I thought everybody liked JD Drew?

Also there will be dueling Dodger Thoughts and Bronx Banter tonight?

Who will emerge triumphant?

I'm betting on Dodger Thoughts because I think Bronx Banter's readers will all be asleep.

I thought everybody liked JD Drew?

as crazy as this might seem, JD Drew was no Reggie Smith/Raul Mondesi.(i'm to young to remember other Dodger right fielders.

2

freaking game bro/Bob!!!!!!

Hendrickson
5-13, 4.31

Vs.

Peavy
6-12, 4.55

Probable Pitchers

I like J.D. Drew.
He's consistent in almost every way - aside from his health. The only serious slump he's endured since arriving in Los Angels was that 0-fer-forever to start last season. Since then, money.

2

friendly competetiveness always good.

5 - This is make or break for H'son in the rotation, is it not?
Then again, what are Little's options if he decides to make a change?

rightfielders with 200 plate appearances or more
Jon, how many players made this cut?

Odalis is cruising after a shaky 1st inning in Cleveland. He's staked to a 2-1 lead after five.

I'd probably only be a mildly positive fan of Drew except for the incessant hatred continually thrown his way. I feel compelled to really cheer him on -- he seems like a solid human being: quiet, no-nonsense, a family guy who keeps his nose clean, etc. He's an upper-tier player that I wouldn't consider as the centerpiece of a team, but is a valuable member of one.

Not to get wackily spiritual, but I think he does strive for the baseball equivalent of the Buddha's "Middle Path" -- he tries not to get depressed when things are bad, he tries not to get too excited when things are going well; he simply tries to maintain that "even strain" so he can fully concentrate on his task: performing on the field.

I think it's also abundantly clear what sort of player he is at this point, and it seems rather pointless and silly to me to get riled up about something you know he's not. He's not going to bust a Aaron Rowand and go diving into some fence... but then agan Rowand isn't helping his team as he's recovering from a broken ankle either.

Clarification: the hatred thrown Drew's way isn't from DT (though I know he has his detractors here), it's more from the ugliness that regularly gets spouted over at the LA Times Dodger Blog and on other forums.

9 30 players have had 200 or more ABs as a RF according to ESPN.com. Bernie Williams may be the 31st, but I can't find his PA as a RF. He's at 199 AB+BB+HBP as a RF.

i'm watching Dodger blue the championship years

13 30 players have had 200 or more PAs as a RF according to ESPN.com.

so if Hendrickson gets the win and Peavy gets the loss, they'll have the same record.

incidentally, Betemit is something like 1-6 against Peavy with 4 K's.

6 I think thats Drew's 'problem' - consistency. He does everything he's supposed to do so it becomes unremarkable. I think alot of people recognize that his slugging isnt what it could be, so they dont expect fireworks. Thus, not many folks can get too upset when he doesnt deliver the big hit. But he's consistently on base, hitting singles and doubles, etc.

The Orioles hit 5 solo homers today, 3 by Markakis.

Would It not be about accurate to rate him as 'average', all stats considered? Only in OBP, enhanced by a larger than average number of walks, is he in the upper third. I don't say he's garbage, just that he is most definitely not a $11M superstar. I suppose we should blame DePo for that, not him.

14

i swear hearing Tommy speaking pumps me up!!

I think it is the rare Dodger fan who can see Drew objectively, through the haze of his salary, his tight connection to Beltre's departure, and citizenship in the land of Boras. Drew is overpraised and overcriticized, because from the beginning he was overpaid and overhyped. I expected an All-Star level performer (his OPS the year before he joined the Dodgers was in the top 5-6 of the major leagues), and instead we've got a very solid performer. Very good, but not great.

I agree with Telemachos' assessment of his playing style and personality, but it's interesting that a guy like that would rile up so many fans.

18 But he's consistently on base, hitting singles and doubles, etc.
If he would just hit them as often as Lofton, or Nomar, or Ethier everyone would be happy with him...

The hatred towards him is really pronounced on that LA Times blog. The assumption is that the guy's missed half the season, when in reality he's played in about 90% of them if not more.

I really do think a lot of it is misdirected jealousy. He's getting paid a ton of money and he's not the flashy type who looks like he earns it, so some of his detractors assume they could do as well.

Beltran wins the game in New York on a 2-run homer in the 9th off of Isringhausen. Reds win 14-0 and pull within one game of the Cardinals in the Central.

18

11,000,000.00 million dollars makes people like me very upset. i'm pretty sure he's a nice guy & all but i'm a fan (loyal bluebleeder) & gorsh darnt when i'm upset about a player i'm gonna express it.

Has anyone ever seen any analysis that compares player performance in "contract" years vs. non-"contract" years?

23 Lofton has the same on base percentage. Ethier .012 higher and Nomar is .030 higher. He's on base almost as often.

When the first you think about when you get to JD Drew is 11M a year for 5 years, almost anything short of really amazing becomes a problem.

I get as frustrated as the next guy when he hits those weak grounders but there are a couple of things about this year. One, he has played about what the Dodgers had hoped for thus far, he would have probably done the same last year had he not gotten hit on the wrist by that pitch.

Second, I hope that if he is here next year, his wrist recovers and he hits for a little more power.

Given the market, I think it might be tough for him to get a bigger contract, had he hit 30 plus homers, well that is a different story. Also, I think he likes it here, basically he's not booed by fans here and he is on a team that looks like it is on the rise.

Boras will have enough with Zito, Carlos Lee, Eric Gagne and probably others this off season, so I think Drew will not opt out.(and I think that will happen sooner so the Dodgers can compete for Zito, Lee and Gagne)

25 I never hate a player but if having Jason on my fantasy team this year does not make me a happy guy very often.

Drew is a solid complimentary player and his biggest skill is getting on base. The problem is that he was our "replacement" for Adrian Beltre when we couldn't re-sign him. People expect Drew to put up MVP numbers because of his contract, but we have to realize he's not that type of player. As mentioned before, Drew is just a good solid player.

27 I've seen two pieces. One, by Dayn Perry in Baseball Between the Numbers, shows a correlattion but he only uses "premier" free agents.

The other one was a presentation that Bob showed us, and it showed no correllation when looking at all free agents.

