Pierre in front of Ethier? No way, Ethier's been our best offensive outfielder so far.

LAT'd comment:

Baseball America's list of executives (which isn't perfect) lists 10 GMs for the Dodgers.

I think the Dodgers were going by the list that Baseball America uses:

http://www.baseballamerica.com/execdb/?show=franchise&fid=lad#gm

1 Ethier was given the night off to rest (he's played in every game thus far).

Ethier hasn't had a game off since the season started. Torre said he'd be off tonight, so the move isn't much of a shock. Hopefully Jones can continue to look better at the plate...

For Nate from the previous thread regarding DeJesus.
12
Ask these guys
http://www.bb-ref.com/pi/shareit/5X6r

I hope this lineup makes me eat crow.

Mmm, tasty, delicious crow!

6
If you cook up crow right, it tastes just like raven.

2 The Coca Cola Quiz last night featured the question which university did Jackie Robinson attend?

A. USC
B. UCLA
C. UCSB

My comment to Marty was something like I guess the Dodgers don't recognize the New York Times style guide.

I think they list UCSB for Trainwreck.

With a fleece blanket crowd and Nomar's 1st game back I expect he will get a rousing ovation the 1st time he's introduced. I hope he earns the 2nd ovation.

1 We should not get upset every time someone gets a day off just because Pierre is starting.

Nice to finally see Nomar back in the lineup. I hope everyone gives him a chance to contribute instead of looking for every little flaw in his game like they do with Pierre.

10 Well, let's be honest: You don't have to look very hard these days.

5 PVLs > 3 kids.

Holy crap I didnt realize we have a stretch of 10 games in a row starting on Friday. That might have something to do with Ethier getting a break today.

8
UCSB is quite random.

I'm getting this tingly feeling in my tummy that Nomar will swing at the first pitch he sees this year.

To me, fleece blanket night and Nomar just go together.

It really seems like Penny should be batting 7th

12 That's still a lower PVL ratio than last year. We no longer have Gonzo in there!

Expecting to be proven wrong momentarily, I still think Troncoso goes down.

The Baseball America list of executives list starts at 1950. The Giants have had seven GMs in the same period as the Dodgers 10:
Chub Feeney
Horace Stoneham
Spec Richardson
Tom Haller
Al Rosen
Bob Quinn
Brian Sabean

Sometimes these guys left and came back so there are numerous Grover Cleveland type situations.

14
I wouldn't be surprised if the person who wrote the question went to UCSB.

When do they have to announce who's roster spot Nomar is taking? vr, Xei

In my humble opinion I really think Sabean is by FAR the worst GM in major league baseball.

22
Anytime before the game starts.

I think either DeWitt goes down or Delwyn gets the ax tonight. I'm leaning toward DeWitt.

I don't think it will be Troncoso, because of the aforementioned streak of 10 games in 10 days. The Dodgers probably feel they need twelve pitchers for that stretch, and if they send Troncoso down tonight they can't recall him until April 26.

23 And think, we hired his padawan.

Anyone think it could be Hu?

25. I tend to agree. Cutting Sweeney would be my "dark horse". If you send DeWitt down is Hu the only reserve who could then play SS/3B? vr, Xei

27 No team's going to go without a utility infielder.

Can anyone here explain this statement:

Garciaparra close to returning to the team

>> but because Las Vegas has an early start (11a.m.) at San Bernardino with the Inland Empire 66ers and frigid temperatures were expected, that assignment was nixed. <<

Las Vegas is actually playing a night game in Salt Lake City. But why would Doug Padilla think that Las Vegas would be playing Inland Empire? Or am I missing something.

http://www.presstelegram.com/moresports/ci_8939876

27. Then whom would be our backup SS? Nomar is not allowed as an answer.
vr, Xei

I'd prefer to send DeWitt down. If they keep him up, he's not gonna play all that much, and they'll just send him down anyways when LaRoche is back. Might as well send him down and have him play every day.

30 I would guess this sentence is missing the word "and" from between "Bernadino" and "with". I guess it would need a couple of other small alterations but I'm guessing that's what he meant to say.

30 It is not uncommon for Dodgers to rehab in San Bernadino due to its proximity to Los Angeles. The downside being that they play A-ball competition instead of AAA. However, I do not see how that applies to your quoted passage.

32. Where do you send DeWitt to? Las Vegas or Jacksonville? And if you send him to Vegas, then where do you send LaRoche to on his rehab assignment? Not arguing, just wondering. vr, Xei

I just don't see DeWitt going down until Torre sees what he has in Nomar, who is still complaining of pain, after all.

