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About Jon
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1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
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Peanuts Classics
2008-10-19 11:18
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

Here's some footage I uploaded from an appearance by Dodger peanut vendor extraordinaire Roger Owens on The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson.

Comments (164)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-10-19 11:57:15
1.   KG16
I miss Johnny Carson. And I'm too young to remember him doing more than 15 shows a year. I couldn't imagine any of the late night guys today doing something like that today.

Also, watching that video, all I can say is that the carpet on the stairs burned my eyes, just a little bit.

2008-10-19 11:58:50
2.   Eric Stephen
60 Minutes tonight has one of the greatest teases ever! Champion bull fighter gets gored = guaranteed viewing.
2008-10-19 12:07:45
3.   Greg Brock
Being Johnny Carson was probably pretty awesome. What a life.
2008-10-19 12:44:03
4.   DBrim
Funny how Grady's inept playing of Loney in 2006 is saving us millions of dollars next season. Things go full circle, I guess.
2008-10-19 13:04:31
5.   Eric Stephen
4
I tend to view that as more a Colletti decision, or at least a joint decision between Little & Ned.

Besides, I'm sure you meant 2007 since it would have been hard to justify Loney playing over Nomar in 2006, who was hitting .327/.398/.535 when he went on the DL in late July (Loney came up for the rest of the season at that time).

2008-10-19 13:05:21
6.   underdog
Your quickie NFL report:

Wow, Rams.
Brad Johnson < Tony Romo

How much longer will Mike Martz keep calling JT O'Sullivan a great QB? They should start having a betting line for over-under the # of fumbles from JT each week.

Bills might be the surprise team of the league so far. Very solid.

The Bengals = The Bungles again.

No defense in the Chicago-Minn game today. 89 total points. So far.

2008-10-19 13:07:05
7.   underdog
Did anyone comment on this yet? Kind of an embarrassment.

http://tinyurl.com/6nozkq

Dodger fans dump beer on LAPD

2008-10-19 13:09:17
8.   Greg Brock
The Bengals sucking is a tradition to pass from father to son. Except for that one time that they were decent for five minutes that one year.
2008-10-19 13:12:52
9.   Eric Stephen
6
Also, LT, it's been a nice run. Be sure to collect your parting gifts on the way out the door*.

*He still has one game against Oakland so of course he will still do well in that game.

2008-10-19 13:15:58
10.   Eric Stephen
8
Pretty much ever since they angered the football gods by (unintentionally) injuring Bo Jackson, Cincy has paid the price.

Still, the Bengals get a free pass for all-time thanks to this epic quote:

http://tinyurl.com/5epvwa

2008-10-19 13:19:10
11.   Eric Stephen
This might come as a shock to some of you, but the Raiders lead the league in defensive penalties.
2008-10-19 13:19:38
12.   underdog
8 Might be time for them to be bumped down to Football League One, or Two.

9 Indeed. I wonder if they're feeling bad for not bringing Michael Turner back after all.

2008-10-19 13:20:37
13.   Eric Stephen
11
The Jets have run 6 plays so far, and the Raiders have been called for offsides on 3 of them. The Tom Cable Era indeed!
2008-10-19 13:21:13
14.   Greg Brock
This is too much activity for Dick Enberg. He's going to get a headache!
2008-10-19 13:21:48
15.   underdog
13 It's a tradition! Al loves tradition. Sort of like Burning Man or Kwanzaa, except with penalties, and it happens every week, instead of just once.
2008-10-19 13:22:42
16.   underdog
...but it could be like Burning Man, in that Al Davis gets burned (not in effigy) at the climax.
2008-10-19 13:23:56
17.   Eric Stephen
Having a kicker in the league named Jay Feely, and a QB somewhere named A.J. Feeley is more confusing than the Roy Williams Duo in Dallas.
2008-10-19 13:25:11
18.   underdog
Whaaaaa?? The Detroit-Houston game isn't on TV here? /call cable company
2008-10-19 13:26:04
19.   underdog
17 One of them should change their name to Touchy.

Okay, I need to either get out, or nap. Or both.

2008-10-19 13:26:41
20.   Eric Stephen
18
That epic tilt is indeed on here in SD, along with one of the very few televised Raider games.
2008-10-19 13:27:29
21.   underdog
Jeez. My fantasy FB opponent's defense today gave up 41 points, and still got 28 fantasy points. Stupid fantasy football.
2008-10-19 13:28:05
22.   underdog
20 Seriously? Wow, an infomercial would beat that in ratings.
2008-10-19 13:32:54
23.   trainwreck
16
If only we were so lucky.
2008-10-19 13:33:23
24.   trainwreck
I hate when Raiders D celebrates stops after getting moved on so easily.
2008-10-19 13:34:17
25.   Eric Stephen
Question for you Mac people:

Is the main advantage of having a Mac less susceptibility to viruses? As Mac gains more market share, won't more viruses be written for them?

Is it just easier to use than a PC? Just wondering.

Also, how hard is it to transfer files back and forth from a PC to a Mac?

2008-10-19 13:35:05
26.   Eric Stephen
24
It's just a celebration for finally doing something positive.
2008-10-19 13:36:54
27.   Jon Weisman
Washington State won the all-important time of possession battle against USC yesterday.
2008-10-19 13:40:18
28.   still bevens
25 I think Macs have less virus susceptibility because of a lack of third parties developing software for it. Could be wrong on this tho.

