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About Jon
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1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
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4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
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Revisiting The Dodger Thoughts Comprehensive, Non-Definitive 2005 Minor League Report
2008-03-10 08:36
by Jon Weisman

In September 2005, when life was somehow simpler, I took the time to snapshot every player in the Dodger minor leagues that I could find. It's pretty amusing to revisit some of those comments today.

(Note: The links with the players' names are no longer active, so don't bother clicking them.)

Dioner Navarro, Las Vegas/Los Angeles, 5-10, 190, 2/9/84: Honestly, it's hard to imagine his Dodger debut at age 21 going much better. At the absolute worst for 2006, he is a solid backup, and he's looking more and more like a solid starter each day. It's worth noting that Mike Rose out-offensed Navarro in Las Vegas - it's also worth noting that the Dodgers haven't had a catcher this capable at this age in forever.
Russell Martin, Jacksonville, 5-11, 200, 2/15/83: His .430 on-base percentage in a pitcher's league has people abuzz. He added 17 doubles and nine homers in 409 at-bats. He also ran a surprising amount, tallying 15 steals, though he was caught seven times. Given the pleasure the Dodgers have found using Navarro during this semblance of a pennant race, it's not hard to imagine Martin (51 weeks older) joining him in the majors in 2006 - and yes, even getting at least even playing time with him. Baseball America projects his upside as Cubs catcher Michael Barrett, which is sort of cool but not overwhelmingly so.

First base
James Loney, Jacksonville, 6-3, 200, 5/7/84: The sweet swinger is back as a prospect (if he ever left). Showed good power for the Suns with his 11 homers and 31 doubles, slugging .419 while on-basing .357. Still the age of a college senior, he'll start 2006 in Nevada and see his stats really inflate.

Second base
Delwyn Young, Jacksonville/Las Vegas, 5-10, 180, 6/30/82: Got the Vegas bounce in on-base percentage (.361) but not slugging percentage (.475) after his promotion from Jacksonville (.346/.499). His 16 homers with the Suns matched the more heralded Joel Guzman in 71 fewer at-bats. While the younger Guzman has greater long-term potential, Young is better positioned to help the Dodgers in April 2006, although currently 25-year-old Antonio Perez blocks his path. Young also has the plate discipline of Dodger minor leaguers of old - 35 walks against 531 at-bats over the two levels. He is hardly a basestealing threat.
Tony Abreu, Vero Beach/Jacksonville, 5-11, 160, 11/13/84: OPSed .808 in Vero Beach, then moved up to the Suns to replace Young and struggled to a .607 OPS. Was caught stealing 12 times in 26 attempts overall.

Chin-lung Hu, Vero Beach, 5-9, 152, 2/2/84: Working in my weight class, Hu was picked as early as 2003 as the Dodgers' best minor-league defensive infielder. Did fine in Florida this season, OPSing .777 and stealing 23 bases in 29 attempts. He even hit 29 doubles and eight home runs, but walked only 19 times against 470 at-bats.
Lucas May, Columbus, 6-0, 190, 10/24/84: .612 OPS. Eighth-round pick in 2003.
Joel Guzman, Jacksonville, 6-6, 225, 11/24/84: The scouts say he will grow to 7-1, 330 and move from shortstop to the low post. In all seriousness, perhaps the best sign for Guzman was that his walk rate improved despite having plenty of support in the lineup. Interestingly, though, he batted seventh for the Suns at times, perhaps indicative of the fact that his ceiling, however high, is still some time from being reached. Sixteen homers, 31 doubles and an .826 OPS are knockout numbers for a 20-year-old shortstop, but please, let's take it easy and not even think about this guy until 2007.

Third Base
Andy LaRoche, Vero Beach/Jacksonville, 6-1, 200, 9/13/83: Absolutely the talk of the minors with his 21 homers in 63 games (And 1.031 OPS) in Vero Beach through June 16, LaRoche settled in at Jacksonville and hit nine more with an .812 OPS. Move him on up with the crew to Vegas.

Matt Kemp, Vero Beach, 6-4, 210, 9/23/84: Boom chucka chucka chucka. Kemp slugged .569 with 27 homers and added 23 steals in 29 attempts at age 20. Teach this guy to take a walk (25 against 418 at-bats) and you've got something.
James McDonald, Ogden, 6/5, 195, 10/19/84: The Long Beach Poly Sports Factory product pitched in 2003, played outfield in 2004, and did both in 2005 (.601 OPS in 83 at-bats, 1.50 ERA with nine strikeouts in six innings). You tell me.

Right-Handed Starter
Chad Billingsley, Jacksonville, 6-2, 215, 7/29/84: Emerged as the Dodgers' 2004 Minor League Pitcher of the Year with a 3.52 ERA and 162 strikeouts in 146 innings. Combined for a no-hitter in the Southern League playoffs – then got KOed after two innings in his next start. He walks more than three batters a game, which perhaps translates to trouble in the big leagues if he is promoted too soon. But does anyone want to see this guy anywhere near Las Vegas?
Eric Hull, Jacksonville/Las Vegas, 5-11, 185, 12/3/79: Hull had a fine season: 3.38 ERA, a strikeout for every inning. Pitched seven shutout innings in Game 2 of the Southern League Championship Series.
Eric Stults, Jacksonville/Las Vegas, 6-3, 215, 12/9/79: 3.31 ERA in 68 Jacksonville innings preceded a 6.58 ERA in 78 Vegas innings.

Right-Handed Swingman
Jonathan Broxton, Jacksonville/Los Angeles, 6-4, 240, 6/16/84: A bonafide starter candidate who moved to the bullpen, perhaps out of need, perhaps out of destiny, Broxton is in great shape for a 21-year-old despite his oversized physique and 7.04 major league ERA. His 3.17 ERA and 107 strikeouts in Jacksonville surrounding his 21st birthday are certainly something to build upon.

