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About Jon
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1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
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11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Hot 'n' Old Corner
2008-12-11 08:23
by Jon Weisman

Not aiming for anything profound here, but in the wake of Casey Blake's three-season pickup by the Dodger TV network, I thought I'd scope out what were the most productive seasons by an age 35-or-over third baseman in Dodger history.

OPS+ (minimum 200 plate appearances)

127 Tim Wallach (36), 1994 – 466 PA
121 Jim Gilliam (36), 1965 – 432 PA
113 Billy Herman (36), 1946 – 211 PA
110 Bill Madlock (35), 1986 – 421 PA
107 Jackie Robinson (37), 1956 – 431 PA
106 Tim Wallach (37), 1995 – 362 PA
96 Enos Cabell (35) 1985 – 208 PA
96 Jackie Robinson (36), 1955 – 390 PA
93 Doc Casey (36), 1906 – 648 PA
91 Frenchy Bordagaray (35), 1945 – 305 PA

(Blake had a 110 OPS+ last season.)

Runs Created

72 Tim Wallach (36), 1994
60 Jackie Robinson (37), 1956
58 Jim Gilliam (36), 1965
55 Jimmy Johnston (35), 1925
52 Bill Madlock (35), 1986
49 Jackie Robinson (36), 1955
49 Doc Casey (36), 1906
44 Tim Wallach (37), 1995
44 Tim Wallach (35), 1993
41 Doc Casey (37), 1907

Here's how Blake and some of these players did in their age-34 seasons (Blake turned 35 in August):
Robinson: 104 RC, 139 OPS+, .312 EQA
Gilliam: 76 RC, 120 OPS+, .302 EQA
Madlock: 72 RC, 110 OPS+, .263 EQA (Pit), .339 EQA (L.A.)
Blake: 86 RC, 110 OPS+, .297 EQA (Cle), .269 EQA (L.A.)
Cabell: 56 RC, 120 OPS+, .279 EQA
Bordagaray: 64 RC, 103 OPS+, .261 EQA
Johnston: 40 RC, 96 OPS+, .250 EQA
Casey: 52 RC, 93 OPS+, .243 EQA
Wallach: 54 RC, 79 OPS+, .237 EQA

Comments (167)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-12-11 11:48:25
1.   ToyCannon
Garate has now struck out 9 of the last 10 hitters he's faced in the VWL. Not bad for a rule 5 minor league pick.
2008-12-11 11:48:48
2.   bhsportsguy
And yet, had the Dodgers won Game 4 of the NLCS, Casey Blake would have been a hero.
2008-12-11 11:50:33
3.   bhsportsguy
BTW, that list is for Dodger 3B not all 3B in baseball history.

At first I thought, wow, didn't all those guys play with the Dodgers at one time.

2008-12-11 11:51:25
4.   Harold M Johnson
3 lol i had the same reaction.
2008-12-11 11:51:56
5.   ToyCannon
91 Frenchy Bordagary (35), 1945 – 305 PA
2008-12-11 11:52:17
6.   Marty
I can't believe Enos Cabell makes that list.
2008-12-11 11:53:07
7.   bhsportsguy
4 Ron Cey had a 118 OPS+ at when he was 35 and playing for the Cubs.
2008-12-11 11:54:16
8.   ToyCannon
Chipper Jones had a heck of a year last year. All Time 3rd base leaders 35 and over.
2008-12-11 11:55:58
9.   Bob Timmermann
Among all third basemen, the most productive season belongs to one Chipper Jones, who had an OPS+ of 174 last year at age 36.

The previous best was 166, by Chipper Jones at age 35.

2008-12-11 11:56:15
10.   Bob Timmermann
That's what happens when you get old.
2008-12-11 11:57:28
11.   ToyCannon
Yup, two days ago you would have beat me to it. 43 will do that to you.
2008-12-11 11:57:44
12.   cargill06
2 What about game 2 when he was about 15 feet short of the deepest part of the park of a game tying 3 run HR in the 8th.
2008-12-11 11:58:51
13.   Jon Weisman
3 - Yeah, I meant that.
2008-12-11 12:05:15
14.   Daniel Zappala
bhsportsguy, per the previous thread -- I of course do not condoning betting on anything, much less on the one true football team. But I'm happy to have you rooting on our side. :-)
2008-12-11 12:06:09
15.   Daniel Zappala
If I think of Casey Blake as Bill Madlock, I feel much better.
2008-12-11 12:08:57
16.   Bob Timmermann
I will root for Pac-10 teams in the bowl games only if they are situated at a more northerly latitude than where I am presently seated.
2008-12-11 12:16:24
17.   Eric Stephen
When Chipper Jones moved to LF in 2002, I thought he torpedoed his HOF chances. He had a chance to go down in history as one of the all-time great 3B.

