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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Every Little Thing They Done Been Doing ...
2007-11-09 13:00
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

An offseason update of affairs great and small ... starting with the latest news: Russell Martin adds a Silver Slugger award to his Gold Glove.

Roster

  • Chin-hui Tsao, Jason Repko, Yhency Brazoban, Jason Schmidt, Hong-Chih Kuo and Randy Wolf activated from the 60-day disabled list
  • Wolf, Mike Lieberthal and Ramon Martinez file for free agency after team options are bought out
  • Tsao and Zachary Hammes outrighted to AAA Las Vegas
  • Olmedo Saenz, Roberto Hernandez, Chad Moeller and Tim Hamulack become free agents after refusing assignments to Las Vegas
  • Luis Gonzalez, Rudy Seanez, Mark Sweeney, Shea Hillenbrand and David Wells also file for free agency
  • Chan Ho Park signs non-roster contract with an invitation to Spring Training

    Management and coaching

  • Manager Grady Little ankles, replaced by Joe Torre
  • Larry Bowa hired as third-base coach, replacing Rich Donnelly
  • Don Mattingly hired as hitting coach, with Bill Mueller returning to the front office
  • Bench coach Dave Jauss hired by Baltimore Orioles in same role
  • Gene Clines promoted from minor-league outfield/baserunning coordinator to minor-league hitting coordinator

    Front office and staff

  • EVP and COO Marty Greenspun departs, replaced by Dennis Mannion
  • De Jon Watson promoted to assistant general manager, player development
  • Todd Tomczyk promoted to assistant athletic trainer
  • Sue Falsone hired as physical therapist
  • Brendon Huttman hired as strength coach
  • Assistant athletic trainer Stan Johnson dismissed
  • Lon Joyce earns 2007 Distinguished Scout Award

    Broadcasting

  • Dodgers sign multi-year deal with KABC 790 AM
  • Broadcasters Rick Monday and Charley Steiner extend contracts through 2009

    Stadium

  • Field level renovation at Dodger Stadium commences.

    If I'm not mistaken, Tsao had to agree to accept his assignment to Las Vegas rather than become a free agent, which is interesting.

  • Comments (193)
    Show/Hide Comments 1-50
    2007-11-09 14:42:42
    1.   D4P
    Bill Mueller returning to the front office

    Is Mueller still under his initial contract...?

    2007-11-09 14:43:11
    2.   Johnny Nucleo
    With Lieberthal departing via free agency and Moeller in AAA, the suspense builds: who will be the Dodgers backup catcher?
    2007-11-09 14:43:46
    3.   kinbote
    so who had chan ho park in the first-player-added-this-offseason pool?
    2007-11-09 14:46:53
    4.   CajunDodger
    1
    Nope. Finally got him off the payroll. He is probably making much closer to what I make than what he did during his contract with us.
    2007-11-09 14:51:40
    5.   Jon Weisman
    I thought I had read that Moeller had become a free agent, but I couldn't find any evidence online in the few minutes I spent looking.
    2007-11-09 14:58:14
    6.   trainwreck
    5
    It is under the November 2nd news, on Diamond Leung's blog.
    2007-11-09 14:58:56
    7.   Samuel
    5

    It was on Diamond Leung's blog.

    http://tinyurl.com/yoxmfr

    2007-11-09 14:59:49
    8.   Samuel
    bah, trainwreck beat me to it. i shouldn't have spent the time trying to get the tinyurl.
    2007-11-09 15:00:00
    9.   Andrew Shimmin
    I was all set to dispute Little's "ankling," but I looked it up first, and now have no problem. Jon is crafty.

    http://www.variety.com/index.asp?layout=slanguage

    2007-11-09 15:02:08
    10.   CajunDodger
    I thought it was interesting that, according to a link posted on the last thread, the Dodgers have gained $93 million in value each year the McCourts have owned the team.

    The team price seemed awfully low to me when they bought the team, but I had no idea that it would be worth $600 million after only three years.

    2007-11-09 15:03:14
    11.   ToyCannon
    For those complaining that the Angel offer of Kendrick/Wood/Adenhart is not better then Kemp/Laroche/Kershaw your right, but I hope the Marlins would rather have the Angel package. 1st, I'm not sold that I want to trade those 3 guys for two years of Miggy and 2nd it takes the Angels out of the Arod sweepstakes and I think they are the number one competition right now. Boras must be fit to be tied that the Marlins made Miggy available at the same time that Arod came on the Market.
    I don't really expect McCourt to seriously court Arod but anything that helps put him in our pockets keeps a gleam of hope alive.
    2007-11-09 15:03:39
    12.   63Dodger
    SI has a photo gallery of worst free-agent contracts in last 10 years:

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/0711/mlb.worst.free.agent.contracts/content.1.html

    Two are Dodger disasters (Dodger Boy days); Texas and Colorado each make the list twice as well. Also, one of Texas' "worst contracts" is Chan Ho Park...

    2007-11-09 15:05:22
    13.   ToyCannon
    10
    Might be that extra 30Million per team that MLB.com is generating plus the capital expenditures he's made to Dodger stadium. Not that I know jack about how MLB teams are valued.
    2007-11-09 15:06:11
    14.   Ricardo
    "The Angels and Dodgers are regarded as two front-runners in the quest for Cabrera"

    Will Kershaw pitch at least one game for the Dodgers or Ned won´t let this happen?

    Link: http://tinyurl.com/2kehqa

    2007-11-09 15:09:06
    15.   ToyCannon
    12
    At least Kevin Brown paid off for a couple of years compared to most of those guys who got alot of nothing.
    2007-11-09 15:13:14
    16.   LogikReader
    Lessons for life:

    Never sign a fly ball pitcher to a big contract to play in Colorado.

