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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Offseason Summary
2008-01-20 22:15
by Jon Weisman

An update of offseason affairs great and small ...


  • Chin-hui Tsao, Jason Repko, Yhency Brazoban, Jason Schmidt, Hong-Chih Kuo and Randy Wolf activated from the 60-day disabled list
  • Wolf, Mike Lieberthal and Ramon Martinez file for free agency after team options are bought out
  • Zachary Hammes and Mike Megrew outrighted to AAA Las Vegas
  • Chin-Hui Tsao, Olmedo Saenz, Roberto Hernandez, Chad Moeller and Tim Hamulack become free agents after refusing assignments to Las Vegas
  • Luis Gonzalez, Rudy Seanez, Mark Sweeney, Shea Hillenbrand and David Wells also file for free agency
  • Xavier Paul, Lucas May, James McDonald, Ramon Troncoso, Justin Orenduff, Mario Alvarez and Cory Wade added to 40-man roster
  • Robert Boothe signed to minor league contract
  • Chan Ho Park signs non-roster contract with an invitation to Spring Training
  • Wesley Wright lost to Houston in Rule 5 draft
  • Mark Hendrickson not tendered a contract, making him a free agent
  • Andruw Jones, Hiroki Kuroda and Gary Bennett signed as free agents
  • Rene Rivera, Terry Tiffee, Tanyon Sturtze, Mike Koplove, Brian Falkenborg, Rick Asadoorian, Fernando Desgue, Greg Jones, Brian Shackelford, John-Ford Griffin, John Lindsey, Angel Chavez, Danny Ardoin, Matt Riley, George Lombard and Alfredo Simon invited to Spring Training on non-roster contracts
  • Wilson Valdez sold to Korean team Kia Tigers
  • Arbitration-eligible Yhency Brazoban, Jason Repko and Scott Proctor sign contracts for 2008

    Management and coaching

  • Manager Grady Little ankles, replaced by Joe Torre
  • Larry Bowa hired as third-base coach, replacing Rich Donnelly
  • Don Mattingly hired as hitting coach, with Bill Mueller returning to the front office
  • Bench coach Dave Jauss hired by Baltimore Orioles in same role
  • Gene Clines promoted from minor-league outfield/baserunning coordinator to minor-league hitting coordinator
  • Ken Howell named bullpen coach
  • Bob Schaefer named bench coach
  • Rodney McCray hired as roving baserunning and outfield coach
  • Minor league coaching assignments posted

    Front office and staff

  • EVP and COO Marty Greenspun departs, replaced by Dennis Mannion
  • De Jon Watson promoted to assistant general manager, player development
  • Todd Tomczyk promoted to assistant athletic trainer
  • Sue Falsone hired as physical therapist
  • Brendon Huttman hired as strength coach
  • Assistant athletic trainer Stan Johnston dismissed
  • Charles Steinberg hired as executive vice president for marketing and public relations
  • Senior vice president of communications Camille Johnston ankles
  • Rick Lembo hired as assistant trainer
  • Marty Lamb promoted to East Coast supervisor of scouting
  • Matt Paul hired as an area scout


  • Dodgers sign multi-year deal with KABC 790 AM
  • Broadcasters Rick Monday and Charley Steiner extend contracts through 2009


  • Field level renovation at Dodger Stadium commences.
  • Groundbreaking takes place for Spring Training facility in Arizona (scheduled to open in 2009).
  • Dodgers announce Spring Training exhibitions in China, Arizona and Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum for 2008.


  • Russell Martin wins Silver Slugger, Gold Glove and Tip O'Neill (top Canadian player) awards
  • Walter O'Malley and Dick Williams elected into the Hall of Fame
  • Lon Joyce earns Distinguished Scouts Award
  • Clair Rierson named Mid Atlantic Scout Association Scout of the Year
  • Ralph Avila earns George Genovese Lifetime Achievement Award in Scouting
  • Al LaMacchia earns Special Recognition in Scouting Award.

  • Comments (167)
    Show/Hide Comments 1-50
    2008-01-20 22:33:13
    1.   Eric Enders
    Thanks for the great summary, Jon. A couple of additions, if I may:

    - Russell Martin also won the Tip O'Neill Award. (

    - I believe the surname of the longtime trainer who was fired is actually Johnston.

    Also, I note with great trepidation that Vin Scully is entering his "contract year," as he's signed only through 2008. Here's hoping he doesn't become a free agent.

    2008-01-20 23:52:39
    2.   berkowit28
    I am not familiar with the term "ankles" as verb. The meaning is clear, but where does it come from?
    2008-01-21 00:05:34
    3.   Eric Enders
    "When -- and for God's sake, why -- did 'ankles' become a preferred headline verb somehow meaning both 'quits' and 'fires'? We know the chief culprit: the mockworthy Hollywood trade-mag Variety."

    2008-01-21 00:07:09
    4.   Eric Enders
    In other words, Jon, the Times -- and specifically, Matt Welch -- would like you to please stop making up silly words. ;)
    2008-01-21 01:07:24
    5.   Bob Timmermann
    But Matt Welch left the Times and moved to DC to go edit "Reason."
    2008-01-21 02:37:46
    6.   Benjamin Miracord
    As if the last nine baseball seasons weren't bad enough, now we have to put up with it in the Super Bowl — New York versus Boston.
    2008-01-21 07:05:27
    7.   D4P
    Osama Bin Laden's son is 26 years old, and is married to a woman who (according to CNN) is twice his age.

    Don't see that everyday.

    2008-01-21 07:08:52
    8.   Bluebleeder87
    Repko is gonna have a hard time (kind of like Jason Werth did) making the club, with the emergence of Delwyn Young & such, he always fairs well in spring training so we shall see.
    2008-01-21 07:25:49
    9.   Jon Weisman
    3 - I'm sure you could have found a kinder way to explain that term.

    Like, say, here:

    "A classic (and enduring) Variety term meaning to quit or be dismissed from a job, without necessarily specifying which"

    The fact is, it's a pretty useful word.

    2008-01-21 07:48:34
    10.   Daniel Zappala
    For some reason, when I read "ankles" my mind conjures up someone hitting you in the ankles, a la Tonya Harding.
    2008-01-21 07:56:01
    11.   regfairfield
    8 Since Repko has options and Young doesn't, I can't see him making the club unless we make Nomar the third baseman and start LaRoche in AAA.