Through 2001, Chipper had a 141 OPS+ for his career, with 227 HR. I figured he would pretty rapidly.


From 2002 to present, Chipper has a 150 OPS+ (5th best in MLB during that span). He even moved back to 3B in 2004, although with his hitting that doesn't really matter. He's a no-doubt HOF. Now I just have to convince my uncles and brothers ("Chipper was never really feared.") of this fact.

2008-12-11 12:17:20
18.   Eric Stephen
I figured he would decline pretty rapidly.
2008-12-11 12:23:08
19.   old dodger fan
Jim Gilliam in 1965. What great memories.
2008-12-11 12:29:45
20.   bferb
So we're hoping for Blake to be Wallach reincarnate?
2008-12-11 12:36:00
21.   underdog
What, no Dick Schofield on this list? I'm shocked, shocked!
2008-12-11 12:37:57
22.   mwhite06
16 So Oregon is out?
2008-12-11 12:41:59
23.   Bob Timmermann
It's the location of the school, not the bowl game.
2008-12-11 12:47:17
24.   Tripon
Anyway, it was an uneventful major league portion, but the Dodgers later did lose shortstop Francisco Lizarraga to Cincinnati, outfielder Andrew Locke to the Astros (team that nabbed Wesley Wright last year) and infielder Shane Justis to the Brewers. The Dodgers selected

2008-12-11 12:49:24
25.   bhsportsguy
23 Or else Bob would have to root for the other team on January 1st.

It appears that the Padres are not backing away from their projected 2009 payroll of $40M. They have 4 players with guaranteed salaries totaling $27.5 M (Peavy, Giles, Gonzalez, and Tall Chris Young).

That leaves $12.5 M for 21 players or slightly less than $600K per player which is above the minimun salary but really outside of rookies and 2nd year players, every other player will probably make at least $1M a year.

2008-12-11 12:54:13
26.   Eric Stephen
Speaking of salaries, I saw in the LA Times today on the front page of the sport section a little table with the most lucrative contracts in MLB history. The part that caught my eye was at the bottom of the table:

Source: Cot's

Nice to see Cot's Baseball Contracts go mainstream!

2008-12-11 12:56:29
27.   bhsportsguy
26 Do the local talk shows want the Padres to keep Peavy and trade Towers?
2008-12-11 13:05:56
28.   LogikReader
One item to consider is that Casey Blake played 60% of his season in Cleveland. The 110 OPS+ for '08 is a little skewed as a result. Granted, the whole point of OPS+ is to neutralize park factor, but I wonder how he'd have fared with a whole season as a Dodger.

Lots of factors involved: opposing pitchers in the Division, protection in the Lineup, whether Manny was on the team, etc.

2008-12-11 13:06:36
29.   cargill06
Tim Brown and Gordon Edes say the Cubs "remain optimistic that they can acquire Peavy, all but ignored Towers' self-imposed deadline." Meanwhile, Gerry Fraley says the Angels have already put together a package for the Padres to consider.

It will never ever die. Even if Peavy get's traded to the Cubs there will still be trade rumors about Peavy to the Cubs.

2008-12-11 13:07:39
30.   oshea2002
28 - surely you're not insinuating Manny's presence in the lineup affects others?
2008-12-11 13:09:20
31.   Eric Stephen
Nobody wants to trade Peavy. Most talk show hosts and callers have the typical "who is Yunel Escobar?" talk (last month when the Braves were actively in pursuit) or beating the "if we trade Jake, we have to get guys who can contribute immediately in 2009" drum.

Towers is not receiving as much flak. Most people recognize the Moores' divorce and its devastating impact on the club. Also, many feel Towers' hands are tied somewhat by Sandy Alderson.

I'll say this for Alderson: he's pretty proactive about getting the club point of view out. He has a weekly radio appearance and often does interviews outside of that. However, he tends to talk in a very monotone voice and can seem quite boring to many.

2008-12-11 13:19:41
32.   underdog
(via mlbtr:)

>>Yesterday we heard from Ed Price that the Dodgers were internally considering guaranteeing a third year for Manny Ramirez. Ned Colletti's comments today are along the same lines:

"Scott outlined what they will need and we're not interested in doing five years or four years, a long-term deal. We want the player back and we're willing to pay a very high salary to bring him back -- but short-term."<<

(Not sure where their source for that quote is...)

2008-12-11 13:28:04
33.   Jacob Burch
32 It's from Dylan Hernandez.

