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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Walk This Way
2008-12-07 09:52
by Jon Weisman

Mike Davis is blogging. I found this out via Blue Heaven, which pointed me to Vin Scully Is My Homeboy, which had the link to the blog of the October 1988 Dodger hero, supporting class.

Blue Heaven also has a link to some classic photos, including Babe Ruth in an LA uniform. (Follow the link for an explanation.)


* * *

Stanford (25-5) plays USC (28-0) for the NCAA men's water polo title at 3 p.m. today on the Farm.

Comments (244)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-12-07 10:12:06
1.   D4P
According to the Seattle Times, the Twins have had conversations with the Mariners about third baseman Adrian Beltre. The paper suggests that outfielder Michael Cuddyer could be had for Beltre.

Perhaps the LA Times should start suggesting that outfielders Juan Pierre and/or Andruw Jones could be had for Beltre.

2008-12-07 10:28:31
2.   berkowit28
I like the comment that "the reverse bares some Editors notations". On the Babe's backside, perhaps?
2008-12-07 10:39:00
3.   Tripon
Where would the M's play Cuddyer? He plays RF, and they already have Ichiro.
2008-12-07 10:55:47
4.   thinkblue88
...."a date which will live in infamy"....
2008-12-07 11:10:47
5.   D4P
1-0 Notre Dame after 16 seconds of play.
2008-12-07 11:15:44
6.   Bob Timmermann
Notre Dame has a decided schematic advantage in this match.
2008-12-07 11:16:43
7.   D4P
Their scheme to kick the ball into UNC's net is a good one.
2008-12-07 12:01:41
8.   D4P
UNC outshoots ND 7-2 in the first half, but the NCAA has decided to base the outcome of the game on a concept they label "goal", where ND leads UNC 1-0.
2008-12-07 12:08:56
9.   Bluebleeder87
thanks for the links Jon.

nothing new but here's some more Dodgers news from the Daily Breeze

2008-12-07 12:11:32
10.   Bluebleeder87
9 *Daily Breeze> The Dodgers also are believed to be still in the running for free-agent left-hander CC Sabathia, the top pitcher on the market, and the fact Sabathia still hasn't jumped at the New York Yankees' offer of six years and $140 million seems to suggest he isn't all that interested in pitching in baseball's biggest pressure cooker.

Still, if Sabathia doesn't join the Yankees, the San Francisco Giants appear to be the favorites to land the Vallejo native.

if the Giants land CC there gonna be STACKED with great arms man!

2008-12-07 12:22:05
11.   D4P
2008-12-07 12:33:34
12.   Tripon
10 They already spent about 15 million in 2009, and 30 million overall already on free agents, do they really have another 20 million this year, and another 120 million overall to give to C.C.?
2008-12-07 12:35:09
13.   trainwreck
I know they have been trying to get rid of Zito to save some money. But, I do not see how that gets done.
2008-12-07 12:35:43
14.   Tripon
* is reporting that Jason Varitek will decline Boston's offer of arbitration.
Varitek looked liked the only big-name free agent with even a slim chance of accepting the offer prior to tonight's deadline. Darren Oliver and Brandon Lyon are the best bets from the entire group of 24.*

You have gotta be kidding me, Boras is giving him horrible advice.

2008-12-07 12:36:36
15.   Tripon
13 The funny thing is that the Giants might have been able to have enough money to spend on C.C. if they didn't go on this mini-free agent spree they already did.
2008-12-07 12:37:37
16.   D4P
Boras is giving him horrible advice

Do agents get a chunk of arbitration salaries, or does Boras only get paid if Varitek gets a new contract...?

2008-12-07 12:38:36
17.   Tripon
13 Mike Hampton would show the way I suppose. A 3 way trade where all three teams paid for Hampton's contract so the team who actually traded for him only paid a portion of the contract.
2008-12-07 12:39:11
18.   Tripon
16 I would assume any new contract, arbitration, or otherwise, that Boras makes a commission on it.
2008-12-07 12:41:37
19.   D4P
You gotta wonder if it's even worthwhile financially for players to have agents. Is the difference between what they'd get in salary with an agent vs. without really larger than the amount they pay the agent? I'm not convinced...

All agents really do is demand a lot of years and a lot money: why can't players do that on their own?

2008-12-07 12:42:14
20.   Bob Timmermann
Since Boras would represent any of his players in an arbtiration hearing, I would think he would want a commission.
2008-12-07 12:50:57
21.   Bluebleeder87

well, if you've been playing long enough some players act as there own agents from what I've seen in the past.

2008-12-07 12:55:54
22.   KG16
13 - Zito is going to be the comeback player of the year next year. I have this strange feeling, from reading a few articles about him, that he figured out what ever it was that sent his career sideways. CC, Linecum, Cain, and a renewed Zito is a scary, scary rotation, especially in a division that will give them close to 100 games in the Phone Book, Dodger Stadium, and Petco.
2008-12-07 12:55:59
23.   Tripon
Boras wants a commission even when players fire him, and negotiate their own contracts.
2008-12-07 12:57:28
24.   Marty
You hire an agent to negotiate contracts for the same reason you don't represent yourself in court.
2008-12-07 13:00:31
25.   KG16
19 - I don't know. the CBA is not an uncomplicated document. most ballplayers fall into one (or more) of these categories: a. didn't go to college; b. do not have english as their native language; c. would prefer not to focus on the business side of baseball; d. would like to get endorsement deals to supplement their baseball income; e. get agents when they are entering the system and don't know anything about the system.

It's not just about asking for a lot of money, it's making a case that this particular player fits this particular team's needs in a particular way that other players can't. And then the negotiation of the contract. The devil is in the details.