Furcal, SS

Lofton, CF

Garciaparra, 1B

Drew, RF

Kent, 2B

Ethier, LF

Lugo, 3B

Hall, C

Hendrickson, P

__________________________

today's line up provided by Josh & I.T.D. in all honesty i just hope our bats wake up today & Hendy keeps us in the game, but this is baseball so you never know. (see the Padres rook pitcher yesterday)

The other one was a presentation that Bob showed us

Did Bob do the math...?

Before the 8th inning started, Atlanta was ahead.

It's still the 8th inning and now Atlanta is behind.

Yep, they've been Baezed.

34 Nope, some guy whose name I forgot did.

"11,000,000.00 million dollars makes people like me very upset. i'm pretty sure he's a nice guy & all but i'm a fan (loyal bluebleeder) & gorsh darnt when i'm upset about a player i'm gonna express it."

Sure, I think it's fair to criticize Drew (same as any player). However, the amount of hatred directed at him as a person is astonishing... and uncalled for.

31

I hear JD Drew always hands out compliments. He's just a nice guy.

But is he complementary? Does Drew and another player add up to 90 degrees?

Would a complementary player be worth less than a supplementary player? After all, a supplementary player makes everything add up to 180 degrees.

35 On the other hand, Kansas City was not Odalised. It's 2-2 in the bottom of the 6th.

There was a debate on KSPN 710 today about Garrett Anderson and Ireland brought J.D. Drew's attempted catch last night, I heard a lot of people talk about "hustle" which sounds a lot like when they talk about players showing emotion or managers yelling and screaming. It reminds me of the scene when Magic in his first pro game, jumps into Kareem's arms after Kareem hit a skyhook to win the first game of Magic's rookie year.

Kareem reportedly told Magic, hey we have 81 more of these to go.

There is nothing wrong with fans living and dying with each game, I know my mood often depends on how the team is doing especially if they are in contention.

But for the guys that are around it 24/7, I guess the only way they get through it is to treat it like a job, some do express themselves but others don't and recently the Dodgers have tended to have players and managers who don't wear their emotions on their sleeves.

I think that is why the 1988 team with Lasorda, Gibby, Sax, Mickey Hatcher got to people, these were all good players but they also showed their emotions.

Anyways, JD Drew is what he is, he will do his thing and we will just have to get used to it for probably another 3 years.

People expect Drew to put up MVP numbers because of his contract, but we have to realize he's not that type of player.

The first thing i thought while reading that was he's not that type of competitor i might be wrong but that's just how i feel about the guy.JMO.

i truly hope i'm wrong about my 41

Peavy's splits anybody?

Furcal up to bat against Peavy & Furcal strikes out.

43- http://tinyurl.com/rw2yl

41 How on Earth do you know the guys not competitive? The guy has played great defense the entire time he's here, he loses one ball in the lights, and it's time to pile on him.

Scott Rolen sits there saying nothing and he's intense and leading by example, J.D. Drew does the same thing and he's not a competitor.

We had a guy with fire and intenstity and we ran him out of town because he had bad chemistry. We have a guy who gets in peoples faces and he's a jerk. This is why I refuse to believe any of this "he's (not) a gamer" stuff. It's nothing but perception, perception that is generally formed by the media.

I could be wrong. Maybe J.D. Drew chose to be a professional athlete despite the fact he doesn't care. But you don't know that, and it's wrong to tear down a guy because of it.

We have a guy who gets in peoples faces and he's a jerk

Yep.

Ooh, Odalis Perez also "called people out" and "showed emotion", which seems to be what Dodger Talk wants. But nope, he's a jerk and doesn't care.

I'm not here to dump on JD (tho I thought his not signing with Philly was chicken bleep). But I noticed two lame defensive plays recently that bothered me: 1) he didn't dive after what became the first hit of the last Maddux game when he had a no hitter going and 2) the play in the out field yesterday when the ball got by him...

the Maddux one bothered me the most cause of hte no hitter possiblities. But in both cases he seems unwilling to dive for balls. Am I the only one who'd rather have Beltre? :-) Then again JD is no Steve Finley.

46 -- can anyone be bummed about the Milton Bradley trade? How great is Ethier??

49 I'm not bummed about it, I'm just saying the media destroyed the last guy that had "fire" and now they keep clamoring on about how we lack it. At least we did during that losing streak. Apparently fire is no longer an issue.

Ethier is wicked awesome.

How on Earth do you know the guys not competitive? The guy has played great defense the entire time he's here, he loses one ball in the lights, and it's time to pile on him.

like i said in my post jmo i see you're point.

even gameday thinks Hendrickson is being squeezed

Penny also has "fire". Does the media hate him, or is it just Plaschke?

Am I the only one who'd rather have Beltre?
I won't answer for everyone, but I wouldn't - not at his price, or even half of it.

Sounds to me like the answer to all the Dodgers problems is:

ERIC BYRNES!

Lots of diving in the outfield!

Cameron scares my against Hendy

Cameron made me feel good with that strike out to Cameron. :o)

Go Dodgers!

OK - Now I have to go back to work.

That people think silly things about JD Drew doesn't qualify as news.

That the dodger blog at the la times still exists does.

Hendy pitches a pretty good inning que no D.T'ers?

I can taste far more Seagrams now since 7 up became all natural.

55- You're kidding, of course, but I would LOVE that. And he's been not too shabby this year, even in the old BOB (I know the new name; I choose not to use it). Can't we afford to waste one roster spot on sheer entertainment value?

60 - si, even with 52

Beltre's Seattle numbers:
260/315/421/735.
In 279 games, 1086 ABs, he's hit 69 doubles and 32 homers. His BB-K ratio is 76-197.

high throw, from Bellhorn (sp?) Kent at first because of it.

Ethier hits a little fly ball to the Padres leftfielder 2 down with Kent at 1st.

Beltre's home/away splits:

Home: .245/.308/.397
Away: .283/.348/.461

See? Byrnes is way better than Beltre. My dream team outfield would be Ethier, Byrnes, and Encarnacion, from left to right. Or the other way around; I'm not particular.

I know everything can be considered a double-edged sword (Louis CK has a great bit about that), but Eric Byrnes is the epitome of a double-edged sword.

bluebleeder, I think most of us here are following the game one way or another.

Lugo slaps it to right field, men & 2nd & 1st with Hall at the bat.

67 - Yikes. Is Safeco that much a pitcher's par?

more beltre splits:

home: 229 AB, 9 2B, 1 3B, 8 HR
away: 254 AB, 24 2B, 3 3B, 5 HR

69- If by double-edged sword you mean hyper-concentrated awesomeness, I agree.