    In other words, there's a pretty good chance.

    2008-01-21 08:08:21
    12.   Bluebleeder87
    This version of U2's "Pride" tune just rocks. Happy Martin Luther King day everyone. []
    2008-01-21 08:10:23
    13.   Bluebleeder87
    I've read there just keeping Repko around as insurance, which is good I guess.
    2008-01-21 08:15:07
    14.   Andrew Shimmin
    Does "ankles," really have a double meaning, or does it always mean, "They said he quit, but it looks mighty likely that he was fired" ?
    2008-01-21 08:21:16
    15.   silverwidow
    It's probably nothing, but Billingsley's profile on re-directs to a dead page.

    Someone must've messed up because I was watching his game highlights just the other day.

    2008-01-21 08:23:51
    16.   D4P
    Billingsley's profile on re-directs to a dead page

    Only a matter of time until it re-directs to

    2008-01-21 08:42:19
    17.   D4P
    Rotoworld on Tomko:

    It's so ridiculous to complain about what Alex Rodriguez is making when baseball is swimming in so much cash that Tomko can disappoint organization after organization and still receive $3 million. The soon-to-be 35-year-old had a 5.55 ERA while pitching in two of the National League's bigger ballparks last season. Once in 10 years -- with the Giants in 2004 -- has he actually met the expectations a team had for him. There's simply way too much money being made by baseball if he's worth $3 million.

    2008-01-21 08:45:40
    18.   cargill06
    17 - amen
    2008-01-21 08:46:08
    19.   Xeifrank
    Ah, thank god for lower tiered holidays and sleeping in... Can I get an Amen!?
    vr, Xei
    2008-01-21 08:57:30
    20.   berkowit28
    9 14 re "ankles": A comment in the Times blog referred readers to here - much more complete, and very interesting:
    2008-01-21 09:06:05
    21.   Bob Timmermann
    I checked my work email and after 12 days gone, I had just 167 messages and lots of those were the spammers replying to my "out of office" message.

    I should have a much more manageable 44 to deal with tomorrow.

    2008-01-21 09:09:17
    22.   Ken Noe
    Tomko's contract is the best reason I can think of to support contraction. When he gets that kind of money, there are too many teams.
    2008-01-21 09:12:23
    23.   regfairfield
    17 Add Rotoworld to the list of organizations that don't realize Dodger Stadium is a hitters park.

    Sadly a pitcher that you know will probably be below average instead of horrible is worth about three million these days. Looking at the avialable options, Tomko might have been the best pitcher still on the market.

    2008-01-21 09:14:42
    24.   Disabled List
    In his football recap, Don Banks of SI had an interesting bit that parallels a lot of the discussions we've had here about injured players toughing it out "for the good of the team." I think it's a little stupid considering the Chargers still had a fine running game without LT yesterday, and although they missed his big-play ability, that probably wasn't happening anyway with him not at 100%:

    LT last week said it was the first time he has ever hurt either one of his knees, so a certain amount of caution is understandable. It's his career and he gets to decide such matters. But he also can't guarantee that he'll ever have another chance to play for a trip to the Super Bowl, so as I see it, the time to try to play the hero was now. No guts, no glory, and all that stuff.

    Seems to me that Chargers quarterback Philip Rivers (knee) and tight end Antonio Gates (dislocated toe) were playing hurt and gutting it out, but not Tomlinson, who has never lacked for toughness in his football career. He was probable for most of the week, and didn't even end the week on the injury list. More than anything, I'm just surprised. Maybe he's close to tearing something, knows it, and didn't want to take any chances. [...]

    I'll say this: Willis Reed, he's not.

    2008-01-21 09:20:23
    25.   cargill06
    another case of Tom getting so much more help from his teammates than Peyton gets from his, yet Tom is "clutch" and Peyton "can't win the big one", it's really unfair how much blame Peyton gets for his teams losses
    2008-01-21 09:22:36
    26.   Bob Timmermann
    It's even more interesting given your handle.

    But football does have the "warrior mentality." I don't know if it's a good one. It's possible that Tomlinson was just one bad cut away from turning in to Ki-Jana Carter.

    A lot of the newer measures of football performance have come to the conclusion that running back is actually a somewhat overrated position. Look at how Denver would just anoint someone as the starting running back and they would get 1000 yards a season no matter who they were.

    There are great running backs and some have a lot more talent than others, but I'd rather have a team with great receivers. I say this as a fan of UCLA who watched a team that had no guys who were deep threats and the most TD catches any player had was 4.

    2008-01-21 09:23:45
    27.   D4P
    A lot of the newer measures of football performance have come to the conclusion that running back is actually a somewhat overrated position

    Like I said: invest your money in the offensive line (and conversely, the defensive line).

    2008-01-21 09:26:11
    28.   Eric Stephen
    I heard a little of the Norv Turner postgame presser, and some of the reporters were out of line with their LT questions. One guy actually said, "but [LT] was 100%, he practiced all week."

    First of all, I'm pretty sure it was clear to everyone that LT was not 100%. As if such an accurate percentage rating was possible, Phil Simms reported before the game that LT said himself he was 90% and could make his cuts. That's not 100%.

    Second of all, Norv said LT hurt himself during his first two drives, which would make all the talk of being 100% during the week irrelevant.

    2008-01-21 09:29:02
    29.   cargill06
    27 bingo, after QB D-line is the most important position, if you can get pressure without blitzing and stop the run without 8 guys in the box it makes your DB's and LB's them great players regardless how much talent they have
    2008-01-21 09:34:11
    30.   Jon Weisman
    27 - Are the lines on the NYSE or Nasdaq?
    2008-01-21 09:34:52
    31.   D4P
    My investment advice was for entertainment purposes only.
    2008-01-21 09:40:17
    32.   silverwidow
    15 It's been fixed.
    2008-01-21 10:00:21
    33.   Linkmeister
    I'm pretty sure that Wodehouse had Bertie Wooster use "ankles" as a verb long before Jon's employer began using it that way.
    2008-01-21 10:08:02
    34.   LogikReader
    24 and others.

    I have to disagree with some of you on this one. It's one thing when you're going through the regular season like Rafael Furcal did and play through injury when a simple month off would have benefitted the team much more.

