Now it's Pierre's time to shine

Where was this new rally cap Sunday..., and Tuesday, and Wednesday?

Not quite. 0-5

And how do you get a 0.04% chance of an HR for Pierre?

I'll admit it: My first thought upon reading the "weeks ... months" line was Spock in Wrath of Khan.
"If we go by the book, hours could seem like days..."

At least Pierre didn't ground out to 2nd.

[367 from last thread] You'd think he could run my plate without pulling me over and find out I legitimately have stickers.

You drive one of the best rollercoasters, no loops, in California. For free (sort of). I'm nostalgic for the on-ramp stop signs.

5 Maybe our centerfielder should be renamed "The Kobayashi Maru"

The no-win scenario.

Nomar's due for a longball.

Re post 363 in the previos thread - I have ALL FOUR of those BUTT-UGLY stickers on my car, each in its exact and proper place, and I lose most of my carpool lane time savings for that???? Is there some sticker black-market problem I don't know about? Has this happened to you?

Yes, in fact there have recently been stories in the news of counterfeiters manufacturing these decals. People are also stealing the decals:

http://www.contracostatimes.com/ci_5640887

Nomar is due for a longball.

8 - may you live long and prosper for that crack. LOL!

8 But how do we reprogram him?

I like how the TNT announcers said that Parker couldn't "hit that shot". They were referring to a specific 3-point attempt, but I took it to mean he couldn't hit that shot ever. They are openly mocking Williams and Parker's inability to shoot.

337. what are some realistic scenarios saving us from 5 years of pierre? or even one full year..

I suspect we're stuck with Pierre for at least two years. And even after that he will not be easy to get rid of with that contract. I was really feeling good about most of the things Ned was doing until THIS signing. It's not just a matter of considering the Pierre signing bad. I considered it such a TERRIBLE signing that it completely shook my faith in him.

11 - apparently 60 feet 6 inches is what passes for a longball from Nomar these days.

A called strike three in a clutch situation. Guess it happens to everyone.

Somehow the Lakers played good defense and the Suns couldn't hit threes.

16 That was a really good pitch.

That last pitch was tragically beautiful.

Ugh. Or Ugly. Very frustrating game.

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the Juan.

I'll stop now.

14
I do not blame them.

22
JUANNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

23 - so if he weighs more than a duck, then he must have a glove made out of wood. And therefore...

10 , and, as capdodger also pointed out in the last thread,
And a story last week in USA Today reported that hybrids with carpool stickers are selling for as much as $4,000 more than those without the decals.

That's a pretty good return on an $8 investment (sticker fee.)

if anything we're still in first place.

Kevin Kennedy should have been a mortician. The man has dead eyes.

19,20

to Benitez credit he did pitch great during the series

This series seemed similar to the 2005 KC Royals sweep.

Hopefully the concluding results will be different.

10 Also, REGISTRATION CARD: Drivers are required to carry their hybrid sticker cards with them.

I don't remember receiving such a think with the stickers; now I have to do a search.

Shoulders should not be "crunchy".

31
I got one. It's in my glove compartment.

When was the last time a team didn't score against the Giants bullpen for an entire series?

34
Arizona didn't score against the Giants pen in their series last weekend.

Although I didn't like the Pierre signing from the get go, tonight's game will make everyone a Pierre hater. That dropped ball cost us the game and 0-5 killed us in the second hole.

Ah, getting swept at home by the Giants. There is nothing worse. Only the Laker victory is drowning my sorrows. Also, it was nice to see Eithier get a double and homer. Hopefully he can get that swing from last year going and remain in the lineup and Kemp can spell Pierre and Gonzo.

How long before Grittle shakes up the lineup? The top four hitters have combined to hit 2 homeruns so far. At the very least, Pierre should not be getting more PAs than Martin.

35 See, all the way back to four days ago.

Pythagorean Records:

SF 83-79
LA 104-58

What do the following have in common?

Brown
Drifert
Gagne
Schmidt

Drifert?

I did not see the game. Being objective, could/should the Pierre ball have been caught?

