Baseball Toaster was unplugged on February 4, 2009.
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TV and more ...
1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with
In 1979, I was at sleepaway camp in Colorado when word filtered in (and of course in those days, it wasn't like any of us was hooked into the news the way you could be as an 11-year-old today) that Thurman Munson had died in a plane crash.
It wasn't the first time in my life a contemporary athlete had died, but it was still unfathomable. Munson, of course, had been a member of the Yankee teams that defeated the Dodgers two years in a row in the World Series (1977-78). So I was no fan of his, but I knew what a player he was. It was dusk when we heard, and I remember there was this kid from New York at camp, his name was something like Vinny Schicchi, and he was just beside himself.
Last month, I read Tyler Kepner's New York Times article that is now recirculating around the Internet about the fear surrounding Cory Lidle, the Yankee pitcher and precocious pilot, who we now know perished in a plane crash today. For the crash to be into a building, for the crash to involve a Yankee ... I'm not sure there are words to describe the feeling. I can only imagine the memories the tragedy pulls up.
My heart goes out to Lidle's family, and to everyone in the city and in baseball who felt the blow.
More at Bronx Banter. Update: Here too.
See the list here:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2621860
The bus crash that injured Buck Rogers with the Angels is the only other major sports crash I can think of regarding an entire sports team.
http://tinyurl.com/e7g9h
http://manutd.soccer24-7.com/custom/1.html
The biography ends a season or two before the Lakers won their only championship with West as a player. Being such a private person, it is doubtful we will ever get a followup about the last 35 years or so where he may have come close to equaling his playing career with his NBA executive career.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0106246/
It is always heart aching when those we depend on to bring levity to our daily lives are taken from us without warning. Brings in to perspective how trivial where A-Rod might be playing third base next year truly is.
Being an athlete doesn't give one immunity, despite what we'd like to think.
I'm so sorry for his family and friends.
This may be inappropriate, but I've always wondered what happens when a person dies; is the team obligated to pay the person's family? That's what I'm assuming, since it's a guaranteed contract and is considered a career ending injury.
My prayers go out tot his family.
IIRC, the diaster policies all basically involved canceling the remainder of that team's season, then holding a special draft from among all the other teams.
You should have stopped posting after that.
Housman wrote a poem about athletes passing:
http://tinyurl.com/kynkv
The time you won your town the race
We chaired you through the market-place;
Man and boy stood cheering by,
And home we brought you shoulder-high.
To-day, the road all runners come,
Shoulder-high we bring you home,
And set you at your threshold down,
Townsman of a stiller town.
Smart lad, to slip betimes away
From fields were glory does not stay
And early though the laurel grows
It withers quicker than the rose.
Eyes the shady night has shut
Cannot see the record cut,
And silence sounds no worse than cheers
After earth has stopped the ears:
Now you will not swell the rout
Of lads that wore their honours out,
Runners whom renown outran
And the name died before the man.
So set, before its echoes fade,
The fleet foot on the sill of shade,
And hold to the low lintel up
The still-defended challenge-cup.
And round that early-laurelled head
Will flock to gaze the strengthless dead,
And find unwithered on its curls
The garland briefer than a girl's.
Baseball: If 6 or more players from a team's roster are disabled, that team is able to draft from the other teams. The league president would determine how many players are "frozen" -- or protected -- by the healthy teams. In addition, players with no-trade clauses would be protected.
NFL: The NFL has two designations; "disaster" and "near-disaster."
A near-disaster is described as a team losing fewer than 15 players in one accident. In such instances, a special draft would not be put into effect. Instead, a team would use such things as the waiver list to rebuild. But if a quarterback is among those lost, the victimized team would be able to draft up to two quarterbacks from other teams.
If 15 or more players were to be lost, the commissioner can decide whether he wants the team's season canceled. If it continues, the "near-disaster" contingencies apply.
NBA: If five or more players on a team "die or are dismembered," that team can draft from the other teams. Each team is allowed to protect five players, and only one player per team may be drafted.
NHL: If five or more players on a team are killed or dismembered, there is an unexplained "restocking plan" to fill that team's roster. Each team losing a player in the restocking plan is compensated $500,000 from a special life insurance policy.
There is still a lot we don't know and may never know about how this accident occurred but to go to the personal responsibility card seems a bit crass given that the man just died.
Sometimes a little respect for the moment goes a long way, sure if it turns out that it was pilot error that caused the accident then we can go from there but for now I just think a little respect is not a place to go.
In other words, you acknowledge that you're presuming - but then you run with that presumption. You may ultimately be right that Lidle was reckless, but aren't we a long way from knowing that?
First thing that came to mind upon hearing the news today.
I know he was compensated well for his last 2 years in baseball but again I just thought this was something to note.
Actually, he wasn't all that far from the legitimate VFR air corridor over the East River. The question is why did he stray? It may have been pilot error. It may also have been an aircraft malfunction, since there is a report that there was a distress call. There are also reports that he was flying with an instructor, for whom it would not be a frivolous, dangerous hobby.
When you speak/type without a reasonable grasp of basic information you run the risk of making yourself look like a genuine fool. Of course, for some, that is apt to occur in any case.
