Baseball Toaster Dodger Thoughts
Jon Weisman's outlet
for dealing psychologically
with the Los Angeles Dodgers
and baseball.
Frozen Toast
Google Search
Dodger Thoughts

02  01 

12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

12  11  10  09  08  07 
06  05  04  03  02  01 

09  08  07 
About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Who's Whose
2007-06-27 08:38
by Jon Weisman

Below is a chart of who brought in the players on the 2007 Dodger roster and how much those players have contributed to this year's success as hitters and pitchers, according to Baseball Prospectus and its Value Over Replacement Player statistic.

There are some major caveats that come with this chart:

  • This is not an effort to determine who the best or most important front-office executive is. It couldn't be. For example, if Ned Colletti chose the right players from his predecessors to keep, that reflects well on him. And we don't know what Paul DePodesta or Dan Evans would have done had they stayed in the organization longer.

  • The statistics do not factor in defense.

  • Playing time granted by manager Grady Little have an obvious effect on each player's numbers.

    And so on.

    I did feel it was interesting to see how some of this broke down, forever, even if the presentation is unscientific. At a minimum, credit for the Dodgers' current first-place standing in the National League West should be shared.

    Paul DePodesta (84.1)

    Name		Bat	Pitch	Total
    Penny		3.5	41.4	44.9
    Lowe		2.2	25.1	27.3
    Kent		11.9	---	11.9

    Logan White (60.3)

    Name		Bat	Pitch	Total
    Martin		23.0	---	23.0
    Loney		11.0	---	11.0
    Broxton		---	8.5	8.5
    Kemp		7.7	---	7.7
    Billingsley	0.9	6.4	7.3
    Abreu		2.1	---	2.1
    LaRoche		0.7	---	0.7

    Ned Colletti (50.9)

    Name		Bat	Pitch	Total
    Gonzalez		21.1	---	21.1
    Saito		---	14.8	14.8
    Wolf		1.0	12.5	13.5
    Seanez		-0.1	7.0	6.9
    Ethier		5.5	---	5.5
    Furcal		5.2	---	5.2
    Tsao		---	5.1	5.1
    Hendrickson	-1.8	5.5	3.7
    Beimel		---	2.9	2.9
    Betemit		2.7	---	2.7
    Pierre		-0.3	---	-0.3
    Anderson		-0.9	---	-0.9
    Valdez		-1.8	---	-1.8
    Clark		-3.1	---	-3.1
    Lieberthal	-3.1	---	-3.1
    Schmidt		0.9	-4.2	-3.3
    Garciaparra	-5.7	---	-5.7
    Tomko		-1.7	-4.2	-5.9
    Martinez		-6.4	---	-6.4

    Dan Evans (-0.2)

    Name		Bat	Pitch	Total
    Saenz		2.9	---	2.9
    Brazoban		---	-3.1	-3.1

    Ed Creech (-0.9)

    Name		Bat	Pitch	Total
    Kuo		1.5	-2.4	-0.9

    * * *

    Fun with history, courtesy of Eric Enders:

    Best Career Slugging Percentage in Baseball History
    (since 1871, min. 100 PA)

    .690 Babe Ruth
    .662 James Loney
    .634 Ted Williams
    .632 Lou Gehrig
    .621 Albert Pujols
    .611 Ryan Howard
    .609 Jimmie Foxx
    .608 Barry Bonds
    .605 Hank Greenberg

    Enjoy it while it lasts ...

  • Comments (430)
    Show/Hide Comments 1-50
    2007-06-27 08:56:18
    1.   D4P
    I've wanted to post something like this before, but thought it might be verboten. It's worth adding this:

    Average VORP

    Depo: 20.3
    White: 7.4
    Evans: 2.9
    Flanders: 2.7

    Course, it's also worth noting that, among the four player acquisitioners, only Depo probably knows/cares about VORP.

    2007-06-27 08:59:12
    2.   StolenMonkey86
    Course, it's also worth noting that, among the four player acquisitioners, only Depo probably knows/cares about VORP.

    I'm sure White knows about it, but also keep in mind he drafts them.

    2007-06-27 09:00:58
    3.   StolenMonkey86
    wait, when was DePo hired?
    2007-06-27 09:03:37
    4.   weatherman
    I like that 100 PA counts as a "career".

    It seems odd that Ned has brought in 5X as many players as Depo. I look forward to seeing how their draft classes match up.

    2007-06-27 09:04:36
    5.   kngoworld
    In a few years it might be interesting to evaluate the players White drafted under each general manager. I am sure White has the majority of say when it comes to drafting players but the GM should have some input.
    2007-06-27 09:05:38
    6.   kngoworld
    Depo brought in other players, they were just not on the team this year.
    2007-06-27 09:09:26
    7.   Jon Weisman
    The key thing about Colletti (at least as far as perception) is that so far, in over a year and a half, he hasn't gotten rid of anyone that most people care about. The closest to that was Izturis, but that didn't really burn people. His worst moves can be written off as bad spending. "It's not my money."

    He can't keep that going forever, of course, but he has that going for him right now.

    2007-06-27 09:10:17
    8.   Bob Timmermann
    DePodesta was hired in the middle of February 2004.
    2007-06-27 09:11:08
    9.   Joshua Worley
    Ned has let a lot of the Depo players who didn't work out go, of course. That pushes up Depo's average a lot.
    2007-06-27 09:12:58
    10.   Greg Brock
    7 He hasn't brought much in that anybody cares about, either.
    2007-06-27 09:13:32
    11.   Joshua Worley


    2007-06-27 09:13:42
    12.   bhsportsguy
    4, 5

    The 2004 and 2005 drafts are a bit hazy right now.

    2004 - Elbert remains as the best prospect but he is injured and will miss the rest of this season. Dewitt and Orenduff were the other high picks along with Dunlap, none of these players are destined to be in LA anytime soon.
    2005 - Hochevar affair, enough said (some would put this in both DePo's and Ned's camp but he was drafted under Paul's regime so here he stays) Meloan and Josh Bell are two of best prospects in 2005, Meloan certainly seems to be on track to play in LA sooner rather than later and Bell is probably the best young power hitter in the system.

    Under Ned you have 2006, which has Kershaw, a raw Mattingly, a TJed Morris and a Canadian named Orr at the top of the list, all young and at least 2-3 years away. 2007 remains to be seen.

    I think it is unlikely to see the wealth of talent up with the Dodgers that White's first two drafts has brought in, Loney, Broxton, Martin, Billingsley, Kemp, LaRoche and now the latest to be added maybe in a few years, James McDonald. That's a lot of frontline talent for a decade of drafts let alone two years. And not even mentioning the guys from those drafts that are still in the system.

    2007-06-27 09:15:03
    13.   D4P
    Ned has let a lot of the Depo players who didn't work out go, of course. That pushes up Depo's average a lot

    I had thought of that.

    2007-06-27 09:15:08
    14.   StolenMonkey86
    8 - That's what I thought, and Brazoban was part of the Kevin Brown trade from December 2003.
    2007-06-27 09:15:33
    15.   regfairfield
    Colletti deserves at least partial credit for Kent, since the DePo contract expired last year.
    2007-06-27 09:16:35
    16.   ToyCannon
    Your kind of cherry picking aren't you. Look at the VORP for Depo's boys in 2004/2005 when he had to fill a roster of 25 not with what is left of the good ones.
    Using Jon's analysis it would be easy to look at the roster configuration for each of the Gm's starting with Evans last year through today. Last year Ned would have been on top with the positives from Furcal/Nomar/Maddux and the negatives Depo would have taken from Penny's meltdown.

    In any given year I'd like to see the home grown boys with the largest VORP. We are well on our way to seeing that happen over the next few years.

    2007-06-27 09:17:04
    17.   Greg Brock
    11 He signed a NRI, 36 year old journeyman Japanese baseball player. I don't know how Saito has pulled this off, but he has. If Ned saw this coming, he is Jesus.
    2007-06-27 09:19:33
    18.   bhsportsguy
    7 Furcal was a good signing, if he could have avoided Repko, he probably would have a higher VORP and raise Ned's total there. And I think most believe that Raffy has worked out for the Dodgers.

    Wolf and Gonzalez have probably done at least as much as could be expected and in Luis's case, he is having a good month so that reflects even better.

    Obviously Nomar has been a double-edged sword, he certainly filled a need both in the PR sense for the team in 2006 and on the field. But no question, this year has been nothing short of a disaster.

    2007-06-27 09:20:11
    19.   ToyCannon
    Really, you don't care about Furcal, Saito, Ethier, Wolf, Betemit, and shockingly the 6th best LF in the NL this year?
    2007-06-27 09:22:24
    20.   Greg Brock
    Furcal was a good signing. I stand corrected, BH. I wasn't thrilled about the Nomar signing last year, he gave us a nice year, so there's that. But then giving him a two year contract when Loney was waiting sort of mitigates that (in my mind). Gonzo is fine. He's been good, and I'm pleased with his performance, but it's not what I'd call a master stroke of a signing.
    2007-06-27 09:23:11
    21.   ToyCannon
    If you want to carry the Depo average VORP a step further just figure out every player brought to the Dodgers by Depo, then calculate the average VORP based on how they are doing right now, no matter where they are. Don't forget to include the 0 vorp for Choi,Edwards, Grabowski and company since none of them are even in the major leagues two years later.
    2007-06-27 09:23:59
    22.   Sushirabbit
    I think whatever GMs do, it's always a gamble, however informed, mis-informed, or un-informed. And we don't what information they have or use. It was gamble on Saito, just like SChmidt. One worked out, and one has not, but (tenuously) might still have value. Even he who shall remain nameless was OK last night... for the first time in my watching him.
    2007-06-27 09:24:28
    23.   Eric Stephen
    Maybe tonight's the night Loney passes Marlon Anderson...

    Over 2006-2007, Marlon Anderson leads all Dodger batters with a 162 OPS+ (minimum 100 PA). All-time slugger James Loney stands at 160.

    2007-06-27 09:27:05
    24.   ToyCannon
    Why only partial, Depo gets the good year in 2005 the health impaired year in 2006 and Ned gets the age decline of 2007.
    2007-06-27 09:28:47
    25.   ToyCannon
    Hardley a gamble, he was a non-roster invitee.
    2007-06-27 09:29:25
    26.   ToyCannon
    The best way for Loney to pass Marlon is for Marlon to get more at bats.
    2007-06-27 09:33:41
    27.   Eric Stephen
    Tomorrow will be interesting. With the Dodgers facing a lefty in Randy Johnson, it's a perfect opportunity to begin the "Rest Pierre Every Few Days" project. That said, Ethier will probably be the odd man out though.
    2007-06-27 09:34:41
    28.   bhsportsguy
    Actually Brazoban was part of the deal that sent Brown to NY with Jeff Weaver so that should go under Evans.

    So Evans is now -.2 VORP.

    Which leaves DePo with the guy who was part of the worst trade ever (Penny).

    The guy who admitted that his personal life influenced his pitching in 2005. (Lowe)

    And, Mr. Warmth (Jeff Kent).

    DePo's guys do have the highest average salary but only because Ned can sprinkle in the Ramon Martinezes and Betemits with the Pierres and Schmidts.

    2007-06-27 09:36:59
    29.   Greg Brock
    27 BH and I talked about that last night. Today is a good opportunity to play Betemit and Abreu, and rest Kent and Nomar against the righties. Tomorrow, against the Unit, Kent and Nomar go back in, the guy that plays CF should sit against Unit, and Kemp can play CF (I think Kemp will get absolutely owned by Randy Johnson, but it should be fun to watch).
    2007-06-27 09:41:21
    30.   Jon Weisman
    28 - Thanks.
    2007-06-27 09:42:22
    31.   Eric Stephen
    29 Maybe Kemp can recreate the Big Unit hat tip he gave to McGwire after Big Mac hit a HR that went about 800 feet in the Kingdome.

    I think that's how the Kingdome was imploded (IM-plode?)...McGwire just kept hitting balls at it.

    2007-06-27 09:45:03
    32.   Greg Brock
    31 That McGwire homer is the biggest bomb not named Ishtar that I've ever seen. It was like hitting a golf ball with an aluminum bat.
    2007-06-27 09:46:10
    33.   JoeyP
    This just confirms that Penny/Lowe/Martin are the entire team.

    Its amazing that 1 pitcher can make the difference between being in contention, not being---and Penny is that guy for the Dodgers. All I can say is that he better keep it up in the 2nd half, or the Dodgers will inevitably fall out of contention.

    2007-06-27 09:48:20
    34.   ToyCannon
    Or someone else will step it up. It wasn't long ago that you said our season was done when Schmidt went down the 1st time.
    2007-06-27 09:50:18
    35.   JoeyP
    If you want to carry the Depo average VORP a step further just figure out every player brought to the Dodgers by Depo, then calculate the average VORP based on how they are doing right now, no matter where they are.

