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About Jon
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1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
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4) arguing for the sake of arguing
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An Ironic Burst of Optimism About Sports Fans Online
2008-07-06 21:57
by Jon Weisman

I'm pretty sure it's been said recently that sports fans on the Internet have no shame, morals, ethics, common courtesy or some combination of the above. But apparently, when we go to the games themselves, we're princes - or so the Dodgers are kind enough to believe (or naive enough to hope).

Dylan Hernandez of the Times has a follow-up story on the previously mentioned TravelZoo promotion that makes available tickets for this week's Dodger home games at prices as low as $3. He writes:

Under the latest promotion, offered by to members, $16 reserved seats cost $3, $20 lower reserved seats $6, $28 infield reserved $9 and $50 field box seats $18. To purchase tickets, fans can log onto (the site) and use the promotion code TZOOJULY.

Steve Shiffman, the Dodgers' vice president of ticket sales, said the method of distributing tickets wouldn't attract the kind of fans who misbehaved and prompted the cancellation of the once-popular promotion that included $2 right-field pavilion seats on Tuesday nights.

Because this promotion is Internet-based, Shiffman said, "You're targeting an affluent crowd, a computerized crowd."

I'm making no predictions whatsoever for this week's games, but I'm not convinced that the Internet is a rich man's playground or that drunken louts can't click the little blue link. However, I sincerely hope for the best, because it's true - we're not all Deadspin commenters. Nice to get the benefit of the doubt for a change!

And yes, by the way, it does appear that TravelZoo is getting sufficient publicity for its efforts.

* * *

Howard Cole of Baseball Savvy got some nice ink tonight about his quest for a Sandy Koufax statue at Dodger Stadium in a Times package concerning monuments at baseball parks.

Comments (220)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-07-06 22:09:35
1.   Bob Timmermann
Steve Shiffman needs to come to my workplace sometime.
2008-07-06 22:10:59
2.   ToyCannon
Seems like a good time for a group package. I wonder if there is a limit on the tickets.
2008-07-06 22:11:48
3.   natepurcell
I want to go to a Dodgers game this week. Let me know if any of you guys don't have tickets you want to sell off.
2008-07-06 22:12:17
4.   natepurcell
Or maybe I should just buy the absurdly cheap tickets available above.
2008-07-06 22:12:45
5.   Bob Timmermann
I'll be the guy wearing spats at the game Thursday sitting a few rows in front of bhsportsguy.

But he won't be able to see around my top hat.

2008-07-06 22:15:09
6.   Fallout
Bulletin: In an unexpected move today the Dodgers announced the signing of Barry Bonds. Ned Colletti, the Dodger general manager, said that they were in need of a power hitter and when he heard that Bonds had been playing shortstop he sent his scouts out to take a look. Apparently they liked what they saw.
Bonds, who had been desperate to get back into baseball, said that he saw a need in the Dodger organization and started working out at the position in the past couple months. His efforts have paid off and will report to his new team on Monday.
2008-07-06 22:15:37
7.   ToyCannon
That is one less thing the anti-McCourt group can complain about. He certainly is making the seating affordable for a family.
2008-07-06 22:15:43
8.   Linkmeister
I can't make it, so it would be a nice gesture if somebody wore a Reyn or Tori Richards shirt in my honor. ;)

Statuary: Frank White?

2008-07-06 22:16:38
9.   ToyCannon
I always felt we should have signed Barry just to twist the needle into the Giant fans.
2008-07-06 22:20:45
10.   Bob Timmermann
The Dodgers won't put up a statue unless they get to do their modifications to the stadium. Since the stadium doesn't have a single entrance, there's no place to put a statue for people to see it.

I think the Cardinals lead the majors in statues. Musial, Gibson, Schoendienst, Slaughter, and Jack Buck all have statues. There could be more.

The Reds have several at their new park also.

The Gene Autry statue in Anaheim always seems like something of an afterthought.

2008-07-06 22:23:53
11.   Greg Brock
I'm fairly confident there will be a statue of Jackie Robinson or Vin Scully at Dodger Stadium before I die. know...A statue of the fans.

2008-07-06 22:25:18
12.   Icaros
I was involved in the Kuo Wars years ago, but that was only because Greg wasn't giving him much credit. I always liked Billingsley, too.

I usually side with Greg on LaRoche/DeWitt, but the issue is at times a white whale for him.

2008-07-06 22:25:29
13.   bhsportsguy
4 If you want to go to Thursday's game, I have an extra ticket.
2008-07-06 22:25:43
14.   ToyCannon
They could put the statue in front of Canters so that only those affluent enough to afford those seats can genuflect. Why waste a statue on the kind of people who buy tickets on a walk up basis.
2008-07-06 22:25:56
15.   Icaros know...A statue of the fans.

I call shotgun!

2008-07-06 22:27:19
16.   Jon Weisman
Hey, the oft-maligned widget has been upderated!
2008-07-06 22:27:46
17.   Greg Brock
12 Kuo was just the girl with the curl for me. Two surgeries, brilliant stuff, injured.

After Dreifort, I didn't think I could love again. I've been hurt before.

2008-07-06 22:27:46
18.   ToyCannon
It was only the spring of 2007. Don't make us older then we really are.
I'm ready for Canuck to remind us how stupid we were for even raising the idea that Kuo might have as much talent as Chad.
2008-07-06 22:30:06
19.   Icaros

I remembered it as a Winter 06 debate, but fair enough. You agreed with with it.

2008-07-06 22:30:12
20.   ToyCannon
Are you teaching summer school? I heard it starts tomorrow but that is for LAUSD.
2008-07-06 22:31:25
21.   Icaros

For me, there was no going back after the bat flip. I wonder if he got my flowers?

2008-07-06 22:32:25
22.   Greg Brock
17 Not enough kids enrolled, so I lost the summer gig. Which, aside from the money I lost, is actually fine by me.

AP Summer Institute all next week though. In Long Beach.

2008-07-06 22:33:38
23.   bhsportsguy
20 He told us last week of his sad tale of his summer school class being cancelled and then lots of dental work.
2008-07-06 22:35:01
24.   Greg Brock
23 I didn't mention it here. Yeah, wisdom teeth pulled, summer school canceled, 101 degree fever for three days.

The end of June was a harsh mistress. I took it out on Blake DeWitt, naturally.

2008-07-06 22:36:46
25.   ToyCannon
Four years ago my wife had 5 fourth grade teachers. Now they are down to 2 and a split.
2008-07-06 22:38:50
26.   Icaros

At first read I thought that comment had something to do with fertility drugs.

