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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

NL Win Paces
2006-08-25 10:35
by Jon Weisman

100 New York
85 St. Louis
85 Cincinnati
84 Los Angeles
83 San Diego
82 Philadelphia
79 Milwaukee
79 Arizona
78 San Francisco
77 Florida
76 Houston
76 Atlanta
75 Colorado
69 Chicago
69 Washington
63 Pittsburgh

Comments (139)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2006-08-25 10:49:18
1.   bluetahoe
It's time to end interleague play and go back to the balanced schedule.
2006-08-25 10:58:10
3.   Jon Weisman
Regarding the last thread ...

Gibsonhobbs88, it seems like I'm dealing with many comments from you that are big fat rants. I think you really need to learn how to tone it down if you want to continue to participate.

Bluetahoe, my frustrations with you come every single day you post. It's almost beyond me why I haven't banned you yet - every day some of your comments seem to go out of their way to be provoke a hostile reaction. This is the absolute last time I'm going to ask you to think of the community here before you post.

2006-08-25 10:59:52
4.   bluetahoe
I'd ban the DH too. I'm coming up with new formula on how the new schedule should be set up. The AL is giving me some problems.
2006-08-25 11:06:20
5.   KG16
I'm with Bluetahoe on this one, end interleague play (it was a bad idea to begin with) and balance the schedule - it doesn't even have to be entirely balanced, just closer to balanced for the sake of the wild card races.

I'm wondering if there is a way to set things up so that it would work with 15 teams in each league. I know without interleague play it would mean two teams would be off everyday, but is that really a bad thing? Or should they just expand the AL by two - maybe a team in Vegas and one in somewhere else (San Juan maybe?).

2006-08-25 11:10:46
6.   the OZ
Significant players switching leagues, 2003-2006:
(not an exhasutive list, and off the top of my head):

NL -> AL
Jim Thome
Troy Glaus
Vlad Guererro
Gary Sheffield
Randy Johnson
Curt Schilling
Ritchie Sexson
Adrian Beltre
Carlos Lee
Bobby Abreu
Dan Haren
Scott Kazmir

AL -> NL
Nomar Garciaparra
Roger Clemens
Pedro Martinez
Carlos Beltran
Derek Lowe
Tim Hudson
Alfonso Soriano

*switched as minor-leaguers

My point is that I think that talent has been flowing to AL teams that expanded their payrolls - the Angels, Yankees, and Red Sox, most notably, moreso than NL teams. When people say that the NL is weak, I think this is one of the big reasons why. My list is totally inexhaustive and arbitrary, but I'd be curious to look up "Net Talent Flows" between leagues by WARP or something since 2003.

2006-08-25 11:11:00
7.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
I myself would keep the "natural" rivalries--NYY/NYM; LAA/LAD; CWS/CHC; etc.--but do away with everything else interleague. I have more of an issue with the unbalanced schedule within the leagues.


2006-08-25 11:17:53
8.   KG16
7 - are they really rivalries though? I know that MLB (and ESPN) likes to talk about how those games always sell out, but it makes sense because you have two fan bases going to one stadium for one game. It's probably less true here in Southern California but I'm guessing if you're a Yankee fan, you're not a Met fan - same with the Chicago teams.

Besides, I don't like the idea that pennant races are being decided by games where one team plays teams that another team is not playing. Ex: NL East teams get to play the D-Rays, NL Central teams get to play the Royals (in addition to getting to play the Pirates).

2006-08-25 11:21:27
9.   the OZ
I dislike the unbalanced schedule simply because I have to watch 19 Dodgers-Rockies, Dodgers-Padres, and Dodgers-DBacks games per year. Those teams bore me and have ugly uniforms.

I'm actually more sympathetic to economic rule changes than most fans, so I can appreciate the Wild Card and logic behind an unbalanced schedule giving your team a chance to catch a division-leader. I just get sick of the same teams all the time. How much fun would it be to play the Mets or Cubs a few more times per year?

Additionally, humidor or not, Coors Field is not a good place for pitchers. The non-Rockie NL West teams must play 9-10 games there per year. Even without the ball flying all over the place and the resulting bullpen burnout, the altitude adversely affects a pitcher's metabolic recovery. The non-NL West teams only have to make one trip to Coors per season when the rest of them have to make three.

2006-08-25 11:23:18
10.   bluetahoe
I'm like John Wayne and Clint Eastwood. I'm a straight shooter.

5 Bingo. I figured it out.

1) End interleague play.

2) Don't totally balance the schedule, but get it more balanced to where a wild card battle is more 'fair'.

NL West
Play 15 games in the division. 6 home, 9 away. Vice versa. Alternate each season.

Play 9 games against the NL East. 3 home. 6 away. Vice versa. Alternate each season. You will be playing +3 or (-3) home/road games verse the east.

