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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

When the Going Get's Tough ...
2008-06-14 12:48
by Jon Weisman

Dodgers at Tigers, 12:55 p.m.

* * *

From Diamong (sic) Leung of the Press-Enterprise:

Shortstop Rafael Furcal has been diagnosed with a bulging disk and has been limited to conditioning exercises, leading Dodgers manager Joe Torre to realize he might not have his leadoff hitter back in three weeks, as he'd been told. ...

(Angel) Berroa, however, is hitting .133 and isn't the best defender either. In the first inning Friday, he botched a rundown play, allowing Detroit's Carlos Guillen to elude a tag by sliding underneath it and returning safely to third base.

Torre said he would give Blake DeWitt a look at shortstop before thinking about turning to All-Star catcher Russell Martin, who has said shortstop is his dream position to play.

But on a night when Andy LaRoche started for the first time at third base, Torre called DeWitt his starter there.

"I'm more apt to move LaRoche around," Torre said. ...

Comments (370)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-06-14 12:53:47
1.   Alex41592
Lets get some...err...a run!
2008-06-14 12:55:18
2.   Eric Stephen
Beimel with a national Bison reference!!!
2008-06-14 12:57:46
3.   Andrew Shimmin
One up, Juan out.
2008-06-14 12:58:41
4.   mintxcore
Is that a Croatia home kit I see someone wearing in the crowd? Is Bob at this game?!
2008-06-14 12:59:13
5.   Dodger Dawg
Nothing will change until management is either changed itself, or becomes serious about winning, and replaces the dead wood PVLs.
2008-06-14 13:00:06
6.   Eric Stephen
Hit it to Cabrera!!
2008-06-14 13:03:25
7.   Jacob Burch
As weird as I think a Joe Beimel Bobblehead is, I have to say I love the guy.

Was it a simple Bison drop in the line-up? Any other winners?

2008-06-14 13:04:43
8.   D4P
"I'm more apt to move LaRoche around," Torre said

Is that because he thinks LaRoche is more versatile, or because DeWitt has somehow earned the right to stay at 3B?

2008-06-14 13:05:51
9.   Dodger Dawg
That's Kent showing the way to lead.
2008-06-14 13:06:07
10.   bhsportsguy
I hate to keep bringing this up but who exactly is the PVL that needs to be replaced.

I don't consider Pierre one because one, he's 30 and two, he's only in his 8th year.

At this point you are only talking about Kent.

2008-06-14 13:06:12
11.   Eric Stephen
It was "fresh off parole, Matt 'The Bison' Kemp".

Beimel also added:

Andre "Neck Beard" Ethier
Jeff "Only Man in MLB Who Should Wear a 'Stache" Kent
Juan "The Only Man in Baseball That Can Wear This [mini] Hat" Pierre

2008-06-14 13:06:12
12.   regfairfield
Good to see that we're going to wait until it's way too late to cut bait on DeWitt.
2008-06-14 13:09:46
13.   Eric Stephen
Pierre is clearly thought of in baseball circles as a "veteran", "leader", etc.
2008-06-14 13:10:40
14.   D4P
DeWitt now OPSing less than Loney, Kemp, and Ethier, though Management no doubt thinks he's hitting the best of the bunch.
2008-06-14 13:11:30
15.   JoeyP
Why on earth would they get Berroa, if trying Dewitt is already an option?

And Pierre needs to get out of that leadoff spot.

Torre's as bad as Grady.

2008-06-14 13:11:56
16.   DaDoughboy
Yay Penny!
8 pitch 1st?
2008-06-14 13:12:05
17.   Alex41592
Martin doing the little things
2008-06-14 13:12:37
18.   JoeyP
10---You dont consider Pierre a veteran that needs to be replaced?
2008-06-14 13:12:47
19.   Eric Stephen
With the Dodger offense struggling as it is, it's kind of shocking to see the infield in with 1 out for Ethier.
2008-06-14 13:13:37
20.   Alex41592
You see THAT'S why we don't score any runs.
2008-06-14 13:13:41
21.   Eric Stephen
Bison Speed™ = run
2008-06-14 13:14:26
22.   Alex41592
2008-06-14 13:14:35
23.   thinkblue88
Sweet, all the Dodgers except Kent and Kemp with the high socks.
2008-06-14 13:15:10
24.   fanerman
C -Martin

That line-up could score some runs.

2008-06-14 13:15:13
25.   Ken Noe
I suspect Torre simply means that Martin won't be playing short.
2008-06-14 13:16:28
26.   Eric Stephen
Yeah, that's how I read it too.
2008-06-14 13:16:47
27.   Gen3Blue
Gameday went right from Either to Young. I assume Kemp got to first and Loney scored.
2008-06-14 13:17:18
28.   Alex41592
D.Y is really impressive batting from the left side.
2008-06-14 13:17:20
29.   fanerman
25 The more unrealistic scenario isn't Dewitt at SS. It's JP out of the line-up.
2008-06-14 13:18:00
30.   Eric Stephen
Infield single up the middle. Kemp beat the throw from Renteria.
2008-06-14 13:19:01
31.   Gen3Blue
30 excellant.
2008-06-14 13:19:36
32.   Ken Noe
29 No, he's batting leadoff until Furcal gets back, and who knows when that will be.
2008-06-14 13:20:57
33.   Dodger Dawg
I know this won't happen, but they might want to think about using LaRoche in Left field or 2nd base. Kent's just a shadow of his former self, and a shadow really doesn't hit much.
2008-06-14 13:23:04
34.   Andrew Shimmin
Arguing about whether Pierre is a PVL is like arguing about whether golf is a game or a sport. Call it whatever you want, just keep it off my television and I'm happy.
2008-06-14 13:26:17
35.   Eric Stephen
No U.S. Open for you this weekend, Shimmin?
2008-06-14 13:26:37
36.   JoeyP
It's too bad the Dodgers didnt sign Larish when they drafted him.

Tigers got a steal in the 5th round when they drafted him.

He's going to be a good one.

2008-06-14 13:26:43
37.   ChicagoDodger
CBS Sportsline Gamecenter writes:

Cabrera flied out to shallow shortstop.

Can someone please explain what shallow shortstop is?

2008-06-14 13:27:32
38.   Andrew Shimmin
35- That's right, I don't go in for tennis, either.
2008-06-14 13:28:16
39.   Andrew Shimmin
I miss the pitcher's spot.
2008-06-14 13:30:13
40.   D4P
And yet, you wear pleated pants and leather belts and tucked in shirts and shoes and socks everyday. I don't get it.
2008-06-14 13:31:22
41.   Gen3Blue
Well, we're through the hole in the line-up.
2008-06-14 13:31:51
42.   Eric Stephen
No Masters or Wimbledon either? I follow golf and tennis pretty much 4 weeks only a year at most, but they're pretty much mainstays for me (except the Australian Open I guess).
2008-06-14 13:32:58
43.   Eric Stephen
I wonder if the Tigers' starting pitcher today left tickets for his brother Ernest to view his major league debut.
2008-06-14 13:39:02
44.   Andrew Shimmin
Only baseball matters.
2008-06-14 13:39:22
45.   Eric Stephen
Hey Karros, Lowe's ERA in his losses is 6.68 too. It's not like he's losing 1-0 every time.
2008-06-14 13:40:33
46.   D4P
Only baseball matters

But other sports have pretty numbers too...

2008-06-14 13:40:35
47.   Eric Stephen
That should be engraved on something.
2008-06-14 13:41:16
48.   Bob Timmermann
I've mentioned this before, but the Tigers are the only team in the original AL Eight that the Dodgers have never played in the postseason.

1916 - lost to Red Sox in 5
1920 - lost to Indians in 7 (best of 9 series)
1941, 1947, 1949, 1952, 1953, 1956, 1977, 1978 - lost to Yankees
1955, 1963, 1981 - beat Yankees
1959 - beat White Sox
1966 - lost to Orioles
1974 - lost to A's, avenged loss in 1988