Wow that was pretty bad. Dreifort

42 - I think so. He got to it, it hit his glove, and I don't think it was out of his reach.

42 Being objective, I'd say it could have been caught but not necessarily should have. Much like the second hit off Kent's glove.

Pierre didn't take an obnoxiously bad route to the ball, but it certainly could have been better. He ran back, then to his right, instead of taking the shortest distance between point A and point B.

An good centerfielder makes that play. Juan Pierre didn't. Draw your conclusions from there.

40 None of them have ever been in my kitchen.

44 Your initial reaction was a lot stronger than that:)

44 IMO the ball was clearly out of his reach. It hit off the very end of his glove, with arm outstretched. The argument that the ball should have been caught rests entirely on the route he took to it. (It was a bad route, but at least he didn't run in at first like he often does.)

Let's not all blame Juan at once, since there was a ball off Kent's glove that was rather catchable, Nomar's failure to keep a ball in front of him, Betemit whiffing when a "mere" fly would have been nice, and then for the 2nd time this series Broxton comes in fails to shut the door.

Don't forget that Pierre probably missed the squeeze sign in the second.

I've only seen the Pierre drop once (and on replay at that), but I'm a purist. If it's a fly ball, if you can get your glove on it you ought to catch it.

Juan for Five also failed even to live up to his already unambitious nickname.

Little's showing alot of Tracy-like stubbornness by keeping Pierre in the 2 spot, despite Martin's hot start.

Its honestly similar to Beltre in 2006 hitting 7th for like 2-3 months, and Green continuing in cleanup--before Tracy finally moved Beltre up in the order.

Colletti needs to make a decision on Betemit. Either ride him out through May. Or cut bait now---Move Nomar to 3rd, bring up Loney. Or just bring up LaRoche.

Furcal not hitting, and Tomko/Hendrickson both in the rotation are my biggest concerns at the moment. Both of those things cant be good for the long term hopes of the Dodgers.

This is the most gut-wrenching loss of the young year so far. Given good defense and passable clutch hitting, we win that game 9-1.

36. Also, it was nice to see Eithier get a double and homer. Hopefully he can get that swing from last year going and remain in the lineup and Kemp can spell Pierre and Gonzo.

Ah, but that is one of the problems with this signing. When Kemp come back he is not going to spell Pierre or Gonzo. He is going to spell Ethier.

5 = Awesome.

Andrew S, re: last thread, did they look like the dudes in this guy's story?

http://www.dickbarrie.co.uk/baseball/usatrip.htm

(everything I have read about them says that yes they are indeed eminently likeable)

And is the Wolfman rocking the 2005 look yet?

http://www.the700level.com/2005/03/philadelphia_ph.html

Jon, if I have something to add to the Bonds debate in the next day or so, do you think it would be better to go back and post there or bring it up in whatever thread is active by then?

53 I would be disappointed if they gave up on Betemit before he has 150 or so plate appearances. After that, I'd be fine with cutting bait, but only if that involves moving Nomar to 3rd or calling up a hopefully hot LaRoche. If the solution is going to be trading a young guy for a Randa-type (and let's face it, that probably will be the solution), then count me out.

53. If you are going to move Juan don't you have to move Furcal? Furcal is stinkin up the joint far worse than JP.

Hmm... I just went over to the sidebar links to check how many ABs Betemit has so far this year, and apparently Jon has already beaten Colletti to the punch.

42 If I had not known it was Pierre, if it was one of my favorite all-time centerfielders, Kirby Puckett say, or Curt Flood, or Ken Griffey, Jr.... I would say he should have caught that ball. Especially in that situation.

My solution to the Juan Pierre problem is to bring back the ghost of Charles O. Finley to haunt Bud Selig until he is persuaded to expand rosters to 26, and allow for a designated runner.

My solution in two words: Herb Washington.

Furcal will get it going.
But it'd be nice if Little jumbled the lineup like:

Martin
Gonzalez
Nomar
Kent
Ethier
Furcal
Betemit
Pierre

Or bench Pierre, and play Clark everyday in the 8th spot.

