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About Jon
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1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
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7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
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Solid State
2008-07-20 09:07
by Jon Weisman

A quote getting a lot of play today, and deservedly so, is this one from Andre Ethier in T.J. Simers' latest for the Times:

"They don't like consistent players in this game unless you're older," Ethier said. "They want to see the young guys flash a lot of stuff or they get impatient."

I think it's a good quote but also obfuscates an issue. It's okay to be inconsistent as long as you get the job done in the end. I don't think Ethier is undervalued because he's "consistent." In fact, Ethier has never struck me as a consistent player. His first summer in the majors he was flashing all kinds of stuff. He's run hot and cold ever since he arrived. The sum of it all: he's a good player.

If we could do a second take, I would have Ethier rephrase thusly:

"They don't like solid players in this game unless you're older," Ethier said. "They want to see the young guys flash a lot of stuff or they get impatient."

2008-07-20 09:15:53
1.   D4P
I support the second take, and would add a third take thusly:

"They don't like bad players in this game unless you're older."

2008-07-20 09:16:42
2.   Bob Timmermann
Andre Ethier is trying to espouse the civil service method of advancement. I've been promoted recently because I show up all the time and don't annoy people.
2008-07-20 09:19:13
3.   bhsportsguy
2 All I know is when I asked for you at the library, the people at the reference desk wondered if it was okay to call you.

Apparently you also carry that requisite level of fear or the other take is no one wants to bother you.

2008-07-20 09:19:55
4.   Bob Timmermann
That's stretching it a bit. Teams may give bad older players more of an opportunity if they had been good at one point.
2008-07-20 09:20:08
5.   gpellamjr
2 Good thing for you that I'm not the guy in charge of librarian promotions.
2008-07-20 09:22:56
6.   Bob Timmermann
Finishing in a tie for third in a major tournament as an amateur is quite an accomplishment.

But I'd rather have the money.

2008-07-20 09:25:49
7.   D4P
What, no NPUT yet...?
2008-07-20 09:28:59
8.   bhsportsguy
2 Bob is the you-know-who of City employees.
2008-07-20 09:33:41
9.   Bob Timmermann
I have ensured a steady supply of motorcycle magazines for the library.
2008-07-20 09:39:04
10.   goofus
Basically, his use of the word "consistent" could be replaced with "average". And he's using "flash" as a means of describing players who "seem" to have the potential to be great, the Mantles, Ruths, Roses, etc, of the baseball world. He's saying the average young player who just does a good job doesn't excite them as much as the Matt Kemps and others who come up and give signs of greatness. I think we're all like that, but I hope our leaders, bosses, and in this case baseball bosses, can rise above it and look at everything. You got to have some corn and potatoes on the plate as well as the steak.
2008-07-20 09:43:21
11.   Suffering Bruin
Five posts before 10am? As Dr. Cox would say, "It's going to be a great day!"
2008-07-20 09:49:04
12.   Bob Timmermann
Somebody go rile up Jon's kids to make him less productive.
2008-07-20 09:53:42
13.   Bumsrap
10 -You got to have some corn and potatoes on the plate as well as the steak. Is that steak rare or well done? What about fruits and dark green vegetables? Corn and potatoes are both starches. It just isn't that easy to create a well rounded team any more.
2008-07-20 09:56:43
14.   Bumsrap
12 - Define productive.
2008-07-20 09:58:56
15.   D4P
Looking like Joey Harrington's cousin might win his second consecutive British Open.
2008-07-20 10:00:17
16.   Bob Timmermann
How about prolific?
2008-07-20 10:02:23
17.   Bumsrap
I once knew a person that lived next door to the Uncle of a guy who knew the guy that lived next door to a cousin that won the British Open two years in a row.
2008-07-20 10:02:56
18.   Bumsrap
16 - There you go.
2008-07-20 10:05:40
19.   Suffering Bruin
17 I think that's within the Kevin Bacon rule of actually knowing a guy.
2008-07-20 10:06:52
20.   Bob Timmermann
Reports are that the NBA team in Oklahoma City will be called the Thunder.

Not sure if they will be the Oklahoma Thunder or the Oklahoma City Thunder.

I'm against teams not using a plural noun for their nickname.

2008-07-20 10:09:12
21.   D4P
I'm against teams not using a plural noun for their nickname

They tend to be know-it-alls.

