we can stash in Triple A just in case Schmidt IS ready, which means D.J. Houlton or his type and certainly not a big money pitcher.
2007-11-07 09:01:24
31.   TellMeTheScoreRickMonday
How could you leave a team named the Carp? (even for the Dodgers)
2007-11-07 09:03:55
32.   natepurcell
30

That works but last year showed that starting pitching is always in need. Kershaw, McDonald and Elbert are our best impact arms in the high minors and all of them probably need all of 2008 in the minors.

I personally would re-sign Wolf to a smaller, incentive based 1 year deal and go after Kuroda. If I could accomplish those two things then I would leave the pitching alone for the rest of the offseason.

If by some miracle all those starting pitchers stay healthy and are effective in their roles, then we are just that much deeper in the bullpen.

2007-11-07 09:05:34
33.   Bluebleeder87
From everything I've read Loaiza had back issues last year, if he stays healthy next year I'm sure he'll put up good #'s.
2007-11-07 09:08:29
34.   dzzrtRatt
Does Rosenthal even copy-edit what he writes?

First, about Miguel Cabrera:

The Yankees are likely to pursue Marlins third baseman Miguel Cabrera, but the Red Sox and especially the Dodgers appear to match up better with the Marlins. The Dodgers could offer Matt Kemp, satisfying the Marlins' need for a center fielder. The Red Sox could offer Jacoby Ellsbury, the Yankees Melky Cabrera.

A few grafs down, about Glaus:

Glaus is one of several possibilities for the Dodgers, but the Jays believe they would lose too much even if they received third baseman Andy LaRoche and a quality young pitcher in return . . .

In Rosenthal-land, Troy Glaus is worth LaRoche and a "quality young pitcher," presumably McDonald or Meloan; but Cabrera is worth Matt Kemp straight across.

I don't know, but that seems to suggest that Glaus, nearing the end of his prime if he hasn't already passed it, is worth as much or maybe a little more than Cabrera, who is not only better, period, but is younger and will probably cost a little less in the short run.

Meanwhile, Garrett Atkins is said to be irreplaceable.

So, in Rosenthal's world Atkins > Glaus > Cabrera.

2007-11-07 09:08:34
35.   regfairfield
33 I'd count more on Estaban Loaiza numbers.

Now that Schilling's gone, the only other pitcher that might be a fit is Wolf, but giving Hendrickson arbitration seems more in character for Ned. Still, we should have at least six starters on the active roster on opening day (Kuo), so I can't imagine how much more you can add.

2007-11-07 09:12:41
36.   silverwidow
Hendy should be non-tendered. There is no justification to keeping a horrible starter and mediocre reliever at $3M plus.
2007-11-07 09:14:28
37.   Bluebleeder87
Looking at Loaiza's #'s he's a good 5th starter & good for 10 or 12 W's, I will say he's had healthy issues the last 2 years though.
2007-11-07 09:16:59
38.   CanuckDodger
30 -- So you want Penny, Lowe, Schmidt, Loaiza, Kuroda, and Wolf? Unless two of them get injured at the same time, I guess it's back to the bullpen for Billingsley, or Triple A. Look, no MLB team can stockpile SIX veteran starters who have no chance of being sent to the bullpen or Triple A, and no team that has Billingsley should even have FIVE of those guys. Your depth HAS to be fringe guys who can be sent to Triple A -- Houlton or Stults -- or real prospects, and Joe Torre's team last year used plenty of Double A, and even high A, starting pitching prospects when they had to.
2007-11-07 09:19:39
39.   Bluebleeder87
37 -That should be, He has had health issues the last 2 years.
2007-11-07 09:20:02
40.   Dark Horse
Honestly, given the fact we're not going to sign A-Rod--that's a fantasy we should give up on, right now--I'd be happy so sign Kuroda. I think that's a great idea, and it keeps us from counting on Schmidt/Loiaza more than we should. I fully expect the worst from both of those guys, and Kuroda's probably the best pitcher we could acquire without giving anything up. So good.

It's the "impact bat" that scares me: the Glaus, the Lowell, the not-A-Rod-or-Cabrera Ned is bound to give up too much for. Kuroda would be great, unto himself.