57. I agree with Eric about 150 ABs for Betemit shuld answer our questions.

61. To my own suprise, I actually like that line up. Having said that, its still too early to panic. We are still in 1st and the season is only 20ish games old.

55

I know, but I'd at least like Eithier to make it a very tough decision. We need the Eithier from last year and right now he is clearly the best defensive outfielder we have in the starting lineup (I knew about Pierre's terrible arm, but the dropped balls from him and Gonzo are hard to watch). As for that flyball tonight, I suppose I shouldn't call it a drop, but a good center fielder would have had that ball no question and that was the game, although there are others that share the blame tonight.

56- More like this:

http://tinyurl.com/hzdgp

Pierre should have made the catch. While his route to the ball wasn't perfect, his biggest problem on that play was the fact that he ran a fair distance with his arm outstretched. Outfielders are normally taught not to reach for the ball until the last possible moment when attempting to make a catch on the run, thereby maintaining maximum running speed.

From Tony Jackson:

>>> Grady implied that Pierre had acknowledged the sign. But Pierre said he wasn't aware of any such acknowledgement mechanism. <<<

What in the world is going on here?

That's funny. Juan Pierre has level three (of twenty) security clearance. Funnier than when he dropped the ball over his fear of throwing, but not as funny as when he fell down, for no reason.

They pretty much have to tell us what the acknowledgment sign was, don't they? An ear tug? A nose scratch?

Despite his .585 OPS , Juan Pierre is currently on a pace to score 132 runs this season . That would break the LA Dodger team record of 130 runs scored by Maury Wills in 1962.

22 Instant classic!

Question: haven't noticed Bigbie in the 51s box scores lately. Hurt, or ?

What makes anyone think that the Dodgers haven't committed to Betemit as a lefty batter through May or whatever - that Colletti and Little have not made that decision? Except for Valdez's mini-hot streak, Betemit has played.

I strongly felt Pierre should have caught the ball - much more than I thought Kent should have caught his.

Das 411, you can comment on Bonds wherever.

As someone pointed out earlier, the real problem in the eighth was probably Beimel pitching to Durham instead of Broxton.

59 - That's an oversight on my part.

Koufax has been drafted:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2850886

I personally like the way Pierre and Betemit are playing. They are playing well enough for the Dodgers to win a decent percent of their games since the pitching has been good, but not so well that Kemp, Ethier, Loney do not have very good opportunities to take their jobs.

Kemp can play CF as well or better than Pierre and Nomar isn't hitting so well that if he were to move to third and got hurt Loney wouldn't have to do that much to replace his bat.

74 I think the outfield defense, especially Pierre, will start to weigh on the starting staff. Frip's right, too, I had to see it to believe it.

I know Pierre has some offensive moments, but I just can't help thinking "what if we had a real centerfielder?" At the moment I'd pull Ethier over and stick in Anderson.
I kept wanting to say, Jason Repko would've have gotten that.

Kobayashi Maru is great and will sorely test my resolve to never use derogatory nicknames instead of real names.

Pierre did have a great diving catch last night too though.

Just sayin'.

If Pierre hits .263/.283/.305, scores 132 runs and steals 59 bases (as he is on pace to do), would Ned consider that a successful season?

I'm saying "Yes".

75 - What am I right about? I didn't say anything. Don't freak me out like that.

77 - That would make him one of the worst everyday players in baseball and he would still probably get a few MVP votes.

74 - If what you a saying is that you think they are playing fine, but the results just aren't there yet and eventually the balls will start falling in... I can agree. But no way can you say that you like this level of performance. They are two of the worst hitters in baseball so far and Pierre compounds that by being mediocre to terrible in the outfield.

Betemit needs more time, I think he will be fine. Pierre's average should go up, but my opinion of him is unlikely to move. Imagine if instead of Pierre we suffered through this year with Kemp and then made a run at Andruw Jones?

JP's route to that drive didn't need to be perfect. Even with his somewhat winding route, he still got his glove to the ball. He just needed to run a route that was one stride shorter. The ball was in the air so long that Ethier managed to get close to the play before pulling up to let JP take it.