2008-07-06 22:39:50
27.   ToyCannon
After Blake who else do you have it in for that has yet to see the major leagues. Jamie Hoffman or Jamie Pedroza. I've never been a big fan of the name Jamie. Is that a good enough reason?
2008-07-06 22:40:15
28.   bhsportsguy
24 Oops, sorry, see what happens when affluent people mix up their sources of wireless information.

It would be a lot easier if I had to rely on George Washington's personal courier relay my correspondence.

2008-07-06 22:43:10
29.   Greg Brock
27 I haven't decided yet. The enemies list doesn't get updated until fiscal year '09, which starts in October for me.

I can't go creating personal vendettas willy-nilly.

2008-07-06 22:46:58
30.   CanuckDodger
18 -- Do you remember me saying something I don't remember? I honestly don't know what you are talking about.
2008-07-06 22:53:17
31.   ToyCannon
You were Chad's biggest backer. I'm just projecting what you would have said to us if you had read the thread where we felt that Kuo had as much talent as Chad based on the Sept 06 pitching that Kuo did in the rotation.
2008-07-06 22:58:31
32.   CanuckDodger
31 -- Kuo probably had more talent than Chad when he signed him, but all the injuries to Kuo's elbow make it difficult to compare them. One thing that doesn't get said enough about Billz is his durability. No arm injury of any kind in five years. That is pretty amazing for a hard-throwing pitcher between ages 18-23, the injury nexus.
2008-07-06 22:59:05
33.   CanuckDodger
32 -- When WE sign him, that is.
2008-07-06 22:59:25
34.   Jon Weisman
32 - Knock on wood.
2008-07-06 23:01:03
35.   Icaros
After Saito steps aside, I'd like to see Kuo and Broxton used as a two-headed, three-inning closer duo.

Start the seventh with one, based on matchups, let him try for two innings, or pass the baton in the 8th if he gets into too much trouble.

They can trade off. One monster from each side.

2008-07-06 23:01:57
36.   Greg Brock
Kuo had TJ twice, and has four total surgeries on the one elbow (unless I'm off, which I'm sure will be corrected in a nanosecond).

He'll always be house money to me.

2008-07-06 23:05:06
37.   Icaros

Those chips can be made to look rather nice. Circus Circus had pink ones.

2008-07-06 23:08:16
38.   Greg Brock
I just naturally assumed everybody else was waiting for Kuo to get hurt again.

I'm still waiting on Brad Penny to come off the bump holding his elbow again.

2008-07-06 23:08:51
39.   underdog
32 But... but... Will Carroll says that Billingsley is constantly on the verge of surgery, or surge of vergery or something injury-related. It can't be!

Btw, I don't think the Kuo Wars series was William Shatner's best effort.

2008-07-06 23:10:24
40.   underdog
Oh, and it's great to be back home, even if home is in enemy territory. But at least the Dodgers beat the enemy two outta three this weekend. All is right with the world.
2008-07-06 23:13:55
41.   ToyCannon
I'm just glad he rebounded from his last surgery to make Bob's famous comment look like Crow.

I have a soft spot for Kuo because of the way he went out after his scintillating debut. I figured he was done ala Kiki Jones and then he came back. And boom he was gone again. I can still remember the little smile I got when I was perusing the minor league clubs back in 2005 and saw that he was trying another comeback.

You are right, we are playing with house money but he's packing a full house at the moment.

2008-07-06 23:14:48
42.   ToyCannon
If you do a search on Kuo at Baseball-Reference you get Sandy Koufax and Hong-Chih Kuo. How cool is that?
2008-07-06 23:19:09
43.   CanuckDodger
Hey, nobody answered the question I asked earlier about whether Troncoso pitches out of the stretch even when nobody is on base. Someone?
2008-07-06 23:22:01
44.   ToyCannon
I will watch his next appearance but I couldn't tell you right now.
2008-07-06 23:24:46
45.   KG16
10 - the Gene Autry statue was an afterthought at Angel Stadium, Disney was not much into the whole "history" aspect of baseball.
2008-07-06 23:29:03
46.   Eric Enders
"Jamie Hoffman or Jamie Pedroza. I've never been a big fan of the name Jamie. Is that a good enough reason?"

Good thing that's not Pedroza's name, then. You can still go on hating Jamie McCourt, though.

2008-07-06 23:31:42
47.   Eric Enders
So is McCourt finally over his lame-brained "statue of the fans" idea? I'm sure 99% of the people who go to Dodger Stadium would rather see a statue of Sandy Koufax or Vin Scully.

In Detroit they have a Willie Horton statue. In Cincinnati they have a Joe Nuxhall statue. In L.A. you can throw four no-hitters and singlehandedly win two World Series, and all you get is a spot in the pavilion next to Tommy Lasorda.

2008-07-06 23:39:06
48.   KG16
statues at Dodger Stadium can only lead to trouble. Sure, you start with icons like Jackie Robinson, Sandy Koufax, or Vin Scully. The next thing you know, there's a statue of Gibson rounding second doing the fist pump. Or Tommy Lasorda. And then it's Cey, Russel, Lopes, Garvey.

It'll be like St Louis, and someone will have to watch after Bob.

2008-07-06 23:40:08
49.   Indiana Jon
10 47 I've been the GABP several times, and you can't miss the statues when you enter. For the life of me though, I can't remember where a fourth statue (Kluzewski) is located. The other three, Nuxhall pitching, Lombardi catching, and Robinson hitting are very nice, but where is Ted? Any ideas?
2008-07-06 23:44:21
50.   Icaros

It was just an offhand, cheeseball comment he made to us when we met him last year. I never had the impression that this was something he was actually working on.

It would be hilarious if he assigned a project manager to this. I still want to know what a statue of the fans will look like.

How will we human fans get into the stadium if it's occupied by 38,000 statue fans?

Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-07-06 23:48:52
51.   Greg Brock
51 The times piece talks about a double A team that has a statue of the fans. A family of four.


2008-07-06 23:51:16
52.   KG16
51 - see, more common ground
2008-07-06 23:53:05
53.   Eric Enders
St. Louis has 10 statues outside. They actually had 11 made, but they decided at the last minute not to put up the McGwire statue. It's now gathering dust in the sculptor's studio.