2008-06-14 13:41:30
49.   JoeyP
Small ball with I-Rod?
2008-06-14 13:43:57
50.   JoeyP
Poor baserunning by Thames.
He's got to score on Pierre.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-06-14 13:46:51
51.   Eric Stephen
And 1965 - beat Minnesota (Washington)
2008-06-14 13:48:22
52.   Eric Stephen
Yeah, Thames somehow fell for Pierre's deke and froze between 2nd and 3rd. Dodge(re)d a bullet there.
2008-06-14 13:50:36
53.   Eric Stephen
Loney has two of the weaker hit doubles ever. But it all balances out.
2008-06-14 13:51:46
54.   Alex41592
The Gods are making up for Wrigley's foul balls today. And Martin NOT doing the little things this time.
2008-06-14 13:51:54
55.   Johnny Nucleo
Scouting says: jump on the first pitch? Not many people taking pitches this inning.
2008-06-14 13:52:26
56.   D4P
Gameday is telling me that Ethier is batting, but I assume it's Martin.
2008-06-14 13:52:50
57.   Eric Stephen
OK, new strategy: hit it to LF!
2008-06-14 13:53:06
58.   fanerman
Ground Rule Double!
2008-06-14 13:53:10
59.   Alex41592
Got the line by this much!
2008-06-14 13:53:12
60.   Andrew Shimmin
Martin popped out. Ethier did not.
2008-06-14 13:53:17
61.   Eric Stephen
Martin popped out to short on the first pitch.
2008-06-14 13:55:44
62.   Eric Stephen
Pee Wee!!!
2008-06-14 13:56:50
63.   Eric Stephen
Karros does not understand the Rule 5 draft, nor the difference between 25- and 40-man rosters.
2008-06-14 13:56:53
64.   fanerman
Pee Wee!
2008-06-14 13:57:05
65.   Andrew Shimmin
At least the Tigers will bat in between Berroa and Pierre. Seeing them back to back is depressing.
2008-06-14 13:57:54
66.   fanerman
It's nice when the black hole is only 2 batters long and not 4.
2008-06-14 13:57:59
67.   Andrew Shimmin
You could fill a book with stuff Eric Karros doesn't understand.
2008-06-14 13:59:06
68.   Eric Stephen
Chapter 1: How to Exit Gracefully as a Player
2008-06-14 13:59:16
69.   Alex41592
63 - Karros doesn't understand a lot of things, including the team he's paid to cover. I'm actually very disappointed in his analysis of the team.
2008-06-14 13:59:19
70.   D4P
The last time Brad Penny was given credit for a Dodger team victory was May 2.
2008-06-14 14:02:58
71.   Eric Stephen
Great play by Ethier holding Maggs to a double.
2008-06-14 14:03:59
72.   Alex41592
71 - It was even better holding him to a single :)
2008-06-14 14:04:22
73.   Gen3Blue
66 Gameday say the run scoring portion of the lineup scored some runs and we are already half way through the black hole.
2008-06-14 14:04:24
74.   Eric Stephen
At least now Ordonez might get tired having to trot 90 extra feet on Cabrera's HR.
2008-06-14 14:05:00
75.   Eric Stephen
D'oh! My mistake lead to the HR. Clearly.
2008-06-14 14:06:14
76.   D4P
Gameday is useless today.
2008-06-14 14:06:15
77.   MMSMikey
EK has been all over penny from the 1st pitch. Rightfully So.
2008-06-14 14:06:24
78.   ToyCannon
Miggy go boom?
2008-06-14 14:06:35
79.   still bevens
Karros knows one thing: Brad Penny is not good. And he keeps repeating it.
2008-06-14 14:06:35
80.   Reddog
So this should be Penny's last season here, right? I'll be glad to see him gone.
2008-06-14 14:07:46
81.   Eric Stephen
Club holds an option on Penny for 2009.
2008-06-14 14:08:46
82.   MMSMikey
2008-06-14 14:09:02
83.   Reddog
Maybe Penny could get a job next season as a batting practice pitcher.
2008-06-14 14:09:11
84.   Jacob Burch
80 The cost of keeping him is less than 7 mil, i believe, for next year, and I actually can't imagine them not exercising it. Gambling on Brad Penny being somewhere between his 06/7 self and today is probably with it.
2008-06-14 14:09:44
85.   Eric Stephen
The option is for either $8.75m or $9.25m, depending on whom you believe (Cot's Baseball Contracts or, with a $2m buyout.
2008-06-14 14:10:01
86.   Jacob Burch
As much as I want Penny to be "with it," I did mean 'worth.'
2008-06-14 14:10:09
87.   fanerman
Penny implosion: 4th inning.
2008-06-14 14:10:12
88.   MMSMikey
nice hanging spin ball there to pudge.
2008-06-14 14:10:25
89.   Alex41592
Wow. I am full of Rule 1 expletives right now for Brad Penny. He's just terrible.
2008-06-14 14:11:16
90.   still bevens
The bitter cynic in me is proving to be right. I predicted the bats would show up today but the pitching would cough it up.
2008-06-14 14:12:29
91.   still bevens
Nice to see the Scott Proctor Gas Can Experience warming up in the pen.
2008-06-14 14:12:40
92.   D4P
Maybe Penny really wants to leave and wants to make sure the team doesn't pick up his option.
2008-06-14 14:13:17
93.   MMSMikey
phantom dl...phantom dl...phantom dl...
2008-06-14 14:13:23
94.   Gen3Blue
Wow, it seems to be pointless giving Penny a lead. It seems like his sudden concern with keeping a baserunner close broke something. Gameday showed the location of that 92 mile "fastball" about 12" higher than most others.
2008-06-14 14:13:32
95.   Jacob Burch
92 (after triple) I'd buy it.
2008-06-14 14:13:32
96.   ToyCannon
And Leyland was squeezing in the 3rd. Doesn't he read old fashioned scouting reports?
2008-06-14 14:13:35
97.   D4P
Greatest Offense Ever!
2008-06-14 14:14:52
98.   Eric Stephen
Squeezing, and playing the infield in in the 2nd inning with one out of a scoreless tie.
2008-06-14 14:15:30
99.   Ken Noe
Fearless prediction: Penny gone at the trading deadline for not a lot.
2008-06-14 14:16:18
100.   Eric Stephen
Good thing Kuo was used in the last two games in meaningless spots.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-06-14 14:16:23
101.   nofatmike
Hopefully Kuo gets another shot at the rotation now.
2008-06-14 14:16:29
102.   MonkeyBlue
So frustrating. Torre needs to put Penny in the pen and let somebody in the minors take his place.
2008-06-14 14:17:06
103.   MonkeyBlue
Or Kuo(I like Chan ho to Kuo connection) like nofatmike
2008-06-14 14:17:29
104.   Alex41592
99 - He's regressed to second half 2006 Brad Penny.

Great try by Ethier.

2008-06-14 14:18:16
105.   Linkmeister
Please explain (H/T Scott Long) why Torre brought Proctor with him to LA.
2008-06-14 14:18:29
106.   Eric Stephen
That would have been a good time for a collision.
2008-06-14 14:18:42
107.   Ken Noe
Dear Mr. Torre:

I know you love Scott Proctor, but he's done.


PS: So's Sweeney.

2008-06-14 14:19:15
108.   Eric Stephen
Unless Torre knew last July he would be in LA, I doubt he had much to do with the Proctor acquisition.
2008-06-14 14:20:31
109.   OhioBlues12
Closed door meeting after the game? Maybe Penny won't come out when they open them back up. Seriously, does Penny throw a sinker? Seems like he needs something to get guys out since he doesn't strike out anyone anymore.
2008-06-14 14:22:22
110.   nick
the Proctor-Betemit deal managed to hurt both teams.....(though I'd rather have Betemit, so far we've seen a .241 OBP and an ability to play every infield position poorly--when observation does not suggest you're clearly a better IB than Jason Giambi, that's a bad sign)
2008-06-14 14:22:52
111.   Linkmeister
108 Did we get Proctor last mid-season? I thought he was a new arrival for 2008.
2008-06-14 14:24:16
112.   Eric Stephen
Time for Loney's 3rd double.

Kent's DP ball becomes two on base, one out.

2008-06-14 14:24:23
113.   Alex41592
Bonine just gave us a life.
2008-06-14 14:25:14
114.   Zach the Ripper
Right now, I'm trying to figure out how I could have been so excited about our pitching staff, and the whole team for that matter.
Frankly, I'm flabbergasted by our record. How are we only 5 games under .500? It's amazing.
I'm still hoping that if we start playing better we can win, because I can't imagine so many things going wrong all season. Eventually the ship will turn, right? We just need to tread water until we find our power stroke.
Oh thats right. We are the only team in baseball that can manage to spend more then 90% of the other teams, and forget to buy a single power hitter.
Tell me again why the Dodger's don't find it prudent to invest in a weight room?
Sorry about the vent guys. Me very angry.
2008-06-14 14:25:18
115.   underdog
111 - Yes and he was good last year. Even for LA. I have no idea why he's so bad this year.
But even more importantly, why is Penny so consistently terrible this season?

So I checked the box score on my phone earlier and saw the Dodgers go up 4-1 then, and said "Yes! There is a God!" and then came home and saw that Penny isn't even worth a penny and suddenly it was - what the?? = 4-7.


I reeally wouldn't give up on this game yet though, guys.

2008-06-14 14:25:50
116.   Eric Stephen
110 ,111
Part of the humor of Torre coming to LA was that Torre had "abused" Proctor while with NY, so when Proctor finally escaped Torre's perceived wrath, here comes Joe back to LA, haunting Proctor (in theory).
2008-06-14 14:26:44
117.   Ken Noe
Game's blacked out here today. Has Rosenthal demanded a Kemp trade yet? Because I'm sensing his need for veteran presence.
2008-06-14 14:26:57
118.   Eric Stephen
Loney's day:

double play

2008-06-14 14:26:58
119.   MMSMikey
double play by loney...shocking.
2008-06-14 14:27:08
120.   Alex41592
115 - Now?
2008-06-14 14:27:51
121.   Eric Stephen
According to the Fox press release, Ken Rosenthal was supposed to be at this game, but I haven't seen him yet. He's probably making suggestions to Colletti as we speak.
2008-06-14 14:27:57
122.   underdog
Btw, off subject, but when I was driving home I was listening to ESPN radio trying to get the Dodgers score, they had on an NFL report show. And started off with "Breaking news from the NFL! Here's John Clayton with more..." So I listened with baited breath. "On Chad Johnson, in Cincinnati..." Uh huh, I thought, yeah...?

"Reported to Bengals training camp and participated."


