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About Jon
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1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
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9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
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12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Kershaw VI: Kershaw's, Foiled Again?
2008-06-20 15:30
by Jon Weisman

Trivia: Clayton Kershaw has pitched in 15 games this season without earning a win as a pitcher. Why?

Jacksonville (0-3, 2.28 ERA)

  • April 4: Went three innings in his season debut, allowing one earned run, but left trailing 2-1 in what became a 5-1 loss.
  • April 10: Allowed two runs in the first inning of a 2-0 loss. Struck out eight in five innings.
  • April 15: Allowed a run in the sixth inning of another 2-0 loss. That's one run in three games from the Suns offense in support of Kershaw.
  • April 20: Allowed two runs, both unearned, in 5 2/3 innings. Left with the game tied at 2; Jacksonville scored eight runs in the seventh inning.
  • April 25: Pitched six innings of shutout ball, left with a 2-0 lead. Jacksonville led 4-0 in the eighth inning but lost, 5-4.
  • May 2: Pitch 6 2/3 innings, allowing one unearned run. Left with the game tied; Jacksonville scored three in the eighth to win, 4-1.
  • May 7: Suns led 5-3 in the fifth when Kershaw entered and pitched one shutout inning of relief. Stood in position to earn the victory, but Jacksonville lost in 10 innings, 6-5.
  • May 12: Staked to a 2-0 lead, Kershaw allowed more than two runs for the first time in 2008. He left after 3 1/3 innings, trailing 5-2. The Suns later tied the game but lost, 6-5.
  • May 17: Leading 5-0 after five innings, Kershaw allowed three runs (two earned) in the sixth. Jacksonville then gave up eight more and lost, 11-5.
  • May 22: Poised for his Dodger callup, Kershaw pitched a perfect first inning but was then pulled in what became a 6-0 Suns win.

    Los Angeles (0-1, 3.75 ERA, 116 ERA+)

  • May 25: Left after six innings leading, 3-2, in his major-league debut. St. Louis tied the game in the seventh; the Dodgers won in the 10th.
  • May 30: Struggled through 3 2/3 innings, allowing four runs. Dodgers scored four in the eighth to win, 9-5.
  • June 4: Allowed two runs in five innings of a 2-1 loss to Colorado.
  • June 10: Left trailing 2-1 after 5 2/3 innings. Dodgers scored four in the next inning and beat San Diego, 7-2.
  • June 15: Pitched four shutout innings before a rain delay took him out of the scoreless game at Detroit. Tigers went up 5-0 against Chan Ho Park and hung on for a 5-4 victory.

    Kershaw arguably has pitched well enough to have a 11-3 minors/majors record this season (with a no-decision for the May 22 game).

    * * *

    Indians at Dodgers, 7:40 p.m.

  • Comments (208)
    Show/Hide Comments 1-50
    2008-06-20 15:40:38
    1.   larry slimfast
    Joe Morgan would like to point out that the kid just doesn't know how to win.
    2008-06-20 15:41:26
    2.   Zak
    The guy may be a great pitcher but he is not a winner.
    2008-06-20 15:41:59
    3.   Zak
    1 Glad to see it is such an obvious joke :)
    2008-06-20 15:46:00
    4.   Jim Hitchcock
    Before I left for a camping trip last week, I crowed with certitude that `we could beat the Tigers!'.

    I will make no such mistake this time.

    2008-06-20 15:50:06
    5.   Jon Weisman
    4 - No more camping, then.
    2008-06-20 15:51:32
    6.   CodyS
    A major component of earning the official win as a pitcher is being able to stay a long time in the game and be effective. Of course, you can get the win without doing that and you can do that without getting the win. But there is a decent correlation between wins and that highly desirable characteristic of a start. It is legitimate to complain that Kershaw has not been able to pitch deep in games effectively. Of course at his age, it is unrealistic to hope that he will, and probably in some ways counterproductive to his development. But the fact remains that he doesn't currently offer this important facet of a starting pitcher. He's still a great guy to throw out there every 8 days or whatever, don't get me wrong. But there is something important (loosely) captured by Wins, and Kershaw doesn't have it as of June 2008.
    2008-06-20 15:53:51
    7.   Jon Weisman
    6 - Well, part of it is that he's been pulled often because of limits, not ineffectiveness.

    But the importance of pitcher wins is very loose, to use your term. I mean, Kershaw has clearly deserved to have a bunch of them this year.