2008-12-07 13:00:56
26.   KG16
and what Marty said.
2008-12-07 13:02:20
27.   D4P
Let's put it this way: I have to think that hiring an agent is probably worth it for some players, and not for others.
2008-12-07 13:03:56
28.   D4P
2008-12-07 13:07:42
29.   D4P
UNC wins its 19th championship in the 27 years of NCAA women's soccer championships.


2008-12-07 13:10:04
30.   trainwreck
I guess D4P has switched allegiance to an athletic program that wins.
2008-12-07 13:13:09
31.   LAT
19 I have no doubt that in nearly all transactions the agent more than pays for himself. Most of these players barely have a HS degree. They are not equipped to sit across the table from a bunch of shark lawyers and hugely successful business men and fairly negotiate a multi-million contract. The owners probably salivate when they see an unrepresented player walk into their office. The agent knows the market, is better able to negotiate, is more objective than the player, often has a law degree and has the luxury of being an douche bag if the situation warrants. The player cannot do these things in hammering out a deal. Its the same with houses. Sure, anyone can sell their own home and save the 5% but usually the dork in the yellow blazer will get you more money, help you avoid the pitfalls and navigate the paperwork.

From the idealistic naïveté of my couch I like to think otherwise, but the truth is if I were a MLB player, Scott Boras would be on my speed dial.

2008-12-07 13:29:11
32.   Andrew Shimmin
If I were an MLB player, I'd have D4P represent me. Sure, he'd get me a crappy one year, incentive only deal, but I'd feel so good about how honorable I was that it would all be worth it.
2008-12-07 13:32:37
33.   Tripon

Top 11 prospects list for the Brewers.
1. Alcides Escobar, SS leads the list

2008-12-07 13:44:16
34.   Bob Timmermann
He would make sure you are paid more than the manager though.
2008-12-07 13:44:28
35.   natepurcell

That made me LOLz.

2008-12-07 13:50:44
36.   Andrew Shimmin
34- If I were an MLB manager, I would not want D4P to represent me. He'd be like the lawyer in Supreme Courtship who took the Klan's case, lost it for them, and bankrupted them with his bill.
2008-12-07 13:57:13
37.   Tripon
Darren Oliver's going to accept the Angel's arbitration offer.
2008-12-07 13:58:09
38.   D4P
If I were an agent, I don't think I could ever ask for way more than I thought my player deserved.

Kinda like how if I were a lawyer, I don't think I could ever represent a client when I agreed more with the other side.

2008-12-07 13:58:41
39.   D4P
Darren Oliver's going to accept the Angel's arbitration offer

Crap...I already started the presses...

2008-12-07 13:59:00
40.   natepurcell

Who are you to decide how much your player deserves?

He deserves as much as someone is willing to pay him.

2008-12-07 14:01:15
41.   caseybarker
2008-12-07 14:03:50
42.   D4P
Who are you to decide how much your player deserves?

One who would rely on the most sophisticated stats available (e.g. win shares or whatever) to give me the best estimate as to a player's worth.

I would also use the same information if I were a GM.

2008-12-07 14:05:25
43.   natepurcell

I don't think you would have many clients...

2008-12-07 14:05:35
44.   Bob Timmermann
Then just hope that some wild pitcher throws a fastball off of your client's hand and breaks it and disables him for five months.
2008-12-07 14:05:38
45.   caseybarker
Although I've always thought that deserve is a loaded term.
2008-12-07 14:07:46
46.   D4P
No, I wouldn't have many clients. Good thing I don't want to be an agent.
2008-12-07 14:09:12
47.   Tripon
Dan Evans is a player agent nowadays. Thank god he hasn't tried to rip off Ned Coletti yet.
2008-12-07 14:16:23
48.   trainwreck
What would you do if you were an agent for MMA fighters?
2008-12-07 14:17:27
49.   D4P
Notre Dame's goal 16 seconds into today's championship bout was the fastest in lady Irish history.
2008-12-07 14:17:56
50.   D4P
Quit my job...?
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-12-07 14:19:15
51.   trainwreck
I was wondering how you would determine their value, since stats are a lot different.
2008-12-07 14:20:59
52.   D4P
I think I'd probably end up focusing a lot more on their entertainment value (e.g. putting people in the seats, getting them to buy pay-per-views, etc.).

Baseball players contribute to team wins and losses, whereas MMA fighters really only contribute to selling tickets.

2008-12-07 14:22:36
53.   trainwreck
Yeah, that is what I was wondering. Because Brock Lesnar obviously going to make more money than a Lyoto Machida.
2008-12-07 14:24:09
54.   D4P
And Kimbo (arguably the worst fighter in MMA) made something like $500k per fight.
2008-12-07 14:25:15
55.   lab rat
No disrespect to Dodger World Champion Mike Davis...but I was getting excited that urban scholar Mike Davis had started a blog.


2008-12-07 14:34:53
56.   natepurcell
What are thoughts on Ty Wiggington at 3b? I've heard he would be on the block for the Astros.
2008-12-07 14:36:22
57.   trainwreck
Check his home and away splits.
2008-12-07 14:38:33
58.   D4P
I posted those the other day. They're not good.
2008-12-07 14:42:14
59.   natepurcell
57 , 58

Right last year he seemed to do all his damager at home but 2005 for pit and 2006/2007 for tampa, he posted ISOp's of 207, 223, and 183...He seems to be good for around 20 homeruns a year.

2008-12-07 14:42:42
60.   trainwreck
If only we could trade for Pedro Alvarez.

What teams have a couple of elite third base prospects?