That was the breaking news? I thought he'd been traded or someone broke something.


2008-06-14 14:31:46
123.   berkowit28
Like I said, Penny would give up at least 5 runs in one inning, and maybe another 1 or 2. They'll need (I said 7) 8 runs. They might even get them today but jeez.
2008-06-14 14:32:46
124.   PalmdaleSteve1
So what is it with Big Brad? I have noticed that Penny was a "Big Boy" but seemed even more of "Bigger Boy" this year? Is that just my TV?

I also noticed in one early April game there were shots of Penny in the dugout taking puffs off of an inhaler, by chance is Penny asthmatic? In that early April game Penny seemed to me to be winded quite a bit, could an increase in weight and breathing problems be root causes of his lousy performance?

2008-06-14 14:32:50
125.   Eric Stephen
This means only 3 starter wins in the last 22 games for the Dodgers. Starters' ERA is only 4.35 during that time, so you would think they would by sheer luck get more than 3 wins out of that.
2008-06-14 14:32:54
126.   nick
115 marginal relievers tend to be good for a couple years and then not so good....and yeah, somebody was blogging the Yanks as "Scott Proctor's Arm" a couple years back....
2008-06-14 14:33:14
127.   Ken Noe
Dear Ken:

I'm leaving Scott in, no matter what.


PS: I'll get Sweeney in today too.

2008-06-14 14:34:46
128.   underdog
120 - No, I wouldn't give up yet either, even if it's the Dodgers we're talking about.

Although my cat did just make a statement of sorts about what he thinks, and it's not pretty.

Be right back.

2008-06-14 14:35:12
129.   Ken Noe
121 Maybe he's brokering that Ordonzez for Kemp deal.
2008-06-14 14:35:32
130.   Eric Stephen
At least Joe took the time to respond.
2008-06-14 14:35:35
131.   underdog
I told you, EWSP would make much more sense these days.
2008-06-14 14:36:53
132.   Eric Stephen
Let's have every possible thing bad happen, OK?

Also, most of Berroa's throws tend to sink or tail at the end.

2008-06-14 14:37:18
133.   Eric Stephen
As opposed to EMHCK.
2008-06-14 14:37:55
134.   underdog
For those of you watching on TV, was that previous play where the runner scored Berroa's fault or Martin's? Sounds like the throw was on target but low?

It's really hard to tell when Steiner and Monday are explaining things to you.

2008-06-14 14:38:25
135.   underdog
2008-06-14 14:38:35
136.   Alex41592
132 - Oh, you just had to know that would happen.
2008-06-14 14:39:04
137.   thinkblue88
Worst dodger game of the year?
2008-06-14 14:39:18
138.   underdog

Maybe we can trade Berroa and Proctor and Penny for some cows and magic beans.

That last one sounded like Martin's fault though.

2008-06-14 14:39:46
139.   underdog
137 Sadly, very likely not.
2008-06-14 14:40:11
140.   Eric Stephen
Jeff Larish was drafted in the 13th round in 2004 by the Dodgers, but he turned down $650,000 to stay at ASU.

In 2005, the Tigers drafted him in the 5th round, and he got only $220,000.

Even when we go above slot we can't get it right.

2008-06-14 14:40:27
141.   underdog
can anyone remind me why I'm still listening to this game? I thought there was hope but...
2008-06-14 14:40:50
142.   thinkblue88

so your saying its gonna get worse?! this is just sad.

2008-06-14 14:40:56
143.   Alex41592
134 - The ball fell in front of Martin and deflected off Martin. It just doesn't really matter.
2008-06-14 14:41:28
144.   underdog
I promised Bob H I wouldn't sigh today so instead I'm just going to...



2008-06-14 14:41:37
145.   Eric Stephen
It was a bad throw by Berroa, but it's likely the shadows at the plate played a role in it getting away from Martin. It was a funky bounce.

And HCK = Hong-Chih Kuo.

2008-06-14 14:42:22
146.   ucladodger
Can we just release Sweeney, Proctor, Berroa today?
2008-06-14 14:42:30
147.   trainwreck
Reminds me when Sportscenter had the tease:

"Are the Patriots looking at Matt Ryan with the 7th overall pick? Tune in to Sportscenter to find out!"

Well, they have Tom Brady, so obviously they aren't. You can't trick me into watching Sportscenter.

2008-06-14 14:43:58
148.   Eric Stephen
That's the classic news tease..."Find out what common every day household items can instantly kill you...

...tonight at 11."

2008-06-14 14:44:40
149.   Alex41592
141 - Personally, I'm waiting for Woods to tee off. A part of me wants the D'Backs to just run away and hide. This past month has been nothing but false hope for a season long lost. Barring an unforeseen run of 12 games won in a row, we're done.
2008-06-14 14:44:49
150.   Bob Timmermann
Buster Posey pitching for Florida State in the ninth inning of a 5-5 tie against Stanford.
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-06-14 14:44:59
151.   gpellamjr
141 I'm thinking about taking a couple of days off from the Dodgers. But I have tickets for Tuesday's game! But I do think I won't watch on Sunday. My heart can't take it right now.
2008-06-14 14:45:34
152.   underdog
145 Ah. Duh. Yes, indeed. EODHCK would be fine with me.

147 Sportscenter's the king of teases that lead nowhere or take forever to discover the pointless answer.


Huzzah, inning over! The rabid dog has been shot and put out of its misery.

2008-06-14 14:45:53
153.   Ken Noe
Dear Joe:

I must respectfully demur on your Proctor decision.


2008-06-14 14:47:07
154.   D4P
Dear Joe:

Who will you put in CF today after pinch-hitting for Kemp with Sweeney?


2008-06-14 14:48:06
155.   underdog
149 = I know 12 games is probably unlikely, but having been through this before I wouldn't put it past them to eventually reel off 8 in a row or something. That's how baseball is, and they have the talent. Of course, even if that happens it could just be a cruel tease. Just like a Sportscenter promo.
2008-06-14 14:48:30
156.   thinkblue88
Woo! 3.5!
2008-06-14 14:48:39
157.   Alex41592
Ethier killed that ball.
2008-06-14 14:48:58
158.   overkill94
Hmmm, maybe someone else should have been put in instead of Proctor
2008-06-14 14:48:59
159.   underdog
2008-06-14 14:49:23
160.   ucladodger
This Bonnine dude is terrible. Over/under- 3 starts?
2008-06-14 14:49:33
161.   D4P
Win Expectancy up to 8%...!
2008-06-14 14:49:59
162.   underdog
Speaking of pitchers being left in, I have no idea why Bonine has been left in either.
2008-06-14 14:50:23
163.   underdog
Maybe they should bring in Dramamine from the bullpen.
2008-06-14 14:50:40
164.   ucladodger
How does Kemp swing through an 87 mph 2-0 fastball??? Thats sad.
2008-06-14 14:50:41
165.   Eric Stephen
To hear Stockton & Karros explain it, Bonine has pitched great today.
2008-06-14 14:51:58
166.   ucladodger
Man, gotta love the standing O for giving up 6 runs in 5 1/3.
2008-06-14 14:52:26
167.   Gen3Blue
Apparently the guys at gameday are not just lazy. The stuff I see on DT looks really bad, but Gameday has seized up and won't give anything. And I have to think they are protecting Dodger fans. On the other hand, this happens a lot.
2008-06-14 14:52:42
168.   blue22
Rosenthal is in Cincy today.
2008-06-14 14:54:49
169.   Eric Stephen
Pinch hit LaRoche for Pierre!
2008-06-14 14:55:21
170.   underdog
I did say not to give up on this game, right? Just checking.
2008-06-14 14:56:11
171.   Bob Timmermann
So is the score 10-6? Gameday died on Berroa's errant throw home. They are trying to play catch up, but the Gameday stringer is Kent Desormeaux and he says that he has "no game" and he's just easing up the rest of the way.
2008-06-14 14:56:59
172.   ToyCannon
Yes, quite entertaining compared to what we've had to endure for the last week.
2008-06-14 14:57:14
173.   Bob Timmermann
8-5 Stanford in the ninth.

Buster Posey will need to stick to catching.