Mac has a file conversion utility that will copy over all your stuff from your PC.

I just crossed over from using a PC for 20 years this summer and Im lovin my mac. Only thing that messes me up is when I find myself using mac keyboard shortcuts on my PC at work.

2008-10-19 13:41:18
29.   DBrim
5 - Nomar was moved to third eventually... who was playing third in 2006? I remember the Loney/Nomar thing being a controversy but I don't remember who Nomar replaced there. I seem to remember wanting that to happen a lot earlier.
2008-10-19 13:42:02
30.   FiftyYearDodgerFan
If this has been discussed, please refer me to the link. If not, does anyone know what is going on with Andruw Jones? I read that he hates LA and doesn't want to return here because the fans booed him. Is there any possibility that he might ask for his release and give up the last year of his contract?
2008-10-19 13:43:58
31.   Jon Weisman
30 - No, there isn't.
2008-10-19 13:59:04
32.   Marty
I think the best argument for getting a pro football team in LA would be no more Raider games.
2008-10-19 13:59:33
33.   trainwreck
Make everyone on the Raiders do nothing but run laps on Monday.
2008-10-19 14:01:05
34.   underdog
I find my Mac crashes less than the PC I use at work. Not that Macs don't crash, too, of course. But in all my years of using Macs and all the years I've had to use PCs at work, the crash n' freeze problems seem about three times as common on the PCs. And yes I think Macs are a bit easier to use, frankly. easier to find things, easier interface. Macs are also better for graphic programs and desktop video and that sort of thing, imho. Though PCs have made some gains in that area.
2008-10-19 14:01:15
35.   Marty
Is Dick Enberg 100 yet?
2008-10-19 14:03:39
36.   LogikReader
32

You would think, but if it ends up being an NFC team, forget it!

2008-10-19 14:14:47
37.   ucladodger
17

A.J is actually my cousin and leads a freakin great life. Never started much at Oregon behind Joey Harrington, but showed well enough to get picked up by the Eagles. When McNabb got hurt a few years back he played really well and signed a really nice deal with the Dolphins, where he stunk. Now back in Philly, he's 3rd string. Basically, he's started fewer than 30 games in the last 12 years and he's making over $2 million a year. Not bad at all.

2008-10-19 14:17:35
38.   trainwreck
37
And he dated Heather Mitts.
2008-10-19 14:18:09
39.   Eric Stephen
29
Nomar exclusively played 1B in 2006. The Dodgers started the year with Mueller at 3B, then Willy Aybar, and eventually Wilson Betemit played the most there. In between, Izturis also played some 3B before being traded, and Julio Lugo mixed in some hot corner time as well.

The controversy was in 2007, when Loney hit over .400 in the spring (following a .284/.342/.559 in limited duty in 2006) and didn't get called up until early June. By that time, Betemit's low average made him undesirable to Ned & Co. and Nomar made the move to 3B.

2008-10-19 14:23:46
40.   D4P
37
It would be kinda funny if A.J. were making more than Joey these days.
2008-10-19 14:36:38
41.   Eric Stephen
40
The contract signed by Falcons quarterback Joey Harrington was for one year, $1 million. The Falcons initially released that his deal was for two years. Harrington, who was released last week, received a $300,000 signing bonus when he re-joined the team. The 2007 season-opening starter has a base salary of $700,000

Ahh, the life of an NFL backup QB.

http://tinyurl.com/67kdhm

Feeley is in the middle of a 4yr/$7.25m contract, making $900k this year. He got a $2m signing bonus in 2007, plus a roster bonus of $450k.

http://www.eaglescap.com/Players/AJFeeley.html

2008-10-19 14:53:39
42.   trainwreck
Javon Walker sighting. I repeat.

We have a Javon Walker sighting.

2008-10-19 14:55:04
43.   underdog
Ouch, Peyton Manning, you're gonna kill my fantasy team today.

42 I thought he was banished to Greenland or something.

2008-10-19 15:04:54
44.   Greg Brock
It's amazing how quickly I can go from hating Brett Favre to hating the Raiders. Whoever has the ball has my undying loathing.

Why am I even watching this?

2008-10-19 15:06:58
45.   ucladodger
38

Thats why I included the "freakin'" instead of just "great."

He's really never proved much as a football player (as I said, fewer than 30 starts in 12 years) but he's made more money than most of us can dream about.

2008-10-19 15:23:58
46.   Greg Brock
It's a scientific fact that no person can look smart while wearing any Raiders gear.

Poor Greg Knapp, I'll bet he's smart!

2008-10-19 15:30:34
47.   D4P
It's a scientific fact that no person can look smart while wearing any Raiders gear

Or fashionable.

Course, that pretty much applies to all team-related garb.

2008-10-19 15:41:57
48.   CajunDodger
Please forgive me if this has been discussed:

OK, I know that there is a lot of disinformation that is fed to reporters this time of year (especially to Rosenthal), but this is peculiar even by those standards:

You want a surprise name that could end up out on the trade market? How about Dodgers catcher Russell Martin? Rival executives say the Dodgers are not overly enamored with his makeup and at a time when front-line catchers are hard to find, Los Angeles could decide to see what his value is. The Tigers, Marlins and Reds are all looking for catching, and the Red Sox would be, too, if free agent Jason Varitek departed.

