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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

The 38-Man Roster
2007-11-20 17:04
by Jon Weisman

The Dodgers announced today that they added Xavier Paul, Lucas May, James McDonald, Ramon Troncoso, Justin Orenduff, Mario Alvarez and Cory Wade to the 40-man roster in advance of the Rule 5 draft. The team outrighted Mike Megrew and kept two roster spots open.

Comments (213)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-11-20 17:07:42
1.   Jim Hitchcock
Hi! I'd like to buy a Kindle, please?
2007-11-20 17:08:43
2.   silverwidow
Mario Alvarez? Never heard of him. Can someone shed some light?
2007-11-20 17:09:02
3.   underdog
Mario Alvarez?

So who will the other two be, I wonder...

2007-11-20 17:10:03
4.   natepurcell
Megrew really blew last year.
2007-11-20 17:10:05
5.   silverwidow
No Wesley Wright? I thought he was going on.
2007-11-20 17:11:08
6.   Andrew Shimmin
Finally a way to marry monochrome LCD displays with America's greatest shame (its wireless networks)! And it gives you a new way to not check your email. For only four hundred dollars.
2007-11-20 17:12:23
7.   Jon Weisman

Links to the player pages at Inside the Dodgers.

2007-11-20 17:12:31
8.   Andrew Shimmin
2- Doesn't look like much.

2007-11-20 17:16:03
9.   Robert Daeley
Also from that story:

"That's about all the news for today and I don't expect much more over the holiday, so this could be the last post for a few days."

2007-11-20 17:20:16
10.   Andrew Shimmin
Alvarez did suffer a .364 BABIP, last year. .365 the year before. .353 the year before that. Maybe he's just bad at not giving up hits.
2007-11-20 17:25:55
11.   KG16
anyone know if there is a linkafication type add on for Safari?

Oh, and I've been out of touch the last couple of days, what happened with Nate and the Dancer?

2007-11-20 17:29:46
12.   Bluebleeder87
from Ken Rosenthal (MSN.COM/FOXSPORTS) >>>The Phillies were willing to give Lowell a 4-year, $50 million offer, according to major-league sources, with the idea of giving him an East Coast alternative to the Dodgers, who were believed to be offering a contract in the same range.

I don't know but I got angry reading that tid bit just now. I seriously don't wanna think NedCo is that clueless, when I here the guy talk it's like he totally knows what he's doing but then I read stuff like that (especially cause he DID SIGN PIERRE!!) & I just don't know. The guy can talk no question about it but he sure can't walk the walk, I hope I'm wrong & I hope I'm just a little angry today & that it's clogging up my thinking somehow

2007-11-20 17:40:46
13.   willhite
Are we to believe that if Lowell had taken this so called offer from Ned, that he wouldn't have gone after M Cab? He can't possibly have been going after both of them, so I'm thinking at least one of those rumors is not based in fact.

Do you make the offer to Lowell and if he accepts tell him, "You'll have to wait until I see if I can get Cabrera"?

2007-11-20 17:47:34
14.   Izzy
I wonder if we couldn't get away with one key prospect, LaRoche and and 5 or 10 million dollars? Heck they're poor, maybe they'll go for it.

LaRoche's On Base bump is incredible though, and I do wonder if we might not regret losing him the most, in the end. Sometimes it bothers me he hasn't hit for a lick when he has had the chance. We probably shouldn't even be looking for a third baseman, really.

2007-11-20 17:50:26
15.   natepurcell

On the surface that seems like a pretty good just try and buy Cabrera. I wonder if that has been discussed....kinda like a posting fee.

2007-11-20 17:50:32
16.   D4P
We probably shouldn't even be looking for a third baseman, really


2007-11-20 17:52:51
17.   thinkblue0
I would love to be a fly on the wall of Ned's office and see exactly why he doesn't seem to like Laroche.

While all these are rumors, let's face it, he doesn't want Laroche at 3B next year...

2007-11-20 17:53:29
18.   underdog
Blue, it's Ken Rosenthal we're talking about, so don't worry so much about it. We gnashed our teeth about the rumors about Lowell here already and have no idea what was really discussed, or what the Dodger's interest really was. I'd let it die.
2007-11-20 17:53:53
19.   willhite
15 - You could try buying him for a posting fee but the number would be a lot higher than 5-10 mil. Try something in the neighborhood of Dice-K's number.
2007-11-20 17:56:26
20.   thinkblue0

like I said, I know they're all just rumors.

But the fact that we've been rumored for Cabrera, Lowell, Crede etc leads me to believe that the Dodgers are definitely looking for a third baseman....

2007-11-20 17:56:27
21.   underdog
I think Cabrera or ARod would be hard to argue against as premiere third baseman in the league. After that, I've gotten the feeling (I mean Ned said it a couple of times, anyway, and was quoted here) that he's not as down on LaRoche as some think.
2007-11-20 17:58:52
22.   underdog
Sorry, 18 referred to 12 . But yeah, they are all just rumors. So stop right there and spare yourself the ulcer. ;-) I still think the Crede rumors were purely the work of fiction on the part of a bored hack writing for the Chicago paper, wishful thinking and nothing substantiated anywhere else.
2007-11-20 18:01:02
23.   Greg Brock
22 To add, the Dodgers will always be fodder for professional speculators, because they're a big market team and they usually have some good prospects.

Nobody speculates about what the Pirates will do.

2007-11-20 18:01:55
24.   Sam DC
I mean, I knew Live Free or Die Hard would be bad, but I really am surprised it is this bad.
2007-11-20 18:06:43
25.   underdog
Is it that bad? I missed it in theaters. Sounds like a good move. I did, however, see "Live Free or Die," which is very different.

Never mind that, today also saw the release of Hearts of Darkness A Filmmaker's Apocalypse, which if you've never seen, well.. now's your chance. And Rescue Dawn, too, which makes a good double-feature.

2007-11-20 18:07:32
26.   Bob Timmermann
Nobody speculates about what the Pirates will do.
(Has a link to a story about the Bucs signing a reliever from Japan)
(Fascinating link on possible coaches for the Bucs)

OK, I got nothing.