    If you're going to do that, we might as well average the VORP of the players that DePo would have brought to the Dodgers, since Edwards, Grabowski were not long-term plans.

    Perhaps average the Valentin, Drew Vorps in there.

    Take it a step even further. VORP Russell Branyan, Kouz, Heath Bell, Mike Barrett too--guys that were brought in by the Padres probably by DePodesta.

    2007-06-27 09:51:30
    36.   Hythloday
    33 - So it is possible for Penny to fall off, but not for other pitchers to heat up?
    2007-06-27 09:51:30
    37.   bigcpa
    As of yesterday Boston is sitting their $9M/year bust (Lugo), and the upgrade is to... Alex Cora. It took an 0-29 string to get him out the lineup.
    2007-06-27 09:51:33
    38.   JoeyP
    Or someone else will step it up. It wasn't long ago that you said our season was done when Schmidt went down the 1st time.

    I still think it is (as far as not winning the division=done), bc the Dodgers arent going to go 28-4 in Brad Penny starts all year.

    2007-06-27 09:51:43
    39.   bluegold
    33. Weren't they talking about trading away Penny in the pre-season, now that they had Schmidt? You're right, a Penny-less Dodgers team would be deep-doodle at this time.
    2007-06-27 09:51:58
    40.   Eric Stephen
    Has anything surfaced about Penny being hurt in the second half of 2006? Last year's post ASB performance was putrid (6-7, 6.25 ERA, average 5.3 IP/start, opponents hitting .317/.369/.511) but if Penny is healthy I don't see any reason not to expect a solid second half from him. He might not go 21-2, but I'm not worried about Penny.
    2007-06-27 09:52:09
    41.   Tangled Up in Blue
    9,13 Ned has also rid the team of some of his own bad acquisitions so it can be argued that his average is inflated as well.
    2007-06-27 09:52:21
    42.   JoeyP
    33 - So it is possible for Penny to fall off, but not for other pitchers to heat up?

    Which ones are going to heat up hotter, than Penny cooling down cooler...?

    2007-06-27 09:52:56
    43.   ToyCannon
    Speaking of mammoth shots did anyone read the stuff on Bo Jackson. It is now the 3rd entry down in the blog. I always regretted not seeing Jackie Robinson but I was lucky enough to watch Bo play both baseball and football and he is the one player in both sports who I stopped doing whatever I was doing to watch when he was involved. Of every injury that has occurred since I've been watching sports the one I regret the most is Bo's career ending one.
    2007-06-27 09:54:25
    44.   D4P
    The average score of a Dodger game started by Brad Penny in 2007 is:

    Dodgers 5.5
    Opponents 2.2

    The average score of a Dodger game not started by Brad Penny in 2007 is:

    Dodgers: 4.1
    Opponents: 4.5

    2007-06-27 09:55:23
    45.   bluegold
    The only pitcher I saw heating up in the past week was Edwin Jackson.
    2007-06-27 09:55:59
    46.   Humma Kavula
    7 Well, I cared about Joel the Destroyer. He was the first minor leaguer I really rooted for -- never really paid attention before him -- and his slump and subsequent trading was disappointing.

    I still care about him, but not as much... only to the point where every now and then I try to check on how he's doing.

    I recognize that if things stay the way they are, the amount that I care will wane and wane until I get to the point where I say, "Whatever happened to Joel the Destoryer?"

    2007-06-27 09:56:28
    47.   bigcpa
    Googling that McGwire HR off Unit I found a good piece on Slate.

    The Myth of the 500-Foot Home Run

    2007-06-27 09:57:08
    48.   ToyCannon
    Nobody, but with JP, Furcal, and Nomar not just playing below expectations but below historical averages and with the infusion of Loney and Kemp I expect the offense to make up for when Penny slows down.
    Penny has been great but it is not like we've won each of his games by one run.
    2007-06-27 09:58:23
    49.   bluegold
    44. So the road to the World Series is for Penny to start every game. Or for the Dodgers to average 4.6 runs for a non-Penny game. I don't know which one is harder to accomplish.
    2007-06-27 09:58:28
    50.   Hythloday
    42 - You don't need 1 pitcher heating up, you can have the rest of the rotation improving. This is not unreasonable as Kuo and Billz are certainly improvements over Hendy and Tomko. An improved offense will also help balance out any cooling down on the defensive side.
    Show/Hide Comments 51-100
    2007-06-27 09:59:46
    51.   Greg Brock
    Brad Penny for MVP?
    2007-06-27 09:59:46
    52.   ToyCannon
    Take heart, he's been heating up lately. Has an 885 OPS in June.
    2007-06-27 10:02:11
    53.   Greg Brock
    I can't believe Slate wrote a contrarian article.

    Did not see that one coming.

    2007-06-27 10:06:19
    54.   ToyCannon
    So if your an avowed contrarian and a magazine is devoted to writing contrarian articles, is it contrarian to agree with them or should you disagree with them to maintain your contrarianism?
    2007-06-27 10:08:09
    55.   Greg Brock
    Liking Slate would be buying into the contrarian hype. It's too hip a contrarian site for an iconoclast like me ;-)
    2007-06-27 10:08:20
    56.   D4P
    And if you're the kind of person who questions authority, do you or do you not obey a bumper sticker telling you to question authority?
    2007-06-27 10:09:07
    57.   Bob Timmermann
    I knew that article would be by John Pastier.

    Some people are really protective of the length of home runs. So are people about how far away Willie Mays was when he caught Vic Wertz's drive in the 1954 WS. I've seen statements that Mays was 460' from home when he made the catch, but more conservative estimates say he was no more than 410', although he obviously kept running after the catch.

    A Mickey Mantle biographer claimed that in 1951, Mantle, while playing in an exhibition game at USC, hit a home run that went over the fence at Bovard Diamond and then crossed a football practice field behind it. This would have been over 650'.

    I checked four different newspaper accounts of the game and not one writer mentioned that Mantle hit a particularly long home run.

    2007-06-27 10:14:32
    58.   bryanf
    I've been thinking about a chart like this. A trade geneology would be interesting, though it looks like the majority of these were free-agent signings.
    2007-06-27 10:16:03
    59.   robohobo
    44. Penny is hitting .241 with 3 runs scored and 3 RBI.
    2007-06-27 10:16:24
    60.   Greg Brock
    The Mantle home run off the facade, still on the way up, is the one that I always hear about. I can't remember which documentary mobbed the home run, but here's a website that talks about it:

    2007-06-27 10:18:15
    61.   Marty
    The Jackson homerun in the All-Star game in Detroit is the one I always remember.
    2007-06-27 10:18:15
    62.   Bob Timmermann
    It's a frieze, not a facade.
    2007-06-27 10:18:18
    63.   D4P
    Penny is hitting .241 with 3 runs scored and 3 RBI

    Not to mention:

    VORP (bat)

    Penny: 3.5
    Pierre: -0.3
    Nomar: -5.7

    I guess Penny has helped himself with the bat quite a bit thus far.

    2007-06-27 10:18:42
    64.   D4P
    It's a frieze, not a facade

    Don't get Bob started.

    2007-06-27 10:22:08
    65.   Bob Timmermann
    It's a day for contrarians!
    2007-06-27 10:22:37
    66.   Greg Brock
    65 No it's not.
    2007-06-27 10:24:25
    67.   Eric Enders
    I'm sure Robert Adair would be happy to explain why a home run off the frieze that was still going up is physically impossible. Of course, a home run off the facade would be even more physically impossible.
    2007-06-27 10:26:38
    68.   regfairfield
    Same numbers from 2006:

    Ned: 235.7
    DePo: 158.2
    White: 71.2
    Other: 13
    Evans: 11

    2007-06-27 10:27:05
    69.   regfairfield
    Same numbers from 2006:

    Ned: 235.7
    DePo: 148.2
    White: 71.2
    Other: 13
    Evans: 11

    2007-06-27 10:27:55
    70.   bryanf
    During the off season a lot was made of signing Nomar because the Dodgers lost Drew. Some might blame Depo for allowing that clause in Drew's contract. Some might blame Ned for feeling Nomar was the right replacement. Some might blame Evans just because they didn't like James Baldwin.

    I guess my point is to broaden Jon's statement: "At a minimum, credit for [insert your feelings about the state of the Dodgers here]...should be shared."

    2007-06-27 10:28:42
    71.   regfairfield
    Same numbers from 2006:

    Ned: 235.7
    DePo: 148.2
    White: 71.2
    Other: 13
    Evans: 11

    2007-06-27 10:28:59
    72.   bryanf
    During the off season a lot was made of signing Nomar because the Dodgers lost Drew. Some might blame Depo for allowing that clause in Drew's contract. Some might blame Ned for feeling Nomar was the right replacement. Some might blame Evans just because they didn't like James Baldwin.

    I guess my point is to broaden Jon's statement: "At a minimum, credit for [insert your feelings about the state of the Dodgers here]...should be shared."

    2007-06-27 10:32:10
    73.   Eric Enders
    71 That fits nicely with my already-existing notion that DePodesta was somebody who carefully planned for the long-term, while Colletti likes to go for the short-end payoff.

    Of course, I could just be full of it.

    2007-06-27 10:32:14
    74.   Greg Brock
    Yes, but do curveballs actually curve?

    I say no.

    2007-06-27 10:33:05
    75.   Bob Timmermann
    Silly boy, curve balls just Bx and pFx.
    2007-06-27 10:34:23
    76.   Telemachos
    Hmm, I wonder what the numbers from 2006 might be.
    2007-06-27 10:41:47
    77.   Jon Weisman
    72 - Yeah, my post really is meant to highlight the different cooks, rather than single out the top chef.
    2007-06-27 10:48:12
    78.   Sushirabbit
    So what are DT's recommendations for scorebooks?
    2007-06-27 10:50:29
    79.   SG6
    I'm not quite clear on VORP, but if it doesn't factor in player salary, shouldn't salary be acknowledged somehow? Say, VORP per million dollars spent? Does it really take a talented GM to sign Arod for 10/$250 - or just a big pocketbook?
    2007-06-27 10:50:34
    80.   Bob Timmermann
    You can make one from an Excel spreadsheet, a photocopier, a stapler, and six sticks of gum.

    Just make sure you buy one that has a lot of spaces to fill in people in the #9 slot.

    2007-06-27 10:50:42
    81.   Greg Brock
    78 Oh, man. That's right in Bob's wheelhouse.
    2007-06-27 10:52:41
    82.   Sushirabbit
    I should add that, I'm thinking about getting one for keeping a record of my son's games T-ball now (who may or may not be starting fall ball) and then also one for mostly the Nashville Sounds.
    2007-06-27 10:53:01
    83.   D4P
    Maybe Bob won't see "The Revenge of the Nerds" because he fears it will hit too close to home...
    2007-06-27 10:54:17
    84.   silverwidow
    White didn't have anything to do with Kuo. He was signed in 1999 (three years before White became scouting director).
    2007-06-27 10:55:33
    85.   mountainmover
    ... proof again that figures do lie.

    If Edwards, Nakamura and others acquired by DePo were on included, the stats would be different. It's appples to oranges to compare the past Paul to the present Ned. Run the numbers again in two years. Then, you have apples to apples.

    2007-06-27 10:58:41
    86.   Jon Weisman
    84 - Okay, thanks.

    85 - I made the caveats to the chart abundantly clear. It's only about this year. As others have shown - read the comments above yours - the numbers would differ greatly at different times.

    So what exactly is the lie?

    2007-06-27 10:59:22
    87.   Jon Weisman
    So who gets credit for Kuo?
    2007-06-27 11:03:11
    88.   Bob Timmermann
    I believe it goes to Xeifrank.
    2007-06-27 11:06:09
    89.   Eric Enders
    87 Ed Kreech was the scouting director then, although I think Acey Kohrogi, the Dodgers' Director of Asian Operations, had more to do with signing Kuo.
    2007-06-27 11:08:14
    90.   jasonungar07
    Anyways, I can't think of many things in life other than the obvious that are better than going from watching Tomko warm up in a tie game to Saito coming in with first place on the line in a matter of minuets.


    I am also just feeling bad for Nomar. 8 runners left on base, being dropped from 3rd to 6th, being moved from first to third to account for a 22 year old, 0-10 over the last two games, swinging at ball 5 twice.

    Even Vinny feels bad for him. It's like watching your puppy get old and now he is bouncing into furniture. Someone in the other comments said even his pre shot (pre hitting?) routine is a little lackluster...I noticed that too and just thought it was me.

    Now I feel apathy towards him.