30
Doug Padilla's column was also in the sister paper LA Daily News. That passage was cleaned up to the following:

"The original plan was to have Garciaparra play one more rehab game today in San Bernardino with the Inland Empire 66ers, but that assignment was scratched"

I thought it was reported yesterday that because Vegas had a night game tonight, Nomar wouldn't be with them because of the late travel. I'm guessing the San Bernardino game was nixed due to the frigid temperatures? Maybe a sentence or two got accidentally cut out of Padilla's Press Telegram column.

35 Reportedly, LaRoche is going to be dropped off in Florida when the Dodgers head east, for extended spring training.

According to the Weather Channel's info, the temps in San Bernardino tonight are not going to be frigid by anyone's definition. It should be 66 degrees there at 7 pm.

38
That makes it sound like LaRoche is just asking "Hey guys, how far you going? I'm going to Florida. What? You're going to Atlanta. That's cool. Can I get a ride to there?"

40 As long as no parachutes are involved, I think it'll be okay. ;)

37 That makes sense. Thanks.

31 Furcal doesn't ever really sit, and I imagine that they want Hu to play every day. Young would play 2nd when Ol' Blood an' Guts needs a rest, and in an emergency, NOMAR could step in at short. When LaRoche comes back DeWitt goes down, and either Abreu (If healthy) or Lucille/Chavez comes up. I like having Hu up, but if he's the future I'd bet they're more inclined to have him be an every day player.

Looks like Lucille II is on the 7-day DL.

http://tinyurl.com/4x97mm

43 If that were really the plan, though, I would have expected them to try Young at 2B during one or both of the blowouts the last three days. That they didn't do that indicates to me that they have no plans to have him serve as the team's sole backup second baseman.

I wonder why the Dodgers felt the need to wait until after batting practice -- i.e. right before the game starts -- to announce the move. I hope it's not because Torre is preparing himself for one of those "Son, this is the most difficult part of a manager's job..." conversations.

Perhaps they could just put Young on the DL and say he's still suffering the effects of being conked in the head with the ball. They've made up similarly bogus injuries before, in situations where they were in danger of losing the player.

If Ethier is traded, then a spot frees up. Saito could be going to the DL. Whatever happens I bet DeWitt stays. If he went down, how long before we could recall him? 9 days?

Kid on phone: "How do you get to the library?"
Me: "Where are you coming from?"
Kid: "Home."
Me: "Where is your home?"
Kid: "California."
Me: "No, I need to know the street and if you're coming by car or by bus?"
Kid: "We're walking."
Me: "Are you in Los Angeles?"
Kid: "I think so, let me ask my mom."

47 I have to say, those are two options I hadn't considered.

47 Ten days, unless another player goes on the DL, in which case the waiting period is waived.

47 - "If Ethier is traded, then a spot frees up. Saito could be going to the DL."

Huh? What?

46 Perhaps Torre wants to see for himself if Nomar really looks ready. Nomar, after all, says he still has pain.

48 It should have gone like this:

Kid on phone: "How do you get to the library?"
Me: Hard Work.

I think they wait until close to gametime to make the decision because, I say half-seriously, you never know when someone's gonna get hit by a batting practice line drive.

Saito's still throwing as hard as ever. Losing the bite on your slider isn't really an injury.

I think 47 and 48 make a logical progression.

So somebody is out there practicing right now who won't be on the team in an hour. I'm picturing a Far Side-style cartoon here with the caption, "Delwyn knew the end was near when he was moved into the same batting practice group as the batboys."

48 My favorite customer service call was when I worked for the rent board, and the caller was being evicted from his mobile home pad because he was a cross dresser. Though perhaps not to the untrained eye, this presents one of the most complex possible issues in housing law. His biggest complaint was that his adversaries apparently did not appreciate the work of Milton Berle.

This line-up is not quite right, but I do like the first two thirds of it. Ethier should not be the one to rest, although with Jones beginning to show life it is probably not the time to rest him. If Pierre should play, which is conceivable, he should bat after Penny, who could be a formidable RBI guy. Then JP could get a chance as a lead-off guy in some circumstances. Oh well.

Nomar is back!

Wooooooo!

We all knew it was coming...and look, DeWitt far exceeded all expectations, but there is a fine rationale for starting Nomar over him. At least Torre's not batting Nomar 3rd, as Little did last season.