How many teams have put up a statue of a player who never played for them? The only ones I can think of are Babe Ruth in Baltimore and Ty Cobb in Atlanta. I could see Pittsburgh putting up a Josh Gibson statue or K.C. putting up a Satchel Paige statue, though.

2008-07-06 23:53:38
54.   Greg Brock
A statue of Koufax with his high leg kick would be the bee's knees.
2008-07-06 23:54:29
55.   Greg Brock
Miller Park has an Aaron statue, right?
2008-07-06 23:55:08
56.   Eric Enders
He played for the Brew Crew.
2008-07-06 23:55:31
57.   Bob Timmermann
Kluszewski is standing apart from all the others statues as I recall.

There's also part of the stadium that has a quote from Kluszewski along the lines of "Have you ever walked into a dark room where you didn't know where all the furniture was and try not to trip. That's what hitting a baseball is like."

2008-07-06 23:55:47
58.   Greg Brock
55 Aaron played for the Brewers, moron.
2008-07-06 23:57:12
59.   KG16
55 - that's what the article said, that Hammering Hank is in both Atlanta and Milwaukee, which kind of makes sense.

53 - I think it'd mainly be expansion teams that replaced teams that moved that would have such statues. I could totally see the Mets putting up statues of Jackie and Ott.

2008-07-06 23:57:22
60.   Greg Brock
56 Yeah, it hit me two seconds after I hit submit.

Then I had to figure out whether to call myself and imbecile or moron. Tough call.

Half-wit was also a possibility.

2008-07-06 23:59:07
61.   KG16
I actually forgot that Aaron played for the Brewers, thought it was more about the Braves having played in Milwaukee and the commissioner owning the Brewers.
2008-07-07 00:00:01
62.   Greg Brock
Does the new Washington stadium have a Big Train statue?
2008-07-07 00:00:17
63.   Bob Timmermann
Picture of Kluszewski statue.

2008-07-07 00:01:26
64.   Greg Brock
I guess the Nats will have Josh Gibson, Big Train, and Frank Howard statues. Or do have them now.
2008-07-07 00:03:08
65.   Bob Timmermann
I don't mind the statues outside Busch Stadium. With the exception of Musial's, they aren't all that big. And a lot of them look pretty good. Slaughter sliding is a cool statue. The Jack Buck statue is kind of goofy.

The Gibson statue looks like it would dust you off.

My alltime favorite ballpark statue was a Buddha made into the image of slugger Alex Cabrera that used to be outside the Seibu Dome in Tokorazawa, Japan.

Cabrera has switched teams so I don't know what happened to the statue.

2008-07-07 00:05:05
66.   KG16
I just looked at Walter Johnson and Cy Young's numbers. They are mind boggling. Numbers I can't imagine anyone coming anywhere near in my lifetime.
2008-07-07 00:06:54
67.   Eric Enders
If we want to get all depressing-like, we could try to figure out how many players the Dodger farm system produced who went on to become statue-worthy for other teams.

Frank Howard. Roberto Clemente. Hodges at the new Mets park, maybe?

2008-07-07 00:06:56
68.   KG16
65 - I was just worried about your reaction to LA becoming more like St Louis.
2008-07-07 00:07:34
69.   Bob Timmermann
Johnson's best season of ERA+ has been bettered by Pedro Martinez and Greg Maddux.
2008-07-07 00:08:23
70.   Bob Timmermann
There's little danger of any American city becoming more like St. Louis.
2008-07-07 00:10:31
71.   Greg Brock
67 Pedro Martinez.
2008-07-07 00:11:54
72.   Eric Enders says of the Tokyo Dome: "On premises is the Baseball Cafe that boasts a huge caricature statue of Tommy Lasorda that greets you as you enter."
2008-07-07 00:12:08
73.   Linkmeister
2008-07-07 00:12:35
74.   KG16
Walter Johson: 417 wins, 531 CGs, 110 SHO, 5914.2 IP

Cy Young: 511 wins, 749 CG, 7354.2 IP

I know it was a different era, and some don't put much weight in those category of stats, but really, wow.

2008-07-07 00:12:35
75.   Eric Enders
(I guess if you're going to have a Lasorda statue, it might as well be in an eating establishment.)
2008-07-07 00:14:49
76.   Greg Brock
If the Dodgers put a Tom Lasorda statue at the stadium, I would be most displeased.
2008-07-07 00:16:58
77.   KG16
76 - you know it's coming, just a matter of time. Maybe we could have them do one with Walter Alston looking over his shoulder, displeased.
2008-07-07 00:17:24
78.   Eric Enders
Perhaps a large water sculpture that shows him bleeding Dodger blue.
2008-07-07 00:17:32
79.   Bob Timmermann
That statue wasn't there when I ate there about six years ago. I was greeted by Aussie who was wearing a Yankees cap and he sat me down for some American food and instead of chips for me to eat before my meal came, I got popcorn.

The food was ... not good.

2008-07-07 00:44:18
80.   KingKopitar
Hey, did anyone mention that Rob Blake is a terrible person? Because he is, you know.
2008-07-07 01:11:07
81.   dzzrtRatt
76 What're'ya'gonna do? He won two titles. He won four pennants. He won a bunch of division championships. Finishing first in '77, '78, '80 (tie), '81, '83, '85, '88 and '95. Plus the best record in 94. His accomplishments must be served.

He's deeply annoying. His reign was flawed. He's got some of the worst decisions in team history in his jacket. But he won, pretty consistently, and generally with something less than the best talent in the league.

2008-07-07 01:43:56
82.   overkill94
43 I'm pretty sure Troncoso only goes out of the stretch. I seem to notice when relievers actually go from the wind-up and I don't recall my spidey senses tingling when Troncoso was on the mound.
2008-07-07 01:49:44
83.   natepurcell
Kuo probably had more talent than Chad when he signed him, but all the injuries to Kuo's elbow make it difficult to compare them. One thing that doesn't get said enough about Billz is his durability. No arm injury of any kind in five years. That is pretty amazing for a hard-throwing pitcher between ages 18-23, the injury nexus.

Its the thighs.

2008-07-07 01:58:19
84.   natepurcell
From Tony Jackson..

More rumormongering

A Philadelphia scout attended Friday's game between the Dodgers and San Francisco Giants but reportedly got up and left as soon as Dodgers pitcher Derek Lowe was lifted after five innings, a clear sign the Phillies are interested in the veteran right-hander.