That is Joel Sherman on the East Coast. Isn't this a little like saying the Marlins would like to trade Hanley Ramirez because there would be a great market for shortstops?

2008-10-19 15:46:21
49.   Marty
Martin wears makeup?
2008-10-19 15:49:48
50.   Greg Brock
It's a good thing that nobody knows of Martin's perceived character flaws. Hopefully we can exploit this secret. That we know. That nobody else knows. Because it's a secret.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-10-19 15:56:42
51.   Bob Timmermann
How many game-winning homers has Martin ever hit in an ALCS Game 6?

The prosecution rests its case.

2008-10-19 15:56:47
52.   D4P
Rival executives say the Dodgers are not overly enamored with his makeup

I knew it. His party animal ways were bound to catch up with him sooner or later.

2008-10-19 16:10:12
53.   KG16
25 - the virus issue is one of the reasons I switched. But the other reason to switch is five letters long: V-I-S-T-A. I made the switch just when the new Windows system was coming out and remembered the nightmare that was the XP upgrade (and the 98 upgrade).

The use is pretty much the same, but there are a few cool things you can do, like creating work spaces so you don't clutter up the screen with different programs, and what not.

As for the viruses, there are a few out there, and there may well be more in the future, but I've already seen anti-virus software at the Mac Store.

In short, I'm not going back. And I'm hoping to convince my boss to make the switch at the office.

2008-10-19 16:10:28
54.   CajunDodger
Marrtin and Pierre for Peavy and Adrian Gonzalez straight up...

How is Sherman so plugged in to the Dodger front office anyway? This is one of those situations where I would like to take the journalist, put him under a lamp in a room with with Kyra Sedgwick and figure out who his source is.

2008-10-19 16:17:12
55.   trainwreck
54
I would be hilariously depressing to trade away Navarro and Martin within a few years of each other.

Good thing it will not happen.

2008-10-19 16:21:59
56.   Bob Timmermann
David Ross will be a free agent at the end of the season. He'll be glad to come to the clubhouse and talk about his postseason experience with the Red Sox. Ross knows how to win.
2008-10-19 16:23:27
57.   Tripon
Yeah, trading Martin after trading Navarro and Carlos Santana would be fool hardy to say the least. For better or worse, the Dodgers are married to Martin and for anyone to claim otherwise is simply not informed.
2008-10-19 16:25:34
58.   D4P
56
I'm sure our guys learned a ton from Gary Bennett's 2006 experience with the Cardinals.
2008-10-19 16:40:43
59.   Lee Corbett
Could someone provide a primer on the winter leagues?

Specifically which Dodger prospects are in action where; which AFL team is affiliated with the Dodgers, stuff like that?

2008-10-19 17:04:12
60.   JRSarno
Drove up near Angel's Point today in Elysian Park. Love the spot where you can look out over the stadium. Reminded me of the times as a kid, when I'd walk from my mom's house to check out the stadium during the offseason. Looks very lonely out there right about now. When do pitchers and catchers report? :)
2008-10-19 17:08:08
61.   Bob Timmermann
60
I think it's a little earlier in 2009 because of the WBC.
2008-10-19 17:19:16
62.   underdog
Mark Ellis is officially off the table, btw, in case anyone was hoping for that. More on Catfish Stew.
2008-10-19 17:34:27
63.   LogikReader
Welp, the ALCS "rubber match" is underway. Off to the Griddle I go! I can't get over how Boston fought back.

---

A very rhetorical question is asked over on LOCKS of the Week (linked on sidebar) re: John Madden. It's rhretorical, but you can answer it.

---

When I saw the title "Peanuts Classics" I thought of the cartoon "Peanuts." Did you? I really missed out on some good stuff with Johnny Carson.

2008-10-19 17:38:00
64.   MJW101
Martin will start getting too expensive for his production by 2011. He will be gone by 2012.

The Dodgers will greatly miss Carlos Santana who should be ready for the majors by 2010.

Loney will also be too expensive for his production by 2012 opening a starting slot for Lambo or Gallagher.

If the kids are going to the WS together they best do it by 2011.

2008-10-19 17:54:49
65.   trainwreck
64
We are not the Marlins. We have a high payroll.
2008-10-19 18:17:07
66.   ToyCannon
59
AFL - Surprise Raptors
http://mlb.mlb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?t=t_ibp&sid=l119&cid=527
Lambo, DeJesus, and Jamie Hoffman are the only real players of note. Others are Lucas May, Rus Mitchel, Justin Orenduff, Jesus Castillo, Schlicting, Brent Leach.

HFL - Waikiki Beach Boys
http://mlb.mlb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?t=t_ibp&sid=l405&cid=1294
Only real player of note is Javy Guerra. Others are Alfredo Silverio, Tom Giles, Gar...., Pratt, and Pfeiffer.

2008-10-19 18:23:47
67.   das411
a hit!
2008-10-19 18:25:29
68.   ryu
65 I don't think he's saying that the Dodgers won't be able to afford them. His point is that Martin and Loney will be overpriced by 2011.
2008-10-19 18:28:50
69.   trainwreck
68
Don't know how we can know that already.
2008-10-19 18:29:54
70.   Tripon
Don't see how Martin or Loney would be overpriced in their last or 2nd to last arbitration years.