2008-12-11 13:28:19
34.   oshea2002
Dannie Evans has hired Bret Saberhagen to join his firm as another agent.
2008-12-11 13:28:39
35.   Ken Noe
32 Wasn't "the player" Terrell Owens?
2008-12-11 13:29:44
36.   fanerman
Thanks for all the help with the eye strain. Are these special artificial tears eye drops available at drug stores or grocery stores?

I really feel like this is a localized thing that may be due to the dry air in the office. I do not have these symptoms anywhere else.

2008-12-11 13:30:44
37.   old dodger fan
32 The fact that we're willing to pay a very high salary to bring him back is encouraging on the economic front.
2008-12-11 13:30:48
38.   silverwidow
Saito, Berroa, and Brazoban sound like definite cuts tomorrow.

Repko is pretty useless with Jamie Hoffmann the new AAA defensive guy. That leaves Proctor, who's been effectively replaced by younger, better options.

2008-12-11 13:32:57
39.   oshea2002
If the Dodgers are truly willing to guarantee 3 years for Manny, I think they could do some vesting option for a fourth. At that point, I see him coming back unless Washington offers something insane. I can't imagine anyone else trumping our 3 year offer.
2008-12-11 13:33:17
40.   Jacob Burch
38 I don't think PVL loving Torre (and I have to think he has a say) would allow cuts to both Saito and EDSP
2008-12-11 13:36:03
41.   underdog
36 - yes, available at both.

35 - I thought it was Tim Robbins.

38 - I agree. Though I could see Proctor brought back. When he's healthy (and not abused by you know who) he can be effective. They will already have a lot of young 'uns in the pen.

2008-12-11 13:37:09
42.   Eric Enders
Maybe Ned meant "we want The Player back."
2008-12-11 13:37:52
43.   old dodger fan
38 Berroa-Didn't we already decline his option? Doesn't that make him a FA?
2008-12-11 13:39:35
44.   Ken Noe
41 42 Or he's pretending his Bill Parcells. Thing is, Tuna clearly didn't want TO.
2008-12-11 13:40:15
45.   silverwidow
43 He has less than 6 years of major league service, so not FA eligible. We can offer him arb tomorrow or cut him loose.
2008-12-11 13:41:54
46.   Jacob Burch
45 With cutting him and then looking to re-sign him (especially if we bring Manny back) the most likely scenario--doubt anyone will be looking to pay him much more than we'd offer, which should still be pretty low.

Really glad they got rid of that dumb can't-resign non-tenders rule.

2008-12-11 13:46:30
47.   cargill06
A buddy of mine just asked if I was Ned would I do a Martin for Choo and Victor Martinez trade. I'd do that in a heartbeat, thoughts?
2008-12-11 13:54:22
48.   bferb
47 The problem with that is Victor is a FA after this season, so if we couldnt resign him, we'd be really screwed at Catcher with no depth in our system.

32 Should we offer Manny 3 years $70 Million?

2008-12-11 13:54:27
49.   MC Safety
47 No way.
2008-12-11 13:56:07
50.   silverwidow
48 3/$75M is fair.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-12-11 13:56:54
51.   cargill06
48 I answered unaware of the contract situation.
2008-12-11 14:03:59
52.   Bumsrap
I wouldn't give Manny a dime until Boras moves Jones and all of his salary to another team. The Yankees want a new center fielder and are trying to trade Milky for Cameron.
2008-12-11 14:07:00
53.   Jacob Burch
Chase Utley: Better baseball player than Ryan Howard, or Much Better Baseball Player than Ryan Howard? I'm having this debate in my head now, and it comes down to whether or not Ryan Howard has been "figured out" in terms to his on-base skills.
2008-12-11 14:08:18
54.   regfairfield
53 Utley is one of the five best players in baseball, Howard probably isn't one of the five best first basemen.
2008-12-11 14:10:18
55.   regfairfield
52 How exactly should Boras do that? It's pretty hard to convince someone to pay 22 million for a guy that had arguably the worst season of all time.

Insert snark here.

2008-12-11 14:11:44
56.   Jacob Burch
55 Has there ever been an article on that? The Worst Season of All Time, with a minimum PA number set? Would be a pretty interesting read in futility, and the situation that let the season(s) happen.
2008-12-11 14:12:50
57.   bferb
Amusing Hot Stove Glossary from MLBTR:

official - Doesn't get misused - a deal is only official if a team announces it.
done deal - Should be reserved for deals that are truly complete, yet someone jumps the gun with it weekly. See also: finalized
set to sign/acquire - One step below the done deal. Doesn't leave much wiggle room. See also: on the verge, on the brink, tentative agreement
close to a deal - This trade or signing is likely, but I'm leaving some wiggle room. See also: nearing a deal, closing in on
working to sign/acquire - Things are coming along positively, but I'm not ready to call it close. See also: escalated, making progress, heating up, stepped up efforts
in discussions - They're talking, but I'm not making any promises.
life support - Faint chance of this deal occurring - I'm not ready to call it dead.
dead - Should be reserved for talks with 0% chance of being revisited, yet we frequently see dead talks "resurrected."
inquired - One party called another to ask about something or express interest. The party receiving the inquiry may have zero interest.
internal discussions - Rarely misused. Front office guys from one team are talking amongst themselves about something.
shopping - Implies a GM is aggressively calling other teams to try to find a trade partner for a player. GMs seem to dread the word because it makes them lose leverage. Also applies to an agent trying to find a team to sign his free agent.
believed to be - Meaningless phrase, yet a popular way to hedge. Can be combined with phrases above for a double hedge. See also: appear to be, seem to be, apparently

I think Rosenthal is the #1 user of "believed to be"

2008-12-11 14:13:10
58.   Humma Kavula
52 I have to agree with 55 . If you try to make Jones Boras's problem, then you will be left with one Jones and zero Mannies.

I'm all for telling Boras where to stick it, but that comes with a price: you don't get to sign his clients, some of whom are very good players. If you can live without Manny, go right ahead and anger his agent.

2008-12-11 14:15:06
59.   Bumsrap
55 - I wasn't trying to say it was possible as much as I was trying to set into the ether something Ned have settle into his brain and then repeat to Boras.

If I buy a lemon from someone that oversold the lemon, glossy pictures and all, I would want to tell that person to take back his lemon before I bought from him again.

Manny would be the victim of having Boras as an agent as well as being a mental risk.

2008-12-11 14:15:14
60.   regfairfield
56 I think it was an off hand comment from Law or Neyer, something like no one has ever gone a whole season hitting below .200 without hitting for power.
2008-12-11 14:15:30
61.   trainwreck
This is the poster for the horror movie, The Unborn:

I do not think scary is what they were going for.

2008-12-11 14:16:21
62.   Humma Kavula
56 It would also have to take position and defense into account. Jason Kendall in 2007 had an OPS+ of 63 in 466 (!) AB between Oakland and Chicago. Compare to Jones' 2008 OPS+ of 52 in 209 AB.

But Kendall is a catcher. How much does that matter? I don't know.

2008-12-11 14:16:21
63.   oshea2002
58 - agree. There's no market for Jones, and it's Ned's fault for signing him, not Boras' for being his agent.
2008-12-11 14:18:05
64.   Bumsrap
I suppose if I wanted Manny on the Dodgers I wouldn't be so arrogant with Boras.
2008-12-11 14:20:54
65.   ToyCannon
No, Victor won't even be catching by 2010 and he lost his power last year just like Martin.
2008-12-11 14:21:26
66.   kinbote
Memo to Ned Colletti:

Please don't re-sign Angel Berroa.

Thank you,

C.X. Kinbote

2008-12-11 14:22:02
67.   Humma Kavula
56 I believe Hardball Times did it by Lineup position (worst seasons as leadoff hitter of all time, worst seasons at #2, etc).

I don't know if it was culled to worst-of-the-worst, though.

I do know that Juan Pierre didn't make the list.

2008-12-11 14:22:45
68.   Linkmeister
Tim Wallach played for the Dodgers? Man, what was I paying attention to in the early 90s?
2008-12-11 14:24:01
69.   trainwreck
Tim Wallach wore glasses right? I think that would be the reason I remember him.
2008-12-11 14:24:30
70.   DBrim
Ned is clearly not a geologist.

This is like watching the San Andreas Fault. Some days you can see it move probably, and other days it's going to sit there. And in a week or two it may move a lot. It's a slow process. It speeds up and it slows back down.

2008-12-11 14:24:43
71.   Bumsrap
How about the category of worst per million dollars? $10MM?, $20MM?
2008-12-11 14:26:03
72.   Eric Stephen
Andruw's OPS+ was even lower, at 34!

He had the 5th lowest OPS+ for an OF with 200 PA since 1901:

2008-12-11 14:26:43
73.   blue22
70 - Uh, if you can see the San Andreas fault move, run.
2008-12-11 14:27:37
74.   Jacob Burch
72 The best thing about these PI lists is finding the best name among the bunch.

Moose! I want to name my kid Moose.

2008-12-11 14:28:14
75.   Marty
70 That is one of the goofiest quotes I've ever read. Did Ned actually say that?
2008-12-11 14:28:22
76.   Humma Kavula
72 Oops. I was looking at his Total Bases.

Man, he was bad.

