And I was all set to link to my breakdown of key dates in the A-Rod opting out timetable.

Also, the rare post by Jon that duplicates a Griddle post.

And it took Fox only a few minutes to disrupt the 8th inning of the possible last game of the World Series to bring up A-Rod.

But it is news.

2
I was two minutes later, but Jon decided to actually you know ... write stuff.

2 - I won by two minutes. :)

Also, I thought this had enough Dodger interest that I could run with it, knowing that Bob would be running with it too. Bronx Banter may well do their own post too, right?

This is pretty funny, Joe, Tim and Kenny talking about the Red Sox signing A-Rod but only if it is appropriate.

Of course, unless you manually change the times, those times are the times the thread is created, not the time the thread is completed. So Bob might have actually won in terms of getting the news up.

4 Of course Jon, no problem. The funny thing is that someone will be posting on the game thread that A-Rod has opted out too.

At first glance I thought that read "There for the (Expletive) Taking."

I think Suffering Bruin posted it first on the game thread.

Bronx Banter regulars are now planning to boo A-Rod from now on.

Seeing Bad Altitude only had 5 posts when I checked, made me realize how good I had it at DT. To be frank, I would be happy to have nothing to do with either A-Rod or Scott Boras. After tonights announcement, I don't know who I find more repulsive, and this is both considered thought and gut feeling.

I did not change the time on my post.

Bad Altitude did not host the Game Chat tonight. It's on Cardboard Gods.

11 Thank you Bob. You may mitigate my foolishness somewhat.

As most here know I've long been one of those irrational (as someone here called us a few weeks ago) people who expected A-Rod to opt out. But I never expected that he would opt out before even receiving the Yankees extension offer. Man, that Scott Boras is one heck of an agent. Ned Colletti will be out of his element trying to negotiate with him. The two most likely outcomes will be:
1). Boras will just use Ned to up the price for others, or
2). Ned will have to overpay (and by a lot).

I didn't like Shaq when he was with Orlando, cringed when I found out he'd be joining my Lakers...By the time title number three came to L.A, my Shaq appreciation had long been solidified.

Watch, it will be Detroit.

You heard it here first.

I wonder what Bud Selig is thinking now?

I can't imagine that we'll actually land the man, but the Dodgers need to go after him this offseason. A-Rod plus whatever we get for LaRoche is exponentially better than anything else Ned could do this offseason, cost be damned.

I would love to see Colletti dance with the Devil himself.

Hypothetically speaking, if Arod goes to the Dodgers, what would everyone do with Laroche?

18- Package him with Pierre for a young arm...

That's what i would do:)

19 You guys must really stop this fantasy of dealing Pierre, trust me you will sleep better at night.

18 Trade him for Kevin Slowey

18 - Either package hime with Pierre for a good young outfielder or have him learn 2nd and find a new home for Abreu.

22- Since we know Pierre isn't actually gonna be dealt, I like the idea of moving him to second...Abreu would make a fine utility man.

15 Looking at Detroit's payroll for the next couple of years, they are going to be starting to pay several players multiple millions of dollars to play so despite the good working relationship they have with Boras, they might not be players after all.

But its a pretty short list of potential suitors.

19,22

LaRoche and Pierre pretty much cancel each other out. I think that for nothing is a pretty fair deal.

23
Would Juan Pierre be worse as a left-handed second baseman or a left-handed outfielder?

Left-handed second basemen don't turn many DPs.

Another scenario might be to have a crowded infield for a year and move Arod to SS after Furcals deal is up. Maybe even have Laroche at 3rd Arod at SS and trade Furcal to the Cubs.

Can Arod play shortstop anymore?

24 Suitors for A-Rod

1. Yankees, they said no dealing with him if he opted out, we shall see.
2. Mets, Wright and Reyes are taking up the left side of the infield, can't see it, though I'm sure they would love it.
3. Red Sox, the revenge for Roger Clemens, Lowell makes more financial sense though Big Papi and Manny can't last forever.
4. Cubs, they would have to trade their Ramirez, which wouldn't be easy but more importantly, their sale is still pending so MLB will frown on anymore long term debt being added to the franchise.
5. Tigers, they certainly have a hole in their line up, Leyland would be a good manager for him, he has Sheff with him but does Detroit want to be the 3rd highest payroll in baseball, that is doubtful.
6. Angels, I see a lot of local pressure (Simers, Plaschke, sports talk guys, etc.) coming down on the Angels to add this power bat. Arte has said in the recent past that he will not pay someone what A-Rod is expecting to ask for but if Alex signs elsewehere and they don't add that bat in the off-season, they will hear about it.
7. Giants, why not, they have space for him and it would certainly continue to bring fans into AT&T but economically, does it make sense.
8. Dodgers, on the one hand, A-Rod would certainly protect all the kids, make the Dodgers a strong contender for the playoffs and probably put the Dodgers over 4 million next year. But, that would be an awful lot of cash and they would have to deal with Boras.

25 LaRoche isn't worth 36 million for 6 years of pre-free agent salary unless he hits 25-30 HRs/season. Also, they would have to play Pierre too.

Did comment 1 get deleted, or did it magically vanish? We had that happen over at BB.

Also, I believe Cashman. I don't think Arod will be a Yankee.