And of course I don't like Pierre playing over Ethier, but Ethier has played 14 days in a row, so I wouldn't exactly call this a platoon. Let's just assume the top of the lineup carries us like last night until proven otherwise.

Man, C.C Sabathia got lit up again. 9 runs in 4 plus innings. His ERA before today was over 10 with a WHIP of almost 2.5. He might be costing himself an absolute ton of money.

He might be costing himself an absolute ton of money

Meh. Andruw got a raise after his worst year in the bigs.

63 Yes, but that doesn't contradict the statement that he's costing himself a ton of money. A free agent is going to get a hell of a big raise no matter what. If he's actually good, he'll get an even bigger one.

I'm in loge 145 row t if anyone wants to say hi. Go blue, go nomar

63

Before the year, there were some huge numbers thrown around concerning his new deal. Obviously hes not going to be this bad for much longer (one would hope), but this start raises a bunch of questions that need to be answered. But if he has the equivalent of the 2007 Jones, he's going to lose at least $30 million.

CC threw alot of innings last year.

OK, ok.....how bout this...may, MAYBE Ned is trying to work out a trade, which is why they are waiting until the last minute to make an announcement...I'm thinking Young or Pierre....

Sabathia seems determined to single-handledly ruin my fantasy season.

"There's few things in life more boring than hearing someone talk about their fantasy team"

- Will Carroll

It's Troncoso, according to Diamond.

70 When I talk about my Fantasy Football team,grown men tear up and throw roses.

63 Jones got 2 yrs / $36M. If he had had a good year in '07 he likely would have rec'd Torii Hunter money, 5 yrs / $90M. That's $54M of "bird in the hand" money he cost himself. It remains to be seen if he can get 3 yrs / $54M or better for 2010 and beyond.

71 Pay up!

Oh, wait, no one bet me. Darn it.

{Shuffles feet, looks glumly down at ground}

I'm gonna take myself for a walk.

Turns out the Pat Jordan story on Joe Posnanski's blog to which Marty provided a link earlier today also appeared on the Toaster a few months ago.
https://bronxbanter.baseballtoaster.com/archives/891907.html

72 Funny, when I talked about my Fantasy Football, people would throw up and tear roses. Or at least my g/f would.

I'm gonna take myself for a walk

Be sure to bring a bag...

I like the idea of resting Ethier and starting Pierre tonight. After all, it is the Pirates. I would rather see Ethier rested and playing well against the Braves, Reds and D'Backs then playing tonight. This is what a fourth outfielder is supposed to be for.

Its also the perfect night to start Nomar. After all he'll be facing Paul Maholm of the lifetime ERA 4.60 Maholms. Its a nice soft spot for him.

77 Got that, the leash, and a ball... Ah, forget it, this is gettin' weird.

But after a 60 minute work conference call, I definitely need a break so I can return afresh for Nomar's 4, one-pitch at bats tonight.

I think Ken Arneson should do a follow-up post explaining the hows and whys behind the pronunciation of Paul Maholm's last name.

Like this move for a number of reasons. Dodgers find out or start to find out where Nomar is at, if Torre only wants to play him five innings and see if there is swelling or problems tomorrow he still has the solution as a solid back-up. Troncosso is valuable and while most on this site would have loved to have seen a JP trade for some great power hitting prospect two years away, I don't think that is even remotely on the Dodgers radar-this also would be my solution but I am not the GM.
One other good thing about Nomar starting now he should get a number of days playing at big league at bats to really get a better picture of where he is at now and probably for the rest of the season. If he does nothing now than it will make it far easier to play La Roche without getting into an immediate platoon, giving La Roche the constant big league at bats he needs...Can't wait for the game

Garciaparra returns....Let the Plate Dancing begin!

Speaking of our old friend Luis Gonzalez, well, guess who just hit a pinch-hit HR?

Harking back to last night's discussion of lonnnnng relief, the AL record for longest relief stint is 17 innings by Ed Rommel of the Philadelphia A's on 7/10/1932.

The A's beat the Indians that day in 18 innings, by a score of 18-17.

PHI 201 201 702 000 000 201 - 18
CLE 203 011 601 000 000 200 - 17

Rommel gave up 29 hits in 17 innings. And got the win!

The NL record is even longer (according to SABR records lord and master Lyle Spatz) at 18 1/3 innings by Zip Zabel of the Cubs on 6/17/1915 against Brooklyn. The Cubs won 4-3 and Zabel gave up just 2 runs in his 18 1/3 innings.