73 - 24 to 9? Whoa.

74
Byrnes was my favorite A's player even though he made countless stupid plays. He's that crazy kid that was willing to do anything on a dare and does everything with wreckless abandon.

Odalis is done for the night: 7 innings, two runs, four strikeouts, seven hits, one walk, and amazingly, no home runs.

You don't have to give a play by play bluebleeder.

70

you don't have to make me feel bad about trying Bob!! (jk)

I went to one of the games against the Cards with a female friend who is a Cardinals fan and a JD Drew fan and when Drew came up as a pinch hitter (with the bases loaded) the crowd got into it - the chants and everything - and she turns to me and says, "I had no idea that he was so popular".

Personally, I like the guy, he may be over paid, but it's not like he's the first ballplayer to be overpaid. But I like line drive hitters more than homerun hitters (yes, I think the homerun is overrated).

76 I've always considered Byrnes Vlad Guerro without the talent.

Jarrod Washburn's splits this year:

Home: 4-5, 3.72 ERA, .82 HR/9
Away: 2-7, 5.14 ERA, 1.29 HR/9

I guess so

81- He can name every U.S. President, in order. You're saying that's not a talent?

80
From my impression, no Cardinals fans were JD Drew fans. The ones I sat next to cheered when he got drilled in the leg by a Suppan pitch.

i'm making it my business to dislike Adrian Gonzales!

Kent must be getting old or something (missed play)

We need more guys who play with reckless abandon, so much more fun to watch.

83
I could do that when I was six.

No brag, just fact.

I consider Eric Byrnes's ability to do that about as a remarkable as 12-year old being potty trained.

84 - it's more of a crush thing, for her, I think.

So Nate,
I may have asked you this already, but do you bowl often? (did you really go yesterday?) I just ask because bowling is probably my best sport, if you count it as a sport.

Brynes and Zito also won that ESPN game show Teammates or whatever it was called. Now that is a skill.

88- Well, sure, but you're a man and a half.

Adrian Gonzales is a good hitter from what i've seen.

One Repko on the team is enough, thanks though.

for a bigger sample, here are Felix Hernandez' home/away splits this year:

Home: 5-4, 3.58 ERA, 7.30 H/9, 1.10 HR/9
Away: 5-7, 5.23 ERA, 10.56 H/9, 1.09 HR/9

88

i can name every Dodger starter for the '88 WS team.

Wasn't Mark Bellhorn one of those guys that got a pardon from President Bush recently?

Oh no, wait, it was an actor who was in "Deliverance".

My bad.

88 You got me by three years, except I can never remember who came first, Coolidge, or Wilson.

I consider Eric Byrnes's ability to do that about as a remarkable as 12-year old being potty trained.

LOL'ed!!

98
Hmm... odd mistake.

You must have removed Warren Harding from your memory.

H'son is pitching like he knows his rotation slot is at stake.

Peavy is throwing rocks tonight.

H'son is huge. When he was batting he looked like Shawn Green for a second. With the trade of Green to the Mets, we could see an LA and NY match up where SG is a hero against his former team. I always liked Greenie...I imagined him being friends with Vinny and Sandy Koufax. Does anyone else think they can tell when Vinny really likes someone?

Gameday suggesting that the Dodgers could get on base if they weren't so trigger happy

Manny Alexander, he got caught doing steroids before it was hip.

Jake Peavy is pitching like he's got a cab waiting for him.

Peavy is throwing rocks tonight

He better be without sin...

I know it means nothing, but why isn't Hendrickson wiping the 44 off the mound between innings? I thought that was something they taught all pitchers to do.

Manny Alexander looks like R Kelly...

Re Glenn Hoffman: I wonder if it is harder to be a 3rd base coach when you've been a mgr before...

Well (duh) it is probably easier than not being a coach (Bill Russell, etc.)

108- I think the 44 looks to Hendrickson like a small dot from his altitude. He's clearly trying not to fall down. :-)

Hendrickson wants to leave it there for Saito

well, gameday thinks Barfield shoulda struck out by now

no high strikes from Laz Diaz, eh?

Im watching the game and i dont think the ump is squeezing Hendrickson that much.

i don't wanna say it to early but Hendy looks pretty good today.

Byrnes's knowing the names of each President in order is as impressive as a twelve year old's being potty-trained. Manny Alexander looks like R. Kelly. You do the math.

Even though Hendrickson has looked good so far, Peavy has looked better. And if i was a betting man, I'd probably go with Peavy to sustain his high level of pitching and for Hendrickson to turn into a pumpkin.

i don't wanna say it to early but Hendy looks pretty good today.

forever an optimist.

118

Andrew you're a noughty boy!!

Manny Alexander looks more like Seal then R Kelly.

Vinnie talking about Drew "loosing the ball in the lights"

the bad side of me was thinking when i heard Vinne say that.[we're not at jack murphy stadium anymore Drew!!]

In the past I was very critcal of Drew, mostly for unfairly predudicial reasons mentioned above. He has been a solid hitter, though not as good as Lofton due to his present shortage of power, and usually a solid fielder.
I feel like I haven't been paying attention.
When did the Pads. assemble this potent pitching, able to cut down our best hitting. And why are they not far above .500. It is bizarre.
Also, how did we contrive to have these pitching match-ups? I don't think "just luck" quite serves.

I believe Ethier has seen a total of two pitches from Jake Peavy tonight.

atleast Hendy is keeping up with Peavy.

you know what...these games are freaking fun to watch. I like our players and man the NL West is competetive...I mean even the Gints were at least trying to root their team on. What's the over under on Peavy's Ks and taking over the NL strikeout lead tonight? I say yes he will!

Looks like Chone just got Figgy with it.

Two-run costing error.

Jamie Moyer 1, National League 0.

Mark Hendrickson's 2006 Topps card notes that "Mark tossed 134 more innings than anyone on the team [Drays] in 2004-05".

You do the math. ;)

Incidentally, Beltre hit a 2 run shot in the first inning in Seattle

What everyone forgets is we already have Eric Byrnes. We just call him Jason Repko.

Jason Repko wishes he was Eric Byrnes.

Will the Pads resign Piazza? Why not eh? HOt good to pro baseball players in San Diego have it??

124 - the Padres have been in the bottom third of nearly every offensive category since the beginning of the season, that's why they are hovering around .500.