2008-07-20 10:12:46
22.   immouch
RE: Ethier's comment:
The bigger point isn't semantics, it's the oddity of the Dodger's position on this issue. What other team actually values age and expense over youth and potential? It's bizarre. I suspect it has something with the McCourt's East Coaster perception that we Dodgers fans are baseball dolts who live too close to Hollywood, but that's just a weird theory.
2008-07-20 10:12:57
23.   Suffering Bruin
It's been over an hour since Jon's last post.


2008-07-20 10:13:22
24.   Bob Timmermann
I think that approach shot by Harrington clinched the Open.
2008-07-20 10:14:20
25.   Bob Timmermann
L.A. Dodgers fans have been considered baseball dolts by the East Coast media since 1958.
2008-07-20 10:15:04
26.   larry slimfast
Most profound quote from Simers column...

"The Dodgers have thrown five hitting instructors at Kemp the last two years: Eddie Murray, Bill Mueller, Mike Easler and now Jeff Pentland and Don Mattingly. Funny thing, the Dodgers aren't big into consistency, and yet that's what they want out of their players."

I really wish Ethier wouldn't speak. I appreciate his point of view but his quote doesn't hold up for anyone but him. I like him but if a young one has to be traded I hope it is him. He's not going to get much better than average and I doubt his value will ever be higher. He'd be great in Boston with that opposite field stroke but I don't believe Ned is capable of getting fair value there.

2008-07-20 10:15:13
27.   D4P
He'll have to pull a Van De Velde not to win now.

Or a muscle.

2008-07-20 10:18:30
28.   The Trolley Dodger

"The Dodgers have signed utility infielder Pablo Ozuna, who was recently designated for assignment by the White Sox. Luis Maza was designated for assignment. Developing..."

2008-07-20 10:19:12
29.   Bob Timmermann
Thesis: Jean Van De Velde is more famous for losing the British Open than he would have been if he had won it. Who remembers the winner of that British Open? Would Van De Velde have just become the next Trevor Immelman?
2008-07-20 10:19:51
30.   immouch
25: Right. Particularly the Boston media. Somehow, not winning a WS for most of the 20th century turned Boston into a petri dish for baseball acumen. Meanwhile, only big dummies moved to a place where you don't need an ice scraper to start your car.
2008-07-20 10:20:10
31.   Bob Timmermann
At least they didn't trade John Franco to acquire Ozuna.
2008-07-20 10:20:56
32.   Bob Hendley
Woke up this morning and found that DT has gone Juice-like. (without the photos).
2008-07-20 10:21:24
33.   Greg Brock
26 Ethier is slightly above average, and certainly somebody I'd like to see packaged for a real home run hitter. But if we had power hitters, he'd be the perfect two-hitter to plop down in the lineup for a long time.
2008-07-20 10:22:24
34.   Bob Timmermann
If you ever get the chance to read Dick Young's coverage of the L.A. Dodgers in the Sporting News in 1958, you would be appalled. Young wrote stuff about Los Angeles that was both inflammatory and patronizing.

Dick Young would go on my "Dead to Me" list except that he's already dead.

2008-07-20 10:22:27
35.   D4P
Ozuna looks like a prototypical Ned kinda player.


.285/.322/.358/.680, 77 OPS+

2008-07-20 10:23:51
36.   Jon Weisman
2008-07-20 10:24:23
37.   Jon Weisman
28 - Dang - five minutes late.
2008-07-20 10:28:14
38.   larry slimfast
Ethier is a valuable tool when you don't have to work him in between Jones and Pierre. I see him as more of a 6th slot. He doesn't really have the speed to... AACCKK! I've been possessed by some old school baseball demon!
2008-07-20 10:31:28
39.   jasonungar07
That's a great quote Larry.

Bob I agree with that 29 I read it I tried to scan my brain for another example and couldn't. Can anyone? (more famous for 2nd, or loosing)

Also, wow on The Dark Knight. Saw the late showing last night and I thought it was the best movie of the summer for me, overtaking Wall-E.

As for the dodgers I just give up. I can't listen to them talk or read what they say anymore without cringing. They are willing to roll the dice with a JJJ start and not give LaRoache a week? Please.

And this might not be fair cause I didn't watch but Norman still is a chooker! out of the top 50 players today only 3 shot a higher score.

2008-07-20 12:35:21
40.   Michael Green
I think we are parsing Ethier a little too much and not looking at the bigger picture. The Dodgers have a history of outstanding young players--look at the list of rookies of the year. But every time I think of them, I think of the misuse of Pedro Martinez and John Wetteland because they didn't immediately fit into the spot designated for them. And while I don't think Ethier is great, I do think the Dodgers have a tendency to lose patience.

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