2008-12-07 14:47:22
61.   Tripon
I'm sure if the Dodgers made an offer for Andy LaRoche, the Pirates will bite.
2008-12-07 15:00:35
62.   Kuo-fax
Anyone see how Wigginton's defense is at 2nd vs 3rd? He could be a good stopgag at 2nd, allowing Blake to slide over to 3rd, where he is better defensively, no? Seems like W would produce as much as Casey Blake.
2008-12-07 15:11:10
63.   jujibee
Would you guys trade JP for Zito plus 40ish mil divided evenly for the remainder of his contract?
2008-12-07 15:12:24
64.   Dodgers49
A-Rod's WBC decision pleases his mom

>> Rodriguez is expected to play third base in the WBC, the same position he plays for the Yankees. The Dominican third baseman in the inaugural 2006 games was Adrian Beltre, who probably cannot play in 2009 because he is recovering from offseason thumb and shoulder surgeries. <<

2008-12-07 15:21:12
65.   trainwreck
Apparently there is talk the Giants are thinking of a Sanchez for Blalock deal now.
2008-12-07 15:42:56
66.   D4P
Looks like Manny will decline arbitration.
2008-12-07 15:50:33
67.   Bluebleeder87
one thing about the Babe Ruth pic (depending on what year that picture was taken) he looks in pretty good shape, you think he lost a few for the movie?
2008-12-07 15:54:43
68.   Bluebleeder87

I'm a bit indifferent about him these days... I'm sure the Dodgers would have given him a really long leash in '09.

2008-12-07 16:01:33
69.   Bumsrap
Given Congress' attitude about baseball work stoppages / strikes, I can't imagine the scorn they would show if baseball asked for a bailout. The Dodgers can field a pretty good team full of young players and be more fiscally responsible than if they were to sign one or more high priced free agents. Admittedly, staying away from high end free agents to keep the team solvent puts the accountants in control and not the marketeers.

If revenues are down for all teams in 2009, the Dodgers might be able to take contracts off the hands of teams that can't meet payroll, assuming the Dodgers minimize their payroll to begin the 2009 season. I kind of like that.

I think the Dodgers already have the players they need for 2009 with the exception of a couple of Chan Ho Park type innings eaters.

2008-12-07 16:02:56
70.   Ken Noe
Heyman thinks the Indians to make a push for Furcal. Also a link to his story on Manny declining arbitration.

2008-12-07 16:04:48
71.   Bumsrap
I thought part of the agreement for getting Manny was that not only did the Dodgers not get the rights to the two option years Boston had, but that Manny and the Dodgers agreed that the Dodgers would not offer and that Manny would not accept arbitration.
2008-12-07 16:07:15
72.   trainwreck
2008-12-07 16:10:15
73.   Bumsrap
72 - In that case, I bet Manny's best deal will be a one year arbitrated contract with the Dodgers.
2008-12-07 16:23:23
74.   D4P
Pacers leading Celtics by 2 at the half.
2008-12-07 16:30:43
75.   oshea2002
USC wins the mens water polo title.
2008-12-07 16:38:24
76.   Tripon
The Wall Street Journal is reporting Tribune Co. is preparing for a possible bankruptcy-protection filing as soon as this week, according to people familiar with the matter.

You have gotta be kidding me. Can't Tribune just sell the Times to somebody who gives a damn?

2008-12-07 16:43:59
77.   Eric Enders
Well, I'll say one thing, nobody will ever accuse Mike Davis of having a ghostwriter do his blog.

67 The stereotype of the jolly, fat, Babe Ruth comes mostly from the 1930s when he was older. In his twenties Ruth was a lot trimmer with a very athletic build.

2008-12-07 17:14:24
78.   trainwreck
Utah vs Alabama does not thrill me.
2008-12-07 17:15:00
79.   trainwreck
Ohio St vs Texas
2008-12-07 17:19:32
80.   trainwreck
Poor Boise State.
2008-12-07 17:24:07
81.   cargill06
65 Do the Giants not realize how good that guy could be?
2008-12-07 17:37:01
82.   Icaros
Pacers and Celtics headed to OT in Indiana.
2008-12-07 17:47:05
83.   Tripon
81 Could be is different than will be. Sanchez is the most expendable of the young arms SF has. Of course the Giants are targeting the wrong guys, Sanchez should be able to get another young up and comer like a guy like Hermida, not a slug like Cantu, or Blalock.
2008-12-07 17:49:32
84.   Tripon,0,6945838.story

Shakin questions if Baseball is actually affected by the recession as much as they claim.

2008-12-07 17:52:36
85.   Tripon
It might not be easy to separate the effects of the recession from the effects of the amphetamine ban on older players and from the increased reluctance of teams to pay for past performance, based on statistical analysis showing that most players tend to peak in their late 20s.

From above post. Players will rue the day when sabrmetrics has shown that their best years are already arbitration controlled.

2008-12-07 17:54:22
86.   Tripon
According to Hal McCoy of the Dayton Daily News, a Major League source told him a Homer Bailey for Jermaine Dye trade "is done and will be announced this week."


2008-12-07 17:58:40
87.   trainwreck
lol why are you mad?
2008-12-07 18:00:22
88.   Tripon
87 Kenny Williams is able to move high priced contracts for young players. Meanwhile, we're worrying that we don't even have enough money to sign anybody.
2008-12-07 18:07:20
89.   trainwreck
Not like we had a player to trade for Dye. Probably would have taken McDonald.
2008-12-07 18:34:05
90.   Tripon,0,4324399.story,0,7658661.story

The Times does angels and dodgers winter meeting previews

2008-12-07 18:36:37
91.   underdog
You guys want to kill 7 minutes of your evening. Enjoy (or cry while playing) this one:

2008-12-07 18:39:35
92.   trainwreck
Your team is going to kill mine in playoffs.
2008-12-07 18:57:52
93.   underdog
92 Yikes. yeah, a few people (and units) went off, guess that's all it takes to make up for the other slackers. Ah well, sorry. Too bad there's no actual money involved. ;-)
2008-12-07 19:13:06
94.   Tripon
Mark Gonzales of the Chicago Tribune is reporting that the swap of Jermaine Dye for Homer Bailey isn't true.