Play 3 of the central teams 9 times and 3 of the central teams 10 times. (If you play an extra 3 road games against the east you would get 3 central teams at your place for a 4 game series. 4 at home. 6 on the road. The other 3 would be 6 at home, 3 on the road.)

NL East
Same principles as the NL West.

NL Central
Of the 10 teams out of division they would be playing 5 of then 10 times and 5 of them 9 times.

Within the division they would play 2 of the teams 14 times and 3 of the teams 13 times.

AL East
Play 3 of the central teams 12 times.
Play 3 of the central teams 9 times.

Play 2 of the west teams 12 times.
Play 2 of the west teams 9 times

Play 2 teams in yoour division 18 times.
Play 2 teams in your division 15 times.

AL Central
see AL East

AL West
Playing 5 of the 10 out of division 12 times.
Playing 5 of the 10 out of division 9 times.

Play each team in your division 19 times.

2006-08-25 11:24:54
11.   the OZ
8 There was in interesting study on the topic of lurking variables in the studies that MLB uses to "prove" that interleague play is great. The fact that the games sell out can often be attributed to the fact that they are intentionally scheduled during the times of year when attendance it typically at its highest and during weekend, rather than mid-week series.

I found a link to the study, which may require a BP account:

2006-08-25 11:32:41
12.   gibsonhobbs88
3-Jon, I'm sorry for going Dennis Miller or Lewis Black on you all. Most of the time, I'm pretty mellow, this has been a bad week with the Petco debacle and the Pedophile in LA getting in my craw more than usual. I'll tone it down, it was a temporary flare-up where I got a little hyper-sensitive. I enjoy the posts and the Dodger views. As far as my posts regarding Pluto, those were tongue in cheek and not meant to be taken seriously. I was joking like the others, so I'm sure that wasn't part of your comments.
2006-08-25 11:38:20
13.   Jon Weisman
12 - Thanks, I appreciate that.
2006-08-25 12:00:05
15.   Daniel Zappala
If you're going to balance the schedule, then you might as well get rid of divisions as well. If everyone basically plays the same teams, what is the importance of winning the NL West? Just pick the 4 best teams in the whole NL, regardless of division, and those are the best teams.

If, on the other hand, you are going to keep the division format (which I don't see going away), then a non-balanced schedule, where you play your division more, is OK. It does make sense, though to have divisions with equal numbers of teams so it works out equally. I also wouldn't mind ending interleague play to keep the schedule fair and to heighten the anticipation of WS matchups.

2006-08-25 12:16:05
16.   Bob Timmermann
So nobody read my long treatise on how Japan settled its schedule and playoff disparity?

After which paragraph did most people give up?

2006-08-25 12:23:07
17.   Daniel Zappala
I'm not sure if I like the idea of a 4 game series where the first-place team is spotted a win. That's essentially a 5-game series with an automatic forfeit.
2006-08-25 12:23:50
18.   Telemachos
16 I'm just bummed the Griddle didn't catch my cool link to the article on the Vintage Base Ball Federation. ;)
2006-08-25 12:30:00
19.   Bob Timmermann
I assume that mathematically not all the teams can actually end up with those win totals however.
2006-08-25 12:39:30
20.   capdodger
16 I stopped after the paragrah detailing DH rules.
2006-08-25 12:43:43
21.   Jon Weisman
19 - They are paces, not predictions, projections or predilictions.
2006-08-25 12:49:50
22.   Bob Timmermann
I know, I was just hoping to find somebody who would crunch the numbers and come out with a possible set of numbers.

According to the RIOT numbers site, the Giants would not be guaranteed a playoff spot even if they won all of their remaining games. But the Rockies can.

2006-08-25 12:53:27
23.   Paul Scott
Pittsburg's total is unacceptably high. 61 or fewer wins is mandated. Hopefully our pending 3-game sweep of the Tracys will change the balance.
2006-08-25 13:04:23
24.   xaphor
I always considered baseball's imbalances to be part of its charm. Just like the stadiums themselves, the schedules represent different challenges for different teams. If you can build a team around your stadium, why not your schedule as well? Combine that with the fluctuation of the quality of play from a team over the course of a year and it makes balancing a schedule a moot point. It seems to me that injuries represent the greatest imbalance and there is nothing anyone can do to rectify that. If the AL is better, then so be it. The NL West had its day in the sun and I'm sure it will come again. As we say where I'm from, it's just swings and roundabouts.
2006-08-25 13:18:51
25.   blue22
9 - re: the unbalanced Coors schedule. Getting to play a higher amount of games in places like Dodger Stadium, Petco, and AT&T minimizes that a bit, doesn't it? The NL West has 2 extreme hitters parks (AZ and COL), and 3 pitchers parks*.

*I've learned not to trust ESPN's park factor figures, so if someone can point to a better resource to refute that statement, I'll gladly take it back.