    2007-06-27 11:08:34
    91.   Eric Enders
    89 Turns out I spelled Ed's name wrong. It starts with a C. Although what the heck, he deserves to have it misspelled. After his years of franchise-wrecking drafts for the Dodgers, you'll be happy to know that has been presiding over the Pirates' acclaimed string of recent first-round picks.
    2007-06-27 11:10:31
    92.   Jon Weisman
    91 - So it's Ced? Or Cd?
    2007-06-27 11:10:36
    93.   Sushirabbit
    80, thanks, but I'm less interested in re-inventing the wheel than when I was younger. :-) Plus, I've found that I inevitably loose those that aren't bound. I had this same issue with music. It's VERY annoying to be playing something and find you're missing the 5th sheet. And with my son, I was thinking about doing all his games, which means I need something that will last awhile. I've thought about going with a custom note book, but I really like the spiral bound kind.
    2007-06-27 11:11:04
    94.   Telemachos
    90 Nomar will get out of his slump, though. He may not have any power, but if he's spraying singles around with some regularity, he'd still be useful as a #6 (given that he almost assuredly won't drop further in the lineup, nor leave entirely unless he gets injured).
    2007-06-27 11:14:33
    95.   D4P
    I just visited a sub shop operated by a Greek couple, located across the street from my hotel in Wilmington, DE. One of the "Breakfas" sandwiches on their menu is "Scrapple egg cheese".
    2007-06-27 11:15:04
    96.   Jeff Zellman
    If the Dodgers win the World Series then DePodesta should get a ring. I doubt they'll give him one though.
    2007-06-27 11:20:53
    97.   bryanf
    If the Dodgers win the World Series then DePodesta should get a ring. I doubt they'll give him one though.

    Why? There are three players left over from his time as GM. I don't see how he deserves a ring if the Dodgers win the WS.

    If you get fired from your job and something you created there makes them a ton of money, you don't get to see any of it. That's what being fired is...

    2007-06-27 11:23:24
    98.   robohobo
    I noticed that Loney changed the trigger motion on his swing from last year. He used to have a herky-jerky right knee before his swing. He seems to have done away with it and his swing looks much smoother/less effort on the front end. Of course I only see him in the highlights provided by MLB

    Has anyone else noticed this? Has it changed since spring training? If so, is it the minor league hitting instructor that helped or Bill Mueller? (not that I expect a definitive answer, more just thinking out loud)

    2007-06-27 11:27:31
    99.   Penarol1916
    95. Doesn't North Carolina have "Scrapple Egg & Cheese?" I thought that was pretty common in the south?
    2007-06-27 11:31:41
    100.   D4P
    I've never heard of "Scrapple egg cheese."
    Show/Hide Comments 101-150
    2007-06-27 11:34:07
    101.   robohobo
    99. sounds like Dr. Seuss to me.
    2007-06-27 11:34:41
    102.   Bob Timmermann
    A scorebook for T-Ball is ambitious. Especially since niceties like a batting order or even counting runs scored is often dispensed with.

    I hear those official scorers in T-ball love to hand out errors.

    But wild pitches are way down.

    2007-06-27 11:35:53
    103.   Bluebleeder87

    tushey Joshua

    2007-06-27 11:37:49
    104.   Greg Brock
    Scrapple= Awesome
    Eggs= Awesome
    Cheese= Awesome

    Putting them together is some unholy amalgamation of awesome.

    2007-06-27 11:38:11
    105.   Penarol1916
    100. I just looked up scrapple, and I had always thought that it was a staple of the south, but it turns out that it is from Pennsylvania, no wonder you have never seen it before.
    2007-06-27 11:42:46
    106.   kngoworld
    Just looked it up on Wikipedia. Must say it does not look very appetizing.
    2007-06-27 11:42:59
    107.   D4P
    Wow, scrapple is a real thing. I had assumed it was a misspelling of "scramble".
    2007-06-27 11:44:27
    108.   D4P
    BTW: The latest Joe Morgan chat on FJM is stellar. Among other things, Joe criticizes "that OPS thing", then later says that hitters should be evaluated based upon their ability to hit for power and for average.
    2007-06-27 11:45:30
    109.   Penarol1916
    106. That's only if you don't love grease.

    and D4P, I'm honestly shocked that you had never heard of scrapple before.

    2007-06-27 11:45:40
    110.   underdog
    Ah, Is this the right room for an argument?

    I told you once.

    No you haven't.

    Yes I have.

    2007-06-27 11:47:25
    111.   D4P
    D4P, I'm honestly shocked that you had never heard of scrapple before

    I guess I don't eat at "country" restaurants very often or something.

    2007-06-27 11:55:34
    112.   Retire 55
    VORP is distorted when applied to batters with a relatively low # of PA
    2007-06-27 12:01:41
    113.   Hythloday
    112 - That's crazy talk.
    2007-06-27 12:03:58
    114.   SG6
    108 - words of wisdom from Joe on our favorite catcher. I'm guessing Nomar doesn't have this "confidence" right now.

    Pat ((Ontario,CA)): Do you think Russell Martin is one the best catchers in the game?

    Joe Morgan: I think that he's definitely established himself as a very good catcher. When you watch him play, he has confidence and I look for that.

    2007-06-27 12:07:43
    115.   Daniel Zappala
    43 I can't believe no one else picked up on the greatness of Bo Jackson. I'm in full agreement with ToyCannon. His injury was hands down the worst blow to the American sports scene ever. I would give the first son of both Andrew and D4P to have a full career of Bo in baseball and football.
    2007-06-27 12:25:45
    116.   Jon Weisman
    Eric made the Dodger Game notes. Let's see if it makes it into a broadcast tonight:

    "LONEY AND THE BABE – Though his career is still quite young, it's interesting to note that James Loney's slugging percentage of .662 is second all-time to Babe Ruth (.690) among all players with 100 or more plate appearances, according to SABR's Eric Enders. Among those just behind the rookie first basemen are Ted Williams (.634), Lou Gehrig (.632), Albert Pujols (.621), Ryan Howard (.611) Jimmie Foxx (.609) and Barry Bonds (.608). Since Loney was recalled last July 29, he is batting .375 (36-for-96), the third-highest average of any Major Leaguer with more than 100 PA during that span behind Willie Harris (.383) and Marlon Byrd (.380)."

    2007-06-27 12:26:29
    117.   Jon Weisman
    Also: James Adkins has signed.
    2007-06-27 12:28:36
    118.   underdog
    Yay, re: Adkins.


    Off subject, but, man, the US is going to have its hat handed to them in the Copa America. They'll be missing some key players and playing a lot of talented but very inxeperienced young 'uns against some of the hemisphere's best. Well, should be a good experience for them and fun to watch.

    2007-06-27 12:30:02
    119.   Sushirabbit
    115, And look at that one! Bo Jackson says hello!

    He maybe one one of the reasons why Auburn was always my favorite Tennessee Rival when I attended UT. Those were some awesome "up-the-gut" football games.

    2007-06-27 12:35:34
    120.   Hallux Valgus
    118 I think we've got no chance tomorrow against Argentina, but the other two games are winnable. I think it'll only take one win or so to get to knockout, and that'd be a moral victory (for me at least). I just hope to see Mapp and Feilhaber going crazy in the midfield.
    2007-06-27 12:36:44
    121.   underdog
    Some good questions asked in the latest Times' Dodger Q&A (perhaps by some of you!)

    2007-06-27 12:37:03
    122.   bhsportsguy
    119 Bo Jackson's TD in the Kingdome was one of the most memorable football plays I can recall watching.
    2007-06-27 12:37:27
    123.   regfairfield
    112 Why, other than the standard small sample size.
    2007-06-27 12:37:41
    124.   underdog
    120 It's true, they could sneak to the next round, that wouldn't shock me and would be a victory of sorts. I'm also looking forward to seeing Mapp and Feilhaber, both of them are real up and comers. Should be fun to watch, whatever happens.
    2007-06-27 12:43:32
    125.   Retire 55
    when you're summing VORPs the way Weisman does in that chart, small sample-sized values are pretty distorted. Loney, Lowe, Penny for example.
    2007-06-27 12:45:19
    126.   Eric Enders
    125 Big Orel Hershiser fan? ;)
    2007-06-27 12:46:19
    127.   regfairfield
    125 True, but he's just measuring contributions made at this point in the season. Right now, Loney has contributed 11 runs to the team, sample size or no sample size. He's not saying that he's going to continue to produce at that rate.
    2007-06-27 12:46:26
    128.   overkill94
    90 I'm glad someone else noticed it as well. Last year it seemed like he had so much energy that he couldn't wait for the pitcher to deliver the ball. Now it seems like he goes through the routine just because everyone expects him to.
    2007-06-27 12:48:12
    129.   Eric Enders
    128 Get that man some greenies!
    2007-06-27 12:48:40
    130.   Retire 55
    126 - yeah man, when Wayne Kirby was wearing #55 it made me want to puke!
    2007-06-27 12:48:44
    131.   ToyCannon
    How much zip would you have in your routine if you couldn't even outhit JP.
    2007-06-27 12:51:22
    132.   Jeff Zellman
    By the end of today I don't see the Dodgers whiffing 1st place for the rest of the season. Next 5 matchups. Webb/Johnson/Young/Peavy/Germano. Doesn't bode well.
    2007-06-27 12:51:55
    133.   Andrew Shimmin
    115- If D4P and I were to adopt a son together, I think the state would take him away well before you could get your childsnatching hands on him.
    2007-06-27 12:52:29
    134.   Bluebleeder87

    i keep on telling my self he's gonna break out of it, but to my surprise he has not.

    2007-06-27 12:52:44
    135.   underdog
    Wayne Kirby? Wow, you do have a memory. That guy didn't last long. (Had an okay '96, then fell of the map quickly.)
    2007-06-27 12:55:47
    136.   Bluebleeder87

    the only ones i'm scared of in your list are Peavy & maybe Webb (also maybe Young) or else bring it on!

    2007-06-27 12:56:32
    137.   Eric Enders
    132 Well, at least now we know the next person who will be impersonated at ItD.
    2007-06-27 12:58:44
    138.   Retire 55

    even if those guys pummel us, that's a dumb, joeyp-esque statement to make with with half the season left to play

    2007-06-27 12:59:17
    139.   underdog
    132 So because the next few matchups are tough, the Dodgers won't see first place again for the rest of the season? That's the spirit!
    2007-06-27 13:00:24
    140.   SG6
    Bo was awesome. I was at the Raider/Bengal Playoff game when he was injured. I attended every home game that year. It was like, "get up, Bo" - the tackle from behind didn't look like anything that could destroy that great career. The Boz will always make a great trivia question in the Jeopardy of Bo Jackson.
    2007-06-27 13:03:44
    141.   Marty
    We've had scrapple thoughts before. My dad grew up on the stuff in Pittsburgh.
    2007-06-27 13:04:54
    142.   D4P
    If D4P and I were to adopt a son together

    You'd probably make the lad wear pleated pants and socks and tuck in his shirt and stuff. Poor little guy.

    2007-06-27 13:08:51
    143.   Jeff Zellman
    I base my reasoning off statistical analysis. Not the rah-rah method.

    The Dodgers are due for a loss and they face one the games finest in Webb tonight. After SD wins today the Dodgers will drop back down to 3rd place. Even if they manage to beat Arizona on Thursday they will be tied with SD. My calculations suggest the probability of Kuo defeating Young on Friday night at 15%. And winning 2 of 3 at 20%. The Dodgers will enter Monday's play at 1 or 3 games back. The Pads are poised for a run while the Dodgers are destined to regress. Just check out the Pythag records.

    2007-06-27 13:11:20
    144.   D4P
    Just check out the Pythag records

    I've been doing that for months now. The Padres should have been/should be way ahead, but they aren't.

    2007-06-27 13:12:08
    145.   Ricardo
    Everything I read about Kershaw says about his slider, fastball and curveball.Is he trying to develop another pitch?

    120. Argentina is the best in the competition, Riquelme is a great player.Good luck for USA against "nuestros hermanos".

    2007-06-27 13:12:32
    146.   underdog
    143 All that may be reasonable, though it's been wrong before - but I don't see how that applies to the rest of the season. Or did you mean, week, or month?
    2007-06-27 13:13:00
    147.   underdog
    Wasn't that a Sci-Fi Channel movie? "Pythag vs. Boa"
    2007-06-27 13:14:00
    148.   LogikReader

    Jeff, you get a drink from me if you're right. but I offer you these words of advice: That's why they play the games.


    2007-06-27 13:14:27
    149.   Hallux Valgus
    147 You might be thinking of "Komodo vs. Cobra." That was a classic.
    2007-06-27 13:15:04
    150.   Sushirabbit
    Naw, history channel, Pythag v. Bowa

    The Phillies lost that battle.