A comparable player would be Adam LaRoche who is making around $7 million in the last year of his arbitration year. And Martin is near the upper echelon of catchers. If we pay him $10 million in his last year, he still wouldn't be overpaid compared to other players who signed free agent contracts. Martin, or Loney will not make Ryan Howard type numbers in arbitration.

2008-10-19 18:31:36
71.   trainwreck
Oooo, Lizzy Caplan in True Blood.
2008-10-19 18:34:46
72.   MJW101
65 The Dodgers may be a large market team, but Frank sold his soul for the team and his pockets are starting to be empty. Remember that FOX, not Frank, has the Dodger media rights as a condition of the sale. Frank is good at the parking business, but, he let Ned run wild for too long and for too many $$$. Now we will pay the price in cheaper, less desirable FAs and the trading of prospects to save $$$$. Deadweight contracts DO matter and they will limit the moves that the team can make.

Hopefully, we can still sign CC as he seems amiable to signing with the LAD if the $$$ is right.

2008-10-19 18:37:08
73.   Bob Timmermann
The Treasury Department recently announced that it is injecting capital into Frank and Jamie McCourt's souls.

Their souls should be very liquid.

2008-10-19 18:37:23
74.   Lee Corbett
66 Thanks.
2008-10-19 18:43:11
75.   Tripon
72 McCourt field a $115 million payroll in 2008. Even if you think McCourt may be cash strapped. (I think its more like McCourt is unable to have access to easy lines of credit, but same difference I suppose.) Its still in the top five of payrolls in MLB. Even if he keeps it at the current level or lowers it, it means that the team is less likely to sign high priced free agents to supplement their current talent instead of trading away pricier talented players. Martin and Loney, and Kemp and Billingsley, and Broxton, and Kershaw are going to get paid as Dodgers unless the Dodgers see that trading one of their young stars will make the team better. I find it highly unlikely that the Dodgers will try to do a salary dump. That's the L.A. Kings domain.
2008-10-19 19:42:45
76.   das411
JAHRFA!!!!!!!!
2008-10-19 19:44:10
77.   superbas
woot woot wtg willy aybar
2008-10-19 19:45:23
78.   Gen3Blue
Hey Willy; was that Willy Aybar?

I guess these guys like Aybar( and hence Young, Abreu , and Hu are good enough to play on a team where every one is young and OK.

2008-10-19 19:53:24
79.   JRSarno
Bartlett, meet Raffy Furcal.
2008-10-19 19:54:35
80.   superbas
ugh another error, won't the sox go down quietly ever?
2008-10-19 19:55:40
81.   superbas
would u rather have wheeler or broxton here? :)
2008-10-19 20:01:24
82.   Gen3Blue
Play your young free players and add the right free agent here and there. This is Bostons plan and could almost be Tampa's.

And remember, Boras will prep as fancy a brochure whether it was one of his--Manny, Abreu, Drew ,Andruw or Furc(?) or a hypothetical like Pierre or Jason Schmidt.

You have to figure Manny only fits an American League team.

2008-10-19 20:44:44
83.   das411
And the TAMPA BAY RAYS are your 2008 American League CHAMPIONS!!!!!!!
2008-10-19 20:53:03
84.   MJW101
Billingsley may be worth $15M in 2012, but will the Dodgers pay Loney, Kemp, Ethier and Martin $15M each in 2011?

Lambo, Gallagher and Bell will be low cost youngsters ready to take over. Unfortunately, there will be no youngster (Santana) to replace Martin.

2008-10-19 21:01:25
85.   Tripon
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/playoffs2008/news/story?id=3647584

Joe Torre article.

84 Billingsley may be worth $15M in 2012, but will the Dodgers pay Loney, Kemp, Ethier and Martin $15M each in 2011?

Arbitration numbers doesn't dramatically rise after the first year. The biggest problem with Ryan Howard was that his budget busting first year was out of line to just about every other baseball player. Howard asked for the moon, and got it, but that's partly because the Phillies didn't offer a bit more than what Miguel Cabera got in his first year of Arbitration which was around $7.1 million.

I can see Billingsley earning $12 million in his last year in arbitration and hopefully the Dodgers will be proactive and sign him to a long term deal that guys out a couple of his FA years. But position players like Loney, Kemp, DeWitt, and Ethier aren't going to make nowhere near $15 million via the arbitration process. The most expensive position player is likely Martin, due to being a catcher and I can't see him making more than $10 million in his last year.

2008-10-19 21:12:26
86.   regfairfield
85 Arbitration salaries go up about 50% every year.

Russ isn't getting traded, especially when the best replacement option is "idunno, Varitek?". Even in his down year, he was a 33 run offensive player. He's the closest thing we have to a great player on offense, we can't give that up.

2008-10-19 21:30:10
87.   Tripon
86 That seems a big high. That means that Ryan Howard's salary next year will be $15 million. That seems a bit excessive, even if he wins the MVP.
2008-10-19 21:37:10
88.   Eric Stephen
Congrats to the Rays. The World Series will finally be payback for acquiring Kevin Stocker from the Phillies way back when for some young Venezuelan outfielder.
2008-10-19 21:39:20
89.   StolenMonkey86
Billingsley may be worth $15M in 2012, but will the Dodgers pay Loney, Kemp, Ethier and Martin $15M each in 2011?