    2008-06-20 15:56:45
    8.   Eric Enders
    I've always thought that the scoring rules for awarding wins should be changed. If the starting pitcher goes at least 5 innings and leaves with a lead, he should get the win even if his bullpen blows it but his team later re-takes the lead. Too many vulture wins end up going to the Scott Proctors of the world.
    2008-06-20 15:58:27
    9.   Jon Weisman
    8 - I'd be pretty ready to get rid of the five-inning minimum, if I still cared at all about pitcher wins.
    2008-06-20 16:02:07
    10.   Marty
    Wins are for closers!
    2008-06-20 16:02:44
    11.   Marty
    I guess Glen Garry Glen Ross lines don't always translate.
    2008-06-20 16:03:02
    12.   Ryan Jerz
    9 Exactly. Why the different standards for starters and relievers? I'd like to know if I also still cared a lick about wins.
    2008-06-20 16:08:05
    13.   Michael D
    I've never understood why a starter has to go 5 innings to get a win but a reliever can literally not throw a single pitch and get a win, or even if they do just get one out to get a win.
    2008-06-20 16:08:20
    14.   Jon Weisman
    Tonight's lineup:
    Pierre, LF
    Kemp, CF
    Kent, 2B
    Loney, 1B
    LaRoche, 3B
    Ethier, RF
    Berroa, SS
    Ardoin, C
    Kershaw, P
    2008-06-20 16:08:38
    15.   Eric Enders
    It's incumbent upon me to care about wins as long as the world at large cares about them. Wins are never going away, and given that, we should try to make the stat as meaningful as possible so that the stats used by the average fan actually reflect the quality of the player.
    2008-06-20 16:09:57
    16.   Eric Enders
    13 A starting pitcher, like a reliever, can also technically get a win without throwing a pitch. But it's difficult.
    2008-06-20 16:14:57
    17.   Jim Hitchcock
    5 Sorry, next Thursday & Friday, more Sierra. :0. But I'll keep my mouth shut this time!
    2008-06-20 16:16:37
    18.   Jon Weisman
    15 - So, wins are like Ken Rosenthal.
    2008-06-20 16:17:17
    19.   underdog
    LaRoche Alert! Stand Up! LaRoche Alert!


    Jon, I might be suffering from dehydration but I'm embarrassed to admit I don't get the reference in your subject header...

    2008-06-20 16:17:53
    20.   underdog
    18 Wins aren't quite that pointless.
    2008-06-20 16:18:20
    21.   Eric Enders
    The other thing about wins is that what they've become is not at all what was originally intended. We would be better off replacing the pitcher's W-L record with the team's record in games which he starts. This is, in fact, what the wins stat originally measured, because back in the 1870s every starter pitched the complete game, with no exceptions. Wins were a way of measuring how your team did in the games you started.

    But then guys stopped pitching complete games and the concept of the wins stat changed. Its meaning has been distorted from what was originally intended, much in the way that "Wings" has become listed in retrospect as the 1927 Best Picture winner even though Academy members actually voted "Sunrise" as the best film of the year.

    Okay, re-reading, that analogy doesn't really work. But I'm too lazy to come up with something better.

    2008-06-20 16:19:04
    22.   underdog
    Ah, "Curses! Foiled again" - right? Not a movie title. I need to get my head out of the movie catalog.
    2008-06-20 16:19:43
    23.   underdog
    17 Where are you camping this time?
    2008-06-20 16:20:36
    24.   Brent Knapp
    13 what, the first 15 batters bat in the wrong order?
    2008-06-20 16:22:35
    25.   Eric Enders
    24 Pitcher goes to his mouth while on the mound. Ball one is called. Repeat three more times. Batter takes first and is picked off.

    Repeat 15 times.

    (Hey, I told you it was technical.)

    2008-06-20 16:23:13
    26.   Jim Hitchcock
    23 TBD. My cousin has books with every water hole and campsite in California listed. Might head up to the Lassen/Shasta area, but the water there is cold!!
    2008-06-20 16:26:26
    27.   Jim Hitchcock
    23 Speaking of Greencine, last week I took a portable DVD player along. We not only had the best campfire burning, we had movies! It was kinda neat, even though it could be said that it introduces a little too much civilization into the experience.
    2008-06-20 16:27:06
    28.   Ryan Jerz
    26 Almanor is cool. Burney Falls I hear is a great spot. Eagle Lake is closer than both and cool.
    2008-06-20 16:27:28
    29.   bigcpa
    What I can't believe is that Steiner, Reuss, Monday and Ken Levine have openly ridiculed the Quality Start stat this year. Meanwhile they cite win stats on a daily basis just because. Somehow it's unthinkable that 6ip, 3er reflects "quality" yet a 5ip, 3er, WIN is commendable.
    2008-06-20 16:29:52
    30.   Jon Weisman
    BigCPA - Defending the Quality Start since 2003.
    2008-06-20 16:30:23
    31.   Jon Weisman
    30 - I should add, you basically converted me over to your side.
    2008-06-20 16:32:08
    32.   Eric Enders
    What I find amazing is the ceaseless citing of the worst possible quality start (6 IP, 3 ER) as if it were the only kind of quality start that anyone ever gets, instead of a rather rare anomaly. It's like constantly citing 5 innings and 22 earned runs as a ridiculous instance of a pitcher getting a win.

    And even if 6 IP, 3 ER was the only kind of quality start anyone ever got -- that comes out, over a full season, to 204 innings pitched with a 4.50 ERA. In other words, a pitcher that every single team in baseball would embrace having in its rotation.