2008-06-14 14:57:15
174.   Gen3Blue
What, I'm tired of losing, but I guess I'm not used to being humiliated.
We would be so much better off with Hu it might be worth him never getting staightened out at the plate.
Procter and Sweeney are so done that it's going to be interesting seeing how this gets blamed on the young players!
2008-06-14 14:57:35
175.   Eric Stephen
10-7 after a Pierre groundout.
2008-06-14 14:58:11
176.   Eric Stephen
Honda Pilot using an actual Bison in its new advertisement.
2008-06-14 14:58:46
177.   Bob Timmermann
Gameday also got bogged down over Brent Clevlen replacing Marcus Thames in LF. In fact, Marcus Thames was at bat for about 20 minutes.
2008-06-14 15:00:14
178.   Johnny Nucleo
Gameday update: Casey Fossum replaces Casey Fossum.
2008-06-14 15:01:17
179.   ToyCannon
The botched double play ground ball by the Dodger draft pick didn't help him any. 3rd out would have been the SF. On other hand I don't think I've ever seen such a bad call by a 1st base umpire.
2008-06-14 15:01:29
180.   Bob Timmermann
And then there was a coaching visit to the mound after Fossum replaced Fossum. No doubt that was the Tigers sending out the coach who is designated to handle existential crises.
2008-06-14 15:01:47
181.   Brent Knapp
did those stats on Quentin say he had "3.23 Game winning hits?" How can you have 23 hundreths of a game winning hit?
2008-06-14 15:01:49
182.   scareduck
176 - saw that. Was much amused.
2008-06-14 15:02:26
183.   Johnny Nucleo
180 Laughing out loud.
2008-06-14 15:02:45
184.   ToyCannon
All this hitting by the Tigers today just assures Kershaw of a dominating performance. Plus it will be against the team that could have drafted him before us.
2008-06-14 15:02:51
185.   Gen3Blue
Now it looks like we might get to their middles relievers, but it probably doesn't matter at this point. In the fourth we needed someone like Kuo who wouldn't bring the gas can.
And in my opinion you have to play Ethier, you must play Kemp for defense if nothing else, and you have to play Young. We got some offense today, its not their fault we got no pitching.
2008-06-14 15:03:57
186.   Gen3Blue
He hit Procter?---good night.
2008-06-14 15:04:21
187.   D4P
Tiger makes double bogey on the first hole.
2008-06-14 15:04:45
188.   thinkblue88
Let's not forget, Todd Jones is their closer.
2008-06-14 15:05:25
189.   mintxcore
Leland wants "ballplayers not athletes"? Maybe he's interested in Juan Pierre?
2008-06-14 15:05:32
190.   Eric Stephen
He's just giving false hope to the non-felines.
2008-06-14 15:06:49
191.   Pepperdine

I was wondering the same thing. It's either a mistake or some sort of average.

2008-06-14 15:07:38
192.   Eric Stephen
I rewound the DVR and you are correct. I would have loved to see that 0.23 of a hit.
2008-06-14 15:08:08
193.   Bob Timmermann
Barring a miracle, the Cardinal are moving on to the winner's bracket against either Georgia or Miami.
2008-06-14 15:10:00
194.   Eric Stephen
Probably should have thrown to third on that one, Bison.
2008-06-14 15:10:45
195.   dzzrtRatt
After reading the quote from Diamond Leung, I'm thinking Torre should go for the all-offense, PVL-free lineup for the rest of the season:

Loney 1b
LaRoche 2b
DeWitt ss
Martin 3b
Young lf
Kemp cf
Ethier rf
Ardoin c

Then package Kent and Lowe to the Rays for Navarro to return at catcher. I'd love to see the Rays stick it to the Sox and Yanks. Seriously. I think it would be a good trade for both sides.

I wouldn't insult any other GMs by offering up Berroa. Just DFA him.

Pierre: Pinch-runner and bunter extraordinaire.

Jones, if he comes back: Pinch-hitter and late inning defensive substitute.

2008-06-14 15:10:56
196.   Eric Stephen
This score is begging for a sponsor!
2008-06-14 15:11:10
197.   ucladodger

He had no chance at either guy. At least he made the play at home look close. Larish was 3 steps from 3rd when Matt released the ball.

2008-06-14 15:11:34
198.   thinkblue88
The dodgers have scored every other inning.
2008-06-14 15:11:45
199.   Ken Noe
Dear Joe:

We've closed to three runs. Why am I still in?


PS: I think I might burn my glove.

2008-06-14 15:13:03
200.   MollyKnight
Is it 11-7 going to the 7th? Gameday broke.
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2008-06-14 15:13:10
201.   Eric Stephen
OK, good call. I didn't realize Larish was already so close to 3rd. Heck of an attempt by Martin at the plate.
2008-06-14 15:13:27
202.   Bob Timmermann
The Tigers have scored more frequently than every other inning.
2008-06-14 15:13:30
203.   Eric Stephen
2008-06-14 15:13:38
204.   68elcamino427
When the Going Get's Tough ...

Still looking forward to a modest three game winning streak :)

2008-06-14 15:13:51
205.   Linkmeister
200 Not just Gameday. Yahoo's Gamechannel is stuck on the Larish walk. What happened after that?
2008-06-14 15:14:23
206.   ucladodger

You seriously think that would be good for the Rays? So they would lose their All-Star to be catcher and downgrade their defense, all the while ,getting older and more expensive. Not exactly the direction they are going in.

2008-06-14 15:15:12
207.   Eric Stephen
RBI single for Renteria, followed by a flyout to end the inning.
2008-06-14 15:15:44
208.   nick
I'm not really paying close attention but feel the need to wonder about Torre using Proctor in the 6th--you folks were all too stunned to comment? bright side: maybe he wants to transition him to the long man role and move Kuo up the ladder?
2008-06-14 15:16:35
209.   Linkmeister
207 Thanks.
2008-06-14 15:17:25
210.   underdog
195 Not bad. I think Hiroki Kuroda approves as well.

Sounds like they really may try Russell at short, instead. Depends on how poorly Berroa fares but he may be on a short leash.

2008-06-14 15:17:51
211.   Eric Stephen
The Dodgers plan to honor their every other inning arrangement.
2008-06-14 15:18:32
212.   overkill94
I may be late to the party on this one, but iGoogle is the greatest thing ever. How else would I know that a snail moves 2.5 meters per hour?
2008-06-14 15:19:18
213.   underdog
208 - Somewhere between stunned and indifferent. But yeah, although he started off the inning fine I would've still not brought him in. The bloop that Wade gave up was kind of bad luck, but yeah, I would've not brought EWSP back out.


Would've been nice if the Dodgers had done more than roll over in that last half inning. Against the Tigers pen no game is quite out of reach.

2008-06-14 15:19:27
214.   Alex41592
Down by 1 and runners at 1st and 3rd with one out. Griffey Jr. swings 3 and 0 and hits into a 4-6-3 DP.
2008-06-14 15:20:20
215.   Ken Noe
195 210 Nomar's the incumbent SS now, until he returns to the DL. I'm guessing it happens during the minors rehab assignment. Then who knows, we might see DeWitt and LaRoche at third.
2008-06-14 15:21:35
216.   Eric Stephen
I viewed it more as Proctor taking one for the team.
2008-06-14 15:21:45
217.   underdog
We were stunned and wouldn't vooom if you put four million volts through us, we're bleedin' demised.
2008-06-14 15:22:48
218.   Bob Timmermann
You could have asked me.
2008-06-14 15:23:40
219.   JoeyP
Worst Dodger start to the season since 1992.
31-37 likely record.

When you look at the payroll, its just been an complete failure from upper management at assembling this team.

2008-06-14 15:27:54
220.   underdog
I've been looking into genetic research and cloning and feel like an unexplored solution to the Furcal Problem is to take some of his DNA and clone him in a lab. It will probably take less time to grow a new Furcal than to try to acquire a suitable replacement. Just a thought!
2008-06-14 15:28:18
221.   scooplew
219 Agreed. Look at the money spent on Schmidt, Loiaza, Jones and Garciaparra. I don't see many games on TV, but is the team listless?
2008-06-14 15:29:23
222.   Bob Timmermann
Every day Joe Torre makes a list with nine names on it. Today he made one with ten!
2008-06-14 15:34:54
223.   D4P
Every day Joe Torre makes a list with nine names on it

That's $2,743.5 per name...!

2008-06-14 15:35:51
224.   dzzrtRatt
221 Listless pretty much says it.

Penny will pitch okay for awhile, then just seems to give in.

As the game goes on, the hitters take fewer and fewer pitches, as if they've got a car waiting.

And Torre puts in Sweeney for no good reason.

2008-06-14 15:36:18
225.   Andrew Shimmin
Give me Martin at SS, and I don't care about the Proctor garbage.
2008-06-14 15:37:30
226.   Alex41592
Martin will DH tomorrow. Torre said in his pregame.
2008-06-14 15:37:39
227.   Andrew Shimmin
Oh, I forgot about Maza.
2008-06-14 15:38:01
228.   Eric Stephen
Dodgers are 5-26 in AL parks since the beginning of 2005.
2008-06-14 15:38:27
229.   dzzrtRatt
Pierre, swinging for the fences? What's with the uppercut?
2008-06-14 15:38:35
230.   Alex41592
Pierre swinging for the fences. That has a 0% win probability.
2008-06-14 15:41:45
231.   Alex41592
"Takahashi Saito" Dick Stockton 3:40 PST.
2008-06-14 15:45:33
232.   Alex41592
Takahashi is in trouble. Might want to get him out so he can come in to save tomorrow's game. Oh who am I kidding?
2008-06-14 15:45:37
233.   scooplew
How deep was Pierre's drive in an attempt for his first homer ever as a Dodger?
2008-06-14 15:46:29
234.   underdog
Great, so now in addition to having to worry and wonder about Penny's suckitude, now we have to do the same with Saito.

I think it's time to both Phantom DL some guys and DFA a couple of others.

2008-06-14 15:46:32
235.   Eric Stephen
Only about 70 feet short.
2008-06-14 15:46:49
236.   68elcamino427
What needs to be fixed?

1. Shortstop, the most important postition on the infield.
Furcal can't play and is no longer reliable.
Nomar hasn't been a shortstop for a long time and if he can't stay healthy playing third, how can he stay healthy at short?
DeWitt is not a shortstop.
LaRoche is not a shortstop.
If Hu can't play there then the Dodgers need to go outside and get a shortstop.