2007-11-20 18:10:10
27.   Andrew Shimmin
I'm with Jon. It's been a down year for movies. I don't think last year's were a bumper crop, either. The last movie I loved was In the Bedroom, and that was 2001.
2007-11-20 18:14:27
28.   D4P
Did you at least "like" "House of Flying Daggers"...?
2007-11-20 18:15:31
29.   Bob Timmermann
You always have C-SPAN3 and Brian Lamb to fall back on.
2007-11-20 18:16:18
30.   dzzrtRatt
The problem with sports reporting is that its ethics are even lower than political reporting.

I think agents especially, but also some GMs are just telling out and out lies this time of year under the cover of source anonymity that reporters respect even when they're obviously being used in a sleazy way.

Either Florida's GM is lying about Ned's offer, or Lowell's agent is lying about the supposed contract offer, or both.

I'm almost positive Lowell's agent is lying. Lowell set down a marker: Four years. If we offered it to him, why didn't he take it? I don't think it happened. But I think his agent wants other players to think he succeeded in getting Lowell his four years -- he just rejected it for personal reasons.

Think about it. You're a reporter. You know Ned's reputation. It's perfectly credible to suggest he would offer something like that. Reporter goes, "Hm. Plausible," and goes with it.

If the Dodgers are saying no news til after the holidays, I'm guessing the reporting on MCAB and the D's is also based on lies.

2007-11-20 18:18:47
31.   D4P
Lowell needed four years.

I don't see how he's gonna feed his family once his three-year contract runs out.

2007-11-20 18:25:08
32.   Bob Timmermann
As someone who has a brother in the sportswriting racket, I wouldn't say that all sports reporters are unethical and trade in rumors or let themselves be played by GMs and coaches.

And I don't think Gammons or Stark are unethical.

Rosenthal strikes me as someone who just feels that he keeps having to crank out column after column because that's what wants.

2007-11-20 18:28:34
33.   dzzrtRatt
Well, that's the way agents think, and a concept that a lot of GMs buy into. Every contract is one year longer than is reasonable given the player's age. Players want at least one year of free money to fund their retirement.

Turns out in Lowell's case that four years was two years too long. He'll be good for only two more years, so he got a three-year deal.

2007-11-20 18:30:13
34.   Andrew Shimmin
28- Didn't see it. Fantasy as a genre doesn't do it for me. I was indifferent to the Tolkien movies, too.

29- I don't get CSPAN3. I'm very bitter about it. I just found out the other day that I do get ESPNU. Now if only there were anything on it.

2007-11-20 18:30:48
35.   old dodger fan
From the Marlins page at Fox Sports:
"The Marlins need to rebuild their pitching staff, with or without LHP Dontrelle Willis. They also must find a new catcher if Miguel Olivo is not tendered a contract, as is expected. They're also still looking for a center fielder."

I know where they can find a centerfielder. Might we include ours in a deal with half his salary paid? Probably not, but probably as likely as a lot of stuff we have specutlated on in the past few days. Just wishful thinking.

2007-11-20 18:31:06
36.   Andrew Shimmin
31- By the way, how did you not get that that was a parody of a movie trailer?
2007-11-20 18:31:55
37.   Andrew Shimmin
36 cont.- It started out with, "In a world. . ."
2007-11-20 18:32:32
38.   dzzrtRatt
32 I should rephrase.

Within the sportswriting field, a low level of ethics is accepted. It doesn't mean every sportswriter sinks to it.

And to drill down a little further: It's really the sources who are being unethical. The reporters I'm thinking of let them get away with it, because they themselves pay no penalty for being wrong. I don't know if that's unethical or amoral or just stupid. Probably a case by case thing. But one thing's for sure. When MCAB signs with the Orioles, Rosenthal won't be fired because he said the Dodgers were close.

2007-11-20 18:33:37
39.   D4P
Didn't see it. Fantasy as a genre doesn't do it for me. I was indifferent to the Tolkien movies, too

House of Flying Daggers has nothing to do with Tolkien. I guess it's "fantasy", but not in the Comic Book Guy sense. It's a beautiful movie with a great soundtrack.

I bet you'd like it.

2007-11-20 18:34:42
40.   D4P
Did you mean to refer to 31 ...? If so, I don't follow.
2007-11-20 18:35:54
41.   Jon Weisman
There's very little incentive for reporters to be gatekeepers in the Hot Stove. I don't think they make stuff up - they don't have to.

And then, they're also allowed to speculate about what might happen based on the lies they're told. It's just a mess - but that's what most people seem to want.

2007-11-20 18:37:59
42.   natepurcell
favorite word for baseball reporters...


After the inclusion of that word, they can put anything following it and it wouldn't be wrong!

2007-11-20 18:38:22
43.   old dodger fan
I just finished the Hobbitt and Fellowship of the Ring. I thought they were interesting but not riveting. I probably won't watch the movies though. They usually disappoint me if I read the book first. The Eragon movie was OK but the book was much better.
2007-11-20 18:39:35
44.   Andrew Shimmin
39- I saw the Jumping Tiger, Singing Dragon movie. It was fine. I see why people like those movies. I'm sadly immune to their charm.

40- The other day. You jumped ugly with dzzrtRatt over saying that Lowell needed four years, when it was clearly an affected voice. I read it catching up on six hundred comments at a time, so I could mention it. I thought that was the allusion in 31. I've been looking for an opening to scold you over it, since.

2007-11-20 18:42:27
45.   Andrew Shimmin
44 corrected- Couldn't, even. Which isn't strictly true, since I could have mentioned. But the thread had moved on to more unpleasant things, and calling you names, while it would have fit in, didn't seem prudent.
2007-11-20 18:46:21
46.   D4P
dzzrtRatt was quoting someone else saying that Lowell "needed" four year. I jumped ugly over the someone else, and appropriately so.
2007-11-20 18:49:04
47.   Andrew Shimmin
46- Ah. Alright. Well. If you've learned your lesson, then okay.
2007-11-20 18:50:30
48.   D4P
Wait a second: I just looked back and found that Andrew was right. I totally missed that. The fact that it was in bold made my mind assume that he was quoting someone else.

