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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Check and Mate
2006-05-22 09:55
by Jon Weisman

The detective's side of baseball reappeared Sunday, when Dodger pitching coach Rick Honeycutt espied a pattern among Angel hitters and advised Derek Lowe to change his pitching style. Steve Henson of the Times describes ...

... a radical game plan that had Lowe uncharacteristically jamming left-handed hitters with four-seam fastballs.

"I've never thrown so many four-seamers in my life," he said. "Everything I threw inside was a cutter or four-seamer."

Lowe's bread-and-butter pitch is a two-seam fastball that sinks. Honeycutt noticed that the Angels' left-handed hitters tend to hang over the plate looking for pitches low and outside, such as the pitch from Brett Tomko that Dallas McPherson drilled for an opposite-field home run a day earlier.

So Lowe countered with four-seamers that moved up and in. ... The Angels' best opportunity, in fact, came in the first inning, but third baseman Willy Aybar made a nice play charging a topper by Robb Quinlan with two out and the bases loaded.

"He walked two in the first but set a different tone," Honeycutt said. "He got them thinking."

Over time, this stuff tends to even out as adjustments and counteradjustments are made - the real brilliance is to find a chess move that will transform a season for you, not just one game. That doesn't take anything away from a Sunday in which the Dodgers completed a three-game sweep, and showed how silly the discussion was last year that the Angels had taken long-term control of Los Angeles in some sort of seismic shift. Fortunes rise and fall, and heaven help the folks who think they have everything figured out.

* * *

Rob McMillin of 6-4-2 was kind enough Sunday to give myself, Rich Lederer of Baseball Analysts, Halofan Mat Gleason and others our first taste of life in a Dodger suite. It was a real nice group, and I appreciate him supplying good food and a Dodger victory to go with it.

* * *

One inning pitched for Odalis Perez since May 2, none since May 14. I can understand the need for Perez to be a mop-up man while everyone figures out what's next - unless he's really misbehaving, Perez is one Torch Seo Trilogy from re-entering the starting rotation - but for now you have to wonder, with Lance Carter back on the roster, shaky as ever, what do you do with two janitors?

Comments (107)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2006-05-22 10:12:27
1.   Bob Timmermann
So Jon gets to lead the good life where every seat comes with an ivory-handled back scratcher and a complimentary factotum to bring him drinks.

Some guys get all the breaks in life.

I was on the couch with my cat watching with Vin calling the action, although sometimes I switched over to KCOP.

My cup of yogurt during the game was quite tasty.

2006-05-22 10:12:53
2.   CharlieBrown
The interest in Lance Carter seems fairly inexplicable, but I guess one year he got a bunch of saves and somehow made an all-star team.

If this has already been hashed over, I apologize, but does anyone get why Broxton pitched the last two innings yesterday? If you don't give innings like that to Odalis, with a 7-0 lead, when does he pitch at all? And is Carter or Hamulack also not trusted with 7-0 leads?

I say right now that Broxton probably won't be available tonight, and, honestly, he is maybe our best reliever right now. So if the Dodgers blow a close game, you know one place to look for blame.

But staying positive...with Saito, Baez, Broxton and hopefully Gagne on the way, a once dismal pen is looking much brighter. Maybe Kuo will get re-called and find the strike zone to then give us a solid lefty. What a pen!

2006-05-22 10:15:17
3.   blue22
what do you do with two janitors?

How does Hamulack avoid inclusion in the dustpan club?

2006-05-22 10:22:43
4.   Jon Weisman
3 - I deliberated for a couple minutes. I decided that because Hamulack at least has a strikeout pitch, and has thrown three, count 'em, three scoreless innings in a row, I'd cut him a break.

2 - Devil's Advocate: Broxton had thrown only 30 pitches since May 11, then threw only 10 pitches in the eighth inning Sunday. So he wasn't near tired. He finished with 24 pitches in the game and 40 pitches for the weekend. I bet he could throw an inning tonight if need be.

2006-05-22 10:34:59
5.   blue22
4 - Ah, the ol' "what have you done for me lately?".

If that's the case, Carter and Odalis have only given up one run each for LA since May 3rd. :-)

2006-05-22 10:37:58
6.   scareduck
1 - not unless you count Aeron chairs as "ivory". And while you may get your own factotum, you also have to pay said factotum, which, considering the pricey fare, is not an inconsiderable sum.

But I don't want to sound like I'm complaining; they were very attentive, and just great to work with. Helen's already talking about "next time"... heh. And of course, you're welcome, Jon.

2006-05-22 10:58:03
7.   Marty
Fortunes rise and fall, and heaven help the folks who think they have everything figured out.

How true. Many people, including me, forget that too often.

2006-05-22 11:01:34
8.   LAT
Let's put it this way:

Odalis is the broom and dustpan janitor. The "dry" janitor if you will.