2006-08-25 13:23:30
26.   Jose Habib
My solution is simple:
Move the Brewers back to the AL Central.
Move the Royals back to the AL West.
Now each league has 3 divisions of 5 teams.
Each team plays 13 games in the division (6/7 home/away) and 11 games outside the division (5/6 home/away) .
(4 x 13) + (10 x 11) = 162.

More balanced in lots of ways.

2 teams must be idle every day
Playing 5 games against another team means having either a 5-game series or a 2-game series.

2006-08-25 13:28:58
27.   dzzrtRatt
My answer to the disparities of the unbalanced schedule, and the marketing needs of Bud Selig and his owner-patrons is pretty radical: Do away with the AL and NL as leagues, and instead create four regional leagues of 7 or 8 teams each, such as:

West: Dodgers, Angels, Padres, Giants, Mariners, A's, D-Backs

Midwest: Chicago, Chicago, Milwaukee, Colorado, Texas, Houston, St. Louis, KC

ESPN-land: Boston, New York, New York, Philly, Baltimore, Washington, Pittsburgh, Atlanta,

Fertile Crescent: Toronto, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Florida, Tampa Bay, Detroit, Minnesota

It's not perfect, but the idea is:

You want natural rivalries? They're all there, and the ones that have yet to take hold will have a chance to grow.

You want to minimize brutal travel schedules, especially in the era of $100/barrel oil? Keep 'em near home.

The national media can't stop contemplating their navals? Give 'em what they want.

The "interleague" play under this scenario could be purely balanced, or close to it, and wouldn't be affected by the rivalry mandate. If the 8-team leagues played each other 12 times, that would leave 68 games (if you stay with 162) to parcel out among the other 22 teams, roughly one three or four game series each, with home and away alternating each season. (The seven-team leagues might add a game within their division.) So a Dodger fan would see each of the other western teams at home for two series, and then would see each of the other teams in the majors at home at least once every two seasons.

We would develop our own media outlets out here. ESPN could broadcast all the Boston/NY games its little heart desires; we'd have WSPN to flog the Dodgers/Giants.

Oh yeah, and the DH? Gone. David Ortiz would have to pick up a glove if he wanted to hit home runs off Jered Weaver.

2006-08-25 13:36:21
28.   Marty
The Fertile Crescent Division is genius.
2006-08-25 13:37:59
29.   capdodger
27 - That's what they call "radical realignment" isn't it?
2006-08-25 13:40:52
30.   s choir
The players' union would not like eliminating the DH too much. You'd have to work out a compromise.
2006-08-25 13:41:16
31.   dzzrtRatt
We need to develop the notion of the two Florida teams as rivals, the two Ohio teams, and the two teams on Canadian highway 401, Detroit and Toronto. Minnesota is an odd man out, but since it has no natural rivals, they'd fit in here. Plus all the teams low- to mid-budget teams, so it would be fairer. "Fertile Crescent" might not grab Bud's fancy, but I'm sure his marketing geniuses can top me.
2006-08-25 13:42:35
32.   dzzrtRatt
30 How about just expanding the rosters to 26 players? Would that be something the player's union would be interested in?
2006-08-25 13:44:34
33.   Bob Timmermann
A 26 man roster would allow Tony La Russa to carry 16 pitchers on the Cardinals!
2006-08-25 13:46:56
34.   Marty
32 Sounds like dzzrtRatt is channeling Martin Landau in Entourage.
2006-08-25 13:47:03
35.   s choir
32 That makes sense to me, but I'm not sure the union would go for it. You're talking about adding a minimum wage player to a roster, replacing a DH with no fielding skills, who's probably a veteran and still makes millions.
2006-08-25 13:47:26
36.   King of the Hobos
25 ESPN's park factors appear correct. Only Petco is playing as a pitcher's park in the NL West this year.
2006-08-25 13:53:06
37.   caseybarker
I'd like to see some new leagues formed or increased competition from other leagues.
2006-08-25 13:54:27
38.   blue22
36 - I quit using that page last year, when the numbers would literally change when clicking a different column to sort by. Others had noticed the same thing. Have they fixed it?
2006-08-25 14:05:03
39.   s choir
If I were commissioner, I'd model baseball after the English soccer leagues. I'd take the worst teams and place them together in a secondary league. After each season, the best team in the lower league would replace the worst teams in the higher league.

The owners would never go for it.

2006-08-25 14:05:06
40.   thinkingblue
This from Ken's article of today's game:

The Dodgers have turned into a feast or famine proposition in the second half, which started by losing 13 of 14, followed by winning 17 of 18. Martin is similarly streaky. His 0-for-3 Wednesday night left him 1-for-20 on the trip and in jeopardy of losing playing time to veteran Toby Hall.

Shut up. Please.