Left-Handed Reliever
Hong-Chih Kuo, Vero Beach/Jacksonville/Los Angeles, 6-0, 200, 7/23/81: As good as the two Tommy John surgeries on his tender arm will let him be, Kuo has now thrown 96 2/3 innings in his minor league career and struck out 141 batters - 13.1 per nine innings, while walking 32. His 54 1/3 innings in 2005 exceeded his totals for all previous years combined. Hard for us to know how durable he can be, but the Dodgers will hope.

Comments (163)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-03-10 08:53:15
1.   LogikReader
Now, wait a minute... there's two posts at once? Which one do I comment in?


I was just LAT'd so I'll take a moment to respond to berkowit28's query on hockey coverage.

I tend to agree with the field. I've always been and always will be an LA Kings fan, although I never did see the Gretzky era. Interestingly enough, I just saw their last game against Montreal, who happens to be really good.

It's hard to get back into a sport, any sport, when you lose an entire season due to a work stoppage. Even baseball's '94 strike didn't wipe out the preseason and most of the regular season.

Finally, I have to admit, the game itself is still pretty good. I saw a game on NBC yesterday that had an exciting finish, and I enjoyed that way more than the college basketball game that was on CBS. So that's where I am with hockey.

2008-03-10 08:58:21
2.   CanuckDodger
Hey, guys, check out Inside The Dodgers. Rawitch has posted Colletti's responses to people's questions, questions like shouldn't Ethier be playing left-field.
2008-03-10 09:02:32
3.   underdog
"Baseball America projects his upside as Cubs catcher Michael Barrett, which is sort of cool but not overwhelmingly so."

As Nelson would say, HAH HAH. Fooey and shame on you, Baseball America. Hee.

I wonder if the Dodgers will ever give Eric Hull a chance.

2008-03-10 09:05:39
4.   LogikReader

I thought Colletti gave some decent responses given the circumstances.

I believe Ethier appeared in 153 games last year. However, Kemp is really lighting the fire, so he will not be denied. Not even a yellow caution sign can stop him.

2008-03-10 09:07:24
5.   Jon Weisman
4 - There's still a complete unwillingness to directly compare Ethier to Pierre. There's this constant independent evaluation of each, without ever acknowledging which one is better.
2008-03-10 09:08:49
6.   LogikReader
Besides the aforementioned Russell Martin projection, I think Jon was spot on about just about everybody. That's pretty impressive talent and/or statistical evaluation.
2008-03-10 09:08:52
7.   Disabled List
Given the attrition rate for prospects in the low minors, I'm amazed that almost everybody on this list is either already a major-leaguer, or still has viable prospects at being a decent major-leaguer.

The only exception is Guzman (although the book's not closed on him yet) and Lucas May, I guess. YMMV with Hull and Stults.

2008-03-10 09:09:03
8.   underdog
4 Yeah, I agree. His first answer on the Ethier/or question was pretty well thought-out. And even though I still disagree with him on the question of why they didn't use the young guys more earlier last season, I liked him saying that they could soon become one of the youngest teams in the league, too.
2008-03-10 09:10:54
9.   underdog
5 And that's true, too. (And I just re-read his second answer which is the same gobbledygook about why the signed Pierre in the first place.) Still, his first response seemed to leave things open enough to the idea that Ethier may not be the 4th outfielder for very long, though I could be reading into that.
2008-03-10 09:12:48
10.   underdog
For the ultra-patient, Chan-Ho Park vs. Steve Trachsel start today. I wish I could watch that one on fast-forward.
2008-03-10 09:20:45
11.   wronghanded
This response by Ned leaves me inclined to believe that Ethier and Kemp will be platooning this year:
"We still feel that if Furcal and Pierre are healthy all season and if the middle of the order - Jones, Kent, Martin, Garciaparra, Loney and Kemp or Ethier produce in the clutch that Juan's value to the club increases dramatically."

Not only does he fail to compare Ethier to Pierre directly, he also fails to mention that Kemp's ABs will be compromised because of JP.

2008-03-10 09:21:43
12.   CanuckDodger
Colletti sounds pretty bad trying to make Loney appear unready for the majors after 2006. He led all of baseball with a .380 Avg. in Triple A, and OPS'd .901 in the majors in 2006, for God's sake, and got three hits in Game 3 of the playoffs after Nomar stunk in the first two games of the series.
2008-03-10 09:29:30
13.   gpellamjr
12 He also implies that LA is a tougher town for a rookie to play in than Boston. I really just don't know what his problem is with playing talented young players.
2008-03-10 09:30:07
14.   Kevin Lewis
There is something inherently wrong with basing a players value on how the other players do in the "clutch". I think Ned's response is saturated with displeasure of the contract and wishing things could be different, but "Lee and Soriano didn't want to come out here", so I had to sign Pierre and not Lofton.
2008-03-10 09:33:30
15.   CanuckDodger
13 -- I think he MEANT it is tougher for a rookie to play in L.A. than Denver or Phoenix, but the way he worded it makes it sound like he was thinking of Boston too, which I'm sure he wasn't.
2008-03-10 09:37:07
16.   gpellamjr
15 That's the problem. The question explicitly asks about Pedroia and he ignores that part.
2008-03-10 09:37:57
17.   fanerman
That is a pretty cool feature, to just be able to ask questions to the GM and have him answer them on a regular basis.
2008-03-10 09:41:03
18.   gpellamjr
17 Yes, it's awesome. Now if only he would give us the answers we want...
2008-03-10 09:41:10
19.   CanuckDodger
16 -- Colletti was once in the PR game, you know. He knows how to ignore the part of a question he doesn't have a good answer for. Or ignore an entire question he doesn't have a good answer for while appearing to answer it. Politicians do that all the time.
2008-03-10 09:42:16
20.   Kevin Lewis
And this may be the fault of the phrasing of the question, but you can't talk about that contract without examining the length and cost. Yes, Ned, we agree we did not have "seasoned" outfielders in the organization, but were Pierre and Gonzo the best use of resources?
2008-03-10 09:43:00
21.   Bob Timmermann
The Soccer Hall of Fame failed to vote anyone in on its regular ballot (of which my brother is an elector), but the Veterans Committee chose Anson Dorrance and Hugo Perez.