Their pitching, they got lucky I think. Their rotation on opening day was Peavy, Williams, C Young, Shawn Estes, and D. Brazelton. Estes got hurt, and Brazelton got rocked and sent down, and they've gotten way unexpected performances from Clay Hensley and CH Park. Then whoever Mike Thompson is, he stepped up and filled in when Williams was out for a while, similar to what DJ Houlton did but maybe better.

Hendrickson should scrawl 44 into the mound next time he pitches!

So far Hendrickson is looking good. Nothing like the fear of losing your job to bring out the best in you.

Hendy is keeping us in the game, NOW LET'S SCORE SOME RUNS!

133 If Piazza is willing to sign a cheap deal, then there's a chance, although with Bard, Bowen, and Kottaras, the Padres could use those resources towards other improvements.

Nothing like the fear of losing your job to bring out the best in you

Nothing like pitching against the Padres at Petco to make you look a lot better than you are

nice lugo!

Lugo doing what he can to earn playing time.

Darn it! if that ball wasn't a ground rule double, that's a sinch triple by Lugo.

134 Must be luck. And then they pull this Stauffer guy out of their butt.

An update to the other LA game tonight - looks like the Sawx aren't quite over the Boston Massacre - three guys nearly ran into each other going after a Vlad pop up, it dropped between them for a double.

On a some what related note, what's the proper protocol for being both a Dodgers and Angels fan? I'm just wondering because... I have this friend, see... Keep in mind, I live behind the Orange Curtain but was raised a Dodger fan.

I miss Padre Brown. This blue nonesense is crazy.

Lugo had that base stolen!! [dont' swing at that pitch hall]

Reggie Reggie Reggie!!

That's not to mention what they get out of their bullpen. Pretty anonymous guys, along with Embree who I don't think had too many offers.

They got Cla Meredith along with Bard when they sent Mirabelli back to Boston. Meredith has been tremendous.

Has anyone here (everyone here??) read "Praying For Gil Hodges: A Memoir of the 1955 World Series And One Family's Love Of The Brooklyn Dodgers" by Tom Oliphant? I think about it everytime I hear Vinny talk. It's amazing how good he still is considering he was working during the 1955 World Series. Amazing.

Keep in mind, I live behind the Orange Curtain but was raised a Dodger fan.

no excuses, i have the same situation.

just kidding. i think there are a couple of people here that are fans of both teams. I know Daniel is.

I know Martin can't play every day, but why can't it be Navarro, or even SA.

2-0 to Hendrickson?

Hendrickson should scrawl 44 into the mound next time he pitches!

i'm so into this game i wish Hendy would have scratched the # Peavy wrote on the mound out!! (but all things considered i'm o.k. with it)

No strike. Hend had a good at bat.

let's go Furcal

i really dislike Furcal's swing, just try getting on base Furcal (that's what you're paid for!)

150 - Heh, I wore a Dodger hat to Game One of the Series between the Angels and the Team That Shall Not be Named... the ticket guy looked at me funny and said something, I turned to him and said, "I'm just here to root against the Giants".

And of course if the Freeway Series ever happens, my loyalties would be entirely with the Dodgers.

if anything our boys in blue are making Peavy make alot of pitches!!

Wow. Furcal, Drew and Garc are like 1 for 20? in the last 2 games.
I hope its 2 if I send this.

The Padres have a lot of young back of the rotation guys that look better than they are at Petco. Hensley, Stauffer, Thompsons the elder and the younger, Wells, Oyervidas, and whenever Cesar Carillo is healthy, he could be a #2 behind Peavy at Petco.

dah! good ab by furcal.

The Padres have a lot of young back of the rotation guys that look better than they are at Petco.

were the pets go! (bad joke i know)

yay, Drew caught the ball

162 - Tonight, literally. There are dogs in the park tonight, not sure if the Prime feed has shown them.

Nice catch by Andre

164 - And I'm not talking about the Dodger hitters! Real dogs.

Along with Vin's comment, If Furcal, Drew and Nomar do nothing, we are usually in trouble, especially if Martin isn't playing.

I agree with Franklin, Alexander looks more like R Kelly than Seal.

no matter what (if we loose or not), i'm gonna say Hendy is pitching really well.

ps that's all i ask for.

I've never really gotten the hatred local fans have for the Blue Crew or the Halos....I like 'em both. But man if there was really a game on the line I think I'd root for LA. My fiance loves the Giants and says she's a National Leaguer and would root for LA in the World Series. I find that a bit hard to believe...when the Angels won the Series there wasn't a snowball's chance in hell I was going to root for SF.

Awesome that Hendrickson has made great pitches on just about every 3-ball count.

Hey--our batters this inning our incredibly due! I used to put a lot of stock in that.

171

don't you just love baseball!, #'s are iralavent at times.

172 - I still do, even as I become more Sabremetricly-inclined - the statistical improbability of a nasty slump vs the statistical probability of breaking said slump. Or maybe I'm just rationalizing my old school ideas under a new metric.

Do you think any other annoucers wear a suit to work? Love that Vinny does.

What? Nomar takes strike one?

When did Drew shave? He's hurting the team's facial hair strength.

Do you think any other annoucers wear a suit to work? Love that Vinny does.

Vinnie is the sharpest dressed cat out there, i'm not kidding when i say that (if you know me from dodgers.com you'll know it's not lip service)

Kid just saved the Dodgers a base

sit down Giles!

Poor kid. He didn't even know he caught the ball!

175

Morgan and Miller wear suits for Sunday night games on ESPN.

I think most of the ESPN announcers wear suits.

If he really saved the Dodgers a base, he saved them a run, then he may have saved them the game, then he may have... I could go on.

Hey Bob!

I seem to see a lot of those Tiger Woods polos....God they annoy me.

"Too hot to handle too cold to hold."

Didn't that look like he literally booted it?

you can't blame Furcal for missing that HOT SHOT by Piazza. wow.

182 - haven't some of them been doing the polo shirt thing recently? I try to avoid the ESPN games when I can, most of their announcers annoy me.

183 - well, at least until Piazza's hit

The Padres have shown great defense in this series. And the Dodgers have not.

I think Furcal's only hope was to catch that right off his shoetops.

Or else charge it and try to catch it with his groin.

If you just knock the ball down in front of you, you'll get piazza at 1b. so annoying.

*Morgan and Miller wear suits for Sunday night games on ESPN.