30 I think you're over estimating what 36 million is worth. He would only need to be about 6 win shares above replacement a year to make that much. Kemp was worth that much for a good half a season.

Though the point was that you aren't getting anything if you put Pierre in a trade, so if you think it's not enough, that's fine.

So does the 15 day countdown for free agency start the day the game ends local time or East Coast time.

So Lugo has a World series ring.

Julio Lugo, World Series champion.

Awwww.

So how did the Red Sox survive with a mix of experienced veterans and coddled youngsters?

It just makes a ton of sense for the Dodgers to sign A-Rod. They have a low payroll going forward with all the kids, they need a big bat and a star, and it fits with our preferred philosophy of only signing a veteran who is a superstar.

It also makes a ton of sense for the Angels, who have a huge hole at 3B and also need power.

I fully expect A-Rod to be an Angel or Dodger.

32 I think you're over estimating what 36 million is worth.

Don't feel bad, I make that mistake all the time. I head out for the evening with $36 million in my pocket and by the time I get home, I'm asking "Where did it all go?"

38 Don't you think the Red Sox and Yankees will essentially swap third basemen?

With AROD do we just become the latest incarnation of the evil empire? I'd rather have A Jones and LaRoche the next 4 yrs than Pierre and AROD. If LaRoche can hit like Youkilis my tandem is worth around 14 WARP to 12.5 for AROD/Pierre.

41 I don't see it because I don't think the Red Sox break the bank for A-Rod. They've already got a World Series team. Do you think they'll become the new Yankees and sign him anyway and skyrocket the payroll?

I suppose I wouldn't be too surprised, but I still put my money on the Angels and Dodgers. If all things were equal, I'd guess Dodgers because he could be the guy in LA, and own the town, but of course he'll go where the money is highest.

I've had a revelation. If Ned goes after A-rod it could keep him from screwing up anything else. Believe me A-rod is no great shakes, and has never got a team a World Series. But then we would have to trade a package like Laroche and Abreu. And we better get something great. We would be giving a small market team a left side that would cost nothing. If properly managed we could be good. Not my personal preferance, but a competent person could found a dynasty on this.

I actually think pitching is the thing, so I would trade none.

43 It makes them better, why wouldn't they? They're dropping around 23 million between Schilling and Lowell alone so it wouldn't break the bank.

41 Why do we become an evil empire? We'd start the year with five key players from our farm and up to five more being added the next year. Spending money on one player doesn't make you evil.

Also, the problem with your scenario is Pierre isn't going anywhere.

43 A-Rod is one of the best players in baseball, if he isn't great shakes, who is?

41

your scenario hinges on

1. the idea that we could actually trade pierre

2. the idea that we could trade pierre and basically not pay his whole salary.

45 I sort off get it.
44 I this to my 43; elaborate--I don't get it.

47 Wow, lots of errors there. 45 was for you.

45,48 sorry about the Typos. Your point is good-my pessimism is about Coletti's ability to get value in that kind of trade.
And I suppose I must admit repugnance to A-Rod and Boras' GREED. Call it fair value if you must.

My pick for the Arod sweepstakes...the Giants. I think they will offer the most amount of money and replace Barry Bonds as the face of that franchise. My guess for a contract is 8 years and $252 million with opt outs after seasons 3 and 5.

50
I don't think A-Rod will go to a place where he can't win for awhile.

While I'm ranting--what is this policy of huge oil prices and a worthless dollar about OOps- it just slipped.I think the Dodgers are fine if they keep their players and stay the course.

AROD met with Boras for a couple of days and together they explored what AROD wanted to do. They could have decided where he could make the most money but not necessarily. AROD has plenty of money and maybe now he just wants to play where he wants to play and maybe he wants to get that paycheck monkey off his back.

Twenty million dollars is still huge and there are those endorsements.

AROD just might, odds be as they are, play for the team of his choice for $20 Million a year.

This will be interesting.

As I've said, I advocate overpaying for A-Rod. I wonder what Boras would say to a 3-year, $110 million deal... and I am not even sure it's a good idea.

If the Dodgers don't get A-Rod, then our opening day third baseman's first name will start with A: Anthony Nomar Garciaparra. He'll lose his job mid-season to LaRoche.

If Colletti does get A-Rod, I believe (but cannot prove) that he may feel the necessity to trade both LaRoche and Garciaparra, "the respected veteran." Garciaparra will yield nothing, of course... but I doubt he would ask Nomar to start the season on the bench.

If ARod can still play short here's what I could see happening. Boston signs him. They dump Lugo to whomever will take his contract, move Youkilis over to third and trade for a cheap fist basemen (Dan Johnson?). They'd be losing Lowell's and Lugo's contract so the payroll hit wouldn't actually be that big.

AROD just might, odds be as they are, play for the team of his choice for $20 Million a year.

No way. ARod is going to be the highest paid payer in the Majors and anything else would be an insult to him and Boras (Thats what they woudl think, not me).

ARod is not going to be playing short. He has his hands full at 3rd, and he's bigger and slower than he was when he played short.

There is no way Arod takes a 3 year deal. Not even at 110 mil total. Why would he, when he can near 10 years, 300 million total?

53 If A-Rod drops Boras, then maybe I could see your scenario. But he's not so it will be about the money. He's done well evan with being the highest paid player, so why should that change.