    It is another thing entirely when, in the most important game of your career, you sit out after being more than 70% healthy. LT let down a lot of people yesterday and quite frankly, he could have been the difference between the Chargers winning and losing. The Patriots did not play very well yesterday and the SD defensive line was playing up to par. Rivers and Gates were potentially more banged up than LT and they wound up being quite servicable during the game. I have to take the side of SI for this one.

    2008-01-21 10:13:03
    35.   Gen3Blue
    10 20, etc. I for some reason felt the etymology of ankles was somehow related to a milder version of being knee-capped. Seems funny now.
    2008-01-21 10:14:27
    36.   cargill06
    "And now the division has added Dan Haren and Hiroki Kuroda, who might be every bit as good as Dice-K. That's a pretty strong statement in behalf of the NL West for me."

    Jerry Crusnick- ESPN

    2008-01-21 10:34:24
    37.   Eric Stephen
    Gates didn't do anything yesterday. He caught all of 2 passes for 17 yards. The Chargers certainly missed LT and a healthy Gates yesterday mostly in the red zone, where they failed to score a TD when they were sorely needed.

    But, where do you get the 70% figure for LT? Why can't you accept that he re-aggravated the injury during the first moments of the game, as was reported? The doctors and trainers said LT couldn't play, so he didn't.

    Side point: I have no idea what the doctors and trainers said regarding Rivers, but I'm assuming he played despite the warnings not too. However, for all the accolades being thrust upon Rivers, couldn't Volek have done better than, or reasonably similar to 51.4% passing with 0 TD and 2 INT? That's something to think about when factoring in whether an injured player should play.

    2008-01-21 10:37:15
    38.   Eric Stephen
    I forgot the Lakers started last season 26-13, only to finish 42-40 after many injuries led to their collapse.

    Hopefully, they can whether the storm after this season's 26-11 start.

    2008-01-21 11:04:41
    39.   Lexinthedena
    Speaking of Bills, he has completely flown under the "Experts" radar this pre-season...
    2008-01-21 11:19:06
    40.   Jon Weisman
    At Variety, I take stock of where the Friday Night Lights characters are.

    2008-01-21 11:19:49
    41.   D4P
    Yadier Molina...agreed Monday to a $15.5 million, four-year contract with the St. Louis Cardinals...The 25-year-old had asked for a raise from $525,000 to $2.75 million in salary arbitration and the Cardinals had offered $1.85 million..."

    I did the math. It doesn't make sense.

    2008-01-21 11:31:32
    42.   Eric Enders
    The math does makes sense because Molina's salary was guaranteed to go up gradually each year he went to arbitration.

    So, with Mauer, McCann, and Molina, all the young, talented 'M' catchers in baseball have been locked up long-term except for one.

    2008-01-21 11:34:26
    43.   Marty
    21 Piker

    I get over 300 emails a day. And none of them are spam

    2008-01-21 11:34:35
    44.   D4P
    all the young, talented 'M' catchers in baseball have been locked up long-term except for one


    2008-01-21 11:35:19
    45.   Dodgers49
    10 For some reason, when I read "ankles" my mind conjures up someone hitting you in the ankles, a la Tonya Harding.

    For me it conjured up an image of someone being thrown overboard with sandbags attached to their ankles.

    2008-01-21 11:44:23
    46.   Bob Timmermann
    I was grateful it was that few.

    The worse thing will be the voicemails. I hate going through my voicemails as they almost always are from people who talk too long about something unimportant or they should have just sent me an email.

    I'm like Paul DePodesta, I don't want to talk on the phone unless it's important.

    2008-01-21 11:49:44
    47.   Eric Stephen
    Here's quick recap of the young "M" catchers and their long-term deals:

    Victor Martinez (signed in 2005 with 1 yr, 114 days service time):
    $1m signing bonus
    2nd yr - $500k
    3rd yr - $800k
    arb yr 1 - $3m
    arb yr 2 - $4.25m
    arb yr 3 - $5.7m
    FA yr 1 - $7m option ($250k buyout)
    Total contract - 5 yrs, $15.5m

    Brian McCann (signed in 2007 with 1 yr, 117 days service time):
    $1m signing bonus
    2nd yr - $500k
    3rd yr - $800k
    arb yr 1 - $3.5m
    arb yr 2 - $5.5m
    arb yr 3 - $6.5m
    FA yr 1 - $8.5m
    FA yr 2 - $12m option ($500k buyout)
    Total contract - 6 yrs, $26.8m

    Joe Mauer (signed in 2007 with 3 yrs service time - not an exact comp):
    arb yr 1 - $3.75m
    arb yr 2 - $6.25m
    arb yr 3 - $10.5m
    FA yr 1 - $12.5m
    Total contract - 4 yrs, $33m

    NEW - Yadier Molina (signed in 2008 with 3 yrs, 123 days service time):
    $250k signing bonus
    arb yr 1 - $1.75m
    arb yr 2 - $3.25m
    arb yr 3 - $4.25m
    FA yr 1 - $5.25m
    FA yr 2 - $7m option ($750k buyout; option increases to $7.5m if traded)
    Total contract - 4 yrs, $15.25m

    Martin currently has 1 year, 150 days service time, and will be arbitration eligible as a "Super Two" next offseason, and will have 4 years of arbitration eligibility.

    I'm certain Martin will be locked up before the 2009 arbitration hearings, but it might behoove the Dodgers to save some money by making the deal now.

    2008-01-21 11:59:41
    48.   Humma Kavula
    47 Agreed. Dodgers' checklist for the offseason probably looks like this:

    __x__ Sign Jones
    __x__ Sign Kuroda
    _____ Figure out what we're doing about Pierre
    _____ Lock up Martin

    They just haven't gotten to that part of the list yet.

    2008-01-21 12:05:46
    49.   Dodgers49
    Pierre could be the odd man in Dodgers' outfield

    >> "I have managed players with (consecutive games) streaks before," Torre said. "In New York, I had Hideki Matsui (518). In Atlanta, I had Dale Murphy (740). I remember going to (then-Braves owner) Ted Turner's office one day and telling him I thought Dale Murphy would be better off not playing every game. Ted said he was playing every game, and that was that. But when it comes to streaks, it's something I would address with the individual player and try to gauge how important it is to the player." <<

    2008-01-21 12:08:51
    50.   Bluebleeder87
    I'm certain Martin will be locked up before the 2009 arbitration hearings, but it might behoove the Dodgers to save some money by making the deal now.