Carter is the mop and bucket guy. The " some drunk just had an accident all over the bathroom floor" janitor.

2006-05-22 11:03:01
9.   Sam DC
[Jon, thinking]: "Hmmm . . . "you're welcome, Jon" like a response to thank you or "you're welcome, Jon" like I I'm welcome to come again when Helen gets "next time" worked out."


In DC news, I can't find the link right now, but I read over the weekend that the Nationals have offered to trade Livan Hernandez to the Mets for Milledge. Livan has next year at $7 million on his contract, pitched poorly to start the year but well his last two outs (against the woeful Cubs and Orioles).

Frank Robinson was granted an honorary degree from GW.

Dodgers are in town starting friday and wouldn't you know my mom decides to visit, likely scuttling my chances of getting to RFK. Grrrr. I mean, love you mom.

2006-05-22 11:04:48
10.   Marty
That's easy Sam. Take her to the game.
2006-05-22 11:09:43
11.   bluetahoe
We need to find a way ship Odalis off. When Gagne comes back we need to go to an 11 man staff that does not include Hammy or Carter.

Starters - Tomko, Lowe, Penny, Sele, Seo.
Bullpen - Gagne, JBrox, Saito, Baez, Beimel, Carrara.

That bullpen immediately becomes the BEST in the league. We'll have the best closer in the league. I beleive Joe Beimel has established himself as the best left handed specialist in the league. We'll have 3 guys that can all get the job done in the 8th in Broxy, Saito, and Baez. Carrara can pitch in the blowouts without worries. Carrara can finish off a 5 run lead in the 9th.

2006-05-22 11:21:24
12.   Marty
11 What's Gio doing in there? Get him out!
2006-05-22 11:28:45
13.   towerofpower

lets not jump to conclusions. names and histories dont make a bullpen the best in the league, production does. gagne isn't throwing 97 mph anymore, and itll take time for him to adjust to that. I still think he will be effective, considering his bread and butter is the off speed stuff, however it'll take innings and time to get to that point. beimel the best in the league? the guy is showing us good things, but lets wait it out and make the guy prove it first. And Gio? Are we forgetting he was cut from the pirates, of all clubs? maybe he has something left, maybe he doesnt..but to claim that at this point of his career he is effective, more so than say a hamulack...

2006-05-22 11:36:51
14.   scareduck
9, 10 - I'm sure they'll have pink tote bags for every female over the age of ... well, you can have one, too, Sam.
2006-05-22 11:38:18
15.   scareduck
13 - roster decisions made by the Pirates prove nothing, although you could argue that failure is a more likely outcome. I tend to think he's done, but IIRC he's pitched well so far for Vegas, an always-challenging environment.
2006-05-22 11:38:45
16.   bluetahoe
Gio is a known quantity. I trust him to hold a 5 run lead in the 9th. He was LIGHTS OUT for us the last month and a half or so of last season. I don't think he was released by Pittsburgh. He was released from his minor league contract meaning he was given permission to leave.
2006-05-22 11:41:33
17.   Bluebleeder87

I agree with Bob pic's like that make little people like me jealous ;o)

2006-05-22 11:43:30
18.   scareduck
4 - wasn't Broxton a starter in the minors, anyway? And isn't the long-term plan for him still to become a starter in the Show?
2006-05-22 11:44:20
19.   Marty
Gio is a known quality all right. Known to be done. He's Carteresque.
2006-05-22 11:45:01
20.   Marty
Make that quantity
2006-05-22 11:46:53
21.   Ken Arneson
News of Note: On August 24, 2003, Kevin Brown and the Dodgers faced Tom Glavine and the Mets. The first five batters in the Dodgers order all went hitless: Rickey Henderson, Paul LoDuca, Shawn Green, Fred McGriff, and Adrian Beltre. The Mets won, 2-1.

In losing that game, the Dodgers also lost their MLB Heavyweight crown (see Catfish Stew sidebar), and have not had a single chance at holding the title in the 2+ seasons since then.

Tonight, at long last, the Dodgers can grab h old of that revered title once again, when they face the current heavyweight champs, the Colorado Rockies.

2006-05-22 11:51:35
22.   Jon Weisman
21 - At long last!
2006-05-22 11:52:09
23.   GoBears
That bullpen immediately becomes the BEST in the league. We'll have the best closer in the league. I beleive Joe Beimel has established himself as the best left handed specialist in the league.

Here's the deal: It's fine to come to conclusions such as those above. And it's even fine to do so based on subjective judgments (as opposed to, say, meaningful performance data), but back them up! Show your work. How is that you've reached the conclusion that Beimel has established himself as the best lefty specialist (let's assume that's a meaningful category of pitcher)? Who is in the comparison set? Do you watch games not involving the Dodgers? If you're going on subjective evidence, you'd better be watching every team, or how could you know? If you're basing such a conclusion on statistics, tell us what statistics back this up. How would the data have to look to show that you're wrong (I'm not saying you ARE wrong - just wondering about the standards of evidence).