If Pierre really does hit that badly over an extended period of time, I would guess he would not be playing every day. Surely the Dodgers would bring up Kemp or somebody to share time at the very least? If he goes back to being within 80% of an average player, as he has the past few years, I think he stays and even convinces management that he is doing a good job. But if he is OPS+ of 56 like right now ... for much of a season ... the Dodgers would have to do something.

I don't know if I can take a full season of Pierre. God beer me strength.

I think Rob from 6-4-2 has it right. Pierre didn't make the play, but Beimel was left in for no good reason and ended up giving up the hit along with the game.

I also think we need to drop the Kemp in CF fantasies. Kemp is a corner, Pierre is going to be in CF every game, all year. Sad but true.

No Kemp in CF? Fine, then I will root for the Dodgers to call up Mitch Jones, who plays CF for the 51s. He has 6 HRs already, and is OPSing 1.02. As a bonus, he's Mormon and he grew up in Orem, UT.

this is my hello and goodbye i suppose. i've lurked here for a while, mostly to read nate & Canuck's prospect comments. i'll continue to lurk, only to read the baseball comments, but there's no point in posting anymore.

before reading this latest thread, i didn't even know pierre had dropped another fly ball. i turned off the t.v. in disgust after his failed squeeze bunt.

i was nuetral at first, but now it has become clear to me that juan pierre is one the worst baseball players i have ever seen. his speed and hit-for-contact skill set is barely adequate even if he's making all the easy plays on defense and performing his basic offensive duties (i.e., sacrificing). now that he's making what seems to be multiple mistakes per night, it is almost unbearable to watch.

Canuck expressed frustration a couple of days ago with our organizational insistence on blocking young talent, and i have to say that's exactly the point i've come to. loney is clearly getting the shaft; billingsley is too; even ethier is not getting the regular play he deserves.

we have kemp, loney, laroche, & abreu just waiting in AAA for an injury or a trade. at this point, the only dodger i truly enjoy watching play is russell martin.

the next move is colletti's . . .

Boy I sure picked the wrong game to make my return to dodger stadium. I was about 8 rows up just over the first base dugout.

1. Pierre should have caught that ball. Period. I used to think there is no way he would be benched, but there is no way any real baseball manager can watch that nighly. He will have to improve his defense or he has to go. Hitting aside.

2. No reason not to put Broxton in for Beimel after getting the double play.

3. Still in first at least after loosing 4 straight. That's just the type of year its going to be........................AGAIN

The frustration of watching Pierre drop that fly ball is not simply because it was an easy play, which it wasn't, but because when I'm watching him in the field I already know what a detriment he is to our offense. So when he botches plays defensively the anger just boils over, since it's perfectly reasonable to expect that a player that we signed to a high-price, long-term deal bring something positive to the table. If we can't hit, hit for power, or even bunt, then my rational mind tells me, "well, we must have signed this guy because he is one hell of a fielder." But my rational mind is disproven time and time again. I am bit prone to hyperbole, but if the Pierre situation doesn't improve markedly this contract will be one of the worst in Dodger history and will be a black mark on Colletti's resume that will be hard to hide.

86. The thing about Pierre is there is not voice on the other side. I think the best anyone can say or has said is that give him time and he might get back to being just not-very-good as opposed to the disaster he is now. Anyone out there think he might help this team be better?
As for blocking young talent, I don't think that is true or fair. With the exception of Pierre, there are no long term contracts blocking the path of young talent. Guys like LaRoche and Loney are extremely young and they will get their time soon enough. We have lots of young players already playing extremely important roles on this team. Don't forget, Russell Martin is a young player by any definition. Broxton is 22 and our set up man. Ethier will play as long as he hits. That's the same deal for ANY player his age. Same for Bills, he was given a chance to make the rotation. You don't hand it to kids this age, they have to earn it. If they do, there's nobody blocking them.