Finally, Jon or Bob, there is a serious troll problem in the Bronx Banter and I understand that the host is unavailable to do anything about it at this time. Is there anything that you can do to help?
Since the NTSB apparently appointed you lead investigator into the crash, why don't you drop the holier-than-thou attitude?
Any particular reason you're completely disregarding the prospect that this was an aircraft malfunction?
On October 29, 1960 a chartered plane carrying the Cal Poly football team, hours after from a loss to Bowling Green State University, crashed on takeoff at the Toledo, Ohio airport. Eighteen of the forty-eight people on board were killed, including sixteen players, the team's student manager, and a Cal Poly football booster. Cal Poly alumnus John Madden's fear of flying is commonly attributed to the crash. Madden, who played football for Cal Poly from 1957-58 and was coaching at the nearby Allan Hancock Junior College at the time of the crash, knew many former teammates aboard the plane. Among the survivors were quarterback Ted Tollner, who went on to become head football coach of the University of Southern California and San Diego State University.
http://tinyurl.com/rhq2n
ugh .... how sickening a thought ....
This story haunted me when I was a very young baseball fan.
"The next day, before the start of the Yankees' four-game set with the Baltimore Orioles in the Bronx, the Yankees paid tribute to their fallen captain in a pre-game ceremony during which the starters stood at their defensive positions, save for the catcher's box, which remained empty. At the conclusion of Robert Merrill's musical selection, the fans (announced attendance 51,151) burst into a 10-minute standing ovation.
Four days later, on August 6, the entire Yankee team attended his funeral in Canton. Lou Piniella and Bobby Murcer, who were Munson's best friends as well as teammates, gave moving eulogies. That night (in front of a national viewing audience on ABC's Monday Night Baseball) the Yankees beat the Orioles 5-4 in New York, with Murcer driving in all 5 runs with a three-run home run in the seventh inning and a two-run double in the bottom of the ninth.
Immediately following his death, Yankee owner George Steinbrenner announced that his uniform number 15 was being retired. On September 20, 1980, a plaque was dedicated in his memory and placed in Monument Park. The plaque bears excerpts from an inscription composed by Steinbrenner and flashed on the Stadium scoreboard the day after his death: "Our captain and leader has not left us, today, tomorrow, this year, next... Our endeavors will reflect our love and admiration for him." To this day, despite a packed clubhouse, an empty locker, with Munson's number 15 on it, remains as a tribute to the Yankees' lost catcher."
i love the dodgers, but what you suggested sounds more like something the dodgers would do. the franchise has a history of treating former players and players past their prime like crap.
I was suggesting that Steinbrenner's sadness over what happened to Munson would play a role in being nervous about athletes who fly, not that he would be vindictive.
I do agree that the feeling of immortality that drives great athletes may cause them to greater risks. Like riding a motorcycle without a helmet. A stupid and unnecessary risk. But flying a plane is not necessarily risky business. At some point, all experienced fliers have only 90 hours in the seat. Practice is how they get better.
One thing we do know is that at this point there is very little information. Let's wait and see.
Or washing a truck
Or carrying venison up a flight of stairs
(I'm looking at you, Clint Barmes)
Nightfall will be coming soon
Oh my my, oh hell yes, you gotta put on that party dress.
"Because the regular season was over, Lidle had already received the full amount in the contract."
http://tinyurl.com/kcpnf
It doesn't have to be about ego. It doesn't have to be about anything. It's simply my opinion on the matter.
i am invincible, though :)
(i sometimes remember the scene in... goldeneye, was it? some recent bond film, anyway, where the russian guy yells "I am INVINCIBLE!" right before he is uh, vinced)
Very telling? As a website filled with statistics enthusiasts, I am surprised to see a number of people on here who seem to interpret the Lidle crash as some kind of flaw in character. Accidents happen. Driving, walking across the street, playing baseball (yes, people die playing baseball - look up commotio cordis) - some activities are higher risk than others but unless you're an agoraphobic shut-in you can hardly live life without subjecting yourself to a certain level of risk. Without delving deeply into the numbers, I am going to guess that flying isn't that high on the list.
Lidle chose to fly, and not only seemed to know what he was doing, but had a FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR with him at the time of the accident. I don't see how that equates to a telling character flaw. And even though I didn't know Lidle, I can still have sympathy for what transpired yesterday and the sadness his family must now endure.
162 games played / 3 game series = approx 54 series played. 1/2 of those are away and require a flight in and flight out, so that's 27 away series x 2 flights = 54 flights season per team x 30 teams = approx 1,620 chartered baseball team flights season (not include Spring Training and post season).
According to "planecrashinfo.com", the odds of being killed on a single trip on an airliner is 52.6 million to 1 (besting that of a car, which is 7.6 million to 1).
Therefore, dividing 52.6 million by 1,620 flights, gives a probability of 1 in 32,470 that one person would be killed over 1,620 flights, or .003% chance over one season.
Did I do this right?
Some follow-up information on Lidle and the plane--apparently, the parachute system is somewhat useless:
http://philip.greenspun.com/flying/cirrus-sr20
And guess who else lived in that building:
http://tinyurl.com/y7ls6y
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