For example, for Baez, you MUST be relying on something other than this year's performance, which has been mediocre at best. And that's fine too - his established career stats are likely much more meaningful than this year's small sample. But then you can't argue that small samples are meaningless for Baez, but meaninful for, say, Beimel.

So, the optimist in me would love to endorse your conclusions. But the skeptic in me wants to see the evidence before I do so.

2006-05-22 11:55:35
24.   Jon Weisman
Cliff at Bronx Banter says the Yankees are looking at signing Jason Romano!
2006-05-22 11:55:58
25.   Marty
I beleive Joe Beimel has established himself as the best left handed specialist in the league.

GoBears, it's faith-based analysis.

2006-05-22 12:04:07
26.   regfairfield
Let's say that we ignore everything we know about perhiprials and about Beimel's history and just look at his ERA. Even then, he isn't the best left handed specialist in baseball. The first name that came to mind when thinking of LOOGYs was Mike Myers, let's see how he's doing:

ERA: 0.96

Hmmm, that's doesn't work. How about if we just keep it in the NL:

Chuck James: 2.38
Pedro Feliciano: 0.71
40 Year Old Rheal Cormier: 0.64

This was just from the first three teams I looked at. By no possible measure is Beimel the best lefty specialist in the NL.

2006-05-22 12:04:52
27.   Bob Timmermann
The heavyweight champion idea isn't new. That's how baseball determined its "champion" until the National Association in 1871. The top teams would issue "challenge matches" to play for the "whip pennant."

The 1869 Cincinnati team went undefeated playing as the first openly all-professional baseball team. But they never claimed the pennant because they never played the team that owned it (which was a Brooklyn team). They opted to make a West Coast tour to make more money.

2006-05-22 12:05:18
28.   blue22
25 - I'd go with you if it was "I believe Joe Beimel is the best LOOGY in the league." (Not that I do believe that, but for the sake of argument...)

I won't go with "I believe he has established himself as the best LOOGY".

How in the world can anyone argue he's established himself? Who has he gotten out when I wasn't looking?

To believe he's the best, that's fine. But believing he's established himself is opening yourself up for criticism.

2006-05-22 12:06:24
29.   bluetahoe
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Tom Martin.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Ray King.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Terry Mulholland.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Steve Kline.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than any lefty San Diego has.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Kent Mercker.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Scott Eyre.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than anyone St. Louis has..
Joe Beimel is BETTER anyone Milwaukee has.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Damaso Marte.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Mike Gallo.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Pedro Feliciano.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than anyone Philadelphia has.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than McKay McBride.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than Mike Stanton.
Joe Beimel is BETTER than anyone Florida would have..
2006-05-22 12:07:03
30.   GoBears
25. Yeah, good point. If you know it, you don't need to believe it. And vice versa. Just ask Stephen Colbert.

[rant] I gotta tell you though, it's no joke any more when trying to teach college students. It's amazing how many have not learned the distinction between beliefs and facts.

(Note: I'm not directing any of this at bluetahoe - this is a tangential rant.)

Forget questions about WHICH beliefs and WHICH facts - just the idea that the two are different is apparently too much for primary and secondary education these days. Apparently, if you really believe something, then that's just as valid as if it were actually true - because the most important thing isn't knowledge, it's a feeling of self-worth.

And we wonder why American education (and most obviously in California) is circling the bowl...


2006-05-22 12:10:03
31.   regfairfield
29 Typing in capitals doesn't make things true. Philadelphia has Rheal Cormier, so at least one of those is false.
2006-05-22 12:10:11
32.   GoBears
29 OK, now you've told us the comparison set. On what basis do you conclude that Beimel is better than any of those guys, let alone all of them? Again, I'm not saying you're wrong - just that you need to explain your reasoning, not simply assert your conclusion.
2006-05-22 12:13:50
33.   Bob Timmermann
San Diego's lefty reliever has a name: Alan Embree.

St. Louis presently has two lefties in the pen in Tyler Johnson and Randy Flores.

2006-05-22 12:13:58
34.   GoBears
31. Now, if Joe Morgan or Jim Tracy or Harold Reynolds or [insert name here] had said this stuff, THAT would make it true, because they played the game.
2006-05-22 12:14:07
35.   bluetahoe
32. He's been LIGHTS OUT. Great ERA. Inherited runners don't score. He's got a win and a save. When he pitches the Dodgers win. Add to that he's another 'no name' discovered by Midas.
2006-05-22 12:15:52
36.   bluetahoe
I don't think anyone thought Brett Tomko was going to be very good, let alone GREAT. My Boy Midas isn't perfect but you've got to trust his moves. The man knows what he's doing.
2006-05-22 12:18:13
37.   bluetahoe
33. You just mentioned 3 names of pitchers who I don't think are better than Beimel. Alan Embree. I should have remembered him. He recently gave up a walk off to Shawn Green. LOL.
2006-05-22 12:18:54
38.   bluetahoe
33. You just mentioned 3 names of pitchers who I don't think are better than Beimel. Alan Embree. I should have remembered him. He recently gave up a walk off to Shawn Green. LOL.
2006-05-22 12:18:56
39.   regfairfield
Is this a good argument?