    I think the Dodgers are going about it the right way with Martin & like you said he's gonna be locked up most likely in '09.

    Show/Hide Comments 51-100
    2008-01-21 12:11:24
    51.   trainwreck
    Thankfully, we should not have to worry about that kind of offense in the coming years.
    2008-01-21 12:12:33
    52.   Jon Weisman
    If there was a time the Dodgers gave a contact of more than two years to a pre-free agent, I can't think of it.
    2008-01-21 12:16:17
    53.   Dodgers49
    Dodgers' reliever Beimel has more leverage this time

    >> Last winter, the Dodgers were able to make their case to a panel of arbitrators largely on Beimel being unavailable during the first-round playoff loss to the New York Mets because he cut his hand on a broken glass while drinking in a bar two nights before the series opener. It is believed that incident played a major role in the club winning its case against Beimel last February <<

    2008-01-21 12:18:02
    54.   Eric Stephen
    Mondesi? He signed a 6/$60m deal prior to 1998 with only 4+ full years of service time.
    2008-01-21 12:19:52
    55.   Bob Timmermann
    From people I've heard talk about the arbitration process, off-field matters usually don't play much part in the decision making. Beimel likely just got paid whatever someone with his experience and statistics would get paid.

    The one guy who handled arbitration cases who spoke at a SABR meeting said that the only player he thought ever won a case on the basis of his personality was David Eckstein. Guys like John Rocker and Kevin Brown, who aren't exactly warm and cuddly types, weren't affected.

    2008-01-21 12:22:10
    56.   D4P
    the only player he thought ever won a case on the basis of his personality was David Eckstein

    The legend grows.

    2008-01-21 12:24:43
    57.   Eric Enders
    52 But these aren't your daddy's Dodgers.
    (Unless you're Drew McCourt.)

    Also, from the NY Times...
    "February 23, 1996
    HIDEO NOMO became the first Los Angeles Dodgers pitcher ever to sign a multiyear deal after his rookie season when he agreed to terms of a three-year contract yesterday. Terms of the deal were not released, but the package is believed to be worth about $4.3 million."

    2008-01-21 12:24:54
    58.   Eric Stephen
    The Dodgers also signed Karros to a 3-year deal after his first two full seasons:

    The contract ran through his first 2 arb years. I love that the article linked above, from 1994, begins with "The Los Angeles Dodgers continued their commitment to youth."

    2008-01-21 12:25:52
    59.   Dodgers49
    52 If there was a time the Dodgers gave a contact of more than two years to a pre-free agent, I can't think of it.

    I find myself wondering where all of this optimism about locking up Martin next year is coming from. It would not surprise me at all to see Martin end up in arbitration at least once.

    2008-01-21 12:25:52
    60.   Eric Enders
    55 But the broken glass was an on-field matter, since it prevented Beimel from contributing in the playoffs.
    2008-01-21 12:29:19
    61.   Eric Stephen
    I think the hope/optimism in signing Martin early comes with:

    (a) avoiding the corrosive arbitration process
    (b) creating goodwill among fellow young players, fans, etc by locking up a young star
    (c) saving money over the life of the deal (albeit with the risk of losing money if Martin gets hurt), especially if they can include 1 or 2 FA years like the Rockies are doing with Tulo.

    2008-01-21 12:32:07
    62.   Jon Weisman
    59/61 - Yeah - I'm glad that there were examples, and I understand there's new leadership now, but I don't see any reason to think that a long-term deal with Martin will come easily, if at all. I could see some short-term stuff that would avoid arbitration, but I don't know that I would expect a major, major deal.
    2008-01-21 12:39:38
    63.   regfairfield
    The economics of the game have changed so much since then though. Right now, there's no reason not to lock up any good young players you have long term if you're confident they can hold the position for the dutation of the contract. You end up saving so much money in the long run, with only the minor risk of them getting a major injury.

    Someone Martin's age would have to be way over confident to turn down something like 6/44 right now.

    2008-01-21 12:45:19
    64.   ToyCannon
    If I was a betting man, I'd be betting that Martin gets locked up sometime in 2008. With the contracts the young catchers like Martinez, Mauer, and McCann have gotten they can't go against the tide and ignore their own. They can, but they won't.
    2008-01-21 12:46:30
    65.   Eric Enders
    I hope the Dodgers eventually adopt the model Cleveland used to sustain their dynasty of the late '90s, when they had a bunch of young star players all about the same age, and locked them all up with long-term deals that bought out their first couple of years of free agency. It saved them a ton of money and also kept the players from leaving after six years.

    The way things look right now, Martin, Loney, Kemp, Billingsley, Broxton, Abreu, LaRoche, Ethier, and (assuming he's still good) Saito will all become free agents within about two years of each other. That is going to be very, very expensive for McCourt.

    2008-01-21 12:50:43
    66.   regfairfield
    White Sox sign Dotel for 2/11, for those of you that thought he would be a nice buy low acquisition.
    2008-01-21 12:53:18
    67.   ToyCannon
    That won't turn out well.
    2008-01-21 13:00:12
    68.   cargill06
    66 would've liked to see him in LA but not at that price no way
    2008-01-21 13:05:32
    69.   ToyCannon
    Me to, loved those Indian teams, even Belle. Now that was a feared hitter Jim Rice fans.
    2008-01-21 13:17:14
    70.   regfairfield
    I guess when you're blindly doing everything to win this year, getting Octavio and praying he's healthy might be a decent strategy. They need to get up to 95 wins somehow.

    Now, trying to jump from 70 wins to 95 might not be the brightest idea to begin with.

    2008-01-21 13:17:32
    71.   JoeyP
    38---Tough break for the Lakers---no pun intended.

    2008-01-21 13:18:49
    72.   Eric Stephen
    Here are the players that have made an all-star team before arbitration eligibility in the past few seasons, and their contract status:

    Long-Term Contracts (10)
    Chase Utley - signed 7/$85 before 1st arb year (2007)
    David Wright - signed 6/$55 before 3rd season (2007)
    Joe Mauer - signed 4/$33 before 1st arb year (2007)
    Brian McCann - signed 6/$26.8 before 2nd season (2007)
    Jake Peavy - signed 5/$25.5 (after option and escalators) before 1st arb year (2005)
    Jose Reyes - signed 4/$23.5 before 1st arb year (2007)
    Grady Sizemore - signed 6/$23.45m before 2nd season (2006)
    Matt Holliday - signed 2/$23 before 2nd arb year (2008)
    Chris Young - signed 4/$14.5m before 3rd season (2007)
    Brian Fuentes - signed 2/$5.5 before 1st arb year (2006)

    Seven of the 10 bought out at least one year of free agency.