2007-11-07 09:20:17
41.   silverwidow
38 Wolf should only be a fallback option. I don't expect him to be here if Kuroda is signed.
2007-11-07 09:25:09
42.   regfairfield
Just make sure Kuroda's out pitch isn't a high change up.
2007-11-07 09:27:19
43.   regfairfield
I do agree that we shouldn't sign any more starters. Kuo and Stulton should provide a decent enough stop gap until Kershaw and McDonald are ready.
2007-11-07 09:28:20
44.   CanuckDodger
And I forgot about Kuo. So we've got Penny, Lowe, Billingsley, Schmidt, Loaiza, Kuo, Houlton, and Stults -- and knowing Colletti, Hendrickson too -- and STILL we are looking at throwing a whole bunch of money into starting pitching? The only way it makes sense is if they have decided to trade Loaiza or they know FOR SURE that Schmidt can't pitch next year.
2007-11-07 09:28:45
45.   Greg Brock
38 So you assume Schmidt will contribute from the get go? I'm not disagreeing, I just don't have the first clue, though I'd bet against it.

Why wouldn't you hedge your bets, sign another good starter, and trade one away if Schmidt is in tip-top form?

2007-11-07 09:30:36
46.   Jon Weisman
http://www.sonsofstevegarvey.com/2007/11/in-case-you-need-help-visualizing.html

I believe someone mentioned this in the past thread, but Murray Chass of the NYT puts the Angels and Giants as the leading candidates to get A-Rod, with the Dodgers the only other likely contender. If the Yankees, Mets, Red Sox and Cubs aren't in on the bidding, it tremendously increases the possibility for him going to the state of California.

2007-11-07 09:32:33
47.   regfairfield
45 Problem is that there are no more good starters. Because of that, I can't see Wolf getting any kind of discount.
2007-11-07 09:33:37
48.   Andrew Shimmin
I wouldn't tear my hair out if Hammes had to start a game or two, in a pinch.
2007-11-07 09:33:41
49.   bearlurker
I'd like to resign Wolf and pass on Kuroda, but why would either one want to sign with the Dodgers when there's not a rotation slot open?
2007-11-07 09:37:39
50.   regfairfield
48 I think we'd go to Orenduff before Hammes.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-11-07 09:39:11
51.   kinbote
44 the doomsday scenario is that we trade billingsley to florida for miguel cabrera, opening up a rotation spot.
2007-11-07 09:43:16
52.   Penarol1916
34. I'm going to be charitable to Rosenthal and assume that he meant that the centerpiece of the deal has to be a centerfielder, not that the deal would be straight-up for a centerfielder, thus the Red Sox and Dodgers are at an advantage.
2007-11-07 09:43:17
53.   Andrew Shimmin
50- Sold. Either would be preferable to Hendrickson. They would have been last year, too. Both need to be protected from the rule five draft, right? So it's not like using them would screw up some fancy roster management theory.
2007-11-07 09:43:45
54.   StolenMonkey86
25 - good to know that we're not bidding on a potential rule 1 violation.
2007-11-07 09:45:25
55.   regfairfield
53 Yep, Orenduff will be on the 40 man this year.
2007-11-07 09:45:39
56.   D4P
Either would be preferable to Hendrickson

As would Ethier.

2007-11-07 09:47:53
57.   Dark Horse
45-Precisely. And we've been ignoring Kuo in this discussion for a reason. Even a far less conservative GM than Colletti would bank upon Kuo for precisely nothing.

Of course, the key distinction here is a good starter, but Kuroda doesn't look too shabby. Beats Kyle Lohse.

2007-11-07 09:48:04
58.   dzzrtRatt
40 Honestly, given the fact we're not going to sign A-Rod--that's a fantasy we should give up on, right now...

Relying on the same source Jon mentions in 46 , I think A-Rod is in no way a fantasy for the Dodgers. If the Yankees are truly out of the running, and if every other team except the Angels and Giants have said publicly they're not interested, Boras is looking at a very different marketplace than I'm sure he anticipated. At the end of the day, A-Rod will be the best paid player in the MLB, but not by the wide margin Boras demanded, and not with the years either. At $25 million for 6 years, say, don't you think the Dodgers might go for it?