Herman Li is the best guitarist in the world because he ROCKS harder than anyone else.

Because, that's basically what you're argument is. I think I'm going to take a break now.

2006-05-22 12:22:53
40.   bhsportsguy
After watching Grady's usage of the bullpen, he appears to not believe in the standard bring a LH reliever to face a LH batter approach. If anything, he is more likely to be someone who uses a hot guy until he can't use him anymore.

Right now, Beimel, Baez and Saito are his guys when the game is on the line. Broxton is someone he will use in a no pressure situation. Hamulack and Carter are both blowout guys.

Grady also believes (small sample) if the guy is effective (low pitch count) he has no problem sending him out for another inning.

If Gagne is ready next week, my hunch is that Carter should look into some summer housing in Vegas and once Kuo or Miller show that can keep their walk totals (Kuo) or be able to pitch on shorter turnaround times (Miller), Hamulack will soon join him.

As for the starters, only Lowe, Penny and Tomko are settled, somewhere between Sele, Seo, Perez and Billingsley, the Dodgers will need to find their other 2 starters.

Let's assume that Chad is untouchable, don't think the Mets wouldn't want Seo back to fill in their back end of their rotation. Sele is more likely to be a spot starter, long man candidate and Perez could be a tradeable asset if the Dodgers agree to either take on someone with a similar salary or agree to cover some of his contract.

Personally, the best case would be for Odalis and Chad to makeup the starting 5 because I think they are the best pitchers of the group, Sele has limited value because of his age and Seo, while tradeable, won't get you much and his salary makes him a pretty good asset

2006-05-22 12:25:26
41.   GoBears
He's been LIGHTS OUT.

Defined how?

Great ERA.

What is it? Really, if you want people to be persuaded by your arguments, don't make them do the work of looking up the data. That's just rude (and unlikely to work).

Inherited runners don't score.

Data? You might be right, but show me.

He's got a win and a save.

So what? How are those measures of quality? Especially in comparison to other pitchers?

When he pitches the Dodgers win.

Again, so what? Unless you're asserting that he's the marginal reason they win, that they'd lose were anyone else to pitch those innings. That might be true, but convince me -- don't just expect me to swallow it.

Add to that he's another 'no name' discovered by Midas.

If this is true (and by Midas, I gather you mean Colletti), then it says something about Colletti, but nothing new about Beimel. Unless you claim that one piece of evidence that Beimel is as good as you say is that Colletti would not have picked him up otherwise. IOW, Colletti is Midas because he finds guys like Beimel, and Beimel is the best lefty specialist in the league because he was picked up by Colletti. That's circular.

Look, I hope you realize that I'm actually trying to take your conclusions seriously, but I'm asking for more than just bald assertions. Persuade me, don't bully me. If I really thought that the notion that Beimel and the Dodger 'pen are good were completely preposterous, I wouldn't have wasted the time to respond. I'm willing to be persuaded, but not if the "argument" is "because I said so!"

2006-05-22 12:33:00
42.   bhsportsguy
If Kelly Wunsch could pitch, he would be the only one in recent Dodger history who I would call a true LOOGY, every other LHP mentioned is just someone who throws from that side.

Beimel has done well this year but his career LH BA against is .283, so while he made Barry look bad, do you want him to pitch to him in late inning situation in September.

I think Ned and Grady want the best 6 pitchers in the bullpen, Gagne, Baez and Saito are the only ones that can count on being there, Broxton will stay unless he just doesn't get enough opportunities, maybe 2 out of these 4 (Beimel, Hamulack, Miller and Kuo) can also get ready to move chairs in the bullpen. If Broxton goes down, take your pick between Sele, Seo, or Osoria being the other guy.

2006-05-22 12:36:44
43.   blue22
39 - But I believe Tom Morrello has established himself as the hardest ROCKING guitarist.
2006-05-22 12:38:56
44.   bluetahoe
Beimel has a WHIP of 0.90.

His BAA is .204.

The way he pitches it doesn't surprise me that he may have more success against righthanders. His change up is FILTHY.

Only once has Beimel pitched kind of bad in a close game. And that was in Colorado. If not for Robles' error it would have been an outing of o.2 IP, 2 hits, and 1 run.

Beimel has been THE MAN, otherwise, when the game has been close.

In his 1st outings in tight games at Az he went 2.1 scoreless.

Against Milwaukee he came in with 1 out and runners on 1st and 3rd and got the GIDP.

He went 2.2 and 2.0 SOLID innings in SF.