No, but I don't think that they'll be worth that much. I think it's tempting to want to think Ryan Howard set a new precedent, but the fact is that Howard's in his own league. A pure power hitter who in a down year still leads the league in HR and RBI will get paid. Martin is a good hitter at a premium defensive position. Kemp's value will be higher as a CF, and it will depend on how many 30-30 seasons he has. Ethier will be closer to his value if not right on because he's a better on-base guy than Kemp. Loney isn't an above average first baseman offensively, so $15 million would be a bit of a stretch.

2008-10-19 22:02:54
90.   Eric Stephen
Amazingly, the demand for Game 7 tickets was way down tonight in St. Pete, relative to Game 6. The reason: Mike Alstott!

http://tinyurl.com/55s2dx

2008-10-19 22:49:38
91.   immouch
Does anybody know what the "makeup issues" might be with Martin? While I don't think an ownership group that fires long-time employees by FAX and threatens to charge $140 for the worst WS tix can be credible judges of character, I'm wondering what the rumor is related to... Also, any thought about what they might get for Martin? I'm not inclined to think trading Martin would be wise - and I do think he's a very good/fun player to watch - but without knowing who/what they're talking about it seems early to judge...
2008-10-19 23:05:14
92.   LAT
There are no "makeup" issues with Martin. This year and last Ned spoke at a ticketholder lunchon and went out of hos way to prais Matin's "makeup." I don't think there is any issue with him. Rosenthal must be bored.
2008-10-19 23:11:00
93.   Tripon
92 Its a Joel Sherman rumor. How a guy from the New York Post is somehow privy to the Dodgers front office I have no idea.
2008-10-19 23:19:40
94.   LAT
92. Nice typing. Must be wearing mittens.
2008-10-19 23:43:08
95.   bhsportsguy
94 Did you have your make-up test yet?
2008-10-19 23:52:18
96.   LAT
Not yet. Scheduled for Oct 27.
2008-10-20 00:56:15
97.   Michael D
Hasn't it been reported that Martin likes to party and enjoy the night life? It could be possible that the front office thinks he parties too much and that's the "makeup" problem he has.
2008-10-20 01:06:58
98.   Jacob Burch
Or the reports, who come from people with totally bogus reputations, put up another bogus report.

You decide!

2008-10-20 01:18:34
99.   ibleedbloo
If the Dodgers were to give Manny 4 or 5 years, money not a factor, who could we compare him to? Would Bonds be a good comparison? Bonds was a better all around player in his prime, but do we think Manny could be as consistent over the long run?

If I were signing Manny, I would not give him a full no trade after year 3. Are people more worried his abilities will decline or his attitude will escalate?

2008-10-20 04:56:55
100.   Ken Noe
93 Sherman specifically says that the rumors come from other front offices--you know, those guys who would like to get Martin in a trade.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-10-20 05:22:13
101.   Bob Hendley
Xavier Paul is playing this winter in Mexicali, where he will no doubt pick up batting tips from old friend and teammate, Oscar Robles
2008-10-20 06:01:32
102.   Eric Stephen
Former Dodgers in the WS

Rays
Navarro, Aybar, Jackson

Phils
Victorino, Werth

Both Utley and Price were drafted by LA, but chose college instead, so that's a wash.

Overall advantage, Rays.

2008-10-20 06:40:00
103.   D4P
In exchange for Navarro, Aybar, Jackson, and Werth (plus some other players), Ned netted Toby Hall, Mark Hendrickson, Wilson Betemit, Danys Baez, and Lance Carter.

None of whom are still with the Dodgers.

2008-10-20 06:52:35
104.   Marty
RIP Mr. Blackwell.
2008-10-20 06:59:14
105.   tjshere
Whether the rumors about Martin are true or not, this isn't the first time I've heard them. He was discussed back in August on ESPN's Baseball Today -

http://tinyurl.com/649s8u

The blurb about Martin begins around the 13 minute mark following an interview with Andre Ethier. It basically says the Dodgers feel Martin has an inflated opinion of himself.

2008-10-20 07:02:56
106.   D4P
Martin has an inflated opinion of himself

His pimp daddy garb always gave me that impression.

But to be fair, he's only 25 years old.

2008-10-20 07:22:20
107.   Bob Timmermann
102
You can't Victorino as a former Dodger in my opinion since he never played for the big club.

There is a possibility that Jackson could lose his roster spot in the World Series to Troy Percival if the latter is healthy.

2008-10-20 07:40:09
108.   D4P
I'll never Victorino as a former Dodger again.
2008-10-20 07:46:44
109.   Bob Timmermann
I like playing Dodgers Madlibs in the morning.
2008-10-20 08:06:39
110.   ToyCannon
107
At True Blue you can. If you were drafted and signed by the Dodgers you are an old friend. At least 1/2 of us at TB think that way.
2008-10-20 08:07:17
111.   Eric Stephen
107
Good point. I'll put Victorino in the Sid Fernandez / Roberto Clemente pile then! :)
2008-10-20 08:08:03
112.   Eric Stephen
111
I knew I should have looked it up first. Sid Fernandez threw 6 innings for the 1983 NL West champs.