    Signed One-Year Contracts (2)
    Miguel Cabrera - signed 1/$11.3 (2nd arb year) - working on long term deal with Tigers; 4 years service time
    Scott Kazmir - signed 1/$3.785 (1st arb year)

    Still Indentured (14)
    Freddy Sanchez - 4yrs service time (in 2nd arb 2008)
    J.J. Hardy - 3yrs service time (in arb 2008)
    Alex Rios - 3yrs service time (in arb 2008)
    Robinson Cano - 2.153 service time (in arb 2008)
    Ryan Howard - 2.145 service time (in arb 2008)
    Francisco Liriano - 2yrs service time
    Dan Uggla - 2yrs service time
    Prince Fielder - 2yrs service time
    Takashi Saito - 2yrs service time
    Bobby Jenks - 2yrs service time
    Jonathan Papelbon - 2yrs service time
    Justin Verlander - 2yrs service time (still under major league contract signed when drafted)
    Russell Martin - 1.150 service time
    Cole Hamels - 1.143 service time

    For the 16 still yet unsigned to a long-term deal, I would bet at least Howard, Fielder, and Martin will have deals done before the 2009 season starts.

    2008-01-21 13:20:41
    73.   Eric Stephen
    Apologies to Bob, 72 should have specified "Tall" Chris Young.
    2008-01-21 13:21:57
    74.   JoeyP
    Looks like the Rockies made a great deal with Tulo.

    They are signing him to a 6/30mils contract. His 5th/6th years he would have been a free agent I believe, so they are basically paying him 2/10 for those years. Thats a great deal, when he'll probably we worth 2/30 at that point.

    2008-01-21 13:23:59
    75.   Eric Stephen
    Only the 6th season of the deal is a free agent year (he has just over 1 year of service time currently), but there is an option for a 7th (and 2nd FA) year as well.
    2008-01-21 13:26:49
    76.   JoeyP
    (c) saving money over the life of the deal (albeit with the risk of losing money if Martin gets hurt), especially if they can include 1 or 2 FA years like the Rockies are doing with Tulo.

    The 2nd half of your statement is the only reason IMO that MLB teams would ever buy out arbitration years. The clubs only save money if they get to buy out 1 or 2 FA years.

    To me, its very risky for clubs to buy out arbitration years bc generally arbitration rewards have been a slow progression upward even for the best players. Plus, as with a long term deal, the risk of injury is there also.

    One of DePo's bad moves was signing Gagne and avoiding arbitration. That cost the club some unnecessary cash that they ended up paying for a hurt Gagne. With the club seemingly knowing about the steroid accusations on the club surrounding LoDuca, I'm very suprised they ended up giving Gagne his deal.

    2008-01-21 13:31:37
    77.   cargill06
    72 wow how did cleveland pull that one off with sizemore after the 06 season?
    2008-01-21 13:40:22
    78.   Disabled List
    Interesting. UCLA de-ankled Norm Chow.
    2008-01-21 13:42:14
    79.   Eric Stephen
    There's a very good chance that the Rockies will save money on the arbitration years of Tulo as well, especially with the inflation of MLB salaries. And by signing him now, obviously the team is absorbing a lot of risk, but Tulo's price would go up if he has another season similar to 2007.
    2008-01-21 13:53:09
    80.   Eric Stephen
    Also, look at Sizemore's contract, signed two years ago. His arbitration years are as follows:

    1st yr (2008) - $3m
    2nd yr (2009) - $4.6m
    3rd yr (2010) - $5.6m

    Through 2007, Sizemore has hit .283/.369/.488, 124 OPS+, as a CF

    Matt Holliday, through his 3rd season (2006), hit .310/.368/.533, 121 OPS+, as a RF.

    Holliday earned $4.4m in his first arb year (2007), and of course cashed in a monster 2007 with a 2/$23 contract to finish out his arb years.

    Being conservative, let's give Sizemore the following if he went through the arbitration process:

    2008 - $4.4m (same as Holliday)
    2009 - $6.4m ($3.1m less than Holliday)
    2010 - $8.4m ($3.1m less than Holliday)

    This new projection would cost the Indians $19.2m, a cool $6m more than they are paying Sizemore in total over the next 3 years.

    So, it's not just the FA years that the club can benefit from.

    2008-01-21 13:54:07
    81.   Eric Stephen
    2010 should say "$5.1m less than Holliday"
    2008-01-21 13:54:13
    82.   das411
    77 - Wasn't 06 the year the Indians finished in 4th place and the G-man had a relatively quiet great season?

    Man oh man, if only Minaya had never traded Brandon Phillips, Cliff Lee, and Sizemore for three months of Bartolo Colon...I guess though that would have prevented the hilarious insanity that will be the 2008 Nationals OF...

    2008-01-21 13:55:55
    83.   Eric Stephen
    Sizemore signed his contract after the 2005 season (his first full season), during which the Indians finished 2nd to the White Sox and narrowly missed the playoffs.
    2008-01-21 14:01:02
    84.   Ken Noe
    I just read Gurnick's mailbag, and I believe that at last he has accepted the reality that is LaRoche. Meanwhile, Robert from Whittier needs a link to this site.
    2008-01-21 14:13:18
    85.   Eric Enders
    Those Whittier folks sure stand up for their own.
    2008-01-21 14:14:37
    86.   D4P
    Meanwhile, (INSERT NAME OF DODGERS.COM MAILBAGGER) from (INSERT CITY NAME) needs a link to this site.
    2008-01-21 14:20:23
    87.   Ken Noe
    87 Well...yeah.
    2008-01-21 14:50:58
    88.   ToyCannon
    Did that seem to be one of Gurnick's best mailbags?
    2008-01-21 14:51:48
    89.   Dodgers49
    Oh my. Tomko is a new pitcher again and we just let him get away.

    Tomko eager to 'grind' for Royals

    The Dodgers had changed his delivery and his velocity dropped alarmingly.