Lowe is in the final season of a four-year, $36million contract, and the Dodgers conceivably could move him before the July 31 trading deadline. But the Dodgers' primary need, as stated last week by general manager Ned Colletti, is an everyday shortstop, and the Phillies clearly aren't going to part with reigning NL Most Valuable Player Jimmy Rollins, who is signed through 2010.

I don't see us trading Lowe with Penny ailing and Schmidt not fully recovered.

2008-07-07 02:22:23
85.   natepurcell
If the Phillies were to put Adrian Cardenas and Dominic Brown on the table, I'd probably deal Lowe.

Their system isn't very appealing; especially the pitchers.

2008-07-07 02:27:29
86.   Michael D
We're a half game out, we're clearly not going to be sellers. Stupid 2006 Cardinals are going to make it so every .500 team in the future that isn't buried by a good team in the division will be buyers.
2008-07-07 02:58:48
87.   elandcohen
i can't wait until lowe is gone. he reminds me of ismeal valdes. always pitches good enough to lose.
2008-07-07 04:52:04
89.   Ken Noe
Why are the Dodgers suddenly winning? Because of Torre, of course! Those darn kids finally get it!

Actually, if this silliness prevents trading Kemp, I can live with it.

I'd trade Lowe in a heartbeat. LA has the pitching.

2008-07-07 05:17:07
90.   D4P
Blech. When the team is winning, they get along and everyone's happy. When they're losing, we hear stuff about trash cans and entitlement.
2008-07-07 05:27:36
91.   D4P
The bottom line is that the team is giddy because they're only a half-game out of first place. If Arizona had been playing well all this time and were still way ahead, we wouldn't be hearing any stories about the kids buying into Torre's Winning System™ or fun clubhouse atmospheres.
2008-07-07 06:33:23
92.   Ken Noe
It's the same catch 22 that followed the Yankees. When the team loses, it's because of this player or that player, as well as the GM. When they win, it's because Joe Torre is a genius. Torre can't lose. I always assumed the NYC media was solely to blame, but I begin to wonder how much of this Torre and his lieutenants stoke themselves.
2008-07-07 06:52:50
93.   Bob Timmermann
In the words of Bill James, "Bad teams blame their best players for their problems."
2008-07-07 07:13:08
94.   D4P
Bad teams blame their best players for their problems

So true.

Funny how it seems.....Always in time, but never in line for dreams.

2008-07-07 07:19:07
95.   D4P
The Dodgers are officially more likely to make the playoffs than the DBacks, at least according to BaseballProspectus's PECOTA projections.

NL West champs:

LA: 46.5%
AZ: 46.0%


LA: 47.3%
AZ: 46.8%

2008-07-07 07:36:00
96.   madmac
So, was there a norcal gathering this weekend at the game or what. Underdog?
2008-07-07 07:39:54
97.   silverwidow
July OPS:

DeWitt .343
LaRoche .708

2008-07-07 07:41:47
98.   CanuckDodger
97 -- A 6 day sample size? Okay.
2008-07-07 07:49:26
99.   D4P
Second hand, from the ESPN Dodger board.

OIney says the reason we're out for CC is that other teams have no idea who the Dodgers have in charge of decisions. He asked if it's Ned, McCourt, White, the scouts... and it's the reason we can't get deals done.

He also blasted Colletti for being very vague about which young players are available, making it impossible for other teams to even try completing a dea.

Phillips says Colletti leaves teams hanging like Sabean... Will make them feel like a deal is a day away and practically blow them off looking to make other deals with those players and nothing gets done.

Just interesting view points on all this I thought i'd share... This is from the Baseball Show on ESPN Radio today.

I only post this because, IIRC, we were led to believe that (1) Depo was responsible for this kinda stuff, and (2) it would change when we hired The Great Communicator.

2008-07-07 07:59:53
100.   Dexter Fishmore
[I]t's true - we're not all Deadspin commenters.

But those of us who are... we're still eligible for the promotion, right?

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-07-07 08:01:53
101.   silverwidow
Minotaur starts TODAY at 10:05 for Jacksonville.
2008-07-07 08:02:46
102.   silverwidow
98 True, it's a small sample size, but it can be seen as a continuation of DeWitt's very bad June.
2008-07-07 08:05:19
103.   silverwidow
Basically, I think Blake should be optioned. But, of course, that won't happen for whatever reason.
2008-07-07 08:07:55
104.   Gen3Blue
99 If there is much truth there it is probably beneficial in this critical period.
2008-07-07 08:08:27
105.   Indiana Jon
99 Good. As long as we keep talking about getting Jack Wilson, I hope Ned continues to be difficult to deal with and no deals get done.
2008-07-07 08:11:55
106.   cargill06
101 any updates during the game will be appreciated.
2008-07-07 08:12:41
107.   Indiana Jon
The Phillies were not very smart to give Lidge that kind if money over that many years.
2008-07-07 08:12:45
108.   jujibee
This just in on ESPN rumor mill:

According to Fox Sports' Ken Rosenthal, the Los Angeles Dodgers are seriously interested in Pittsburgh Pirates' shortstop Jack Wilson, but their pursuit will be put on hold while they restructure their offer for the infielder.

2008-07-07 08:16:45
109.   D4P
If I understand correctly, Pittsburg's new GM is a New Stats Guy, which doesn't necessarily bode well for Ned.
2008-07-07 08:18:03
110.   regfairfield
I really don't think Jack Wilson is that bad of an idea. He's a solid player who improves the team this year and gives us an insurance policy so we aren't forced to panic and give Orlando Hudson 5/75 this offseason. Of course, it all comes down to what we give up for him, but the idea of "get Jack Wilson" isn't a bad one.
2008-07-07 08:20:22
111.   Marty
I wonder what restructure means.
2008-07-07 08:21:51
112.   Dexter Fishmore
110 I agree. Wilson's an above-average defensive SS, and at the plate he certainly couldn't be worse than what we've been getting from that position post-Furcal (and would likely be marginally better). It is indeed all about what he would cost us. I wouldn't be in favor of dealing any of our top prospects (let alone a current starter) for him, but if Pittsburgh is mostly just looking for someone to pick up his contract, this could work out well for us.
2008-07-07 08:23:12
113.   OhioBlues12
The idea of Jack Wilson isn't bad. What is a bad is the idea that the same players that were supposedly going for Sabathia are supposedly required to get Wilson. Those two names are leagues apart. Meloan and Hu would be my absolute limit for Wilson and even then I would be pretty hesitant.
2008-07-07 08:23:22
114.   D4P
Jack Wilson's primary offensive asset appears to be batting average.
2008-07-07 08:23:25
115.   CanuckDodger
104 -- Yes, other teams finding it difficult to impossible to make trades with the Dodgers is a GOOD thing, and I say that not just because I don't trust Colletti to do the trading for us. Other teams are trying to sell us something they no longer want, and people selling stuff just want people to buy quickly and get lost. If a GM is haggling about prices, or comparison shopping with other vendors, good for him. That is being a good shopper, a shopper who isn't a push-over for a sales pitch. Of course in Ned's case I don't want him shopping at all.
2008-07-07 08:25:23
116.   jasonungar07
Torre continued....