Not to nitpick or anything, but does Ethier really need an extra day of rest before a travel day? I'm not upset about him not starting, but the "rest" argument always seemed strange to me when the next day is an off day/travel day.

84 - I'm a sick, sick man, I think I would have appreciated the second half of that game more than the first.

The LaRoche brothers are discussing the spelling of their last name on the pre game show. They are spelled differently on their jerseys (ANDY LAROCHE/ ADAM LaROCHE). Both said they didn't know the proper way to write it, and didn't care, so long as it was on a major league jersey.

45 Young did play the last two innings of the blowout of the Padres at 2B paired with Hu at SS.

85

I think it's more of a situation were they wanna GIVE Pierre a game he'd sat for 2 games straight, I think it's more that than anything.

86 IIRC, for a couple of days last year Andy decided it should be spelled "Garcia."

85
I think the rationale behind the rest before an off day is to maximize the off day, so he gets 2 full days (even though he might pinch hit tonight) while only missing one game.

Also in the 1932 Philadelphia-Cleveland marathon.
It took just 4:05 to play.
I counted 89 total baserunners in the game.
Cleveland shortstop Johnny Burnett was 9 for 11 in the game.
Cleveland led 14-13 with two outs in the 9th when Jimmy Dykes reached on an error by Cleveland first baseman Ed Morgan. Al Simmons walked and Jimmie Foxx singled in two runs.
Foxx hit three home runs and drove in eight.
Cleveland used three pitchers and Philadelphia used just two.

By contrast, during Sunday's 1-0 game between the Dodgers and Padres there were nine pitchers in the game.

Contact rate can be more revealing than batting average

>> So, when it comes to batting average, perhaps the skill that we should be tracking is the rate at which a batter makes contact.

Contact rate (at-bats minus strikeouts, divided by at-bats) is a statistic that is far more stable and projectable. League level rates run about 80%. Our .300 hitters often come from those with contact rates greater than 90%. Batters with rates less than 70% typically have trouble keeping their batting average above .250. <<

http://tinyurl.com/54mplj

Ethier obviously isn't tired. I just think this is Torre's way to get Pierre a game in. Kemp is too hot to take out. If this is how Torre utilizes Pierre, spelling one or the other very occasionally, I'll be a lot less worried.

89 yeah, they mentioned that. It was his dad's last name.

Nice segment with Ethier & Pycho Steven Lyons talking about hitting (apposite field)

90

That should be the rationale with Russell Martin one would think, he's getting hot though.

Dallas's win over New Orleans means the Lakers play Denver in the 1st round.

I think the ghost of Ed Rommel is pitching for both the Yankees and Red Sox tonight.

Dodgers activate Nomar Garciaparra, send Troncoso to minors

>> "The best thing that's come out of the whole bad luck part of (the rash of injuries to the third base position) was Blake DeWitt," Torre said. "We certainly got a peek at a guy who didn't come to spring training with it, and found himself playing on opening day. So whatever happens for him from here on out has certainly been a positive for him and us both—to watch the way he's handled this stuff and to know that he's there in the event that we need some help." <<

http://tinyurl.com/44xoxx

97 Which sent me immediately scrambling for playoff tickets. Of course, I will be rooting for the opposite of the majority of the posters here.

97
And if Houston and San Antonio hold their current leads, Suns & Spurs will meet in the first round.

South Park time. I'll talk to you shortly, folks.

This is the bracket I wanted - Denver, Utah, and Houston. Let those other 4 teams beat on each other. Utah is really good, but I like how we match up with them.

Utah is really good

...at home. They're currently 17-23 on the road.

103
Utah/Houston are slated to play as 4/5 seeds in round 1 (assuming the Spurs and Rockets win tonight). Presumably, the Lakers will play the Hornets, Mavs, Suns, or Spurs in the conference finals.

Jon Meloan is having a terrific start again (5 IP, 1 hit).

This guy deserves a shot at the #5 spot soon.

105 - Houston would have home court over Utah though.

At least Nomar/Pierre are at the bottom of the lineup.

Sending Troncoso down was also a good move. Nomar cant play everyday at 3b.

Just heard Rick and Charlie on the pre-game show talking about Nomar. Rick asked Nomar if he is "pain free." And Nomar indicated "no" but "at least he knows what he's dealing with." Apparently, Nomar's index fingure is causing him pain up through his wrist. As such, they expect Maholm will pitch Nomar inside. So I ask, why is Nomar coming back if he is still in pain? Jon, loves it when this happens.