    Show/Hide Comments 151-200
    2007-06-27 13:15:25
    151.   Greg Brock
    D4P and Andrew having a child.

    I don't know what it would look like, but it's a pretty good bet that a numbered birthmark would be involved.

    2007-06-27 13:19:09
    152.   jasonungar07
    143 so let's use stats then, not your feeling that the dodgers are due for a loss. Aren't the backs facing a tough arm tonight as well?

    2.16 1.06 .209 May
    2.67 0.63 .152 June

    4.37 1.29 .256 may
    2.12 1.09 .224 june

    2007-06-27 13:21:13
    153.   Jeff Zellman
    Brandon Webb owns the Dodgers. 'nuff said.
    2007-06-27 13:23:19
    154.   GobiasIndustries
    The Dodgers own the Diamondbacks. Nuff said.
    2007-06-27 13:24:37
    155.   Bob Timmermann
    Except for the three games he lost to the Dodgers.
    2007-06-27 13:25:09
    156.   jasonungar07
    In 11 starts vs the dodgers he is 6-3 with 3.39/1.13/.222 and Derek Lowe far from owns the backs so maybe your right.

    2-4 with an era over 5.00 in 9 starts

    2007-06-27 13:28:03
    157.   Bob Timmermann
    To be non-metaphorical, the Diamondbacks are owned by a syndicate headed by Ken Kendrick.
    2007-06-27 13:28:21
    158.   underdog
    150 149 Hah hah. Eureka! Wait, no that's a Sci-Fi program, too.

    153 Jeff Zellman owns the D-Backs.

    2007-06-27 13:29:51
    159.   bhsportsguy
    The Padres have been a very strange team this year because you would think due to their pitching and generally anemic offense, they would win a lot more close games but they don't. (18-21 in one and two run games)

    And despite their overwhelming pitching advantage at home (last time I checked, an ERA under 3, their home record isn't much if even better than the Dodgers or D-Backs.

    This is a telling stat, when the Padres score 4 or less runs, their record is 18-29, with a 12-14 record when they score 3 or 4 runs.

    Only when they score 5 or more does their pitching really hold the advantage as they win the majority of games with a 25-4 record.

    And despite this being somewhat a flawed stat and despite what you hear people say about San Diego's bullpen, they have lost 8 games after leading after 6 games.

    Now if they get that straighthened out in the second half, they may begin to look like their Pyth. record. But if you look at their last two games in San Francisco, Linebrink gave up the tying run in the 8th, the Padres who are also 6-9 after being tied after 8 innings, did win the game but they have had problems with some of their relief and really their lineup leaves a lot to be desired.

    2007-06-27 13:31:56
    160.   Gen3Blue
    108 That sounds just like Joe. I feel like being disgusted some more, but for some reason FJM won't register when I know it should. Little help DP4 or anyone?
    2007-06-27 13:34:30
    161.   D4P
    It's just
    2007-06-27 13:36:35
    162.   jasonungar07 from last nights thread (i got caught up today, not last night, see I read the comments!!)

    You mentioned Dylan was real good. Have you seen him a bunch of times? What made it good this time? Lots of energy? I am debating going to the show out here at the OC fair. I have seen Dylan maybe 15 times (1996 and after) and its hit or miss. I really want to see him again cause people are saying good things and I love the new album. Last time I saw him he hid on the Piano.

    With a baby on the way I may have to choose between Wilco and Dylan and I am leaning towards Wilco.

    It was strange being in Dodger Stadium without the dodgers there. The police last weekend were pretty good, but limiting.

    2007-06-27 13:36:38
    163.   Gen3Blue
    Ahhh. The Lightbulb of recognition pops on.
    Thanks DP
    2007-06-27 13:37:02
    164.   Jeff Zellman
    Relief pitchers are volatile to judge. Interchangeable parts really. The best way to evaluete a pitching staff is to look at the starters. Ideally, you want 3 stars, 1 above average, and 1 average starter.

    The Pads have 2 stars (Peavy/Young), 2 above average (Maddux/Germano), and 1 average (Wells).

    The Dodgers have 2 stars (Penny/Lowe), 2 average (Billz/Kuo), and 1 below average (Wolf)

    Plus the stars Young/Peavy > Penny/Lowe.

    Bottom line. The Dodgers are playing for the WC.

    2007-06-27 13:41:49
    165.   Bob Timmermann
    Jeff Young at Ducksnorts recently wrote about the Padres and luck, be it good or bad.

    2007-06-27 13:42:31
    166.   kngoworld
    Jeff, I dont think you are winning over many fans around here.
    2007-06-27 13:43:36
    167.   overkill94
    164 A 4.32 ERA is below average? On average, that's better than a quality start everytime out!

    Then there's the whole "scoring runs" thing where I believe the Dodgers have an advantage.

    2007-06-27 13:44:57
    168.   Penarol1916
    166. I wonder if he would be doing better if his tone was a little less strident and he didn't state the most likely outcomes as if they were pre-ordained fact.
    2007-06-27 13:46:59
    169.   dzzrtRatt
    160You probably couldn't get onto Fire Joe Morgan because I was laughing so hard while reading the Morgan transcript I spewed coffee all over my computer. That can mess up a site, right?

    My God, if anything, he is worse on these chat transcripts than he is during the game. He literally knows nothing, and tries to cover it up in myriad ways. But nothing gets by Ken.

    Just hilarious. Makes me appreciate...Rick Monday. At least he sort of knows what he's talking about.

    2007-06-27 13:47:04
    170.   underdog
    Yeah, I wouldn't rank Wolf below average, and certainly wouldn't rank him below David Wells. Or at least, I know which one I'd choose, lupine first innings or no.
    2007-06-27 13:48:43
    171.   underdog
    I love how FJM actually has a category label "incorrect attribution of power-hitting ability to the wrong Cora brother".
    2007-06-27 13:49:12
    172.   GobiasIndustries
    Bottom line. The Dodgers are playing for the WC.

    That's like saying Robotech was better than Voltron. Or better yet, the Go-bots were better than the Transformers. It makes no sense and anyone who knows anything about anything, knows it's way to premature to be making those kind of blanket statements. In the words of the immortal Gob Bluth..........Come on!

    2007-06-27 13:49:38
    173.   Humma Kavula
    Jeff -- in 143 you say you base your analysis on statistical method, then, almost immediately, you say "The Dodgers are due for a loss." Do you have a statistical analysis that can measure when a team is due for wins and losses? That would be very interesting to see.

    The next five pitchers are tough, no doubt, but you're basically guaranteeing five losses in a row. Even the '98 Devil Rays beat the '98 Yankees once. (7-0, too. You could look it up.)

    2007-06-27 13:51:02
    174.   D4P
    I love how Messr. Tremendous points out how little Joe knows about baseball teams, given that he's paid to analyze baseball teams. I mean, what the hell is ESPN paying him for anyway?
    2007-06-27 13:51:28
    175.   Gen3Blue
    162 I have only seen him live 3 or 4 times including a brief appearance with Eric C.

    I have a friend who is a big fan, though I don't think he's gone as much as you, so I go with him, just for the spectacle,but last night was very different. It all seemed to be his attitude(although the band and the sound was excellent). I mean he came right out front with his guitar and for the first five songs it was about as good rock as I have seen. And I'm an old timer who saw bands like The Allman Bros. in their prime. He then retreated to the piano but kept standing and delvering, never missing the mike, and he really seemed to be telling his stories for the first time in my experience. He even participated in the guitar solos and did OK. Lot of good songs like Highway 51, Desolation Row and Watchtower. I was really surprised, But the reviews from Europe kind of hinted at this but I hadn't known what weight to give them. Of course his voice is pretty shot but it didn't bother me this time. If it's part of the same tour I might tell you to give it a try.

    2007-06-27 13:52:24
    176.   Humma Kavula
    174 My favorite part is when Joe says that he's not close to the Reds, so he can't comment, but he does talk to the Reds' owner regularly.
    2007-06-27 13:52:55
    177.   Hallux Valgus
    172 The Go Bots had characters who transformed into rocks. honest to God rocks. Agreed- They weren't better than anything.

    ... wait, that was the point, right?

    2007-06-27 13:54:23
    178.   D4P
    Go-Bots sucked. But, I seem to recall that they existed before Transformers. I hope I'm wrong about that.
    2007-06-27 13:56:07
    179.   Blue in the Bay
    166 - "...honest and popular don't go hand in hand." - 2nd Ishtar reference of the day.
    2007-06-27 13:56:37
    180.   Humma Kavula
    I was eight. My allowance -- this is 1984 -- was seventy-five cents a week, where it would remain until high school, when it went up to the grand sum of one dollar. So I was dependent on mother for everything.

    My mom wouldn't buy me Transformers. She didn't understand why I needed Transformers when there were perfectly good Go-Bots available at the all-for-a-dollar store. And if I wanted Go-Bots, well, that's what I had an allowance for, right? After three weeks of chores, I would have enough money to buy TWO Go-Bots! And have a cool quarter left over!

    2007-06-27 13:57:40
    181.   Hallux Valgus
    178 the Go-Bots were indeed first, but that counts for little in my book. That's like giving credit to the crappy Voltron built from cars just because it came before the awesome Voltron built from lions.
    2007-06-27 13:58:11
    182.   robohobo
    172. Reminds me of Tron and MCP
    2007-06-27 13:58:39
    183.   dsfan
    164, 172, 173

    Will Ned make the right moves and non-moves down the stretch? I don't think he's as creative and resourceful as Towers, who appears pretty good at the small stuff, cheaply getting nice value out of the likes of Bell, Cruz, Ring, Germano.

    I don't think Ned needs to go for the big trade. I do think he needs to firm up the pitching a bit. I wouldn't have minded seeing him get Maroth, someone who can plug it without much cost.

    2007-06-27 13:59:41
    184.   Terry A
    We had secondhand little green army men. And dirt.

    And we liked it!

    2007-06-27 13:59:44
    185.   D4P
    I convinced my mom to buy Megatron for me sometime around 1985-6. I told her she'd never have to buy me anything else ever again.
    2007-06-27 14:00:25
    186.   robohobo
    181. I liked the car Voltron for the simple reason that I occasionally got to play with one of the cars when someone would bring the toy Voltron to school. Unfortunately, I was not one of the five coolest kids in the class so the lion Voltron was admired from afar.
    2007-06-27 14:00:43
    187.   GobiasIndustries
    There was no point to what I was saying really. Just a blanket statement to start an argument of which is better. Much like 164 saying that we're playing for the wild card. Sure I can back it up with MY opinions, but that's all they are. My opinions.
    And I seem to remember the Transformers before the Go-Bots. I thought the Go-Bots were the American rip-off the Transformers. Could be wrong though.
    2007-06-27 14:00:45
    188.   D4P
    When I was a child, there were times when we had to entertain ourselves. And usually the best way to do that was to turn on the TV.
    2007-06-27 14:01:36
    189.   Humma Kavula
    All we need now is the Go-Bots movie. It won't look nearly as good as Michael Bay's movie, but admission will only cost $1.
    2007-06-27 14:04:44
    190.   GobiasIndustries
    I did the same thing with Voltron for my birthday. The day I merged all those lions into Voltron was one of my red letter days for sure.
    2007-06-27 14:05:44
    191.   Hallux Valgus
    189 The Go-Bots movie would probably be made by the same guy who did all those "Thumb Wars" movies. On one side of his thumb would be a plastic car (or rock). On the other side would be a little drawing of a guy. Perfect!
    2007-06-27 14:05:46
    192.   jasonungar07
    Thanks Gen3blue! The things you mention sound good. He has been almost the opposite the times I have seen him.
    2007-06-27 14:05:59
    193.   Disabled List
    189 Michael Bay has never made a good movie in his entire career. What makes you think he's gonna start now?
    2007-06-27 14:06:04
    194.   robohobo
    185. In the new movie and newer cartoons, I don't think Megatron turns into a big gun. Very disappointing.
    2007-06-27 14:06:14
    195.   weatherman
    From a Dallas newspaper:

    Would we really take Gagne back? I mean I love the guy, but this would never happen right? Besides, James Loney is the second greatest slugger of all time.

    2007-06-27 14:06:31
    196.   Humma Kavula
    183 Considering that there's much debate even on this board over what the right move would be, which players should be targeted, and which players should be (or could realistically be) on the trading block, Ned is getting a wide berth from me.

    Bottom line, I'm just hoping he doesn't do something patently dumb, like trading for an oft-injured, expensive third baseman whose team will likely request two highly prized major league-level players in his early 20s. As long as the patently dumb doesn't happen, I'm willing to wait and see.