    2008-06-20 16:33:04
    33.   Jim Hitchcock
    28 Always wanted to see Burney Falls, though the water has the rep of being waaaayyy to cold to swim in. Some fishing might be in order,though.

    Thanks for the tip on Almanor. BTW, where in Northern Nevada are you?

    2008-06-20 16:35:01
    34.   berkowit28
    14 Kemp is batting second, with DeWitt not in the lineup. Not much chance for many RBIs there - if his bat is heating up as it seems to be. I bet he's there because he's a fast baserunner.
    2008-06-20 16:35:22
    35.   underdog
    27 That's neat! Especially if there aren't a lot of other campsites around you, close by, that might get annoyed by having to listen to it against their will. ;-) The one time I went camping by myself a couple of years ago I definitely wished I had something like that, though. Nothing like sitting there in the dark wide awake by yourself. Those owls need to learn to play poker.
    2008-06-20 16:36:39
    36.   Eric Enders
    In case anyone was wondering, since 1957 the most runs ever given up by a pitcher who was credited with a win was 10, by Bob's best pal.

    And also by Vida Blue.

    2008-06-20 16:38:12
    37.   Gen3Blue
    While I like some things about our line-up tonight, it does effectively have a four man black hole. At least Berroa and Maza aren't played together, an event I can't understand with any amount of logic
    (obviously what is called black logic in the Missionary conundrum.)
    Kershaw should just throw normally and get his experience. Cliff Lee is a thirty year old in his prime and having a career year. And in my opinion with a bit of luck Kershaw has every chance to win.
    2008-06-20 16:40:17
    38.   Greg Brock
    Winners win. Losers lose.

    And nodecisioners no-decision.

    2008-06-20 16:41:58
    39.   bigcpa
    30 Ha! That got a smile out of me. I defend the QS because it is one of the few attempts to fix a stupid mainstream stat that gets any airtime at all. The fact that the boys club rips it just adds fuel to my rage.
    2008-06-20 16:42:09
    40.   Marty
    I've spent a lot of time at Almanor. Huge, man-made lake. The town of Chester, on the lake has a cafe with the best chicken-fried steak I've ever had.

    Jim, you should also check out Bucks Lake outside of Quincy. It's a great place with very good fishing.

    2008-06-20 16:43:04
    41.   Jim Hitchcock
    35 LOL!
    2008-06-20 16:46:05
    42.   Jon Weisman
    Given that every night brings a minimum of a three-man so-called black hole at SS, P and LF, it can't be much of a surprise that we sometimes go to four.
    2008-06-20 16:46:18
    43.   overkill94
    36 Vida Blue's a hell of a nice guy. He came to a baseball camp I went to when I was 12 and he couldn't have been a more likable guy.
    2008-06-20 16:47:44
    44.   Jim Hitchcock
    40 Funny you should mention Quincy, Marty...I just left a message for another cousin, who has a cabin outside of town. Hope he can get some time off.
    2008-06-20 16:48:37
    45.   sporky


    By the way, I stopped by my local Borders during lunch. No Daily Variety :(

    2008-06-20 16:57:20
    46.   Kevin Lewis

    I am glad you pointed this out. They used the term "quality start" this past weekend, but it wasn't for the same definition. I got all confused.

    The good news about Vin calling the game: no more debates about instant replay.

    2008-06-20 17:08:29
    47.   underdog
    45 I know, I had the same troubles - both a Border's newsstand and a Border's store did not carry Variety. I know this is SF, not LA, but still, that's pretty lame.

    Rats, I have to go to an event this early evening so I shall have to catch the Minotaur VI playing in the archives. Hope it's a good one.

    2008-06-20 17:09:23
    48.   Ryan Jerz
    33 Live in Reno, work in Carson. I also work at state tourism, so it should be noted I endorse none of the above recommendations as they are in California.
    2008-06-20 17:14:19
    49.   bigcpa
    Historically only 5-6% of all Quality Starts are of the 6ip, 3er variety ( A Neyer study in 2005 showed the avg ERA for pitchers earning Qual Starts was 2.04 compared to 7.70 in Non Qual Starts. Also the avg ERA for NL starters in 2007 was 4.64.

    Reuss said on the air that 4.50 isn't even average. Maybe he's talking about the 80's.

    2008-06-20 17:15:49
    50.   Jim Hitchcock
    48 Cool. I live and work in Carson (work on Arrowhead Dr.), but head to Reno every Saturday to hang out with my cousins.

    So far, your only the second Dodger fan I've run into. Too close to the Bay Area, I guess.

    Show/Hide Comments 51-100
    2008-06-20 17:16:56
    51.   Jim Hitchcock
    {48] We'll have to get together sometime to share the fun stories of driving through Washoe:)
    2008-06-20 17:17:30
    52.   Jiminy Cricket
    Time to see if Loney will continue to hit when Mattingly is around. To my casual observation, it sure seems like having a retired left handed line drive hitting first baseman around to tutor a left handed line drive hitting first baseman sure makes a difference.
    2008-06-20 17:18:45
    53.   El Lay Dave
    My friend have vacation homes/cabins in Eagle Lake, which I've been to a couple times. It's a huge, natural lake that is remote enough to be lightly used. It's a little over 5000' and the water is kinda cold - I used a shorty for water skiing, but I'm getting old and increasingly intolerant of the cold - but you can definitely swim in it, and it's quiet and peaceful there. (Never camped there though.)