    2007-11-09 15:14:52
    17.   fiddlestick
    2-
    Chad Kreuter's hitching a ride with Chan Ho to ST.
    2007-11-09 15:17:45
    18.   Jon Weisman
    17 - USC's baseball team will feel abandoned :)
    2007-11-09 15:22:07
    19.   jasonungar07
    "We didn't hire Joe Torre to help us finish .500," Colletti said.
    2007-11-09 15:23:40
    20.   trainwreck
    19
    I would hope not since Grady Little did better than that in both seasons.
    2007-11-09 15:23:52
    21.   Gen3Blue
    How did MLB come to have these riciculous gauranteed contracts. Most sports don't effectively have them, and I can think of no industries that enforce a contract when one side can't deliver.
    2007-11-09 15:24:57
    22.   ToyCannon
    21
    Ever heard of the NBA?
    2007-11-09 15:25:10
    23.   Humma Kavula
    17 If anybody sees Chad, please don't mention that I have his cap.
    2007-11-09 15:25:25
    24.   underdog
    Aw, man, Roberto Hernandez isn't coming back?
    :-( Why on earth did the Dodgers ankle him?
    2007-11-09 15:26:41
    25.   jasonungar07
    20 Does he even think before he talks?
    2007-11-09 15:26:53
    26.   Jon Weisman
    21 - I can think of tons of industries where management is forced to fulfill the terms of payment on a contract even if they want to fire someone. I don't think the term "golden parachute" was invented for baseball.

    Football, in my mind, is the exception when it comes to having a contract. And it seems amazing, frankly, given that the punishment football players get puts them in jeopardy every minute.

    2007-11-09 15:27:06
    27.   ToyCannon
    So by the time I rejoin DT next Monday the Clippers will either be 4-2 or the talk of the NBA.
    2007-11-09 15:27:18
    28.   Eric Stephen
    21 NBA contracts are guaranteed.

    The NFL contracts are not all guaranteed, partially a result of having a union much weaker than the MLB players' union.

    2007-11-09 15:28:18
    29.   Humma Kavula
    24 Aw, man, Roberto Hernandez isn't coming back?
    :-( Why on earth did the Dodgers ankle him?

    That is the second definition of "ankle," as in, "to hit in the ankle with a tire iron."

    2007-11-09 15:28:26
    30.   Eric Stephen
    27 Have a nice weekend, ToyCannon!
    2007-11-09 15:30:55
    31.   underdog
    27 And the Warriors could still be winless.
    2007-11-09 15:31:27
    32.   underdog
    29 That was my fantasy several times this past season.
    2007-11-09 15:33:59
    33.   CajunDodger
    26
    I would make the case that if one sport needs guaranteed contracts it's football. I don't get upset when players hold out for better contracts in football because most contracts have very little guaranteed money and the player can be cut by the team if they get hurt with no salary obligation to the player.

    I tend to think that Gene Upshaw is one of the worst union negotiators in any industry.

    2007-11-09 15:34:08
    34.   underdog
    Also, re backup catchers - wasn't there some talk that the Dodgers could still resign Lieberthal? Or are they definitely not bringing him back? Seems like a perfectly good backup backstop to me. Or even Moeller could still be brought back. Or who knows, they could give AJ Ellis a shot.
    2007-11-09 15:35:16
    35.   Gen3Blue
    26,Jon, I think golden parachutes may apply more often to management, and what I'm actually more interested in is that most situations where health or injury intervenes are handled with "disability insurance". Baseball just seems amazingly remote from real life.

    22 unfortunately----yes.

    2007-11-09 15:38:20
    36.   Jon Weisman
    33- I agree.

    35 - Well, obviously a sport where the minimum salary is $400k is remote from real life. But I certainly don't think baseball is some lone exception.

    2007-11-09 15:38:32
    37.   Jon Weisman
    34 - Sure, they might resign him.
    2007-11-09 15:38:46
    38.   trainwreck
    34
    I heard they wanted him back at a lesser price. Torre says he wants to rest Russell more, so our back-up catcher will be a little more important this year.
    2007-11-09 15:38:50
    39.   Eric Stephen
    34 The Dodgers want to bring Lieberthal back, but at a salary of less than $1.3 million (he was due $1.4m minus the $100k option buyout).
    2007-11-09 15:41:22
    40.   Gen3Blue
    I actually agree that football could be a valid exception.
    2007-11-09 15:41:28
    41.   El Lay Dave
    29 Annie Wilkes wants to remind you that the word you are looking for is "hobble".
    2007-11-09 15:41:30
    42.   Benaiah
    What is the best case scenario? The Angels trade for Caberra, the Yankees sign Lowell and the only teams left to compete for A-Rod are the Red Sox (who could have Youk play 3B), the Mets (who have Wright) and the Dodgers. Worse case, the Dodgers sign Torii Hunter, trade Kemp, Billingsley and McDonald for Caberra and pretend to be World Series contenders.

    The only position the Dodgers could seriously upgrade at without A-Rod is CF, and that just isn't going to happen (without seriously downgrading LF anyway). The best way the Dodgers win this offseason is by not playing and saving their chips for 09 when Peavy, Santana, Sheets and Bonderman might be on the market.

    2007-11-09 15:44:10
    43.   LogikReader
    42

    Worst Case scenario: ugh

    I'm saving your scenarios into the queue for recall. Those are well planned out.

    2007-11-09 15:46:30
    44.   Jim Hitchcock
    What's really important to me?

    Come back, Vinny, come back...

    2007-11-09 15:47:33
    45.   Bluebleeder87
    Vizquel agrees to a 1 year contract with the Giants [ http://tinyurl.com/yurcpq ]
    2007-11-09 15:51:32
    46.   trainwreck
    42
    I thought Pedro Feliz was the worst case scenario?
    2007-11-09 15:52:58
    47.   Linkmeister
    9 I think Variety stole that from PG Wodehouse. I recall Bertie Wooster describing one of his movements as ankling.
    2007-11-09 15:53:26
    48.   underdog
    45 Cool. Another year of all-field, no hit short-stopping for the Giants.
    2007-11-09 15:57:46
    49.   bhsportsguy
    46 Right now, I am just hoping no one else gets hurt tonight at Pauley.
    2007-11-09 15:59:34
    50.   bigcpa
    Is 1 year of Kevin Love more valuable than 2 yrs of Miguel Cabrera?
    Show/Hide Comments 51-100
    2007-11-09 16:00:38
    51.   njr
    The more I think about the present situation the deeper the pit gets in my stomach. As much as I like listening to Torre talk, I fear that his signing might be a harbringer of horrible things to come. Everyone from the top down seems to be making it clear that the Torre signing represents the Dodgers wanting to win now. But since it's a manager and not a player, that statement looks hollow if they don't make huge moves, even from a purely PR standpoint.