    2007-06-27 14:08:05
    197.   overkill94
    Damn, I knew it was only a matter of time before my computer bugged out and closed my Text Twist game. Six days and 2,300,000 points later and I have nothing to show for it. I wasn't even given a chance to pass my old record.
    2007-06-27 14:08:20
    198.   Humma Kavula
    193 I said it would "look...good." I didn't say it would be good.

    Michael Bay has a magpie's eye for gloss. Everything looks good in his movies.

    2007-06-27 14:09:57
    199.   Daniel Zappala
    184 When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child, using statistics like AVG, RBI, and ERA; when I became a man, I did away with childish things and used OPS, SLG, and WHIP.
    2007-06-27 14:10:44
    200.   skybluestoday
    Re: 175

    Did you see the Allmans during the Duane era? I'm always curious for I-was-there reports from that period, since it was so evanescent and is inevitably tinged with this timeless, perennial Georgia melancholia that is endemic to so much of the state.

    Show/Hide Comments 201-250
    2007-06-27 14:11:07
    201.   Daniel Zappala
    199 Was meant to refer to 188.
    2007-06-27 14:11:50
    202.   Eric Enders
    I had little green army men, Transformers, AND Voltron. Voltron was the best, but you really couldn't go wrong with any of them. Except I think the designers of the little green army men were dealing with impotence, since the ends of the bayonets and rifles were always flimsy and too easy to bend.

    Dylan vs. Wilco: Pick Wilco. Although the last time I saw Dylan, he was just stunning. But that was a couple of years ago now.

    Now I'm off to destroy the evil forces of the Decepticons.

    2007-06-27 14:13:17
    203.   Disabled List
    I'm more pessimistic about the new Transformers movie and the new Die Hard movie than I am about the Dodgers upcoming five-game stretch from hell.

    I'll be pleased if the Dodgers win two of the next five, starting tonight. And I'll be pleased if the two aforementioned movies don't completely suck and ruin my nostalgic memories of the 80s.

    2007-06-27 14:14:21
    204.   Hallux Valgus
    the new Die Hard was quite good.
    2007-06-27 14:15:07
    205.   Eric Enders
    203 Is there any doubt at all that they're going to suck? I'm not even going to waste my time.

    (I mean the movies, not the Dodgers)

    2007-06-27 14:15:16
    206.   bryanf
    204 I can't wait I'm seeing it tomorrow...
    2007-06-27 14:15:36
    207.   GobiasIndustries
    Did you ever have Muscle Men? Remember them? They were like the green army men but they were fleshy colored soft rubber. I never understood what the point of them was but my cousin had enough to fill a plantation.
    2007-06-27 14:16:54
    208.   robohobo
    207. I think they were Mexican Lucha Libre wrestlers.
    2007-06-27 14:16:55
    209.   weatherman
    202 - I saw them on the same stage.

    Different years.

    Same stage.

    2007-06-27 14:17:11
    210.   still bevens
    203 Transformers will suck, but will look shiny and things will explode. It will also make more money than any of the other summer movies.
    2007-06-27 14:17:33
    211.   Bob Timmermann
    If the Dodgers are due for a loss, it will be Saturday when I will be in attendance and I can add to the 26-8 deficit the Dodgers have experienced in the three games I've attended.
    2007-06-27 14:17:38
    212.   overkill94
    193 Obviously you've never seen Playboy Video Centerfold: Kerri Kendall. The way he manipulates the lighting in that one is groundbreaking.
    2007-06-27 14:17:40
    213.   bryanf
    195 I hope this guy is just blowing smoke.
    2007-06-27 14:18:41
    214.   D4P
    Did you ever have Muscle Men?

    Millions of Strange Creatures Lurking Everywhere...?

    2007-06-27 14:20:27
    215.   GobiasIndustries
    That makes sooooooooo much sense! Thanks man.
    2007-06-27 14:20:34
    216.   weatherman
    213 - It is always weird to read other fans' notions about trades and whatnot. He made it sound like the Dodgers had been scouting Gagne.
    2007-06-27 14:23:55
    217.   GobiasIndustries
    All this waxing nostalgic is making me want to go to my folks house and dig through the stuff in the attic that's been put away for years.
    Toys, comic books, baseball cards, etc...
    E-bay here I come!
    2007-06-27 14:24:02
    218.   Hallux Valgus
    Transformers is on the cover of Variety today. Jazz is a Pontiac. sigh...
    2007-06-27 14:25:19
    219.   Lexinthedena
    214- I had a gang of Muscle those were weird....

    We will never have that kind of stuff again...everything follows the same corporate model...that's why movies are so bad...

    BTW, Is the Transformers movie about something other than the Autobots V. Decepticons....are they trying to add a human plot or something?

    2007-06-27 14:26:54
    220.   LogikReader
    *off topic*

    For the first time, I'm going to try to predict Vin's "This Date in Dodgers History" tonight. I'm going to peg Reuss' 8-0 no hitter from 1980. It could also be the 23 inning tie from 1939, but we'll see.

    on topic: the minute I saw that Transformers trailer I knew it would be a dumb movie. What is it with all these movies about stuff from the 80s lately?

    2007-06-27 14:27:16
    221.   underdog
    Weatherman, don't blame ya for missing it but see comment 691 and follow-up comments in previous DT thread for discussion on that Dallas columnist's trade fantasies. Which is surely all they are. I think Greg B even wrote an email to the guy about it.
    Transformers is featured in the new Wired btw. My coworker is seeing preview of it tomorrow. Looks like the action and FX are great, and that the film is likely still junk.
    2007-06-27 14:27:19
    222.   jasonungar07
    Yeah I am sure Boras is thinking I would love to hear Guns and Roses followed by The Destroyers while out at the yard.
    2007-06-27 14:27:27
    223.   weatherman
    Did I accidently log on to Screen Jams?
    2007-06-27 14:27:43
    224.   DodgerBakers
    213. and 216. and others re: stupid trades other people want the Dodgers to make.

    Someone in this thread or last night's thread was saying that stories like that come from 2 incorrect notions:
    1. They (the reporter) is the only one who knows anything about these "hidden gems," usually our highest rated prospects.

    2. They believe the Dodgers are like the Yankees and will spend tons of money and mortgage the farm for a 3 month rental of a mediocre veteran that their team has no hope of signing in the off season.

    Can't remember who said that, but I thought it was good.

    2007-06-27 14:27:53
    225.   Humma Kavula
    210 Do you really think that Transformers will make more money than Spider-Man 3, which is sitting on $330 domestic and $879 worldwide?

    If so, I'll take that bet.

    2007-06-27 14:28:06
    226.   Greg Brock
    221 I did. I have not yet gotten a reply.
    2007-06-27 14:28:43
    227.   LogikReader

    I'm going to that game too! noooooooooooooo! ;)

    2007-06-27 14:29:25
    228.   underdog
    Btw, I have it on good authority that GoBots were indeed first, barely; introduced in 1983, to Transformers 1984.
    2007-06-27 14:29:43
    229.   DodgerBakers
    221. Yeah, that's the one. Got beat by a good 24 seconds.
    2007-06-27 14:30:59
    230.   underdog
    226 You probably shamed him and he has since joined a monestary.
    2007-06-27 14:32:14
    231.   Marty
    I never played army as a kid. Just sports. For in-house entertainment it was board games. Monopoly, Life, Clue, Careers, Risk, Stratego, Rack-o. I also had electric football and electric baseball. Two of the biggest scams ever invented.

    Plus the liquor and drugs.

    2007-06-27 14:33:19
    232.   D4P
    I remember calling Toys R Us everyday after school to ask if they had Dinobots in yet. I also remember one of my friends calling and asking for the toy department.


    2007-06-27 14:33:49
    233.   Greg Brock
    230 That's gotta be it.

    I don't even want to think about what happens if the Dodgers were to ever trade the mythical beast that pitches with his left hand. I think the internets might explode.

    We would certainly take some shoelaces away from Nate and Canuck.

    2007-06-27 14:34:56
    234.   D4P
    We would certainly take some shoelaces away from Nate and Canuck

    Probably wouldn't be necessary. I'm guessing Nate wears flip-flops, and Canuck wears loafers.

    2007-06-27 14:35:27
    235.   weatherman
    221 - Thanks. Yeah, I read through these posts looking to see if anyone else had posted it. I didn't think to check through the 734 post Behemoth. I apologize for the redundancy and I'm sorry.
    2007-06-27 14:36:12
    236.   Lexinthedena
    Hollywood has no Cojones...they make movies like Jim Tracy managed...And they know that a dumb FX laden movie about a cartoon that people have nostalgic feelings about will sell....And when they get a good script, they ruin it, because they re-write it to follow whatever formula they think will make money...

    I was thinking about this after watching "Knocked Up'...everyone is talking about how great it's not...but it's at least kind of creative, and he bar is so low right now, that marginally good feels great...

    OK, off the box...thanks...

    2007-06-27 14:36:54
    237.   Hallux Valgus
    232 Man were the Dinobots a dumb idea. "Robots in disguise" was right there in the theme song. How do you disguise a robot by having it turn into a 10 foot steel Brontosaurs?
    2007-06-27 14:37:03
    238.   Disabled List
    Greg, can you post a CC of the letter in question here?
    2007-06-27 14:37:22
    239.   trainwreck
    Transformers was my favorite show growing up and now Michael Bay has crapped on my childhood memories.

    I hate you Michael Bay.

    2007-06-27 14:41:36
    240.   Greg Brock
    238 I just gave him a hard time. Not really mean, no vulgarity or anything. Just went over the prospects and why they wouldn't get dealt.
    2007-06-27 14:42:19
    241.   Greg Brock
    I didn't know one could destroy the artistic integrity of Transformers.
    2007-06-27 14:44:57
    242.   still bevens
    236 From what I understand the script is, and always has been godawful. My roomate was saying its one of the worst scripts he's ever read, which is saying something. The premise is something along the lines of Megatron gets frozen in ice way back when, gets discovered, and all technology henceforth is deriven from Megatron. Kinda like that Bjork song...
    2007-06-27 14:46:17
    243.   Disabled List
    240 So you didn't offer him the Ark of the Covenant?
    2007-06-27 14:46:43
    244.   underdog
    235 No need to apologize! Just thought it'd worthy to read what was said earlier, 'cause it was amusing. (And in case people ignored you. ;-) )

    I think the very dumbness of the Dinobots concept was the charm of it! And I was into dinosaurs, too, as were a lot of kids, which makes them more forgiving.

    But I was already in high school when transformers really took off so I kind of missed the bandwagon. I grew up playing with Legos. And look where it got me! Try to make a Lego movie, Mr. Bay, just try!

    2007-06-27 14:46:58
    245.   Hallux Valgus
    242 Then your friend has never read Kevin Smith's version of the Superman script.

    oh wait, you said "one of." sorry.

    2007-06-27 14:48:56
    246.   Greg Brock
    243 I actually went with Shroud of Turin and the Hope Diamond.
    2007-06-27 14:49:23
    247.   Gen3Blue
    200 I am on and off this evening without much time on, but yes during the Duane era I saw the Bros. at Boston Garden in about '70? (I'll have to figure this out) We were in awe of how their sound evoked the spanish moss dripping Georgia that we really knew little about. And also in awe about how solid their sound was--we attributed that to two drummers.
    J. Giles filled in during a long break ( in retrospect Duane and Greg were probably getting off in the dressing room.)
    Gotta go, back later.
    2007-06-27 14:51:36
    248.   Lexinthedena
    242- I was more talking about hollywood at that point...They have ruined many great script, and many a great vision....

    I have no hopes for Transformers, but it would be nice it they let it play out the way the cartoon, or even the first movie did....

    2007-06-27 14:52:29
    249.   Marty
    I saw the Allman Brothers in Santa Barbara in 1976. Post-Duane, but Cher was on the stage.
    2007-06-27 14:52:41
    250.   GobiasIndustries
    I thought the Transformers were introduced in Japan first?

    As for the Dynobots, I only liked Grimlock. Don't remember why, I just know that I liked him best.
    What about the Constructacons that formed Devastator! Now those guys were something to have as a kid. Kind of like Voltron, five dudes that made one big dude.

    Show/Hide Comments 251-300
    2007-06-27 14:53:43
    251.   Greg Brock
    I believe Orson Welles concluded his glorious career with his appearance in the Transformers movie.

    Not kidding.

    2007-06-27 14:54:02
    252.   Disabled List
    246 Well, that's a relief. I was afraid you might've gone with the Mona Lisa and the crown jewels of England.

    That, along with our entire farm system for three months of Teixiera and two relief pitchers we don't need, really would've been too much.