"Before the road trip the guy at the top of the order had been gettting on at a 29% clip with 6 extra base hits in over 200 ABs, since the trip he has been getting on at 41% and has 3 extra base hits in only 25 ABs.....The guy in the middle who had been OPS'ing under .700 all year since the roadie is in the 1.200 range. And thats not even getting to the recent consistent play out of our 2 hole hitter who for some reason has found his groove to the tune of a 1.356 OPS since the trip began. So yeah they are finally listening and as I told them what matters most is the name on the front of the jersey not the back...."

2008-07-07 08:27:11
117.   underdog
96 Hey mac, sorry man, I thought I'd dropped you a note awhile back. I know I posted a few notes here about it. I had to go down to Sta Barbara for a family thing so I ended up not being around this weekend. I'd hoped someone else would pick up the ball for a DT North gathering but it didn't happen this time - BUT I think we will try something for the August or September series. Will definitely let you know in advance!

At least they fared better than they probably would've had I gone. Or I guess if I'd gone it would've been to Saturday's loss.

2008-07-07 08:27:26
118.   regfairfield
114 That is a problem, but considering our best option right now is Nomar, I'm down with Wilson.
2008-07-07 08:28:18
119.   D4P
Other teams are trying to sell us something they no longer want, and people selling stuff just want people to buy quickly and get lost. If a GM is haggling about prices, or comparison shopping with other vendors, good for him

I understand what you're saying, but in Ned's case, I feel like the longer he waits the more desperate he'll become, and the more likely he'll be to say, "Fine, I'll throw in Kershaw with Kemp and LaRoche. Just give me your singles-hitting shortstop, already!"

2008-07-07 08:29:52
120.   CanuckDodger
110 -- What player or players would you be willing to give up for Wilson? Hu can't be traded while he is on the DL. If I HAD to look into acquiring Wilson, I would offer Meloan, Orenduff, and Lucas May. Nobody better than that.
2008-07-07 08:30:08
121.   cargill06
116 whose quote is that? joe's?
2008-07-07 08:32:45
122.   cargill06
what is the story with juan gonzalez? he's 26 and only in AA, but it seems like he has great plate discipline, how is he with the glove?
2008-07-07 08:32:52
123.   regfairfield
120 That's pretty much what I was thinking Meloan or May for Wilson. I don't think Orenduff gets it done, unless we're assuming Huntington is a stereotypical stat dork.
2008-07-07 08:33:40
124.   Samhain
On the subject of L.A. Dodger Stadium statues: I'd love to see a bronze one of Vin, microphone in hand, doing a post-game interview of a uniformed Koufax.
What could be more appropriate?
2008-07-07 08:36:13
125.   D4P
Haven't heard this mentioned yet.

limited no-trade clause 2007-09, allowing (Jack) Wilson to block deals to 6 clubs each season

Does this mean that there are 6 particular clubs that have already been identified that Wilson can block, or does it mean that he has the power to block trades up to 6 unspecified teams in a given season?

If the former, can we find out which 6 teams have been identified?

2008-07-07 08:38:03
126.   jasonungar07
no that's just BS Cargill totally made up by me.
2008-07-07 08:38:18
127.   The Trolley Dodger
I'm thinking a titanic statue of Koufax astride the Elysian Park entrance, like a modern-day Colossus of Rhodes, would be a tasteful celebration of his career.
2008-07-07 08:41:48
128.   jasonungar07
Everyone makes fun of Eckstein but whats the difference really between him and Wilson?
2008-07-07 08:42:21
129.   cargill06
126 man, i thought that was such an encouraginh quote.

i figured it was too good to be true.

2008-07-07 08:43:16
130.   Bob Timmermann
I don't believe Vin ever did post-game interviews. That was Jerry Doggett's job.
2008-07-07 08:43:50
131.   cargill06
128 if we traded for eckstein i think he'd end up hitting leadoff, wilson will probably end up hitting 8th.

i'd much rather have wilson and have him hit 8th.

2008-07-07 08:44:43
132.   Bob Timmermann
I would think Wilson would want to block trades to places like Washington or Florida or Kansas City.

I'm sure he would be very amenable to playing in L.A. or Anaheim or San Diego. Not that the latter two teams need him.

2008-07-07 08:46:20
133.   D4P
Everyone makes fun of Eckstein but whats the difference really between him and Wilson?

Wilson is over 5 feet tall.

2008-07-07 08:47:11
134.   regfairfield
128 Eckstein is a better on base guy, Wilson has a much better glove.
2008-07-07 08:48:01
135.   D4P
Wilson's games played:

2005: 158
2006: 142
2007: 135
2008: 38

Seems to be a pattern there. Has he been getting hurt?