Preki was 9 votes short and Joy Fawcett was 10 votes short.

2008-03-10 09:43:13
22.   Kevin Lewis
Now I am going to watch the Kershaw clip again to bring my stress level down
2008-03-10 09:44:25
23.   adamclyde
hard to believe kershaw wasn't even a glimmer in our eye three years ago.

I was at the game Friday and yesterday... a few observations on those names above...

Martin's pick off on Sunday was impressive. That Adroin was trying to do the same thing Friday but executed it not nearly so well (the play when LaRoche got hurt) underscores Martin's value to this team...

It was a bummer to see Billingsly and Broxton let a few long balls out of the park. But they looked good otherwise.

Delwyn Young's fielding looked great on Friday. I know lots of folks have said he's improved in the infield... I don't really remember what it was before. But he looked good Friday.

Kemp. Man, his bomb was huge. Even more impressive was that it was still so big and it was fighting the wind. For those who have been to holman field, it cleared the entire back grass area and went into the parking lot. Against wind. It looked pretty similar to Pujol's on Friday, except AP had some wind on his side.

then, again to Kershaw. Man, that was seriously impressive. None of the Sox fans around me (of which there were many) had heard of him. But all were impressed. And not just by his curve. His fastball must have some serious heat. He just made the batters look silly. It was the most exciting part of the game. I'd have loved to have seen him for another inning...

anyhow, 3 years on, it's good to see a lot of the prospects delivering according to or above what folks had anticipated. My only fear is that some (Hu, Young) just haven't had the opportunity to move a little more quickly. But I'll try and be patient.

2008-03-10 09:49:30
24.   JoeyP
There's still a complete unwillingness to directly compare Ethier to Pierre. There's this constant independent evaluation of each

What's even worse is that Colletti will NOT independentally evalute Juan Pierre alone. He spent most of his quote stating how bad the middle of the lineup was, as if they were the reason that Juan Pierre is not good at baseball.

The guy still doesnt "get it". And in a division that has AZ, SD, and Colorado (apparently getting it), its going to kill the Dodgers in the long run.

Player evaluation is a fundamental skill that Ned just doesnt have.

2008-03-10 09:50:42
25.   kinbote
I wonder what Greg Miller thinks when he sees Kershaw--other than "That used to be me."
2008-03-10 09:51:16
26.   LAT
In some cases, we would rather err on the side of the veteran. One of the reasons being, if the veteran can't cut it, there is still a young player available. If there is no veteran available and the young player isn't ready, the cost to acquire a veteran player from another club in season would be very prohibitive.

When I first read this I thought it made perfect sense. Upon further reflection not so much. Shouldn't you just play the better player. Plug Nomar and LaRoche or Pierre and Ethier into this statement. Its not like the less productive PVL disappears. They just go to the bench and will either earn a spot with fewer opportunities (like the younger player) or get back by virtue of injury to another player. How can you ever go wrong simply playing the better player.

2008-03-10 09:54:16
27.   Kevin Lewis

Amen to that. Now I am depressed.

2008-03-10 09:58:34
28.   ToyCannon
I'm amazed that James McDonald even made the list. Very impressive, we were quite giddy in those days after the Jacksonville 5 ran roughshod over the competition and were young for the league while doing so.
Throw in some Vero Beach Kemp and the pot is boiling.
2008-03-10 09:58:50
29.   kinbote
As depressing as the whole concept of Juan Pierre is, there is nothing that rankles me more than seeing Matt Kemp playing CF. We were told [the rally cry of all great uprisings] that BECAUSE Kemp couldn't handle CF, we needed to address that position long-term. And sadly, I actually believed it.
2008-03-10 10:02:35
30.   Jon Weisman
28 - Everyone made the list. I looked at every player.
2008-03-10 10:07:08
31.   LAT
Ned's discussion of JP's contract is disingenous. Even if you assume we needed some PVL in the outfield, its not like JP was the only one out there. Kenny Lofton was standing right in front of Ned and would have taken a 1 year deal. I'm sure some others would have taken one or two years as well.

Also this constant tag line about JP's work ethic is tiresome. Neither Ned nor Joe can mention JP without adding the slogan. Its like a marketing executive who is trying to brand an idea, e.g. Must See TV. 4 out of 5 Dentists Recommend. JP: A Shining Beacon of Work Ethic. As an attorney my income is driven by hours billed. I work my butt off. I have friends who work in the finacial sector who work a lot less and make a lot more. Who is the better earner? Who does a gold digging, B starlet want to be married to (and divorced from in 5 years). Does it matter who works harder?

2008-03-10 10:07:11
32.   ToyCannon
Joe Torre has done three things which I like.

1. he took Betemit when he was handed him last year and quickly played him at all 4 infield positions even though our management said Betemit could only play 3rd base.

2. he took Delywn Young and quickly moved him back into the infield after our previous management said he could only play the outfield.

3. He has moved Kemp into center field so he can see for himself if Kemp can play the position.

2008-03-10 10:09:55
33.   cargill06
i was in the thinking that pierre is starting hopefully he can have a big year and not make it as big a mistake as it could've been becuase he had such a big year. but ST is getting ridicolus, it was so obvious last year who our 3 best OF's are (if you include andruw), this spring is making it glare out even more. it would be absolutely awful if pierre takes AB's away from ethier and even worse Kemp, Kemp is hitting the snot out of the ball this spring, and ethier even though his avg isn't awesome (still better than JP) he is getting on-base and driving the ball out of the park and add a couple assists to boot. i'm seriously worried that this season may get messed up because of it.
2008-03-10 10:11:25
34.   Johnny Nucleo
Just got back from Dodgertown. Great trip, great game. Boston fans sitting behind me after seeing Kershaw pitch: "Holy (moly). Who's 96? This guy is sick."
Afterwards, wandering the grounds I got another Minotaur sighting. I would have mistaken him for a fan, except he was signing autographs for two or three kids - left-handed - and had a thick Texas drawl. Someone asked how he felt out there, he just said "I felt all right!" I didn't bug him.