2008-12-07 19:15:31
95.   Alex41592
Matt Kemp interview coming up on FSN West during the Laker game.
2008-12-07 19:15:36
96.   trainwreck
Matt Kemp to be interviewed during Laker game. He was just off in some are sitting by himself.
2008-12-07 19:15:53
97.   trainwreck
2008-12-07 19:16:11
98.   Tripon
Does Kemp stay in L.A. during the off season?
2008-12-07 19:18:55
99.   natepurcell
Trevor Ariza is one of Kemp's best buddies...maybe Arizona will re-sign after the season.
2008-12-07 19:19:26
100.   natepurcell
and by Arizona...Ariza...whatever.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-12-07 19:20:03
101.   Tripon
The Suns better not sign Ariza in the off season!!!
2008-12-07 19:21:22
102.   Eric Stephen
Cue D4P:

Matt Kemp: "...Manny wants to be's not my decision, it's not his decision..."

2008-12-07 19:21:42
103.   natepurcell
Apparently Kemp has spoken with Manny several times this off season...
2008-12-07 19:22:19
104.   trainwreck
He said he moved to LA.
2008-12-07 19:22:26
105.   natepurcell

I think Matt meant that it would be the team's/management's decision.

2008-12-07 19:22:53
106.   trainwreck
I expect Lakers to let Odom leave and then sign Ariza. Unless someone gives him a crazy offer.
2008-12-07 19:23:43
107.   Eric Stephen
I figured that's what he meant...I just thought the quote was funny.
2008-12-07 19:25:34
108.   Tripon
Also, Myers is such a homer. Vin Scully would not approve.
2008-12-07 19:26:51
109.   Tripon

Burnett and Lyons reject their arbitration offers. I'm surprised Lyons did it, he finished poorly.

2008-12-07 19:27:02
110.   Alex41592
Brandon Lyon declines arbitration from the D'Backs.

2008-12-07 19:29:43
111.   Tripon
According to Jon Paul Morosi of the Detroit Free Press, "The Tigers and Texas Rangers have made significant progress toward a trade that would send catcher Gerald Laird to Detroit and pitching prospect Guillermo Moscoso to the Rangers." It's not known whether the Tigers would include anyone else.

2008-12-07 19:32:26
112.   Alex41592
No Dye/Bailey deal.,0,7672373.story

2008-12-07 19:38:14
113.   Jon Weisman
So the Laker defense has done its job tonight, apparently?
2008-12-07 19:42:13
114.   Tripon
Huh, Sun Yue is activated tonight. Well, with the game going like it is, he's not going to play anyway.
2008-12-07 19:48:27
115.   Eric Stephen
Is there some back story to the seemingly mentally-challenged way Bill MacDonald says "Jack in the Box" when mentioning the sponsor? I'm trying to find a reason not to hate him.
2008-12-07 19:48:27
116.   Tripon
Brian Fuentes reject the Rockies arbitration offer.

2008-12-07 19:55:35
117.   Eric Stephen
This is going to sound incredibly nit-picky, but sometimes links to the specific articles/posts are cool.

There are 3 different news items in 109 , 111 , & 116 , but all 3 links point to the main page of MLB Trade Rumors.

2008-12-07 19:59:21
118.   Tripon
117 Because I was just scanning mlbtraderumors. But I get your point.
2008-12-07 19:59:32
119.   KG16
couple of quick points:

1. i had the opportunity to play water polo in high school at Stanford's pool, it is one of the best facilities I ever played in - the other was Belmont Plaza in Long Beach.

2. I haven't followed polo closely the last few years, but I am not surprised to see that USC is still dominant, and that Stanford is playing well.

3. Boise State should have got in the Fiesta Bowl spot over Ohio State.

4. I kind of missed this place the last few days.

2008-12-07 20:00:57
120.   Tripon
118 And on that note, Heyman reports that Orlando Cabrera declines arbitration.

Which team will give up a first or 2nd rounder for Cabrera?

2008-12-07 20:02:40
121.   KG16
120 - we all know the answer to that question is the Dodgers.
2008-12-07 20:03:49
122.   Tripon I was able to obtain a sub of a promo for the new Full Metal Alchemist series that is going to air in Japan starting in April. Its only a 30 second promo, but still, its FMA!

Also, its a retelling starting from the beginning, so you can forget that Edward Elric met Martin Luther King Jr.

2008-12-07 20:04:11
123.   Dodgers49
Spotlight on Vegas as Meetings begin

>> A deep starting-pitching market is buoyed by Sabathia, A.J. Burnett, Ben Sheets, Derek Lowe, and veterans Pedro Martinez, Kenny Rogers, John Smoltz, Tom Glavine, Jamie Moyer, Brad Penny, Oliver Perez, Jon Garland, Paul Byrd, Braden Looper, Josh Fogg, Jon Lieber, Livan Hernandez and Mark Hendrickson. <<

I had forgotten that Big Bird is available. I wonder what Ned is thinking? :-)

2008-12-07 20:04:51
124.   silverwidow
Manny still has 55 minutes to accept...
2008-12-07 20:05:30
125.   silverwidow
Who knows, maybe Casey Blake will accept.
2008-12-07 20:09:37
126.   Tripon

Stark has a new column out. He takes a couple of more potshots at Manny. I get it Stark, you don't like Manny. You can stop ramming that point through my skull now.