Damn.

2008-10-20 08:12:42
113.   ToyCannon
112
I was crushed when we traded Sid. He had mad minor league strike out numbers.
2008-10-20 08:12:53
114.   Eric Stephen
107 ,110
This is one of those debatable issues.

I'm sticking to counting draft and signs like Wesley Wright as former Dodgers.

Consequently I won't count Ethier as "homegrown" even though the Dodgers are his only MLB team to date, because he was drafted & signed by Oakland.

2008-10-20 08:15:52
115.   Eric Stephen
113
His ability to limit hits was devilish:

http://www.bb-ref.com/pi/shareit/K7Ca

2008-10-20 08:40:52
116.   Bumsrap
I still like the idea of telling Boras the only way the Dodgers will sign Manny is if Boras can find a team that will take Jones' contract (100%) and then only sign Manny to a one year $35MM contract.
2008-10-20 08:43:45
117.   D4P
If I were speaking with Boras about Manny, I would require that Boras explain Manny's behavior in Boston. I would essentially make Boras admit that Manny's behavior was a problem and that it hurt his performance. Then I would ask Boras how I could be certain it wouldn't happen again. Boras wouldn't be able to guarantee such a thing, so I would ask for a huge discount in Manny's salary. Boras would then look elsewhere. I would be happy.
2008-10-20 08:46:45
118.   PalmdaleSteve1
106

Speaking of inflated, look for Andruw Jones appearing in the Macy's Thanksgiving day parade as one of the balloons.

2008-10-20 08:55:55
119.   Bumsrap
116 & 117 Different approach, same result.
2008-10-20 08:55:56
120.   Eric Stephen
If I were to sign Manny, I would be fully aware of the entire package I'm receiving and come to a conclusion that the positives far outweigh the negatives. Then I would proceed to condone any missteps by Manny up until there is a half season left on his contract. At that time, even though he is still the best hitter on the team, I will suddenly change my tune and act indignant at this behavior I knew was there all along.
2008-10-20 08:57:51
121.   DBrim
Bowa might be headed for New York later this week. Who coaches third if he goes?
2008-10-20 08:58:02
122.   kinbote
In the previous thread, someone mentioned a potential seven-man bullpen featuring Broxton, Saito, Wade, Kuo, Proctor, Elbert, & Troncoso.

While several of those names have question marks attached to them due to injury or performance (Saito, Proctor, & Troncoso especially), Elbert is the one that is most iffy.

I really hope we let Elbert begin the year in the minors as a starting pitcher. I know it's a very small sample size, but I didn't see quite enough in his stuff as a reliever to make me think that is the direction we need to go. Let's give him a chance to reestablish himself as an elite starting pitching prospect; lord knows those always come in handy.

If that happens, the spotlight be bright on Greg Miller this spring. He should (will?) have every chance to win the second lefty job in the pen, replacing Beimel. If Kuo can do it, so can Miller. (In theory.)

2008-10-20 09:01:15
123.   kinbote
122 kinbote's Law: Regardless of how much time one spends looking at a comment for typos, one will invariably appear as soon as it posts. ("The spotlight be bright")
2008-10-20 09:01:25
124.   Kevin Lewis
120

That sounds so familiar.

2008-10-20 09:02:30
125.   Bumsrap
122 - I would protect Miller even if it took putting 13 pitchers on the Dodgers to do it.
2008-10-20 09:06:07
126.   cargill06
122 I'm just try to understand this, Elbert and Troncoso are to iffy to give a spot to in the pen but you want to give Miller a chance? If Miller made the major league roster I'd have to turn off the TV every time he pitches, I'd be pulling my hair out.
2008-10-20 09:10:03
127.   Eric Stephen
122
I agree completely. If Elbert's arm can hold up, I would keep him as a starter.
2008-10-20 09:17:52
128.   Eric Stephen
126
If Miller has any semblance of control, he should and will be given every opportunity to make the team, because he will be out of options. If there is any chance they can utilize his arm, they should take it. Elbert & Troncoso can still be sent to the minors if needed.
2008-10-20 09:18:02
129.   cargill06
122 Comparing Kuo and Miller isn't a fair comparison. Miller is averging 9.4 BB/9IP over the last 3 seasons, if they don't have the room on the 40 man to keep him on in case of a maricle it's time to cut ties.
2008-10-20 09:20:34
130.   ToyCannon
125
Why? Even his biggest backer Canuck has finally given up on him. You'd be hard pressed to find ONE pitcher who walked more then a batter per inning while giving up at least a hit an inning in AAA who ever made an impact at the major league level.
2008-10-20 09:21:39
131.   ToyCannon
129
They are both left handed and that is where the comparison ends.
2008-10-20 09:24:28
132.   regfairfield
No one has ever walked more than 7 per nine at the big league level and ever had success. Even if Miller makes it to that level, do you really want Mitch Williams going for you?

Greg Miller is going to find a home somewhere like Pittsburgh where they can keep running him out there without caring if he stinks. He can still be a successful pitcher, just not with the Dodgers.

