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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

20-20 Vision for Martin
2007-06-20 07:50
by Jon Weisman

If I'm not mistaken, Russell Martin's current pace would just about make him the National League's first 20-20 catcher (in home runs and stolen bases, that is).

Ivan Rodriguez had 35 homers and 25 steals for Texas in 1999, but that's the only example, according to

With eight home runs and 11 stolen bases in the Dodgers' first 70 games, Martin is on pace to finish with 19 home runs and 25 stolen bases. Summer heat and more rest could slow down his production, but there's still more than a fighting chance.

* * *

Ideally, Chad Billingsley will be so efficient in his first start of the season Thursday that he throws 65 pitches spread evenly over six innings, hardly taxing himself before handing the game over to the Dodgers' late-inning relief.

But even a nice outing from Billingsley might force the Dodgers to rely on their bullpen for four or more innings Thursday. And that's without knowing how the exciting but still-developing Hong-Chih Kuo will do in his start tonight.

So, with no off days remaning until the All-Star Break, the Dodgers might need to replace a position player with a pitcher over the next 24 hours.

Who could come?

Though the possibilities aren't limited to the following, here are three principal candidates:

  • D.J. Houlton has a 3.73 ERA with AAA Las Vegas and 59 strikeouts in 70 innings. Houlton last pitched June 13.

  • Eric Hull, who got the no-action callup recently, has a 3.31 ERA with 39 strikeouts in 35 2/3 innings with Las Vegas. Hull threw 1 2/3 innings Sunday.

  • Jonathan Meloan has a 2.38 ERA with 50 strikeouts in 34 innings for AA Jacksonville. Meloan struck out the side in his one inning of work Sunday. The Suns have a pseudo-doubleheader scheduled today with the completion of a suspended game from Tuesday, followed by a seven-inning nightcap.

    Who could go?

  • Tony Abreu has 11 runs, 11 doubles and 11 strikeouts, but he could draw snake eyes with minor-league options remaining (and a .280 on-base percentage). That would leave Marlon Anderson as the backup second baseman and Wilson Betemit as the starting third baseman and backup shortstop.

  • On the heels of his ill-fated outfield adventure Sunday, James Loney's merging into the first-base position could be postponed. The disabled list seems unlikely, considering that Loney said he would be able to play this week, but another demotion isn't out of the question, even though Loney is 5 for 15 with a home run.

  • Matt Kemp has been sent down with a .400+ batting average before – why not again? Just so you know, if this happens, I'll shave my head – in my mind.

  • With an 86 OPS+, Andre Ethier is barely hanging onto playing time in right field - though if he went down, Anderson would be the fourth outfielder.

    What would I do?

    Meloan for Abreu. I'm just too eager to see what Meloan would do. But obviously, you'd like to see Hull actually get in a game, and I wouldn't mind Houlton get another shot at the bigs.

    What will the Dodgers do?
    I'll guess they do Hull for Loney. Or, they'll just gut it out with Hendrickson and Tomko and render this whole discussion moot.

  • Comments (181)
    Show/Hide Comments 1-50
    2007-06-20 11:21:34
    1.   blue22
    I don't think Meloan is on the 40-man. How would they reconcile that?
    2007-06-20 11:22:58
    2.   bluegold
    All this, thanks to Schmidt. Schmidt hurt the Dodgers when he was a Giant; and now he hurt the Dodgers when he is Dodger.
    2007-06-20 11:23:23
    3.   Humma Kavula
    1 Repko to the 60-day DL would do it, wouldn't it?
    2007-06-20 11:23:32
    4.   Eric Stephen
    Wow, there have only been 17 seasons of a catcher getting 20 steals, let alone HRs.

    The only ones to combine 20 SB with at least 10 HR are:

    Pudge II
    Jason Kendall twice (1998 & 2000; man he used to be good)
    Craig Biggio 1989
    John Stearns 1978
    Benito Santiago 1987

    2007-06-20 11:23:35
    5.   Greg Brock
    I'll guess they do Hull for Loney.


    2007-06-20 11:25:11
    6.   Eric Stephen
    1 The Dodgers only have 39 players on the 40-man roster currently.
    2007-06-20 11:25:31
    7.   blue22
    3 - That would do it, yes. I forgot about Repko (not the first time...)
    2007-06-20 11:27:07
    8.   blue22
    6 - This is correct as well. By-product of the Wilson Valdez move?
    2007-06-20 11:27:08
    9.   Bluebleeder87
    I'm just as geeked as you are about Meloan, i really hope we get to see him do his thing this year. Hear are some more #'s from Meloan.

    Jonathan M. Meloan #'s as of today.

    ERA 2.38
    W-L 5-2
    SAVES 12
    IP 34
    BB Allowed 13
    SO 50
    OPPONENT BA .147

    2007-06-20 11:27:17
    10.   Eric Enders
    Ah, the no-action call-up. Otherwise known as "The Jesus Martinez." Like Moonlight Graham, but worse.

    I'm guessing they gut it out with Tomrickson.

    2007-06-20 11:27:23
    11.   Eric Stephen
    Carlton Fisk, Pudge I, did manage to put up an amazing 37 HR, 17 SB season for the White Sox in 1985, when he was a mere 37 years old!!!
    2007-06-20 11:29:57
    12.   Eric Enders
    If we're talking about making a move later this week, perhaps it's an option to activate Tsao as well.
    2007-06-20 11:30:52
    13.   Humma Kavula
    There's another possibility: they could DFA Mark Handrickson and keep the same number of pitchers.