I think most of the ESPN announcers wear suits.*

they ain't Vin Scully

Vin's comment about Astroturf was right on the money. And if Piazza had used an aluminum bat on astroturf the ball would have melted. ;-)

you can't blame Furcal for missing that HOT SHOT by Piazza. wow.

the bad person in me thinks Izzy would have made that play no problem.

193 - ditto

Hendy can't win in pitch counts

The Dodgers of my youth (Saxy, Russell, etc.) would have taken that inning and given the Pads like 5 runs...

Hendy - 90
Peavy - 88

192 - What was Vin's comment?

Peavy went 120+ in his last start.

198 - something like, "if that hit was on astroturf, it would have taken Furcal into left field"

he said if that Piazza blast had been on astroturf it would have carried Furcal all the way into the outfield!

Will Ethier take a pitch?

Nice. Kent almost nailed Vasgersian with that foul ball.

good start to this inning Kent walks

203

If it had hit Vasgersian, Tom Hoffarth would have cried.

Is it ok to complain about Kent's non-hustle on that play?

Jeez, even when the Padres botch a play, they still make the play. GRRRR.

206 - Kent threw the first stone at Bradley last year for such an offense, so yes

No Strike!

Raul Mondesi, elected official

http://tinyurl.com/rsoy3

Spanish language article via BTF

Good idea. Hit for Hall.

Hendrikson pitched a good game & that's all i ask for, now if we can score some runs!!

bah!

210 - Poor Dominican Players blog. Raul Tavares wrote about this in May.

Makes you notice the things that go your way in a 16 for 17 stretch.

210

My not very good Spanish leads me to believe from that aritcle that Raul Mondesi is a very weird guy and he sleeps in very late.

214 I thought he was just a mayor before.

Hendrickson ties his best Dodger start with a game score of 62.

214

But with all the Shawn Green doings today, I'm missing Raul...

Can someone explain to me why the Dodgers look flat in every game against the Padres this year, while in recent weeks being great against every other team?

Oh, and... I'm back!

I was in Santa Barbara, ironically while the Dodgers were up here in SF playing the Giants I was down in SoCal. But at least I got to watch most of those games on TV with Vin Scully instead of Duane Kuiper. I had the blessed experience of watching Sunday's game partially with my step-grandmother, who is battling Parkinson's. She loves sports, roots for both the Dodgers and Angels, and it gave us something fun to do together, something to talk about and to get her mind off things - and something she feels pretty comfortable talking about.

Anyway, it's good to be "back."

I'm glad Peavy's done.

I'm glad Hendrickson pitched real well.
I'm sorry our offense couldn't do diddly against SD.

Google translator says his 1994 award was "novice of the year"

Andre Ethier's uncle-in-law is Joe Germaine.

Try to come up with a less interesting fact than that.

nice inning by Tomko

The Padres own us its science!

Also, I know this was discussed in the previous thread a bit - but couldn't Arizona have gotten a bit more for Shawn Green? (Esp. considering they also sent cash to NY.) That prospect doesn't sound like much of one. It's like that New York mojo again - as when Abreu and Lidle went to the Yankees for Spare Change and his brother. Of course, Green is pricy and his best days are behind him, but still...

It's too bad Betemit couldn't have faced Linebrink - and made Kevin Towers nervous.

There's no such thing as an uncle-in-law. If you're an uncle by marriage, you're just an uncle.

225
The D-Backs get to play Quentin everyday. That is their reward.

227
So cousins in law are just cousins?

Matt Vasgersian just did an impression from the "Martin" sitcom. I pray that this guy is not in line to take over when Vin is done.

Is the radar gun on Prime Ticket on or does it seem high tonight? Was Tomko really hitting 96?

225

Arizona is happy that Green is gone. He was a millstone around the team's neck.

Vasgersian is so annoying.

On Martin's strikeout, and subsequent chatter with the ump: "OH NO YOU DI'N'T!!!"

Y'know, I was thinking this Padres announcer was okay, but then when Martin took a close strike three call, and argued, he made an annoying voice - as if channeling some Latina woman - and said "Oh Martin no you didn't!"

>>thwap!!<<

229

I'm going to give a lecture on consanguinity when the game is over..

Hah hah. 233 Ya beat me to it. Glad I wasn't hearing things.

Oh no, Raffy, you didn't!

yeah Furcal :)

233
LOL, but he was so great for the XFL.

Is it just me, or are all the Dodgers equally late on their swings tonight?

With the "heart" of the order up in these two innings, hopefully we'll be able to muster a run or two.

He is perfect for the XFL and American Gladiators.

240

That would be nice. Since it's the 8th inning and all that.

Arrggh.

"Muster" is a good word for this situation.

The Dodgers will have to hope that Hoffman blows his first save against the Dodgers in San Diego ever.

245 - he's really never blown a save against the Dodgers in SD?

227 - Tell it to the judge.

At least I took Dodger Thoughts (-50 comments) over Bronx Banter. I think I can cash that ticket barring extra innings over there, or some other event that might inspire profane outbursts.

Here's the Padres' TV press guide on Vasgersian:

"In his second year as Channel 4 San Diego's play-by-play announcer for Padres baseball, Matt Vasgersian brings a unique blend of baseball knowledge and enthusiasm to Channel 4 San Diego's Padres telecasts.

Prior to joining Channel 4 San Diego in 2002, Vasgersian was the television voice of the Milwaukee Brewers from 1997-2001. His love of the game and sense of humor have earned him accolades throughout the baseball community. "I take a fan's approach to each game," says the California native, who has been called a "walking encyclopedia of cultural references."

I guess Martin references are part of that vast, oracle-like encyclopedia of knowledge.

We don't get Fox Prime Ticket (or whatever it's called), so I'm watching the Angels-Red Sox game. They have 3 announcers talking. It's very annoying.

For inspiring three simultaneous DT posts, Matt Vasgersian hits the trifecta of cringe-inducing lame-ness.

Broxton, they couldn't rip the ball off Hendrickson, let's stop this foolishness.

I didn't even understand the reference.

Interestingly, Vasgersian's contract expires at the end of this season. His partner, Mark Grant who is not in the booth tonight has been extended, while his hsa not. This fact worries me.

PetCo Field: Where Offense Goes to Die.™

For reasons unclear, the company insists you spell the name PETCO.

But they're not initials.

250 - and one of them is Rex Huddler. I don't know who I like least: Huddler, Bill Walton, or Lyons.

254

That is the most disturbing thing I have read all night.