58 Why would he, when he can near 10 years, 300 million total?

Well, if Boras thinks that at the end of the 3 years, he will be able to put together a 7-year, $250 million deal, that would be one reason. $37 million a year is a lot and 3 years from now A-Rod will still be in, or near, his prime.

29. 4. Cubs, they would have to trade their Ramirez

Are we assuming A-Rod can no longer play shortstop?

58 60 I should make it clear that I don't actually think this will happen. Just that if it CAN happen, it MIGHT be a good idea. Or it might not. What do I know? Nothing.

I just don't know what reasonable argument exists for NOT going after AROD. It's not like there's a fixed budget we're working with that we can argue about how to allocate. Frank and Ned have shown a willingness to spend on free agents, they just haven't all panned out. This could be the best free agent in the history of baseball to ever come out, in his prime. We have a major hole at 3b, not to mention plenty of young players under minimum contracts. It seems to me that all the stars are aligned. Those who oppose such a push, I argue, have become complacent and accustomed to the losing the Dodgers have been doing in the past 10 years. There's not enough anger and hunger around here (LA). We're the friggin Dodgers! I'm not saying let's sign anything that moves at any price Kevin Malone style, but this is quite possibly the greatest player to ever put on a uniform when it's all said and done. And man are we starving for someone to bring us back to our winning tradition.

So are we going to bat ARod 3rd or 4th?

Where he should end up: Los Angeles (NL)

Where he will end up:

San Francisco
Chicago (both)
Detroit

It is laughable thinking A-Rod would opt out and not ask at least 30 mil a year( for about 6-8) years. Good luck to anyone that puts up with this.

Andruw Jones + a complete Pierre write-off plus LaRoche is still less than $30,000,000/year.

Bye bye A-Rod

>> New York was preparing to offer Rodriguez a four- or five-year extension worth between $25 million and $30 million annually and had hoped to meet with A-Rod to present the offer.

"We didn't want to enter in a discussion of the economic parameters until we knew the status of players because that was central to Alex's decision,'' Boras said. <<

http://tinyurl.com/36pw6y

67 Good point.

If you don't have premium content for ESPN.com, then just wait to hear Buster Olney on their various outlets blast A-Rod and Boras for upstaging the World Series with this announcement.

And he says more too.

Royce Clayton seems to be enjoying his first WS ring after 17 seasons. His 2007 contribution to the Red Sox: 6 hitless AB's. He did have 5 assists though.

70
It was Buster riding his highest horse yet!

70 And before I feel bad for the Red Sox being upstaged by AROD's news, I'll wait to see if they sign the guy.

70 That was amazing. Full judgment mode.

70 Any choice quotes? It certainly was bad timing and not fair to the Red Sox--as a Yankee fan I can't believe I'm saying that:)

70. If you don't have premium content for ESPN.com

Actually, premium content isn't needed to read the article.

http://tinyurl.com/2wgxtq

70 I think you can now read it on their regular site, go to their MLB page and look for Olney's story in the bottom left box.

76 Initially it was posted on their "Insider site" but it was reprinted on their regular site a few minutes later.

A-Rod opting out of contract

>> Boras hasn't said how much he believes Rodriguez is worth on the open market, but he suggested in interviews that Rodriguez could be worth $500 million to the Yankees over the next 10 years. It's clear he's shooting for a deal well in excess of $300 million, perhaps even as much as $400 million. Rodriguez was to make $91 million over the final three years of his Rangers/Yankees deal. <<

http://tinyurl.com/ypnr3q

Part of me wants to think that Boras is leaking this opting out stuff as a negotiation ploy. The only real chip that Cashman has is that they won't negotiate with Arod if he opts out. Now if he threatens to opt out (this may just be a Boras-threat as he has 10 days left to decide) and Cashman backs off and keeps negotiating, then Boras has won the chess match. vr, Xei

From the NY Times piece:

"It's a shame," said Hank Steinbrenner, who is now running the Yankees, "but we are all in agreement: myself, my dad, my brother, all the baseball people. If you don't want to be a Yankee and paid what you're being paid, we don't want you, that's the bottom line. You'd be hard-pressed to argue that point. If you don't understand the magnitude of being a Yankee and understand what that means, and being the highest-paid player in baseball, I think it's pretty obvious."

If you don't understand the magnitude of being a Yankee...

Wow. Perhaps we could just eliminate the word "hubris" and use "Yankee" instead. What does it mean to be a Yankee? Does the sun shine a little brighter? Do the roses smell a bit sweeter? Do canaries land on your shoulders and whistle in harmony? Goodness.

Kemp
Loney
Arod
Kent
Martin

2-6 could score some runs.

82 But I think he has public (Yankee fans) on his side in this debate.

84 Of course. But it takes outsiders to realize the insanity of a cult.

"Magnitude of being a Yankee." Just amazing.

82. >> "If we're going to make you rich and we're going to give you the privilege of being a Yankee," he said, "you've got to show us you want to be here." <<

http://tinyurl.com/33w6hc

80 By making the announcement before the 10 days started, Boras was putting pressure on the Yankees. If the Yankees do not budge from their stance, they will lose their best player. If the Yankees change their minds and agree to negotiate with Boras, Boras will know how badly they want to keep Rodriguez and will be able to use that as leverage.

http://tinyurl.com/33w6hc

"Does he want to go into the Hall of Fame as a Yankee," Steinbrenner said, "or a Toledo Mud Hen?"