2006-08-25 14:12:35
41.   Penarol1916
39. Bob doesn't like that idea. I'm moderately in favor of it.

27. Pittsburgh is sorely out of place in ESPN land. It is really more of a midwestern city than an eastern one and it's natural rivals are the Ohio Cities, not any east coast cities. You could just slide them into the fertile crescent without disrupting the 7 or 8 team set-up. I also hate to see the Florida teams in a different division than Atlanta, but the lack of southern teams makes it hard to make a Southern Division.

2006-08-25 14:13:39
42.   Telemachos
39 Relegation/promotion is a brilliant system. But, as you say, it'd never happen. There's simply too much disparity in revenue between the minors and the majors, and too much money to be made from the current system. Our minor leagues are really just training camps for the ML teams, whereas English leagues are established professional leagues (though admittedly closer to amateur level once you get down to the Third Division level).
2006-08-25 14:15:17
43.   King of the Hobos
38 I have no idea if they fixed it, but the factors for runs were roughly the same numbers I calculated, at least for the NL West. The page doesn't seem perfect (Colorado's 1.036 appears between a 1.056 and a 1.046), and I wouldn't trust it if there are known problems with it.
2006-08-25 14:18:28
44.   Jon Weisman
Andrew - I just saw your message at the end of the last thread. Before reading it, but after my warning above, I banned Bluetahoe on the grounds of extreme tone-deafness. If you want to pick from the list of guidelines, No. 3 will suffice.
2006-08-25 14:26:06
45.   popup
I would retain the National and American Leagues and add two new expansion cities. Each league would be split into eight team divisions. The bulk of the schedule would be intra-division, but there would be a limited number of inter-division games. No interleague play except for the All Star game and W.S. No wildcard; teams that aren't good enough to win an eight team league don't play in October. I would put one of the expansion teams in Brooklyn and have them play in the National League. A 154 game schedule, with a best of 7 LCS and W.S. Have the season end somewhere in mid October if there is a 7 game W.S.

That actually would be very similiar to the major leagues in existence when I was young. I doubt that the people who run the game would agree to such a proposal.

Stan from Tacoma

2006-08-25 14:27:58
46.   s choir
42 It could happen, but only if the ownership structure was completely different. This would only happen if the owners' hands were forced by a change in the law requiring a restructure, such as if Congress took away baseball's antitrust exemption.

But that too will never happen.

2006-08-25 14:28:27
47.   King of the Hobos
Wayne Renfrow was given the start in today's final, and unfortunately for the GCL Dodgers, he wasn't very effective. He gave up 6 runs, 4 earned, in 4.2 IP, and the bullpen gave up 5 more runs. The Dodgers managed only 3 hits, including a Trayvon Robinson triple and a Jovanny Rosario double, as well as 3 walks. The Dodgers lost 11-2.
2006-08-25 14:34:59
48.   Blu2
Just a thought, but 162 games isn't carved in stone anywhere. The players wouldn't mind if they played less. Now the owners would mind but there might be some financial advantage to be found in a few less games. The key word is 'few'. How about 18 games in division (72 games) plus 6 games with one division (30 games) plus 12 games with the other division (60 games)for a total of 162 games? You would alternate the other divisions every year. Twelve games with Pittsburgh and only 6 with the Mets sounds good...
2006-08-25 14:40:26
49.   s choir
48 I'd go down to 154 and add an extra playoff series (meaning 12 or 16 teams get in). And this is an idea that shouldn't bother anyone, except maybe for the traditionalists.
2006-08-25 14:42:59
50.   Eric Enders
44 My mother thanks you, my father thanks you, my sister thanks you... and I thank you.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2006-08-25 14:51:20
51.   StolenMonkey86
Some way or another, I would arrange for a net loss of an NL Central team and a net gain of an AL West team. Then there are 5 teams in each division, 15 in each league. Each would play the following number of games:

21 vs division opponents (84 games)
6 vs out of division opponents (60 games)
18 interleague games (18 games)

There would constantly have to be at least one interleague game going on (and always an odd number). There would also still be 81 home games and 81 road games.

The opening day interleague series could be anything from the last year's world series teams to the worst records in each league.

2006-08-25 14:52:35
52.   Jon Weisman
2006-08-25 14:53:08
53.   jasonungar05
34. wow, marty that one went over everyone's head and that was so funny!!

you must have kind eyes.

2006-08-25 14:53:18
54.   Eric Enders
Is the page design really weird today or is it just me?

Also... from Henson this morning... shouldn't Grady have talked to Jim Rooker before saying this?

"So maybe the necessary number is closer to the 82 victories the Padres logged to win the watered-down division last season.

'That means we'd go 16-19 the rest of the way,' Little said.

He laughed and said, 'I'd shoot myself if we do that.'"