    Right now, Tomko and Hendrickson have the same role on the team. We only need one.

    It's a much riskier move and I don't think they'd do it, but it is an option and not out of the realm of possibility.

    2007-06-20 11:32:22
    14.   Eric Enders
    Zito's pitched one-third of an inning and the Giants are already losing 4-0 on a Billy Hall grand slam.
    2007-06-20 11:32:49
    15.   Bluebleeder87

    Wow, i think mother nature can't cough up players like that anymore. But in all honesty those stolen bases must have been on pretty lousy catchers & long dangly pitchers

    2007-06-20 11:34:17
    16.   Eric Enders
    15 The majority of Babe Ruth's home runs were off lousy pitchers. That doesn't change the fact that they're home runs.
    2007-06-20 11:34:38
    17.   regfairfield
    Hamulack can also go on the 60 day DL.
    2007-06-20 11:36:43
    18.   Jon Weisman
    A Dodger mentioned in a Top Outfield Arms story.

    Check the fine print.

    2007-06-20 11:36:46
    19.   ToyCannon
    Billy Hall, where has he been. He was my sleeper pick for MVP, followed by A Jones. Talk about being wrong, I feel like Joe Sheehan whenever he talks about the Angels.
    2007-06-20 11:38:02
    20.   Jon Weisman
    19 - But Marlon Anderson got his two hits :)
    2007-06-20 11:38:15
    21.   ToyCannon
    Abreu Down
    Riley Up
    Just for wiggles.
    2007-06-20 11:42:06
    22.   silverwidow
    22-Thankfully, Houlton is pitching tonight for Vegas. I never want to see him back up.
    2007-06-20 11:45:02
    23.   Xeifrank
    I don't think it really matters which of those three pitchers we'd call up. Of course it would be the most exciting if it was Meloan, but more likely Hull if any kind of move is made. It's probably more important, which player/hitter they would send down. It should be Abreu, but...
    vr, Xei
    2007-06-20 11:45:07
    24.   Humma Kavula
    22 OK, I'll bite. Houlton was never the greatest shakes, but he was a rule 5 pick and did OK all things considered. Why is he dead to you?
    2007-06-20 11:46:38
    25.   Jon Weisman
    22/24 - Plus, it's two years of development later.
    2007-06-20 11:48:36
    26.   silverwidow
    24-He had a bad attitude last year because he wasn't given another big league chance after his lousy 2005, then he went on to stink up Triple-A.
    2007-06-20 11:51:11
    27.   Jon Weisman
    26 - Evidence of this bad attitude?
    2007-06-20 11:51:32
    28.   Linkmeister
    Victorino fits the "had we only known we'd need a rightfielder" category, since we had him until Rule 5 (I think).

    I get to see highlights of his play nearly every night, since he's one of four current "Big League Bruddahs," as our local sportscaster likes to call Hawai'i-born players in The Show.

    2007-06-20 11:52:10
    29.   Humma Kavula
    26 / 27

    From a lvrj article in April:

    Drinking a bottle of Corona after the game, Houlton showed no sign of a bitter beer face Tuesday.

    "I was just frustrated not going up and not getting a chance last year," he said. "I kind of had a bad attitude. It was tough to come here and I was struggling, and it all snowballed on me.

    "I tried to come in here with a positive attitude, and it's working for me."

    2007-06-20 11:52:29
    30.   Xeifrank
    Video/Scouting report of Chris Withrow (#20 pick) at Hardball Times. vr, Xei
    2007-06-20 11:52:53
    31.   silverwidow

    2007-06-20 11:53:03
    32.   Humma Kavula
    Forgot to add my question after posting 29...

    ...if Houlton is the pitcher best-suited to help the Dodgers -- and I'm not saying that he is -- how long should the team hold that bad attitude against him?

    2007-06-20 11:57:22
    33.   ToyCannon
    About as long as they held Loney's against him. Which hopefully was zero since everyone has the right to be mad when sucked from the awesomeness of the big league life into the vortex of dispair that is minor league life.
    2007-06-20 11:57:28
    34.   GS Allen
    If Chin-hui Tsao has a good throwing session today, couldn't he be another pitching possibility? My guess is Tsao will be reactivated tomorrow with Loney going back down.
    2007-06-20 11:59:40
    35.   Eric Stephen
    All this talk of needing a 12th pitcher is a waste of time. Everyone knows Chad Billingsley will strike out the first 21 hitters on 63 pitches, then get pulled with an 0-2 count on Troy Glaus in the 8th.

    Luckily, Marlon Anderson will have provided the Dodger offense with 2 HR.

    2007-06-20 11:59:53
    36.   Humma Kavula
    If Loney goes back down, I say we all chip in and send him a care package. Talk about getting jobbed.
    2007-06-20 12:01:49
    37.   PHilldodger
    34 - Tsao hasn't pitched in a game since May 19. Not sure you want to put him in major leagues games until he's had the opportunity to pitch on a rehab assigment, see how his arm bounces back the day after pitching, etc.
    2007-06-20 12:02:53
    38.   Eric Stephen
    "Bad attitude" is one of those labels you can spin and pin on anyone.