Steinbrenner is not bitter is he?

At the end of the LA Times story about the World Series (for the record, Boston won).

Inside the Boston clubhouse, wearing a pair of goggles to protect his eyes from flying champagne, outfielder J.D. Drew leaned against a locker and smiled. He was at the center of controversy this time last year, when he opted out of his contract with the Dodgers to try free agency, and now he will wear a ring.

"I was looking for a team I knew had a chance to compete," Drew said. "Looks like I chose the right one."

Don't know if it got lost in ESPN-TV's truncated version of Baseball Tonight on Sports Center in between the Blitz, but Peter Gammons came down very hard on both Boras and AROD, and repeatedly made the point that AROD has never won a World Series and truth be told that both with Seattle and the Yankees he had teams that were better than the current make-up of the 2008 Dodgers.

If I were the Dodgers and attempting to sign AROD, I might take a different tack and make a public offer of 3-4 years at 30 million per year with certain incentives. I doubt Boras would take it, but it does prevent the Dodgers from negotiating against themselves and also might push the Dodgers and their players to know that this is the window to make things happen or else.

I realize this is fantasy, but who is to say that AROD can't have a major injury or get bored at 35.

89 I guess leaving a team that just made the playoffs to one that faded in August was the smart move.

Whatever.

90 Who's to say he won't finish his career as an inner circle hall of famer?

92 Inner Circle?

J.D. was one of the two idiots thrown out at the plate on the same play, right?

My Who's-To-Sabermetrics pythagorean sliderule says the Dodgers' chances of winning a world championship in 2006 dropped 68 percent right after that happened.

I can't think of a free agent that's more "Ned" than Mike Lowell. He has an infinitely better chance of signing here than A-Rod.

I hope the Red Sox buy ARod. They'll ensure the first ten years of their new drought.

I give up. Where others talk about the homegrown players on Boston's roster, we have this from our own flip flopper.

http://tinyurl.com/3amt54

95 Agree. I think Lowell will be in Boston next year, but I'm sure Ned is salivating to get him.

95

No doubt, silver. If Chick Hearn were around to see this, he'd say they TELEGRAPHED that transaction.

I know why Lowell is a bad idea, but for those of you who tuned in late:

Career Year in 2007
Low OBP in years other than 2007
Figures to hit 20 hr or less in '08 and beyond

---

Re: Arod. This is as surprising as Drew opting out. That basically means "not at all surprising." I just love how other players are quick to bag the Dodgers when they leave them. JD Drew didn't want a contender, he wanted "whoever paid him the most money." He can stop right now trying to say he wanted a team with a chance to compete.

97

You know they always used to tell me: The best way to make bullies stop pestering you is to not listen. Just walk away.

It's amazing how well that worked. I'm hoping Frank and Arte follow the same advice.

Doesn't the media control whether A-Rod opting out upstages the World Series?

97 So...Plaschke has gone from:

Veterans and money win championships
to
Damn the torpedoes, the youth movement shall be served
to
Prospects are chips, to be sold. Spend! Spend! Spend!

Is anybody at the LAT paying attention?

101 When the best (paid) player is leaving the premier team, its news. Especially when Boras emails the press directly.

103
Sure, but they kept talking about it while covering the World Series.

I think the story should have had its own separate segment. Bringing up the A-Rod story, while talking about the World Series makes the story seem equal to the World Series or close.

Someone said earlier in the thread that he can't think of any reason somebody could oppose the Dodgers going after A-Rod (and predictably he added "We're the friggin Dodgers," which is always a give-away that somebody wants to do something stupid). I don't want to see A-Rod on the Dodgers, and the reasons are numerous:

(1). I don't like A-Rod.
(2). I don't like A-Rod's agent.
(3). We already have one of the top two third base prospects in baseball and he is MLB-ready.
(4). I don't want a "bought" superstar being to the Dodgers what Barry Bonds was to the Giants: a justification to never build and always "Win Now!" with veterans.
(5). The kind of money A-Rod wants makes no sense for a team to spend on one player unless it has the payroll of the Yankees or Red Sox and its own TV network.
(6). Plaschke wants A-Rod in L.A., and I really don't want that fool getting anything he desires.

We'd have a few years before we'd have to worry about "winning one for Arod".

Getting Arod would probably help the team get it's own TV network in a few years. I think the two LA teams have the most to gain from Arod economically. 4 million fans paying increased ticket prices next year plus extra merchandise sales would surely look pretty good to McCourt.

Laroche can only dream of being the fraction of what Arod is, on a down year. LaRoche is a reason to pass on Lowell. He's not a reason to pass on one of the greatest players ever. Now, I would buy into the argument that we're better of with Laroche plus 30 million to spend elsewhere, but alas our team is ran by a moron who has demonstrated zero ability to spend the big money.

Signing Arod pretty much forces Ned to play the kids since he won't have anymore money to waste on say Hunter or Rowand. Hey it might even make Ned dump Kent and get Hu or Abreu in the lineup.