    2007-06-27 14:55:07
    253.   regfairfield
    252 A year and three months.
    2007-06-27 14:55:37
    254.   Telemachos
    What's to ruin about Transformers? It was a series based on selling toys, and now it's a movie based on a series based on selling toys. I think it looks all kinds of awesome (yes, incredibly stupid too, but also incredibly awesome).
    2007-06-27 14:55:43
    255.   overkill94
    250 When I got my first tetanus shot my parents got me to stop crying by buying me the set of Transformers that consisted of a bunch of heavy machinery (dump truck, crane, etc). For the life of me, I was never able to put the whole thing together to make the one big Transformer :(
    2007-06-27 14:56:28
    256.   Greg Brock
    Okay, Welles has been used in a few other things, but he made the Transformers cartoon movie and then died.
    2007-06-27 14:56:59
    257.   Hallux Valgus
    250 as I recall, the Constructicons were introduced as direct competition to Voltron, which I find hilarious.

    Now that I think about it- The Insecticons were much dumber than the Dinobots, because they had the same "disguise" issues, but their only discernible value was chewing through stuff.

    2007-06-27 14:57:57
    258.   kngoworld
    VIA ItD:

    Here's tonight's lineup:

    Furcal, SS
    Pierre, CF
    Martin, C
    Kent, 2B
    Gonzo, LF
    Loney, 1B
    Nomar, 3B
    Ethier, RF
    Lowe, P

    2007-06-27 14:57:58
    259.   Hallux Valgus
    256 Didn't the same thing happen to Judd Nelson?
    2007-06-27 14:58:31
    260.   berkowit28
    From ItD:

    Furcal, SS
    Pierre, CF
    Martin, C
    Kent, 2B
    Gonzo, LF
    Loney, 1B
    Nomar, 3B
    Ethier, RF
    Lowe, P

    No Kemp again.

    2007-06-27 14:58:52
    261.   underdog
    250 They were, except they weren't called Transformers. The Takara toy company (why does this sound like that Simpsons episode with Mr. Sparkle?) produced the transforming "Diaclone" and "Micro Change" toy lines. They re-branded those as Transformers for the US via Hasbro. That happened in '84. I dunno the GoBots story but they probably did rip off the Japanese version and then beat Transformers to launch here.


    The worst contracts in sports history, according to one:
    Dodgers/Strawberry makes the list.

    2007-06-27 14:58:56
    262.   Hallux Valgus
    and Nomar just keeps on falling. So how many walks does Loney draw tonight? 3?
    2007-06-27 14:59:22
    263.   Telemachos
    We know a remote farm in Lincolnshire, where Mrs. Buckley lives. Every July, peas grow there.
    2007-06-27 14:59:41
    264.   kngoworld
    If we do not see Kemp in the starting lineup tomorrow I will be very concerned.
    2007-06-27 15:01:25
    265.   underdog
    256 Yes, don't forget Citizen Gobot, his finest hour indeed.

    No, but seriously, he also finished his career as the voice of Robin Masters on Magnum PI, another sad lowlight.

    2007-06-27 15:01:58
    266.   Humma Kavula
    263 I love that.
    2007-06-27 15:02:07
    267.   GobiasIndustries
    Devastator was by far one of the hardest of all Transformers to construct. But boy was he cool.

    Ha! The Insecticons! Those guys were terrible. They brought nothing to the table! I think the two Decepticon Triple Changers (can't recall their names) brought back some level of respectability to the toys and the cartoon though.

    2007-06-27 15:02:32
    268.   LeeLacy
    Quick request: Next week, my dad, two brothers, and I will be making our annual pilgrimage out to Los Angeles (staying in Manhattan Beach) to watch the Dodgers (hopefully) beat up on the Braves on the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. Since it will be the week of July 4th, I figured there may be some interesting events (concerts, tournaments, beach happenings, etc.) that would be worth checking out during our downtime when we're not at Chavez Ravine. If any of you have any recommendations and could pass those on, I'd greatly appreciate it.
    2007-06-27 15:02:36
    269.   trainwreck
    Are we trying to trade Ethier? Because I am getting tired of this.
    2007-06-27 15:02:40
    270.   underdog
    264 Ditto. They could sit Ethier or Gonzo vs. Johnson. Kemp vs. RJ would be fun to watch, no matter what, as someone stated earlier. Dunno if the Dodgers see it that way though.
    2007-06-27 15:02:46
    271.   D4P
    Why drop Nomar but not Pierre? They should go hand in noodle-armed hand.
    2007-06-27 15:03:52
    272.   D4P
    One of the great things about Transformers were the "stats" on the back of the action figure package that you could cut out and keep.
    2007-06-27 15:04:21
    273.   Dodgers49
    260. No Kemp again.

    Grady is saving him for Randy Johnson.

    2007-06-27 15:04:58
    274.   natepurcell
    Probably wouldn't be necessary. I'm guessing Nate wears flip-flops

    Suprisingly, D4P is correct. I only need shoelaces for my basketball and tennis shoes.

    2007-06-27 15:05:10
    275.   trainwreck
    Orson Welles was Unicron, eater of planets.
    2007-06-27 15:08:11
    276.   MC Safety
    while we are on 80's cartoon/movie talk, i need to ask, do any of you guys remember captain power? it was a tv show/interactive game, in which you shot at the screen from your spaceship, and when you were hit the cockpit blew off? mattel put it out. transformers , thundercats, silverhawks, centurians all went by the wayside when i got this. input greatly appreciated.
    2007-06-27 15:08:24
    277.   Hallux Valgus
    272 those, and the bio cards for GI Joe's, were probably the last things I ever properly filed. Garbage Pail Kids? check- organized. Tax returns? Just toss them in that pile over there.
    2007-06-27 15:09:53
    278.   GobiasIndustries
    Can anyone tell me if Higgins was actually Robin Masters? I can't remember.
    2007-06-27 15:11:51
    279.   Hallux Valgus
    276 Wasn't it like Captain Power and his Soldiers of Fortune or something like that? I remember it mostly because my mother wouldn't let me have anything to do with it- too violent.
    2007-06-27 15:13:12
    280.   GobiasIndustries
    Totally! I could tell you everything you ever wanted to know about Destro or Snakeyes.
    2007-06-27 15:13:15
    281.   overkill94
    276 I'm pretty sure I had the action figure of the main guy. I think even as a little kid I realized that the show wasn't really interactive.
    2007-06-27 15:13:29
    282.   underdog
    John Hillerman was Higgins, I thought, and Welles was Masters. Unless I missed a very special episode.


    (Combining two topics) Maybe Matt Kemp needs to transform himself into Kempatron, Destroyer of the Pierre.

    2007-06-27 15:14:47
    283.   D4P
    I remember overpaying my middle school janitor for boxes of 5th edition Garbage Pail Kid packs before they were generally available. He had some kind of connection. I think the 5th ed. was the end of the line for me.
    2007-06-27 15:16:35
    284.   MC Safety
    279- yes. it was awesome. it was sorta violent in a star wars kind of way. it was so much fun. it must have came and gone pretty fast, because no one seems to remember it.
    2007-06-27 15:16:37
    285.   Hallux Valgus
    282 He needs to seize the Matrix of Leadership and become Mattimus Prime.
    2007-06-27 15:16:57
    286.   D4P
    Coming home from school to half hour episodes of Inspector Gadget, Transformers, and GI Joe was massive. And the back-to-back AWA Wrestling/Roller Derby on ESPN Monday nights was tubular.
    2007-06-27 15:17:11
    287.   GobiasIndustries
    Maybe Matt Kemp needs to transform himself into Kempatron, Destroyer of the Pierre.

    It was the 3rd edition for me. I was done after that.

    2007-06-27 15:17:45
    288.   The Blue Legend
    Has anybody hear the rumor that Texas and the Dodgers are talking about doing a Teixirea & Gagne for Loney, Bills, & Kershaw?

    I really hope they don't pull the trigger on this trade offer. I say we stay with what we have. Loney is going to be a stud.

    2007-06-27 15:17:57
    289.   ToyCannon
    I can tell how much older I am then most here when my main toy was a GI Joe, a Cherokee Indian, a big Texan, and the combination of the 3 were used to play hours upon hours of baseball games. The Indian was always the black ballplayer the Texan the big white guy, and GI Joe was everyone else. I'd play a baseball game of dice and then re-enact the game. Not having a TV from 7-10 kind of changes what you do for entertainment.
    2007-06-27 15:18:12
    290.   Dodgers49
    260. One move he could have made with this lineup is flip/flop Kent and LuGo. It then could be right/left from top to bottom (with Furcal being a switch hitter).
    2007-06-27 15:19:16
    291.   GobiasIndustries
    I remember M.A.S.K coming on after Inspector Gadget. Yet another great 80's cartoon.
    2007-06-27 15:21:59
    292.   D4P
    Some of the mock NBA drafts I've seen have Josh McRoberts going to Utah.


    2007-06-27 15:22:18
    293.   Greg Brock
    I've gotta be honest...He-Man is kinda getting ignored here a little bit.
    2007-06-27 15:22:21
    294.   ToyCannon
    KC sweeps the Angels!
    2007-06-27 15:22:59
    295.   underdog
    288 meet 221 and friends.

    Inspector Gadget, another cartoon that was mistakenly turned into a movie. Two movies, in fact(!) I worked for the studio that made the first one that year, and remember being embarrassed by it.

    2007-06-27 15:23:50
    296.   ToyCannon
    I remember my nephew running amuck through the house with his He-Man. Then it was transformers. I bet he's geeked up about the new movie even though he's now 25.
    2007-06-27 15:23:59
    297.   GobiasIndustries
    You're right, you can't have a discussion like this without the likes of Man-In-Arms or Orco coming up at least once.

    Super Fantastico!

    2007-06-27 15:24:16
    298.   D4P
    By the power of Grayskull, I have the powerrrr!!!
    2007-06-27 15:24:20
    299.   underdog
    294 Wow, break up the Royals.
    2007-06-27 15:24:57
    300.   overkill94
    291 Hell yeah on M.A.S.K.! I don't even really remember what it was about (somewhat Transformers-like?), but I remember totally loving it.
    Show/Hide Comments 301-350
    2007-06-27 15:25:23
    301.   Hallux Valgus
    and 293 will soon be added to the list continued by 295... and the Smurfs... and Alvin and the Chipmunks...
    2007-06-27 15:25:26
    302.   Greg Brock
    299 I think they'd like that very much in Kansas City.
    2007-06-27 15:25:35
    303.   MC Safety
    291- MASK was awesome!! battle beasts or dino bots anyone? pretty sure all same era. madballs and my pet monster were also staples in my upbringing.
    2007-06-27 15:27:12
    304.   Humma Kavula
    When we weren't busy being worked to the bone for our seventy-five cent weekly wage, we were watching reruns. You had to be quick with the remote in the Kavula house. If I didn't get it tuned to Inspector Gadget, my sisters would get it and the television would quickly settle on reruns of "Little House on the Prairie," "Full House," and -- I kid you not -- "Small Wonder."

    Mother was not interested in settling this debate.

    2007-06-27 15:27:16
    305.   MC Safety
    298- how great were he man's words of wisdom after every show!! great. covered everything from drugs to spousal abuse to playing tag.
    2007-06-27 15:27:19
    306.   Hallux Valgus
    Orco: Masters of the Universe :: Snarf: Thundercats

    A creepy little thing that no one has a clue as to what it actually is or what it does for the plot.

    2007-06-27 15:27:41
    307.   Greg Brock
    The Eighties really were the high water mark for cartoons and their toy tie-ins.

    1) Think of a toy
    2) Pretend to come up with a cartoon and then a toy
    3) Profit

    2007-06-27 15:28:59
    308.   Greg Brock
    GI Joe taught me not to play with downed power lines. Not sure the world is better for it.

    But knowing is, in fact, half the battle.

    2007-06-27 15:29:06
    309.   Frip
    18 - "But no question, Nomar this year has been nothing short of a disaster."

    So he's been a disaster? Or nothing short of one, which leaves catastrophe and holocaust as options.

    That's saying a bit much for a .270 hitter whose pretty good at first. Seems to me he's a cloudy day, with a smog alert thrown in for OBP.

    But disaster? We're getting carried away now.

    2007-06-27 15:29:11
    310.   MC Safety
    304- vicki from small wonder was my first robot crush!!!!
    2007-06-27 15:29:27
    311.   Jon Weisman
    I am officially infuriated by Evan Grant and that ridiculous article.
    2007-06-27 15:29:36
    312.   Bluebleeder87
    Thunder-Cats was also a well animated, well written cartoon, i'm shocked you've yet talked about the great Thunder-Cats.
    2007-06-27 15:29:51
    313.   GobiasIndustries
    Good guys = M.A.S.K
    Bad guys = V.E.N.O.M

    I remember that the toys I had we're cars. I had a teal 56' chevy with flames on it that turned into a tank of some sort, an orange formula one car that wings came out of the sides, and a green motorcyle that turned into a helicopter. I have no clue what the cartoon was about though. I do however remember the theme song. Strange what we choose to store in our brains....