It was great to have a long-held dream realized.

2008-03-10 10:12:21
35.   ToyCannon
I actually thought all of Ned's answers are exactly what you should expect from a GM.

Those of you who keep waiting for Ned to say he made a mistake are barking up the wrong tree. While a player is on the team, why should he beat him down just to appease those who want affirmation? Every quote from Ned will filter back to the players. They all have families and friends who read everything about them.

It is our job to talk about the negative, not the General Managers.

2008-03-10 10:16:24
36.   cargill06
35 where can i see this Q and A
2008-03-10 10:17:13
37.   underdog
I agree with you on 32 and 35 . I'm not sure what people expect. And it's more important to me how Torre handles things. So far he's doing the right things in my book, but obviously the season is the real test. If Colletti lets Torre keep doing what is best for the team, then I could care less what PR-speak comes out of Ned's mouth.

Btw, a nice little tidbit on Kershaw from the Boston perspective, though not really anything new:
"The Red Sox got their first look at left-handed Dodgers prospect Clayton Kershaw, who is projected as the team's ace of the future. Kershaw retired the side in order in the fourth inning, finishing his outing with a banana-bending curveball (complete with yellow warning signs) that nearly caused the left-handed-hitting Sean Casey to bend over backward.

"I wish he had a Red Sox [team stats] uniform on," Francona said when asked about Kershaw. "I can see why he's the buzz of spring training. He has phenomenal stuff."

Kershaw almost certainly will open the season in the minors, but that hasn't stopped some Dodgers veterans from lobbying for him to make the club. The 19-year-old has been so impressive that many Dodgers, including Derek Lowe, believe he is ready for the big leagues now..."

2008-03-10 10:17:49
38.   fanerman
35 I think most people are just trying to get a sniff at how much everybody will be playing. Whether Kemp and Ethier are the ones who are gonna split time. That sort of thing.

And if it's our job, where's my paycheck?!

2008-03-10 10:18:45
39.   LAT
35. You are, of course, correct but then Ned should not trot out his usual answer of "you have to look at where we were at the end of '06". He should just say he loves JP and leave it at that. He almost damns him with faint or qualified praise.
2008-03-10 10:19:04
40.   JoeyP
Ironic that Kershaw will probably be directly replacing Lowe in the rotation next year.
2008-03-10 10:22:22
41.   fanerman
40 Lowe is such a team player, he's lobbying that the Dodgers don't overpay for some PVL pitcher guy to replace him when he leaves for FA, and instead go with the in-house option.
2008-03-10 10:24:23
42.   ToyCannon
That has been Ned's story from day one. Why should he change it now? Even if he is right or wrong I like the fact he doesn't change his story to fit the breeze.
2008-03-10 10:25:33
43.   KG16
26 - the statement makes a great deal of sense in the general sense. But that doesn't mean the particular facts of a particular case won't be an outlier. It's a matter of taking a known over an unknown.

There are times when you have to dispatch the general rule - usually when the vet is nearing the end of his career (Nomar) or when the kid is head and shoulders better than the vet (Pierre). But as a starting off point, it's not too bad.

Also, I agree with those who say we shouldn't expect the answers we want to hear. If for no other reason, we don't want to depress the trade market for Pierre.

2008-03-10 10:26:03
44.   bhsportsguy
31 Ned wanted an outfielder who had a track record of playing everyday. Lofton could only be counted for 120 games and you would have to address the issue again in another year. He did not want to have to do this again. Now if he knew for sure the Dodgers would be able to sign Andruw Jones, then maybe you go with that option. He knew or had good reason to think that at some point, barring any other deals, Matt Kemp and Andre Ethier could very well both be starting for the Dodgers, that is why he did go short term with Gonzalez.
2008-03-10 10:28:29
45.   ToyCannon
Even if they were only spring training games, it is hard not to be exhilarated after two games with Vinny and the pounding and pitching that took place.

How about them Ray's? David Price's debut got everyone on the East Coast as excited as we were in LA with Clayton.

2008-03-10 10:29:25
46.   silverwidow
45 Price should be ours, too. Should've just paid the man.
2008-03-10 10:30:19
47.   Jon Weisman
40 - How is that ironic?
2008-03-10 10:31:39
48.   JoeyP
44--I wish Colletti would value talent/results ahead of durability.

Playing everday certainly has value.
Playing poorly everyday does not.

2008-03-10 10:33:35
49.   underdog
So the game isn't even on the radio today? I wonder if this is due to the apparently archaic nature of the Orioles' ballpark in Ft Lauderdale. (I just read Tony Jackson's amusing diatribe - yes Jackson kvetching, what a shock! - on that place.)

The Dodgers are already up 1-0 after Andruw drove in a run.

2008-03-10 10:34:37
50.   underdog
Sounds like Pierre reached on an error by the O's SS, an error no doubt caused by Pierre's speed.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-03-10 10:34:38
51.   JoeyP
47--Because while Lowe is saying it'd be great to have Kerhaw on the team now, that would be giving the Dodgers more of a reason to not re-sign Lowe next year with Kershaw ready.

Derek Lowe's job security with the Dodgers (for 2009) dwindles the faster/better Kershaw performs.

2008-03-10 10:35:48
52.   underdog
DeWitt starting, btw, and Lucas May catching. Hu's at second.
2008-03-10 10:36:17
53.   bhsportsguy
46 Price said he was going to college and that as he looks back, he was not ready to pitch professionally at 18.