When the games close Joe's THE MAN. I mean, c'mon. Anyone that watches the games knows this.

2006-05-22 12:41:13
45.   LAT
30. Add DVD players in cars to the list. My younger daughter (5th grade) is studying fact v. opinion. While running errands on Fri. we were taking turns testing each other. After 15 mins in traffic she had it nailed. Put a DVD player in the car and that all goes away.
2006-05-22 12:46:28
46.   thinkblue0

I think you're getting a LITTLE to excited over Beimel. The guy has only pitched 13.1 innings this year wtih a 2.70 ERA. That's not stellar. He's given up two HR in those 13 innings and only struck out four. Not to mention in 2001-2003 when he pitched a good amount of innings his ERAs were: 5.23, 4.64, 5.05

Maybe we should wait till Beimel throws more innings before annointing him the best lefty pen guy in the league because statistically he's not the best.

2006-05-22 13:04:32
47.   Bob Timmermann
It's time for a Victoria Day matinee from Rogers Centre as the D-Rays are taking on the Blue Jays, who must be glad to get away from Denver.
2006-05-22 13:16:36
48.   MartinBillingsley31

Do you guys from ever look at career stats?
Here is beimel's career stats in 275.2 innings.
10.15 h/9 0.98 hr/9 4.34 w/9 5.16 k/9 1.61 whip

The only thing i see decent there is hr/9.

Now i don't know if beimel has added a pitch since last season, if he did it could have the same effect as when sanchez added a changeup.
Anyone have any info on if beimel has added a pitch?

2006-05-22 13:19:10
49.   blue22
48 - What about the fact that he only managed to appear in 7 games for Tampa Bay last year? Guess they didn't need him, what with all the innings Carter pitched for them.

LIGHTS OUT, indeed.

2006-05-22 13:22:54
50.   bluetahoe
48. I'm familiar with his career stats.

I also know what I've seen of him this year. He looks GREAT. I have complete confidence in him. I don't know about you, but I actually watch the games on TV. I don't need to look at a stat sheet to know who's getting the job done and who isn't.

Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2006-05-22 13:23:10
51.   Ken Arneson
30 In regards to fact vs. opinion, the English language doesn't really help us much here. It is one of the cases where, as a bilingual person, I find our otherwise wonderful language quite lacking.

I can say "I believe Joe Beimel is the best LOOGY in the NL", and it would be unclear whether I was either:
a) stating my opinion, or
b) stating a fact, but I am uncertain I have my facts correct.

The Swedish language has two distinct words (tycka and tro) for these two cases, and a native Swedish speaker would never, ever mix them up.

"Tycka" is used when your opinion effects the truth of the statement. If I say "I believe Eric Gagne is ugly", whether or not Eric Gagne is ugly depends on whether I believe he is ugly or not.

"Tro" is used when the truth of your statement is independent of your belief. When you say "I believe 2+2=4", whether 2+2 equals is true or not does not depend on whether you believe it or not.

English speakers spend a lot of time arguing over things like this, when if we just had the right words to express ourselves, we could just move on to other things.

If bluetahoe says "I tycker Joe Beimel is the best LOOGY in the NL", nobody pesters him to back up his statement with facts, because it's clear he's just stating his opinion, and that's fine.

2006-05-22 13:24:33
52.   Jon Weisman
48 - "you guys from" is not a constructive comment. It serves no purpose, and helps set up an Us vs. Them circumstance that can only help prevent people from reasoning with each other.
2006-05-22 13:26:44
53.   Jon Weisman
50 - "I don't know about you, but I actually watch the games on TV. I don't need to look at a stat sheet to know who's getting the job done and who isn't. "

Also not a constructive comment. It's silly to even suggest that you're the only guy watching games. And since you use stats to justify your own arguments, your second sentence is both nonsensical and false.

2006-05-22 13:27:55
54.   bluetahoe
48. Aren't you the guy always ragging on Kenny Lofton? Did you look at Kenny's career stats? Did you look at Kenny's stats from last season? LOL.
2006-05-22 13:28:33
55.   Marty
"Tycker" is the best word I've learned in a long time, I tycker.
2006-05-22 13:30:44
56.   bluetahoe
53. I was suggesting he doesn't watch the games.
2006-05-22 13:34:08
57.   Jon Weisman
56 - I know what you were suggesting.
2006-05-22 13:35:00
58.   Bob Timmermann

Are the words "tycka" and "tro" both of the same mood? Or does Swedish even have moods for verbs?

It's almost like Swedish has a mood for verbs that is halfway between indicative and subjunctive.

It's like it's the indijunctive. Or the subjcative.