The thought of Matt Vasgersian doing Dodger games has turned my bone marrow into non-dairy creamer.

Some entertaining lip-reading there courtesy of the 2B umpire.

258 - yeah, I thought we got Charlie Stiener to be the hier apparent?

256 I prefer "Kitty Litter Park" myself, but if it avoids litigation I'll try the official way.

It's not an acronym? P.E.T.C.O. = Padres Effectively Try Crummy Offense

Oh no you didn't Martin!

Sorry... couldn't resist.

For those of you scoring at home, I've turned off MLBTV and am listening to Steiner and the Dodgers' broadcast. Just in time for Trevor Hoffman

256 - maybe they want you to scream their name

... Heh, Hoffman's never blown a save at home vs. LA.

258 - Wasn't he rumored to be hired by the Dodgers in recent years? I know he is a USC grad.

I rationalize it by thinking he will play it straighter were he to be hired by the Dodgers. I wouldn't mind his voice and delivery without the nonsense but sometimes he screams for no reason, like tonight, he screamed when Peavy struck out Hendrickson.

Time for Drew and Kent to hit back-to-back home runs.

wow Cameron was tweaking. wasn't that classic the ball beat the runner? Cameron got a great jump but the ball beat the foot...not sure about if the tag did...but the ball did

Wow, the HP umpire's been calling that all night.

... Ball 4!!! Tonight, that's a rally.

Time for us to stop jinxing things, too.

That's what Drew does people.

265

Tom Hoffarth, the Daily News media critic, beats the drum for Vasgersian to replace Scully a few times per year.

Hoffman just walked the leadoff batter!

OH NO HE DIDN'T!!!

(sorry)

272
Oh no he didn't!!!

Someone was bound to do it, I figured lets get it out of the way.

273 - Now THAT'S a jinx.

... Ethier looks bad up there.

Placard obviously not tacked to the Dodgers locker room wall this week:
"You've got to hit 'em where they ain't." - Willie Keeler

It's all up to you Julio Lugo. Proove me wrong Julio, proove me wrong.

Hoffman just owned Ethier with junk.

Can we trade for Michael Young?

Or:

"You've got to hit the ball." - Underdog

----

The Beat LA chant in San Diego always sounds particularly lame for some reason.

Clowning other teams' broadcasters is never a jinx. Especially one as bad as Vasgersian. It's one of the joys of MLB.tv.

280
I would love to get UCSB's best baseball player ever!

281

There are always more Dodger fans in San Diego than San Francisco.

Staying alive, we're still good.

LUGO!!!!!!!

Lugo's played well tonight. Hit the ball hard every time up.

... I'd probably bet the house that the Fat Guy doesn't see a fastball.

Saenz was just yawning. That's either a very good sign or a very bad one.

We go from a guy batting 1.000 against Hoffman to a guy batting .000 ... crazy. I predict we win...

Well they thumped us pretty soundly these two games!
Poor Tomato, he didn't deserve to get put in there

I had to put my head on the chopping block!

LAME!

Why not Betemit? Old Maid is a professional outmaker against rhp.

294
Betemit was used already.

Nevermind, just got back home and didn't see that Betemit had already been used.

294 Betemit was already used.

so Bob, can you explain to us how cousins work?

Is that the bat boy being interviewed??

298
Didn't you watch "Arrested Development"?

I'm not happy with the way the first two games of this series have gone. The Pads are coming up with the plays, the Dodgers sre not, and our offense has gone to sleep.

We're still having trouble against the better teams in the league. It's a disturbing sign.

It hurts to be spanked by the Pads but mark my words they will never win the series. IMPOSSIBLE.

Sigh. I don't think the Dodgers got thumped as much as they just can't put enough together on offense so far. Plenty of chances. Padres have pitched well, give them credit.

The Dodgers really need to win tomorrow - not a "must win" game but they really have to put another game between they and the Pads and go out with their heads held high rather than between their legs.

Anyway... night all!

If the Dodgers can keep losing streaks to 2 games we'll be in fine shape I think.

The Dodgers have winning records against 2 of the other 5 teams in the NL with winning records.

They are 3-0 against the Reds and 4-3 against the Phillies.

1-2 against the Mets. 0-7 against the Cardinals. 3-10 against the Mets.

Rare evening that the Dodger game is over and there are three games still going on, which couldn't be much closer.

McCourt must have sold the team, because Trevor Hoffman owns the Dodgers. ;-)

Well, the good news is that no matter what the Dodgers will leave San Deigo in first place. I'm just hoping they can win the Arizona series and reurn home with a lead.

291 The Yankees "thumped" the Red Sox during the past weekend.

1-0 and 4-2 do not go "thump."

Peavey v. Hendrickson should have been a 6-1 game. That we were in it at the end at all is a gift.

We have a better shot tomorrow night, but basically I will be glad when the Dodgers leave San Diego. That place is cursed.

301 - More disturbing than the other teams in the league having trouble with worse teams?

308 - after 9 of the last 10, and 10 of 13, not to mention I have to go to work tomorrow and deal with happy Padre fans, I do feel thumped.

However, tomorrow night I will be at Petco, where the Padres are 0-6 in my visits.

309 Any team can have a bad matchup with a particular team. But there's a pattern here with the Dodgers. Their recent red-hot streak came against some bottom-feeding teams, like Florida, Washington, SF, and Colorado. When we've played some of the better teams like St. Louis, Oakland, Minnesota, and the Padres, we've been dominated.

At least our stadium is not called PETCO.

311 Fortunately, there's about two good teams in the NL.

311 - I am bothered by the big Oh-fer against the Cardinals, Twins, and A's, where I can't remember a close game besides that marathon game against the A's. But, if we face those teams again this season, I know this team can do better.

I don't consider the Padres in that class. They're scrappy and they have chemistry... oh yeah, they have a pretty darn good rotation too.

311 - But you say that as if that's surprising, when except maybe for the Padres, that's about where the Dodgers fall on the food chain.

If you believed your own premise before Monday's game, I don't know why a two-run loss and a one-run loss against the Padres' best pitcher would be news.

It doesn't matter who you beat. It matters how many games you win.

Programming note: coming up next on ABC, Mary Kate and Ashley Hitler.

311

Most teams in the NL not named the Mets don't play well against good teams.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/standings/grid

If it weren't for the Cubs and Dodgers, the Padres wouldn't be having all that good of a season.

311 Yeah, and we have a 4-game series against one of them in a couple of weeks. (Of which I will be attending at least two.)