106 -- I think you are kidding yourself if you think A-Rod is going to be part of a team in which he is surrounded by kids, and once he is here, with a ridiculously expensive, and long, contract, it really will be "A-Rod's team," and what he wants and doesn't want will actually matter -- a lot. Every year will be about "winning one for A-Rod." Say what you will about Kent, or Gonzo, or Lowe complaining about the kids -- and a great deal has been said -- but nobody is under the illusion that what they say matters, probably least of all themselves. Would there be payroll money enough to surround A-Rod with really good veterans? Of course not. So we would get cheaper "character veterans" like the guys that Sabean surrounded Bonds with, guys with little talent but plenty of age and experience who wouldn't make A-Rod feel like he is the only adult on his team.

I want the Dodgers' to be "Russell Martin's team," not "A-Rod's team." Andy LaRoche will never be as good as A-Rod, but he doesn't have to be: I guarantee that in his pre-agent years LaRoche will be a good middle of the order hitter who fits in well with the other young players we have, and want to continue to have, and his production relative to his salary will make him the "bigger bang for the buck" player relative to A-Rod. Idiots like Gurnick keep talking about "a hole at third base," but we know that whatever the case has been since Beltre's departure, it is not true NOW. Also, a team that goes for the high-dollar mercenary instead of going with the homegrown nobody that just needs a chance to become a star himself is not a team I WANT to be a fan of, though by dint of capricious and often cruel fortune I don't really have a choice to be anything but a Dodger fan.

"Alex's decision was one based on not knowing what his closer, his catcher and one of his statured pitchers was going to do," Boras said.

Plus, he'd like to make more money. You left that part out.

Take it for what you will, the New York Post is reporting that Girardi turned down the Dodgers, who have now turned back to Torre. With buyout negotiations with Little also now in progress. The usual sources.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/10292007/sports/yankees/joe_hollywood.htm

I thought the A-Rod announcement was a stroke of genius, if the younger Steinbrenners go all Vesuvius like their old man. What better time to extract the maximum contract offer than when the hated Red Sox are about to win the World Series?

The New York Post is claiming that the Dodgers and Grady Little are negotiating a buyout of Little's contract, that the Dodgers want to bring Joe Torre in to heal a "fractured clubhouse," and that Torre is interested in talking to the Dodgers.

Geez, I'd rather stick with Little. I'd say I'd rather get rid of Colletti, but I have no confidence that McCourt could avoid replacing him with somebody worse. I HATE this time of year, and it has nothing to do with the fact that no baseball is being played.

109 - Oh, good heavens. It's happening again.

It can't be happening again, can it? Nobody is this clueless, right?

This is the opportunity for the Dodgers to return to their glory days. I absolutely hate Arod, but the Dodgers have been mediocre for too long. Pay him his 30 million for 7-8 years and get a lot of that back in ticket sales or other revenue. You then fill a hole that has been a problem for a long time with the best hitter in baseball. Does anyone doubt Arod will put up big numbers? Set the all time home run record as a Dodger? If he does and the team wins one title, it is worth it. They may win more and will be contenders every year. You bring excitement back to LA at a time when the Lakers are in flux. If they dont win, no one will question the effort of management. Go out and get this guy. This is LA for christ sake.

111 I see we have similar morning readings habits! IF true, it's irksome at best. Let's spend that money on the field, rather than on someone who maybe can handle Kent for a year.

October 29 was the day McCourt fired DePo. Could be a long day.

I'd rather have Grittle at $700k/year than anyone at $7million/year. Managers are not worth whatever Torre will get paid. Period. We already have one Great Communicator: we don't need another.

112 Scott Proctor's wife just woke him, and he has the shakes.

112 Hahaha!

I'd throw out that it's possible that AROD wanted to give the Yankees the finger in part because of Torre. And if the Dodgers are seriously looking at AROD maybe they already know that having Torre would help their cause. I like Torre, but unless the McCourts have deeper pockets than I think, I can't see spending the money on Torre or AROD.

114 -- Since I want the Dodgers to take care of our needs by promoting kids from within the organization, I can't endorse spending money "on the field" either. If Frank has a lot of dough sitting around doing nothing, let Jamie expand her shoe collection to far beyond Imelda Marcos proportions, or better yet, DFA Juan and Nomar and write them cheques totaling $45 million. Frank can then tell the Times, "Hey, I can't spend any money this year because Ned flushed a fortune down the toilet last off-season."

118 Trading JP while eating some of his contract to make room for Young-Kemp-Ethier would be "on the field" spending as far as I'm concerned. So would funneling money to Logan White. But I would not oppose going after A-Rod either.

A Kemp-Ethier-Young outfield with Pierre going somewhere else and the Dodgers eating a good part of his contract would be the direction I'd take if I were GM, or owner, since McCourt probably wouldn't allow his GM to do that.

120 IF all this turns out to be true (still a big IF), I wonder where it leaves Colletti. Surely a Torre could convince a McCourt to...to do what?

I don't know if anyone has mentioned the Dodger Roster story on Dodgers.com that quotes Bill James' 2008 baseball guide. He gave the Dodgers the 20th best pool of under 30 talent. That doesn't sound real good to me. Maybe someone with a bit of knowledge on the subject can shed some light.