2008-12-07 20:12:53
127.   Eric Stephen
Whomever is running the PA system at Staples Center should get a raise. As Kobe & Tyrron Lue walked to the bench to clean up some blood (Kobe had a cut), "Sunday Bloody Sunday" played over the loudspeaker.

Moments like that are what I live for.

2008-12-07 20:13:16
128.   trainwreck
Awww, I thought they were going to make it look different.
2008-12-07 20:20:04
129.   DBrim
127 - I liked "Why Can't We Be Friends?" on the PA at Dodger Stadium during the NLCS brawl.
2008-12-07 20:25:43
130.   Tripon
128 Just wait until you meet the people from the country of Xing. They're the best characters not to make it into the original series.
2008-12-07 20:27:27
131.   trainwreck
Is this version based more off comics?
2008-12-07 20:34:42
132.   Alex41592
Casey Blake declines arbitration.

2008-12-07 20:34:54
133.   silverwidow
Blake just declined. There you go.
2008-12-07 20:35:47
134.   silverwidow
Manny for 1 year/$30 million is still a possibility.

25 minutes to go.

2008-12-07 20:37:51
135.   Tripon
131 Yeah, it should closely follow the plot of the comic series.

The previous series was developed when the series was only in its 1st year, so the anime studio had to develop its own plot based on the information the mangaka gave them.

I don't want to spoil much, but the comics has different homunculus, a new back story for certain characters, and introduces some really cool characters like the people from Xing, and Armstrong's older sister, Olivier Mira Armstrong.

2008-12-07 20:44:32
136.   Daniel Zappala
114 You were saying?
2008-12-07 20:46:00
137.   Tripon
136 Well, we know that Sun Yue can foul with the best of them.
2008-12-07 20:46:14
138.   Daniel Zappala
Two fouls and a turnover in the first minute of play for Yue Sun.
2008-12-07 20:48:06
139.   Tripon
3rd foul for Sun Yue!
2008-12-07 20:49:15
140.   trainwreck
Sun Yue, Yue suck!
2008-12-07 20:51:04
141.   Tripon

New article by Gammons discussing on the private lives of athletes.

2008-12-07 20:56:10
142.   Tripon
Joe Alexander's back on the roster?
2008-12-07 20:58:35
143.   eusmus
Nice to see Sun Yue outscore Lamar Odom in his debut.
2008-12-07 20:59:23
144.   Tripon
4 points, 4 minutes, 4 fouls for Sun Yue.
2008-12-07 21:05:18
145.   Eric Stephen
Derek Fisher is going to take his wife out on a date tonight, per his postgame interview. As he holds the door open for her at some restaurant and she walks by, unfettered, she will truly understand the ease of an NBA point guard's game playing the Lakers.

OK, that was probably a horribly weak analogy.

2008-12-07 21:05:26
146.   Daniel Zappala
Don't forget the two turnovers.
2008-12-07 21:08:24
147.   Eric Stephen
That would have ruined the "quads wild" ("double dueces?") moment. :)
2008-12-07 21:13:18
148.   Tripon
So is Joe Alexander back on the team, or did Joel Myers misspoke?
2008-12-07 21:24:35
149.   trainwreck
Yeah, he is.
2008-12-07 21:30:12
150.   Tripon
11:27pm: Ken Rosenthal says the Tigers acquired Laird for Moscoso and a second prospect. He adds that the Tigers are considering Adam Everett and Nick Punto as shortstop options.

David Weathers accepts the Reds' arbitration offer, Milton Bradley declined, and so did Brian Shouse.

Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-12-07 21:34:11
151.   Dodgers49
Baseball players, agents, GMs set to wheel, deal in Las Vegas

>> Sabathia, 28, says he's not stalling, but simply needs time. He and his wife have a newborn. They left their Cleveland home last week to return to Fairfield, Calif. Now, he says, he will start focusing on a decision.

"His intent is to sit back and hear from everyone that might be interested," agent Brian Peters says, "and take it from there." <<

2008-12-07 21:34:23
152.   Tripon

Tony Jackson reports that Manny, Lowe, and Blake all rejected arbitration.

2008-12-07 21:38:11
153.   underdog
Moscoso and a prospect for Laird seems pretty fair for both teams. I'm still not totally sold on Laird, but we'll see. He fills a need. Moscoso could move up the prospect chart if he shows he's healthy. Other prospect is a young unnamed Dominican.

Seems fair 'nuf tho.

Brace yourselves, should be a flurry of activity coming in next two days.

2008-12-07 21:43:49
154.   trainwreck
Why in the world would they want to be in Fairfield?
2008-12-07 21:45:27
155.   MC Safety
150 Looks like the AL OPS leader isn't going to be accepting the one year deal you proclaimed he would.
2008-12-07 21:46:10
156.   Icaros

It's a step up from Vallejo, barely.

2008-12-07 21:53:07
157.   Tripon
155 I'm a bit surprised at that. Maybe Bradley still thinks he can get 4 years/40 million.
2008-12-07 21:56:57
158.   oshea2002
157 - Furcal thinks he can get 4 and $52, so nothing surprise me.
2008-12-07 21:57:03
159.   underdog
Fairfield, the North Haverbrook of the Bay Area.

No, worse.

Man that place is depressing, no offense. I should think Sabathia could afford to rebuild the entire town with the money from his next contract, if he wanted.