2. Second Base, Kent has limited mobility and now his offense is declining as well.
Should Kent be playing? If he is going to play he is better suited to first base or really, DH. Is Kent only interested in producing stats at second base to pad his HOF numbers? Take one for the team Kent and demand a trade to the AL where you can DH.
Move DeWitt to second base.

3. Left Field. The left fielder should be able to hit, and hit for some power.
How about Young?

Will any of this happen? Ha!

2008-06-14 15:47:17
237.   Alex41592
233 - Can of corn to center field I'd say no more than 300 feet away. CF is 420 in Comerica.
2008-06-14 15:47:27
238.   D4P
Win Expectancy now at 0%, which I assume means something between 0 and 0.44.
2008-06-14 15:51:05
239.   bigcpa
Pierre as leadoff hitter (162 pa):

16 SB (2.8 run value)
5 CS (-2.4 run value)

"Making things happen" since May 5th.

2008-06-14 15:51:20
240.   herchyzer
LF - Young
CF - Kemp
RF - Ethier
3B - LaRoche
SS - Hu
2B - DeWitt
1B - Loney
C - Martin

To heck wit' it. Long term solution. With this lineup, We can afford to allow Hu to search for his groove. There won't be that much pressure. His defense will make up. Just do it. Kent pitch hits and DH's at AL parks if any more are scheduled. Nomar = utility infielder? I donno. Something. Just do it. Whut da' hay? Season's 'bout gone anyhow.

2008-06-14 15:51:30
241.   underdog
236 - #2 Could happen some of the time.

#1 (Rick Monday said today Furcal's injury was picked by a round table of baseball experts(?) as the most devastating of '08) I think we all agree. The question is, who? Which shortstop is both good, available and can be acquired?

#3 - I think we all basically agree with that one. Losing Jones, or having Jones stink and then losing him didn't help either.

Okay, well, Saito looked a LOT better to those last three batters. Maybe it was just the rust showing.

2008-06-14 15:52:04
242.   Alex41592
We have several questions that are not just about this season, but next season. Saito most likely is done. Furcal might not be returning. Kent is done. The outfield is set through next year. Penny and Lowe could both be gone. Lowe is gone. A lot of questions.
2008-06-14 15:52:24
243.   Eric Stephen
Entering the bottom of the 9th on 9/18/06, the Dodgers win expectancy was 5%.
2008-06-14 15:52:46
244.   underdog
It really is amazing that I actually want Nomar to come back now. I'm not sure about his defense either, but feel like at least maybe he can contribute with the bat. For those five days or so he's healthy before reinjuring himself that is.
2008-06-14 15:52:54
245.   scooplew
235 237 Thanks.
2008-06-14 15:53:52
246.   Bob Timmermann
I would doubt that the outfield is set for next year if this trend continues.

There's no way both Ethier and Kemp would come back from a team with a losing record.

2008-06-14 15:54:29
247.   underdog
So, what can the Dodgers get for Penny? Should they DL him for now, then hope he comes back and is effective and THEN trade him? (that's what I'd do. Trading him right now when his value is so low doesn't make much sense, but they are desperate for some other help.) If Schmidt was actually ready to come back that would make it even easier to trade him.
2008-06-14 15:55:04
248.   overkill94
I've never seen a less-deserving "player of the game"
2008-06-14 15:55:11
249.   Eric Stephen
Today's player of the game: 5.1 IP, 9 hits, 6 runs.
2008-06-14 15:55:46
250.   ToyCannon
Tampa Bays Dodgers with a 1-0 lead. Ruggiano, Aybar, and Navarro try to lead our step-team to victory.
Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2008-06-14 15:55:48
251.   underdog
Hey if you subtract Penny's 4th inning, the Dodgers are winning! :-/
2008-06-14 15:56:25
252.   underdog
Wha....?? Bonine was the player of the game?? Sheesh, that is just...wrong.
2008-06-14 15:56:37
253.   Alex41592
Loney starts the rally that will turn our season around.
2008-06-14 15:57:11
254.   Eric Stephen
Soooo close to tying the LA Dodger record for 2B in a game by Loney.
2008-06-14 15:58:09
255.   underdog


2008-06-14 15:59:40
256.   Eric Stephen
{punch a puppy}
2008-06-14 15:59:52
257.   nofatmike
246 "There's no way both Ethier and Kemp would come back from a team with a losing record."

How so?

2008-06-14 16:00:35
258.   ChicagoDodger
246 Why not? They are both under contract, no? I can't imagine any breathing person blaming the losing record on those two!
2008-06-14 16:01:11
259.   Eric Stephen
Meaning management would probably make wholesale changes, and one or both of Ethier and Kemp would fetch the most in return.
2008-06-14 16:01:44
260.   Alex41592
257 - Bob is the journalistic version of a crafty left hander.
2008-06-14 16:01:49
261.   nofatmike
258 "I can't imagine any breathing person blaming the losing record on those two!"

I take it you don't subscribe to the LA Times.

2008-06-14 16:02:09
262.   Eric Stephen
The breathing persons that are in fact blaming them all reside in (a) Dodger management; or (b) mainstream media outlets.
2008-06-14 16:02:35
263.   nofatmike
259 But that would be idiotic.
2008-06-14 16:03:15
264.   ChicagoDodger
259 They would also give the most in production from 'anyone" they could possibly acquire by trading one or both of them.

Check the Dodgers track record! Stop acquiring lousy players! Hold onto the good ones!

2008-06-14 16:06:07
265.   68elcamino427
After the All-Star break Jones makes his return.

1. Billingsley, Lowe, Kuroda, Kershaw, Kuo
2. Martin
3. Loney
4. DeWitt
5. LaRoche
6. Hu
7. Kemp
8. Jones
9. Ethier

2008-06-14 16:06:18
266.   ChicagoDodger
261 No I don't!

262 a) Well, Dodger management is hopefully gone by the end of this year, and b) I said breathing!

2008-06-14 16:07:42
267.   Eric Stephen
263 ,264
I wouldn't do it, of course, but you know that would happen.
2008-06-14 16:08:41
268.   Alex41592
The Padres are wearing throwbacks tonight in Cleveland.

2008-06-14 16:10:47
269.   Eric Stephen
2008-06-14 16:12:44
270.   Bob Timmermann
Eric said what I was going to say, so I now I will just make a reference to something that I was going to say, but was previously said.
2008-06-14 16:16:06
271.   D4P
Twenty years from now, the Padres's camouflage unis will be "throwbacks.". Course, I'd already throw 'em back.
2008-06-14 16:17:47
272.   ChicagoDodger
$36 million for Jones, $40 some million for Kuroda, how many more millions for Torre? All that for something they could have had by not acquiring any of them and trading off Penny, Lowe, Furcal, Kent, and eating some of Pierre's contract to dump him during this past offseason.

Dodgers would be far better off had they done the latter.

But instead they continue their "buy a lottery-ticket" ideal to building a champion!

Why is it so hard to see it doesn't work? How many years of evidence is required?

The answer, sadly, appears to be--->>> more then 20!

2008-06-14 16:23:28
273.   Bob Timmermann
I think the Dodgers management plan should be to have a guy come by and gather together everybody's credit cards and tell you which one is the lucky one!
2008-06-14 16:27:22
274.   Eric Stephen
I'm watching John Adams, and I must say I think 1770s nautical leg amputations seem to use the same medical technology used in Adrian Beltre's appendectomy some years back.
2008-06-14 16:30:19
275.   Alex41592
BTW, Park was unavailable yesterday and today due to a minor injury. Which explains Proctor today. AND Penny to have MRI tomorrow.
2008-06-14 16:31:20
276.   Alex41592
From Kevin Pearson on Diamond's blog:

Dodgers P Brad Penny, who was once again shelled on Saturday in Detroit, will have an MRI on his right shoulder on Monday.

Penny will fly back to Los Angeles on Sunday to have the tests performed.

Penny said in his previous outing last Sunday in LA that his shoulder was finally feeling a little bit better so obviously this is a step back. He has repeatedly denied pitching this season with an injury but his numbers indicate that this may be a serious issue for the struggling right-hander.

2008-06-14 16:33:52
277.   Bob Timmermann
On the other hand, "My American Cousin" rocked!
2008-06-14 16:33:54
278.   D4P
If injuries aren't hurting Penny's velocity, what kinds of other negative impacts on his pitching might they have?
2008-06-14 16:34:30
279.   ChicagoDodger
276 He has repeatedly denied pitching this season with an injury but his numbers indicate that this may be a serious issue for the struggling right-hander.

Or it could simply mean the Dodgers do not want to continue to send him out there, and the DL seems the best spot to put him for at least the next 11-12 weeks.

2008-06-14 16:36:26
280.   Alex41592
Penny said it's affecting everything. Not worse than before. He feels it every pitch. It's not going to get any better and he'll find out what's wrong. He's not doing the team any good.
2008-06-14 16:37:18
281.   Alex41592
To clarify Penny said it's affecting his location.
2008-06-14 16:44:02
282.   Bumsrap
Kemp seems just a mechanical change away from being a much better hitter. Is it Kemp or is it Easler that can't get that change made.

I suggested Penny go on the DL over a month ago only to have it pointed out to me that he was throwing 95 mph.