    Who wouldn't or shouldn't be angry if they got sent down? If it's a player valued highly by the organization (a la Loney), he gets praised for having fire and will, etc. But if it's a player not as highly valued (Guzman), he's got a questionable attitude.

    2007-06-20 12:04:56
    39.   Linkmeister
    Jon, I'm having trouble reaching the ScreenJam site. I get the following error:

    Firefox can't find the server at

    2007-06-20 12:05:18
    40.   D4P
    If you like a player, getting mad about being sent down is interpreted as "Fire" and "Desire to win".

    If you don't like him, getting mad about being sent down is "Pouting" and "A bad attitude."

    2007-06-20 12:05:59
    41.   Eric Stephen
    I think Loney will be the one sent down, if only for the reason that Betemit would be the only 3B left on the roster if Abreu was sent down (I don't think they will play Saenz or Nomar at 3B, and Lucille II isn't due back yet).
    2007-06-20 12:07:48
    42.   heato
    per ItD...

    Furcal, SS
    Pierre, CF
    Nomar, 1B
    Kent, 2B
    Gonzalez, LF
    Martin, C
    Saenz, DH
    Betemit, 3B
    Ethier, RF

    2007-06-20 12:08:14
    43.   Jon Weisman
    39 - Me too.

    29 - That quote would not seem to justify someone burying Houlton in the minors or holding a grudge against him.

    2007-06-20 12:10:10
    44.   Humma Kavula
    43 I agree. That's why I posted it.
    2007-06-20 12:10:19
    45.   trainwreck
    No Kemp again?
    2007-06-20 12:11:22
    46.   robohobo
    32. I think Houlton struggled last year because he was still developing as a pitcher. He had some good games last year but was very inconsistent, like with the Dodgers in '05. I saw him pitch last year against the Rivercats (As AAA) and he dominated. He struck out double figures (Milton Bradley 3 times) and threw a great game. This year he seems to have found some level of consistency (which is more than one can say about Tomko/ Hedrickson). Houlton has pitched well since spring training. He's not going to be a great pitcher but I would like to see him get another chance with some team somewhere.
    2007-06-20 12:12:18
    47.   ToyCannon
    Didn't realize that Schmidt is having his exploratory surgery today, so we should have results tonight. I'm hoping they find something so we can get it fixed and get him ready for next year.
    2007-06-20 12:13:40
    48.   Doctor
    I can't believe even with a DH we can't get Kemp some starts. I know he looks bad yesterday, but lets trot him out there 3 or 4 days in a row and see what we have. Maybe they know something....
    2007-06-20 12:14:41
    49.   PHilldodger
    45- Seems odd that no Kemp. Halladay's actually has (slightly) better splits against lefties this year. Oh well.
    2007-06-20 12:16:57
    50.   bhsportsguy
    Also, ITD states that Brady Clark cleared waivers so he gets approx 900K from the Dodgers that they owe him for the rest of the 2007 season plus whatever amount he sign's for as a free agent with another club.
    Show/Hide Comments 51-100
    2007-06-20 12:18:29
    51.   Humma Kavula
    I find it hard to believe that Brady Clark can't help some major league team.
    2007-06-20 12:20:49
    52.   silverwidow
    The only reason why Houlton played a role for the 2005 club is because our legit prospects weren't ready. Besides, he doesn't exactly have the kind of stuff to be complaining about not being called-up.
    2007-06-20 12:21:31
    53.   Eric Stephen
    51 It's not that Clark can't help some other team, it's that they didn't want to claim him and be on the hook for his pro-rated $3.8m salary. Now that he's cleared waivers, the Dodgers (and Brewers) are paying Clark, and an interested team can pick up Clark for a pro-rated minimum salary.
    2007-06-20 12:24:43
    54.   Eric Enders
    Until yesterday, either Kemp or Loney had started every game since their callup. Now, for the second day in a row,
    neither of them starts.

    Reports of the newfound enlightenment of Dodger management have, apparently, been highly exaggerated.

    2007-06-20 12:25:11
    55.   Bluebleeder87

    there's some people that think Alex Rios has a "Cannon" arm & he isn't even mentioned on that peace, he probably has an above average/accurate arm, cause i saw him live & he didn't impress me much.

    2007-06-20 12:26:35
    56.   Humma Kavula
    52 [first sentence] That's true. He was a Rule 5 pick who was asked to hold together the back end of the rotation. As to whether or not he succeeded... YMMV, but I would bet (have not looked it up) that with an ERA+ of 80, he wasn't too far behind the league-average fifth starter. WHich is to say: not very good, but neither were the people he should be compared to.

    [second sentence] That's true, too. He shouldn't have complained. He's acknowledged that and tried to have a better attitude. He is also pitching better and has had two more years of development.

    2007-06-20 12:28:19
    57.   Eric Stephen
    50 I'm not questioning you, bhsportsguy; I'm asking because I don't know...

    Doesn't the amount Brady Clark signs for with his new team (probably a pro-rated minimum of $380k, or about $225k) get deducted from the amount owed him by the Dodgers?

    Clark was due $3.8m this year. The Dodgers are paying him, but also received $2.1m from Milwaukee (I'm not sure if they paid LA or if they pay Clark as well...I would think they pay LA and let the Dodgers deal with paying Clark). There is about $2.25m (roughly) due Clark for the remainder of the season. I think the $225k or so Clark receives from his next team will be deducted from that remaining salary.