    "We just stripped down my mechanics, went back to my first 10 years in the big leagues and just tried to throw what was natural for me. It was night-and-day," Tomko said.

    Meantime, the San Diego Padres called, seeking his help for their stretch run.

    "I came back to San Diego, my velocity was back up to the low- to mid-90s and when I got back to starting, it was like a whole new pitcher," he said.

    2008-01-21 14:52:02
    90.   Indiana Jon
    According to, Mike Piazza "is one of only three players to hit a home run completely out of Dodger Stadium, drilling a ball over the left-field pavilion during the 1997 season." I know Stargell is another one, doing it twice. Who is the third?
    2008-01-21 14:53:21
    91.   Eric Stephen
    I think it was Mark McGwire, but I'm not completely certain.
    2008-01-21 14:54:29
    92.   Bluebleeder87
    Scott Proctor is the kind of workhorse a manager can abuse and he'll keep asking for more.

    I just read Ken Gurnik's mailbag & that up top is so true but it's true of most all pitchers, it's like they go on tunnel vision of some kind...

    2008-01-21 14:55:41
    93.   regfairfield
    91 It was McGwire.
    2008-01-21 14:58:17
    94.   Eric Stephen
    It was McGwire. Go to and look at the timeline. The game was May 22, 1999.

    Here is the boxscore:

    Dreifort gave it up.

    2008-01-21 15:00:11
    95.   Ken Noe
    89 Tomko always was fine, he had fgured out what was wrong, and all he even needed was one more more more more....
    2008-01-21 15:01:26
    96.   cargill06
    89 let a kid dream
    2008-01-21 15:12:40
    97.   Jon Weisman
    March 7, 2007:

    "I trained hard over the winter and came in ready," he said. "They [management] know I want a starting spot and they're giving me every opportunity to get it. I'm not worried about it or thinking about it too much, but over the winter I really got after it and tried to put myself in a position to be a prepared as I could be and whatever happens, happens. It's not like this is my second or third camp. It's my 11th Spring Training. I kind of know the ropes and what it takes."

    "I'm not saying I have to prove myself, but I want to be consistent so people know I can do the job," he said. "When I'm on, I feel I'm as good as anybody. I just need to be more consistent."

    2008-01-21 15:36:30
    98.   CanuckDodger
    So, did anybody else watch the debut of Breaking Bad last night? I loved it. A really impressive acting performance by the lead, Bryan Cranston.
    2008-01-21 15:37:42
    99.   Marty
    I recorded it but haven't watched it yet.
    2008-01-21 15:38:15
    100.   Jason in Canada
    Yep, I was there and took a photo of the score board when they announced that he had done that.

    As you can imagine, he got all of that ball.

    Show/Hide Comments 101-150
    2008-01-21 15:38:42
    101.   D4P
    Shoot, meant to watch that. I liked Malcom's dad when he played Malcom's dad on Malcom.
    2008-01-21 15:39:30
    102.   Ken Noe
    "I had a rough trip to Chicago and New York and I think that stuck in a lot of minds. I volunteered to go into the bullpen at the time because that was best for the team. I did something selfless and had a rough week. That's how life is. It was a tough stretch for me."
    2008-01-21 15:52:18
    103.   Bob Timmermann
    I believe Jamie Arnold was the pitcher who gave up the shot to McGwire.

    Alan Foster and Andy Messersmith gave up the homers to Stargell. Frank Castillo gave up the home run to Piazza.

    2008-01-21 15:54:33
    104.   D4P
    I'd love to hear Charlie Steiner say "Messrs. Smith and Messersmith".
    2008-01-21 15:54:58
    105.   Jon Weisman
    98 - I watched it Friday and liked it all the way through. I'm told subsequent episodes aren't as good, but we'll see.
    2008-01-21 15:55:31
    106.   CanuckDodger
    101 -- AMC is replaying the episode at different times this week. Check your local listings, as they say.
    2008-01-21 16:05:35
    107.   bryanf
    I was at the scouting event and saw Ralph Avila and Al LaMacchia (among many others) receive their awards. It was quite an affair. I saw Frank and Ned their and Tommy as well. I ran into Bob Uecker, Dave Winfield, Tony Gwynn, and even the commissioner. Not to name drop, but I was drooling the whole time. I was lucky to have known someone who had a table there. It was pretty cool.

    Also, I didn't hear anything about Camille Johnston. What happened to her?

    2008-01-21 16:07:11
    108.   Jon Weisman
    107 - She quit a little while after Steinberg was hired above her.
    2008-01-21 16:09:36
    109.   CanuckDodger
    105 -- If someone said subsequent episodes were as good as the pilot, I wouldn't believe them. That pilot is a pretty tough act to follow.
    2008-01-21 16:24:55
    110.   StolenMonkey86
    65 - You think Saito will play until his mid 40s?
    2008-01-21 16:29:26
    111.   bryanf
    108 Wow, that must have happened pretty recently, and I totally missed it. Thanks for keeping me updated as usual. Busy offseason indeed.
    2008-01-21 16:57:30
    112.   Andrew Shimmin
    Just noticed that is gone; it redirects to MVN, now.
    2008-01-21 17:07:33
    113.   El Lay Dave
    Will Carroll guesting on LoHud Yankees Blog, via a Bronx Banter link, discussing the 30+ IP rule:

    "Looking at the list, I think the younger players - Kazmir, Hamels, Carmona, Davies, and Garza - are at the highest risk, making Chad Billingsley the top candidate for problems. I think we may have started to see this at the end of the season when his control began fading. That's often a precursor of elbow problems."

    Billingsley's MLB IP progression: 90, 147

    2008-01-21 17:15:38
    114.   regfairfield
    113 Do the innings not count if they're in the minors, because Bills pitched more in 2006 than in 2007.
    2008-01-21 17:21:01
    115.   Gen3Blue
    A bit more than some, I have sometimes suspected Will Carroll of throwing a bit to improve a story. I guess this could be a test.
    2008-01-21 17:40:03
    116.   El Lay Dave
    114 Will Carroll wrote, "The problem is that the Rule is based on Major League innings only, not a combination of Major and Minor League innings. I wish I could explain why this is so, but my best efforts to find a translation for minor league innings remains just a dream. Using the best translation in the business, the Davenport Translations, the ones that are at the heart of Baseball Prospectus' efforts over the last 13 years, doesn't work for translating workload. Adjustments to the translations haven't come up with consistent results either, leaving me with this corrolary (sic) to the Rule: Minor league innings are somehow not the same as major league innings."