I actually find some of this talk about just paying some of these guys monster bonuses somewhat tiresome because there are times when it just wouldn't have mattered.

2008-03-10 10:36:49
54.   underdog
51 I don't think Lowe expects to even come back anyway. Maybe I'm mistaken. I certainly don't expect him to be be re-signed. (But I get your point.)
2008-03-10 10:38:22
55.   madmac
28 yeah, but he made it as an OF
2008-03-10 10:38:46
56.   ToyCannon
But they weren't all here when we went over the list months and months ago. If you get tired of that then I think your stint as a Dodger Talk host would get stale very fast.
2008-03-10 10:39:29
57.   OhioBlues12
44 - In addition, there had been some question as to whether Lofton would even be willing to re-sign. He and Penny had a tenuous relationship at best according to some reports.
2008-03-10 10:45:11
58.   bhsportsguy
49 Dodgers do not broadcast a game until their first game in China at the end of the week. Only one opponent, the Astros, broadcast their contest against the Dodgers on Thursday (also on MLB TV), otherwise you'll have to look at boxscores.

The team that Tommy is managing will get its first radio broadcast next Sunday. After that, games are pretty much available on the net, except, and this ironic, the last game in Florida, which will be a week from tomorrrow.

2008-03-10 10:45:19
59.   cargill06
forget kershaw we have chan ho park.
2008-03-10 10:48:32
60.   kinbote
I had a dream last night in which I realized that Joe Torre feels exactly the way we do about the Pierre/Ethier situation, and that's he's only doing what he's doing to drive up Pierre's value for the inevitable trade. In the dream, Torre clearly knew that Ethier/Jones/Kemp was our ideal lineup; he also knew that Pierre on the bench was a mistake, owing largely to Pierre's desire to play every day. At the end, I understood that Pierre is not a part of this team's future, but we are trying to make it seems like he is so that we can move him to another team by the end of spring training. A great feeling of relief washed over me.

And then I woke up.

2008-03-10 10:49:14
61.   Eric Enders
Jon, the links work for me.
2008-03-10 10:51:52
62.   Jon Weisman
51 - That's not really irony unless Lowe really wants to come back here, and I think there's a lot of doubt about that.
2008-03-10 10:55:25
63.   kinbote
Checking the depth chart, Pierre would look sweet playing LF for the O's. Luke Scott is the favorite, but he's a little banged up right now. If Roberts is traded (as many expect), Pierre could slide right into the leadoff role and take Baltimore by storm.

Pierre + $18m to Baltimore for B prospect.

2008-03-10 10:57:13
64.   underdog
58 Thanks. Glad I got a fix of them last week, at least.
2008-03-10 10:58:25
65.   underdog
63 Works for me. Get Andy McPhail on the red phone, stat!
2008-03-10 10:58:38
66.   Sac Town Dodger Fan
21 - Perhaps Ned can make the Soccer Hall of Fame for his epic performance during Nomar's charity game?
2008-03-10 11:03:18
67.   underdog
4-zip Dodgers now. Triple by Furcal, double by Kemp. Hu has a single. The Orioles have zilch.
2008-03-10 11:04:11
68.   ToyCannon
Now I understand, I clicked on the 2nd link, not the 1st one. I will now start reading what you said about every player.
2008-03-10 11:06:39
69.   cargill06
i say it's about 40-60 park makes the team.
2008-03-10 11:09:43
70.   Bob Timmermann
Only the best can make it to Oneonta.
2008-03-10 11:11:04
71.   eekrock
21 - ah, Footie talk on DT. I shall not complain!

Did anyone go to that Nomar/Mia charity game?

2008-03-10 11:13:33
72.   Andrew Shimmin
"And so, my fellow Dodgers: ask not what Juan Pierre can do for you--ask what you can do for Juan Pierre."
2008-03-10 11:15:50
73.   ToyCannon
Chan Ho puts up 3 perfect innings.
2008-03-10 11:16:41
74.   Andrew Shimmin
"Let every National League team know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe, in order to assure the survival and the success of Juan Pierre's consecutive games streak."
2008-03-10 11:17:46
75.   Ken Noe
Question for Ned. If you had it to do over, would you sign Pierre?

Ned: Heck no! Look I was new, Drew left, I panicked, and there he was. I'd trade him in a heartbeat if I could, but it'll cost an arm and leg to trade him.

Kim: Uh, Ned, we'll never trade him if you talk that way.

Ned: Oh yeah. Hmmm. It's constructive to point out where the club was when we signed Juan....

2008-03-10 11:18:04
76.   fanerman
72 74 Obviously what you're saying is that we need to trade Juan Pierre to a team that will play him every day. The pursuit for 3000 must continue!
2008-03-10 11:22:59
77.   Andrew Shimmin
"To those peoples in the huts and villages across the globe struggling to break the bonds of mass misery, we pledge our best efforts to help Juan Pierre play every day."
2008-03-10 11:25:24
78.   Ken Noe
I've got a question for Ned. Don't you think that the team would be better with Either as the everyday left fielder?

Ned: Heck yeah! Look at his stats. But c'mon guys, I've got McCourt as a boss and now Torre breathing down my neck. Let him decide to bench all that money I spent...

Kim: Uh, Ned....

Ned: Yeah, you're right. Let' see. Andre is developing into a very good player. As Joe and the staff get more acquainted with Andre and others, I'm confident they'll find a way to get a solid amount of at-bats from all the outfielders....

2008-03-10 11:25:25
79.   underdog
Is today JFK's birthday or did someone just send Andrew his wikiquote page?

Ich bin ein berliner-armed centerfielder!