2008-07-07 08:48:40
136.   jasonungar07
sorry cargill. yeah so for the record so know one could say otherwise, i'd just as well not trade for Wilson and play Hu. And No I was not impressed with Hu the hitter but given a little time I can see him hitting as badly as wilson does.
2008-07-07 08:48:59
137.   CanuckDodger
123 -- Meloan OR May? So you were thinking just one of them? I think a package of at least three guys like that would be necessary. I don't see Meloan, May, or Orenduff having any future with the Dodgers' big league team, so I say throw all of them into a deal and hope that quantity compensates for lack of quality in the other team's eyes.
2008-07-07 08:50:01
138.   regfairfield
137 Mainly Meloan, but I wouldn't really mind if we threw in the other two guys.
2008-07-07 08:52:39
139.   Indiana Jon
Meloan/May for Wilson would be fine, but that's absolutely the highest I would pay for him. I fear it will be more like Laroche, which is ridiculous. I still like Nomar at short. He's a much better hitter than Wilson. When he gets hurt, I would just go back to Hu if he's available. Hu can be Jack Wilson with ease.
2008-07-07 08:58:02
140.   Bumsrap
Rosenthal has details of other teams' attempts to acquire Sabathia. He says the Dodgers wanted the Indians to package Sabathia with Casey Blake.
Take third baseman Casey Blake, who's hitting .353/.414/.529 since the beginning of June. He's owed about $2.8MM for the remainder of the season and figures to draw decent trade attention.
2008-07-07 08:58:20
141.   OhioBlues12
139 - Exactly. Let's exhaust the Nomar option before running out and doing something regrettable. I could probably stomach Meloan and May for Wilson, anything else would be a losing situation for the Dodgers.
2008-07-07 09:00:07
142.   Indiana Jon
140 Does it say what they were willing to give up to get those two?
2008-07-07 09:01:20
143.   Bumsrap
That is all that was said out of MLB Rumors re CBS Sportsline
2008-07-07 09:01:41
144.   regfairfield
139 How is Nomar a much better hitter than Wilson? They're both decent average, no patience, no power kind of guys. Wilson is probably worth at least win over Nomar going forward thanks to his glove.
2008-07-07 09:05:09
145.   madmac
117 no worries. It wouldn't have worked out this weekend for me either. I'm still interested though.
2008-07-07 09:06:16
146.   Jon Weisman
116 - I was going to write a post to that effect this morning. Silly, isn't it?
2008-07-07 09:13:25
147.   Indiana Jon
144 Nomar is a no power kind of guy for a shortstop? He's slugged over .450 every year of his career except for last year. Find another SS that can say that and you have a good hitter I guarantee. Wilson has only done that once and has a career high OPS of .794. Although they are both no patience guys, Nomar's career AVG is higher than Wilson's career OBP. That's a big difference. People around here seem to forget how good of a hitter Nomar is for a SS. He was bad last year, but I don't think he's finished.
2008-07-07 09:15:57
148.   regfairfield
147 I weigh the results of recent years way more when we're dealing with aging injury prone guys. Maybe last year was a fluke, but Nomar couldn't even get the ball to the warning track last year. If he's a useful hitter at any point going forward, I'll be shocked.
2008-07-07 09:20:32
149.   Indiana Jon
148 If Wilson is a useful hitter ever, I will be double shocked. Isn't 2006 recent? He was aging and injury prone then too. Nomar is no longer a good enough hitter to be a first baseman for sure, but as a SS he is still way above average.
2008-07-07 09:22:35
150.   Samhain
I know Vinnie basically never did post-game interviews, Bob.
It was poetic license on my part.
I meant that it would be appropriate to have them represented together.
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-07-07 09:23:27
151.   Jacob L
Vin did do a memorable post-game interview with Koufax following game 7 of the 1965 World Series

2008-07-07 09:25:32
152.   bhsportsguy
Again, the same issue that hampered deals in the winter continues to stop any significant deals with the Dodgers. Unlike the D-Backs, Tigers and now the Brewers, teams do not want anyone in the Dodger minor league system (okay, they want Kershaw but he is on the 40-man).

They want the players that have already had some success in the majors. The problem remains, if you deal one of those guys to fill a hole, you don't get any better.

So even though, Ned and to some extent, McCourt, put out those vague pronouncements over the last few days, the reality remains, they cannot afford to deal anyone who is playing or pitching for the Dodgers on a regular basis.

However, despite what some think here, teams are not interested in anyone on the Vegas team, Scott Elbert is still recovering from his injury, DeJesus doesn't have the sexy offensive tools to make him a prime trade target.

So really if a deal is going to be made it is going to involve one of the two 3B on the club and this is where I believe the biggest debate internally involves LaRoche and DeWitt and who will be the third baseman of the future.

I am sure that if you polled the field staff, they would pick DeWitt, if you polled the development staff, they would pick LaRoche and in the end both sides would rather not deal either one right now.

2008-07-07 09:27:05
153.   bhsportsguy
146 Players and managers generally fill time with that kind of talk so either way, it really doesn't mean much to me.

But if Andre represents what the players are thinking, it is probably a good thing.

2008-07-07 09:28:57
154.   Eric Stephen
I thought this was an amusing description by Tony Jackson in today's Daily News, talking of Saturday night, right after Kent made a diving play at 2B:

"On their way off the field, Kent, who at times has been a vocal critic of the Dodgers' young, unproven and sometimes-cocky stable of promising young talent, and Kemp, perhaps the poster child for that brash bunch of youngsters, exchanged a high five so forceful that their hands must have tingled for several seconds afterward."

2008-07-07 09:29:52
155.   Bob Timmermann
Sorry. It's the July Effect. I'll be nicer in August.
2008-07-07 09:31:08
156.   Jon Weisman
So, the entrance to my parking garage at work is located at the southwest corner of 8th and Masselin (near the Miracle Mile). The square of the intersection has what I would call an unusually large amount of space for a four-way stop. If you're last in line, it can be, relatively speaking, a long wait for your turn.

Almost every day, I see a car jump its place in line. Now, I'm not talking about going the opposite direction of the car that has the right of way, because ultimately that does more good than harm. I'm saying that, for example, the car that's 90 degrees from me decides to jump in front of me, even though I've clearly been waiting longer. Frequently on other occasions, a car will try to piggy-back on the car in front of it even though that cuts me off when I'm supposed to have the right of way. I'm not sure where drivers get the idea that stop signs are meant for two cars at a time when others are waiting, but it's a regular occurrence here.

I don't know if I'm explaining this well, but it's become infuriating to me. Although I realize it doesn't do me any good to get aggravated about it, I'm still wondering if I'm insane to get upset about it, or if I can at least feel justified in my mini-road rage.

2008-07-07 09:32:40
157.   jasonungar07
146 Please by all means write!!! lol...You will say it much better than me that's for sure. It sure is silly. :-)

We saw Nomar go warning track twice yesterday!

Great post BH, well said. Who would you choose right now based on everything you know and feel. (if you had to)

2008-07-07 09:33:52
158.   bhsportsguy
156 At least a few below the breath Rule 1 utterances is in order.
2008-07-07 09:35:00
159.   FirstMohican
If Ned is able to execute a trade that makes sense, I will be triple shocked.
2008-07-07 09:35:35
160.   underdog
I watched the tape of yesterday's game late and couldn't believe the number of times Duane Kuiper and Krukow, too, called Andy LaRoche "Adam LaRoche." They did it repeatedly. Sheesh.

I like Kruk and Kuip overall but sometimes they just space out completely.