    I guess I'm saying that given NedCo's history, I will consider it a miracle if two or more of Kemp, Laroche, Billz and Kershaw aren't gone next year.

    If the stories are true, and McCourt stepped in to block Ned from making a big trade at the deadline, what does it say that the Dodgers finished fourth? Is McCourt now seeing the "error" in his ways-- namely, listening to Logan, Ng et al?

    I know this is all speculation, but my gut says be prepared for a worsed case scenario.

    2007-11-09 16:01:32
    52.   trainwreck
    1 year of Kevin Love should bring a championship.

    I do not know if Miguel Cabrera will.

    2007-11-09 16:03:44
    53.   joekings
    I asked this in the last thread but I think everyone had moved on. Is there a glossary for the site? I read it pretty frequently but have not idea what LAT'ed or NPUT means????????
    2007-11-09 16:04:20
    54.   CajunDodger
    46
    I have been on that bandwagon, but I suppose the absolute worst case is a trade for Joe Crede.

    I am not sure why I am so fretful of the kids being traded for nothing. Nothing of the sort has happened so far (though some reporters have indicated that McCourt stopped a Texeria deal earlier this year).

    2007-11-09 16:04:32
    55.   bigcpa
    52 I thought March Madness was a crapshoot!
    2007-11-09 16:04:36
    56.   Humma Kavula
    45 48 Did you guys see the ZIPS projections for the Giants at BBTF?

    http://tinyurl.com/yq4rhe

    When Bonds, um, ankles the Giants, the only Giants who will hit better than a league-average catcher -- yes, catcher -- are Randy Winn, Lance Niekro, Nate Schierholtz, Dave Roberts, and Fred Lewis.

    2007-11-09 16:05:13
    57.   njr
    NPUT= New Post Up Top

    LAT'ed is when a comment is posted just before a new thread starts. Named after LAT because, well...

    2007-11-09 16:06:57
    58.   Eric Stephen
    Speaking of UCLA basketball, I am not a fan (I am a USC fan, but I respect the Bruins and root for them out of conference) so take this with a grain of salt, but I really don't care for their basketball uniforms using the yellow C on the front (to signify 100 NCAA championships). Their basketball uniforms are too classic to be altered in such a way.
    2007-11-09 16:07:18
    59.   CajunDodger
    53
    NPUT=New Post Up Top

    Don't worry, things like that and the mysterious unwritten rule are learned with time here. We are actually very much like a cult in some ways :-)

    2007-11-09 16:07:38
    60.   bhsportsguy
    Do I expect them to try and improve the team, yes I do. From the time I started participating on DT, Miguel Cabrera has been pretty much the one player that there was almost general agreement that the Dodgers should try and get.

    Now that the Marlins, for the first time, is actually shopping him, there is a reluctance to deal, almost hopefulness that the Angels or some other team makes a deal so we can save our kids.

    I am not advocating the Kemp, LaRoche and Kershaw deal, that is too much but I do think that a deal sending 3 really good players could be possible and is something the Dodgers should seriously consider.

    2007-11-09 16:07:47
    61.   Bluebleeder87
    48

    He has such a sweet glove though...

    2007-11-09 16:09:00
    62.   CajunDodger
    57
    It took me a good 3 months before I figured out LAT...too embarrassed to ask.
    2007-11-09 16:09:19
    63.   trainwreck
    55
    It is, but Bruins style of play just beats up on teams during tournament time. And thankfully, we do not have to deal with Florida anymore.

    58
    I do not like it either, thankfully it is just for a year.

    2007-11-09 16:09:19
    64.   LogikReader
    51

    I would venture to say there are key differences between today and other years when we attempted the "win now" philosophy.

    1) The Pitching Staff is better now, top to bottom, than it was from 1999-2002.
    2) In years past it was laughable to argue that the Dodgers were only "a player away." I think this time, the Dodgers can truly be just one player from being a serious contender.
    3) The constant of the last few years was a solid bullpen. That can go a long way.
    4) Even in a worst case scenario, the Dodgers will still have Martin and one of Loney/Kemp. That's pretty good to compete.

    What njr is alluding to is that if NedCo goes for broke (which I don't think will really happen), the Dodgers will be very good for a couple of years but then sink into the same tank the Giants are in.

    That's the cause for our DT paranoia.

    2007-11-09 16:09:21
    65.   bhsportsguy
    58 Many feel that way about the uniforms.
    2007-11-09 16:10:15
    66.   njr
    60

    I think everyone agrees with you, it's just who you define as "really good players", and whether they include are star young pitchers.

    Beyond that I think the hope that someone else makes the deal is an implicit belief that Ned won't get good value for what he gives up, even if what he's getting back is Miggy.

    2007-11-09 16:10:56
    67.   trainwreck
    63
    I should add that anything with a short amount of games is a crap shoot.
    2007-11-09 16:11:28
    68.   LogikReader
    64

    I forgot to add this: there are some actual legitimate players worth shopping for this time around, as opposed to other years. Namely, they are A-Rod, A Jones, and M Cabrera.

    2007-11-09 16:12:16
    69.   Linkmeister
    53 And no, there is no glossary. Like Blanche Dubois, you have to rely on the kindness of strangers. ;)

    Most sites I frequent have an equivalent to LAT'ed, by the way. What with the ease of posting a blog entry, it's not unusual for somebody or somebodies to be merrily responding to the previous post while the blogger is creating a New Post (thus NPUT, merely an initialization for new post up top--not an acronym; acronyms are pronounceable, initializations are not).