108 I like the 'his' part of that statement.

122 -- That ranking sounds about right. Keep in mind it was "Under 30," not "Under 26." The Dodgers lack the 26-29 players that are in their primes and that you see in numbers on teams like the Rockies. The truth is that despite all the media nonsense that suggests that the failure of the 2007 Dodgers was the failure of a young team, the 2007 Dodgers were NOT a young team, but a veteran team with a "sprinkling" of young players.

123
Me too. Everyone belongs to ARod. They play for him.

116 Hilarious.

If Arod becomes a Dodger, enjoy him. He's just amazing to watch play. But, take it from me, don't believe him when he says he loves the city and his teammates or whatever else Boras tells him to say.

DL's updated A-Rod sweepstakes handicapping:

Angels: 30% It's the perfect fit for A-Rod. Contending team, moneybags owner, mellow fan base. Boras will come calling and Moreno will listen, despite his previous statements.

Cubs: 25% A-Rod would have to move back to SS, but the Cubs have the deep pockets and win-now mentality to make this happen.

Red Sox: 15% Signing A-Rod just to spite the Yankees would make their journey towards the dark side complete. They have the revenue stream to make it cost-effective, and a looming vacancy at 3B. Theo Epstein has never hesitated to cut loose a player he thought was past his prime, even if that player was a World Series hero (like Mike Lowell).

Dodgers: 10% On paper, the Dodgers should be prime contenders for A-Rod: Big market, in a position to contend, payroll flexibility to make the contract work. But as we all know, the Dodgers never seem to live up to their "on paper" expectations. I doubt McCourt and Colletti have the cojones to pull this one off.

Yankees: 10% I'm not convinced the Yankees are out of the bidding, although they've really boxed themselves into a corner with the statements they've been making. Gonna be tough to go back on that now.

Giants: 5% A long-shot maybe, but kind of a sleeper. The Giants have lived and died on the fortunes of one great superstar for a long time. They're used to that dynamic, and maybe A-Rod wants to go somewhere and be "The Man", like Kobe. But A-Rod also wants to win, and SF probably isn't the place for that right now.

Field: 5% The Cardinals? Braves? Tigers? Mariners? White Sox? All long-shots, but weirder things have happened.

But, take it from me, don't believe him when he says he loves the city and his teammates or whatever else Boras tells him to say

Trust us: we don't.

127. You left out the Mets. A-Rod's already used to the NY lifestyle, will get to play in a brand new stadium generating lots of added revenue, and David Wright has already volunteered to change positions if necessary. I'd list the Mets higher than that other NY team right now.

Using the net win shares value formula, A-Rod was as good of a deal last year as Russell Martin, over performing his value by about 10 million dollars.

Now, this was a career year, and he'll be paid more next year so this won't be true if we get him. However, the goal isn't to build the best team for the money, it's to build the best team. A-Rod gives us a third baseman that we couldn't improve on.

I do agree with Canuck that signing A-Rod could change the direction of the franchise and force Ned to do stupid things. That's the only real case I see for avoiding him, I don't see how you could from a pure performance standpoint.

129. The only place to put Wright is 2B or corner OF. I don't know if he has the arm for OF but I could see making the transition to 2B.

Wright
Arod
Beltran
Alou
Delgado

That is a pretty scary middle of the order. Of course it doesn't do much good if you have no pitching (read bullpen).

131 Wagner, Heilman, Duaner, Feliciano seems like a good start.

I remain intrigued with the idea of AROD in center field for the Dodgers.

I also like the idea of trading Kent to the Yankees. Cano can move to third or Kent can play first. If the Yankees lose Rivera maybe the Dodgers could trade both Lowe and Kent to the Yankees.

Lets start 2008 without the attitude of Kent and Lowe.

What's good for the goose...

http://www.kcci.com/news/14441475/detail.html

133-Has Lowe been a problem in the clubhouse as well?

Mornin' All,

I got up at 9:30 last night... it was not a very long sleep. Then I took a nap at 1am and got up again at 6 am.

I am groggy... Sometime around 1 am I thought of this:

"What happens if NedCo signs A-Rod? That will be great initially, but it could also make the front office push for other veteran leadership so the Dodgers 'win now', and away go our wonderful young studs!"

Looks like some others here on DT were thinking the same thing. Now if A-Rod signs and the youngin's stay put, THEN I'll be excited.

129 I left the Mets out because they don't have a position for A-Rod, although I hadn't seen Wright's comment. But I still can't see Rodriguez staying in New York after bailing out on the Yankees like that. The papers are just KILLING him this morning. The front and back page of the NY Daily News is all A-Rod, with the headlines: "A-ROD A-GONER" and "GET LOST!"

In the corner, a tiny banner reads: "Red Sox Sweep Rockies, Win World Series"

A-Rod makes so much sense for the Dodgers that it probably wont happen.

#1. Dodgers have many cheap, effective pre-arbitration players.

#2. They have a postion (3b or SS) that can be improved upon immensely.

#3. Dodgers are a big market, and investing in A-Rod's career seems to be as sure of bet as any, given all the records he'll break.

Dodgers can take that next step forward, and really become like the Yankees/Red Sox by signing the marquee in their prime players..or they wont.