2008-12-11 14:29:05
77.   Jacob Burch
75 Dylan says he did.
2008-12-11 14:30:15
78.   Bumsrap
Andruw therefore had an OPS+/$$ of .0000018
2008-12-11 14:31:23
79.   delias man
If Druw could match McGwire's 1991 or 2001 next year, would that be a success? About .200BA with near 30 HR?
2008-12-11 14:32:29
80.   Humma Kavula
Here is THT's link to worst leadoff hitters of all time...

And if somebody was bad, they probably got stuck at the bottom of the lineup...

So which would you rather not have:

Andruw Jones, sucking in CF for 209 AB, to the tune of a 34 OPS+...

...or good ol' Mario Mendoza 1979, who got 409 AB to hit for a 25 OPS+... but at shortstop?

2008-12-11 14:33:21
81.   Eric Stephen
I like the ability to name the lists I create. When I click on the Play Index, I have all these saved searches with really corny names. My favorite one ever was for a list of worst Padres' OPS+ seasons; I called it "Deadbat Dads."
2008-12-11 14:34:44
82.   Eric Stephen
I'd settle for any Rob Deer season 1989-1991.
2008-12-11 14:35:03
83.   Humma Kavula
Continuing and quoting from 80

"The OPS+ figure of 25 Mendoza posted in 1979 wasn't just the lowest of any regular No. 9 hitter since 1957, it was the lowest presented by any regular at any batting order position since 1957, lower even than the mark presented by Luis Gomez as a regular No. 8 hitter in 1980."

2008-12-11 14:40:03
84.   delias man
82 About the same. Where was Deer for 3 years before the Padres picked him up in 96?
2008-12-11 14:44:13
85.   Jacob Burch
84 He had a couple minor league deals in 95. No idea about 1994.
2008-12-11 14:44:34
86.   Jacob Burch
85 Japan is the answer!
2008-12-11 14:49:17
87.   Eric Stephen
Deer went to high school with my sister-in-law. That is all.
2008-12-11 14:50:59
88.   trainwreck
Your family sure knows a lot of people.
2008-12-11 14:50:59
89.   kinbote
87 I believe they call that coming full circle.
2008-12-11 14:51:09
90.   Jacob Burch
87 That's a pretty funny out of context sentence.
2008-12-11 14:54:08
91.   ToyCannon
Hard to believe a year ago at this time I wanted Andruw Jones to be our CF in 2008. Even worse is the fact I want him to be our CF in 2009 if we don't sign Manny.
2008-12-11 14:55:51
92.   Jacob Burch
91 (Random Burell-Esque-FA)-Kemp-Ethier not worth the extra cash? Or you just don't think it would happen (which is my case).
2008-12-11 14:57:41
93.   DBrim
75 - Here's the source.

2008-12-11 15:04:37
94.   Harold M Johnson
91 Given the law of Karma, Andruw should bounce back this year to the tune of 250/320/450 and then sign a 2 year, 15m contract with the Indians.
2008-12-11 15:07:57
95.   scareduck
94 - how about a .095/.102/.200 season and a set of complimentary steak knives?
2008-12-11 15:09:12
96.   trainwreck
It is sad and scary that I rather have Pierre start, because I trust him more.
2008-12-11 15:13:00
97.   Humma Kavula
96 You should trust Pierre more -- to the extent that Pierre will almost certainly put up the same rate stats that he's put up for the last several years.

That's not the question. The question is -- if the Dodgers don't sign Manny, what are the likelihood that Jones will put up, say, a 90 OPS+ or better?

2008-12-11 15:13:56
98.   trainwreck
The way they have been talking the last couple of days on ESPN, it seems like Teixeira may come down to Red Sox vs Nationals.
2008-12-11 15:14:40
99.   trainwreck
I think Jones's bat speed has slowed too much to compensate for his bad approach at the plate.
2008-12-11 15:15:14
100.   bhsportsguy
How's this for headline?

Royals agree to terms with Ramirez

Then you find out that the Royals signed a left-handed pitcher named Horacio Ramirez to a one-year, $1.8 million deal plus incentives. He could earn an additional $1.1 million as a starter and $500,000 as a reliever.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-12-11 15:15:23
101.   ToyCannon
Neither, I just like Jones. I have faults I can't explain.
2008-12-11 15:15:42
102.   Humma Kavula
99 Fair enough.
2008-12-11 15:17:07
103.   bhsportsguy
77 It's also posted on
2008-12-11 15:17:15
104.   ToyCannon
If I was him I'd take the Orioles over the Nationals. A future core of Wieters/Markakis/Teixeira/Jones could be awesome.
2008-12-11 15:18:21
105.   bhsportsguy
104 At least his games against the Red Sox, Yankees and now the Rays could show up on national television now and then.
2008-12-11 15:22:04
106.   bhsportsguy
What will Vic the Brick do now?

On the otherhand, perhaps now KLAC can devote all the extra time to UCLA coverage.