2006-08-25 14:54:21
55.   skybluestoday
RE: 41

I think you could make a fairly persuasive case for Washington and Baltimore to be part of a hypothetical Southern Division. Both of these cities hung on by their fingernails (or at gunpoint) as part of the Union in the Civil War, and I still have grand-aunts from Maryland who have a distinctly Southern attitude.

2006-08-25 14:54:30
56.   Eric Enders
53 I got it!

I mean, ¡Yo la tengo!

2006-08-25 15:03:18
57.   Eric Enders
Southern Division
Tampa Bay

East Coast Division
New York
New York

Great Lakes Division

Midwest Division
St Louis
Kansas City

Western Division
Los Angeles
San Francisco
San Diego

The main problem is there's one too few Northeast teams and one too many West Coast teams.

Also, the economic imbalances of the country would come into play too much. The Great Lakes division would usually be terrible and the East Coast division would usually be really good.

2006-08-25 15:05:37
58.   Travis
57 Why not move Baltimore to the East Coast Division and Arizona to the Southern Division?
2006-08-25 15:08:23
59.   Eric Enders
58 Mostly because Arizona belongs in a Southern Division like I belong in Playgirl.

There just isn't a real good way to divide them up evenly given the teams currently in existence.

2006-08-25 15:12:00
60.   Bob Timmermann
I dislike relegation like Uncle Miltie dislikes Jeff Kent.
2006-08-25 15:12:04
61.   Travis
58 Yeah, I know. But it doesn't really make sense to put Baltimore in the Southern when Washington (40 miles south, and right down the Baltimore-Washington Parkway) is in the East Coast.
2006-08-25 15:14:33
62.   Eric Enders
61 I totally agree that it makes no sense to have Balt and Wash in different divisions.

Of course, I would probably go further than that and argue that it makes no sense to realign the leagues.

2006-08-25 15:16:07
63.   Disabled List
Geographical realignment, or any system that eliminates the traditional NL-AL format is absolutely awful, abominable, alarming, appalling, atrocious, bad, deplorable, depressing, dire, disgusting, distressing, dreadful, fearful, frightful, ghastly, grody, gross, gruesome, grungy, harrowing, hideous, horrendous, horrible, horrific, horrifying, nasty, offensive, raunchy, repulsive, shocking, stinking, synthetic, tough, ugly, unpleasant, and unsightly.

The integrity of the traditional league format must be preserved. The long history and tradition of the major leagues is one of the things that makes baseball stand out from the other sports. It connects the history of the teams, some going back more than 100 years. Yes, it gets tweaked from time to time, but the basic format has always been there. I thought Bud Selig got over his NBA-envy phase and dispensed with the geographical realignment nonsense back in the mid-90s.

(BTW, is a very useful website.)

2006-08-25 15:20:29
64.   Eric Enders
63 "Geographical realignment, or any system that eliminates the traditional NL-AL format is absolutely awful, abominable..."

True dat. However, I would argue that the traditional AL-NL format was eliminated long ago. No league presidents, no separate umpiring staffs, no red and green books, interleague play... the only thing distinguishing the two leagues anymore is the DH. Which is the sole argument for the DH's existence -- and a relatively weak one at that.

2006-08-25 15:20:30
65.   underdog
Hey, off topic here for a second (wait, what is the topic), but I just joined Xei's DodgerThoughts Fantasy Football league and noticed there was room for one more participant. Which would be good because right now it's an uneven #, which means there'd always be one team with a bye. So... sign up!
# is 501880
password is nomar

And, back on topic, goooo Maddux! Fingers are crossed...

2006-08-25 15:20:44
66.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
Re: 63

Also, I think it should be pointed out that any system will have its own defects and flaws. Furthermore, everyone and their brother will have different criteria for what makes for competitive balance and the like. For that reason, it may not be such a bad thing to stick with the status quo.


2006-08-25 15:20:53
67.   underdog
Can't we just re-align Bud Selig instead?
2006-08-25 15:21:38
68.   Eric Enders
65 is, I think, getting Maddux confused with Terry Forster.
2006-08-25 15:22:54
69.   underdog
sorry, that was "Goooooo," in the way Spanish announcers call a goal in soccer, not as in "Fat tub of..."
2006-08-25 15:23:01
70.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
Re: 64

I think it was George Will who said that age sanctifies regarding the DH, so I think any further attempts to do away with it are pretty quixotic in all due honesty. For that reason, I think that in fact makes it the last, and a very powerful, distinction between the AL and NL.


2006-08-25 15:23:39
71.   popup
63 I agree.

Stan from Tacoma

2006-08-25 15:24:40
72.   Andrew Shimmin
44- Thanks Jon. Right after I hit submit it occurred to me that I probably should have sent an email, instead. Then I started reading this thread and saw your warning, so I doubly regretted it. Anyway. Sorry to presume. Glad it's over.
2006-08-25 15:26:08
73.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
Re: 70

I should rephrase that. I think the historical distinction between the NL and the AL are still very important--it's just that the DH is now the only tangible (and a very important) difference between the leagues.