    Burney Falls is certainly a beautiful sight and my fingertip confirms that the water is chilly!

    2008-06-20 17:26:54
    54.   CodyS
    I feel it's important to distinguish the ways a pitcher can not win. Ismael Valdes, for example. He never was a winner because he was such a wussy closet boy. His teammates were so disgusted with his wussiness that they were willing to sacrifice their own statistics to make sure the Dodgers never scored when he pitched. At least I'm pretty sure that's what Rick Monday et al said at the time.
    2008-06-20 17:28:35
    55.   Eric Enders
    In 2007, 11.2 percent of quality starts were of the 6 IP, 3 ER variety. (261 of 2,324)
    2008-06-20 17:35:54
    56.   bigcpa
    Another bit of drivel heard recently... our starters are 19-31 and the bullpen is 15-7. This is presented as evidence of some kind of defect in the rotation.
    2008-06-20 17:38:28
    57.   Marty
    Big trout in Eagle Lake. Last time I was there they had just had a pretty big fire. Lots of charred wood.
    2008-06-20 18:09:25
    58.   Telemachos
    Go Blue! I'm off to the stadium to see the Minotaur live for the first time. Glad to see LaRoche's in the lineup too.
    2008-06-20 18:20:05
    59.   MollyKnight
    Dodgers and Indians! Weird!
    2008-06-20 18:21:06
    60.   Alex41592
    Some good news as the Twins have a 6-0 lead on the D'Backs in the 4th.
    2008-06-20 18:37:57
    61.   Disabled List
    In my fantasy league, we use quality starts as a scoring category instead of wins. We just started doing it this year, and it's been a big success. The correlation between QS and W's is almost 1:1, and it eliminates wins thanks to big offense, vultured wins by relievers, and bullpen shenanigans.

    Count me a fan of the QS.

    2008-06-20 18:45:35
    62.   KG16
    The problem with the minimum quality start is that it doesn't really sound like that great of a start. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just talking perception. Personally, I'd like to see the requirement for a quality start extended to 7 innings.

    The problem with wins is the middle reliever, and particularly the different rules for starters and relievers.

    I think the proper way to measure these is as a ratio, QS:W. I'd also suggest a line of W-L-QS.

    For relievers I think a ratio of BS:W is also something worth looking at.

    2008-06-20 18:51:25
    63.   68elcamino427
    #27 Matt Kemp, The Bison, Tougher Than a Robot Made Of Nails, rounding a base near you ... soon. Fasten your seatbelts Cleveland Indians!
    2008-06-20 19:15:30
    64.   Linkmeister
    The usual Borders I go to doesn't carry Variety either (I asked).

    How come Firefox 3.0 has eliminated storing my sign-in cookie for the Toaster? Ken?

    2008-06-20 19:22:08
    65.   Marty
    Yeah, I noticed it doesn't remember my login name anymore too.
    2008-06-20 19:23:54
    66.   dianagramr
    64 65

    the first time you reach a (now forgotten) page, you should see a "pop-up" asking you if you want firefox to remember your password

    2008-06-20 19:27:53
    67.   Marty
    I don't get no popups
    2008-06-20 19:29:45
    68.   D4P
    Preferred Option:

    1. Eliminate "Win" statistic completely

    Second Best Option:

    2. Eliminate 5-inning minimum requirement for starting pitchers

    Third Best Option:

    3. Distinguish between "Starter Wins" and "Reliever Wins".

    2008-06-20 19:30:06
    69.   MollyKnight
    I have been out every night this week and my goose is cooked. I have just made the executive decision to skip my friend's concert in favor of staying in and watching the game. Of course, he's a Dodger fan so he should understand.
    2008-06-20 19:31:55
    70.   MollyKnight
    Is anybody else really excited about seeing Clayton Kershaw pitch to Grady Sizemore? Ahhhh!!
    2008-06-20 19:34:03
    71.   Linkmeister
    69 Phew. Livin' the high life, huh? ;)

    No pop-up here, either.

    2008-06-20 19:37:23
    72.   Linkmeister
    I, on the other hand, stayed in and made crock-pot bbq.

    2008-06-20 19:40:00
    73.   68elcamino427
    The Minotaur has captured my attention like no other. Every time that I see him pitch, I feel that I'm witnessing another steppingstone on a pathway that leads to a historic career.
    2008-06-20 19:40:09
    74.   tjshere
    65 I've had no problem with that, but Cool Iris seems to only work when it wants to with Firefox 3.
    2008-06-20 19:42:27
    75.   MollyKnight
    69-Yah. I go to plays and baseball games.
    2008-06-20 19:43:17
    76.   Andrew Shimmin
    Ctrl-Shift-Del will open Clear Private Data box. After you delete your saved passwords, it should re-prompt you to save them, the next time.