Just announced by Mason and Ireland, KSPN 710 has just acquired the rights to the Lakers starting in 2009.

The Clippers are ending their deal with the station at the end of this year.

2008-12-11 15:22:56
107.   blue22
Hey, who wants to help me with my fantasy football roster this weekend? Wow, really, that many of you? I'm touched.

I need two WR's from this group: Ginn Jr, Domenick Hixon, or Braylon Edwards

and a QB: Big Ben, Garcia, or Shaun Hill.

2008-12-11 15:27:25
108.   mwhite06
107 I like Ginn Jr. and Hixon. 2 defensive backs are out for Dallas and the Giants will look to through the ball early and often. Plus, even though Hixon dropped that ball last week, he had beat the DB by a solid 5 steps, Hixon is a good WR. Ginn Jr. I take by default over Edwards. Ginn always get into the game which will include some reverse that he can take 50+ yards to the house. Edwards has Ken Dorsey throwing the ball to him, and he drops way too many passes to begin with.
2008-12-11 15:28:39
109.   underdog
I would go to the Orioles, too, if I was Tex -- and his hometown team, with much more upside in immediate future. Otherwise I'd be happy if he goes to his other hometown team, the Nats, as at least it for once would not be yet another case of the rich getting richer in baseball. Just like I'll root for Raffy to go to the Royals if the Dodgers don't bring him back. As an underdog team, or to punish him, not sure which.
2008-12-11 15:29:27
110.   madmac
101 He can only get better, right? Seriously, my impression is he now realizes he can't just fake it. He seems to be really serious about getting his body and mind right. I think the ability is still there, he just has to work at it now and I think he gets that.

I think I am more afraid of giving him away and seeing him be comeback POY for someone else than I am of paying for the same 2008 Druw.

2008-12-11 15:29:28
111.   oshea2002
106 - wow, that's pretty big news. I'd imagine he'll just kiss up to Neuheisal 24/7.

People like to bash Rome, but I can't think of a show that's gone downhill more then the Cannons. I really like that show when Chet was on it, and even Werndel.

2008-12-11 15:29:37
112.   cargill06
107 Those are your options and you made it to the semi's??? Was it a 4 team league?
2008-12-11 15:29:55
113.   bferb
107 I'd go with Hixon, Ginn Jr. and Shaun Hill. Watch Hixon's status thouhg as I think he has a minor foot injury
2008-12-11 15:32:12
114.   mwhite06
107 For your QB either Shaun Hill or Garcia. Those 2 are really a coin flip. Hill is better, but the Miami defense is underrated. Garcia is playing in a dome. Ben is the weak link of those 3 this week.
2008-12-11 15:33:58
115.   Eric Stephen
I miss the Chet Forte days, back when Steve Hartman didn't make my ears bleed.
2008-12-11 15:34:35
116.   blue22
112 - Thanks go to LenDale (my keeper) and Chris Johnson (drafted as his handcuff), mostly. It's actually week 1 of the playoffs, and I'm a 4-seed.

113 - That's my gut instinct right there, though Ginn over Braylon is giving me an ulcer. The week I sit Braylon is the week he snaps out of it.

Thanks all. I'm pretty much on the same wavelength as you guys.

2008-12-11 15:39:37
117.   oshea2002
116 - I'm in the semi's too, and my 3 WR's have all flamed out (TJ, Burress, and Braylon). I now go with Michael Jenkins, Kevin Walter, and either TJ or Desean Jackson. I was ok at RB with LT and Hillis until Hillis went down, not I'm back to Lendale.
2008-12-11 15:40:02
118.   LogikReader


KLAC is the Lakers! They can't move them now! They've been on KLAC for over 30 years. They've been on KCAL for over 30 years. They've been on FSWest/FSN/PT for nearly 25 years.

Man, my world is rocked!

2008-12-11 15:41:54
119.   underdog
113 - Hm,maybe I should start Amani Toomer after all. He was gonna sit on my bench unless someone (Anquan B, Lee Evans or Vincent Jax got injured) -- but then again all three of those guys are better than Toomer.
2008-12-11 15:43:35
120.   underdog
117 - Broncos RBs this year are like butterflies. They may give you something lovely for a very short period of time, but have a short life expectancy. Enjoy 'em while they last. (Or they're like Spinal Tap drummers.)
2008-12-11 15:45:09
121.   blue22
117 - I still have Santana Moss who is my only reliable WR. I had Braylon as a keeper and traded for Plaxico mid-year (for Forte, nice). Now I'm stuck starting Ginn and Hixon (and S Moss) in the playoffs. Gulp.
2008-12-11 15:45:24
122.   Lexinthedena

I would start Jeff Garcia, he has clicked wth the uber-talented Antonio Bryant, this should equate to 250 yds @ TD's...