Sheesh. Strike all of my comments in relation to Lowell needing four year.

2007-11-20 18:51:32
49.   D4P
Huh: so this is what it's like to feel stupid.
2007-11-20 18:52:34
50.   Andrew Shimmin
48- You shouldn't have checked. I was prepared to believe that I'd misread it all. Now I have hand.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-11-20 18:54:18
51.   D4P
I'm glad I checked. Hopefully Ratt will see my explanation and apology. He must have been confused over my response.
2007-11-20 18:58:40
52.   silverwidow
Rosenthal just updated the article. They want four players and are insisting on Kemp AND Kershaw.

2007-11-20 19:06:08
53.   old dodger fan
52 For what it's worth he also says, "the Dodgers continued balking at the Marlins' price".
2007-11-20 19:06:14
54.   kingbb99

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned or not, but Tim Brown has the Dodgers talking about Matt Kemp in a package for Erik Bedard.

That would certainly eliminate the Dodgers from any Santana or Cabrera blockbusters.

2007-11-20 19:06:32
55.   Marty
House of Flying Daggers is one of the most beautiful movies I've ever seen.
2007-11-20 19:08:38
56.   Marty
If you can stand the commercials, It's a Mad Mad Mad Mad World is about to start on AMC.
2007-11-20 19:10:37
57.   Bob Timmermann
Kid, you told me these commercials were going to be short! Why you ....
2007-11-20 19:11:41
58.   Marty
Down there? Down there?
2007-11-20 19:14:53
59.   Marty
Bob, I just saw on that Gus' BBQ was bought by the owner's of the Tops Hamburger chainlet and will remain a rib joint. Hopefully edible ribs.
2007-11-20 19:16:47
60.   Bob Timmermann
And presumably the ribs would be placed on the table by someone who actually was polite.
2007-11-20 19:18:49
61.   trainwreck
I have seen the Taiwanese movie where House of Flying Daggers got the forest fight seen from.
2007-11-20 19:20:40
62.   bigcpa
OK if Rosenthal's anonymous third-hand sources are correct I see 2 possibilities:

1) we deal Kemp/Kershaw/? for Cabrera. Then go cheap in CF with Cameron because Cabrera will get $12M in arb.

2) We lose out on Cabrera. With money to burn and losing out to the Angels again we go big with Andruw Jones. Then we have a surplus outfielder and the Pierre fantasies can play out.

I prefer 2 in a huge way. A Pierre/Cameron/Ethier OF will take all the fun out of having Miggy.

2007-11-20 19:23:05
63.   Marty
And I'm incorrect about IAMMMMW being on AMC. It's on TCM sans commercials. Woo hoo!. It's way up there on my list of all time great comedies.

"But what if something happens?!?"
"What could happen to an old fashioned?"

2007-11-20 19:23:30
64.   Ghost of Carlos Perez
I watched House of Flying Daggers while I was in China when it came out. At the most dramatic point in the movie (I won't give it away), the entire theater erupted with laughter. Somehow, I don't think that's the effect ZhangYiMou was going for.

I did not read any of the Chinese reviews, but I'm guessing the movie was received much better among non-Chinese speakers.

2007-11-20 19:24:47
65.   MC Safety
It has to be Kemp or Kershaw. Not Kemp AND Kershaw.
2007-11-20 19:24:57
66.   Bob Timmermann
I believe the movie is somewhere in the 200s on my Netflix queue.
2007-11-20 19:25:08
67.   Robert Daeley
Nervous Motorist: That's a police helicopter!

Otto Meyer: Yeah, that's what it looks like. They always use them.

Nervous Motorist: Who always uses them?

Otto Meyer: Who do you think?

2007-11-20 19:27:22
68.   old dodger fan
64 It was probably the sub-titles. Sometimes the Chinese subtitles have little relation to the spoken English.
2007-11-20 19:30:23
69.   Ghost of Carlos Perez
It was not dubbed, and the subtitles were in Chinese.
2007-11-20 19:32:16
70.   Sam DC
Five minutes in the Bruins still have not scored.
2007-11-20 19:32:39
71.   Ghost of Carlos Perez
69 I'm not sure that was clear. All Chinese movies use subtitles that match word-for-word the dialog being spoken (so you can read along with what you are hearing).
2007-11-20 19:37:37
72.   JoeyP
I'm not sure how Kevin Love got so highly ranked.

He cant jump at all, nor is very athletic.

2007-11-20 19:40:00
73.   Vishal
"the marlins WANT both kemp and kershaw" (but presumably will accept something less?) from the dodgers.

"the marlins are INSISTING on kendrick and possibly adenhart" from the angels.

maybe i'm reading too much into the word choices there, but it sounds like the marlins might be persuaded to get something less than both kemp and kershaw. i mean, i WANT millions of dollars, a mansion, and a bugatti veyron, but i'm not necessarily expecting those things to be handed over to me.

2007-11-20 19:41:33
74.   El Lay Dave
54 It came up near the end of the thread before last.

72 And yet he scored 18 and rebounded 16 against Maryland the other night. His footwork looks good to me as do his hands; those can be difference-makers for big men.

2007-11-20 19:41:56
75.   trainwreck
You sound like an NBA GM. The reason the NBA game has deteriorated is because there are too many guys who are not like Kevin Love. All athleticism with no fundamentals or skills.
2007-11-20 19:43:42
76.   El Lay Dave
8 minutes in and it's 10-4 Michigan St., but UCLA has them in the penalty already - 7 fouls.
2007-11-20 19:45:44
77.   El Lay Dave
I see James Loney will be on the Rose Parade float, but Matt Kemp is not listed. Perhaps the veterans conspired to place Kemp too close to the exhaust pipe.
2007-11-20 19:46:33
78.   Eric Stephen
Tom Krasovic in the San Diego Union-Tribune has a nice feature up on their website regarding the Padres' 40-man staff:

I think that's a good idea, and it's a good way for a newspaper to provide something that probably couldn't fit in the daily paper.

Some of it is dated, as the players are the 40-man roster as of the end of the season.

2007-11-20 19:47:14
79.   trainwreck
Oh no! Not Westbrook.

He should have tried to lay it up instead of dunk it.