    I always delete the hidden user files when I install a major upgrade, after uninstalling the program (after backing up my bookmarks, searchbar plugins, and extensions). I'm all about fresh starts.

    I assume LaRoche is going to a costume ball as Colonel Sanders, next week, and is just getting his facial hair in order.

    2008-06-20 19:45:10
    77.   MollyKnight
    Oh, and Ben Francisco and Ryan Garko both went to Servite and graduated the same year. I think Vin just said Diamond Bar.
    2008-06-20 19:45:19
    78.   El Lay Dave
    76 "I'm all about fresh starts."

    Good time to get rid of the pleated pants?

    2008-06-20 19:47:13
    79.   Andrew Shimmin
    78- I'll lose the pleats when I decide to stop sitting down or putting things in my pockets. Until then, they're useful enough that I'm willing to tolerate D4P's disdain.
    2008-06-20 19:47:53
    80.   Andrew Shimmin
    Scrappy throw to second.
    2008-06-20 19:49:34
    81.   Indiana Jon
    After three days in Cincinnati, bringing the Dodgers good luck, I am starting to believe the Dodgers don't like me. Not only did Kershaw pitch the game before Cincy and now the game after, but Laroche didn't see one at bat during my three games there. I knew I should have gone to Detroit.
    2008-06-20 19:50:13
    82.   El Lay Dave
    57 Eagle Lake Trout is its own species. Cooks up pink!
    2008-06-20 19:52:27
    83.   MonkeyBlue
    Wow, tough break for Kent.
    2008-06-20 19:53:03
    84.   Andrew Shimmin
    I wonder whose bright idea that was.
    2008-06-20 19:55:06
    85.   68elcamino427
    Nice at bats by Kemp and Loney.
    2008-06-20 19:58:23
    86.   scareduck
    68 - The Mariners would be happy if wins were eliminated as a measure of the team's standings.
    2008-06-20 20:01:20
    87.   68elcamino427
    Kershaw dominates the batters in the second inning.
    2008-06-20 20:03:29
    88.   D4P
    The Dodgers wouldn't be too displeased themselves.
    2008-06-20 20:07:14
    89.   D4P
    How is Ned most likely to get rid of LaRoche:

    1. Trade
    2. DFA

    2008-06-20 20:08:54
    90.   tjshere
    3. Unprotected in Rule 5 draft
    2008-06-20 20:10:20
    91.   silverwidow
    90 Doesn't apply -- LaRoche is already on the 40-man roster.
    2008-06-20 20:11:58
    92.   El Lay Dave
    Lots of notes on the P-E blog by Kevin Pearson:

    Andruw Jones (knee) took live batting for the first time and Torre said that Jones looked more comfortable than he has all season.

    Nomar Garciaparra (calf) will be shut down for at least 10 more days and is not expected to return before the All-Star Break.

    Communication problems: Hiroki Kuroda ... has been dealing with the (tendinitis) issue for 3 weeks, .... What makes this a major issue is the fact that he has been seeing the trainers for three weeks to get treatment and get medication but somehow there was a lack of communication to Joe Torre and Ned Colletti that this may have been a serious issue.

    2008-06-20 20:13:23
    93.   El Lay Dave
    Add 92 "communication problems":
    neither Torre or Colletti told Kuroda he was going on the DL. The player said he heard it from someone else not involved in the decision making process.
    2008-06-20 20:14:08
    94.   El Lay Dave
    Hot night. I hope the Dodgers can hit a few out too.
    2008-06-20 20:14:34
    95.   Andrew Shimmin
    Who's going to come back sooner:

    1. Nomar
    2. Godot

    2008-06-20 20:16:07
    96.   scareduck
    And now, something entirely different:

    (I know one of the skaters.)

    2008-06-20 20:18:44
    97.   scareduck
    95 - 3. (Ivan de) Jesus.
    2008-06-20 20:19:25
    98.   dianagramr

    Bell Bottoms

    2008-06-20 20:19:34
    99.   KG16
    95 - Godot, but I hear he's already come and gone
    2008-06-20 20:20:23
    100.   El Lay Dave
    Good spot for the K.
    Show/Hide Comments 101-150
    2008-06-20 20:21:10
    101.   scareduck
    98 - come and gone, my friend.
    2008-06-20 20:21:34
    102.   Andrew Shimmin
    Note to self: never let scareduck set me up on a blind date.
    2008-06-20 20:21:57
    103.   68elcamino427
    Nice recovery by the twenty year old.
    2008-06-20 20:23:16
    104.   Bluebleeder87
    was the HR Kershaw gave up a little high? It looked a little high from were I'm sitting but it definitely looked down the middle
    2008-06-20 20:24:40
    105.   El Lay Dave
    ...She was five foot six and two fifteen
    A bleached-blonde mama
    With a streak of mean
    She knew how to knuckle
    And she knew how to scuffle and fight

    And the Roller Derby program said
    That she was built like a 'frigerator with a head
    The fans call her Tuffy
    But all her buddies called her Spike

    You know that I fell in love with a Roller Derby Queen
    Round and round, oh round and round
    The meanest hunk o' woman
    That anybody ever seen
    Down in the arena...