2006-08-25 15:27:01
74.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
Re: 73

Arghhh... replace "are" with "is"


2006-08-25 15:30:44
75.   Bob Timmermann

Andrew has survivor's guilt.

Or Stockholm Syndrome.

2006-08-25 15:35:33
76.   Disabled List
Yes, the DH is the only tangible thing differentiating between the leagues now, and that's a shame. But there is the intangible connection to the past that the traditional league format provides, and that's important. It's something that baseball has that other sports do not. Winning the National League pennant is still a big deal (more than 100 years after pennants become secondary to the World Series title), but who would care about winning the MLB Western Conference?
2006-08-25 15:42:11
77.   Bob Timmermann
I always have to go look up the name of the conference that the LA Kings won the year they went to the Stanley Cup Finals.


2006-08-25 15:43:10
78.   Eric Enders
76 "but who would care about winning the MLB Western Conference"

Um, everybody?

I'm just playing Devil's advocate here. I'm not in favor of any sort of realignment scheme, but it would hardly make people care less about baseball.

2006-08-25 15:43:49
79.   Andrew Shimmin
75- I'm not sorry I thought it, I'm just sorry that I presumed to (sort of) tell Jon what to do. He doesn't need idiots like me explaining how to take care of this blog. I had a blog for about four years. I averaged fewer than a thousand visitors per year. There was a very good reason for this.
2006-08-25 15:49:44
80.   Bob Timmermann

Definitely survivor's guilt.

2006-08-25 15:53:08
81.   Travis
77 My favorite odd conference names and alignment are from the NFL 1967-69: Capitol, Century, Coastal, and Central. Except for the Central (the current NFC North), none of the divisions make any kind of geographical or historical sense.
2006-08-25 15:59:36
82.   Marty
Too bad it wasn't Capital, Century, Central and Pacific. Then it would have been CCCP. That would have gone over big in the late 60s.
2006-08-25 16:00:00
83.   Andrew Shimmin
Hmm, maybe I don't know what that means. I'm not taking responsibility; Jon hadn't seen my little note when he made his decision. Actually, I'm done with the whole topic.

So, Bob, if my Grandmother's brother adopts a child, who grows up to have three sons, is there a different word for my relation to each of those sons? Why not?

2006-08-25 16:00:08
84.   StolenMonkey86
We have a lineup:


With a possible TYFN #9 on Josh (I don't know if the sportscaster exception applies here).

2006-08-25 16:04:21
85.   StolenMonkey86
Lineup on ITD


2006-08-25 16:04:40
86.   GoBears
72 Andrew Shimmin
44- Thanks Jon. Right after I hit submit it occurred to me that I probably should have sent an email, instead...Anyway. Sorry to presume.

This is the message I should have sent yesterday. Jon - I apologize for my over-the-top, and, yes, presumptuous comment yesterday after yet another of these provocations. Even though I'm just a fellow traveler here, I feel protective of DT, and of you, because you've expressed more than once how bad behavior on DT hurts you personally. I guess I just felt like it was worthwhile to play "bad cop" and stick up for you (especially since it was you who was attacked). I even took my time with that comment - to word it exactly as strongly as I meant it. But I should not have presumed. You know what you're doing.

And thanks Andrew, for showing me the path to humility, which is way better than self-imposed exile.

2006-08-25 16:05:33
87.   Bob Timmermann
Since I have a niece and nephew who are adopted and I don't use a different term, you shouldn't either.

Stepchildren are a different matter.

2006-08-25 16:05:52
88.   StolenMonkey86
84,85 - ok, I submitted it, stepped out of the room, stepped back in, didn't see the comment after refreshing a few times, and posted again. So I forgot I submitted it.
2006-08-25 16:07:31
89.   GoBears
84/85. I worry some that Grady feels compelled to run Martin into the ground. Almost literally - Russell is looking even shorter to me lately.
2006-08-25 16:09:15
90.   Andrew Shimmin
87- The adoption was a red herring. I was asking about the kids. Is there a different word for kid one vs kid two vs. kid three. It was a silly question.
2006-08-25 16:12:30
91.   Bob Timmermann
But the adoption was the only thing that might make a difference. But just for purposes of inheriting the throne.
2006-08-25 16:15:07
92.   Greg S
Greetings all from the lobby of the Dodgers' hotel in sunny Scottsdale, AZ. The access is free down here but not in the rooms!
I hope to be able to log in with my Treo at the game tonight. The boys look rested and ready to go.
Hope we get some wins as it's much more fun to be around after wins than losses.
2006-08-25 16:15:34
93.   Disabled List
78 The tradition and history of baseball is something that has always attracted me, as a fan. Geographical realignment would remove something that's special about the sport. So just to extrapolate, I think it would make people care less about basebell. Maybe indirectly, but it would.
2006-08-25 16:16:26
94.   StolenMonkey86
90 - well presumably they have different names . . .
2006-08-25 16:17:59
95.   StolenMonkey86
89 - that's just because Colletti is making the rest of the team taller. Don't be surprised Mark Hendrickson is drinking 6 glasses of milk a day to try to get to 7 feet.
2006-08-25 16:18:20
96.   Bob Timmermann

That's standard practice in hotels now. I think the theory is that when you're in the lobby, you can't sit there forever, but in your room, you will be hanging out all day long.