    2007-06-20 12:28:51
    58.   overkill94
    I could see the Dodgers wanting to audition Meloan for the 7th inning job and thus calling him up to see what he can do. If he turns out to be the answer, I could see a trade/DFA including Hendrickson or Tomko.
    2007-06-20 12:29:18
    59.   bhsportsguy
    54 Let's give it a couple of days, part of this may be to give Anderson and Saenz a chance to get some extra at bats with the DH in play.
    2007-06-20 12:32:22
    60.   bhsportsguy
    57 I frankly don't know but the Dodgers did not trade his rights, they cut him but owe him the guaranteed part of his salary as does the Brewers, who owe him for the part they agreed to pay when they acquired Dessens in the deal.

    So my guess would be that if Clark signs with another team, whatever amount he gets does not affect what the other two teams owe him for the rest of 2007.

    2007-06-20 12:32:38
    61.   Doctor

    Neither started yesterday and we hung 10 runs (mostly) on a pretty decent starter, I feel like that's not going to help the cause. Its pretty frustrating, im curious what those guys will do with playing time.

    2007-06-20 12:43:57
    62.   bhsportsguy
    Also, there are the beginning of a 20 game stretch with no off days, flying to Toronto, down to Tampa and then to Phoenix before settling into LA for a 10 game homestand.

    When we get back to LA and still Kemp/Loney are not playing much, that will not fall in line with what Ned/Grady said last week but for now, I just think Grady is trying to spread out some time, see what Ethier can do, and give a couple at bats to some of his bench guys like Anderson and Saenz.

    2007-06-20 12:49:12
    63.   MC Safety
    did this wole ItD/ Jon Weisman imitation thing stem from a depo debate gone bad?
    2007-06-20 12:51:12
    64.   Xeifrank
    Grand slam by Molina, gets the Giants back in the game. 6-4 Brewers ahead.
    vr, Xei
    2007-06-20 12:52:22
    65.   ToyCannon
    I'd rather see what Kemp can do since we already had a few months of seeing what Ethier can do. Our RF is batting 9th, nuff said.
    2007-06-20 12:53:38
    66.   ToyCannon
    Disgruntled poster who was banned and decided to act like a spoiled child.
    2007-06-20 12:54:08
    67.   ToyCannon
    Bengie Molina has stealth speed.
    2007-06-20 12:55:58
    68.   Eric Stephen
    60 I think the most Brady Clark can earn this year is $3.8m. Any amount he receives from his new team will be deducted from the amount owed him by the Dodgers.

    I found an article for the poster boy for MLB severance pay, Griddle favorite Russ Ortiz.

    From the article, "The Giants snagged him this winter after watching him pitch in Puerto Rico. They have to pay him only the minimum $380,000 salary, including a $3,000 monthly housing allowance. The remainder of his $7.5 million salary is being paid by the Diamondbacks."

    2007-06-20 13:03:16
    69.   bhsportsguy
    65 Not disagreeing with you but its only been two games.
    2007-06-20 13:05:56
    70.   Bluebleeder87
    just peaked over & saw the line up on ItD, i dig it it's better than yesterdays that's for sure, i'd love to see Kemp in there though, hopefully tomorrow.
    2007-06-20 13:08:12
    72.   Bluebleeder87

    Bengie Molina & Sal Fassano are long lost brothers i'm convinced of that.

    2007-06-20 13:10:47
    73.   Bluebleeder87

    the end of Jons last thread had some stuff on it.

    2007-06-20 13:10:59
    74.   Jon Weisman
    71 - Yes, there has, and it's also on The Griddle.
    2007-06-20 13:10:59
    75.   trainwreck
    Barrett has been a productive offensive catcher last few years. Good trade for Pads, because they did not give up much at all for him.
    2007-06-20 13:12:07
    76.   MC Safety
    66- ah i figured as much, geez we all know 05' was bad but thats quite a grudge.
    2007-06-20 13:12:53
    77.   Hythloday
    71 - Check out the previous thread.

    I think the general consensus is that people hope Barrett catches every day and alienates the entire pitching staff.

    2007-06-20 13:13:27
    78.   El Lay Dave
    72 Doesn't Bengie already have enough brothers? ;)
    2007-06-20 13:16:16
    79.   Jon Weisman
    JoeyP, would you like the Dodgers to win the World Series in 2007?
    2007-06-20 13:17:18
    80.   Jon Weisman
    79 - P.S.: It's not a trick question.
    2007-06-20 13:18:35
    81.   MC Safety
    i didnt know there were multiple chambers to this fine blog. i was not aware of these things called screen jam and the griddle.
    2007-06-20 13:19:14
    82.   still bevens
    71 We concluded that we do not approve of anything done by the San Diego Padres and wish that they would lose ballgames; which they seem unwilling to do.
    2007-06-20 13:19:48
    83.   MC Safety
    ouch jason wood three run job off bobby jenks to put the marlins up 4-2.
    2007-06-20 13:20:15
    84.   Doctor
    That blog is borderline creepy.
    2007-06-20 13:21:57
    85.   Hythloday
    81 - speaking of screen jam-- and totally OT-- there was a thread about most quotable movies and i had to think about it, but realized that there were two I quoted most often: Goldmember and Army of Darkness. Not willingly necessary, but I can't help speaking freaky deaky Dutch.

    Also as someone else mentioned. I haven't been able to access it the past couple days.