At the very least, Boras needs the Dodgers to stay in the picture to keep the price from crashing. He's not looking forward to comparing offers from SF and Anaheim.

The coverage of this story, in which Chass and others have asked GMs to publicly take a position on ARod, has limited Boras' maneuvering room significantly. For him to get what he wants, either the Yankees have to flip, or a team like the Cubs, Mets or Tigers. But they all sound pretty persuasive about not wanting to go that route, so even if they change their minds later, they would retain the upper hand.

I know, I know. Boras is infallible. Boras is Houdini. But right now, he looks vulnerable.

2007-11-07 09:51:04
59.   Andrew Shimmin
55- You think Hammes is going to be left unprotected? Are you a Hammes hater? Reveal yourself!
2007-11-07 09:53:29
60.   Sam DC
Radiohead album download results: http://tinyurl.com/2mtqy9

Feel free to guess what percent downloaded for free before looking.

2007-11-07 09:56:11
61.   CajunDodger
44
I hope that I am not treading old ground, but a good plan may be to trade Lowe. If we pick up someone like Kuroda, we get him for 3-4 years as an innings eater, give up no draft picks and we could trade Lowe for a solid prospect or two.

I like Lowe, but in a pitching-starved market, his salary is reasonable and he is a low injury risk...and we won't resign him because he is a Boras guy.

I don't want to give Colletti too much credit, but he may just be preparing to lose Penny and Lowe over the next two years.

2007-11-07 09:57:08
62.   Kevin Lewis
51

If that is all we had to give up, then I would consider it. I feel dirty now

2007-11-07 09:59:02
63.   Giant Hater
I don't post here very often but as an avid reader of Dodgerthoughts, I felt I had to respond to Buster Onley's speculation today about a possible Dodger deal for Miguel Cabrera that would send perhaps Kemp, Kershaw and La Roche to the Marlins in exchange for Cabrera. What freaks me out about ANY deal for Cabrera is the fact the kid has gained roughly 70 pounds in the last 4 years-and he's only 24. I he is one of the most talented hitters in the game but 70 pounds? What is he going to look like in another 4 years? He doesn't seem like a NL type of player to me-his defense is just atrocious. Does any trade for him make sense if you are the Dodgers?
2007-11-07 10:00:04
64.   kinbote
62 i only mention it because i can see nedco being tempted. of course, he'd have to include laroche and _____ too, but bills would be the centerpiece.

honestly, nobody but martin [& torre] are untouchable right now.

2007-11-07 10:00:07
65.   CanuckDodger
Hammes has already been taken off the 40-man roster. I think the Dodgers are anticipating that his 2007 season was bad enough that no team is going to take him in the Rule 5 draft, or if he is taken, he will likely fail to stick on a 25-man roster.
2007-11-07 10:00:27
66.   Kevin Lewis
60

You have to figure in the fact that Radiohead made more on this than any percentage they would have taken through a record company. I think it is great for music.

2007-11-07 10:00:32
67.   CajunDodger
62
Again, I may be treading old ground, but according to Buster Olney, the Marlins have demanded the following from the Dodgers for Cabrera: LaRoche, Kershaw, and an outfielder "like Matt Kemp".

Not sure who else is "like Kemp" unless they want both Ethier and Young, but that sure is steep even for a bat like Cabrera's.

2007-11-07 10:00:33
68.   Greg Brock
61 I don't know why we'd trade sinkerball pitcher, who always takes the ball, pitches tons of innings, and is above league average at 9 million dollars.

Trading Derek Lowe would not be a prudent move.

2007-11-07 10:01:29
69.   still bevens
58 I thought the Mets mentioned they were interested. I can see them offering up a huge chunk of change for A-Rod.
2007-11-07 10:01:31
70.   uke
Interesting article on Arod's worth compared to other high price players. Worth checking out...

http://tinyurl.com/2mnllx

2007-11-07 10:01:33
71.   Kevin Lewis
64

That makes it much harder to swallow. Seriously, can we shop Pierre to anyone?