    In this case, I think the above scenario happened so frequently to LAT that the phenomenon acquired his screen name as shorthand.

    /end pedantry

    2007-11-09 16:13:52
    70.   joekings
    Thanks, I held out on asking for as long as I could, hoping I could figure it out on my own but my curiosity go the better of my pride.
    2007-11-09 16:14:40
    71.   Bluebleeder87
    60

    I totally agree BHSportguy. But knowing my self I'm gonna be plenty upset that we traded 3 studs but Miggy Cabrera should even out my frustration & I'm sure with do time I'll be glad he is sporting Dodger blue.

    2007-11-09 16:14:48
    72.   Linkmeister
    70 When I was in the business of training people, my first statement was always "The only stupid question is the unasked question."

    Sometimes it took, sometimes it didn't. ;)

    2007-11-09 16:15:50
    73.   CajunDodger
    60
    I would swallow hard, but Kershaw, LaRoche, and a solid starter like Abreu or Ethier is about as far as I would go.

    I feel like our farm system can restock itself with good pitching, but hitting seems to be much shallower and harder for our

    2007-11-09 16:17:54
    74.   Marty
    I want Matt Kemp on my team.
    2007-11-09 16:20:45
    75.   Eric Stephen
    I'd go as high as Kershaw-LaRoche-McDonald for Cabrera, just to avoid trading Kemp. I'd try to sell Ethier in place of one of Kershaw/McDonald, but the Marlins might not go for that.
    2007-11-09 16:21:13
    76.   bhsportsguy
    73 You have to explore it but in the end but it is becoming more and more apparent that really good starting pitching and power are two commodities that you really want to hold on to so to trade 2 of our better power hitting prospects and a stud pitcher for albeit the second coming of Pujols and A-Rod still seems like a lot to give up even if it would set up the Dodgers for the next couple of years.
    2007-11-09 16:22:19
    77.   Bluebleeder87
    74

    I think we ALL do Marty but we have to give up something to get something. It's gonna be a fun off season I just hope NedCo doesn't blunder.

    2007-11-09 16:22:32
    78.   Kevin Lewis
    Sadly, I was really excited when I figured out NPUT on my own. It was like learning to tie my shoes. I spent so long not know how to do it, and then one day...BAM, I got it.

    I don't know what I would do without this site during the day.

    2007-11-09 16:22:42
    79.   CajunDodger
    73
    Accidentally hit the submit button:

    "...harder for our draftniks to restock"

    2007-11-09 16:23:26
    80.   Kevin Lewis
    not knowing
    2007-11-09 16:23:48
    81.   Jim Hitchcock
    70 I asked the same question a month or so ago, and was led to McGuffin...
    2007-11-09 16:24:03
    82.   Kevin Lewis
    oh, I just found out how to bold something by accident
    2007-11-09 16:27:07
    83.   Jim Hitchcock
    82 You've reached a new level, keyboard warrior!
    2007-11-09 16:30:20
    84.   Eric Stephen
    82 Bold = place asterisks (*) immediately before and after text

    Underline = place an underscore (_) immediately before and after text

    ® = type & followed by "reg" followed by ";" (no spaces)

    © = type & followed by "copy" followed by ";" (no spaces)

    ™ = type & followed by "trade" followed by ";" (no spaces)

    Not sure of the Mac™ commands for those symbols.

    2007-11-09 16:32:29
    85.   Humma Kavula
    84 Now if only the Toaster gods will give us italics.
    2007-11-09 16:34:48
    86.   wronghanded
    WOW thanks™ for® the© information!
    2007-11-09 16:35:31
    87.   Jim Hitchcock
    85 There is no baseball in Italica.
    2007-11-09 16:35:32
    88.   Bill Crain
    83
    Square brackets around the number creates a link, as in 83 , while underscores produce only underlining, as in 83.
    2007-11-09 16:37:02
    89.   Bob Timmermann
    85
    If you want italics, you must sacrifice a goat, a dodo bird, and a male platypus on an altar built out of Pedro Guerrero and Tyler Houston baseball cards.
    2007-11-09 16:38:21
    90.   Jim Hitchcock
    That dodo bird's gonna be a bit tough...
    2007-11-09 16:39:42
    91.   Bill Crain
    What if I'm using italics and not aware of it, like Ned Colletti and VORP?
    2007-11-09 16:39:48
    92.   Humma Kavula
    89 Hmm, I have no goat. What if I name my still unborn firstborn after Score Bard?
    2007-11-09 16:41:01
    93.   old dodger fan
    I sure miss having baseball games to talk about. Oh, BTW Amen to 74 .
    2007-11-09 16:41:56
    94.   KG16
    21 - I could go into another long legal rant about bilateral contracts vs unilateral contracts and the obligations of each party to perform, but I'll hold off on boring everyone to the point that their eyes glaze over. As far as industries enforcing contracts when one side can't perform, well, it depends on the nature of the contract (goods or services).
    2007-11-09 16:42:04
    95.   Bluebleeder87
    84

    you know how to do accent marks Eric? for last names & stuff, that's the only think I don't know how to do.

    2007-11-09 16:42:07
    96.   Humma Kavula
    93 At least we're not talking about the strike.
    2007-11-09 16:43:49
    97.   wronghanded
    Whats up with the Marlins asking us for Kershaw, LaRoche and Kemp for Miggy when apparently the Angels can get him for Kendrick, Brandon Wood and Nick Adenhart?

    Call me crazy but isn't Kershaw, LaRoche and Kemp much > Kendrick, Wood and Adenhart?