    2007-06-20 13:22:45
    86.   regfairfield
    79 Wouldn't you have to pay yourself if he said yes?
    2007-06-20 13:25:51
    87.   Bluebleeder87
    because they did not give up much at all for him.

    they also get a supplemental pick from what i've read, i don't know i really feel the Pads fans are gonna be pucking at his defensive skills/or lack there of.

    2007-06-20 13:26:25
    88.   Jon Weisman
    86 - Nah, it'd be some guy with a different e-mail address paying me.
    2007-06-20 13:26:33
    89.   Bob Timmermann
    Which blog is borderline creepy?
    If it's The Griddle, I'll try to push it fully into the creepy category.
    2007-06-20 13:26:41
    90.   capdodger
    79 Wait a sec.... You can't play in your "own" contest!!!
    2007-06-20 13:27:05
    91.   Jon Weisman
    In the L.A. Times Dodger mailbag, someone asked about the possibility of a Wilson Betemit for Miguel Cabrera trade.
    2007-06-20 13:30:10
    92.   Doctor

    Inside Dodgers on, I feel bad for Josh who either doens't have time or doesnt want to babysit.

    2007-06-20 13:30:13
    93.   Curtis Lowe
    91 - Make it happen! ...
    2007-06-20 13:30:18
    94.   capdodger
    81 I've been looking for the chamber that leads to The Grotto. I'm told it's a link off of Bronx Banter...
    2007-06-20 13:34:37
    95.   StolenMonkey86
    91 - "Well, that wouldn't be an easy trade through, er, traditional means. Now, if you try kidnapping his family, holding a gun to his head, or maybe even flat-out bribery, it might work."
    2007-06-20 13:39:16
    96.   Curtis Lowe
    Why can't a team just trade a boat load of cash for a player?
    2007-06-20 13:41:16
    97.   regfairfield
    96 I don't think there's anything specifically stopping you from doing that, but someone like Miguel Cabrera would cost something like 100 million dollars. I don't know if any team is willing to do that.
    2007-06-20 13:41:31
    98.   scareduck
    91 - that's a "Dodger Talk"-level trade hypothetical. Good lord, are people really that stupid? Yes. Yes, some of them are.
    2007-06-20 13:44:26
    99.   Humma Kavula
    "Hmm, the Yankees need pitching. What about Hendrickson and Tomko for A-Rod and Giambi?"
    2007-06-20 13:44:52
    100.   bluegold
    96. Colletti came close...traded a boat load of money for a player who can't physically play.
    Show/Hide Comments 101-150
    2007-06-20 13:45:13
    101.   regfairfield
    98 It's amazing how many people don't realize Miguel Cabrera is, at worst, one of the five best players in baseball. I remember after that whole talking with Omar Minaya non-incident seeing comments like "No way would I want him, he gives up more runs with his glove than he drives in", and "He'd look really good hitting 6th for the Mets.

    Then again, apparently most Twins fans wouldn't trade Torii Hunter for A-Rod, so nothing really should surprise me.

    2007-06-20 13:46:59
    102.   Curtis Lowe
    97 - I would do it.
    2007-06-20 13:49:17
    103.   bhsportsguy
    96 Commissioner's office has to approve any deals where more than $1 million is exchanged between teams.

    And there is no way MLB would ever approve a cash for player move.

    2007-06-20 13:49:20
    104.   El Lay Dave
    97 Bowie Kuhn would, from the grave, invoke the best interests of baseball clause and void the deal.
    2007-06-20 13:49:54
    105.   scareduck
    96, 97 - trades involving cash over a certain amount (I think it's $1M, something ridiculously low these days) have to go through the commissioner's office. For a top-notch player, this is almost an automatic pass, but there are occasions where the trade has been nixed. An example of this (and if I remember right, the precedent) was then-commissioner Bowie Kuhn nixing Vida Blue's trade to the Reds, along with Dave Revering, for the then-astronomical sum of $1.75M.
    2007-06-20 13:50:23
    106.   Jon Weisman
    We could buy the Marlins, release Cabrera, then sell the Marlins. Maybe even get a tax deduction out of it.
    2007-06-20 13:50:40
    107.   Hythloday
    I find it easy to spend $100M when I barely have $1k.
    2007-06-20 13:50:50
    108.   Humma Kavula
    102 You'd also better be prepared to spend another $100 million right away on Cabrera himself... If it were me, I might feel funny about the fact that my former employer was getting paid $33 million a year for the rights to my services, while I get a fraction of that. The only way to make it right would be to immediately offer me a huge contract.

    So, yeah, $100 million for the rights to the player, plus $100 million for the player himself right off the bat.

    2007-06-20 13:52:07
    109.   Hythloday
    We could also just bribe Cabrera to insult Loria publicly. That seems to work as well. Would that be tampering?
    2007-06-20 13:52:41
    110.   Bob Timmermann
    That's very 19th Century of you. Why don't the Dodgers just go operate two teams and put all the good players on one and leave the bad ones on the other.

    Gave the Dodgers back-to-back pennants in 1899 and 1900.

    2007-06-20 13:53:07
    111.   Bluebleeder87

    he doesn't have a great glove he has a serviceable glove. He more than makes up for it with his bat, he made 2 or 3 really nice plays when we played against the Marlins a while back.

    2007-06-20 13:53:13
    112.   scareduck
    106 - the Las Vegas Marlins of Florida?
    2007-06-20 13:53:24
    113.   Curtis Lowe
    106 - I was thinking the same thing.