2007-11-07 10:02:17
72.   Daniel Zappala
Why would the Dodgers not be in on the A-Rod sweepstakes, even if Chass is wrong and the price still stays huge? They have lots of young players, plenty of money to spend, and a high likelihood that management considers the existing 3B options to be inadequate. The only reason to stay out seems to be bad blood with Boras, but I'm sure Boras will not let that get in the way. I'm equally sure that if Colletti is given the go-ahead to spend the money, then he will be more than happy to make the spash.
2007-11-07 10:02:33
73.   kinbote
63 the biggest problem with cabrera is that he's a 1b (or DH) waiting to happen. 1b is covered with loney, so we'd be banking on his ability to play 3b or lf long-term.
2007-11-07 10:02:51
74.   uke
Oh Still, the Mets have said they are going to sit down with Boras to see what he , er, Arod wants.
2007-11-07 10:03:22
75.   CajunDodger
64
I would also say that Loney is in that territory since his name just doesn't make it on the rumors page.
2007-11-07 10:05:54
76.   Johnson
46 If the real suitors for ARod are that few (Giants, Angels, maybe Dodgers), he might not only be attainable but attainable at price far below what Boras wants to command (which, for the Yankees, was apparently 10/$350M to sit at the table).

SF can't bring much to the table but money - and they're already paying Barry Zito something like $17M/year until he retires. Plus, they've already tried tying up all of their salary in one superstar and it didn't work even when they had Schmidt and Kent in their prime (OK, it almost worked once). Are they willing to do that again? Is ARod wiling to take that chance?

That leaves the Angels, and some have said that Moreno is leery of putting too much salary in one player. Doesn't mean he won't put out an offer, though.

But with the way salary sheds off our books in the next few years, ARod might be affordable for us - especially if the kids come through. I suppose the only question is how an ARod contract would affect our ability to buy out their arbitration years and extend them. But I'm not sure that offering ARod 7 years, $210M with a TEAM option for three more years (@ $30-35M each, one option for 3 years, not three options for 1 each) would be unreasonable...and if interest is as low as suggested, might it be the best offer?

2007-11-07 10:09:07
77.   Andrew Shimmin
65- I didn't know that. Rats. Don't they realize that players named Zach Hammes don't grow on trees?

If Kemp were sent away in a Cabrera deal, there'd be an OF slot open. It looks like his LF defense wasn't good even two years ago, though.

2007-11-07 10:10:56
78.   natepurcell
Players on the Dodgers who hit over .330 over an extended period of time should not be allowed to be traded.

That should be rule 13.

2007-11-07 10:12:22
79.   CajunDodger
77
...and that would leave us with a still-gaping hole at third, but without LaRoche possibly filling the need.
2007-11-07 10:13:40
80.   ToyCannon
78
Players with a lifetime EQA over 320 who are 24 and have already played over 600 games make exceptions to rule 13 when they become available.
2007-11-07 10:13:43
81.   Andrew Shimmin
79- That's where A-Rod would play. Didn't you get Steve Phillips's memo?
2007-11-07 10:15:43
82.   ToyCannon
I can't believe were talking about Miggy when the Clippers are 3-0:)
2007-11-07 10:17:33
83.   CajunDodger
81
Oh that's right...Phillips said all we have to do is get ARod, Santana, and Miggy. See, that's the kind of thinking that made him so successful with the Mets.
2007-11-07 10:19:59
84.   dzzrtRatt
74 I suppose we could let the Mets sign A-Rod and then trade them Lowe and LaRoche for David Wright.
2007-11-07 10:20:25
85.   CajunDodger
On a different topic, has anyone seen Rule 11 invoked? I think that I have seen nearly all the others (and I have been to the principal's office a few times for Rule 1), but never 11.
2007-11-07 10:20:44
86.   KG16
Before any move is made with respect to the starting rotation, we need to know what the situation is with Kuo and Schmidt. If neither of those guys are ready to go at the start of the season (or for a while), then the Dodgers have 4 starters: Penny, Billingsly, Lowe, and Loaiza. If Kuo and/or Schmidt are ready to go by May, then I say go get a spot starter/long reliever type to be the 5th man for the first two months.