2006-05-22 13:35:21
59.   bluetahoe
I tycker Joe Beimel is the best left handed relief man in the NL. I can't imagine too many better. My last comment on Joe Beimel.
2006-05-22 13:36:10
60.   bluetahoe
non-closer I mean
2006-05-22 13:37:16
61.   Marty
Jon, how was the suite? Where exactly are they? Do you get a good view of the game? It sounds like they are available on a single-game basis. That might be interesting for me to look into.
2006-05-22 13:37:51
62.   Bob Timmermann

That message was brought to you by the Joe Beimel Marching and Chowder Society.

A Delaware Limited Liability Corporation.

2006-05-22 13:38:23
63.   Marty
A Delaware Limited Liability Corporation

Like the Hanso Foundation.

2006-05-22 13:42:11
64.   Bob Timmermann
Perhaps the Hanso Foundation has created some powerful magnetic force that has turned around Joe Beimel's career. Sort of like how Locke can walk again and Rose's cancer has gone away.

Maybe the Hanso Foundation isn't so evil after all....

2006-05-22 13:42:23
65.   Jon Weisman
61 - It was nice. Rob would be the one to ask for full details. The view was nice - I'm sure you can imagine it. Just like a front row seat on the old Club level, down the right-field line.
2006-05-22 13:44:34
66.   bluetahoe
66. Anyone ever sit in the Diamond Seats? That's 4 hours of living the good life.
2006-05-22 13:44:48
67.   autumnlanding
60- is there a hatch under the mound?
2006-05-22 13:45:08
68.   Daniel Zappala
The Dodgers actually had Rickey Henderson and Fred McGriff in the lineup at the same time? Man, where was I in 2003?

If we're 25 years in the future, looking back at that lineup -- Rickey Henderson, Paul LoDuca, Shawn Green, Fred McGriff, and Adrian Beltre -- we'd probably be thinking, man the Dodgers must have had a great year that year! Of course, they weren't all in their prime at the same time. It might be fun to drag out other old lineups and imagine what might have been if only they were all in their prime at once.

Well, okay ... but more fun than arguing over Joe Beimel.

2006-05-22 13:45:21
69.   autumnlanding
make that 64
2006-05-22 13:46:12
70.   Bob Timmermann
Warren Beatty and Annette Bening were in that section Friday night.

They don't strike me as a sports-loving couple, not like a Tim Robbins and Susan Sarandon.

2006-05-22 13:48:06
71.   bluetahoe
I LOVE the diamond seats. Best seats in the house. Best view of the players pre-game. Great dinner. All the booze you want. HEAVEN.
2006-05-22 13:48:23
72.   Bob Timmermann
The hatch under the mound at Dodger Stadium is called "The Curve."
2006-05-22 13:50:13
73.   thinkblue0

I don't think you're taking into account that Beimel has only thrown about 13 innings this year. I'm not ragging on him, I like how he's performed so far...but let's not get TOO excited over a guy who has only thrown 13 innings for us, and his previous years' numbers are sub par at best.

There are a few other lefties out there who have better numbers out of the pen than Beimel...going by the numbers, he's not the best left handed specialist in the league. Right now he's doing okay, but I'm not jumping on the bandwagon until he produces for a long period of time..which is something he's never proven in the past.

2006-05-22 13:53:05
74.   bluetahoe
73. No comment till next week. I'm going to get my photograph with Joe. I feel it. I'll post it next week if someone tells me how.
2006-05-22 13:54:54
75.   autumnlanding
what if the dodgers had a hydrolic platform under the mound and whenever we needed a pitcher from the bullpen the mound would open and gagne or baez or even carter would rise up from below dodger stadium directly onto the mound??
2006-05-22 13:55:16
76.   LAT
Are the Diamond seats the same as the Dugout Club. Cause the booze isn't free. In fact in the bar next to the resturant the drinks are fancy-shmancy resturant/club prices.
2006-05-22 13:55:21
77.   Xeifrank
Clippers vs Dodgers tonight! What do you do, flip the channels back and forth? Break out the picture n picture? Watch basketball until the Clippers fall far enough behind? Watch baseball until the final 2 minutes of the basketball game? Watch the Clipper game and follow the Dodgers on DT? Or just go to bed early and forget the whole thing? Decisions, decisions... oh the permutations are endless. vr, Xei
2006-05-22 13:57:15
78.   JoeyP
The guy has only pitched 13.1 innings this year wtih a 2.70 ERA. That's not stellar. He's given up two HR in those 13 innings and only struck out four. Not to mention in 2001-2003 when he pitched a good amount of innings his ERAs were: 5.23, 4.64, 5.05

Exactly. If this is the best left handed reliever in the major leagues, then how effective are left handed relievers to begin with?

2006-05-22 13:58:18
79.   Bob Timmermann
I think the permutations would have an end, but it would still be a very large number and you wouldn't be able to go through all of them.
2006-05-22 13:58:21
80.   ryu
77. Also, 24 is on tonight. Yikes.
2006-05-22 13:59:05
81.   Daniel Zappala
77 Tivo the Dodgers, watch the Clippers. Game 7s don't come along often for the Clippers.
2006-05-22 13:59:39
82.   Sam DC
64 Can we get them working on poor Barbaro?