Shaun Hill is an interesting pick, but Miami's D occasionally shows up big.

2008-12-11 15:48:14
123.   oshea2002
121 - anything can happen. I'm really left right now with Brees and LT, but random guys have huge games. Hillis has a bunch of big weeks for me, and Kevin Walter is pretty $. The problem with Ginn and Hixon is they seem like all or nothing guys. That's how Desean Jackson is for me, if I think I need a big game and I'm an underdog, I throw him in.
2008-12-11 15:48:20
124.   blue22
122 - Garcia is a bit dinged up right now. Hill/Garcia will be a gameday decision for me it seems.
2008-12-11 15:48:42
125.   Lexinthedena
122 2 TD's....not @ TD's...
2008-12-11 15:49:40
126.   bhsportsguy
From Las Vegas to Indianapolis, Indiana. Next year, baseball comes to Indiana for the winter meetings. With average temps in 30s, it should be a crowded lobby in that hotel.
2008-12-11 15:52:25
127.   MC Safety
Eli Manning vs. Matt Cassell is killing me.
2008-12-11 15:52:54
128.   bferb
Anyone in the playoffs where Dominic Rhodes or Pierre Thomas is free, I would suggest picking either of them and starting them. I know they are free in a lot of shallow leagues
2008-12-11 15:53:32
129.   Eric Stephen
I call the spare bedroom at Indiana Jon's house!
2008-12-11 15:54:58
130.   blue22
127 - Cassel is going against the Raiders, usually not a recipe for success for QB's this year (except this past weekend).

Eli is @DAL, which could be a shootout. Just make sure he targets Hixon a lot, could you?

2008-12-11 15:55:56
131.   MC Safety
129 You mean you call the futon in the basement?
2008-12-11 15:56:09
132.   bferb
127 There is a chance Cassell could be out this week due to the death of his father. Not sure, but I would monitor before you set him as your starter
2008-12-11 15:56:16
133.   Jacob Burch
129 That's pretty interesting--I wonder if I could swing a Colts game, a Pacers game, a family meetup AND winter meetings all in one swoop. Could be a bizarre and fun weekend.

I've yet to add anyone officially to my Timmermann brand obelisk--but Kurt Warner could be the first if he wins the MVP. I have to hope Minnesota embarrasses him.

2008-12-11 15:59:53
134.   oshea2002
Ok, I've got a Fantasy Question - pick 3

TJ, Kevin Walter, Desean Jackson, Braylon, Michael Jenkins.

Thanks for the tip on Rhodes, I've got him but didn't know Addai was hurt (darn law school finals taking over my life).

2008-12-11 16:00:22
135.   MC Safety
130 132 I'm thinking he may try and pull a Brett Favre for his Pops.
2008-12-11 16:01:15
136.   Lexinthedena
I have great matchups.

I survived the loss of Tom Brady and now have Tyler Thigpen v. SD, along with Dwayne Bowe at WR.

Michael Turner and Stven Jackson, Wes Welker and Antonio Bruant.

Jason Witten at TE:)

I play in a keeper league which is how I scored on Welker and Turner.

2008-12-11 16:01:35
137.   MC Safety
131 Mom's basement.
2008-12-11 16:02:02
138.   bhsportsguy
133 The Winter Meetings take place Monday - Thursday.
2008-12-11 16:02:56
139.   oshea2002
Dodgers may pursue Hells Bells, per Stark.
2008-12-11 16:03:53
140.   Jacob Burch
138 That should have said week, not weekend.
2008-12-11 16:05:13
141.   bhsportsguy
140 In 2010, they move to Orlando, Fla.
2008-12-11 16:16:40
142.   Humma Kavula
Completely OT:

Does anybody know any way to get around MLB's blackout policy on the internet?

I want to get rid of my TV, but I'd miss baseball. If I had my out-of-state mom with her out-of-state credit card sign up, would I get the Dodgers on my machine in L.A.?