2008-03-10 11:26:32
80.   Kevin Lewis
Did anyone else notice the swings Andruw Jones was taking yesterday? It just looks like he cannot catch up to the fastball like he used to. There was one one right down the pipe, and after he fouled it off, Andruw was muttering to himself. I think 4 years ago he would have caught up to the pitch and taken it out of the park. It reminds me of Nomar all last year.
2008-03-10 11:31:15
81.   underdog
Looks like Stults had a rough inning. 2 runs at least, on 3 walks and 1 hit.
2008-03-10 11:35:56
82.   Andrew Shimmin
79- I'm trying to help. I'm sick to death of reading the same nonsense every single time. I think it's time they branched out on the nonsense. The sentiment in 72 is Colletti's (and, to his eternal shame, Tony Jackson's). But there's more to that speech, and it's time to appropriate the other parts.

"Now the trumpet summons us again—not as a call to bear arms, though arms we need; not as a call to battle, though embattled we are—but a call to bear the burden of a long twilight struggle, year in and year out, 'rejoicing in hope, patient in tribulation'—a struggle against the common enemies of man: benching Juan Pierre."

2008-03-10 11:41:22
83.   Ken Noe
"The dogmas of the quiet past, are inadequate to the stormy present. The occasion is piled high with difficulty, and we must rise -- with the occasion. As our case is new, so we must think anew, and act anew. We must disenthrall ourselves, and then we shall save our Dodgers.

Fellow-citizens, we cannot escape history. We Dodger fans will be remembered in spite of ourselves. No personal significance, or insignificance, can spare one or another of us. The fiery trial through which we pass, will light us down, in honor or dishonor, to the latest generation."

2008-03-10 11:44:45
84.   Daniel Zappala
All pretenders to the throne: My new high score on Spin City is 1,150,000. I could have gone higher and registered my score on the web site but I accidentally close the window while still playing (doh!). Have at it.
2008-03-10 11:44:59
85.   cargill06
80 didn't get a chance to see the game, but i am starting to get a little worried about druw.
2008-03-10 11:46:17
86.   ToyCannon
Tommy Lasorda is running out of patience. He knows he only has a few more years where he can bask in the limelight of a world series and he also knows that Juan Pierre stands in his way. Given how Tommy gets what he wants, and eats everything in sight, I would not be partaking in any pasta dishes if Pierre goes missing.
Pasta Pierre is where you'd expect his noodle arm to end up.
Pâté Pierre would be a dish that is expensive and does not live up to the billing.
2008-03-10 11:46:41
87.   Eric Stephen
I don't know if I like the abbreviation of Kershaw's first name to Clay. Buster Olney mentioned "Clay" in his blog today, and it kind of irked me. Save "Clay" for Clay Kirby.

Clayton Kershaw sounds poetic. And heroic.

2008-03-10 11:50:52
88.   Bob Timmermann
Did Clay Kirby take his first name to his grave?
2008-03-10 11:51:12
89.   bhsportsguy
Down to 2
Due to minor dings and ouchies, both Nomar and Mark Sweeney are not going to China according to Tony Jackson. Now only Andruw Jones and Matt Kemp will be heading off there.
2008-03-10 11:51:27
90.   Kevin Lewis

That is a lot of time in front of the computer

2008-03-10 11:51:58
91.   LogikReader

Wtg Daniel! Dang, it will take me three hours to eclipse that.

2008-03-10 11:52:16
92.   Jon Weisman
85 and other comments like it -

It's March 10.

2008-03-10 11:53:23
93.   bhsportsguy
First time I have seen the Family Leave Act cited in a sports story.

Bob, be forewarned, this link leads to a story about Mr. Lute.

2008-03-10 11:54:22
94.   bhsportsguy
84 I won't believe that until I see a picture of you and your 15 kids.
2008-03-10 11:54:23
95.   bhsportsguy
84 I won't believe that until I see a picture of you and your 15 kids.
2008-03-10 11:55:26
96.   ibleedbloo
86 First we had Fusilli Jerry.
Then came Macaroni Midler.
Now be on the look out for Penne Pierre.

'It was a million to one shot, doc, million to one.' " - Kramer, in "The Fusilli Jerry"

2008-03-10 11:57:49
97.   cargill06
92 ya, but if he was coming off a "normal" year i wouldn't be worried at all. i have heard a number of people saying his approach at the plate hasn't gotten better since last year. like i said i'm starting to get a little worried about druw, but he's been a sucsess most of his career so i'm not too concerned, yet.
2008-03-10 11:58:15
98.   LogikReader

I always thought Frank Costanza said that.


It is March 10th, but we're also pretty excited about Bison's great hitting in ST... and of course Kershaw's nasty curve.

2008-03-10 11:59:45
99.   cargill06
it was fusilli jerry because jerry is "Silly" it would be nice if it was penne pierre because of his low cost.
2008-03-10 12:00:42
100.   Daniel Zappala
90 It's not that bad if you break it up over multiple days.

91 Have at it. I likely won't play again, so you've got all the time in the world. Hint: never open a repair shop.

Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-03-10 12:02:36
101.   eekrock
84 - Is this turning into a "King of Kong" style obsession?

...and since I brought up the documentary genre, has anyone seen Darkon before? Just saw it this weekend. Wow, I might have enjoyed that as much as Kershaw's knee-buckler.

2008-03-10 12:02:49
102.   kinbote
96 I like Penne Pierre. There's also a "Blue's Clues" my son likes with a "Penguin Pierre" who wears roller skates. Needless to say, I enjoy it on a completely different level than he does.
2008-03-10 12:04:08
103.   Bob Timmermann
I wouldn't think a basketball coach would have a contract set up in such a way that he would be eligible for FMLA time. But an employee is an employee. No matter how much he gets paid.
2008-03-10 12:04:36
104.   Jon Weisman
98 - I'm excited about Kemp and Kershaw independent of Spring Training, though.

100 - I still don't get the anti-repair shop vibe. I've never had a problem with it.