Also, the hotels want to help out people coming in for meetings.

2006-08-25 16:22:26
97.   Nick Iyengar
Has anyone noticed/mentioned that "old friend" Joe Thurston is starting in LF for the Philles today?
2006-08-25 16:23:40
98.   Daniel Zappala
96 Not the ones I stay in. I've used hotels from Best Western to Hilton and had free wireless in my room. It's considered a necessity these days.
2006-08-25 16:23:59
99.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
92 - Which hotel? I ask because I work in Scottsdale, next to the mall (where I saw Barry Bonds two weeks ago).
2006-08-25 16:25:30
100.   Bob Timmermann

I need to stay in those hotels. At the Renaissance in Seattle, I got dinged $10 a day to use the internet in my room and it was free in the lobby.

That was the same setup as the Claremont in Berkeley.

I've got to find hotels in Japan when I'm there that have access, but I don't think any have free access except VERY expensive hotels.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2006-08-25 16:26:42
101.   regfairfield
89 If you count his starts with the 51s, Martin is second in baseball in games started as a catcher. The information is sketchy, but I think he's already at his career high for games caught.
2006-08-25 16:27:26
102.   Andrew Shimmin
The hotel I stayed in in Orlando advertised high speed in-room internet access. They meant BYO dial-up. I hate Florida.
2006-08-25 16:27:54
103.   mrboma
Did anyone else see this?

Babe Ruth was put through a series of cognitive and reflex tests at age 26. GQ magazine commissioned Washington University to put Albert Pujols through a battery of similar tests at the same age. Like Ruth, Pujols rocked the tests, scoring literally off the charts on some tests.

So my question is, could this battery of tests be given to potential draft picks to evaluate innate ability/potential?

2006-08-25 16:28:27
104.   Daniel Zappala
Bob, when are you going to Japan? I don't think you're allowed to leave until Sam in DC comes back.
2006-08-25 16:29:45
105.   Jon Weisman
97 - Gotta love Thurston. For all his heartaches, he's got a .304 career batting average to brag about. For now, anyway.
2006-08-25 16:30:16
106.   Greg S
99- Don't mind answering as its public info (in the media guide).. Westin Kierland
2006-08-25 16:33:40
107.   Bob Timmermann
October 9-16. Then I return home and head off to Michigan on Oct. 18 as my brother and I will head down to South Bend to watch UCLA gets depantsed at Notre Dame.
2006-08-25 16:37:47
108.   Greg S
98 & 100-
In my experience, the nicer the hotel the more likely they'll ding you for internet access. Free at La Quinta and Fairfield... Charge you at the Westin and Marriott (team hotel in SD). I don't like this trend. Stayed at the Bellaggio in Vegas earlier in the year and they charged me $8 to receive a FedEx!
2006-08-25 16:42:37
109.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
106 - Near me that is not.
For Dodgerspotting (the poorly received sequel to the 1996 film starring Ewan McGregor), perhaps I should try Swift Aviation at the airport on Sunday afternoon. I don't know what the team's charter looks like, but perhaps I can find a clue. When Seattle was in town the jet with the Mariners logo on the tail gave away the identity.
But why not just go to the game(s), Gold Star?
Because I want to spare myself the possible sight of the team coughing up the division lead, that's why. Besides, the team is 0-3 this year when I've seen them in person.
2006-08-25 16:42:59
110.   Travis
108 Add Holiday Inn Express to the list of hotels that usually have free wireless Internet.

The Vegas hotels usually charge $10/day, and their business center prices are much, much worse.

2006-08-25 16:51:26
111.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
Re: 108 etc.

With regards to American hotels, things like free wireless, free local calls, free breakfast, etc., are usually only associated with midrange places (around 100 bucks/night) like Hampton Inn, Holiday Inn Express, etc. Places like Motel 6 won't even have that sort of thing available, but the logic seems to be that if you're staying at somplace like a Hilton (200 bucks/night and up), you'll be willing (and able) to pay for something like wireless.