    2007-11-09 16:44:55
    98.   KG16
    89 - I've got a couple of dodo eggs left, they're what I use to make my daily omelets. The rest of the stuff, I'll leave to everyone else.
    2007-11-09 16:45:53
    99.   KG16
    95 - you've got to have a Mac, if you do, then it's option+e followed by the letter you want to accent.
    2007-11-09 16:46:10
    100.   Bluebleeder87
    I just figured it out, I rule!! Báez
    Show/Hide Comments 101-150
    2007-11-09 16:46:25
    101.   Bluebleeder87
    I just figured it out, I rule!! Báez
    2007-11-09 16:47:11
    102.   Bluebleeder87
    That was my fault & for that I apologies.
    2007-11-09 16:47:33
    103.   Robert Daeley
    95 é = & eacute ;

    http://www.w3schools.com/tags/ref_entities.asp

    2007-11-09 16:50:06
    104.   CajunDodger
    97
    Happens every time with Dodger prospects. I read that the Red Sox walked away from Florida when they asked for John Lester and Jacoby Elsbury.

    They see the Dodgers come to the table and they ask for more. Not really sure if that is reality or perception, but either way it's really annoying.

    2007-11-09 16:50:42
    105.   KG16
    103 - ok, then ignore me in 99 , I forgot about the fun that is html entities.
    2007-11-09 16:51:50
    106.   Bluebleeder87
    Thanks everyone, I'm actually kind of proud I figured it out on my own.
    2007-11-09 16:53:24
    107.   Kevin Lewis
    thank goodness for the weekend
    2007-11-09 16:54:28
    108.   Bluebleeder87
    104

    About 2 years ago Theo Epstein wanted Loney & another great prospect for David Wells, Yeah Theo sure thing.

    2007-11-09 16:56:20
    109.   wronghanded
    104 That is really annoying, it seems to me that LaRoche, Kershaw and Ethier are still way more than the asking price for the Angels. If we could somehow get them to bite on that trade proposal, its definitely worth consideration IMO.
    2007-11-09 16:57:09
    110.   bhsportsguy
    To be fair, most people who follow prospects would say that Brandon Wood and Nick Adenhart are the top two prospects in the Angels' system and among the top 25 prospects overall. Howie Kendrick remains a player that many believe he will win a batting title.
    2007-11-09 16:58:51
    111.   CajunDodger
    109
    Let alone some fool of a deal I read about this week that involved a swap of Bills and Kershaw for Miggy.

    Seriously...

    2007-11-09 16:59:38
    112.   wronghanded
    110 Good assessment but isn't Kershaw the top rated minor league pitcher or am I mistaken?
    2007-11-09 17:02:33
    113.   thinkblue0
    109-

    No one wants to give up Kershaw, but you gotta give something to get something.

    Don't know how I feel about that deal. I mean, we ARE talking about Cabrera here...I guess it all depends on what other moves would be made to augment....

    2007-11-09 17:03:50
    114.   bhsportsguy
    112 No, right now, Kershaw is the number one pitching prospect in the game and LaRoche is still among the top 20 prospects in baseball and if he has not passed Wood, he is certainly not too far behind.

    And the difference between Kendrick and Kemp is that one projects as a very good corner outfielder with power/speed while the other may be a very good offensive second baseman but I don't think that equates to what Kemp could become.

    2007-11-09 17:05:14
    115.   trainwreck
    110
    Wood and Adenhart have fallen a lot in the last year.
    2007-11-09 17:06:37
    116.   trainwreck
    I also think a lot of prospect followers would rank LaRoche ahead of Wood.
    2007-11-09 17:07:36
    117.   thinkblue0
    114-

    let's say for sake of discussion we dealt eithier, kershaw, and laroche for miggy.

    What do we do about that extra outfield spot now that eithier is gone? Does that open up the door for an Andruw Jones?

    He did have an awfully down year, gotta figure he'll bounce back though...and while I don't want to give up our young players, a middle of the order that includes miggy, jones, kemp and loney sounds really, really nice.

    2007-11-09 17:08:14
    118.   wronghanded
    114 Agreed and I don't even understand why they would want Kendrick with Uggla there unless Uggla/Kendrick can switch to 3rd, but then what do they do with Brandon Wood (Hanley is a stud)?
    2007-11-09 17:08:28
    119.   El Lay Dave
    110 112 This was discussed a bit in the previous threads. Since LaRoche and Longoria are top two 3B prospects in baseball, LaRoche > Wood, the question is by how much? Since Kershaw is the #1 or 2 pitching prospect (if there is such a thing) in baseball, Kershaw > Adenhart. There was much discussion on how to compare to Kendrick. Are LaRoche+Kershaw better enough than Wood+Adenhart for the Marlins to be talked into someone like Abreu instead of Kendrick?
    2007-11-09 17:10:37
    120.   wronghanded
    117 Absolutely! Ethier leaving opens the door for Andruw and Slappy McSquirtgun to LF.
    2007-11-09 17:13:07
    121.   El Lay Dave
    119 Ooops, wrapped myself around the axle there - got confused and thought Wood was a 3B, not an SS.

    118 Doesn't Uggla have range problems? And there's been talk that Hanley isn't a good enough SS and could end up in CF. Uggla 3B, Wood SS, Kendrick 2B, Ramirez CF.

    2007-11-09 17:15:13
    122.   CarlosDeC
    Trust me i dont want this AT ALL. But doest ALL signs point to Kemp being included in one of these big time trades. The writing is on the walls, the Dodgers dont really want Kemp, he has been getting back handed complements from the orginization all year.
    2007-11-09 17:16:42
    123.   thinkblue0
    122-

    I have the same feeling...and it's just so depressing.

    Why this organization doesn't seem to be high on Kemp is absolutely beyond me.

    2007-11-09 17:17:43
    124.   wronghanded
    122 Maybe they are putting that negative press out there to diminish his value to other teams (and they stop demanding him in trade talks), plus isn't that why we got Torre?
    2007-11-09 17:19:46
    125.   Bluebleeder87
    122

    Specially if A. Jones is in the market...

    Kemp is projected to be a 30+ HR guy, those don't grow on trees, specially for the Dodgers.