A-Rod probably goes to Boston IMO. Red Sox will let Schilling/Lowell go, add maybe 10 mils to the payroll, and be able to get A-Rod. Plus with Ortiz/Manny getting older, they can afford to really extend A-Rod and not have it hurt them that much down the line.

I don't want anything to do with A-Rod. I would rather watch a mediocre Dodgers team, than have that contract tying up the Dodgers. It truly is pitching that wins you the big games. Keep what they have, and find some dominant pitching eventually through their system.

139 Why can't they get A-Rod, then find some dominant pitching throughout their system? Also, the Dodgers are only on the hook for about 45 million dollars after 2008 after Broxton, Martin, and Bills get their arbitration payments. We can afford a giant contract.

If Ned turns out to be a good GM, he figures out a way to steal a few arms in minor league deals that eventually bloom for the Dodgers. More under the radar moves for guys like Beimel and Saito.

140 because it is another huge contract for a guy that isn't going to win it all for the Dodgers. He brings bad vibes with him, the media likes to pick at him and I just don't like guys who try to upstage the World Series.
At least with Bonds, they had a guy who LOVED playing in San Fran. A-Rod just doesn't care.

More under the radar moves for guys like Beimel and Saito

But for every Beimel and Saito who happen to work out, there's two Baez, Carter, Hendrickson, Tomko types who don't.

Incidentally, the back page of the NY Post this morning is a picture of Joe Torre in a Dodgers cap: http://www.nypost.com/

The article is the standard reporter-repeats-or-invents-rumor story, but this weird paragraph caught my eye: If Torre replaces Little, it will be a popular move based on the reception Torre received at an Elton John concert in Las Vegas Saturday night. John introduced Billie Jean King and Torre from the stage. The crowd at The Colosseum At Caesars Palace gave Torre a standing ovation and the Dodger fans on hand serenaded Torre with "Come coach L.A."

Does it really matter if A-Rod "cares", as long as he puts up numbers and plays 162 games a year?

He's still a pretty good player for not caring I guess....

144

What is this, Mad Libs now with the NY Post?

Great day for sports conversations.
Arod opting out
Joe Torre talks appear to be serious
Colts/Pats showdown
Lakers finally in serious Kobe trade talks with both the Bulls and Wizards
Great Monday Night Football Game
Sundevils/Ducks showdown
Basketball regular season kicks off with Mr. Ming invading Staples with his new entourage

I've said for two years that Arod would be the perfect addition to the Dodgers. I'm not about to back off now that he's opted out. Many of the points by Joey and Regfairfield are exactly why it can be done. We can easily afford Arod from 2009 on, so they would just have to bite the bullet in 2008. If he can still play SS so much the better. If not it still makes sense from just about every angle.

"Great Monday Night Football Game"

Did I miss the memo?

For those who say A-Rod is motivated only by greed, he apparently agreed to cut $28 mil out of his contract to make the Boston trade happen. I can't think of any other player (Griffey maybe) willing to leave that much money on the table.

He's the highest-paid player in baseball because he earns it. It never seemed fair to me that he became a pariah the day he got the contract that paid him what he's worth.

Couldn't it be that his main reason for opting out is the treatment the NY fans and media have given him? I think that, and the questionable makeup of the Yankees team in '08, are far bigger factors than money.

143 The best GM's are the ones who make the most under the radar moves that work out and the least bad moves for guys like Baez. And I dont' think that it is by chance that those moves work out or don't work out.

TC, if you mean the Favre playing his last game in Denver, that sounds pretty good; otherwise it won't be much of a game. Denver is outmatched on numerous levels.

149 is a good argument, but no, he just wants more money.

=)

As Canuck put it, I hate this time of year.
I think it is important to look at how teams who have had A-Rod have fared, or one dominant player like Bonds, for that matter.

134 Wonderful. Several things came to mind, among them: The dogs aim was not as nearly deadly as Dick Cheney: Also "The first marine went over the wall-----

150 I would argue that the best GMs are the ones who make enough good "under the radar" moves that they can afford a truly great player when he becomes available.

I think getting A-Rod is nice looking candy on the shelf and it tempts me.....But there are hundreds of other good/great ball players out there. The Dodgers just need the skill and smarts to find them which their drafts have started to do.
Find a Josh Beckett or young Curt Schilling and overspend for that and take your chances instead of a guy who doesn't care that much about his team.

Deciding to go or not go after AROD is not science. Just ask what Georgia Fronterie would do and then do the opposite.

I can't see how signing Joe, bat me eighth, Torre to manage the Dodgers would encourage AROD to sign with the Dodgers.

Signing A-Rod, even if we're "buying" a superstar, is far far far away from the worst thing NedCo could do, so I wouldn't mind if it actually happened. But signing A-Rod would be very un-NedCo-like (Boras, A-Rod doesn't have heart, blah blah), so I really doubt it'd actually happen.

The Dodgers came so close to being able to draft AROD instead of Driefert that I can find a way to think of AROD as coming out of the Dodgers' system. Imaginations are a terrible thing to waste.

If only Coletti wasn't hamstrung with the contracts of Schmidt,Pierre and Nomar..Damn those Fox people. Oh..wait...

If the Dodgers sign A-Rod, great, maybe it will work out, but if they don't sign him, it doesn't mean there aren't any other options. A-Rod doesn't excite me to watch the Dodgers like Kemp, Martin, Loney etc. do.