    2008-06-20 20:25:16
    106.   KG16
    What are the odds that the Dodgers trade for Sabathia before the start of tomorrow night's game?
    2008-06-20 20:26:15
    107.   KG16
    105 - that's why you shouldn't look at the tv when leaving the bar
    2008-06-20 20:26:57
    108.   scareduck
    102 - no, none of them have been blinded to my knowledge.
    2008-06-20 20:27:31
    109.   Marty
    Unusual arm angle. Lucky for us Choi isn't in there.
    2008-06-20 20:29:20
    110.   Gen3Blue
    Oh, to face Cliff Lee, with a black whole to boot.
    2008-06-20 20:29:38
    111.   Bluebleeder87
    Pamela Anderson is sitting about 8 rows from were I'm at.
    2008-06-20 20:29:39
    112.   dianagramr

    but has anyone blinded you with science?

    2008-06-20 20:30:41
    113.   Gen3Blue
    Of course, Feller has to be mentioned. Luckily I'm not that old.
    2008-06-20 20:30:48
    114.   El Lay Dave
    108 That might have worked to Shimmin's advantage.
    2008-06-20 20:31:02
    115.   Marty
    Does that mean part of her is only 7 rows away?
    2008-06-20 20:31:21
    116.   El Lay Dave
    111 Dude, posting from DS! How old is she looking now?
    2008-06-20 20:31:51
    117.   scareduck
    112 - good heavens, Miss Nakamoto, you're beautiful! Er, uh, no, why do you ask?
    2008-06-20 20:32:21
    118.   Andrew Shimmin
    114- Hello. Is it me you're looking for?
    2008-06-20 20:32:32
    119.   scareduck
    116 - I don't think you can answer that without a core sample.
    2008-06-20 20:33:08
    120.   68elcamino427
    Belt high, middle of the plate. They gave a slo-mo overhead view of the bat hitting the ball just in front of the plate, with Kelly releasing his right hand just after impact getting very nice extension and staying back, stepping on his right foot. I commented to myself, "Bison, swing like that!".
    2008-06-20 20:33:11
    121.   KG16
    115 - or 9 rows away?
    2008-06-20 20:34:07
    122.   dianagramr

    winner .... quote of the night!

    (and that core has got to be REALLLY cold)

    2008-06-20 20:34:33
    123.   Zak
    92 , 93 Maybe we hired DePodesta as our Japanese translator.
    2008-06-20 20:34:51
    124.   dianagramr

    her mere presence causes a rip in the space/mind continuum

    2008-06-20 20:36:05
    125.   scareduck
    Vinny mentions Casey Blake is from Wichita State.

    That school is dead to me:

    2008-06-20 20:36:15
    126.   Marty
    What insurance is that Yogi?

    Making a commercial that they never stop playing.

    2008-06-20 20:36:28
    127.   ucladodger
    Clayton cant just lay the ball in there 2-0. Twice they just plastered a 2-0 fastball over the heart.
    2008-06-20 20:37:34
    128.   KAYVMON
    Does the Minotaur only throw his change-up to righties?
    2008-06-20 20:38:19
    129.   El Lay Dave
    If Pam were up on pointe shoes and given a good twist, would she spin forever?
    2008-06-20 20:38:31
    130.   68elcamino427
    121 is the correct answer.
    2008-06-20 20:39:07
    131.   Bluebleeder87
    She still looks nice I guess.
    2008-06-20 20:39:26
    132.   El Lay Dave
    128 Pretty much.
    2008-06-20 20:40:43
    133.   Andrew Shimmin
    Pff. Loney would have taken three.
    2008-06-20 20:41:20
    134.   68elcamino427
    The old man hits a stand up double to the wall in right center!
    2008-06-20 20:41:23
    135.   dianagramr
    in 11 days Pam turns 41 ...
    2008-06-20 20:41:42
    136.   scareduck
    107 - you know the funny thing is I had that album on my iPod and I had never listened to it until you brought up those lyrics. That's pretty terrific.
    2008-06-20 20:41:45
    137.   El Lay Dave
    I wonder if the Indians' RF is avoided a lot?
    2008-06-20 20:42:11
    138.   KAYVMON
    Old Grumpy! If Lebron-Sizemore is the most physically gifted city combination in pro sports, Kent and Vlade #2 must be the least.
    2008-06-20 20:43:28
    139.   Andrew Shimmin
    Can actors and actresses still get away with lying about their ages? Or does that not work, anymore?
    2008-06-20 20:44:37
    140.   68elcamino427
    Hey everybody, Andy's Up!
    2008-06-20 20:44:39
    141.   El Lay Dave
    139 Only Caribbean ballplayers can do that.
    2008-06-20 20:45:06
    142.   Marty
    Andy stung it.
    2008-06-20 20:45:23
    143.   dianagramr
    Lee throws strikes 68% of time (league average 62%)
    2008-06-20 20:46:58
    144.   KAYVMON
    132 Since all I know about baseball is that it and jazz are the two best things in life, can you explain to me why lefties throw change-ups more to righties more, Id be much obliged. Someone needs to tell Andy a funny joke, hes looked mad all game
    2008-06-20 20:47:12
    145.   KG16
    124 - i think it depends on which way she's facing
    2008-06-20 20:48:07
    146.   scareduck
    139 - it worked for Satchel Paige, right?
    2008-06-20 20:49:16
    147.   KG16
    139 - imdb says not really.
    2008-06-20 20:50:20
    148.   68elcamino427
    Vin - "riding the elevator from a two run home run, to a strikeout."
    2008-06-20 20:51:17
    149.   natepurcell
    what is gameday saying that pitch to K shoppach was?
    2008-06-20 20:52:13
    150.   nick
    Has DT already appropriately 'buked and scorned this nonsense from Rosenthal? (Linked at BTF)