Bob needs to hang out with the hoi polloi more. =)


2006-08-25 16:56:35
112.   Greg S
111 - The theory of "we charge you because you can afford it" doesn't usually go over well with those who can afford it. Or maybe it just doesn't with those like me who can borderline afford it.
2006-08-25 16:58:55
113.   Greg S
Sorry, just a test post from the Treo. Off to the game!
2006-08-25 16:58:58
114.   gibsonhobbs88
67 - I'd like to do more than that to Selig but Jon has told me to cool the rants. My distaste for the current Commish is well noted!! Go Maddux tonight and we need to get our bats back in gear tonight!!
2006-08-25 17:02:08
115.   Wayne Wei-siang Hsieh
Re: 112

I agree, but I'm also in the "borderline" afford it category.

Generally, I only stay in a "nice" hotel if I'm traveling on business, and am at least comped for part of the cost, or I'm really giving myself a treat (then, I frequently don't have a computer with me at all). Otherwise, I'm in a midrange place like a Hampton Inn, where the wireless is free. But if I had the scratch to be able to put down 250/night for a room easy, then I probably wouldn't care that much about another 10 bucks a night for wireless.


2006-08-25 17:13:29
116.   Marty
So, is it a 6 o'clock game because of Arizona's time fetish?
2006-08-25 17:13:57
117.   Andrew Shimmin
I'd sleep in Kramer's drawer if it saved me twenty bucks. Fifteen if the drawer had free wifi.
2006-08-25 17:15:26
118.   D4P
You'd shop at Wal-Mart if it saved you a buck
2006-08-25 17:15:55
119.   D4P
BTW: What are you doing with all the money you used to spend on cigs?
2006-08-25 17:18:29
120.   Gold Star for Robot Boy
116 - 6:40 p.m. start.
2006-08-25 17:20:14
121.   Bob Timmermann
Maybe we can get the game to start an hour early and have Chase Field put on an Indian reservation.

Either the Hopi or the Navajo use DST. But not both.

2006-08-25 17:21:51
122.   Jon Weisman
Yeah, Gibsonhobbs88 needs to prove to me he can go at least 24 hours without using exclamation points :)
2006-08-25 17:22:26
123.   Bob Timmermann
I found a hotel in Tokyo for $91 a night that has free high-speed internet access.

The rooms are small, but not horribly small. Just somewhat small.

I once stayed in a big hotel with a big room in Yokohama. I forgot to book a hotel for this one day of my trip and had no place to stay. Turned out that this fancy hotel just wanted to dump a room so I got a $400 room for $100.

2006-08-25 17:24:28
124.   Bob Timmermann
Jon has turned into Jake Jarmel.
2006-08-25 17:25:07
125.   Andrew Shimmin
119- I go to Walmart and, when no one's looking, I slip it in to an unattended cash register.
2006-08-25 17:25:34
126.   mankatododger
121 The Navajo go on DST, the Hopi (surrounded by the Navajo Nation) do not.
2006-08-25 17:27:24
127.   Mr Customer
107 Hey, you're off to my old stomping grounds (not the Pacific Rim part, after that). What are you going to be up to in MI?

I have a bushel of left-over Seething Hatred of all things Notre Dame athletics I've been meaning to send back. Do you have room in your carry-on?

2006-08-25 17:28:08
128.   Marty
125 gives pause if you read it out of context.
2006-08-25 17:28:55
129.   Mr Customer
126 You learn something new every day. That is fantastic!
2006-08-25 17:29:35
130.   mankatododger
129 I aim to please.
2006-08-25 17:30:19
131.   Andrew Shimmin
128- That's what she said. . .
2006-08-25 17:30:42
132.   Bob Timmermann
One of my brothers lives in Michigan, not too far from South Bend. But farther than Benton Harbor!

I can carry any seething hatred for Notre Dame in my carry-on as long as it's in solid form.

2006-08-25 17:35:16
133.   Marty
Notre Dame may have Touchdown Jesus, but we have Baseball Jesus.
2006-08-25 17:40:34
134.   natepurcell
i just got back from seeing the descent. incredibly brutal awesome movie with lots of blood, gore and broken bones sticking out the body.
2006-08-25 17:43:24
135.   D4P
"Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."


2006-08-25 17:44:26
136.   Mr Customer

I froze my collegiate butt off for five years in Berrien county. The area grew on me after a while.

Don't worry, the seething hatred has set nicely, and is quite solid enought to pass security.

2006-08-25 17:44:34
137.   natepurcell
speaking of blogs, what happened to "danys baez is an asshat?"
2006-08-25 17:46:04
138.   Bob Timmermann

Baez had that part surgically removed recently.

2006-08-25 17:51:05
139.   Bob Timmermann
Farther north than Berrien County.

Actually, it shouldn't be too hard to figure out where I'm going in Michigan if you just used Google.

2006-08-25 17:59:38
140.   Jon Weisman
Game thread is open.
2006-08-25 18:17:51
141.   Steve
That would be a good blog. I wish I had known about it.

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