2007-11-20 19:50:21
80.   El Lay Dave
I wonder what Bill Walton's vertical was.
2007-11-20 19:53:28
81.   Bob Loblaw
This Cabrera rumor must have some truth to it if MSN puts it on their front page.

Re: sportswriters
I don't know how unethical some may be, but I do get a feeling that some of them will lobby for a specific trade that they like, and that may be the case with some Cabrera rumors. An example that comes to mind was last July when Evan Grant of thhe Dallas Morning News kept lobbying for the Dodgers to trade Kemp & Loney in a package for Texiera.

2007-11-20 19:54:11
82.   willhite
77 -

Obviously, the Dodgers know they won't have Kemp by January.

Take another look, do you see Kershaw's name? This is obviously the best way to find out what's going to happen.

How about Cabrera? Is he riding the float?

More importantly, what about JP?

2007-11-20 19:54:44
83.   Bumsrap
Kemp is behind the trash can and perhaps that is why he can't be seen on the float.
2007-11-20 19:56:40
84.   El Lay Dave
Cabrera IS the float!
2007-11-20 19:56:55
85.   alnyden
I am bracing myself to be really really bummed. If this rumor is true, we won't have a team of young Dodgers to look forward to. With LaRoche and Kemp gone that dream is pretty much out the door. So much for "we have a plan and we're sticking to it". I'm praying they sign a center fielder and keep the rest of the kids, but it doesn't sound as if that will happen.
2007-11-20 19:57:52
86.   El Lay Dave
83 I couldn't see a plausible reason for a trash can to be on the float, but I thought the "exhaust pipe" served as a reasonable substitute.
2007-11-20 19:58:51
87.   El Lay Dave
Most published rumors are not true.
Most published rumors are not true.
Most published rumors are not true.
Most published rumors are not true.


2007-11-20 20:00:18
88.   Andrew Shimmin
Westbrook demonstrates why you should never make a non-monetary bet with your barber.
2007-11-20 20:00:30
89.   El Lay Dave
Best guidelines ever on Hot Stove rumors:
2007-11-20 20:05:43
90.   Bluebleeder87
If the right deal comes along & if we were to get A. Jones to replace Kemp I wouldn't mind losing Kemp it has to be the perfect situation though.
2007-11-20 20:12:23
91.   Marty
Come to think of it, I didn't see Kemp or Kershaw at the last Soviet military parade.
2007-11-20 20:13:08
92.   Bluebleeder87

I kind of don't like #5 specially cause Ned acquired Juan Pierre (I can't trust 'em) but I am neutral on him & if he makes the right moves I'll be the first to praise Ned Colletti but till then I'll be looking at him with a suspicious brow (sp?)

2007-11-20 20:14:19
93.   underdog
The only thing worse than having to listen to Dick Vitale is having to listen to Dick Vitale sounding like he needs an esophageal transplant.

Looks like this could be the Bruins' first loss.

I'm gonna turn it to ABC, where an old favorite is on:

"Popcorn?! Toast?? What kind of a Thanksgiving is this Charlie Brown??"

2007-11-20 20:14:40
94.   LogikReader

Bleeders is right, but given the choice, I'd much rather go with the home grown option, all other things being equal.

We can't assume Andruw Jones is going to rake this season. The jury is still out on whether 2007 was a fluke. That's the other factor.

2007-11-20 20:15:11
95.   Benaiah
Is Rosenthal just writing the same article every day? He is pounding home these themes about the embarrassment of losing out on another big bat, 10th best offense in the NL, Matt Kemp no longer being untouchable and Joe Torre means winning now. Is this his personal campaign, or is he just changing the words at the top of the article and getting paid like he wrote two columns?
2007-11-20 20:16:02
96.   fordprefect
Jaundiced eye?
2007-11-20 20:20:03
97.   Daniel Zappala
43 I just finished the Hobbitt and Fellowship of the Ring. I thought they were interesting but not riveting. I probably won't watch the movies though. They usually disappoint me if I read the book first. The Eragon movie was OK but the book was much better.

Aaagh! The Eragon series is very good, but cannot approach the greatness of the Tolkien books. The Eragon movie was not OK, it was lousy, terrible, awful, about the worst movie based on a book ever made. The Lord of the Rings movies, on the other hand, are wonderful, and a great counterpart to the books. You will be really missing something if you don't see them.

2007-11-20 20:22:55
98.   Bluebleeder87
Kemps potential is great so I can understand why many people wouldn't wanna trade him but if the right deal came along why not.
2007-11-20 20:24:45
99.   Bluebleeder87

I'm still neutral towards him so nah. I wanna believe we have a great GM believe me!

2007-11-20 20:26:36
100.   underdog
I agree with Daniel, the Eragon movie was awful (I'm not a big fan of the book series, either; they always reminded me of how young their author was when writing them, but the movie's far worse). I had trouble finishing all the Tolkien books, though I loved The Hobbit, but the movies are damned exciting and for cut out all the stuff you don't need anyway. (Maybe could've cut a bit more, too...)


I'm telling you guys, stop reading Rosenthal. Your life will be that much healthier for it. It is tempting to drop him a line though, asking him what his deal is. But tain't worth it...

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2007-11-20 20:42:11
101.   Andrew Shimmin
"Dan Szymborski says A-Rod will suck in 2016!"

2007-11-20 20:47:30
102.   Jon Weisman
100 - I wouldn't know Rosenthal existed if people here didn't keep reminding me. He really serves no purpose. At best, he posts actual news five minutes before the rest of the world. The rest is all noise ... it's like hearing sensational speculation about the sausage being made.
2007-11-20 20:49:52
103.   Bob Timmermann
Ken Rosenthal is easy to post up, but I don't post him on the Griddle.
2007-11-20 20:52:27
104.   bigcpa
Rosenthal just updated the Cabrera column again! No sign of any new info. I think he changed a comma to a semicolon.
2007-11-20 20:54:30
105.   Bob Timmermann
Subordinate clause instead of a dependent clause, eh? Or was it in a series?
2007-11-20 20:54:30
106.   Andrew Shimmin
Rosenthal is also crushingly boring. If everything he wrote were prescient, I still wouldn't read him.
2007-11-20 20:54:40
107.   Izzy
77. I'd prefer to see Kemp and Kent on the float. I might even pay to see that.
2007-11-20 20:57:09
108.   Jason in Canada
However Ken did break the Mike Piazza trade. I still have that day etched in my brain. Not in a good way.
2007-11-20 20:57:35
109.   Andrew Shimmin
What's the deal with Mata's new last name? Is it a Maurice Drew situation? Did he get married and take his wife's name?
2007-11-20 20:59:12
110.   Jon Weisman
108 - So if he hadn't broken it, maybe it wouldn't have happened. Rosenthal!