    "As bad as center fielder Andruw Jones was...the Dodgers were better offensively when he was healthy.

    [Jones' last start May 18; record 22-21. 12-17 since then. 4.9 runs game before; 3.7 after.]

    "Part of the drop-off, obviously, is attributable to the loss of Furcal to a back injury on May 5. But the increased workload for Andre Ethier and Matt Kemp in Jones' absence has not improved the performances of either young outfielder.

    "Ethier's OPS before Jones went down was .804; since then it's .776. Kemp's OPS was .793 before Jones' injury; since then it's .767.

    "The decreases might not be dramatic, but they're enough to suggest that both Ethier and Kemp benefited from the competition for playing time that existed when Jones was healthy. Then again, they also could reflect the typical inconsistency of young players."

    --Note that last sentence, which manages the difficult trick of simultaneously completely coping out from the initial bogus argument AND introducing a new, unsubstantiated cliche!

    Really masterful work from Rosenthal...

    Show/Hide Comments 151-200
    2008-06-20 20:53:53
    151.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
    Re: 149



    2008-06-20 20:54:27
    152.   natepurcell

    His job is easier when trades happen. Which team has lots of money and lots of young talent other teams covet?

    He just wants the Dodgers to do something so he will actually have something to write.

    2008-06-20 20:55:06
    153.   scareduck
    150 - not one of his better pieces, that's for sure. And yes, it's been trampled underfoot previously.
    2008-06-20 20:55:30
    154.   KAYVMON
    150 All that needs to be said is that there are more anonymous and higher-paying jobs where he can be a complete tool.
    2008-06-20 20:57:22
    155.   68elcamino427
    What's with this Lee guy? Bring back the Reds!
    2008-06-20 20:58:51
    156.   El Lay Dave
    144 I might guess that a lefty considers a curveball a better choice than a changeup to a fellow lefty.
    2008-06-20 20:59:45
    157.   berkowit28
    Lee is almost always throwing the first two pitches strikes, and the next two balls (low). The Dodger batters need to attack the first pitch.
    2008-06-20 21:00:35
    158.   MollyKnight
    I'm going to have a really good giggle if Andruw Jones returns from this injury and begins hitting baseballs over the fence at a rapid rate.

    It'll be like, psyyyyyych!

    2008-06-20 21:00:41
    159.   natepurcell
    Orenduff pitched (sorta) tonight...

    1.2IP 7H 7ER 2bb 4k

    I don't think he should pitched in the Majors just yet...

    2008-06-20 21:01:02
    160.   scareduck
    144 , 156 - presumably a change will drop off the table and fade away from a righty where it's easier to get a curve to break away from a lefty. Or maybe it's backwards. But I do remember that the point is that one type of pitch will break a different way depending on the handedness of the batter.
    2008-06-20 21:03:19
    161.   El Lay Dave
    Ooof, 0-2 to a BB ... to Jamey Carroll.
    2008-06-20 21:03:33
    162.   68elcamino427
    Scott Proctor, please sit down.
    2008-06-20 21:03:41
    163.   KAYVMON
    There's the change-ups. C'mon Kid save us from the Proctologist
    2008-06-20 21:05:56
    164.   natepurcell
    It seems like every game I watch, Scott Proctor is always warming up in the bullpen.
    2008-06-20 21:05:58
    165.   KAYVMON
    2008-06-20 21:06:14
    166.   nick
    Kershaw can be an average MLB pitcher even when he's struggling a little (ever since his first start)--so hard to watch, though...
    2008-06-20 21:06:15
    167.   Marty
    Well, Kershaw is not going to lead us into the promised land this year. Hopefully he follows the same path as Bills. He could be a monster at 22.
    2008-06-20 21:06:33
    168.   Andrew Shimmin
    Take the question mark off the post title.
    2008-06-20 21:07:22
    169.   nick
    164 after a season or so you get used to it...
    2008-06-20 21:07:45
    170.   Bluebleeder87
    Torre loves Proctor...