    2007-06-27 15:29:53
    314.   D4P
    "Small Wonder."

    Ugh. For some reason, I associate that show with Redding. Either it was filmed in Redding or the girl was from Redding or something. Whatever it was, it sucked.

    2007-06-27 15:30:26
    315.   Jon Weisman
    If a blogger were to wishcast like Evan Grant did, he'd be laughed out of the room. But do it in a mainstream paper, and thousands take you seriously.
    2007-06-27 15:30:39
    316.   regfairfield
    309 I don't know what else to call a guy who's last in OPS at his position and is near the bottom of the barrel defensively according to both zone rating and rate2.
    2007-06-27 15:31:49
    317.   Hallux Valgus
    315 spot on. And I thought it used to be confined to guys who covered the Yankees and Mets.
    2007-06-27 15:32:44
    318.   MC Safety
    312- see 276. silverhawks or centurains anyone?
    2007-06-27 15:33:57
    319.   MC Safety
    313- i had the boat.
    2007-06-27 15:36:25
    320.   MC Safety
    313- danny elfman had alot to do with the musical aspect. the theme to pee wee's playhouse is nothing short of sheer brilliance.
    2007-06-27 15:36:28
    321.   Eric Stephen
    Plus, in the Napster halcyon days, there was that great clip of Thundercats outtakes. 5-10 minutes of hilarity!
    2007-06-27 15:36:52
    322.   GobiasIndustries
    Silverhawks used to come on right after Lionel and the Thundercats handed Mumra his latest defeat. At least on KTTV channel 11 back in the day anyway. I just remember the Silverhawks having a really cool robot sounding voice in the theme song. I loved that.
    2007-06-27 15:38:11
    323.   NPB
    A friend had to explain the Transformers to me yesterday. How did I grow up in the 80s and miss that mythology entirely? I guess I was too busy watching "It's Garry Shandling's Show..." Once a comedy dork, always a comedy dork.
    2007-06-27 15:38:32
    324.   GobiasIndustries
    Danny Elfman did the theme to M.A.S.K?
    2007-06-27 15:40:17
    325.   MC Safety
    322- yep classic duo right there. i always thought silverhawks were cool because the characters had corresponding birds that followed them around as sidekicks.
    324- not sure about that specifically but he had his hand in alot of shows music in those days.
    2007-06-27 15:41:12
    326.   underdog
    310 "vicki from small wonder was my first robot crush!!!!"

    Arg. I wanted to crush Vicki from Small Wonder. Ranks #2 after Urkel for most annoying child character ever. Now I remember being really young and yet crushing on the girl from Land of the Lost. What did I know?

    2007-06-27 15:43:27
    327.   Hythloday
    I'm a little late to this discussion, but I have to take umbrage with one thing. Voltron toys were way better than Robotech, but the Robotech cartoon was the best . . . cartoon . . . ever.
    2007-06-27 15:43:40
    328.   Eric Stephen
    RE: Small Wonder

    Looking back, isn't it odd that no one ever noticed anything weird about one of the two children going to school and the other one not? We could sit here and debate Small Wonder plot points all night!

    2007-06-27 15:44:09
    329.   GobiasIndustries
    Vicki ranks higher on the annoyance list than Harriet Brendyl, the redheaded next door neighbor brat that had a crush on Jaime?
    2007-06-27 15:44:17
    330.   overkill94
    Holy crap, YouTube is the greatest thing in the world. For the M.A.S.K. fans:

    2007-06-27 15:44:57
    331.   D4P
    I wanted to crush Vicki from Small Wonder. Ranks #2 after Urkel for most annoying child character ever

    I never actually watched either character, but I still agree. "Screech" has to be up there too, though I never watched him either. Plus, all the kids on "Full House", which I also never watched.

    2007-06-27 15:45:51
    332.   GobiasIndustries
    You must like Japanamation? I myself am a fan of Afghanistanamation!
    2007-06-27 15:46:00
    333.   bryanf
    293 He-Man was my favorite as a kid. I ran from Skeletor when I got to meet him at Universal Studios. (I'm showing my age/youth here a bit I suppose.)
    2007-06-27 15:46:27
    334.   GobiasIndustries
    You rock.
    2007-06-27 15:47:42
    335.   D4P
    Skeletor had a hideous laugh that haunts me whenever I think about it, which is very seldom. But still.
    2007-06-27 15:48:17
    336.   Hythloday
    332 - A totally underrated movie. I approve.

    As a kid a I didn't know Japanimation from a whole in the ground then I saw Akira and Ninja Scrolls. And then . . .

    2007-06-27 15:48:27
    337.   overkill94
    Watching the Go-Bots theme, it seems that I had more Go-Bots than Transformers. Maybe I had the same budgetary problems that someone earlier had. I need to dig up all my old toys from my parents' garage and take a trip down memory lane.
    2007-06-27 15:49:23
    338.   bryanf
    315 I hope no one in the Dodgers organization are among those thousands...
    2007-06-27 15:49:23
    339.   Hallux Valgus
    so here's a question that's been haunting me. Was that the real voice of the guy who did Starscream. Cobra Commander, or was he just really uncreative?
    2007-06-27 15:50:05
    340.   MC Safety
    330- awesome.... i still have that little boat that shoots out of that car.
    333- i still think dolph lundgren's greatest role to this day was playing he man. anyone else growing up in LA, do you guys remember how much masters of the universe the movie would come on! it was one of the all time greats along side all the jean claude van damme movies that came on endlessly in those days.
    2007-06-27 15:50:30
    341.   Hythloday
    I forgot about MASK, I had the helicopter and the 4x4 I think.
    2007-06-27 15:51:11
    342.   Eric Enders
    I would encourage everyone to take 5 minutes and read this blog entry by Padres minor league pitcher Dirk Hayhurst. It's really excellent.

    2007-06-27 15:51:45
    343.   overkill94
    And to cover the whole spectrum of 80's cartoons, someone put together six compilations of their themes:

    2007-06-27 15:51:46
    344.   GobiasIndustries
    Ninja Scrolls. Wow, that takes me back. One of the first films/series of that genre that I remember being blown away by. It was awesome.
    2007-06-27 15:51:48
    345.   Eric Stephen
    Full House...what a cultural phenomenon. Kind of has a Bill Walsh coaching tree of trivial info:

    Danny Tanner: star of 2 top shows simultaneously (Full House, America's Funniest Home Videos), hated by me back in the day but have since come to appreciate his standup comedy at least (and his appearance in "The Aristrocrats")

    Uncle Jesse: went on to marry supermodel Rebecca Romijin. Have mercy!

    DJ: married a hockey player, brother of Growing Pains star turned wacko

    Stephanie: the Dana Plato of this series, a druggie without the fatal end

    Michelle: Matt White couldn't hold a candle to the Olsen Twins financially

    Uncle Joey: Alanis Morissette's "You Oughtta Know" was written about him, her ex-boyfriend.

    2007-06-27 15:51:59
    346.   Bluebleeder87
    ugh, i just saw this little tid bit of info over at ItD, Nomar is 0-10 against Webb & Grady still pencils him in. sigh. Betemits power #"s alone would constitute a start today.
    2007-06-27 15:52:34
    347.   underdog
    329 Um, if that's a Small Wonder reference, keep in mind that I literally only watched 15-20 minutes of that show en total so I may not be aware or have repressed memory of Harriet.

    So, back to baseball, think the Dodgers' season will reach its' lowe webb tonight? /horrible puns, OFF

    2007-06-27 15:53:52
    348.   MC Safety
    344- ninja scroll is awesome. are there any fists of the north star fans here?? any showtime guys?... i know theres at least a couple.
    2007-06-27 15:55:11
    349.   bryanf
    340 I'm a huge fan of the original Masters of the Universe movie starring Dolph himself ... for nostalgic reasons only I'm sure. (I hear they are making a new He-Man movie that I'm sure can't be good.) However, doesn't Ivan Drago (Rocky IV) have to rank as Dolph's finest role?
    2007-06-27 15:55:19
    350.   underdog
    I'm guessing, and this is just a guess, that the main reason for starting Nomar tonight (and at least they moved him further down the lineup, whatever that's worth), is that because of the position switch, they don't want to suddenly bench him after one game there at 3rd. That's my guess, anyway.
    Show/Hide Comments 351-400
    2007-06-27 15:56:37
    351.   GobiasIndustries
    Uncle Joey: Alanis Morissette's "You Oughtta Know" was written about him, her ex-boyfriend.
    Are you serious Clark? (in my best Randy Quaid voice). I don't see those two as a couple at all. But there have been stranger unions.
    2007-06-27 15:56:45
    352.   overkill94
    343 Unfortunately, mixed in with all the awesome cartoons I used to watch are the crappy ones my sisters watched like Jem and My Little Pony.
    2007-06-27 15:56:52
    353.   Eric Stephen
    342 Eric, that was excellent. Dirk Hayhurst is the Paul Shirley of minor league baseball.
    2007-06-27 15:57:40
    354.   MC Safety
    349-no.. ivan drago doesnt hold a candle to he man in my boxing neglected book.
    2007-06-27 15:58:20
    355.   Hallux Valgus
    352 I actually liked Jem. I had a crush on one of the Misfits.
    2007-06-27 15:59:31
    356.   Eric Stephen
    354 "If he dies, he dies."
    "I must break you."

    I think those were Drago's only two lines in the movie, but those were great!

    2007-06-27 15:59:45
    357.   GobiasIndustries
    Fists of the North Star - most definitely!

    Don't forget Rainbow Brite and Carebears. I had two little sisters too.

    2007-06-27 16:01:16
    358.   Hythloday
    355 - Whenever people talk about synergy in meetings I suggest you grab your ear and say, "Showtime!"
    2007-06-27 16:01:39
    359.   Greg Brock
    We've done quality "It's Garry Shandling's Show" chatting here. But it was with Steve. And Steve is not around (sniff).
    2007-06-27 16:02:42
    360.   MC Safety
    352- and strawberry shortcake. my sister had every single my little pony!! we used to have wars and her ponys would always win....
    2007-06-27 16:03:01
    361.   overkill94
    Aww man, how did I forget about the immortal Count Duckula?
    2007-06-27 16:03:08
    362.   bryanf
    356 Exactly. It was all about those great one-liners and the facial expressions he made. Although, I think I loved the tall 80s blonde from Beverly Hills Cop II as his wife in that movie more than Dolph himself.
    2007-06-27 16:04:25
    363.   Eric Enders
    357 My little brother used to be into Cabbage Patch Dolls. It's something I still bring up whenever I feel the need to mock him.
    2007-06-27 16:05:44
    364.   overkill94
    356 Don't forget "it's like hitting steel"
    2007-06-27 16:05:56
    365.   GobiasIndustries
    Brigette Neilson. Watch any of VH1's Surreal Life or that Flavor Flav show with her and reality will slap you in the face!
    2007-06-27 16:06:46
    366.   Hallux Valgus
    363 My little brother watched Full House, and the first Home Alone movie, and that's pretty much it. To this day, he eats only cheese pizza because he got in the habit after watching Home Alone (he's 21 freakin years old). He's pretty easily mockable.
    2007-06-27 16:07:14
    367.   Xeifrank
    hmmm, think I'll come back when Dodger chat begins. vr, Xei
    2007-06-27 16:07:25
    368.   El Lay Dave
    256 Which Transformer changed into a sled?

    I'm with Toy Cannon, too old for this. I attended my daughter's friends' birthday parties where Transformers were hot gifts. In my day, anime was Speed Racer cartoons in grainy UHF. We thought it was far out when Hot Wheels came out with the Boss Hoss. Afternoon reruns were black and white episodes of The Addams Family, The Patty Duke Show, The Donna Reed Show and so on. Sunday morning was The Bullwinkle Show and Wonderama. The DH didn't exist and a 4.00 ERA was horrible. Yada, yada, yada, get offa my lawn you kids....

    2007-06-27 16:07:45
    369.   MC Safety
    357- fist of the north star is classic. showtime just took it off the air like 3 years ago im pretty sure. i love the stereotypical 80's cyber punk bad guys on motorcycles with chains and guns. the running man with arnold brought that fantasy to the silver screen for me...
    2007-06-27 16:08:03
    370.   GobiasIndustries
    Adult Cabbage patch kid mockery = Hilariousness!
    2007-06-27 16:09:02
    371.   Andrew Shimmin
    173- You dare question the logic of the gambler's fallacy? They told me you numbers guys were crazy.
    2007-06-27 16:09:36
    372.   Humma Kavula
    326 et al... Regarding most annoying child character...

    Winthrop Paroo is #1. All other characters are Walter Mondale to his Ronald Reagan.