109 - It's a parent thing, isn't it?

2007-11-20 21:00:45
111.   jasonungar07
"Baby Blu" was born on Nov 18 at 8:54

Benjamin Lucas Ungar was born in good health at 7 pounds 4 ounces and Mommy is doing well.

We just got home and finally settled in...good to see the dodgers still have their kids too. At least for now.

PS: Condolences, Jon.

2007-11-20 21:00:57
112.   trainwreck
For his mom.
2007-11-20 21:01:25
113.   trainwreck
Congratulations to the Ungar family!!
2007-11-20 21:02:09
114.   Jon Weisman
Yea :)
2007-11-20 21:02:19
115.   Bob Timmermann
My problems with the DirecTV commercial about why cable subscribers should switch because there is more HD:
1) the woman says she only has 60 seconds to tell her story. But wouldn't she have more time if DirecTV paid for more time?
2) if she only has 60 seconds why does the commercial run repeatedly? It's not like they have one 60-second spot forever like (begging forgiveness ahead of time) Mr. Plow?
3) if her time is so valuable why is the end of the commercial no longer a plea for me to switch to DirecTV and instead is just a bunch of incentives like getting a free cheap DVD player?
2007-11-20 21:02:42
116.   kinbote
If we're in fact hell-bent on trading the trashcan-mover, I'm starting to root for Bedard over Cabrera.

1. Penny
2. Bedard
3. Lowe
4. Bills
5. Loaiza/etc.

That is a potentially scary rotation. I'm assuming Kemp would be the centerpiece of the deal and replaced by a free agent.

2007-11-20 21:04:07
117.   Jason in Canada
Congratulations to all! We should all chip in for the "Gibby's homer" book!
2007-11-20 21:04:13
118.   trainwreck
Oregon is losing to St. Marys. Maybe the Pac-10 was overrated a wee bit.
2007-11-20 21:05:54
119.   Sam DC
Mazel Tov to the Ungars!
2007-11-20 21:08:38
120.   jasonungar07
Thanks Guys. I'll see ya all we go...duty calls. lol
2007-11-20 21:09:46
121.   Jason in Canada
Bedard and Russ. An all-Canadian battery! Then we can try and get that great Canadian closer to round it out... Ryan Dempster!
2007-11-20 21:09:55
122.   Bob Timmermann
Maybe it's November.
2007-11-20 21:18:35
123.   Andrew Shimmin
UCLA tied it up.
2007-11-20 21:20:59
124.   trainwreck
That's why I said a wee bit.

I should have said my post was not sarcastic.

2007-11-20 21:21:43
125.   Jon Weisman
118 - Maybe, though I don't think the other conferences are going undefeated.
2007-11-20 21:23:14
126.   JoeyP
Love has trouble finishing at the rim. Thats a problem for a big man.

He may be a solid post player in college, like Tyler Hansbrough--but his game wont translate to the pros at all.

2007-11-20 21:23:38
127.   underdog
A rehash, revisit, of The Play is on ESPN right now.

For those of you who, you know, care about such things...

2007-11-20 21:24:07
128.   trainwreck
I think Arizona and USC were the overrated teams. They both have chemistry issues and Arizona also has defensive issues.
2007-11-20 21:26:29
129.   underdog
What was that you were saying...?
2007-11-20 21:26:33
130.   StolenMonkey86
121 - I see Torre lobbying for Bedard.
2007-11-20 21:26:48
131.   trainwreck
What? Taylor Hansbrough is nowhere near the skill level of Love. Love is a good finisher. You are making all kinds of judgements off of one game and he is facing a good defensive team. Plus Michigan State has a a lot of good defensive bigs and there are multiple on him. He has been doing a good job frankly.
2007-11-20 21:27:35
132.   underdog
Maybe other conferences are underrated, too.

Ooh, UCSB beat USF tonight by the same exact score as last year's game.

2007-11-20 21:30:18
133.   Jon Weisman
131 - Plus, he's still a teenager. Has he peaked?
2007-11-20 21:31:25
134.   Bob Timmermann
Obviously, he doesn't have the same upside as Clay Buchholz or Joba Chamberlain, the two greatest pitchers to ever walk the face of the earth.
2007-11-20 21:31:33
135.   underdog
Seriously, what is wrong with Dick Vitale? Can someone get him a big mug of hot tea or something?
2007-11-20 21:32:41
136.   underdog
Whoa. Mbah a Moute with a very unexpected, clutch three!
2007-11-20 21:37:26
137.   63Dodger
Russell Martin's excellence shows why I don't miss Piazza one bit. He wasn't a catcher, just a big bat who parked his butt behind the plate the other half of the inning. I honestly believe all his offensive records as a "catcher" should come with a caveat (I'm so sick of asterisks I just can't use 'em anymore).
2007-11-20 21:38:59
138.   Xeifrank
Nice ending to the game for UCLA. I turned it on at 58-58 and got to see MSU go on the 5-0 run, then UCLA go on the 10-0 run. Pretty good stuff. Peaches and Diet Pepsi on the house. vr, Xei
2007-11-20 21:39:39
139.   trainwreck
Well that made my day.
2007-11-20 21:39:59
140.   Benaiah
Wow, I didn't realize how sick Bedard's 2007 was. His BB/9 rates have fallen for the 4th year in a row and his K/9 is truly absurd (10.93). In the NL, in Dodger Stadium, he might be Peavy V2.0.
2007-11-20 21:42:41
141.   Bob Timmermann
Bedard would have blown out the field in the AL K race except that the O's decided to sit him down at the end of the year after an injury.
2007-11-20 21:44:04
142.   StolenMonkey86
141 - the ever-popular oblique injury
2007-11-20 21:46:06
143.   Sam DC
Five Guys news:

Night all.