2008-03-10 12:05:55
105.   cargill06
i forget who was making the point last thur or fri, but more proof that his theory about salary caps force the best players to play maybe right. shaun alexander of the seahawks, much like pierre makes a lot of money and is really really bad and his hurting the team is expected to be released by june 1st.
2008-03-10 12:09:39
106.   LogikReader

Jon, here's my reasoning for avoiding the Repair Shop:

The repair shop doesn't yield as high of a return as you'd like, considering that cars go into it verrrrrry slowly. If you notice, cars that need the repair shop travel slowly to it and that will bog down the rest of the traffic.

As in life, the Hot Wheels game employs the KISS strategy. Is "KISS" a rule 1 violation?

2008-03-10 12:10:03
107.   Bob Timmermann
My biggest problem with the game is accidentally closing the window or clicking on a link somewhere else in the frame.

Then Bob turns into Jon's son if he hasn't had a nap.

2008-03-10 12:10:07
108.   CajunDodger
I'm not sure that I would worry too much even if it was April 10. Even Shawn Green could catch up to BP fastballs after his shoulder surgery.

About the Pierre at-bat-burglary-in-progress, I feel a lot more comfortable with Torre making the calls and not Little. It seems as if Torre will put the guys out there who he feels are best rather than the ones who are paid the most. Even if it was a mistake, what other coach in the world would bat A-Rod eighth?

2008-03-10 12:11:48
109.   Eric Stephen
That has more to do with the lack of guaranteed contracts in the NFL. Football players are often cut before their contract runs out.

Most of the NFL free agency deals announced in the last week or so have all mentioned the total contract AND the guaranteed money, which is the more telling figure (i.e., "So and so signed a 7/$55m contract with $22m guaranteed").

2008-03-10 12:13:10
110.   Eric L
105 Non-guaranteed contracts in the NFL are more responsible for a guy like Alexander being released than the salary cap. Sure, they'll take a cap hit and it does play into decisions but it isn't why guys in the NFL are replaced so frequently.
2008-03-10 12:13:14
111.   Kevin Lewis

The problem I have had with the repair shop is the same as Logik's, the cars take too long to go around the track. So, if someone comes in needing a repair with four other services, I like to have them go to the repair shop right away, to speed up the rest of the process. But, it is never just one person who needs a repair, they all come at the same time!!!

2008-03-10 12:14:16
112.   ibleedbloo
98 I believe the both say it in the episode. When I googled, however, Kramer's quote came up first...good old cut and paste.
2008-03-10 12:15:10
113.   underdog
Pierre Penne pasta? Did some of you recently watch "Delicatessen" or something?
2008-03-10 12:16:05
114.   Kevin Lewis
"He forgot to give me my bread" "Just let it go"
2008-03-10 12:16:38
115.   underdog
I wouldn't worry so much about Andruw. As Jon said, it's only March 10. It takes most hitters some time to get the rust off in spring anyway, and he seems to be a bit of a slow starter. I also expect he'll strike out a few times during the course of the season. I'm not so worried about him now. If he's slow and overweight in June, that's a problem.
2008-03-10 12:17:44
116.   Kevin Lewis
The top score on the website is now 125 million.

There has to be a system, because I really hope no one has spend 24 hours in front of the computer.

2008-03-10 12:18:41
117.   Kevin Lewis
I repent. I will not bring up any more concerns about Andruw unless it is still going on in late June.
2008-03-10 12:19:12
118.   Jon Weisman
111 - I haven't taken the game past 500,000 yet, but it just hasn't been an issue for me yet. I did take the earlier suggestion to send cars to the repair shop sooner than later, though in general I try to move cars in a counter-clockwise rotation from the music store.
2008-03-10 12:19:13
119.   Marty
That was a fun walk down memory lane. Some guy named Molokai got raked over the coals for trying to trade the entire farm system for Tejada. What a maroon.
2008-03-10 12:23:53
120.   CajunDodger
The overweight thing is really overhyped. He reported about 10 pounds or so over. For a guy like that, he can lose 10 pounds in 10 days with the right routine and nutrition. Chipper Jones said once that he loses 20 pounds over the course of the season just by virtue of playing everyday.
2008-03-10 12:23:57
121.   Eric Stephen
I love how scouts from another team attending a game becomes a news story.

The Dodgers had two scouts at the Tigers' game Sunday, which of course fueled the Inge speculation. But, isn't it common to have scouts spread all over, especially during spring training?

Aren't there other teams' scouts that could have been at the game too?

2008-03-10 12:27:53
122.   cargill06
115 his ops of .857 in april is his 2nd highest month, behind may. so actually i'd believe he's more of a quick starter.
2008-03-10 12:28:51
123.   Penarol1916
112. But Kramer's use of the quote is to explain why proctologists are so much fun at parties, because all of their stories end up the same, with the patient saying "It was a million to one shot doc." While Frank Costanza is the one who actually had the issue with Fussilli Jerry.
2008-03-10 12:28:52
124.   Daniel Zappala
118 in general I try to move cars in a counter-clockwise rotation from the music store

Great strategy and one I use for most of the game. As the game goes on, it starts to break down, though. At higher levels, I try to keep a certain number of cars "in the system". If you add too many, they sit around waiting for a shop to become available. If you have too few, you get a lot of unsatisfied customer. They key is to click in a few additional customers at a time, hopefully over to the music shop first.

I think it is hilarious that we're talking strategy about a Hot Wheels game.

2008-03-10 12:29:25
125.   Daniel Zappala
Anyone else use to setup Hot Wheels tracks when they were a kid, going between the bed, the desk, and the floor?
2008-03-10 12:34:23
126.   Johnny Nucleo
[125) Yep.
84 As a university professor, how do you find time to do this? The professors I know are totally swamped. Granted, most of them are just starting. Does the time commitment ease off after the first few years, to the point where you can actually have a life?
2008-03-10 12:34:33
127.   Hythloday
125 And how. Way better than the electric race sets. My favorite Hot Wheel was my silver Aston Martin with the doors that flipped up.
2008-03-10 12:35:15
128.   Sushirabbit
Some, uh, ironic news about the NY governor.