The Dodgers are 1-2 vs. the Mets so far. I will be hoping for the best but fearing the worst at Shea Sept. 7-10.

317 - Let's change our name to the "Mets"!

If the Dodgers were 10-3 against San Diego and St. Louis and 3-10 against Colorado and San Francisco, I don't see how that would make things better.

We all knew the Dodgers would stop playing .900 ball. It happened to stop in San Diego.

Back to something completely irrelevant, the Mondesi article revealed these choice nuggets:

-- The people love him mainly because he distributes free water in his town from a roving water truck (the place is pretty dry). He had 3 trucks operating during the election.

-- He doesn't usually wake up until after 3:00pm. The article is actually critical that the author kept getting stymied in his attempts for an interview.

-- At one point, the author is told to meet Mondesi at his club for an interview, which Mondesi blows off anyway when he goes to another one of his palaces instead. The club's name? Why, Mondy Disco, of course.

The Tigers have losing records against the White Sox, Angels, and Yankees. They are 3-3 against the Red Sox. They have a winning record against the Twins when they beat up on them at the beginning of the season.

The Cardinals are 5-11 against the Cubs! The Cubs!

235, 300 - that's your lecture?

Armando Benitez gets pulled for Steve Kline in SF

The key to determining what degree your cousin is to find the common ancestor you and the cousin have.

If it's a grandparent, you're cousins.
If it's a greatgrandparent, you're second cousins.
Etc.

Then there's the "Once removed" and "twice removed" thing.

In California, first cousins are allowed to marry.

Oops, I meant to reference 313 in that last post.

315 It's news in that, before Monday, the Dodgers had arguably ascended to the point where they could've been thought of as the 2nd best team in the NL, and maybe one of the elite teams in all of baseball. And yet, the evidence has shown they can't beat - at all - the other teams in that tier.

I'm not necessarily including the Padres in that tier, they just seem to have some kind of block against SD. Getting beat by Jake Peavy is one thing, but I don't know how we didn't knock that AAA pitcher out of the game last night.

326
We are allowed to marry our first cousins? Party!

328 Do I hear Dueling Banjos?

Jebediah: "People, our search is over. On this site we shall build a new town, where we can worship freely, govern justly, and grow vast fields of hemp for making rope and blankets."

Shelbyville Manhattan: "yes, and marry our cousins."

Jebediah: "What are you talking about Shelbyville? Why would we want to marry our cousins?"

Shelbyville Manhattan: "Cause they're so attractive. I thought that was the whole point of this journey."

Jebediah: "Absolutely not."

Shelbyville Manhattan: "I tell you I won't live in a town that robs men of the right to marry their cousins."

Jebediah: "Well then, we'll form our own town. Who will come and live a life devoted to chastity, abstinence, and a flavorless mush I call rootmarm?"

327 - Because it's baseball, and the best teams don't win every night. The best team and the worst team in baseball are only separated by 40 games. For three-quarters of the season, they're identical.

There is no team in the NL besides the Mets that has won with authority this season. You have to have a bigger picture.

The fact that the Dodgers "seem to have some kind of block against SD" doesn't mean they have one.

In most states, first cousins can marry each other.

Because of this, I found the entire premise of "Arrested Development" implausible.

332
Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's dignified or advisable.

PS: What is the correct term for the relation between (for example) me and the children of my cousins?

PS: What do "once removed" and "twice removed" actually mean?

The children of D4P's first cousins are first cousins, once removed to him.

In other words, those relatives are one generation away from, i.e. once removed.

334
So they are my first cousins, once removed, and I am their first cousin, once removed? There's nothing hierarchical in the terminology...?

335
The term applies to both people.

Good job by Hendy. And for tonight's rant, why doesn't Toby Hall know when to take strike two? Toby, next time, take the pitch, and then hit the fly ball. We call that an RBI for you and the out doesn't even count against you. It doesn't get any more generous or preferential than that. All that I will otherwise say in this regard is that, as always, it's the little things that kill.

And someone tell Prime Ticket and/or Fox Sports that it is rather poor form to have the Ethier hype-show [as it were] televised on a night when he went 0 - 4 and left 4 on base, in a 1-0 loss.

Sorry, I lied. Back to my first. Query: why the shutout? Simple. The Furies ruthlessly punished, without mercy, those criminals who broke that law requiring one to take strike 2 when the runner has third stolen. And they'll be following Toby Hall forever...

Beltre ends the Mariners losing streak and the Yankees winning streak with a home run in the 9th.

331 I'm not asking for a win every night, but I want to believe this team is, in fact, one of the top teams in baseball. A combined 4-25 record vs. the Mets, Cards, Twins, A's, and Padres does not bolster that claim. And I'm not cherry-picking here, those are the five best teams we've played so far this year. (Yes, I think the Padres are better than the Reds, but even if you include Cincy, that record still stinks.)

If the Dodgers really are one of the best teams in baseball, then I expect a few more wins against the other top teams.

My mom's cousins kids are my third cousins though right?

Bob is a wealth of knowledge, some of which is even useful...

So a batter who has a split second to decide whether to swing has to also be able to predict whether a runner trying to steal third base is going to be safe?

338
Drew for Beltre!

The children of your mother's cousins are second cousins. The common ancestor is a great-grandparent.

339 - Okay, this isn't getting us anywhere. But I'll try one more time.

The Dodgers are a flawed team. This isn't news. Nevertheless, they are in a flawed league, and they went into San Diego as the No. 3 team in the league. With the catastrophe that you seem to think the past two games are, who is the No. 3 team now? Basically, at this point, it's still the Dodgers.

And still, the Dodgers would be considered an underdog in the playoffs. Martinez and Glavine figure to be back for the Mets, Pujols is a force for the Cardinals, and forget about the AL.

If you needed the last two games to remind you that the Dodgers might not win the World Series, then I guess there you are.

344
Now I can tell my mom how shes wrong again.

hey, Kuo had the start in Vegas tonight

5 IP on only 83 pitches
4 H, 1 R, 1 ER, 3 BB, 4 K, 1 HR

Other guys of interest:

Kemp 2-5, 2 RBI, 0 BB, 0 K
Loney 0-4, 1 BB, 1 K
Young 1-5, 1 R, 0 BB, 2 K

Very few people ever know who their third cousins are.

I've got a database for my family genealogy and it cranks out everyone's relationship.

It helps to draw a chart.