2007-11-20 21:46:47
144.   CanuckDodger
If anybody is in the mood, check out the lastest post, and reader comments, at USS Mariner. Fans of the team that has Bavasi as a GM laughing at the Dodgers over the Kemp situation is so depressing.
2007-11-20 21:47:42
145.   underdog
And the Lakers blew out the Pacers on the road, with everyone contributing, Bynum outmuscling O'Neal, making this a good night all around.

And I've finally got the last Harry Potter book so my night is officially complete. Cheers!

2007-11-20 21:49:22
146.   Greg Brock
The Bruins finally played a solid football game. Just happened to be on a basketball court.

That was a tad physical.

2007-11-20 21:52:32
147.   Xeifrank
144. Colleti hasn't traded Kemp/LaRoche/Kershaw et al, yet so the folks at USSM can laugh all they want. If we give up those three for MCAB then I will jump on their bandwagon, otherwise I will take a wait and see position. I don't see why a GM should be bashed/made fun of for doing something he hasn't even done. vr, Xei
2007-11-20 21:54:39
148.   Vishal
143 wow, i didn't realize they were expanding so quickly! they're no in-n-out, but for an east coast burger, they're pretty darn good.
2007-11-20 21:59:43
149.   JRSarno
"72. JoeyP
I'm not sure how Kevin Love got so highly ranked.

He cant jump at all, nor is very athletic."

Dude, what games are you watching? The guy double/doubles every night.

2007-11-20 22:04:02
150.   CanuckDodger
147 -- I'm not sure anybody over there mentioned Kershaw, and honestly, I believe Colletti really wants to keep him, and Kershaw may be the only thing keeping a Cabrera trade from being done already. But I think it is beyond established that Colletti doesn't like/trust LaRoche and will be happy to jettison him to bring in a name 3B, and I think it is clear that Kemp, if not quite "history," is at least practically out the door, and for the stupid reasons that are making the Mariner fans laugh at us.
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2007-11-20 22:08:28
151.   Vishal
150 i feel similarly, if not quite so matter-of-factly as canuck on this issue.
2007-11-20 22:09:25
152.   Xeifrank
the stupid reasons that are making the Mariner fans laugh at us.

I really don't care what the reasons are if Kemp is traded for MCAB (without having to also give up Kershaw). I like Kemp and would love to see him blossom wearing a Dodger uniform, but I will take MCAB for him if we can work out some kind of extension for MCAB. If Kemp were traded for junk, then yeah I would laugh at us too. MCAB isn't junk.
vr, Xei

2007-11-20 22:16:09
153.   CajunDodger
At some point this offseason, almost every GM will do something stupid (Cashman spending $400 million for the same guys that got them where they currently are, JC Romero, someone paying Silva $45 million). Colletti has always valued pitching, so I could see Kershaw holding the deal up.

I still wouldn't mind getting Jones and Bedard as a consolation prize so long as we keep either Kemp or Kershaw.

2007-11-20 22:21:00
154.   s choir
If I am GM, no way I trade Kemp for Miggy. The Marlins need to trade Cabrera; they are going to take the best package they can get. Let them have three picks of Kershaw, LaRoche, Abreu, Hu, McDonald, Broxton, Meloan and I'll be happy. The Marlins will take it because it's better than what they'll get anywhere else.
2007-11-20 22:23:53
155.   CajunDodger
Since the RosenRumors have started, I think that I now value Kershaw more than Kemp. I wouldn't mind trading offense for offense, but I'm now unsure if it is advisable to trade stud pitching for stud hitting. Not too many power leftys in the majors right now...
2007-11-20 22:30:42
156.   s choir

While I don't want to give up Kershaw either, I chose Kemp based on the TINSTAAPP adage (there being no such thing as Kershaw, it pains me less to give him up).

2007-11-20 23:24:59
157.   trainwreck
Let's just wait to stick Cabrera somewhere when he is a free agent.
2007-11-20 23:35:29
158.   Greg Brock
157 I'm over all of this nonsense.

I declare a powerless, non-binding, completely worthless moratorium on all Cabrera trade talk. Nobody is allowed to discuss trading Kemp, Kershaw, or LaRoche for Miguel Cabrera. Those names are verboten here.

I also declare that Deadspin commenters cannot discuss Kige Ramsey, Kos commenters cannot discuss George W. Bush, and Freepers cannot discuss Hillary Rodham Clinton.

I'm cleaning up the tubes, effective immediately.

2007-11-20 23:54:12
159.   trainwreck
Does that mean no Hal Ashby talk for Brock?
2007-11-20 23:56:01
160.   KG16
158 - any one else read that and picture Brock getting geared up a la Rambo?

Or maybe it was Don Quixote.

2007-11-20 23:56:20
161.   dzzrtRatt
51 D4P, absolutely no apology needed. It's all part of life's great pageant.

What I wrote was confusing unless you had that guy's voice in your head like I did. (My doctor gives me these pills for it, but my dog tells me I shouldn't take them.)

158 Hello, my name is dzzrt R., and I am a Hot-Stove-aholic. I thought I had it under control -- I thought I was a social trade rumor-monger. But it is seriously disrupting my life. I know I should go to work, take a shower, eat, talk to my kid, but I keep hitting refresh...refresh...refresh...

2007-11-21 00:00:11
162.   Bob Timmermann
No Hal Ashby talk for Brock and he cannot talk about UCLA's head football coach on the interwebs.

For six weeks.

2007-11-21 00:00:27
163.   dzzrtRatt
Bedard is interesting. The feeling of impending doom that accompanies talk of Kemp + 3 for Cabrera does not sit over the Bedard idea. I think he's on his way to elite status. With the rest of the rotation, and if we only lost Kemp (and if LaRoche panned out), we might have enough offense for a rotation and pen like the Dodgers would have.