89
At the very least, it seems like Nomar is blocking Loney for 2 years.

One more point on this, both Kemp and Billingsley have been given chances to be permanent starters. They both failed to prove themselves and are now back in line for another chance. They deserve more chances and will get them but they were not blocked, they were given chances and didn't seize them.

90- That is the only example I think is fair. But let's wait and see. Fact is, things don't always dove tail perfectly. Nomar is good too.

91. As pointed out in a thread a couple of days ago, Billingsley did have a spring training that was at least as good as Tomko's, which coupled with his superior performance in the second half of last year leads me to ask you, how did he fail to prove himself to a be a starter this year?

100 Million on Pierre and Schmidt.
27 Million for Gonzo and Nomar

thats hard to hide too.

"Ethier will play as long as he hits. That's the same deal for ANY player his age. "

paging Mr. Loney.

92 You could argue that Billingsley couldn't possibly sustain success with a K/BB under one, but that would imply that Ned or Grady care about peripherals, which they've constantly demonstrated they don't. (Hendrickson, Mark)

94. Of course, you are correct, but I'm just curious as to a realistic justification that Dodger management could make with regards to Billingsley having failed to earn the starting job in spring training.

92. He has failed to prove that he has consistent command of his pitches. He has amazing stuff but can't control it. Just watch him. It was probably a close call out of spring training but not a crazy choice. There were options for what to do with Bills but not so much for Tomko. My guess is any falter from Tomko and step up from Bills would have won him the job. It hasn't happened yet. I look for Bills to be sent down soon if he doesn't find some command.

Despite the four losses, I believe that there is going to be minimal public outcry for Ned to make major changes. Most people will look at the fact that last week the team was 13-5 and had the best record in baseball.

I'm with the guys who are saying that major changes are needed to the lineup -- starting with Pierre -- but I'm not holding my breath.

Juan Pierre's K rate for the year is nearly double what it was last year (9.5% to 5.4%) and so I thought I would look when he had his 9th K last year. Turns out, Juan had his 10th K on the 20th game of the season last year (12.2 K rate) , but then had 28 Ks in the 617 at bats for the year (4.5%). Contact hitters who don't take walks and don't have power, can't strike out since you have to put the ball in play to get hits. Maybe Pierre needs time to adjust at the beginning of the year?

If A-rod can be moved down in the order, then certainly Pierre can be moved down.

"I pretty much directly affected this game in a bad way," said Pierre

at least he said it.

New post on top.

I watched the TiVo of the game early this morning after being out last night and now feel queasy as I head to work. Everyone here's pretty much said what I'd say about it. Pierre did make a nice diving grab on one ball, I'll give him that. As others have said, once he caught up to that Durham ball he should have caught it - wasn't easy but should've been had. (Shouldn't Ethier have had a play on it, too?) And yeah, Beimel shouldn't have been in there for that AB, though they'd been hitting Broxton pretty well this series. I actually would've brought in Tsao there, no questions asked. I hate to say it but I think Grady got outmanaged in that game. But besides the bizarro botched squeeze play (adding to the other baserunning miscues this series), just the simple fact that the Dodgers couldn't blow it open against a very shaky Ortiz was why they lost that game. 3 runs should have been 6 or 7, easily. They let him hang around and the Giants snuck back in, and they lost.

Probably the most frustrating loss of the past week, because they had so many chances to make it a win. Not a good game at all.

100 Kudos to Pierre for at least feeling bad. (In fairness to him, other players had opps in that game, too, to make things happen.)

Sigh, looking forward to going into work today to hear about the Giants 8 game winning streak from my coworker. Thanks Dodgers!

83 That was hilarious. Beer me strength indeed.

It is always bad getting swept by the Giants at home. It was made worse by the fact that neither Zito or Cain pitched in the series.

Out of the gate Pierre has fallen flat on his face. I agree with kinrote, I do not like watching Pierre play at all. His approach at the plate and his defense are just awful. It is early though so he does have a chance to turn it around.

Like last year the lack of power on this team allows for games like the ones we saw in this series. We just dont have anyone that can hit the homerun consistently (especially in the heart of our order). Game 2 is a perfect example of this.