I'm officially staking out the position, now, that the price for Caberra is too high. I don't like the idea that the Bums would have to sell the farm to get him.

2007-11-07 10:21:25
87.   kinbote
everyone relax. i just freed up some salary space by trading furcal for sean marshall over on Cub Town ;)
2007-11-07 10:21:27
88.   regfairfield
85 It was created to deal with one specific case and I don't think it's come up since.
2007-11-07 10:23:27
89.   CajunDodger
According to MLBTraderumors.com

"Finally, the Rockies have an eye on Brett Tomko to fill a swingman role."

Tomko...Coors...That's just comedy right there.

2007-11-07 10:24:02
90.   Andrew Shimmin
Considering the fates of Hamulack and Hammes, Colletti may be bigoted against Porcine Americans. Does not portend well for a Cabrera acquisition.
2007-11-07 10:24:04
91.   LogikReader
85

In my first days on DT, I made error after error during a drowsy late night session. I confused Kuo with Hu, among other things. Folks jokingly reminded me of Rule 11.

Otherwise, no, it's never happened much.

2007-11-07 10:25:53
92.   Bluebleeder87
60

I over heard the figures yesterday on KROQ & they kind of don't surprised me. I was a little surprised but what do you expect.

2007-11-07 10:25:55
93.   D4P
90
Evidence to the contrary:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=4057

2007-11-07 10:27:24
94.   CajunDodger
I wonder if the all-you-can-eat Olmedo Saenz Pavillion will be a lure for Miggy Cabrera...
2007-11-07 10:30:36
95.   Andrew Shimmin
Also, Cabrera's Venezuelan, so he wouldn't meet the Porcine American requirement. Unless he's a naturalized citizen. How common is it for foreign players to take American citizenship? I wonder if it's gone up since dealing with Customs got so much more painful.
2007-11-07 10:33:25
96.   Greg Brock
I wonder how LaRoche could be the centerpiece of any deal for Cabrera. The club has talked about a "gaping hole" at third base, brought him up and benched him after 44 AB's, sent him back down, and talked about his cocky attitude.

I mean, it's not like the Dodgers have done a great job propping the kid up.

2007-11-07 10:38:01
97.   regfairfield
96 Other organizations are smarter than us?
2007-11-07 10:38:44
98.   D4P
96
Ned: This LaRoche kid's an amazing hitter, and a great third baseman. You should want him a lot.
Marlins: Then why don't you want him?
Ned: Uhh...
2007-11-07 10:41:52
99.   D4P
Trading LaRoche will be particularly unacceptable if it leaves Nomar and some other scrub as our third basemen.
2007-11-07 10:42:45
100.   CanuckDodger
I am surprised nobody commented on something somebody posted in the last thread, a report that the Red Sox are trying to trade for Andy LaRoche. If true, shouldn't that send a big message to Colletti, and McCourt? The team that just won the World Series, and whose third baseman won the World Series MVP, thinks Andy LaRoche is, right NOW, a good replacement for Mike Lowell. Sometimes I get the feeling that every team in baseball has a more accurate grasp on how good our young players are than Colletti. The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence. We have no more business shopping for a third baseman than we do another veteran starting pitcher.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2007-11-07 10:43:16
101.   natepurcell
Seriously though. If Colletti is hellbent on trading the kids, he is doing a horrible job of keeping their stock up to other teams.

Every compliment about the kids always seem to include some sort of negative as well.

2007-11-07 10:44:15
102.   Humma Kavula
Miguel Cabrera is a great ballplayer. I would be happy to root for him. But you have to give up players and money to get him, and you only have to give up money to get A-Rod.

A-Rod or Nobody! Sing it loud and proud! A-Rod or Nobody!