2007-11-21 00:06:39
164.   Greg Brock
159 If Hal Ashby ran the Dodgers, he would forgo the big ticket trades in favor of a smaller, more talent troupe of Dodgers. The team would be quirky, yet successful, and everybody would give the credit to the players, instead of the man who put the team together.
2007-11-21 00:06:54
165.   trainwreck
He's pretty much given up talking about the UCLA football coach. He is a beaten man.
2007-11-21 00:07:53
166.   KG16
Doesn't Baltimore like little speedy outfielders "who get on base a lot"?

Since it looks like one of Kemp and Ethier are going to be playing for someone else next year, just how well does Young project as an outfielder?

2007-11-21 00:08:16
167.   Bob Timmermann
Brock shouldn't have tried to beat up Karl Dorrell. Although Dorrell is older, I'm betting he's in better shape and he's got big guys he can call on for help.
2007-11-21 00:09:18
168.   trainwreck
Karl Dorrell knows Eric Scott and Eric Scott knows some people.
2007-11-21 00:11:17
169.   Greg Brock
Hal Ashby would never trade Matt Kemp or Clayton Kershaw. He would construct a brilliant movie around their talents, pay them nothing, and work wonders in the editing room. Hal Ashby undersood the value of pre-free agency talent.

Then he would do copious amounts of drugs.

2007-11-21 00:14:10
170.   Greg Brock
Why would I beat up on Karl Dorrell? That's like beating up on Caryl Chessman.

You don't beat up on dead men walking.

2007-11-21 00:17:14
171.   trainwreck
Could we possibly get a reference from my lifetime once in awhile?
2007-11-21 00:18:29
172.   Bob Timmermann
Gary Gilmore?
2007-11-21 00:19:44
173.   Greg Brock
171 Dude, you know me by now. I skew to the older crowd, despite my age. I'm a Boomer trapped in a younger man's body.

It's what allows me to enjoy Freaks and Geeks on the same level that Timmermann does.

2007-11-21 00:21:55
174.   trainwreck
Wrong decade.

DT causes me to use Wikipedia and a lot, so that is probably a good thing.

2007-11-21 00:31:30
175.   Greg Brock
Caryl Chessman was one of the Hippie pillars of my youth. He ranks up there with the Yoda and good surf.

How can any Californian not know about Caryl Chessman?

2007-11-21 00:49:21
176.   dzzrtRatt
In actuality, my guess is the number of Californians who would recognize that name is in the low single digits.

I wonder how many know who Jerry Brown is. (Chessman was the cause that first got Jerry interested in politics. The interesting thing was, his father was the governor who refused to commute Chessman's sentence.)

An all-news station reported on the state's suit against toymakers yesterday. The story referred to "the attorney general" and never mentioned Brown by name.

2007-11-21 00:59:52
177.   trainwreck
Well I now know who he is and he does sound like a great hippie to me.
2007-11-21 01:00:19
178.   trainwreck
2007-11-21 01:14:01
179.   Greg Brock
177 Does a state have the right to murder its citizens? Is rape a capital offense? What happens when an appeal is granted in the middle of an execution? Can you stop an execution once it's started?

That's why the Chessman case is so interesting. Because it is very complex.

2007-11-21 01:17:57
180.   trainwreck
If only OZ was around back then.
2007-11-21 04:43:20
181.   Greg Brock
180 Anyhoo, how about Kevin Love!

{Switches subject most smoothly}

2007-11-21 05:09:34
182.   D4P
Is Kevin Love the traitor from Oregon?
2007-11-21 06:02:37
183.   Bumsrap
As McCourt talks about building a team that can win in the future as well as now, I wonder what the rotation will look like in 2009 if Kershaw is traded and Penny and Lowe are no longer with the team. Santana would be a long shot because the Yankees will offer as much as it takes to get him or he will show he is no longer the great pitcher he used to be early in 08.

2009 could have Billingsley, Kershaw, Bedard, McDonald, Elbert, Kuo, Meloan, or Broxton in the rotation or just Billingsley and 4 free agents.

2007-11-21 07:00:15
184.   Sam DC
New mascot?

2007-11-21 07:02:06
185.   Daniel Zappala
I give 158 my useless stamp of approval.
2007-11-21 07:10:29
186.   Ghost of Carlos Perez

Do all Californians know who John Muir is (was?)?

Every time I mention John Muir (which happens more than you'd think), my wife asks, "who's John Muir?" I've always assumed that's because she's from Texas.

2007-11-21 07:15:15
187.   Bob Timmermann
I would say that John Muir's name is recognized by close to 50% of all Californians. They put him on the quarter didn't they?
2007-11-21 07:24:17
188.   old dodger fan
Changing the subject back to the subject-Don't you have to have less than 40 players on your 40 man roster in order to select someone in the Rule 5 draft?

If so, does only having 38 on ours indicate we have designs on 1 or 2 players on someone else's roster?

Any other ideas on why we only protected 38?

2007-11-21 07:32:09
189.   Jon Weisman
188 - Or to sign a free agent, etc. In any case, no, it's not surprising that the Dodgers left spots open.
2007-11-21 07:36:48
190.   GobiasIndustries
When speaking of Jerry Brown, the Dead Kennedys
song "California uber alles" immediately jumps in my head..........always. I don't know why, but it just does.

I am Governor Jerry Brown
My aura smiles
And never frowns
Soon I will be president…

Carter power will soon go away
I will be Führer one day
I will command all of you
Your kids will meditate in school

California Uber Alles
Uber Alles California

2007-11-21 07:43:22
191.   Andrew Shimmin
184- If I were a giant, fossilized sea scorpion, and you were a lady, would you marry me anyway? Would you have my baby?
2007-11-21 07:51:24
192.   Andrew Shimmin
George Ou counts down the Black Friday hits, if anybody needs a new computer or t.v. That three hundred dollar Compaq looks enticing, or it would, anyway, if it weren't a Compaq.