2008-10-20 09:28:19
133.   cargill06
If any of you didn't see the LSU @ USC highlights on Sat. do yourself a favor and look at this clip.

http://tinyurl.com/69mkdf (SFW.)

2008-10-20 09:31:10
134.   wronghanded
Does anybody think that a package of Pierre (paid in full), McDonald and Elbert could pull off the Peavy sweepstakes?
2008-10-20 09:32:25
135.   cargill06
134 No way, not only are you trading for an elite pitcher, you're trading for an elite pitcher with a very cheap contract.
2008-10-20 09:35:22
136.   wronghanded
I hate to say it but I think Kemp, McDonald and Elbert would be worth it, I like Peavy more than CC. I think CC is going to have arm issues after the Brewers used and abused him. I love Kemp but this is a chance to score Peavy.
2008-10-20 09:35:43
137.   kinbote
129 131 Fair enough. I guess I just want to see him this spring with everything at stake to see if he can somehow get it together. It's not a strong argument, but my case for Miller would be the fact that his injuries have forced him to adjust his arm slot, thereby causing the control issues. It's not like he's a head case. Maybe it's nostalgia, but he was Kershaw in his time. I'm not ready to give up on that memory until I have to.
2008-10-20 09:45:27
138.   ToyCannon
135
I wouldn't call his contract cheap.
10:$15M, 11:$16M, 12:$17M, 13: $22M club option ($4M buyout)

22 million by 2013. I do like the 4M buyout if he has shreaded his arm by then. It would have to a deal simliar to what the Diamondbacks gave up for Haren. They probably don't want anyone with any major league experience.
McDonald, DeJesus, Withrow, Lambo, Elbert might get it done. I'm passing because I think Peavy already peaked.

2008-10-20 09:52:12
139.   D4P
Whether we trade for Peavy or not, it seems pretty clear that the Dodgers are going to have to make at least one (if not two) starting pitcher acquisitions. I think the most likely scenario involves acquiring an expensive pitcher plus a Tomko/Hendrickson/Maddux/Wells kinda guy, who might also be somewhat expensive (or at least, overpaid) but not as good (on paper) as the first guy.
2008-10-20 09:52:31
140.   old dodger fan
138 I like Sabathia over Peavy if for no other reason than he won't cost us players, but obviously he will cost more dollars.

Any thoughts on what he will get?

2008-10-20 09:54:03
141.   cargill06
138 What is his salary for '09?

'10-'12 is 3 yrs $48 million, AKA the Jason Schmidt deal.

2008-10-20 09:56:49
142.   regfairfield
I think it would take two of Kemp, Kershaw and Bills to even get involved in the bidding for Peavy. Whether or not you think it's worth it is another thing, but someone out there will be more than willing to give up a ton of talent for Peavy.
2008-10-20 09:57:08
143.   old dodger fan
Free Agent Starting Pitchers per mlbcontracts

Kris Benson PHI
A.J. Burnett TOR (may opt out)
Paul Byrd BOS
Ryan Dempster CHC
Jon Garland LAA
Tom Glavine ATL
Mike Hampton * ATL
Rich Harden * CHC
Orlando Hernandez NYM
Jason Jennings TEX
Randy Johnson ARZ
John Lackey * LAA
Esteban Loaiza CHW
Braden Looper STL
Derek Lowe LAD
Pedro Martinez NYM
Mike Mussina NYY
Jamie Moyer PHI
Mark Mulder * STL
Carl Pavano NYY
Brad Penny * LAD
Odalis Perez WAS
Oliver Perez NYM
Andy Pettitte NYY
Mark Prior SD
Horacio Ramirez CHW
C.C. Sabathia MIL
Ben Sheets MIL
John Smoltz * ATL
Julian Tavarez ATL
Steve Trachsel BAL
Brett Tomko SD
Claudio Vargas MIL
Randy Wolf HOU
* - player whose contract includes 2009 option

2008-10-20 09:59:46
144.   Bumsrap
130 Why? Even his biggest backer Canuck has finally given up on him.

I guess that makes me Miller's biggest backer now. I will add him to my DeWitt list.

If Miller's command problem is mental and not physical, that can be fixed during the off season. And, yes, I know how and where it can be accomplished.

2008-10-20 10:05:14
145.   Eric Stephen
144
Wait, I thought Canuck liked DeWitt. Your list classification confuses me!
2008-10-20 10:15:54
146.   kinbote
If Greg changes his name to DeMiller, does he have a chance? ;)
2008-10-20 10:20:00
147.   ToyCannon
141
Sure, but I don't consider Schmidt cheap. How many pitchers are making more then that? D Lowe was cheap.

143
This is our chance to bring in Odalis and Oliver Perez.

2008-10-20 10:20:51
148.   ToyCannon
144
Lobotomy?
2008-10-20 10:21:38
149.   ToyCannon
140
6/150 is my guess.
2008-10-20 10:22:11
150.   Senta
........i'm going to make a case for the rays. i was rooting for them, SORRY but i was. i mean, boston won the world series, what? 2, 3 years ago? i was rooting for boston then. it was TIME they finally won a world series and showed up the yankees. but these young rays deserve it.