2007-11-07 10:46:03
103.   ToyCannon
96
I don't think they have hurt his value any. When he came up early in the year it became obvious that he was playing hurt when you consider how he went off after his DL stint. The reality is that he never should have been promoted in May and should have been on the DL. He's only ranked behind Longoria as far as positional prospects go and he's splitting time with Longoria at 3b for Team USA. Any hit to his value is strictly because of his back and shoulder problems and has nothing to do with how the Dodgers have handled him.
2007-11-07 10:46:58
104.   LogikReader
100

Canuck, here's a similar trade that was rumored a year ago, enjoy:

Dodgers, Red Sox Meet On Manny (12/4/06)

Ken Rosenthal reports that the Red Sox and Dodgers met late last night to discuss a possible Manny Ramirez trade. Rosenthal speculates that a package of Brad Penny, Andy LaRoche, and James Loney could get it done.

Wow, how bad would that have been for the Dodgers?

http://tinyurl.com/28uaep

2007-11-07 10:48:09
105.   Andrew Shimmin
Money and a draft pick. The Yankees announced they'd offer arbitration, which was never really in question, I don't think.
2007-11-07 10:49:10
106.   ToyCannon
God forbid that every comment be 100% lauditory.
2007-11-07 10:51:48
107.   natepurcell
So why are the Yankees allowed to offer arbitration when a Boras client opts out and the Dodgers weren't allowed to?
2007-11-07 10:53:42
108.   ToyCannon
Bronx Banter is doing movie talk.
2007-11-07 10:53:52
109.   regfairfield
107 If I had to guess, teams didn't care nearly as much about losing their draft picks back in 2000, so it wasn't seen as a determent to getting him signed.
2007-11-07 10:56:43
110.   CanuckDodger
106 -- That is Colletti's style when talking about the vets, isn't it? How about some consistency? You don't hear him admitting Pierre has no power and no arm strength, or that Kent has the range of a refrigerator at second base. No, for the vets, it is all positive, all the time.
2007-11-07 10:58:00
111.   ToyCannon
So this makes this year an even better year to sign the only FA we will need for the next 5 years. From this point on we will always lose a number one. That is the optimistic side of my mouth speaking.
2007-11-07 10:58:10
112.   Jon Weisman
Press release:

DODGERS NAME DENNIS MANNION
CHIEF OPERATING OFFICER

Executive brings experience from all four Major League sports including the Philadelphia Phillies and Baltimore Ravens

LOS ANGELES, CA – The Los Angeles Dodgers today named veteran sports executive Dennis Mannion to the position of Chief Operating Officer.

Mannion, 48, has been Senior Vice President/Business Ventures for the Baltimore Ravens since December, 1999. Before joining the Ravens, he worked as the Senior Vice President of Ascent Sports, owners of the NBA's Denver Nuggets, the NHL's Colorado Avalanche and the Pepsi Center. Mannion spent 16 years (1982-1997) with the Philadelphia Phillies, for whom he served the last eight years as Vice President/Marketing. ...

Mannion, who has the rare distinction of having experience in all four Major League sports, will oversee the club's traditional business operations, including corporate sponsorships, ticket sales, retail operations, concessions, broadcasting, and other revenue streams. Mannion will also coordinate the club's integrated marketing efforts. He has been part of two World Series (1983 and 1993 with the Phillies), an All-Star Game, an NHL Conference Championship and a Super Bowl (with the Ravens). ...

Mannion will be relocating with his wife, Pam, and five children to California.

2007-11-07 10:59:19
113.   kinbote
i'd love to hear joe torre's thoughts on nomar. i can see torre going to bat for nomar as the club's starting 3b.
2007-11-07 10:59:21
114.   natepurcell
There is a double standard there with Vets compared to the younger players.

You could argue that Vets have earned that double standard base on past accomplishments but I don't agree with it since its still a what have you done for me lately industry.

2007-11-07 10:59:27
115.   ToyCannon
110
At True Blue you do.
2007-11-07 11:00:36
116.   ToyCannon
122
That was quick. Did they contact him while the other VP was still under contract? TJ Simers should get to the bottom of this.
2007-11-07 11:02:34
117.   LogikReader
112

Awesome! PVL for the front office!