2007-11-21 07:56:38
193.   Xeifrank
Why is Jeff Kent taking so long to decide if he is coming back? Is he waiting to see if a certain someone with a supposedly bad attitude is traded first? vr, Xei
2007-11-21 07:57:49
194.   kinbote
183 I believe we hold a no-brainer club option for Penny in 2009. He should be inked into the 2009 rotation.
2007-11-21 07:59:57
195.   Xeifrank
ZIPS projects AROD to have 806 homeruns at the end of his 10 year contract. His OPS is projected to be above .800 until the year 2016.
vr, Xei
2007-11-21 08:02:13
196.   kinbote
Penny is set to make $8.5m in 2007 and $8.75m in 2009 (club option). Excepting the youngsters [& Saito], he's got to be the most underpaid Dodger. What are the odds of an Extend-me-or-else! spring training disruption? I'd say pretty good, knowing our luck.
2007-11-21 08:02:28
197.   underdog
193 Man, I hope note. If they trade Kemp purely to make Kent happy for one year, I'm going to scream, and then put that scream in an envelope and mail it to Frank McCourt's office.

But I'm with Greg, ix-nay on the abrera-cay alk-tay.

2007-11-21 08:02:55
198.   underdog
I hope not, not "note."

I need coffee. Up way too early. Feh.

2007-11-21 08:04:39
199.   kinbote
2007-11-21 08:08:23
200.   Vishal
192 i think there's a $229 toshiba laptop + printer package at best buy. and a $650 dell with 2GB ram. those are pretty good deals.
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2007-11-21 08:08:51
201.   Vishal
198 yet you got your pig latin right...
2007-11-21 08:11:35
202.   Gr-ool
182 Is Kevin Love related to Mike Love's harp playing sister in Oregon?
2007-11-21 08:11:53
203.   JoeyP
Dude, what games are you watching? The guy double/doubles every night.

You gotta look inside the numbers:
First, his rebounding numbers are a bit inflated since there alot of opportunities to gather rebounds in UCLA games. UCLA opponents are shooting .395 FG's, .239 3-point FGs, .687 FT's. UCLA as a team is shooting .456/.368/.648. Translation, there's lot of rebounds to be had in a UCLA basketball game. Love, since he has 23 Offensive Rebounds/35 defensive rebounds on the season, actually has benefitted from UCLA's own poor shooting to jack up his rebounding numbers.

Love's A/TO ratio is 12/11. This isnt good, especially for a player whose reported skill is great passing ability.

The skill that Kevin Love excels at is drawing fouls. He's shot 47 free throws in only 5 games. At this level, where he's physically stronger than most all other collegians, he'll probably be able to maintain this. But at the NBA level, where the big men are much more athletic and dont need to foul in order to defend, he'll struggle on the offensive end. On the defensive end, he could struggle too given his lack of footspeed on the perimeter.

Very rare in the NBA nowadays to be a good-great player at the 4/5 spot unless you are an outstanding athlete.

I think Love's upside at the NBA level is Andrew Bogut. Bogut's a decent player, but nothing special.

The fact that Love was rated higher than some of the other players like Eric Gordon, Derrick Rose, OJ Mayo, Mike Beasley, Kyle Singler really says more about what the talent evaluators were actually looking at, than his actual ability.

2007-11-21 08:25:58
204.   regfairfield
203 If we lose out on the Santana/Sabathia/Sheets derby, we have to re-sign him if we don't want a mediocre rotation, there's almost no other option. Peavy, Lackey, and Penny are the only good pitchers available in the 2009 off season, and I have to believe that those guys are getting locked up.
2007-11-21 08:29:46
205.   Don Tordilla
From Buster Olney today on ESPN:

The Dodgers are not close to a deal for Miguel Cabrera, because so far, the cost, in young players, is prohibitive for L.A. And as good as Cabera is, there are questions about his extraordinary weight gain and whether he will continue to be a clone of Manny Ramirez, or if he'll become another Kevin Mitchell, whose physical conditioning eventually wrecked what could have been an exceptional career. "It's not as if the Dodgers are one phone call away on this thing," said an NL source. "There is a lot of work to be done for them to get involved. They are pretty far apart, right now."

The growing expectation around the game is that the Angels will land Cabrera.

2007-11-21 08:36:09
206.   LogikReader
I tend to give Buster Olney more credibility than Robothal. The quote from 205 sounds a lot more accurate to me.

First of all, Happy Thanksgiving! That goes for everyone here at DT.

For D4P I submit this to you: You... are... correct. Why is Brady having such an extraordinary season? It's Randy Moss! Why did the 49ers go from darn good to really great? Jerry Rice! What kept the Cowboys from defeat this week? Terrell Owens.

In the catch, the catcher often means more than than the thrower.

2007-11-21 08:47:58
207.   regfairfield
So what it is about Miguel Cabrera that makes people come up with completely absurd comparables? Kevin Mitchell? A guy that didn't have an exceptional year until age 27?
2007-11-21 08:49:19
208.   Jon Weisman
New post up top, hopefully free of Joe Montana talk :)
2007-11-21 08:50:49
209.   Andrew Shimmin
207- Personally, Cabrera reminds me a lot of Andrew Bogut.
2007-11-21 08:52:22
210.   KG16
The more time that passes without a crazy move, the more optimistic I am that NedCo gets it. I'm slowly reaching "cautiously optimistic" territory. Though I would like Kent to make a decision.
2007-11-21 08:57:23
211.   underdog
201 Pig latin what now?

That's just how I speak when I'm sleepy.


2007-11-21 10:20:53
212.   blued22
Good morning-

Long time reader, first time commenter. I have an affection for hyperbole which I'll do my best to curb: (UCSC grad)

193: I've come to believe Jeff Kent is very likely pressuring the FO to trade Matt Kemp.

I've been watching LA baseball since the Hollywood Stars owned the town from Gilmore Field; Bobby Bragan(M), Bill Mazerowski(2B), Chuck Steven(1B), Carlos Bernier(CF), Frankie Kelleher(LF)...

I ushered the first Dodger season at the Coliseum, over-seeing the last RF tunnel as a 16yo.

And lots of connections to commenters here: For example, someone here thinks King of NY the best gangster movie, ever. Many yearshe editor of that film gave me my first gig as an apprentice film editor. Lots to say and too much space...


2007-11-21 10:41:22
213.   blued22
oops--sorry, bad start.

Many years before K of NY was released, the editor of that film gave...

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