    2008-06-20 21:08:01
    171.   natepurcell
    Blah, add two more earned runs to Kershaw's era.
    2008-06-20 21:08:36
    172.   Jon Weisman
    167 - Sounds good to me.
    2008-06-20 21:09:36
    173.   Bluebleeder87
    the only thing I ask of Proctor is NOT to leave his curvball up.
    2008-06-20 21:11:44
    174.   KAYVMON
    To be fair, this is the right situation to use Proctor. Its not like we're showing any sign of scoring runs
    2008-06-20 21:13:03
    175.   El Lay Dave
    I hope Proctor eschews S. Choo's bat.
    2008-06-20 21:14:16
    176.   68elcamino427
    I like Ardoin behind the plate.
    2008-06-20 21:14:27
    177.   scareduck
    175 - shoo, Choo.
    2008-06-20 21:15:41
    178.   scareduck
    "For Joe Torre and the rest of the frustrating staff..." A verbal slip, no doubt, but an accurate one.
    2008-06-20 21:16:36
    179.   scareduck
    The woman in the Indians jersey looked like she was about to disrobe.
    2008-06-20 21:18:49
    180.   68elcamino427
    A valiant effort by Scott Proctor, but a very predictable result (inherited base runner scores).
    2008-06-20 21:18:53
    181.   MonkeyBlue
    Man Proctor is the worst reliever ever.
    2008-06-20 21:19:55
    182.   Daniel Zappala
    But he struck out the side and he gave up only a single.
    2008-06-20 21:21:11
    183.   Jon Weisman
    2008-06-20 21:23:00
    184.   68elcamino427
    Kershaw and Proctor pass by one another on the baseball highway. Kershaw heading up the mountain and Proctor speeding down hill.
    2008-06-20 21:23:22
    185.   KAYVMON
    God, its a shame Pee Wee doesn't play in LF everyday. Such a confident hitter.
    2008-06-20 21:23:46
    186.   scareduck
    183 - ??
    2008-06-20 21:24:49
    187.   Andrew Shimmin
    Kershaw arguably has pitched well enough to have a 11-3 minors/majors record this season (with a no-decision for the May 22 game).
    2008-06-20 21:25:50
    188.   nick
    Proctor appeared in 83 games in 2006 and 2007...this year shouldn't be much of a surprise.
    2008-06-20 21:26:11
    189.   KG16
    it's so weird to hear that Pierre was sitting on a fast ball. and two inches to the left and he's probably standing on second or third.
    2008-06-20 21:27:46
    190.   El Lay Dave
    Juan Pierre: The Fielder's Cherce.
    2008-06-20 21:28:57
    191.   scareduck
    That is the craziest single I've ever seen. Is that an infield single because it hit the pitcher first?
    2008-06-20 21:28:58
    192.   68elcamino427
    The old man is hot!
    2008-06-20 21:29:21
    193.   El Lay Dave
    Run expectancy with first and third and no outs is about 1.5. So Proctor was about 33% above average tonight.
    2008-06-20 21:29:52
    194.   KG16
    191 - that's not all that crazy, guys hit it off the pitcher all the time
    2008-06-20 21:30:06
    195.   scareduck
    2008-06-20 21:30:41
    196.   Andrew Shimmin
    Five lousy feet. I hate baseball.
    2008-06-20 21:30:50
    197.   tjshere
    163 That may be the funniest nickname for a ballplayer I've ever heard.

    Yes, I'm easily amused.

    2008-06-20 21:31:00
    198.   68elcamino427
    Loney, missed it by thattt much.
    2008-06-20 21:34:37
    199.   KAYVMON
    Not to rub it in, but it was actually something like one centimeter. I would not be suprised in the least if Loney was far and away our most productive player at the end of the season.
    2008-06-20 21:35:54
    200.   spacebrother

    My girlfriend and I call im "Proctorologist.."

    Show/Hide Comments 201-250
    2008-06-20 21:37:43
    201.   scareduck
    197 - I only wish the Robot Made Outta Nails had enough currency.

    Somebody needs to fire Cliff Lee. He's not hitting enough.

    2008-06-20 21:38:34
    202.   Jon Weisman
    2008-06-20 21:39:17
    203.   KG16
    201 - well, if the NL would just join the 21st century and hire part time players...
    2008-06-20 21:39:17
    204.   Zak
    If I had to guess without looking, I would guess that in the last month, we must have matched the Diamondback result for that day about 70% of the time.
    2008-06-20 21:39:54
    205.   KAYVMON
    Vin's the best.
    2008-06-20 22:00:38
    206.   spacebrother
    Back to those Dodgers we know and love this season.
    2008-06-20 22:32:55
    207.   spacebrother
    What happened to everyone?
    2008-06-20 23:52:43
    208.   spacebrother
    Oh, they NPUT'ed.

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