2008-07-07 09:35:43
161.   Bob Timmermann
I really shouldn't have bought Jon a copy of Al Swearingen's DVD on How to Cope With Stressful Situations.
2008-07-07 09:37:58
162.   bhsportsguy
157 If its the Pirates, why not Meloan, he could certainly pitch middle relief if you don't want to try him as a starter and add James Adkins, who should be able to advance quickly as another lefty in the pen or maybe even a back end starter. Both have college and now minor league experience and you should have a pretty good idea of what you are getting.
2008-07-07 09:38:02
163.   Xeifrank
The 150:1s game gets underway shortly. It would be amazing if they could expand their lead to 5-1/2 games heading to NY.
vr, Xei
2008-07-07 09:39:15
164.   bhsportsguy
163 Remember the Mets. :)
2008-07-07 09:41:47
165.   Xeifrank
156. LA has a different set of driving rules than the rest of... well, anywhere I've driven in California. I really dislike driving in LA. They have lanes that are for both parking and driving. Very few busy intersections have turn signals. Road rage fights over parking at the grocery store. I can live without all that.
vr, Xei
2008-07-07 09:42:01
166.   Eric Stephen
It's things like that that make me wish Jack Bauer was a traffic cop.
2008-07-07 09:42:42
167.   Doctor

FOR the Dodgers that is.... I have very little hope Ned is capable of making smart deals. There's isn't much data out there that's favorable.

2008-07-07 09:43:01
168.   Xeifrank
164. The Miracle Mets? I was probably just getting out of diapers. vr, Xei
2008-07-07 09:45:50
169.   FirstMohican
156 - If the situation is chronically that bad, I'd suggest contacting your council office. They may be able to request a traffic officer from DOT or enforcement from LAPD.
2008-07-07 09:45:52
170.   bhsportsguy
168 No, last years 99.7% in the playoffs Mets.
2008-07-07 09:48:42
171.   Xeifrank
170. Oh, quit being such a wet blanket! :)
vr, Xei
2008-07-07 09:50:09
172.   bhsportsguy
Oh, and I agree with ToyCannon yesterday on the usage of Falkenborg in the 5th inning, I mean he could have used Troncoso in that spot but you really are down to those two guys, I mean you could have used Kuo but I think the Dodgers are now trying use him as a bridge to Broxton.
2008-07-07 09:52:13
173.   MC Safety
I hear Greg Brock is going to be down in my neck of the woods. I went to Millikan after my freshman year at Wilson. I hated the uniforms and the "Classical High School" thing they were starting up, so I jetted to Millikan so I could wear what ever I felt necessary. I also thought I'd have a better chance of getting some PT over there, which didn't end up happening. Oh yeah, go eat a sandwich at Hector's Place on Ximeno and Los Coyotes, too. Depending on the day, I could join you for a sandwich and some DeWitt bashing.
2008-07-07 09:55:00
174.   bhsportsguy
173 He wants to know if the air conditioner works, that's his biggest concern this week.
2008-07-07 09:58:13
175.   Xeifrank
150:1s threatening in the 1st.
vr, Xei
2008-07-07 10:03:30
176.   gibsonhobbs88
116,146 - Could it be the reason our no. 2 hitter has found his groove is that he has been playing almost every day, so he worked his way back into his smooth line drive swing? Hmmm! Funny how things work out that way, Torre! Maybe if Laroche got the same chance over 2-4 weeks he can find the same groove that Dewitt was given at teh start of the year due to the cicumstances.
Also, more than 2 players mentioned among Meloan, May, Dejesus or Hu should be traded for a stopgap shortstop need. If the Pirates are trying for highway robbery, the Dodgers should either look in an other direction or explore how the in-house options can survive than succumb to that type of thievery.
2008-07-07 10:09:20
177.   Xeifrank
2-0 Rays at the end of 1 inning.
WE: 69%
vr, Xei
2008-07-07 10:10:12
178.   MC Safety
174 Since Millikan is basically in Lakewood, they should have AC. I've found Lakewood to be comparable to Norco in the summer. Not a fun place to be.
2008-07-07 10:11:56
179.   bhsportsguy
176 I think that is too simplistic, lets face it, Ethier had a bad month, Kemp played everyday and was only slightly better.

Baseball is a game where no one generally hits the same day to day, week to week and month to month, you just hope that enough are on to win more than lose.

2008-07-07 10:15:04
180.   fanerman
I went to yesterday's game against the Giants. It was great. The Dodgers finally managed to win at Phone Co. in my presence. Got to see some great Bison Speed™, Andy LaRoche play (though not do much), clutch hitting by James Loney, a G/K appearance, and some Saito action. Seeing the Dodgers beat the Giants was oh so satisfying.

I'll post some pics. Is there a Dodger Thoughts flickr group or anything?

2008-07-07 10:15:05
181.   Marty
Jon, isn't Variety moving soon, so your problem may go away?
2008-07-07 10:17:43
182.   bhsportsguy
Add Kevin Goldstein as a fan of Ivan De Jesus, Jr.

Kevin: What do you hear about Ivan De Jesus, Jr., his plate discipline is impressive but I wonder how that will translate as he advances. Thanks as always.

Kevin Goldstein: I think he's one of the better sleepers in the minors. I do think the walks will translate on a decent level because he's also a dangerous hitter. Very little power, but he laces line drives all over the field and makes good contact.

2008-07-07 10:17:49
183.   berkowit28
" know...A statue of the fans."

Is there anyone who was there last summer who doesn't wish, looking back, that he could have overcome the politeness incumbent upon invited guests and spoken truth to what passes for power? Or at least expostulated with a "Pshaw"?

2008-07-07 10:18:43
184.   kinbote
Back in the day, I considered Jack Wilson to be the second best shortstop in the National League behind Cesar Izturis. I don't know how much his skills have declined, but he used to be really good.

In terms of what we'd likely give up, I agree with some of the names that Canuck gave out: Meloan, Orenduff, & May.

Meloan is clearly behind Kershaw & McDonald, so losing him would not be a major blow.

Orenduff probably has minimal value; I see him as the third player involved (assuming a three player package).

May is intriguing, largely because Carlos Santana is taking over the world! Santana could be our #2 prospect by the end of the year. He's that good.

I wouldn't trade DeJesus, Elbert, Santana, or McDonald. I would consider Miller, Castillo, or a lower-level arm.