I'm sorry if you all od'd on this during the weekend, but how awful that was. Back here, the race ran around dinner time. I got my 5 year old and we sat down to watch and had this long heavy talk about how my dad's favorite thing to do was go to the horse races and he and I would go together alot. Seemed like a good chance to tell my boy a little about my Dad. So it a bit heavy. And then the fun part -- the race -- finally starts, and boom, they're talking about whether or not they have to put down that poor horse. It was wrenching, esp. for a kid.

Was anyone else watching the Foolish Pleasure/Ruffian match race? I remember that so clearly, I was stunned to be reminded over the weekend that I was only 8 at the time. Yick.

2006-05-22 14:01:28
83.   bhsportsguy
64 - personally I prefer Vandaylay Industries, just don't take any calls when I'm in the restroom.
2006-05-22 14:03:50
84.   JoeyP
Bullpen - Gagne, JBrox, Saito, Baez, Beimel, Carrara. That bullpen immediately becomes the BEST in the league.

Gagne and Broxton have good potential.
The rest of the 4 are just time bombs.

2006-05-22 14:04:07
85.   Xeifrank
With all the game sevens and near upsets in the NBA playoffs this year, we are only a Spurs and Suns home playoff victory away from having the same four teams as last years conference finals (imfac). vr, Xei
2006-05-22 14:05:31
86.   bhsportsguy
77 - I have found that given the pacing of both games, it easy to switch back in forth, if you do it enough you almost have a sense on when the basketball game is coming out of commercial.

However, my favorite part of the TNT package is the post game shows, love him or hate him, late night Charles Barkley is a crack up.

2006-05-22 14:07:30
87.   Ken Arneson
58 Tycka and Tro are two different words, not different forms of the same word.

Swedish, being fairly closely related to English, has almost the exact same verb structure as English, with a few exceptions:

a) it has lost its subjunctive (British English has, as well: American English still retains it)

b) it has lost all its present tense conjugations (English still retains the "s" in 3rd-person singular)

c) it has a distinct passive form (In English, the perfect and the passive use the same form: he has eaten, he was eaten.)

d) it doesn't have a "is verb-ing" form; the present tense is used instead.

2006-05-22 14:08:18
88.   Xeifrank
82. I went to the Breeders Cup at Hollywood Park with the thrilling Alysheba and Ferdinand race. I use to be heavily into horse racing. A friend of mine in college thought the sport was inhumane... in part because of the same thing that happened this weekend to Barbaro. I told him that there were alot more things that were inhumane to animals than horse racing. vr, Xei
2006-05-22 14:08:53
89.   bhsportsguy
84 - If I am not the first to say something, so be it but c'mon ... Gagne=Potential? I'm sorry but from 2002-2004, Eric Gagne was quite possilby the greatest relief pitcher in history, only the fact that the team could not get deep in post season only keeps him out of the Eck and Rivera class. But nobody, did it better in the regular season then Mr. Game Over.
2006-05-22 14:11:12
90.   Xeifrank
Is Gagne a FA at the end of the year?
vr, Xei
2006-05-22 14:16:57
91.   Ken Arneson
87 I suppose I didn't answer the original question. "Tycka" and "Tro" are the infinitive forms of the verbs. Tro is an irregular verb; most Swedish infinitives end in "a".
2006-05-22 14:17:31
92.   blue22
90 - Mutual option (team first, then Gagne can refuse)

77 - With a two-tuner Tivo, it's easy. Watch, pause, flip, repeat. You'll have to forego 24 though.

2006-05-22 14:21:41
93.   thinkblue0

I used to be fluent in Swedish...not so much anymore.

2006-05-22 14:23:35
94.   thinkblue0
If I am not the first to say something, so be it but c'mon ... Gagne=Potential? I'm sorry but from 2002-2004, Eric Gagne was quite possilby the greatest relief pitcher in history, only the fact that the team could not get deep in post season only keeps him out of the Eck and Rivera class. But nobody, did it better in the regular season then Mr. Game Over.

I have to agree with using the term "potential". Because we don't know what Gagne is going to do when he comes back after his THIRD elbow surgery, and his second in a year.

2006-05-22 14:23:37
95.   Linkmeister
Somehow I've never lived anywhere where I could easily go to a racetrack, so I've never seen a horse race live. I was saying on Saturday that it's really odd that I care nothing about racing other than three Saturdays every spring.

Barbaro's injury was indeed an awful thing to see, even if you've been exposed to horse accidents through your novel reading (I own all but one Dick Francis book).

2006-05-22 14:25:07
96.   GoBears
44 See, that was easy! You've persuaded me that Beimel has been pretty good so far this year.

Now we can focus the discussion on whether or not we think that this year is going to be different than his track record. Is 13 innings just an aberration, with reversion to the career mean just around the corner, or has he changed something that should make us believe he's "figured it out," and is really as good as these 13 innings suggest.