107
I thought you were naming the Lakers' potential playoff opponents, but I see you were just grouping the 1-8-4-5 seeds together, the Lakers half of the bracket if you will. My bad.

106 I should mention that Meloan has walked four. So the control needs some ironing out still.

BHSportsguy and I were discussing McClouth last night and were wondering if he is the guy who refused to go down to the minors last year or the year before?

Random Ex-Dodgers around the league

Edwin Jackson
W2 - 1L
ERA 2.84
19 IP
14 K's
10 BB's

Eric Gagne
1W - 0L
ERA 7.20
5 IP
6 K's
1 BB
3 Saves

Guillermo Mota
W0 - 0L
ERA 2.45
3.2 IP
4 K's
4 BB's

Joel Hanrahan
W0 - 0L
ERA 9.00
7.0 IP
9 K's
6 BB's

Odalis Perez
0W - 3L
ERA 4.35
20.2 IP
13 K's
9 BB's

Cody Ross
24 AB
0 Dingers
0 RBI
1 BB
1 K

Bret Tomko
1W - 1L
ERA 2.08
13.0 IP
6 K's
3 BB's

109 I wondered that as well. DeWitt is certainly holding his own.

So Tron was sent down?...Is it official?...I just got back home...

112
That was Chris Duffy.

106

Nice, I won't even ask what his MPH readings are, bottom line (small sample, blah blah) is he is getting the job done.

I desperately want "apposite field" to mean something.

A 12-pitch 1st is a nice start for Penny.

Furcal with the awesome.

Furcal; Thats how its done, I don't think I have ever seen better.

Wow, a double play ball becomes a single for Martin. Woo hoo!

NICE! luck is good. Joe Morgan would love this inning so far. It is a gritty inning.

Bison. Nuff said.

That's why they call him The Bison™

Kemp hit a curveball. Weird.

One way to get your on base percentage over .300 is to make sure your batting average is above .300. Way to go, Bison.

BISON!!!

Whoa!!!

OK, wait. That's why they call him The Bison™!

Matt Kemp is the greatest baserunner of all time.

He's crafty, is what it is.

"I meant to do that" says Kemp...

Matty K with he greatest base running play ever. What a gamer.

Whoa.

The wolves can't keep a good Bison down!

What a gritty inning...scrappy!

Well, this is a nice start. Unless you're the Pirates. Which we're not.

You'd almost feel sorry for Mal-holl-um, but, nah, we'll take this.

PACKRAT! PACKRAT!

I'm convinced someone at FSN Prime Ticket saw my note on Loney's season-opening hitting streak and has used it in each of the last 3 games.

Loney always seems to get that RBI.

134 Hah hah. Quoting Vin Scully there, were ya?

At first I thought Kemp just slipped and got lucky. But watching the replay, that really was an amazing job of avoiding the tag and then getting to 3rd. Wasn't lucky at all.

Andruw's bat speed is so slow, it didn't even get off his shoulder.

That was Malholm's best pitch of the inning. FWIW.

Has anyone ever read the real Branch Rickey's scouting resports?....hysterically funny...

Druw dont ruin a good thing.

Here it comes Nomar, wait for it...wait for it....

It's a rear occasion when Nomar takes 3 straight balls in arrow, very rear.

Wow. Nomar's taken the first two pitches!

First four pitches. I think my head may explode.

150 aren't you on the internet? You're getting a faster feed than my stupid DirecTV.

Nomar's 1st ab was the anti-Nomar.

Nomar just worked a walk without swinging the bat.

Apocalypse!

Maybe Nomar can't actually swing the bat yet, but they're hoping opposing teams don't catch on to it.

Come on slappy

This might be the grittiest, scrappiest inning of all time.

Nomar walks?

Maybe he got some hitting pointers from DeWitt.

Pirate MGR John Russell seems to suffer from Terry Collins disease. The man just doesn't blink.

yep, definitely 156

Wow - great execution from slappy

Sigh. We should be going for the sweep.

Hey, did anyone notice if Russ was wearing batting gloves?

Two of the most beautiful drag bunts you will ever see.

One of the librarians on my staff is at this game tonight as it is her only chance to see her beloved hometown Pirates in L.A.

She and her husband at least got blankets out of the deal.

When I asked her once about who her favorite Pirate was when growing up and I suggested that it might have been Willie Stargell or Dave Parker. But I forgot about her age and she told me her heroes were Andy Van Slyke and Barry Bonds.

Love to see the Bison out there. Warms the soul.

The smallest ball inning in the history of baseball.

I'm happy with the result but that's just stupid to be bunting there. Seriously.