    Common sense would indicate that one minor league innings can't be the equivalent of zero, but could be less than one, major league inning. My initial guess would be that a pitcher good enough to be a serious prospect and/or in the majors is good enough to put away a significant number of minor league hitters on less pitches and/or less strenuous pitches than when he is facing all major league hitters.

    2008-01-21 17:42:54
    117.   Eric Enders
    Will Carroll predicting injury for Billingsley for no good reason and with no real evidence. Hmm. Where have we heard that one before?
    2008-01-21 17:49:32
    118.   overkill94
    113 Sounds shaky at best. Sure his arm may have gotten a little tired at the end of the year, but his numbers didn't drop off significantly enough to make me think an injury was at play. Plus, his numbers were skewed by that disaster of a start on the second-to-last day of the season (1 1/3 IP, 6 H, 4 R, 3 BB, 1 K) that could be contributed to lack of concentration since it meant absolutely nothing.
    2008-01-21 17:50:04
    119.   popup
    103 Bob, Alan Foster gave up some impressive homeruns. Dick Allen hit one against him in Philadelphia that cleared the 447 fence in old Connie Mack Stadium and landed well up into the bleacher seats. RIP Johnny Podres gave up one to Allen in that ballpark that might still be going.

    Stan from Tacoma

    2008-01-21 18:15:31
    120.   ToyCannon
    I'm starting to think Will has a grind against our boy. Last year he was the one who said Chad was a problem pitcher with attitude and when I and others confronted him via email he admitted he was wrong and would admit it but he never did.
    2008-01-21 18:18:43
    121.   El Lay Dave
    118 I agree that the reasoning is shaky, since it is based on a premise regarding usage but can't account for non-MLB workload. End of season Billingsley is a slight, but perceptible downturn (significant? beats me, but it's 1.5 - 2 BB/start). The walks go up, as does the pitches/IP after start 16. (per B-R):

    Start IP BB Pitches
    12 5 1 84
    13 7 2 93
    14 7 1 99
    15 7 1 95
    16 6 0 94
    17 6 4 109
    18 5.3 3 102
    19 5.7 4 95
    20 1.3 3 54

    I do worry that if Billingsley is considered the #3 starter, that that comes with a 210+ IP workload; a 40%+ increase that might be significant to his development. I wouldn't be averse to a skipped start or 15-day DL at the slightest provocation, out of concern for the long term.

    2008-01-21 18:21:23
    122.   ToyCannon
    D4P-How is your water situation?
    2008-01-21 18:21:35
    123.   Eric Enders
    Billingsley's "fading control" late in the season is a complete figment of Will Carroll's imagination.

    Billingsley started 20 games in 2007.
    First 10 starts: 28 walks in 56.7 innings (4.45 BB/9)
    Last 10 starts: 23 walks in 55.3 innings (3.75 BB/9)

    And that last group is including the meaningless disaster that was his last game.

    2008-01-21 18:22:42
    124.   El Lay Dave
    120 Perhaps.

    As Canuck recently (and others) have pointed out, Billingsley's mechanics are good and he does use those strong legs of his well; hopefully that is keeping some strain off his arm.

    2008-01-21 18:26:59
    125.   D4P
    I'm not totally sure. The weather page that reports the number of days of water left recently changed its practices to include lower quality water. It was down to 30-something days of high quality water, but now it says 118 days left, which includes the lower quality stuff.

    It has rained multiple times over the past few weeks, including a couple inches of snow the other day. But I think we're still 7-9 inches below normal.

    2008-01-21 18:29:32
    126.   El Lay Dave
    123 Perhaps it was "fading" as opposed to "slicing". Really, it's that Chad had that nice dialed-in stretch in the middle and his ending was a bit of regression toward what he was like in some earlier starts. (If the Dodgers had followed the 30+ rule, he wouldn't have made starts 16 through 20.)

    However, 18 1/3 IP is not much from which to draw a trend of "fading control".

    2008-01-21 18:32:05
    127.   Disabled List
    The headline on, which loaded on my browser before the accompanying picture and article, reads "Sutton Not Don... Yet"

    For a half-second, I was thinking it was a piece about our old friend. Then I realized there's very little Don Sutton could do these days to merit a front-page article on

    2008-01-21 18:36:17
    128.   CanuckDodger
    Does anybody know what Billingsley's ERA was as a starter in 2007?
    2008-01-21 18:36:26
    129.   Bluebleeder87

    There is no way you can argue with that...

    2008-01-21 18:37:29
    130.   El Lay Dave
    128 3.38
    2008-01-21 18:42:43
    131.   El Lay Dave
    130 ... courtesy of B-R.
    2008-01-21 18:43:47
    132.   El Lay Dave
    131 has the wrong link - that is the game logs. This is the splits:
    2008-01-21 18:47:30
    133.   Andrew Shimmin
    Here's his home run log, just to complete the set.

    2008-01-21 18:48:20
    134.   Andrew Shimmin
    That top name makes me sad. Anybody know how Juan Encarnacion is doing? Or is it still too soon to tell?
    2008-01-21 18:49:58
    135.   paranoidandroid
    52 Jon, I think DePo signed Izturis to a three-year deal before he was a free agent.

    Also, doesn't Matt Holliday's shot from 2006 count as leaving Dodger Stadium? It was the longest homer I've ever witnessed in person. It hit a palm tree in the back of the Dodger bullpen, the only reason it didn't come close to my car.

    2008-01-21 18:53:20
    136.   Eric Stephen
    Not sure how he was doing, but I never liked his acquisition by the Dodgers. I don't know why I still harp on this, but it bugs me that the Dodger traded two warm bodies to get a guy (Encarnacion) they would sign for 2/$8m, when better free agents Jose Guillen and Reggie Sanders both signed for 2/$6 during the same offseason.
    2008-01-21 18:54:12
    137.   paranoidandroid
    134 He's out for the season, 2008. Might never play again.

    I wasn't a big fan of him or Ishii, but watching what happened to each of them humbled my fanaticism when railing on players that frustrate me.