151
Jeff Kent has $100.00 saying that Denver wins. GB is due to disappoint. My father is getting way to giddy.

Kobe, Beckham, and ARod. What a triumverate of prima donnas...

Would an ARod signing make it more or less likely that a Johan Santana deal gets made?

161 That's 100% right. Go after A-Rod; if you get him, you'll have a better team than if you don't. But if you don't get him, stop right there (at least, as far as position players go), and go with Garciaparra/LaRoche.

ARONS unite!

with Kobe, I liked him with all of his baggage because he played hard and to win and loved the Lakers. As soon as he said he didn't want to play for the Lakers anymore, that was it for me.
This is the first time I have ever seen people start to question his effort in playing. He seems to have given into the whole "I am bigger than the game," thing.

"Find a Josh Beckett or young Curt Schilling and overspend for that and take your chances instead of a guy who doesn't care that much about his team."

Who knew it was that easy? This is why Logan White is more valuable that Ned any day and every day. If anyone can find a diamond in the rough it will be White. Ned will only trade the diamond away. Of course its possible that Ned begged Sabean not to trade Francisco Liriano and Joe Nathan but I'm guessing Ned was on board with these Delino for Pedro moves.

Kobe was dead to me the day Katelyn Faber's name became household.

And they said LA was riot prone during the Laker celebrations:

HAH!

http://tinyurl.com/2xznm8

165. People have questioned Kobe's effort in playing for years.

167 - I've always been a Kobe fan, but I think it's time to move on. Take Chicago's best offer and get it over with.

Nice work on BronxBanter, D4P. "Are you a Dodger fan?". :)

Let me get this straight. We pursue the fiery 43 yr old Girardi to help groom the young players. And Plan B is to bring in the 67 year old guy?

164
That's it in a nutshell.

What is the abbreviation for those of us who'd like Miggy? Or David Wright? Or BJ Upton to play CF? Or Jay Bruce?

169 - The questioning of his effort has usually been about a bigger battle Kobe is trying to win. The MSM says he is too selfish and needs to pass more - fine, he'll pass on every possession and we'll see how successful they are. I think he's trying to win though, even if it's a bigger point he's trying to prove.

166
I forget which post said it, but let's keep Little, save the $5 mil in salary, give half of that to White as a "bonus" and make him sign a contract in blood, to stay with the Dodgers. Five more years of the Ng, White, Watson triumverate and we may actually have a consistently good team on our hands no matter if we sign a classless ARod or not.

172 It's the same abbreviation. A-Rod here represents not just A-Rod, but any player that one can reasonably and with a straight face say, "He's the best player in baseball." But TBPIBONS doesn't flow off the tongue.

170
It gets tricky. Since Kobe has a no trade they can get his approval for a deal to the Bulls, but he won't say yes if the Lakers take all the talent(Deng, Gordon, Noah, Tyrus Thomas) and leave him with less then he had in LA.

It is funny that if he gets dealt to the Wizards for Arenas and Blathe that he'll be be surrounded by just about the same talent Butler, Jamison, Kobe before the ill-advised deal of Butler for Brown.

What kind of track record does Watson have?

172
Can you imagine if the Mets signed ARod? They would have to get rid of either Wright or Beltran. They could more than make up their investment in ARod by shipping Wright in a deal to the Dodgers or Angels. It would instantly make them the holder of the year's best available position player in either Beltran or Wright (Reyes seems Martin-like in his un-tradability)

The Mets could net ARod, get rid of Beltran and his $15 mil or so, get him to the Angels, Dodgers, or Yankees and get at least three stud prospects in return.

If I was a Met fan, I would be on the ARod bandwagon. You would simultaneously get better (ARod) and younger (minus Beltran, Green, + young prospects).

What did I miss?

153 The Yankees made the playoffs every year with A-Rod. The Rangers were a stupid, stupid team who wasted the other 80 million dollars they spent. Why should A-Rod take the blame because the Chanitor was terrible?

In 2002, A-Rod hit .300/.392/.623 and was paid 22 million. Juan Gonzalez had just 273 at bats and was paid 11 million (more than A-Rod on a pure at bat per dollar basis). Carl Everrett got nine million to hit .267/.333/.439, six million for Rusty Greers .296/.356/.377 and 6.5 to Chan Ho. It wasn't A-Rods fault the Rangers wasted 32 million between those four guys.

178 Wright could move to 2B.

177
I know that he was a development guy under Shapiro in Cleveland and seems to have his act together based on his comments and what I have read about him. But, I guess, the jury is still out...

176 - The Bulls have enough pieces that something will get worked out. I believe in December, they could do a Gordon, Nocioni, Noah, and Tyrus Thomas deal.

That leaves Deng, Hinrich, and Ben Wallace in Chicago with Kobe. LA can run out a young athletic frontline of Noah, Thomas, Bynum, Odom to go with Nocioni, Walton, Gordon, and Farmar in the backcourt. Not ideal, but they're not straddled with any horrific long term deals (like Brian Grant's), and are young, athletic, and tall.

The fact that Wright is the most popular player for Met fans and could be better then Arod going forward from this point of their careers.

NPUT

I just hope NedCo is hard at work trying to snag A-Rod for us.