Absent any information about changes (a new pitch, a corrected flaw, whatever), the best bet is reversion to the mean.

2006-05-22 14:30:20
97.   Jacob L
I sat in the dugout club seats once. It was, indeed, awesome, not the least of which was because Don Newcombe was hanging around. Also Ray Liotta. Stu Nahin. (It was all I could do not to ask, "Dude, where'd you get that jacket?") Booze, however is not free. Everything else is including warm chocolate chip cookies brought to your seats during the game. I personally think that premium sports seating is a "decline and fall of the empire" type of thing, but that doesn't diminish my enjoyment in the moment.

Re: the Preakness thing, I was disgusted by how often the replays were shown on ESPN and elsewhere. Much worse than the infamous Theisman thing, if you ask me.

2006-05-22 14:35:10
98.   JoeyP
Its also a different era for Gagne. We'll see if he can function without being able to throw 97.
2006-05-22 14:35:12
99.   GoBears
add to 96: Or, we could focus on comparing those numbers cited in 44 with comparable stats for all other LH relievers. That might convince me that so far, Beimel has been the top performer in that category.

But looking forward, I'd be more interested in the question of "is this real?" than the comparison over 13 innings.

2006-05-22 14:36:20
100.   LAT
Sam, I am a big racing fan although I have been on a very cold streak my last few trips to the track. Perhaps the best evidence of this was my post on DT a few hours before the Preakness:

*162. LAT
I will be very suprised if Barbaro doesn't win the Preakness easily. Only a bad trip can stop him but with such a small field that is unlikly. Brother Derrick will have a better trip then the Derby and they will finish 1-2. I would use those two on top with everyone else on the bottom of the trifecta.*

I got into horse racing because I had a 5 foot nothing, 250 lbs, cigar chomping grandfather who loved the races. Took me to Hollywood Park as a kid. I remember seeing Laffit and thought he was the greatest jock ever. I didn't care about the Shoe only Laffit. I was there when he broke the record and still have the program and a half dozen winning tickets I won't cash.

Up until last year when Hollywood Park was sold, I used to do some of their regulatory work. Compliance with the CHRB and such. In fact, the last thing I did was write an opinion letter as to whether they could bar P. Val from riding after the CHRB had reinstated him (this was before he shaved his entire body to avoid a drug test). Nakatani had convinced some of the other jocks to boycott if Hollywood Park (Churchill Downs) let him ride because P.Val was reckless and a danger to the other jocks. Yeah they were in danger alright, in danger that he was going to take their prize money. P.Val is the Steve Howe of horse racing. If he could have stayed away from the drugs he would have been one of the best to ever. I digress. Yes, I am big fan of horseracing and yes to answer your question from another thread I rely heavily on Byer figures. Any baseball fan who likes stats would have died and gone to heaven reading the past performances.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2006-05-22 14:38:09
101.   blue22
97 - I was disgusted by how often the replays were shown on ESPN

I feel fortunate in that I haven't seen the replay yet (nor the Theisman play, believe it or not). That kind of thing just doesn't do it for me.

Moises Alou, Jason Kendall, Dave Dravecky, Bryant Young. Makes my stomach turn thinking about those incidents.

2006-05-22 14:49:35
102.   underdog
93 I learned Swedish from the Muppet Show. Does that count? Bork, bork, bork da hurdy vurdy.
2006-05-22 14:52:19
103.   thinkblue0

sure, why not?

I'm of full Swedish decent..that's where most of my relatives live. While I don't speak it very well anymore I can understand what they're saying when I talk to's kind of bizarre.

off to work I go...I'll be missing the game tonight so I'll be looking forward to all the comments when I get home..

2006-05-22 15:15:16
104.   LAT
I just read Plashke's article. Cause my seats are just above them in the loge section I actually saw Frank and Jamie kissing at the conclusion of the game. While it did make you wince a little, like when you see your grandparents kiss each other with their mouths open, I thought it was nice that they were actually excited about the win. I suppose if the Dodgers win the division Frank will really get his socks knocked off. Someone better call the Pfizer rep.
2006-05-22 15:26:47
105.   Bluebleeder87

he's always had great control & with that sick change & curve, I'm sure he'll be just fine. Perez hans't pitched in about 5-6 days don't they wanna show case him.

2006-05-22 15:39:07
106.   dodgerYoda
101 - Be thankful that you're not a pro wrestling fan. There is a clip online of wrestler Sid Vicious sustaining a leg injury that would turn just about anyone's stomach.

Forgive me if this has been discussed to death already but I've been out of town for a while...what did Odalis do to earn himself a trip to the bullpen (not to mention onto the trading block)? Just general lousiness?

2006-05-22 16:18:23
107.   Bluebleeder87

he was "shaky" (Perez) so they demoted him.

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