    2007-11-09 17:20:45
    126.   Jon Weisman
    "All signs" don't point to Kemp staying or Kemp going. There are conflicting signs. My feeling: the Dodgers don't consider Kemp untouchable, but they won't give him away in a pointless deal. He is not Joel Guzman.
    2007-11-09 17:29:43
    127.   silverwidow
    126 White probably considers him untouchable from the quotes I've read. But, ultimately, it's not his call.
    2007-11-09 17:55:53
    128.   Daniel Zappala
    In light of earlier discussions, now seems like a good time to point out my name is properly spelled Zappalà in Italy.
    2007-11-09 17:56:49
    129.   LAT
    69. "Most sites I frequent have an equivalent to LAT'ed"

    An equivalent to LAT! An equivalent to LAT!! Well, I never!!!

    2007-11-09 18:06:33
    130.   Linkmeister
    129 Ahem. There is a distinction between "equivalent" and "equal."

    Don't worry, grasshopper.

    2007-11-09 18:06:37
    131.   Sam DC
    But not as clever or good looking, I'm sure.

    Or tall.

    2007-11-09 18:10:38
    132.   Ricardo
    128. It´s very funny the way that americans pronounce italian names. By the way, my "nono" was from Verona.
    2007-11-09 18:14:33
    133.   Robert Daeley
    "Torre thinks Rodriguez could join Dodgers"

    http://tinyurl.com/2gjs5j

    2007-11-09 18:24:54
    134.   trainwreck
    133
    Biggest news from that article may be that Mazzilli won't be our bench coach.
    2007-11-09 18:28:55
    135.   Eric Stephen
    133 Sad news for Lee Mazzilli in that article as well. Probably good news for Mariano Duncan though.
    2007-11-09 19:04:57
    136.   Bluebleeder87
    133

    You beet me to the punch Robert Daeley.

    2007-11-09 19:10:45
    137.   Bill Crain
    ESPN. I've read more incisive reporting written in crayon.
    2007-11-09 19:11:42
    138.   El Lay Dave
    135 Indeed, to both sentences.

    Apologies if this came up here before, but I don't remember it. Josh Rawitch posted this in the comments section of ItD:

    Hu is back in Taiwan and getting ready to play in the World Games. He stopped playing in the AFL because of a slight hamstring issue but it was precautionary more than anything. The team knew that he would be playing in the World Games, so he was told to rest and prepare for the international competition.

    2007-11-09 19:17:14
    139.   KG16
    Quote the Yankee Captain: I don't ever sit down and look at who's going to be there. You'll drive yourself crazy.

    That's some pretty good advice for all of us, I think... even if it does come from a Yankee.

    2007-11-09 19:24:09
    140.   Duranimal
    Seems like there has to be some real potential around the Dodgers signing A-Rod. Otherwise, why would Torre mention it? Kind of makes McCourt look bad if McCourt doesn't sign him - something that Torre would realize.

    My preference is to be patient and go with youth, but if I had to choose, I'd rather sign A-Rod than trade 2-3 prospects for Cabrera.

    2007-11-09 19:30:11
    141.   underdog
    I agree with 140 totally. ARod costs them (granted, a lot of) money and nothing else. Better that than prospects. Of course, if they did sign ARod, then they'd likely look to trade LaRoche. And hopefully that wouldn't then entail giving him away for too little. But never mind that. The Cabrera scenario makes me too nervous. He could eat the three prospects we'd have to give up for him.
    2007-11-09 19:34:05
    142.   natepurcell
    Does Pecota have Arod projections for the next 3-4 years or so?
    2007-11-09 19:42:23
    143.   CanuckDodger
    Nate, have you given any more thought to next year's draft, and who you would like at #15? I've been reading up a lottle, and right now I want Isaac Galloway, from Rancho Cucamonga. A five-tool center fielder. We can't keep neglecting center field in this organization. That's how we ended up with Pierre for five years.
    2007-11-09 19:43:35
    144.   natepurcell
    Umm...does Odom have a tattoo on the back of his head?
    2007-11-09 19:52:22
    145.   natepurcell
    143

    As far as prep prospects, I like...

    SS Tim Beckham
    CF Aaron Hicks
    CF Isaac Galloway
    RHP Gerrit Cole
    3b Harold Martinez

    Up to this point, Galloway has been all tools and minimal production. I would like to see him dominate his league next spring.

    2007-11-09 19:52:47
    146.   Dodgers49
    Tsao status per Diamond Leung:

    The Dodgers have outrighted reliever Chin-hui Tsao to Class AAA Las Vegas and are awaiting his decision to either accept the assignment or elect free agency. Tsao, if you recall, is represented by Scott Boras.

    2007-11-09 19:55:07
    147.   natepurcell
    This upcoming draft is suppose to be pretty stacked in the college and prep ranks so we should in theory end up with something good at #15.

    Knowing the Dodgers, it'll probably be another prep arm though.

    2007-11-09 19:58:38
    148.   Eric Stephen
    140 I'd prefer A-Rod as well, largely because like you said it would only cost (a ton of) monday.

    Plus, LaRoche could be used as a 4th OF (thinking outside the box) if he's not included in a trade for pitcher. Santana seems like the prize, but I doubt the Twins trade Johan because with their pitching they have an excellent chance of winning their division in 2008.

    2007-11-09 20:00:08
    149.   Eric Stephen
    148 It would be awesome if A-Rod only cost Monday (2 birds with 1 stone), but in fact he will cost money.
    2007-11-09 20:00:50
    150.   Jon Weisman
    Was there a reason the Dodgers had to outright Tsao this week? What's the latest count on people who need to be added to the 40-man from the minors?
    Show/Hide Comments 151-200
    2007-11-09 20:01:51
    151.   natepurcell
    I think Turiaf is turning into a dang good power forward.
    2007-11-09 20:03:12
    152.   Jon Weisman
    For those who care (and I guess I'm one, since they had me as a guest a couple times), the Mason & Ireland combo are apparently done:

    http://www.insidesocal.com/tomhoffarth/archives/2007/11/710am_update_ir.html

    2007-11-09 20:07:55
    153.   Eric Stephen
    150 The timing was kind of weird on that. I think the only minor leaguers that need to be added are Orenduff, McDonald, & Paul, with a maybe to Corey Wade and Mark Alexander. Elbert & DeWitt don't need to be added until 2008.
    2007-11-09 20:11:18
    154.   Jon Weisman
    They wouldn't choose Alexander over Tsao, would they?
    2007-11-09 20:21:59
    155.   Eric Stephen
    Current 40-man (arb-eligible in bold):