2008-07-07 10:19:21
185.   cargill06
can anyone help me with where i can go to get live updates of kershaw pitching today?
2008-07-07 10:19:40
186.   Eric Stephen
I think laughter would have been appropriate, and maybe a "are you serious?" wouldn't have been rude.
2008-07-07 10:20:31
187.   Jon Weisman
181 - We're moving from 5700 Wilshire to 5900 Wilshire. Hopefully, those Westerners know their traffic laws!
2008-07-07 10:22:04
188.   Eric Stephen
I would imagine Greg Miller is a trade candidate at some point, just because he'll be out of options next season. Then again, I'm not sure how much value he can fetch in return.
2008-07-07 10:23:40
189.   cargill06
too much dejesus
2008-07-07 10:24:16
190.   bhsportsguy
183 I think it really wasn't a forum to do anything but interact the way it came out.

I mean no one blinks when sports talk hosts go on and on about management and yet when they interview them, none of their attacks come out. Why is that, well, one, they want to contiune their access and two, they probably don't feel that combative about anyway but it makes "good radio."

As an invited guest to meet Frank McCourt, I don't think it was my place to start asking him questions about how he decides to run the team and even if I did, what kind of answers would I expect him to give.

2008-07-07 10:24:47
191.   bhsportsguy
2008-07-07 10:26:24
192.   Eric Stephen
Or, for the arthritic, :)
2008-07-07 10:29:09
193.   berkowit28
Kershaw: 3 up and 3 down, 1st inning.
2008-07-07 10:30:19
194.   Eric Stephen
As anyone watching the Tampa Bay game? I'm not, but via Yahoo I noticed Eric Hinske reached on a bunt single to 3B. Were the Royals employing an exaggerated shift with three infielders to the right of 2B?
2008-07-07 10:31:37
195.   berkowit28
186 Right. I, for one, was so startled by the inept comment, that the moment passed. It was just embarrassing and uncomfortable to be hearing such a thing.
2008-07-07 10:32:25
196.   bhsportsguy
I predict Kershaw makes his next start for the Dodgers on July 20th in Arizona.
2008-07-07 10:33:56
197.   bhsportsguy
195 Oh, I thought you meant the overall event.
2008-07-07 10:35:36
198.   Eric Stephen
Do you think he'll pitch an inning or so July 17 with the Suns to keep his IP down as well as get him some work in between starts (assuming he also starts Saturday with Jacksonville)?
2008-07-07 10:37:36
199.   Eric Enders
Kershaw set down the first three hitters in order and is now starting the second inning.
2008-07-07 10:37:42
200.   Xeifrank
Can't believe the Rays are about to squander this bases loaded no outs situation. It's up to this Longoria character now.
vr, Xei
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2008-07-07 10:39:48
201.   bhsportsguy
198 I think he'll be part of a roster move with Stults being optioned back to Vegas during the ASB and he'll pitch his bullpen during the ASB and then travel with the team to Arizona.
2008-07-07 10:40:16
202.   Eric Stephen
I just realized the Dodgers are also off Thursday following the All-Star Game, giving them a rare opportunity to start Billingsley (assuming he's not a late ASG replacement) in back-to-back games, on July 13 & 18.
2008-07-07 10:41:19
203.   Xeifrank
202. When is the last time a major leaguer has started back to back games? Bob??
vr, Xei
2008-07-07 10:43:02
204.   bhsportsguy
202 My predicted pitching rotation starting on July 18th.

Billingsley, Lowe, Kershaw, Penny*, Kuroda.

* If Penny is still out, put Park there.

2008-07-07 10:43:31
205.   Eric Stephen
There has to have been a few teams with the Thursday off day to have someone start two straight games around the AS break. But, the caveat is that it's usually the team's best pitcher that has to achieve this, and often times said pitcher will also pitch the ASG, which could muddy the waters, if you will.
2008-07-07 10:45:28
206.   Eric Stephen
That would give Kuroda 10 days rest in between starts on the 12th & 23rd, essentially the same as a skipped start. I think you have the order right, but if Stults pitches well Friday he might also start on the 20th.
2008-07-07 10:45:58
207.   Jon Weisman
203 - I don't know, but there was that day that Newcombe started both ends of a doubleheader. Wilbur Wood might have pulled that feat off more recently.
2008-07-07 10:47:11
208.   Eric Stephen
Greg Maddux started consecutive games last July 8 & 13 for the Padres. There has to be many more.
2008-07-07 10:47:15
209.   Bob Timmermann
Wilbur Wood started both ends of a doubleheader for the White Sox on July 20, 1973.
2008-07-07 10:47:56
210.   Eric Enders
It's probably going to be some pitcher who got ejected from a game in the first inning.
2008-07-07 10:50:17
211.   Eric Stephen
On July 20, 1973, Wood started both ends of a DH and got hammered in both:

Game 1: 0 IP , 6 runs, 5 ER
Game 2: 4.1 IP, 7 runs, 5 ER

2008-07-07 10:50:50
212.   dzzrtRatt
183 The other thing, the "statue of the fans" idea pretty evidently wasn't something he had been thinking about for longer than the two seconds it took him to answer the question. He was on the theme of all the changes he was making to improve "the fan experience." I think he feels grateful/guilty that the Dodgers draw huge crowds despite problems with the team and the stadium. It's allowing him to pay his debt and keeps the value of his equity high. So he was high on the fans, quite obviously.

I would completely support the idea of building a statue of Dodger fans outside McCourt's bank.

2008-07-07 10:52:52
213.   Xeifrank
212. I am surprised his answer wasn't a statue of a blogger. The kind of answer he just tailors to whomever he is speaking with. Plaschke probably thinks there will be a statue of a newspaper writer.
vr, Xei
2008-07-07 10:53:32
214.   Xeifrank
3-2 KC, bottom of 3rd.
vr, Xei
2008-07-07 10:53:58
215.   dzzrtRatt
154 Kent and Kemp remind me of Obama and McCain, who remind me of the two stars of a mythical 1970s buddy-cop show.
2008-07-07 10:55:07
216.   Eric Enders
Kershaw got blasted in the second. Hit, Walk, Walk, Hit, Wild Pitch, E2. Mobile 3, Jacksonville 0.
2008-07-07 10:56:25
217.   bhsportsguy
216 Looks like his winless streak continues.
2008-07-07 11:00:06
218.   cargill06
216 inning still going?
2008-07-07 11:01:59
219.   Eric Enders
218 Nah, mercifully it ended there.
2008-07-07 11:15:41
220.   Jon Weisman
2008-07-07 11:35:37
221.   Linkmeister
fanerman @ 180 , there is a Dodger Thoughts Flickr Group:

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