2008-06-14 16:44:06
283.   ChicagoDodger
Why isn't Penny's weight being looked at as a problem? 260 lbs seems a bit much for 6'4", and are we certain it's only 260?

Perhaps if they DL him, they could also put him on weight watchers? Or is that against the collective bargaining agreement?

2008-06-14 16:46:43
284.   D4P
Perhaps if they DL him, they could also put him on weight watchers?

Or SlimFast. Brad and Andruw could use a few delicious shakes for breakfast and lunch followed by sensible dinners.

2008-06-14 16:47:35
285.   ChicagoDodger
282 I'd say give Kemp a reasonable amount of AB's in the majors, say 2000? If he can't get it fixed by then, I'd say it's Kemp that can't get the change made. Right now it's too early to tell, so by default I guess we could place the blame with Easler?
2008-06-14 16:48:02
286.   Johnny Nucleo
277 They made our English class watch that in high school. Canadian content. Talk about obscure.
2008-06-14 16:48:32
287.   ChicagoDodger
284 Too funny! Lasorda where are you when they need you?
2008-06-14 16:51:25
288.   underdog
276 Ah hah! I said phantom DL him, now they don't even need the phantom part. DL him.

272 I still don't think the Kuroda signing was bad at all. He's been a bit Jekyll and Hyde, but overall I think he'll be better than almost any other free agent pitcher would've been.


285 - This brings up what will surely be a subject of debate here soon if it isn't already, the whole rehash of how much pitching and hitting coaches mean to a team and whether they deserve to be scapegoated for any failings of the pitchers or hitters. Generally, I think feel they shouldn't shoulder the blame. There are times lately where I wonder if having Mattingly around would've helped, because it seems like he's helped individual hitters when he's been with the team. But I feel like that stuff is generally overblown.

2008-06-14 16:58:06
289.   underdog
256 Very belated but...

{"accidentally" step on cat}

2008-06-14 17:02:41
290.   Bob Timmermann
Costa Rica and Grenada play a 2-2 tie in the second leg of World Cup qualifying. Costa Rica will need at least a 0-0 or 1-1 tie at Saprissa next week to move on.
2008-06-14 17:03:16
291.   ChicagoDodger
288 I guess it all depends on what you feel the role of the hitting instructor is. My take is it is to work with the hitters and help them with their swing when they are having trouble.

But, if the job is to help them, but it's not their fault if they are not able to help, then it begs the question what purpose do they really serve?

If that really is the case though, it's pretty good work, if you can get it!

2008-06-14 17:04:46
292.   ChicagoDodger
290 Costa Rica will need at least a 0-0

Too bad they are not playing the Dodgers! They could certainly provide one of those "0"s!

2008-06-14 17:06:22
293.   Bob Timmermann
Delwyn Young's 3 hits as a DH tied a Dodger team record.

Mike Piazza did it twice, Dave Hansen and Shawn Green did it once each.

2008-06-14 17:15:47
294.   underdog
Wow, a DH who can actually hit! What a concept.
2008-06-14 17:17:08
295.   underdog
The Padres finally smell the coffee and are promoting Chase Headley Lamar.
2008-06-14 17:23:29
296.   Eric Stephen
My fantasy team rejoices.
2008-06-14 17:25:48
297.   ChicagoDodger
While they are at it, couldn't they DL Kent as well? His .239 avg and .680 ops aren't exactly helping now are they?

Besides, then we can all read Rosenthal's column about how badly the Dodgers miss Penny and Kent who despite their pathetic performances this year at least provided "veteran presence in the lineup!"

2008-06-14 17:29:42
298.   MonkeyBlue
I wouldn't mind Kent in the lineup, accept that Torre keep on putting him in the heart of the lineup.
2008-06-14 17:30:06
299.   MonkeyBlue
2008-06-14 17:30:59
300.   Bob Timmermann
Rainout in New York tonight so the Mets and Rangers will have to play a doubleheader tomorrow.

That should be "interesting."

Show/Hide Comments 301-350
2008-06-14 17:32:24
301.   Ken Noe
More on Penny: "he said he felt the pain return when warming up in the bullpen today...."I knew I probably shouldn't have gone out there," Penny said....Penny said that for most of the season he has been taking Toradol, a fast-acting anti-inflammatory, before most of his starts.

2008-06-14 17:34:11
302.   ChicagoDodger
298 Which part don't you mind being in the lineup? The .239 avg or the .680 OPS? Because I'm not exactly thrilled with either!
2008-06-14 17:35:46
303.   Eric Stephen
"I knew I probably shouldn't have gone out there,"

I hope Conte, Torre, Colletti, et al take Penny to task for concealing his injury today. Ridiculous.

2008-06-14 17:37:50
304.   ChicagoDodger
301 Yeah, I guess he thought about not going out there but then thought how well Furcal played all last year while being hurt and decided to give it a go!

I mean, if Furcal could OPS .688 while being hurt, why can't Penny provide a 5.88 era while being hurt?

Playing hurt! The most over-rated attribute ever given a player!

2008-06-14 17:41:29
305.   ucladodger

There has been a change in Kemp's approach, and I'm pretty sure that it isnt all his doing. Last year he looked to turn on pitches, especially fastballs. Sure, it led to some ugly swings on sliders away and lots of strikeouts, but it obviously was effective. This year, his approach is to take everything the other way, especially by sitting on breaking balls and hitting them inside out. Now he cant hit a fastball (even in fastball counts), and most of his power is gone. I find it sad to see Kemp whiff on an 88 mph 2-0 fastball like he did today. Last year that pitch is crushed down the line for a double. It's really hard to hit home runs when all of them are to center or the opposite way. And even with the change of approach, he is still striking out too much. Give me the strikeouts and the power, please. I'm not sure how much the change of approach is due to Easler or the higher-ups, but if i were to put money on it, it would have to go on those upstairs concerned last year about Matt's k's and inability to hit the breaking ball.

2008-06-14 17:41:41
306.   underdog
To answer my own question before, which was basically if the Dodgers do look to acquire another SS, if they realize Berroa isn't the answer as a starter and that Furcal will be out longer and longer... WHO then could they try to acquire who would help them?

I looked at SS's out there who MAY be tradeable (they may not, this is just conjecture, eliminating players who are obviously too good to even both inquiring about, and other players who are clearly terrible...)

here are some possibilities. Who do you think they would have interest in, and the current team would possibly trade? (And which would you prefer?)

I'll just list the current OPS for them, +games played, just for now.

Jed Lowrie (highly unlikely the RedSox would trade him, unless it was a sweet deal): .817
17 G

Ramón Vázquez, Tex: .921; 46 games.

Nick Punto, Min: .738; 24 games. (Would rather have Casilla but don't expect they'd trade him.)

Then there's also Jack Wilson, Pit: .694; 19. One of many SS's they seem to have. He's a vet but could be had cheaply. Would be better than Berroa at least, no?

Too bad Jeff Keppinger's on the DL. Otherwise maybe we could trade them Juan Pierre for him.

I've always wanted Michael Young but he'd be way too expensive too acquire.

Thoughts? Who else? Bobby Crosby seems like someone Beane would consider trading but only if they had a suitable replacement and he might cost too much for what he is, too.

2008-06-14 17:54:52
307.   Alex41592
Tiger just made a RIDICULOUS eagle!
2008-06-14 17:58:51
308.   Bob Timmermann
Faint hope alert:

Royals lead Arizona 4-1 in the third. Hochevar vs. Johnson.

2008-06-14 18:00:27
309.   Gen3Blue
Damn, I knew it was too early to try and find blissful sleep, so of course I woke up. It is true that Ethier and Kemp with their performance and potential have been making some of the older players and staff upset and spiteful.
Seriously, the best stroke of luck would be to replace both execs at once, although if the pertinent trio agreed to wait it out and try to help their talented core, I suppose that could work.
2008-06-14 18:00:57
310.   nofatmike
308 "Royals lead Arizona 4-1 in the third. Hochevar vs. Johnson."

Who does one cheer for?

2008-06-14 18:03:15
311.   Eric Stephen
It's easy to drop the hatred for Hochevar when you remember this:

If the Dodgers signed him in 2005, they wouldn't have been able to draft Kershaw is 2006.

2008-06-14 18:11:33
312.   dzzrtRatt
I've always wanted Michael Young but he'd be way too expensive too acquire.

Isn't his ceiling such that giving up some legitimate talent for him would be justified?

Our most tradeable asset is Derek Lowe, especially with his reputation as a great second-half pitcher. Unfortunately, I think we have to put Furcal in the same part of our minds as Schmidt, someone we might not see again in 2008, someone you cannot count on in any way. And, sadly, someone we can't even think about re-signing. So, given that reality, I don't think it's crazy to recalculate how we're going to approach the SS position. Is Hu really who we want to see out there, full-time, in 2009? If not, then I think it's okay to consider bringing a guy like Young, in his prime, over to the Dodgers and paying a commensurate price.

2008-06-14 18:12:37
313.   underdog
312 And the Rangers are desperate for pitching... Hrmm...
2008-06-14 18:14:27
314.   underdog
Dear Rangers,

We know you really need pitching badly. We think you should want all-star pitcher Brad Penny and we'll throw in a prospect too, for Michael Young.

The Dodgers, c/o Underdog

2008-06-14 18:17:31
315.   underdog
Okay, Penny, Hu and a pitching prospect (not Kershaw) for Michael Young. Do it.