2008-12-07 22:00:41
160.   trainwreck
He will only get fatter living there, because all there is to do is go to In N Out.
2008-12-07 22:07:25
161.   MC Safety
157 I don't get how your surprised that one of the best hitters in the game declined a one year deal.
2008-12-07 22:07:37
162.   Icaros
I always preferred the Fairfield Mall to Sunvalley, at least for actually buying things.
2008-12-07 22:11:41
163.   Tripon
161 Because of the amount of games he missed over the years. That affects everyone, including Furcal. If you can only play 120 games as a DH, and you want to be paid 10 million a year, there isn't going to be a big market for you, in my opinion. The Rangers were one of the teams that values what Milton Bradley can do, and this kinda shuts the door on them, who else is going to accept Bradley's contract demands?
2008-12-07 22:20:56
164.   trainwreck
Sunvalley is useful if you want to buy some stupid looking sports hat or want to hang out with a bunch of poser 15 year olds.
2008-12-07 22:31:33
165.   Gagne55
The arb acceptance deadline feels like it's earlier than previous years. Maybe it's just that fewer free agents have signed. Or I'm going crazy.
2008-12-07 22:38:57
166.   Xeifrank
fwiw, UZR defensive stats are now publicly available at Fangraphs along with wOBA. UZR has been touted as the best defensive metric and was once considered highly classified.
vr, Xei
2008-12-08 00:14:56
167.   LogikReader
Morning everyone!

I've started podcasting, and over on LOCKS of the Week (link is along sidebar), I have a quick preview of the upcoming BCS Bowls. Hope you enjoy it everyone!

[bear in mind, I have no formal broadcast training]

2008-12-08 08:04:32
168.   cargill06
166 Interesting, +/- had Orlando Cabrerra as a +1, 17th overall. Whereas UZR has him at +14.2, the best defensive SS in baseball last year.
2008-12-08 08:23:20
169.   delias man
Does anybody know what time Hodges gets denied again today?
2008-12-08 08:38:29
170.   Bob Timmermann
10 am PT
2008-12-08 08:41:19
171.   delias man
170 I'll be there.
2008-12-08 09:07:10
172.   cargill06
According to Ken Rosenthal, the Astros are willing to trade Miguel Tejada, and teams are interested in him as a shortstop and third baseman. Rosenthal figures the Twins, Dodgers, Giants, and Angels could be matches. He adds that the Astros realize they'd have to eat some of Tejada's $13MM for '09.

I guess the Giants are already giving up on Renteria.

2008-12-08 09:14:21
173.   wronghanded
172 Who is the Giants 3rd baseman?
2008-12-08 09:17:01
174.   cargill06
173 I would assume Pablo Sandoval.
2008-12-08 09:20:27
175.   wronghanded
I can see why they're interested in Tejada. If they make a move like that, their offense has another decent stick at least.
2008-12-08 09:21:27
176.   silverwidow
BA has a write-up on the Rangers' farm system and it shows how much they robbed Atlanta in the Tex deal. Neftali Feliz, who was essentially a throw-in at the time, is now their #1 prospect with the best fastball in the minors.
2008-12-08 09:23:27
177.   wronghanded
175 Nevermind, Tejada had terrible numbers last year.
2008-12-08 09:27:06
178.   silverwidow
There's a Barlett/EJax/Sonnanstine for Hermida rumor out there.

I guess the Rays are ready to turn over the reigns to Price and Brignac, if true.

2008-12-08 09:27:09
179.   JoeyP
Winter meetings start today & last through thursday.

Is it reasonable to expect some movement?

2008-12-08 09:29:31
180.   wronghanded
178 Wow that sounds like a lot for Hermida.
2008-12-08 09:31:08
181.   silverwidow
180 Apparently, it's EJax OR Sonnanstine.
2008-12-08 09:32:15
182.   wronghanded
181 I still don't make that move if I'm the Rays.
2008-12-08 09:32:56
183.   blue22
I think the Marlins are all set at shortstop too.
2008-12-08 09:33:44
184.   JoeyP
Yeah, I dont see the Marlins wanting a SS.

Brignac had a great 2006 year at AA.
But 2007/2008 he hasnt been good at all.

2008-12-08 09:34:17
185.   silverwidow
183 They could always move Hanley to 1B or LF.
2008-12-08 09:36:04
186.   Eric Stephen
In total, I think Qualcomm Stadium has the better combo of bowls than Dolphin Stadium:

San Diego
Poinsettia Bowl: TCU vs. Boise State
Holiday Bowl: Oregon vs. Oklahoma St

Orange Bowl: Cincinnati vs. Virginia Tech
BCS Championship: Florida vs. Oklahoma

2008-12-08 09:40:11
187.   KG16
so, bit off topic, but... starting Wednesday and running through next Tuesday, Jake's Corner a film by Jeff Santo (son of Ron) who also happens to be the boyfriend of my very good friend in Phoenix will be playing at the independent movie theater in Downtown LA. Showcase screening on Friday, filmmakers also present on Thursday (which will be the evening I'm likely going).
2008-12-08 09:42:32
188.   natepurcell
Arizona's painting Vegas Red on December 20th!
2008-12-08 09:49:50
189.   Bob Timmermann
At least Arizona football fans will blend in with all the other alcoholics in Vegas.

I can only hope that BYU handles Arizona like the other Pac-10 teams they played this year.

2008-12-08 09:58:07
190.   KG16
189 -I thought Arizona was on the Obelisk under the category "entities who shall not be named".
2008-12-08 10:03:50
191.   natepurcell

I'm ready to party with the BYU ladies. I just know they'll throw their inhibitions out the window once they are in Sin City!

2008-12-08 10:07:45
192.   Tripon
Prepare to rage:

According to Ken Rosenthal, the Dodgers and Yankees have resumed their discussions about second baseman Robinson Cano at the Meetings. The Dodgers also like Melky Cabrera, while the Yankees hope to get Matt Kemp and pitching from L.A.