Genius on the don't get a repair shop. It is funny that DT is strategizing about it.

I'm with ToyCannon on the Ned must respond "with sensitivity" re: Pierre. I think it was a mistake and one he can't really own up to for various reasons. I don't really have a problem with it, now I will still be aggrivated if he plays but it looks to me that Pierre may be one of the unpredictable events of the season. I hope so.

RE: Andruw; I think that's just timing. My kid is rusty for awhile. And then I need a protective cup.

2008-03-10 12:36:13
129.   Marty
I didn't do Hot Wheels, but I went through a big slot car phase when I was 10 or so.
2008-03-10 12:36:22
130.   Jon Weisman
124 - Yeah, I'm with you. I really wish I hadn't hit the wrong button on my last game. I don't know if I can start another long-term game for a while.
2008-03-10 12:37:00
131.   screwballin
Quote from Ned: "The competition for playing time in the outfield will hopefully increase the focus and productivity of the entire group."

My question to Colletti would be: Do you think Pierre's lack of productivity stems from his not having had to compete for his playing time?

2008-03-10 12:38:36
132.   Sushirabbit
125 Oh yeah. It was especially fun to do that and use one of those banked turns from the rubber-carwash-like-power thingy. My son now has lego cars that break up; what fun it is to send those things rocketing off the top steps. (We use the a window-blind box as a ramp).
2008-03-10 12:38:38
133.   Bob Timmermann
$5500 an hour for the top ranked... people.

(In reference to Elliot Spitzer scandal)


2008-03-10 12:40:39
134.   Bob Timmermann
We had both the gravity-powered Hot Wheels that had a loop in the track and also an electric version.

But the latter required batteries and the former required us only to find cheap sources of potential energy. The top of our tables in our rec room sufficed.

2008-03-10 12:41:03
135.   Marty
To turn an old joke around, for $5500 dollars you should get dinner out of it.
2008-03-10 12:42:14
136.   Hythloday
133 It makes me happy I spent so much time getting a degree.
2008-03-10 12:43:11
137.   Eric Stephen
Also from "molokai" in the 2005 thread, this astute premonition:

"The fall will be hard and I don't expect many teams to emulate how he ran the Giants into last place over the next decade."

2008-03-10 12:45:18
138.   Eric Stephen
Didn't Drysdale say that to an ump checking his hair for a foreign substance while on the mound?
2008-03-10 12:46:40
139.   Andrew Shimmin
the top ranked... people.

I wonder who I'd have to bribe and suck up to to get on that selections committee.

2008-03-10 12:49:39
140.   cargill06
ok i'm not worried anymore.
2008-03-10 12:50:43
141.   Johnny Nucleo
133 What they're really charging for is discretion.
2008-03-10 12:50:44
142.   cargill06
2-run hr for druw.
2008-03-10 12:52:40
143.   Hythloday
sure she weighs 500 pounds and has gills and webbed feet fella, but she is as discreet as they come.
2008-03-10 12:55:46
144.   Daniel Zappala
126 You do it late at night when you can't sleep.
2008-03-10 12:58:43
145.   Terry A
144 - Which currently running topic of conversation does that quote belong to?
2008-03-10 13:00:57
146.   Daniel Zappala
The NY Governor? I'm surprised there isn't more discussion on the "new sins" the Vatican has listed. Bob, you're OK, because although pollution is now a sin, you're doing the best you can with your Prius.
2008-03-10 13:02:17
147.   Bob Timmermann
I don't pollute and I no longer do any genetic manipulation in my spare time!
2008-03-10 13:02:59
148.   Andrew Shimmin
I work all day, and get half-drunk at night.
Waking at four to soundless dark, I stare.
In time the curtain-edges will grow light.
Till then I see what's always really there:
2008-03-10 13:05:26
149.   cargill06
good day for pierre, his ST ops .461
2008-03-10 13:09:41
150.   Bob Timmermann
Old friend Chad Moeller has signed with the Yankees!
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-03-10 13:14:57
151.   Jon Weisman
150 - Isn't he coaching USC? Or have I lost my mind?
2008-03-10 13:17:59
152.   underdog
151 I believe you're thinking of old friend Chad Kreuter, no?
2008-03-10 13:18:09
153.   Samuel

That would be old friend Chad Kreuter.

2008-03-10 13:19:58
154.   Jon Weisman
Ah, thanks.
2008-03-10 13:22:42
155.   MollyKnight
It is truly a proud day for New York Democrats everywhere.
2008-03-10 13:28:51
156.   LogikReader
With the hockey talk from the last thread, I should note that I am once again starting to follow the L.A. Hockey Kings.

For you hockey fans out there, is there a resource as good as Dodger Thoughts, but for Kings hockey?

2008-03-10 13:31:38
157.   cargill06
bedard's pitched 1 inning today and gave up 4 runs, pushing his spring era to 12.00
2008-03-10 13:39:41
158.   Samuel

The blog is actually pretty good. There's also, but that is a message board for Kings fan discussions rather than a blog like DT.

2008-03-10 13:42:40
159.   cargill06
let's rewind to november 2006, knowing what you know today, you have to take one guy (with his contract) do you take barry zito or jason schmidt?

zito has given up 10 ER in 5 IP this spring.

2008-03-10 13:44:47
160.   LogikReader

Thanks, Samuel. It's rare to have that great combination of information resource and fan discussion. Another reason to be thankful for Dodger Thoughts.

2008-03-10 13:46:08
161.   DXMachina
141 Apparently they didn't charge enough.
2008-03-10 13:48:37
162.   Marty
Spitzer is identified as "Client 9". That's a great handle.
2008-03-10 13:48:56
163.   Jon Weisman
New post up top.

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