I'm out of here!

2008-06-14 18:18:29
316.   Alex41592
Michael Young signed an extension last season.

5 years/$80M (2009-13)

Plus he has no-trade protection through 2010.

In other words, no thanks.

2008-06-14 18:32:38
317.   Eric Stephen
Michael Young would probably be the worst possible acquisition to play SS for the Dodgers:

1) He is already 31, not really in his prime
2) He is signed through his age 36 season for $16m/yr
3) His defensive +/- MLB rank among SS the past 3 years:

2006: 25th
2007: 29th
2008: 27th

No thanks.

2008-06-14 18:33:14
318.   silverwidow
Assuming Penny goes to the DL (and they don't plan on using Park or Kuo in the rotation), here are the choices:

James McDonald - Best available
Jon Meloan - Command issues as a starter
Eric Stults - Solid, but not a long term answer
Justin Orenduff - See above

McDonald has the most upside, though I'm still not sure if he's ready.

2008-06-14 18:35:25
319.   Eric Stephen
I would imagine it would be Park or Kuo to step into Penny's rotation spot, with Park (unfortunately) probably a 2-1 favorite.
2008-06-14 18:42:32
320.   Gen3Blue
Anybody know how Houlton is doing in Japan.
Even if it's not good, he is the guy I really felt for watching the the Tomdricksen generation of so called starters go through making millions while this guy did a steady job in Vegas, probably just getting buy for Pillars!
2008-06-14 18:42:58
321.   silverwidow
319 In that case, they'll need to call-up a reliever. I noticed that Ramon Troncoso pitched THREE scoreless innings yesterday, so that could be the answer.
2008-06-14 18:45:00
322.   silverwidow
Then again, Troncoso has really struggled in Vegas overall.

Perhaps Greg Miller (who has done a fine job lately).

2008-06-14 18:45:33
323.   Eric Stephen
Yeah, I would imagine it's Troncoso (or maybe Brazoban -- is he hurt?) to come up.
2008-06-14 18:45:56
324.   Bob Timmermann
Houlton is a reliever in Japan. He has six saves for Softbank with a 4.42 ERA.
2008-06-14 19:03:48
325.   bcg60
283 - I agree with you that Penny looks overweight and out of shape. I mentioned it a couple of weeks ago. He was in such great shape at the beginning of last season and it showed in his results. I'm not saying he doesn't have a shoulder problem, but he could stand to lose some weight too.
2008-06-14 19:07:49
326.   Bumsrap
It seems like Colletti and Torre don't want the careers of Easler etc. to suffer from the inexperience of the younger players. That and Torre's continued rant about situational hitting. But if Kemp continues to pull off pitches he is going to need a longer bat or someone helping him to keep his left shoulder from opening too soon and too much. I say this with a smile because it sounds the opposite of what others are saying here and that is why hitters should not listen to everyone who has an opinion as to what is wrong with a swing.
2008-06-14 19:10:11
327.   Bumsrap
Maybe Renteria is available and eager to get back into the National League. Kent for Renteria and LaRoche/DeWitt at second.
2008-06-14 19:12:28
328.   Eric Stephen
The competitive phase of the United States Open has concluded.


2008-06-14 19:46:39
329.   ChicagoDodger
328 That was really something else! Can't imagine anything could possibly happen tomorrow that could top what was witnessed today. But that is the beauty of sports, in that you never know. I guess I should take back a little, my comment in 304 about playing hurt, but then Tiger is quite a unique individual, and at least in golf, if playing hurt doesn't pan out, you are only hurting yourself, and not an entire organization.
2008-06-14 19:50:39
330.   Eric Stephen
at least in golf, if playing hurt doesn't pan out, you are only hurting yourself, and not an entire organization

I think that is key. As part of a team, everyone has a responsibility to everyone else. I know players feel the need to suck it up for the team, but part of the reason managers earn their money is making tough decisions like this. If Torre doesn't have all the information, he can't do his job.

2008-06-14 19:52:25
331.   Gen3Blue
Please, play DeWitt or LaRoche at ss, unless Kent has wandered away and one of them can play second base and one third.
Does Joe actually think they can be worse defensively than Berroa at ss. Offensively, no one can be more offensive than Berroa, Sweeney, or possibly Pierre. What is going on here--it can't be serving rationality, it can't be serving politics, and it's not serving ownership, it's not serving the fans. What the heck is it serving!
2008-06-14 19:53:40
332.   Eric Stephen
Look at the good news: tomorrow will be a great sports day:

10am - Clay K to the rescue, gets win #1
3pm - Tiger tees off, looking for #14
6pm - Lakers force Game 6

This can be Tiger's Ken Venturi or even Ben Hogan moment (even though I know Tiger's knee injury isn't exactly a near fatal car crash).

2008-06-14 19:54:29
333.   Eric Stephen
What the heck is it serving!


2008-06-14 19:56:09
334.   Bob Timmermann
11:45 am PT - Turkey vs. Czech Republic to decide spot #2 from Group A in Euro 2008.
2008-06-14 19:57:24
335.   Gen3Blue
Should we feel betrayed by Furcal? I'm not sure because it is really not someones fault for getting injured. But Furcal last year announced that he was never right and that was why he was awfull all year. Then he led his winter team to the playoffs and looked great for a few games before a ruined back. I hope I don't sound like a bitter Dodgers fan.
2008-06-14 19:58:30
336.   Gen3Blue
333 I hope its not "Serving Humans"!
2008-06-14 19:59:09
337.   Eric Stephen
OK, I finally saw the FSN Make-a-Wish commercial, and I'm with Andrew Shimmin -- the Karros/Kennedy part is a little creepy.
2008-06-14 20:07:57
338.   Gen3Blue
337 I haven't seen it but I'm not surprised it a bit creepy with that combination. They need one more K to really set it loose.
2008-06-14 20:19:31
339.   Bob Timmermann
Yellow alert for Brandon Jones.

Yellow alert.

(He's on the Braves.)

2008-06-14 20:55:16
340.   ToyCannon
Kershaw gets Miggied
Tiger reinjures his knee
Celtics win the title in our house
2008-06-14 20:56:45
341.   Bob Timmermann
Cycle alert canceled.

Stand down.

2008-06-14 20:58:19
342.   Neal Pollack
I think it's time to declare this team a disaster.
2008-06-14 21:01:45
343.   Bob Timmermann
Would the Dodgers qualify for low interest FEMA loans to help rebuild the team then?
2008-06-14 21:04:00
344.   D4P
Regardless of whether you like golf or not, if you haven't been watching Tiger Woods for the past 15 years or so, you've really missed something special.

In other news, we saw a fun French (Freedom?) film tonight called "Priceless". I would think it'd be a good "date" film, if you're into that sorta thing.

2008-06-14 21:07:42
345.   Neal Pollack
Hell, as far as I'm concerned, half of them should move into trailers in the parking lot. Seriously, as fans, we should feel insulted by the way the team is being handled.
2008-06-14 21:12:51
346.   Daniel Zappala
They really need to watch things at the LA Times. First Jack Youngblood is a quarterback, now Game 5 has already been played:

Phil Jackson likes Kobe Bryant's attitude
Coach says his star player was 'uplifting' after Game 5 debacle

2008-06-14 21:17:33
347.   berkowit28
Diamond Leung:

"The news might get worse for the Dodgers. It was learned that Chan Ho Park, a possible replacement for Penny, has been unavailable to pitch out of the bullpen for the past two days after feeling a pinch in the back of his shoulder during his previous outing. He feels better, but still feels a little something when throwing his slider. For what it's worth, Park says he's available to pitch."

2008-06-14 21:20:19
348.   Bob Timmermann
The Lakers have been pre-debacled!
2008-06-14 21:21:45
349.   JoeyP
Tiger's knee will be too much to overcome tomorrow. He really had some lucky shots today to get to -3. I doubt he holes the eagles tomorrow like he did today.
2008-06-14 21:28:17
350.   regfairfield
I said coming into this season that I wouldn't be surprised if we won 80 games or 100, almost everyone on this team had the potential to collapse or be great. So far, almost everything that I feared could go wrong has. Kent and Jones collapsed, Loney and Kemp aren't hitting for power, DeWitt is providing something around LaRoche's 25th percentile performance, Penny collapsed even harder than expected, and Furcal got hurt. Basically, anything that could have gone wrong except for Lowe and Kuroda has.

We have enough young talent that someone can still suddenly breakout, but it's really time to start worrying.