    2007-06-20 13:53:33
    114.   Humma Kavula
    101 Out of curiosity... if Cabrera is, at worst, the fifth-best player in baseball, who do you take over him?
    2007-06-20 13:54:56
    115.   El Lay Dave
    114 ARod.
    2007-06-20 13:55:34
    116.   Bluebleeder87
    i've said in the past i'd walk 100 feet with my hands if the Dodgers work something out with the Marlins.
    2007-06-20 13:57:05
    117.   regfairfield
    114 Depends on how you want to phrase the question. If you're talking about ability today, I would only take Pujols and maybe A-Rod ahead of him. For future value, I could see arguments for Pujols, Mauer, Sizemore, and Reyes.
    2007-06-20 13:57:12
    118.   scareduck
    114 - A-Rod. Pujols. Johan Santana. Vlad Guerrero.
    2007-06-20 13:57:21
    119.   Humma Kavula
    Okay, ARod.

    somebody from middle infield - maybe Utley?

    Who else?

    2007-06-20 13:58:41
    120.   El Lay Dave
    B-R's Similar Batters for Cabrera, through age 23 (* = HOFer):

    1. Hank Aaron (959) *
    2. Orlando Cepeda (933) *
    3. Frank Robinson (925) *
    4. Joe Medwick (920) *
    5. Mickey Mantle (914) *
    6. Ken Griffey (907)
    7. Andruw Jones (907)
    8. Hal Trosky (905)
    9. Vladimir Guerrero (900)
    10.Al Kaline (900) *

    2007-06-20 14:01:05
    121.   ToyCannon
    Isn't that how the Japanese posting system works? You have to pay the Japanese corporation 50Mill for the right to sign the player for 50Mill/5 years. So while the smaller teams can post for the scraps/bargains like Iwamura, Boston/NY will fight amoung themselves for the elite talent which was no different in the old days before the draft was instituted and you had the bonus babies. Or am I way off on this?
    2007-06-20 14:01:49
    122.   bigcpa
    116 That's all you'd do? I'd walk 100 feet on my hands for a free carwash.
    2007-06-20 14:02:41
    123.   Humma Kavula
    120 Pretty great list. Eight HOFers (or surefire HOFers), plus Andruw Jones, plus poor Hal Trosky.
    2007-06-20 14:03:56
    124.   Bluebleeder87
    i saw him play winter ball (t.v.) & i kind of question his work ethic, but i'm sure we can work something out in the contract.
    2007-06-20 14:04:39
    125.   GoBears
    I had a dream a couple of mornings ago that the Dodgers traded Kemp, Billingsley, Loney, Kuo, and Ethier for Cabrera.


    I logged on to DT, and the first post I saw was natepurcell, who wrote: "gipped." It occurred to me that that was misspelled, but I woke up before I could express my own outrage.

    I love Cabrera as much as the next guy (unless the next guy is Greg Brock) but I don't think trading the best 20% of the projected 2008 team would be a particularly smart move. It all seemed so real!

    2007-06-20 14:06:14
    126.   Bluebleeder87

    walking with your hands is very difficult bigcpa, i applaud you if you can walk more.

    2007-06-20 14:07:57
    127.   JoeyP
    So, yeah, $100 million for the rights to the player, plus $100 million for the player himself right off the bat.

    Isnt that what essentially happened with Dice-K?

    2007-06-20 14:08:34
    128.   ToyCannon
    I wonder how many of them gained 50 lbs from 21 to 23 years old. I love Miggy's bat but at best he's a 1st baseman and probably a DH by 25. That has to be taken into account that this guy just isn't taking care of himself. The bat will travel but if I'm trading the future for his future I want a guy a little more dedicated to his craft.
    2007-06-20 14:11:41
    129.   bigcpa
    126 I guess I was picturing hands & knees. I'm unable to do just hands.
    2007-06-20 14:11:52
    130.   Humma Kavula
    127 Yes, except it was half that amount. $50 million or so to the Lions, $50 million to Daisuke.
    2007-06-20 14:15:14
    131.   Eric Stephen
    116,122 For some reason this reminds me of the "What would you do for a Klondike Bar?" commercials. I think it's clear future Dodger Miguel Cabrera shall adopt the nickname "Klondike" when the trade happens.

    Walking on your hands sounds really, really painful.

    2007-06-20 14:15:49
    132.   Hythloday
    128 - I want a guy who poses on the cover of ESPN the Magazine in his rookie year with two chicks at the same time. Because if I had a million dollars that's what I'd do. That's dedication.
    2007-06-20 14:17:03
    133.   ToyCannon
    A million dollars doesn't buy what it used to.
    2007-06-20 14:17:57
    134.   scareduck
    132 - nice "Office Space" ref.
    2007-06-20 14:18:37
    135.   Hythloday
    It doesn't buy the player or the two chicks at the same time?
    2007-06-20 14:19:04
    136.   Humma Kavula
    Diedrich Bader is brilliant. That is all.
    2007-06-20 14:20:34
    137.   Hythloday
    136 - It runs in the family; his brother is a political science professor at UCLA (or was back in the day. I'm not sure where he is at now.)
    2007-06-20 14:20:35
    138.   Bob Timmermann
    I had a dream last night that I was talking to Patrick Ewing near my local grocery store and he was wearing a Tennessee Titans uniform and said he was only stopping to chat because he had to go and run a pass pattern.