I guess we are waiting until September to call up Kuo.

345 Funny, I agree with everything in that post. What were we arguing about again? ;)

Maybe it was this: The Dodgers are a flawed team. This isn't news.

I think many of us (myself included) were believing the hype of the last 3 weeks and were forgetting this.

334 - So that means someone is my uncle only if he is the brother of one of my parents? If he is the cousin of one of my parents, he is my cousin once removed?

351 - What is an example of a cousin twice removed? Or better (or worse) yet, a second cousin, twice removed? (there is such a thing, right?)

Bob has opened a can of worms he wish he never touched.

Can anyone please explain to me why the dodgers have been so owned by the padres historically?

I mean, this is getting unbelievable, Lofton, Nomar, Drew, and Kent have not been a factor against the padres this year at all, and we've been shut down by guys like Micheal Thompson, Chan Ho Park, and Tim Staffer among others. How!?

I can't wait to get out of San Deigo. But even more disturbing than the fact we can't win there, is that we haven't won at home against them.

Alltime record Dodgers-Padres

Dodgers 326 wins
Padres 304 wins

A first cousin twice removed would be the grandchildren of your first cousins.

A second cousin twice removed would be the grandchildren of your second cousins.

If you think of your direct lineage going up and down (grandparents, parents, children, grandchildren), cousins go sideways.

Cousins that are once or twice removed are descending both sideways and up-down.

The Dodgers haven't won a season series from the Padres since ... 2005! Before that it was ... 2004!

I take it we lost tonight.

356
I hope the library pays you a lot because you deserve it.

342 Jon, why don't I make it easier. So why don't I simply say, Toby, you see Lugo going, you take the strike [which can either be no swing or as preferred, the intentional swing and miss]. And does it help if I report that maybe I asked for too much and ought to simplify the matter as I just did? Is that acceptable? He's our no. 8, not our no. 4, hitter. We're not taking the bat and "his pitch" out of his hands by asking him to take strike two in that circumstance. And, Jon, there have been players who not only made a career of doing what I described, they went one better and had the testosterone to not hit on the run-and-hit when they observed that the runner already had the base stolen. Why not otherwise trade the strike for the base, especially when it's third and not second base at issue? And add to that the fact that the next batter hits left, so there won't be anyone in the way of the catcher should someone be contemplating that steal of third. Perfect time to steal, with the lefty pitcher up next and Peavy not paying attention. There's this thing called situational awareness. And, Jon, for the first 10 years of my legal career, I otherwise handled plaintiff's personal injury matters and so had to prove some others negligent. You'd be surprised at how fast the human brain processes information. The only thing that happened here was that someone wasn't aware of the situation and hadn't otherwise been required to learn the lesson re trading the strike for the base. And, sorry, but Lugo, Furcal and Lofton, don't need to be protected by the hitters. So even one more reason for him to take the strike, and yes, with practice, most will learn to process the info as desired and as capable.

356 - I think that makes sense. Well, cross off one thing off of my "things I must learn or do before I die" list.

Missed the game, missed the chat on Jon's threat topic about JD Drew. I'd be interested in seeing Drew's ranking as a centerfielder instead of a rightfielder. Supposedly, when Drew came to the Dodgers he could play CF too. I think you have to move him as far left on the position spectrum as the could capably play. That would possibly be CF. You can't really hold it against Drew that the Dodgers play him in RF.

On a good note we did knock off the undefeated first place team in the City of Ventura softball playoffs tonight, but we lost to the #2 seed in the championship game. We were the #4 seed. vr, Xei

356
I'm glad everyone trusts me implicitly on the subject of consanguinity.

Bob, I trust you wholly on the subject of consanguinity.

There. Now I trust you explicitly.

The Dodgers Thoughts crowd was not sanguine about the team's chances against Jake Peavy tonight together.

I now know what sanguine means and the history behind it!

I'm glad I didn't see it. Having missed the game, skimming over the comments, there was much melancholy.

I don't like melancholy.

367 Makes for good song titles, though. Heck, makes for good mood music in general.

LA Daily News Dodger report contains something encouraging

"I'm a Dodger," Gagne said. "I want to be here. I think we have a really good relationship. But that's out of my control. I have to get healthy, and then I will go wherever someone wants me. But I think they want me here, so I don't think it will be a problem."

Asked if he would give the Dodgers a hometown discount, Gagne said, "Definitely."

Is it technically possible for the Dodgers to renegotiate his contract extension? Wouldn't the player's union get to veto that? Not that I take his promising a hometown discount seriously, but is it even possible?

Last nights loss is hard to swallow. Our staff pitched their hearts out. I'm already conceeding tonites loss. We're still 1.0 up. We've got our worst starting pitcher toeing the rubber. I don't see him being the stopper we need. I'm just hoping we get back on track against Arizona.

The only approved reaction to Lugo going is to throw the bat at him.

By the way does the "hometown" discount come on top of the "arm shredded beyond recognition" discount, or is this just blackmail?

370 Technically they could negotiate a contract extension with him but the rule that limits a pay cut to 20% would make that not likely to happen. To sign him for less, they will have to buy out his option and sever their control/connection with him. Then they will have the same right every other team has to negotiate with him at any salary level they can mutually agree to. But their right to negotiate ends on Jan 9th; if they haven't signed him then, they can't sign him till after some date in May I think it is.

Let me make one last comment on JD Drew. Yes, I criticize him a lot and advocate trading him off if that is possible. But there is nothing personal in it. I don't dislike him as a person because I don't know him that way. And I couldn't care less about what kind of personality he has or whether he gets along well with teammates. A professional athlete should be judged entirely by his performance on the playing field. It really isn't that simple as we all know some players off-field escapades or clubhouse behavior can be a problem to other players. I don't think Drew falls into that category, maybe Bradley did and there were others over the years. And I am not jealous of him making $11M. Envious maybe, but not jealous. And if I were, I think I would focus on someone making more money than that, maybe A-rod. I'll try one last time to put it into words you can understand: If I bought a new BMW for what, $60K (?), and it started looking like a Hyundai or some such, and running poorly, and spending too much time with the mechanic, I would most definitely be upset about it and be looking at ways to trade that sucker off. If we can reclaim our $11M a year from our bad investment on Drew, we can put that money into signing Soriano or Zito or on whomever the powers that be decide. Nothing personal, just trying to get out of a bad investment so we can put the money to a better use, with a better (hopefully) return.