2008-12-08 10:09:40
193.   Tripon
Nine-time All-Star and five-time World Series champion Joe Gordon was elected to the Baseball Hall of Fame today by the Veterans Committee.

2008-12-08 10:11:03
194.   Jacob Burch
Just let it go, Rosenthal.
2008-12-08 10:11:14
195.   kinbote
192 Oh no you di-ent.
2008-12-08 10:12:25
196.   ToyCannon
In 2007 THBT put out this:
2007 OPS+ by position
Pos Mean Median
C 86 83
1B 115 108
2B 96 100
3B 109 101
SS 94 94
RF 111 105
CF 97 88
LF 107 101
(Minimum 100 plate appearances, Player qualifies at position if 50% or more games played are at that position.

Any of you bored people want to take a swing at it for 2008?

2008-12-08 10:12:42
197.   Tripon
The Dodgers would only like Cabrera to play center fielder. The Dodgers already have a center fielder, in fact they have three players who can effectively play center field. What in the world is their obsession with center fielders?
2008-12-08 10:13:03
198.   KG16
192 - going to need more than Cano and Cabrera for Kemp and ML-ready pitching. Like a starting third baseman.
2008-12-08 10:13:39
199.   Tripon
198 Too bad the Yankees traded away Wilson Benemit. Ohohohohohohohohohoho.
2008-12-08 10:14:19
200.   Jacob Burch
Text to BH: "Smack Ken Rosenthal for me please"
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2008-12-08 10:14:45
201.   KG16
196 - I thought OPS+ was tied to position, so shouldn't the mean automatically be 100 for every position, or am I missing something?
2008-12-08 10:14:58
202.   Jon Weisman
192 - I actually do appreciate you giving Winter Meetings updates to the commenters that I'm not able/inclined (I can't decide which) to do. But maybe we should dial back the redundancy. The Kemp-Cano rumor is not news. We don't need to react every time Rosenthal flaps his gums.
2008-12-08 10:15:26
203.   Jacob Burch
201 OPS+ is tied to park factors, not position. VORP covers positional factors.
2008-12-08 10:16:25
204.   KG16
203 - ah, thanks. i knew there was a reason i liked the old standards.
2008-12-08 10:16:38
205.   Eric Stephen
OPS+ is only normalized for park and the entire league, not by position.

sOPS+ (found in the splits pages for each player) accounts for position.

2008-12-08 10:17:00
206.   Jacob Burch
203 Park and league factors, I should say.
2008-12-08 10:17:28
207.   Jon Weisman
192/202 - And I would add, any comment about a rumor that begins "Prepare to rage" makes me suspicious of its worth here. It's nothing personal, but my goal here is not to have people rage.
2008-12-08 10:17:28
208.   KG16
Kevin McHale is taking over as coach of the Timberwolves. Why do old Celtics find it necessary to become GM/VP of Basketball Operations and then go into coaching? Shouldn't it be the other way around?
2008-12-08 10:17:50
209.   Tripon
202 Point noted, but this time Rosenthal is reporting that the Dodgers and Yankees are meeting specially about Cano, not just idle speculation. I think that's a bit news worthy.
2008-12-08 10:18:33
210.   Tripon
207 On that, that is on my fault. I meant it as a joke, but I can see how that can be misconstrued. My bad.
2008-12-08 10:22:12
211.   Eric Stephen
Here are the numbers for catcher:

62 players qualified:

Mean: 82
Median: 83

2008-12-08 10:22:33
212.   Humma Kavula
198 I hear the Yankees have a fellow named Rodriguez at 3B. Perhaps he is available.
2008-12-08 10:23:02
213.   OhioBlues12
209 - I can see where there is still some speculation to this rumor. Maybe reps from the Yanks and Dodgers have talked but Rosenthal is speculating it is about Cano. This "rumor" makes so little sense from a Dodger perspective that I think it deserves very little if any credence.
2008-12-08 10:24:21
214.   cargill06
This "rumor" makes so little sense from a Dodger perspective that I think it deserves very little if any credence.

It doesn't have to make sense for Ned to do it.

2008-12-08 10:25:10
215.   oshea2002
I believe I saw Cabrera OPS'd .575 from May 6 on last year. Pierre is Rickey Henderson compared to him.
2008-12-08 10:26:23
216.   KG16
212 - I'm glad someone got the joke.
2008-12-08 10:26:51
217.   Eric Stephen
196 ,211
2008 First Basemen:

39 players:

Mean: 111
Median: 110

I love that Miguel Cairo qualified as a 1B.

2008-12-08 10:27:30
218.   silverwidow
This has Torre's influence written all over it. Ned needs to stop listening to him and start listening to Logan. NOW.
2008-12-08 10:28:55
219.   Eric Stephen
2008 Second Sackers:

44 players:

Mean: 94
Median: 94

2008-12-08 10:29:28
220.   underdog
I would trade Eric Stults and Delwyn Young for Cano. Maybe. That's about it.
2008-12-08 10:30:28
221.   OhioBlues12
214 - See, I don't buy that at all. This is not "Ned move" if there is such a thing. Trading one of his only two productive OFers on the roster plus pitching maybe for an expensive 2B and a mediocre OF seems very unlike Ned.
2008-12-08 10:32:04
222.   Humma Kavula
The thing is, I would kind of be interested in trading for Cano. Yes, I know he wasn't so good last year, and that he has a contract that is going to get expensive (and soon). That can't be ignored and I'm not ignoring it.

But Cano was good in the recent past, and we have a hole at the position. It would be foolish to hang up on the Yankees. It is definitely worth exploring to see if Cano is available for the right price.