    Catchers (2)
    Martin, backup TBD

    Infielders (8)
    Abreu, Furcal, Nomar, Hu, Kent, LaRoche, Loney, Valdez

    Outfielders (5)
    Ethier, Kemp, Pierre, Repko, Young

    Pitchers (18)
    Beimel, Billingsley, Brazoban, Broxton, Hendrickson, Houlton, Hull, Kuo, Lowe, Loaiza, Megrew, Meloan, Miller, Penny, Proctor, Saito, Schmidt, Stults

    That's a total of 33, with likely Orenduff, McDonald & Paul to be added before December.

    Tsao is also arbitration-eligible, but I assume that if he accepts his outright assignment to AAA then he would be back as a NRI for spring training. Is that the case? I'm not sure what his contract status would be.

    2007-11-09 20:25:05
    156.   Xeifrank
    141. If we signed AROD, I'd like to see LaRoche moved to 2B as the future Jeff Kent replacement rather than traded (for probably squat). vr, Xei
    2007-11-09 20:28:06
    157.   Eric Stephen
    154 I sure hope not. The Tsao situation shows either:

    1) Tsao is still hurt, and/or expected to be hurt for most/all of 2008
    2) Dodgers need to clear roster space because of a planned series of moves (although I can't see how they couldn't just outright Valdez or non-tender Henrickson)
    3) Colletti may lose a potentially productive player because of bad roster judgment/timing (not exclusive to Colletti of course -- Werth, Cody Ross, Victorino were previous examples of this)

    2007-11-09 20:30:04
    158.   Andrew Shimmin
    91 - Then it's nobody's business.

    Parsing that line, again, reminded me how weird Colletti can get. I'm pretty sure he was kidding, by the end of the quote, though it's a somewhat bizarre joke. Dane Cook-y. But when does the kidding start?

    2007-11-09 20:41:33
    159.   dzzrtRatt
    152 A sign I'm getting old. I read the item about John Ireland and it was like reading a newspaper in a town where I don't know anybody. The local sports talk guys are just an assortment of jokers who each adapt the same pseudo-personality. In trying to stand out, they all end up sounding just the same.

    Maybe to young sports fans, the pending arrival of Dicky Barnett and the possible departure of Kevin Kiley are life-changing events. I know I paid close attention to who was doing sports talk at KABC when they ran it.

    2007-11-09 20:42:23
    160.   LA Native
    If I were Florida I would take Kemp, LaRoche, Kershaw anyday over Kendrick, Wood and Adenhart, although I would agree that both are a lot (too much in my opinion) for Cabrera.

    I'm still high on Kemp (not sure why everyone isn't) and think LaRoche has a chance to be a great third baseman both defensively and offensively. Note that he has struggled at just about every level after being promoted and then gone gangbusters. I'd rather see them spend $30M a year on ARod than give up all that and roll all the dice on Cabrera.

    2007-11-09 20:54:34
    161.   natepurcell
    He said he has not spoken directly with A-Rod about the prospect of teaming up in Los Angeles, but the two have left each other phone messages.

    Hmm...

    2007-11-09 21:02:32
    162.   natepurcell
    wow, chadbradfordwannabe from BTF just got hired by the dbacks to be a major league scout for them.
    2007-11-09 21:10:36
    163.   LAbits
    While Joe and Alex are texting or leaving voice mail...

    ... about the Dodgers getting someone lame for more than it took for another team to get someone good... I remember the year the Dodgers traded for Mulholland, and the Giants got Schmidt... wasn't that both from the Pirates? I was like, hey, they didn't give much to get Schmidt, why didn't we get him? Maybe there's a rational answer to that.

    ... about the possibilities, someone mentioned two birds with one stone (and Monday is growing on me, now that they have Steiner, btw) so here's a two-fer:

    Marlins need a CF. Here's the trade: Kershaw, La Roche and subsidized Pierre for Cabrera. Even after signing the extension, you have room for more salary for another OF.

    ... if the Dodgers don't get Cabrera, and sign A-Rod, keep all the prospects, because you're going to need them. Logan White is going to cost you more money, tho, in 2009.

    2007-11-09 21:13:35
    164.   Eric Stephen
    Nate, you do good work over on BTF. A lot of times I need a machete to traverse the mine fields that are the comments sections. It's nice to have an intelligent, well reasoned Dodger presence over there.
    2007-11-09 21:18:40
    165.   Eric Stephen
    162 That's an awesome story. More here:

    http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/NickPiecoro/10440

    2007-11-09 21:19:28
    166.   natepurcell
    164

    The only person that bugs me is that dbacks fan that has to turn every thread into a dbacks thread.

    2007-11-09 21:22:56
    167.   Eric Stephen
    166 Levski? Yeah, he's pretty annoying.
    2007-11-09 21:23:35
    168.   natepurcell
    167

    Yep. He is such a smart alec too.

    2007-11-09 21:24:58
    169.   Eric Stephen
    Add another to the list of players that would provide the Dodgers an upgrade over Juan Pierre:

    http://tinyurl.com/282v3b

    2007-11-09 21:30:04
    170.   Eric Stephen
    I should add to 169 that I don't really think Bernie Williams would be an upgrade over JP, nor do I think this has much of a chance of happening.

    Delwyn Young is out of options, so he pretty much has to be on the 25-man roster to start the season. Signing someone like Bernie would be pointless.

    2007-11-09 21:33:43
    171.   Andrew Shimmin
    142- Yes, but they'll be significantly different when 2007 is the last year considered, instead of 2006.