    2008-01-21 18:55:54
    138.   paranoidandroid
    136 I remembered that Jay Payton signed for less and it frustrated me that we signed Juan instead.
    2008-01-21 18:56:59
    139.   paranoidandroid
    To be fair, that deal was made before DePo was hired. He would never have signed Juan E. He also immediately let Bubba Trammel go and traded for Jayson Werth.
    2008-01-21 18:57:23
    140.   Eric Enders
    134 Apparently his vision is still 20/400.
    2008-01-21 19:23:55
    141.   ToyCannon
    Andrew Shimmin has a heart?
    2008-01-21 19:30:33
    142.   Bob Timmermann
    I believe he just rents one out from time to time.
    2008-01-21 19:33:13
    143.   Brent Knapp
    As bad as Tomko was pitching, according to Jayson Stark's blog he was 0 for 32 batting this year.
    2008-01-21 19:51:09
    144.   Brian Y
    Im bored so I'm going to throw out a little trade proposition. Do you think the Mets (who need SP) would do a deal involving one of Stultz/Hull/Houlton along with Loaiza and possibly a low ceiling prospect for Aaron Heilman? I would even take Schoeneweis if I had to. Plus it upgrades their pitching depth. Then again, they want to contend and that's hard to do with Loaiza as a SP.
    2008-01-21 19:58:53
    145.   paranoidandroid
    143 He once led the league in hitting. 2007 showed the only consistent outs he could get for us were when he was holding a bat.

    I'm happy to pay him 1 mil to pitch for KC. Beats paying Fatdalis 8 mil to pitch for them.

    2008-01-21 20:05:34
    146.   CanuckDodger
    144 -- No, they wouldn't.
    2008-01-21 20:11:19
    147.   Brent Knapp
    144 Aren't we hoping to contend with Loaiza as a SP? I don't think there is any chance Schmidt will be ready opening day.
    2008-01-21 20:14:37
    148.   Sam DC
    So Lakers putting up 160 tonight?
    2008-01-21 20:16:00
    149.   El Lay Dave
    145 Which league, the Sunshine State Conference?
    2008-01-21 20:16:36
    150.   Jon Weisman
    147 - There's clearly a chance Schmidt will be ready for Opening Day if he's already throwing 100 times a day on flat ground and starting to throw off a mound in January. He might have setbacks - who knows what will happen - but he's had the surgery and his recovery is on track. To say there's no chance he'll be ready is basically as incorrect as to say he's a lock to be ready.
    Show/Hide Comments 151-200
    2008-01-21 20:19:53
    151.   Sam DC
    Um, wow, Kobe is channeling Magic tonight.
    2008-01-21 20:55:08
    152.   Brent Knapp
    150 Fair enough. I still doubt he will ready to throw on opening day, and even if he is healthy none of us are certain he will be any good. I read that he was throwing "without much velocity" last week. I'd love it as much as anyone if we ended up with 5 above average starters.
    2008-01-21 20:57:58
    153.   Eric Stephen
    Is this the first year the +/- stat is being used in mainstream NBA coverage? Yahoo has +/- as a column in their boxscores.

    Turiaf is +16 tonight in 12 minutes. Vujacic is +11 in 8 minutes.

    2008-01-21 21:06:23
    154.   Jon Weisman
    152 - I agree the Schmidt of old is probably gone. In any case, Loaiza will be on a short leash with Kuo, McDonald et al behind him. It's not as if Loaiza will get 10 bad starts.
    2008-01-21 21:14:13
    155.   Bob Timmermann
    My brother figures out +/- stats for Saint Louis U basketball games all the time. But he has to do all the math.

    He's done it off and on for college basketball games for close to 20 years.

    2008-01-21 21:40:49
    156.   LAT
    When I think of "ankles," I think of Kathy Bates, James Caan, a railroad tie and sledge hammer.
    2008-01-21 21:41:51
    157.   paranoidandroid
    I think low expectations of Schmidt, Nomar, and Loaiza will just have to play out. I am most hopeful of Schmidt coming back soundly. I don't think we'll rush him by any stretch. Therefore, I don't think he'll be a go for opening day, even if healthy. I think they'll take his along very, very cautiously. That will give him the best chance of giving us some of what we paid him for. Remember, he was signed as a front of the rotation starter. We don't want to rush him back and get a few Scott Erickson starts out of him. Let him heal. Entirely. If he does, he has a very good chance of truly helping us.
    2008-01-21 21:42:39
    158.   paranoidandroid
    156 A good cure for sore ankles: red rum.
    2008-01-21 21:45:46
    159.   paranoidandroid
    My optimism for Schmidt isn't entirely blind. I have memories of being very leary of Todd Worrell ever being healthy for any part of his contract. He ended up having a few very fine seasons, fulfilling his role with excellence despite his health issues from the early part of his contract.

    What reminded me of Worrell was the constant liner notes of "Worrell threw off the mound today and reported no stiffness" or "Worrell threw fifty times from flat ground at decreased velocity while working on building arm strength".

    2008-01-21 22:12:25
    160.   LAT
    46. AMEN!!! Bob I don't know if I have agreed more with anything you have ever written here.
    2008-01-21 22:51:32
    161.   LAT
    Bret Tomko is a career 93-92 for which he has made $17,730,000. His agent deserves 40%
    2008-01-21 22:57:30
    162.   68elcamino427
    Now batting for your Los Angeles Dodgers, number 27, Right Fielder, Matt Kemp!
    2008-01-21 23:09:27
    163.   Eric Stephen
    Thanks, Bob. Using your brother's standings +/- (+1 for a road win, -1 for a home loss, 0 for a road loss or home win), here are the adjusted Pac-10 standings:

    WSU +2 (4-1 actual record)
    UCLA +1 (4-1)
    ASU +1 (4-1)
    Oregon +1 (3-3)
    Stanford 0 (4-2)
    USC 0 (2-3)
    Arizona 0 (2-3)
    Wash. -1 (2-3)
    Cal -2 (2-4)
    OSU -2 (0-6)

    2008-01-21 23:54:54
    164.   Bob Timmermann
    I think Tim Floyd uses the same method for keeping track of conference standings.
    2008-01-22 06:58:43
    165.   Sam DC
    Mark Hendrickson -- it all comes clear now!
    2008-01-22 07:21:31
    166.   Gen3Blue
    If Hendrickson suddenly is great he will now be able to see me for a long distance as I come with my shotgun.

    But I doubt there is any danger of this.

    2008-01-22 07:29:00
    167.   Jon Weisman

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