IMAGINE: kid baseball dreams, and then nobody signs you but the freaking DEVIL RAYS. the laughing stock of baseball. and you know you're going to be playing to only like, 1500 fans any given day. sometimes less.

it must be so depressing. a random clap here and there when you get a hit. in your own freaking HOME TOWN. but you don't let it get to you. you do your BEST.

you and your buddies endure this day after day. you hear rumors that management is considering shutting down...they're not pulling in any money from ticket sales. your pay is super low compared to your peers in other teams.

but day after day you do your BEST. everyone on your team is doing their best. you start winning games for the first time in the history of the team....in fact you go all the way.

you deserve it! and finally, you're filling the stadium. imagine what that must sound like, to finally be hearing something from the stands. :)
baseball isn't a big thing in florida. virtually ignored. but this kind of thing wakes up the people to baseball. fans are born this way. it's good for baseball.

i don't have anything against boston. i like the Sox. but the Rays deserved this. boston put up a good fight. i like their fans. i like boston...great city. but the rays deserved this and i was rooting for them. and their rookie pitcher who didn't have one save on his record. yet performed when he needed to. AWESOME.

Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-10-20 10:23:49
151.   Marty
Didn't you guys hear me? Mr. Blackwell is dead. How can we go on?
2008-10-20 10:24:48
152.   Kevin Lewis
150

You don't need to convince me.

Okay, last time. I have made an evite for a pickup softball game this weekend. Post your email if you want me to send it on to you. This is co-ed and very casual.

2008-10-20 10:25:47
153.   ToyCannon
150
David Price striking out JD Drew is right up there with my Welch/Jackson moment. He's quite a toy.
2008-10-20 10:26:24
154.   ToyCannon
152
Location?
2008-10-20 10:28:20
155.   Harold M Johnson
It would be a real shame to lose Bowa. He was awesome this year a big part of the team's run.
2008-10-20 10:29:31
156.   D4P
Mr. Blackwell is dead

I blame Shimmin.

2008-10-20 10:30:11
157.   Andrew Shimmin
151-
The stars are not wanted now: put out every one;
Pack up the moon and dismantle the sun;
Pour away the ocean and sweep up the wood.
For nothing now can ever come to any good.
2008-10-20 10:30:40
158.   gibsonhobbs88
Congratulations to the Rays: I thought they had given their chance away with that blown 7-0 lead in Game 5 but they pulled it out. Congratulations to Former Dodgers in that series who contributed with their glove or bat - Willie Aybar and Navarro.

I will definitely be rooting for Tampa for several reasons that I may list later but to summarize:
1) Great underdog - Worst to First story in one year!;
2) Lower payroll but using your payroll efficiently with wise new baseball personnel management and sticking it to the high revenue Yankees and Red Sox;

3) A Karmic "stick in the eye" to Bud and Bob that only baseball purists like me would watch the World Series and the ratings will be in the tank. For Bob Watson and Bud to condone Phillies pitchers taking target practice on Dodgers hitters without impunity (no fines) and only fining Kuroda for protecting Martin and Manny;

*Joe Maddon, I guess has it right all along. This is where he differs with his former manager Scioscia who will not have his pitchers protect his batters, Madden will and has proven that this season on a couple occasions. The Shields-Crisp dustup was a prime example. After seeing Crisp do the dirty slide the game before, Shields at the next opportunity hit Crisp in the hip.

Maddon knows from prior experience with the Angels that Bob Watson will do nothing until an actual bench clearing brawl happens before he will act! (Unless someone throws at a Yankee or Met, or Red Sox player)Maddon remembers Ranger pitchers getting away with throing at Vlad's head without retribution from the league until Kennedy charged the mound. Maddon does not wait! Shields did not head hunt, but they got their message across as they did with the Yanks in spring training.

Watson proved again that it is condoned by MLB to throw at the head and eyes of Dodger hitters and the league will do nothing! But God gorbid the Dodgers retaliate, maximum fines, even though Kuroda's pitch was not as close to Victorino as Condrey's or Myers' were to Martin's or Manny's domes. I guess if Kuroda actually had hit Victorino, we would not see Kuroda again unitl next July!! Selig and Watson have once again shown their contempt for LA teams and our market despite the revenue we bring to MLB!! I wish both of them would get lost on a slow boat in the Persian sea!!

2008-10-20 10:33:58
159.   Kevin Lewis
154

Shooting for the Rose Bowl and moving to the Eagle Rock Rec center if the fields are taken.

The Rose Bowl fields are almost always free on Sunday afternoons, except for when the CalTech Frisbee game shows up, and they try to take up the entire outfield for both fields.

2008-10-20 10:35:34
160.   Andrew Shimmin
Did Blackwell have a real job, or did he just have his list every year?
2008-10-20 10:40:18
161.   Andrew Shimmin
Wikipedia says he did a guest spot on Blossom. So, he had that going for him.
2008-10-20 10:41:49
162.   Eric Stephen
155
I can't tell if that was serious or not.
2008-10-20 10:41:57
163.   LogikReader
158

Man, you've been on this train for quite a while, even going back to the Astros "home game" in Milwaukee, the block of the Vlad Guerrero deal, and possibly the decision to make the All Star Game count for Home Field Advantage.

I kind of see it, but really, what is the incentive for MLB to "keep the Dodgers down?"

2008-10-20 10:42:42
164.   Jon Weisman
NPUT

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