    I think I'm batting a virus however.

    2007-06-20 14:22:24
    139.   Bluebleeder87
    Walking on your hands sounds really, really painful.

    that was my claim to fame in elemantary school, i also did some sick back flips.

    2007-06-20 14:22:38
    140.   Eric Stephen
    138 Was Ewing wearing the fake glasses to make himself look smarter like he did as a players union rep during the NBA lockout?
    2007-06-20 14:25:06
    141.   ssjames
    Anybody care to guess what the following players all have in common:

    Hong-chih Kuo
    James Loney
    Randy Wolf
    Jason Schmidt
    Juan Pierre
    Andy Laroche
    Rudy Seanez
    Mike Lieberthal
    Brett Tomko
    Wilson Valdez
    Mark Hendrickson

    2007-06-20 14:25:31
    142.   Bluebleeder87
    i went by the nickname little Bruce Lee.
    2007-06-20 14:29:47
    143.   GoBears
    137 136 - It runs in the family; his brother is a political science professor at UCLA (or was back in the day. I'm not sure where he is at now.)

    Huh? Diedrich Bader's brother? Not that I know of. You sure you have that right?

    2007-06-20 14:35:18
    144.   natepurcell
    is James Mcdonald a top 100 prospect?
    2007-06-20 14:35:37
    145.   Hythloday
    I was in the UCDC program in 97 (with UCSC) and he was a professor in DC at the time. I tried looking it up just now and it may be John Bader. I could be wrong, but that was my understanding at the time.
    2007-06-20 14:37:13
    146.   Curtis Lowe
    144 - I heard about him at the game on saturday, before that I have never heard of him, what's his deal Nate? Canuck?
    2007-06-20 14:40:12
    147.   ToyCannon
    I think we need more then 1/2 a year to know for sure but I think he's one of our top 10 these days.
    2007-06-20 14:40:29
    148.   Bluebleeder87

    i've only heard Nate mention his name so i'm thinking he has some pretty good #'s were ever he is playing.

    2007-06-20 14:42:25
    149.   natepurcell

    tall lanky right hander who has pitched full time for only a couple of years. dodgers drafted him in 2002, signed almost a year later as a draft and follow after going to CC for a year. played outfield in the system, couldnt hack it, dodgers moved him to pitching. last year in low a was his first full year at pitching and showed alot of promise (nice k rate) and hes having a breakout year in high A this year at the age of 22. I think overkill saw him pitch earlier in the year and said he was throwing 90-92 with the fb with a plus slurve breaking pitch or something.

    2007-06-20 14:43:21
    150.   natepurcell
    if i worked out the rotation schedule right, i think mcdonald is pitching at home on sunday. if he isnt promoted or anything, i'll probably attend the game.
    Show/Hide Comments 151-200
    2007-06-20 14:43:43
    151.   GoBears
    145. Oh yeah, that name sounds familiar. He was never a ladder faculty member at UCLA proper but was permanently stationed (seconded?) to the UCDC program. It's a unique arrangement, as far as I know. We have someone else in that job now, so I also don't know what happened to Bader.

    Wild coincidence. I think I met him all of once. Was he a funny guy? I hope he's doing well, wherever he may be.

    2007-06-20 14:44:33
    152.   Curtis Lowe
    149 - Interesting, is being projected as a starter or long relief guy?
    2007-06-20 14:46:09
    153.   Dodgers49
    125. I had a dream a couple of mornings ago that the Dodgers traded Kemp, Billingsley, Loney, Kuo, and Ethier for Cabrera.

    It would appear you're not the only one who is dreaming. :-)

    Cabrera in Dodger Blue? It's a longshot and would be expensive

    >>> If the Marlins traded Cabrera, they probably would want three top young players, and they always love pitchers. Figure three from the group of Chad Billingsley, Jonathan Broxton, Kemp, Loney, Andre Ethier, Tony Abreu, Andy LaRoche and Clayton Kershaw. <<<

    2007-06-20 14:46:12
    154.   natepurcell

    well, hes starting now so hopefully a starter. but its still too early, we would need to see how he does in the upper minors first.

    2007-06-20 14:49:39
    155.   natepurcell
    James Mcdonald also leads the CAL league in Ks with 84. the next best is padre lefty wade leblanc with 83...but it took him 12 more innings to get his number.
    2007-06-20 14:51:15
    156.   ToyCannon
    If I could take any 3 from that group then I couldn't say goodbye fast enough to Ethier/Abreu/Broxton.
    2007-06-20 14:51:21
    157.   Hythloday
    151 - Professors became a lot funnier when I became a grad student. So I can't say what he was like in private. I was only there for a semester. As I recall he was a nice guy, but not 'two chicks at the same time' funny. I didn't realize that he was dedicated to the UCDC program.
    2007-06-20 14:53:04
    158.   bhsportsguy
    146 Drafted in the 11th round in the 2002 draft, signed as a draft and follow in 2003. Went to Long Beach Wilson High and Golden West CC, turned 22 last October.