2008-12-11 16:19:24
143.   underdog
Memo to Jayson Stark: Call us back when it's more than "may have interest" on that Hoffman rumor.
2008-12-11 16:20:22
144.   Eric Stephen
D4P once posted a link on here to a website that shows many a sporting event, rules be damned.
2008-12-11 16:20:57
145.   fanerman
142 I asked this question on the Griddle once and they said MLB looks at your IP. So, your CC idea probably wouldn't work =(.
2008-12-11 16:21:51
146.   Jacob Burch
142 The out of state card should also do the trick. The sites D4P mention(s) are often unreliable, but I'm on an OSX, which doesn't have all the TV sharing options available.
2008-12-11 16:24:48
147.   Jacob Burch
145 They certainly could have changed it, but I remember getting Dodger game access on a friend's account once, who was registered in NorCal.
2008-12-11 16:25:03
148.   Jacob Burch
147 *This was two years ago.
2008-12-11 16:31:39
149.   Andrew Shimmin
If you use the out-of-state CC coupled with a proxy server, you should be okay. Until they suspend your account for juking the rules.
2008-12-11 16:36:13
150.   bhsportsguy
I think Shaq is the worst pick and roll defender in the history of the NBA.
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-12-11 16:37:32
151.   PDH5204
fanerman: Sorry I'm late, but there's this:

Careful with the drops though, as I assume that eye drops are much like nasal spray in that one risks becoming dependent on them with too much use. So check that out if you decide to use drops. I would suggest shortening the time between lookaways, i.e., instead of every 30 minutes, make it every 15 minutes that you spend about a minute and a half or so looking around the room and focusing on objects at varying distances, cut down the glare, and consciously open and close your eyes a few times at periodic intervals. If that don't work, be sure to see a doctor.

2008-12-11 16:37:53
152.   silverwidow
Fantasy Football Thoughts!

Well, my team finished 11-2 and now, the biggest game of the year, my top two RBs (Gore and Jacobs) are injured. I'm forced to play 4 WRs for the first time ever.

QB-Jay Cutler
RB-Chris Johnson
WR-Roddy White
WR-Randy Moss
WR-Vincent Jackson
WR-Santonio Holmes
TE-Owen Daniels
K-Matt Bryant
DEF-Tampa Bay

I don't really like my chances.

2008-12-11 16:38:29
153.   Tripon
The Dodgers selected third baseman Anthony Hatch from the Blue Jays.

2008-12-11 16:38:53
154.   bhsportsguy
142 Just go old school and listen to the games. I still probably listen only to more than 40 games a year. It is the way I learned the game and then you get to really get to know Rick Monday.
2008-12-11 16:41:50
155.   Jon Weisman
153 - I take it you didn't read this morning's Rule 5 discussion in the comments.
2008-12-11 16:47:11
156.   fanerman
154 155 For a second, I was wondering what Anthony Hatch had to do with politics.
2008-12-11 16:50:09
157.   Tripon
155 Who reads anymore!?

I mean, no. No, I didn't.

2008-12-11 16:51:15
158.   fanerman
151 Thanks for the link. I'll check it out.
2008-12-11 16:51:42
159.   jasonungar07
Pierre had 5 steals and was caught 5 times since june 30. 32, coming off knee issue and it is yet to be proven how he will recover. Pierre minus a step would be god awful. his whole game is based on that step.
2008-12-11 16:55:16
160.   kinbote
Which Dodger total will be higher next year: Pierre steals or Jones homers?
2008-12-11 16:56:02
161.   I Love LA
Fantasy questions - should I dart Frank Gore? Should I start Marshawn Lynch? My 3 rd option is Hightower or I can get choice from waiver. Gore is game time decision so I'm scared. Lynch has been crappy lately.

WR- TJ, Jennings, d. Bowe, Desean jackson, A. Bryant.

Out of those 5, which 3 should I use?
TE- Cooley or Boss?

2008-12-11 16:57:15
162.   ToyCannon
Sure glad Cat Mobley did not drop dead on the court while playing for the Clippers. This is a trade that may have saved his life. He evidently knew about the heart condition but not to the extent they found out after he was traded. He was a good guy and the first name player the Clippers ever signed as a free agent. I'm glad he's not taking the Lewis route and ignoring his doctors.
2008-12-11 17:00:36
163.   ToyCannon,0,548502.story

The world is just upside down when a player might be forced to play for $25million.

2008-12-11 17:01:22
164.   Jon Weisman
2008-12-11 17:01:47
165.   underdog
If the Padres are definitely hell-bent on trading Jake Peavy this off-season, then I think they are indeed better off talking to the Angels anyway. The Angels seem to have a better fit as far as young players that could be expendable but also fill a need for the Padres. More so than the Cubs imho. Not that either team is going to give SD the 6 players for Peavy deal they're looking for.
2008-12-11 17:02:06
166.   underdog
2008-12-11 17:03:36
167.   unlazy4sports
Couple of fantasy football notes: Hixon has not practiced the last 2 days, so if he's an option, make sure you check his status sunday morning.

Matt Cassell returned to practice today, in case you're worried about his dad passing away being a reason he sits out on Sunday. Raiders got tough secondary, but remember Favre's inspired play when his dad passed away?

For those looking for WR's, Devin Hester is my fill in this week, so if he's available, you got 10 minutes to pick him up. I think he may have a big week (but I could be wrong).

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