    Year--Projected WARP
    2007--7.4 (Actual 2007 WARP--11)
    2008--7.0
    2009--5.7
    2010--4.6
    2011--3.5

    2007 notwithstanding, it makes me uneasy every time somebody says that A-Rod is in his prime. Could well be, but I wouldn't bet on it.

    2007-11-09 21:36:46
    172.   Andrew Shimmin
    Looking more closely, it seems that PECOTA is most bearish on his defense, going forward, and it expects him to play less than he has. His EQA is above .300 every year.
    2007-11-09 21:38:04
    173.   SG6
    152 - that's at least the second time. First was in mid-late 90's?
    2007-11-09 21:39:10
    174.   SG6
    not sure how I got italicized, but here I go again.
    2007-11-09 21:40:30
    175.   Ken Arneson
    test
    2007-11-09 21:41:20
    176.   Ken Arneson
    sorry about that
    2007-11-09 21:53:57
    177.   Eric Stephen
    Bynum is averaging 20.9 points and 20.1 rebounds per 48 minutes thus far into the season.
    2007-11-09 22:05:03
    178.   CanuckDodger
    We need all of the roster spots that have been cleared for a good reason: we need to protect SIX minor leaguers from the Rule five draft. People have already mentioned McDonald, Orenduff, and Paul as no-brainers. Somebody mentioned Cory Wade as a possible, but I think he is definitely in. The other two guys are Ramon Troncoso and Wesley Wright. If Wade, Troncoso, and Wright are not protected, I guarantee they will be lost in the Rule 5 draft, and they are the kinds of arms that a non-competitive club would have no problem hiding on the 25-man roster, doing bullpen mop-up work if nothing else.
    2007-11-09 22:13:51
    179.   Eric Stephen
    178 Wade's presence in the AFL seems to bode well for him being protected, doesn't it? Or do you think the Dodgers are using the AFL as kind of a tryout for Wade, a final audition if you will for a 40-man spot?
    2007-11-09 22:23:52
    180.   CanuckDodger
    178 -- I think the AFL was a place where Wade had to do well to persuade the Dodgers to protect him, because his "stuff" is not super impressive, and he has performed. Wright is a lefty who throws in the 90's, so I suspect he was going to be protected no matter what. Troncoso also throws 91 to 95. Wade is more 88 to 93, but usually at the low end of that. Wade has better command than Wright and Troncoso. The Dodgers always prefer stuff over command, so that is why Wade was likely on the bubble. If Wade isn't protected, I can see a saber team like Oakland snapping him up in the Rule 5 draft.
    2007-11-09 22:24:42
    181.   CanuckDodger
    180 -- That post was for 179, not 178.
    2007-11-09 22:41:51
    182.   still bevens
    168 AZ fans hijacking every BTF threads vs. Mets fans hijacking every BTF thread.

    Discuss.

    2007-11-09 22:50:42
    183.   natepurcell
    A Mets hijack is more of a group effort whereas a dbacks hijack consist of loud, diamond-back hissing from one rattler.
    2007-11-09 23:20:05
    184.   Benaiah
    Is Furcal 08 going to be like Furcal 06 (Gold Glove defense and a 107 OPS+ with career highs in Average, Slugging and home runs) or Furcal 07 (Career lows in average, slugging OPS and OPS+, lowest home run total since 2001, lowest OBP since 2002)? Sure he was injured, but on the other hand he was also just bad. Really, really bad. Alex Cora's career OPS+ is 74, Furcal's OPS+ in 2007 was 76. Cora has a world series ring, but no one is paying him 13 million a year next year.

    I am not saying Furcal is going to be worthless next year, but I'm glad we have Hu waiting in the wings.

    2007-11-09 23:28:45
    185.   Dodgers49
    Dodgers' split with Vero getting messy

    >> The Dodgers' tentative itinerary next spring: Report to Vero Beach in mid-February, leave in mid-March for the China games, finish training at the Oakland Athletics' complex in Phoenix, play an exhibition against the Boston Red Sox in the Coliseum and possibly another at Dodger Stadium or in Las Vegas. <<

    http://tinyurl.com/2n5obo

    2007-11-10 01:44:43
    186.   coachjpark
    GO CHAN HO!
    2007-11-10 06:33:40
    187.   Daniel Zappala
    Why isn't this obvious? Shouldn't the Dodgers recognize they are closing down a historic spring training site, and play their usual schedule of games there so their fans can come and say farewell? Play in China next year. They're doing a lousy job at PR.
    2007-11-10 06:43:42
    188.   Izzy
    162.
    I love reading Gomez. That will probably come to an end, now that he has a real job. I enjoy the coaching part. It's more like "applied sabermetrics" when you get to teach a teenager how to work a walk, instead of just knowing it's a good thing and looking down on people who don't get it. Sadly, I think alot of guys who are into stats could become good coaches, if they ever tried. Much of it is the same analytical way of thinking.

    A few years of coaching little league would do alot of stat heads some good.

    2007-11-10 07:10:12
    189.   old dodger fan
    The link in 185 says the Dodgers will play 2 exhibitions in China. Anybody know the dates and locations?
    2007-11-10 07:39:26
    190.   Sub4Era
    110 114 119 Where are you guys getting these prospect rankings from? Can I get a link?
    2007-11-10 07:39:51
    191.   Jon Weisman
    187 - I was about to do a post saying the exact same thing.
    2007-11-10 07:53:38
    192.   willhite
    187, 191 -

    This way, McCourt can more or less sneak out of town and not call attention to the fact that the D's are leaving the most revered ST sight in the history of the game.

    I, for one, would have liked to see them make a big deal out of Vero and all the Dodger history there, but I think McCourt somehow considers leaving as a negative he doesn't want to be associated with.

    2007-11-10 08:10:13
    193.   Jon Weisman
    192 - I won't argue the McCourts' reasons for moving to Arizona - there are too many sound reasons for it that trump sentiment and history. But gutting the final year in Dodgertown doesn't make sense. And the fact is, they're not going to avoid calling attention to the farewell - if anything, this will make the coverage worse.

    New post up top, or NPUT.

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