    2003 - Pitched in GCL
    2004 - Played OF in GCL
    2005 - Played OF in Ogden/Rookie, pitched in 4 games
    2006 - Pitched in Columbus/South Atlantic League
    2007 - Pitching in Inland Empire/Cal League

    Minor League Pitching States before this season:
    7-14 197 IP 3.75 ERA, 9.2K/3.8BB ratio

    2007 Stats:
    5-5 68.2 IP 3.54 ERA 11K/2.3BB ratio

    2007-06-20 14:53:33
    159.   MC Safety
    146- he is also a local kid. he graduated from long beach poly.
    2007-06-20 14:53:55
    160.   Eric Stephen
    156 I would certainly trade Ethier, Abreu, and Broxton for Cabrera as well. But, I'm curious...are you down on Broxton, et al, or really high on Cabrera? Or both?

    The "couldn't say goodbye fast enough" threw me off a little.

    2007-06-20 14:55:19
    161.   ToyCannon
    I love Broxton but he's a relief pitcher and no relief pitcher should get in the way of a hitter like Miggy.
    2007-06-20 14:56:28
    162.   blue22
    160 - Broxton is a max 80 IP guy now. Ethier and Abreu are borderline throw-ins at this point, so if Broxton is the primary centerpiece of a Cabrera trade, consider it done.
    2007-06-20 14:59:40
    163.   bhsportsguy
    BTW - anyone notice yesterday that both Kershaw and McDonald were the winning pitchers in their respective league's All-Star games.

    Kershaw gave up a homer but was the pitcher of record (for the one inning he pitched) when his teammates scored the winning runs.

    Both pitchers only pitched one inning so they should be affected for their next start.

    If they want to start McDonald in the first game in Lancaster (shall we all drive to Lancaster for the 4th of July) (which will decide who won the first half for their division), then Sunday is the day they would start McDonald if they are on a 5-man rotation.

    2007-06-20 15:00:54
    164.   JoeyP
    162--I also agree.
    The only "untouchables" should be Kemp/Billingsley.

    Abreu/Ethier/Loney are not impressive IMO.
    Broxton is good but just a reliever.
    Elbert's hurt.
    LaRoche's hurt.
    DeWitt's a bust.

    2007-06-20 15:01:56
    165.   Bluebleeder87
    i'm suprised Bob hasn't mentioned it but Byrnes is a triple away from the cycle. the D-Backs lead the D-Rays 7-4 in the 7th.
    2007-06-20 15:03:26
    166.   blue22
    164 - Clayton Kershaw is an untouchable too, right? Gotta be.
    2007-06-20 15:03:34
    167.   Xeifrank
    141. None of them have ever been in Bob's kitchen?
    vr, Xei
    2007-06-20 15:05:29
    168.   Hythloday
    165 - I forget is that an orange alert?
    2007-06-20 15:06:50
    169.   natepurcell
    its nice that martin has elevated himself beyond trade rumor status. now hopefully billingsley and kemp will soon follow.
    2007-06-20 15:12:25
    170.   Eric Stephen
    141,167 I'm completely stumped as to what those players have in common.
    2007-06-20 15:14:38
    171.   blue22
    170 - Well, there are seemingly many, many things they have in common, considering they are all members of the 2007 club. Which one of them is the poster actually referring to?
    2007-06-20 15:14:40
    172.   Bob Timmermann
    Yellow alert is when you need a triple.

    Wilson Valdez was in my kitchen once. He works as a plumber in the offseason.

    2007-06-20 15:15:30
    173.   goofus
    Substitute LaRoche for Broxton in that trade and throw in Hendrickson, he's cheap enough for them to take.
    2007-06-20 15:15:38
    174.   Nagman
    170 I'm guessing they are the players he would package for Cabrera, but I'm not sure that's enough. Oh wait, Loney might put it over the top.
    2007-06-20 15:16:01
    175.   MC Safety
    james mcdonalds dad was our coach i little league majors. boy is he a beast of a man. iirc, he was a prospect in the white sox org, but the injury bug bit him pretty good. ill always credit his dad for teaching me to catch. james used to have some nasty breaking stuff in little league, im talkin three quarters with kids spinning and ducking out of the way left and right. he was the epitome of the effective wild guy back then, id love to see him pitch nowadays. i never faced him in HS unfortunately.
    2007-06-20 15:19:47
    176.   MC Safety
    james , if your reading this somewhere get at your boy SNACK SHACK!!!
    2007-06-20 15:20:49
    177.   ToyCannon
    Was thinking of hitting the 7/5 game. I have a friend going to the Lancaster game this Friday so he's going to give me the rundown of the stadium.
    2007-06-20 15:23:42
    178.   DodgerBakers
    ...And Byrnes grounds out to pitcher.
    2007-06-20 15:25:15
    179.   Jon Weisman
    Game thread on.
    2007-06-20 15:25:40
    180.   ToyCannon
    Cool, I always hoped someone I played with would make it but no one did. AA was the highest anyone made it. Let's hope McDonald passes that barrier.

    My niece hung out with Freddy Sanchez from Burbank HS which is why my family always roots for him. It was great when he was drafted by the Bosox since that was her Dad's team. Now he's stuck in Pirate limbo but at least he got a chance to play.

    2007-06-20 15:34:05
    181.   ssjames
    167 170

    All of those players currently sport a better VORP as hitters than does Nomar. It is really sad considering that three of pitchers, Seanez, Hendrickson and Tomko have a combined 0 hits this year. Really, Nomar is the biggest black hole in our offense right now.

    2007-06-20 15:37:09
    182.   Bluebleeder87

    a friend of mine made it for the Diablos de Mexico but that doesn't count, i also had 2 freinds make it as high as A ball & double AA.

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