    It doesn't even matter who is playing Winthrop Paroo -- he is so annoying that he transcends any actor's ability to play him, regardless of talent.

    Winthrop Paroo. -shudder.-

    2007-06-27 16:10:00
    373.   MC Safety
    361- the immortal count duckula. how about danger mouse right before that? those were the last two shows i wanted to watch before nick at night came on and i had to go change mr. ed.
    2007-06-27 16:10:10
    374.   Bluebleeder87

    really nice, it's part of the reason i have a if you meet someone famous just talk about regular things code.

    2007-06-27 16:13:14
    375.   overkill94
    What's amazing to me after watching all these theme songs is

    a) that some of my favorites seemed to be on the air for only a year or two (Heathcliff, Denver the Last Dinosaur)

    b) how much TV I must have watched

    2007-06-27 16:14:42
    376.   overkill94
    Thundercats was only on for one season???
    2007-06-27 16:16:40
    377.   MC Safety
    375- we seem to be on the exact same " thrown in front of the tube " wavelength. its wierd i was only born in 83 but i have toys from like 84 85 and remember shows as far back as then.
    2007-06-27 16:19:40
    378.   Bluebleeder87

    darn you overkill!!! you stole my thunder! i was gonna mentioned those also. (I have 6 sisters) aside from my Dad i was the lone macho in the house.

    2007-06-27 16:20:51
    379.   overkill94
    I was born in 80, so since most of these cartoons seemed to come out from 84-87 it's not surprising that I was watching them. I guess the fact that I was in Colombia for half of that period explains why I wasn't out playing with other kids as much.
    2007-06-27 16:30:35
    380.   underdog
    Damn, I feel old all of a sudden.

    I think I'll take a bike ride.

    2007-06-27 16:32:45
    381.   Bluebleeder87
    I wasn't out playing with other kids as much.

    That's were you & i defer, i spent most of my time either outside playing ball & kicking it at my friends house watching cartoons or annoying my sisters by turning off the t.v. & running outside like a bat out of hell & them chasing me. good times.

    2007-06-27 16:35:09
    382.   overkill94
    Chuck Norris had his own cartoon? I should have known.
    2007-06-27 16:35:16
    383.   JoeyP
    Matt Cain gives real meaning to 'tough luck' pitcher.

    His record is 2-9.
    ERA of 3.38

    So when does he get the "isnt a winner" tag from the old school baseball media?

    2007-06-27 16:36:10
    384.   Hallux Valgus
    just too timely:
    2007-06-27 16:38:11
    385.   overkill94
    381 Well, when you're in South America and don't speak Spanish, it kinda puts a damper on your social life. I think I did have one friend in our camp, but for the most part I think I hung out with my sisters and watched cartoons and Star Wars movies.
    2007-06-27 16:39:03
    386.   Greg Brock
    Matt Cain's teammates don't try as hard when he's on the field. Or they are in awe of him.

    Steve Phillips taught me that!

    2007-06-27 16:42:07
    387.   ryu
    379 Hola, paisano.
    2007-06-27 16:43:29
    388.   Eric Stephen
    386 Which Steve Phillips was it? Pink shirt or blue?
    2007-06-27 16:45:55
    389.   jasonungar07
    So I was wondering what you guys think, is Loney a better all around player than Kemp right now?
    2007-06-27 16:47:00
    390.   Bluebleeder87
    i'm still kind of PO'ed Betemit didn't get penciled in today, oh well.
    2007-06-27 16:49:10
    391.   Eric Stephen
    390 Yeah, I would have thought at least one of Betemit or (more likely) Abreu would be in there today, for defense if anything with Lowe on the mound.
    2007-06-27 16:54:46
    392.   Indiana Jon
    389 I don't think so. Without looking, I would say Kemp has been the better hitter at every level.
    2007-06-27 16:55:39
    393.   regfairfield
    389 No, Loney has done this for 100 at bats, Kemp has done his thing his whole career.
    2007-06-27 16:58:19
    394.   Eric Enders
    Loney would have to be a significantly better hitter than Kemp to make up for Kemp's edge in baserunning and athleticism.
    2007-06-27 16:59:25
    395.   rjc41276
    Don't mean to get picky but wasn't Olmedo Saenz one of the first players brought in by DePodesta? (he's listed under Evans)

    I thought Depo brought him in due to his familiarity with Saenz from the A's system.

    2007-06-27 17:04:57
    396.   jasonungar07
    cool guys.

    I guess my next question would be is he better than Pierre ,Gonzo or Ethier right now.

    I feel there is no way he is not one of our best 3 OF'ers right now.

    2007-06-27 17:05:36
    397.   Indiana Jon
    Interesting that the opinion so far here is that Kemp is the better player. At ITD, the opinion goes the other way.
    2007-06-27 17:06:24
    398.   Indiana Jon
    396 If he replaced any of the three, I would be a happy guy.
    2007-06-27 17:06:44
    399.   alex 7
    I think he means pitcher Rudy Seanez.
    2007-06-27 17:07:25
    400.   Eric Enders
    395 Jon's got it right. Saenz was an Evans signee.
    Show/Hide Comments 401-450
    2007-06-27 17:07:40
    401.   Icaros
    Saenz was in camp that spring before DePodesta was hired.
    2007-06-27 17:08:25
    402.   Eric Enders
    He was only an NRI, though, so I guess you have to give DePo some credit for actually keeping him.
    2007-06-27 17:11:08
    403.   Icaros
    Yeah, DePodesta could've kept Bubba Trammell instead.
    2007-06-27 17:11:36
    404.   Eric Stephen
    Here's how I see Kemp:

    Best-case scenario - he's the best current Dodger OFer
    Worst-case scenario - he's still a better hitter than JP Wouldn't Kemp at least be able to match .274/.305/.325?

    I can't see a rational argument for not starting Kemp as often as possible.

    I'm willing to let Kemp & Ethier get 4 games out of every 6, with Gonzo & Pierre getting 5 of 6. Anything to get Kemp in the lineup at least semi-regularly.

    The only "door" left to be knocked down is Pierre's games played streak, and his unfathomable status as an everyday player. ("Regular player" I can at least accept; but never a day off? Really?)

    2007-06-27 17:13:21
    405.   Eric Enders
    404 Or Little Giambi!
    2007-06-27 17:14:01
    406.   Eric Enders
    Er, that was directed at 403.
    2007-06-27 17:15:50
    407.   Icaros

    Didn't they keep Little Giambi in the minors for awhile that year, but then he hurt his back or something?

    2007-06-27 17:19:29
    408.   JoeyP
    Can any basketball fans shed some light on what the Phoenix Suns are thinking?

    Apparently, they are willing to trade Amare Stoudamire for Garnett straight up?

    Any reason why?
    I dont think that makes the Suns better, but it does make them much older.

    2007-06-27 17:23:17
    409.   CanuckDodger
    I am surprised certain people think that Kemp is a better all-around player than Loney right NOW. Kemp has greater potential, will have the better career barring an unlikely failure to develop more or has a serious injury, but Loney is far more advanced than Kemp as a baseball player at the present time. Loney has a much more mature approach at the plate, and he plays his position much better. Loney is a year older than Kemp, and there is a reason why Loney was a 1st rounder while Kemp was only a 6th rounder.
    2007-06-27 17:25:31
    410.   Lexinthedena
    408- Garnett is a dominant defensive player, and Suns need interior defense bad....Amare isn't the player that Garnett is....
    2007-06-27 17:25:41
    411.   Who Is Karim Garcia
    One of these is not like the other...

    Player 1 OPS+ 67

    Player 2 OPS+ 101

    Player 3 OPS+ 158

    Player 4 OPS+ 133

    (You guess which one Pierre is.)

    2007-06-27 17:31:33
    412.   Indiana Jon
    409 Wasn't Kemp a 6th rounder in part because he was a basketball player? How do you explain the fact that Loney has only had one great season in the minors?
    2007-06-27 17:34:31
    413.   CanuckDodger
    About Jon's list, Tony Abreu can't be credited to Logan White, and I don't think Kuo can be credited to Ed Creech. The scouting director only deals with American (including Puerto Rican) and Canadian amateur players. Teams have a director of international scouting to deal with the other amateurs. I don't know who held that post before 2002, but I know Rene Francisco (now with the Kansas City Royals) held it when Abreu was signed in 2002.
    2007-06-27 17:36:49
    414.   Jon Weisman
    409 - Right now, I would say Kemp has more power (despite Loney's recent power surge) and more speed. Loney is a better fielder (though at a more replaceable position). Loney is a better hitter for average (though less likely to get an infield single!) and has a better eye. I prize power so I would give the edge to Kemp. But certainly Loney's recent power surge has been something to behold, and maybe I'm underrating Loney's eye.
    2007-06-27 17:39:14
    415.   Marty
    I feel like I've spent the day at a daycare facility.
    2007-06-27 17:40:18
    416.   Lexinthedena
    414- I would say that Kemp probably has a quicker bat, and is physically stronger, but at this point do we really know who is going to end up hitting more home runs?....Loney is doing things we didn't think he could do!....Is his power a fluke? or just adjustments in his mechanics...?
    2007-06-27 17:41:27
    417.   CanuckDodger
    412 -- A basketball player, exactly. Kemp started his pro baseball career behind the development curve because of his lack of experience, and he is still behind Loney on that curve.

    Injuries and recovery from injuries diminished Loney's stats in the minors between his stunning rookie season and his stunning 2006 season, while Kemp has never been seriously hurt.

    2007-06-27 17:41:31
    418.   Doctor
    Hard to judge Kemp when all he does is ride pine. This is getting rediculous.
    2007-06-27 17:41:36
    419.   Greg Brock
    415 Marty wants all of us off his lawn.


    2007-06-27 17:44:59
    420.   Eric Enders
    409 Loney is a much more polished hitter, no question about it. But the question was who is the better player, which is something different. I do think that's Kemp. His position is not at the very end of the defensive spectrum like Loney's, and he brings a certain athletic ability that Loney doesn't. And, let's face it, a lot more power than Loney, the last week notwithstanding.

    Those who question Kemp, I think, are committing what Bill James used to rail against as the cardinal sin of baseball evaluation -- judging a player by what he can't do, rather than by what he can. Kemp looks bad swinging at breaking balls, but that doesn't make the good aspects of his game less good. If he can hit .345 in the minors over the last year and a half, or .420 in the majors this year, he's bringing valuable things to the table regardless of how many curveballs he flails at.

    Jon put it well in his SI column the other day: Kemp would be a relatively valuable player even hitting .230 or .240. Loney is the opposite; unless his Babe Ruth fortnight is for real, he's the type of player who needs to hit at least .280-.290 to be useful.

    2007-06-27 17:45:59
    421.   Indiana Jon
    417 Even in his stunning 2006 season at Vegas, he was out OPSed by one guy on that team, Kemp.
    2007-06-27 17:46:03
    422.   natepurcell

    that has to be him right?

    2007-06-27 17:48:17
    423.   jasonungar07
    So is it simply economics (and commitment) then on why Kemp isn't in there now?
    2007-06-27 17:48:52
    424.   CanuckDodger
    414 -- Power and speed are "tools," and Kemp's superior tools account for why Kemp is likely going to be the better player in the long run, but the person who asked the original question seemed to me to be asking a question that calls for looking at which player has -- at this point -- done a better job of turning his tools into usable skills. I think Loney wins that contest.
    2007-06-27 17:51:57
    425.   Eric Enders
    417 "Kemp started his pro baseball career behind the development curve because of his lack of experience, and he is still behind Loney on that curve."

    You seem to be judging the players based on polish, on the degree to which each has already maximized his potential. By that yardstick, Loney wins. But if you compare them to each other, right now, as baseball players, instead of to their respective ceilings, I think it's relatively simple to draw the conclusion that Kemp is the better player.

    2007-06-27 17:53:25
    426.   Jon Weisman
    424 - We're getting into semantics here. I think it's pretty clear that Kemp has put his power and speed to pretty good use so far, but I don't really want to argue.

    Coincidentally, new post up top.

    2007-06-27 17:55:13
    427.   schoffle
    WOW, I am stunned by the anwsers to 389

    Right Now Loney is a better player than Pujols! Next week (and almost every week after that), probably not.

    Loney is in such a zone it seems like he picks up piches before they leave the pitchers hand.

    2007-06-27 17:57:08
    428.   lab rat
    422 -- Is Jeff Blair secretly Norwegian?
    2007-06-27 17:59:02
    429.   lab rat
    428 -- Correction: Kyle Blair.
    2007-06-27 20:21:00
    430.   LADfan in IL
    Can someone explain why a .423 hitter sits on the bench for 3 days?

    Comment status: comments have been closed. Baseball Toaster is now out of business.