Show/Hide Comments 351-400
2008-06-14 21:39:37
351.   Eric Stephen
Inspired by a recent organizational chart someone made for the A's (I can't find the link to it), here is a history of how the current Dodger roster came to be (which is probably only interesting to me):

1 & 2) Signed Pedro Astacio as an amateur FA (Dominican Republic)
>> traded to Colorado in 1997 for Eric Young
>> who was traded to the Cubs with Ismael Valdez in 1999 for Terry Adams, Brian Stephenson, and Chad Ricketts
>> Ricketts was traded with Luke Prokopec to Toronto in 2001 for Cesar Izturis and Paul Quantrill
>> Quantrill signed as a Type A FA with the Yankees in 2004; as compensation the Dodgers selected Blake DeWitt (round 1) and Justin Orenduff (sandwich pick)

3) Signed Raul Mondesi as an amateur FA (Dominican Republic), June 6
>> traded with Pedro Borbon (see below) to Toronto in 1999 for Shawn Green and Jorge Nunez
>>Nunez was traded with Matt Herges (see below) to Montreal in 2002 for Wilkin Ruan and Guillermo Mota
>>Mota was traded with Paul LoDuca (see below) and Juan Encarnacion (see below) to Florida in 2004 for Hee Seop Choi, Billy Murphy, and Brad Penny

1 & 2) Signed Ismael Valdez as an amateur FA - Mexico (see Astacio for the link to DeWitt & Orenduff)

3) Signed Matt Herges as an undrafted FA (see Mondesi above for the link to Penny)

3) Drafted Paul LoDuca, round 25 (see Mondesi above for the link to Penny)

4) Signed Chan Ho Park as an amateur FA (South Korea)
>> Park signed with Texas in 2002 as a Type A FA; resulting compensation sandwich pick was Greg Miller

5) Signed Luke Allen as an undrafted FA
>>was traded to Colorado in 2003 for Jason Romano
>>who was traded to Tampa Bay in 2004 for Antonio Perez
>>who was traded with Milton Bradley (see below) to Oakland in 2006 for Andre Ethier

6) Signed Kevin Brown as a FA, December 12
>>traded for Jeff Weaver, Brandon Weeden, Yhency Brazoban, and cash in 2003
3) Signed Pedro Borbon as a FA, December 30 (see Mondesi link above)

7) Drafted Jason Repko, round 1
8) Signed Hong-Chih Kuo as an amateur FA (Taiwan), June 19

9) Signed Willy Aybar as an amateur FA (Dominican Republic), January 31
>>traded with Danys Baez (see below) to Atlanta in 2006 for Wilson Betemit
>>Betemit was traded in 2007 to the Yankees for Scott Proctor
3) Drafted Travis Ezi, round 12
>>traded to Florida in 2003 for Juan Encarnacion (see Mondesi above for link to Penny)
5) Signed Franklin Gutierrez as an amateur FA (Venezuela), November 18
>>who was traded to Cleveland in 2004 for Milton Bradley (see above for link to Ethier)

9) Drafted Edwin Jackson, round 6
>>traded with Chuck Tiffany (see below) to Tampa Bay in 2006 for Danys Baez (see above) and All-Star Lance Carter

10) Drafted James Loney, round 1
11) Drafted Jonathan Broxton, round 2
12) Drafted Delwyn Young, round 4
13) Drafted James McDonald, round 11
14) Drafted Eric Stults, round 15
15) Drafted Russell Martin, round 17
16) Signed Ramon Troncoso as an amateur FA (Dominican Republic), June 20
17) Signed Mario Alvarez as an amateur FA (Dominican Republic)
18) Signed Tony Abreu as an amateur FA (Dominican Republic), October 17

19) Signed Chin-Lung Hu as an amateur FA (Taiwan), January 31
20) Drafted Chad Billingsley, round 1
9) Drafted Chuck Tiffany (see above), round 2
21) Drafted Xavier Paul, round 4
22) Drafted Matt Kemp, round 6
23) Drafted Lucas May, round 8
24) Drafted Travis Denker, round 21
>>traded to SF in 2007 for Mark Sweeney
25) Drafted Andy LaRoche, round 39
26) Signed Juan Rivera as an undrafted FA, July 21
>>traded to Kansas City in 2008 for Angel Berroa

27) Drafted Cory Wade, round 10
28) Signed Jeff Kent as a FA, December 15

29) Signed Derek Lowe as a FA, January 11
30) Drafted Jonathan Meloan, round 5
31) Signed Rafael Furcal as a FA, December 19
32) Signed Nomar Garciaparra as a FA, December 19

33) Signed Joe Beimel as a minor league FA, January 25
34) Signed Takashi Saito as a minor league FA, February 7
35) Drafted Clayton Kershaw, round 1
36) Signed Juan Pierre as a FA, November 22
37) Signed Jason Schmidt as a FA, December 8

38) Signed Chan-Ho Park as a minor league FA, November 8
39) Signed Andruw Jones as a FA, December 6
40) Signed Danny Ardoin as a minor league FA, December 12
41) Signed Hiroki Kuroda as a FA, December 15
42) Signed Gary Bennett as a FA, December 17

43) Signed Luis Maza as a minor league FA, February

2008-06-14 21:52:03
352.   underdog
So, no on Michael Young then. Got it.

Who then?

If not Hu, then.

Put on your GM hats, people!

2008-06-14 21:57:10
353.   Eric Stephen
Berroa will get the next two weeks until Nomar gets back. Then Nomar will play SS for a few weeks until he gets hurt. By then (All-Star break or so), either Hu will be ready to come back up or the club will be out of contention so Hu can come back up anyway.

I'm not opposed to trying DeWitt or LaRoche at SS either.

2008-06-14 21:57:52
354.   Gen3Blue
351 If there is one solid good thing in the whole confuscation, it is obtaining Andre Ethier for Antonio Perez and Monopoly-Man.
Some of the drafts are also encouraging.
2008-06-14 21:58:32
355.   68elcamino427
Y. Betancourt of Seattle?

However, when Jones comes back, if he can perform, then Hu should be good enough, No?

Kemp, Jones, Ethier
LaRoche, Hu, DeWitt, Loney

No Trades necessary with this.

2008-06-14 21:58:52
356.   Xeifrank
Off topic, but I've been given the assignment of researching which of the three following universities are the best for an undergraduate business degree for a relative living in Beijing, China wishing to study abroad. Perhaps somebody may know which of the three following schools has the best academic reputation. Any thoughts?
1. Univ Michigan
2. Miami, Ohio
3. Univ of Toledo

vr, Xei

2008-06-14 21:59:25
357.   nofatmike
352 How about Omar Infante? He's still 26, is currently being blocked by Chipper, Yunel, and Kelly Johnson down in Atlanta, and is currently batting .264/.354/.403 off the bench for Atlanta. It's too bad Chan Ho is hurt, might be a worthwhile swap.
2008-06-14 21:59:39
358.   Eric Stephen
I like the fact that, indirectly, Pedro Astacio and Raul Mondesi are still contributing to the Dodgers.
2008-06-14 22:05:54
359.   underdog
355 I worry about a Ned trade as much as anyone, but there are a couple of things that are hard to count on there regarding Jones and Hu.

353 Seems most like scenario, and fairly safe, but also hard to see helping very much.

Trying DeWitt or LaRoche at short couldn't hurt either, but I don't know if either of them can be a fit there.

2008-06-14 22:08:37
360.   nofatmike
351 You forgot drafting Mike Piazza in '88 and signing Zeile in '97. Mike Piazza was then traded with Todd Zeile to the Marlins for Gary Sheffield, Bobby Bonilla, Charles Johnson, Jim Eisenreich, and Manuel Barrios in '98.

Sheffield was then traded to the Braves in 2002 for Odalis Perez, Brian Jordan, and Andrew Brown.

Andrew Brown was then sent with Franklin Gutierrez to the Indians in exchange for Milton Bradley in '04.

Finally, Milton Bradley was packaged with Antonio Perez and traded to the Oakland A's for Andre Ethier in '05.

2008-06-14 22:08:54
361.   underdog
Anyone else in 306 seem worth a shot?

Not that any of us are actually GMs, but as something to consider or think about. Or wile away the hours until the team fully implodes.

2008-06-14 22:09:01
362.   Bob Timmermann
The University of Michigan runs far ahead of the other two schools.

I'm not certain about the business school, but I would be surprised if Miami U or Toledo were comparable.

2008-06-14 22:11:46
363.   Eric Stephen
Michigan looks pretty good.

US News & World rankings here:

2008-06-14 22:13:45
364.   Eric Stephen
You're right! Egregious error on my part, since Piazza's discussion sparked discussion of his link to Ethier, which in part led me to research that list!!!
2008-06-14 22:13:59
365.   Jon Weisman
2008-06-14 22:15:10
366.   nofatmike
364 FAIL


2008-06-14 22:18:30
367.   Gen3Blue
358 This is amazing but true, and mostly because DeWitt is so precosious. If I was Joe, I would find a way to play both youngsters with two capital letters in their names. I would keep running out Y,K,L,M,L,D,and E, until Furcal or Hu was ready to join and damn the critics.
2008-06-14 22:20:43
368.   Daniel Zappala
352 Well I found it interesting. LaRoche was drafted in the 39th round??
2008-06-14 22:25:46
369.   PDH5204
Where's Tom when you need him? The Furcal Incident and the concept of "replacement player". Oh, and Vaudeville, you here? One C. Guzman would taste sweet right about now [as it were].

The consolation? Well, for those fantasy teams with the DL space required, when Penny was dropped a while ago, J. Johnson and A. Sanchez were added and then DL'd, and so the Marlins and some of my fantasy teams have their replacement players in waiting [and we went off the sinking LAD Brad Penny with dignity, and with J. Johnson and A. Sanchez, and either A. Galarraga or G. Smith].

2008-06-15 11:35:35
370.   Mike De Leon
352 La Roche was thought to be unsignable. He had a full ride to Rice and, IIRC, had signed a letter of intent to go there. Every team was surprised, to the point of being shocked, that he signed with the Dodgers.

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