I'm just kidding. It's so fascinating how Dodger Thoughts ascertained the thought of letting baseball people do the baseball operations, and then two days later, McCourt does exactly that.

2007-11-07 11:02:52
118.   JoeyP
104---That package is laughingly bad. Not even Colletti is dumb enough to give up Penny, Loney, LaRoche for a on his downside Man-Ram.

I think if the Dodgers can trade Kemp+McDonald+LaRoche for Miguel Cabrera you have to take that deal.

Kemp did great sure...But if the Dodgers dont play him in CF, he loses a ton of value. That, and the fact he has trouble walking and his early comps resemble Juan Encarnacion..

Cabrera's a hall of famer, in his prime. His eating hasnt affected his hitting. If the Dodgers are going into "win now", or "trade Kemp" mode---going after Miguel Cabrera would be the right way to go about it.

I'd rather trade Kemp for Cabrera, bc Miggy still wont be a free agent for a while. Dont use any prospects on Johan, since Johan can be signed after 2008.

Trade Kemp/McDonald/LaRoche for Miggy.
Sign A-Rod.
Just say no to every single average mediocre innings eater on the market.

Lineup:
Martin, C
Loney, 1b
A-Rod, 3b
Miggy, LF
Kent, 2b
Ethier, RF
Furcal, SS
Pierre, CF

Then Print the playoff tickets.

Offseason is fun right?!

2007-11-07 11:05:04
119.   Daniel Zappala
I love this comment from Jerry Crasnick on ESPN regarding where Barry Bonds will end up. He surveyed GMs, and one said he'd sign with the Tokyo Yomiuri Giants:

Three respondents predicted that Bonds will retire, and one executive said he'll be "in jail."

Incidentally, 7 out of 15 GMs think A-Rod will sign with the Angels. Two think Dodgers, and one thinks either the Dodgers or Angels.

2007-11-07 11:06:36
120.   JoeyP
Trade Nomar to the Angels for a B-level prospect after getting Miggy/A-Rod too.
2007-11-07 11:06:59
121.   LogikReader
117

Well this isn't quite what I was meant... but the idea is, having a new COO should hopefully give Frank and Jamie fewer things to worry about.

And maybe we can revive COOL A COOS!!!

2007-11-07 11:08:35
122.   Jon Weisman
121 - So Cool-a-coo was an acronym??

New post up top.

2007-11-07 11:09:31
123.   LogikReader
My argument for A-Rod on the Angels:

Let's forget what Moreno said. What could be a better fit? The Angels need an impact bat, they have the money, the market is perfect, and Angel Stadium is just minutes from Scott Boras headquarters (Newport Beach). Clearly the Halos are a contender, the list goes on.

Finally, if nobody else drives the price up, and especially if the Dodgers say "oh we're not getting him," the asking price will be much lower than anticipated.

Hold on just a minute... Arod is 32??

2007-11-07 11:12:49
124.   Bluebleeder87
Cabrera's a hall of famer, in his prime. His eating hasnt affected his hitting.

It hasn't affected his hitting YET! The guy is 24 & is already over weight, you really have to be eating unhealthy food to play a demanding sport & still be chubby. Plus it just looks really bad lack of discipline bad! man, you guys should have seen him during the winter leauge, ugh!

ps He is an awesome hitter but the lack of discipline will catch up to him, bank on it.

2007-11-07 11:23:58
125.   Paul Scott
85 I tried to get it invoked once during a %&#@ no-hitter, but my opinion was not allowed.
2007-11-07 11:26:25
126.   JL25and3
How can commenting on a free agent possibly be construed as tampering?

107 I believe Drew's contract specifically said that the Dodgers couldn't offer arbitration.

2007-11-07 11:31:15
127.   MC Safety
113- I would honestly want to take a bat to Torre or anyone else for that matter whom felt it was in their best interest to go to bat for Nomore Garciapopup.
2007-11-07 12:05:20
128.   Foolsgold
I am for signing Arod, but can't give him 10 yr contract, he is already 33, how many 43 year 3rd baseman do we know?
2007-11-07 15:28:02
129.   Slipstream
10 A lot of people, me included, find this kind of language offensive.

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