I don't have to say that I think the Kemp-for-Cano flier can be filed under I for INSANE.

2008-12-08 10:32:22
223.   underdog
This isn't important literally (though it made me chuckle) but an example of how MLBTR bloggers can misconstrue or get lazy in a posting:

>>Jerry Crasnick says Kevin Towers and Peavy's agent Barry Axelrod shared a cab for the 4.5 hour ride from San Diego to Las Vegas, but Axelrod says they only talked about Peavy for about three minutes.<<

No, if you read Crasnick's story, they did drive together, but they were not taking what would amount to a very expensive cab ride, especially for a cash-strapped team like the Padres to cover.

2008-12-08 10:34:31
224.   oshea2002
223 - Has John Moores not heard of the San Diego Airport?
2008-12-08 10:34:46
225.   Tripon
223 Kevin Towers and Barry Axelrod go to White Castle?
2008-12-08 10:35:48
226.   Tripon
224 I think Towers and Axelrod are friends, besides with the price of gas under two dollars, it's a lot cheaper than a plane ticket to Vegas.
2008-12-08 10:35:49
227.   Jon Weisman
218/221 - It seems pretty clear that Torre and Colletti both like Kemp. What's the evidence that they don't?
2008-12-08 10:36:43
228.   bigcpa
Robinson Cano press release worksheet. Check box to auto-insert.

## LAS VEGAS ## The Dodgers today solidified their 2009 infield by acquiring Robinson Cano from the New Yankees. Cano is a _________ and a _________ who has __________. Ned Colletti adds "Cano will add a lot of _________ and brings _________ to the table.

- Career .300 hitter
- All Star
- Experience playing in big market
- Experience playing in postseason
- "Comfortable" playing with Joe Torre

2008-12-08 10:38:23
229.   Eric Stephen
2008 3B:

42 players:

Mean: 98
Median: 98

Old Friend Andy was dead last

2008-12-08 10:38:23
230.   Bob Timmermann
Online work is now eligible for Pulitzers.
2008-12-08 10:38:56
231.   OhioBlues12
227 - Agree completely Jon. All arrows point to Torre and Colletti really liking Kemp which is another on the list of 100 reasons why this rumor is ridiculous.
2008-12-08 10:40:20
232.   Daniel Zappala
191 It's not an inhibition per se, more a way of life. I'm fully prepared for BYU to triumph over Arizona in the Purcell-Zappala Bowl.
2008-12-08 10:41:46
233.   Jacob Burch
230 As I've hinted at throughout my comments, my academic field of interest is e-literature and e-textual studies, so this is huge huge news for me. Awesome to hear.
2008-12-08 10:42:05
234.   D4P
I'm fully prepared for BYU to triumph over Arizona in the Purcell-Zappala Bowl

If the Dodgers have traded Pierre by then, might it be the Purcell-Zappala-Steve Bowl...?

2008-12-08 10:42:20
235.   Humma Kavula
228 I understand your point, but as a guy who writes press releases for a living, I can tell you that it's not easy to write quotes for people. Usually, there's nothing at all new to say, so quotes end up being interchangable -- no matter who's getting promoted, or fired, or a deal, you can say the same thing about all of them. It's one of the frustrating/challenging parts of the job -- how do you make an interesting quote out of ordinary news?

So I'm not sure you really mean to criticize the press release that makes those announcements. I think you mean to criticize Ned for making moves to obtain a certain kind of player, and that's completely valid, IMHO.

2008-12-08 10:42:27
236.   Tripon
233 But is it e-huge news?
2008-12-08 10:42:43
237.   Eric Stephen
2008 Shortstops:

50 players

Mean: 81
Median: 84

2008-12-08 10:42:45
238.   D4P
You must be e-lated.
2008-12-08 10:43:37
239.   Jon Weisman
2008-12-08 10:44:36
240.   oshea2002
What's the line on the U of A v. BYU game? Seems like a tossup to me.
2008-12-08 10:45:52
241.   Ken Noe
Rosenthal reports that the Dodgers are interested in Melky and Cano, but he only guesses about Kemp. There's a difference.
2008-12-08 10:46:35
242.   CajunDodger
I see things the same way. The Yankees are doing what they can to extract a young outfielder with upside for Cano. Ned will say no to that, but may be amenable to young (Scott Elbert) pitching to make the deal.

Kemp is not going anywhere unless we get a king's ransom in return. The outfielder most likely to leave if we sign Manny is Ethier IMO.

2008-12-08 10:47:02
243.   bigcpa
233 You write press releases for a lousy company that puts out second rate product!

My point was that Cano embodies several things that sound good in a press release but have little to do with winning games. The guy walks 4% of the time, plays below avg. defense and is guaranteed $27M over the next 3 years. No thanks.

2008-12-08 10:54:10
244.   GobiasIndustries
Before the winter meetings are over, I fully expect to see a Dan Uggla to the Dodgers rumor. This is pure speculation on my part, but the Marlins have recently shed the contracts of 4 arbitration eligible players in Kevin Gregg, Josh Willingham, Mike Jacobs, and Scott Olsen. Uggla is due to get the biggest raise out of all their remaining arb-eligible players, the Dodgers need a second baseman and in all likelihood have the players/prospects to make a deal happen.
Now the Marlins (according to what I've read) are not actively shopping Uggla but it stands to reason that if they are still so cost conscious enough to trade away 4 players all due for a raise, they would at least listen to offers for Uggla. What do you guys think? Could this happen and if so, do you think the Dodgers acquiring Uggla for a modest package of players would be a good thing or bad thing? Who do you think it would take to get him?

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