The poor Pirates can't seem to get anyone out. Wait here comes JP--------He almost shows how not to do what Furcal did.

Lol..Pierre.

Grittiest inning of the season..

151 Yep. That's kind of hard to believe, usually I'm a few seconds behind on MLBTV. You should ask them to increase your cable speed. ;-)

Nice drag bunt by Pierre for an RBI.

I really do kinda feel sorry for Malholm. Kinda. Not really.

If Penny hits the homerun I'm investing in a nuclear shelter.

I'd like to see Broxton in knee socks like that.

... Hah! Penny hits the hardest ball in the inning.

I know Penny's an ok hitter, but bunting with two outs and the pitcher due is a little weird.

162
No gloves for Russ.

162
No gloves for Russ.

161 Party Pooper.

That's why they call him Slappy McBunt!

No, wait, we don't call him that. Gritty McSlap?

Slappy McInfield?

Maholm's picture on Gameday looks like he's probably feeling.

Penny's leg work (when batting) is like that of a bowler, to me it does anyway.

Although I wrote 174 without knowing about the WP.

174. A little stupid. If you don't feel like you have a chance to get a hit without bunting, then get out of the league. If you do, then don't bunt with 2 in scoring position and the pitcher coming up!!

167 ,174
I have no problem with Pierre bunting there. He was just trying to get on base, plus it got (only) one run home.

At least he reset the lineup for the 2nd.

170 when I listen to MLB audio, I know that I'm a good 20 seconds behind, but I swear to god- Hallux refreshes, Hallux sees that Nomar walks from underdog, Hallux watches Nomar walk, Hallux tries to fast forward and sees that there is no more forward to fast. That's a first.

I know the TV in my room is a half second faster than the living room TV, thanks to the wiring.

182 Already down 3, shouldn't the Pirate have put Pierre on and taken their chances with the pitcher, try to limit the damage?

If there was ever a time to see if Penny can throw strikes, this is it.

... Kent should ALWAYS be called off of any defensive plays where a real fielder has a play on the ball.

if Kemp had more PVL, he and Kent would have used PVL Thought Rays and decided who would catch that.

If Repko was involved in that fly ball double, Young & Hu would be our middle infield for the foreseeable future.

Given that Adam LaRoche isn't exactly known as a good defensive first baseman, I can understand the safety squeeze. Not what I would of done, but it makes me shake my head and smile.

184 Is this like a quantum physics problem? Sounds like there may be some sort of worm hole in your house.

---

Good to see Kent smiling after that near collision with Kemp. Even better to see no one actually colliding.

Pierre's bunt reminded me of this passage from "Airplane!"

Sir, should we turn on the runway lights now?
No... that's just what they'll be expecting us to do!

189 yours was funnier

186 Penny threw 10 strikes in 12 pitches in the 1st.

A warm message to you all:

You are killing me. Collectively, you are Rick Monday. All this Slappy McBuntGritSmallBallScrap business, and not one of you -- NOT ONE! -- mentions the score of the ballgame.

193
Take that, Nuggets fan! :)

192. Right. Pierre's thought seems to be "I'll surprise them by doing something that nobody would expect because everyone knows it's stupid!"

191 If you saw the wiring in my house, you would understand. I'm convinced that I could crimp a big handful of wires together, and then let them go, and all the TV would come out at once.

PACKRAT!

195 4-0 on another gritty scrappy play by Martin.

195
4-0 Dodgers after 1.

Pirates just tried to make it 4-1, but Nady got Bisoned by a mile at the plate.

195
4-0 Dodgers.

I'll go get my egg timer now.

Sucker's lucky to be walking away from it.

what an arm!

Hah hah. I love Vin: "Oh my gosh!"

"Pittsburgh makes so many mistakes."

Kemp nails a runner running through a stop sign - a sign of the tables turning over a year or so ago!

167 Pierre can't do anything right in some people's minds.

Nice throw Bison.

All hail the Bison.

And Raffy with a very UNSCRAPPY HIT 5-0 DODGERS.

My heartfelt thanks for the score update(s). vr, Terry A.

... Mr. Furcal, you are playing quite well this season thus far. Just thought you should know.

Nice play, although he was safe. The ball was way ahead of him but he hit the plate long before he was tagged.

Sometimes I think Penny is a marvelous country hardball thrower, but hasn't the faintest idea about pitching. We really could use Maddox or perhaps Koufax to sit in the dugout and call his games.

I know basketball is a different flowing sport, but Spiro Dedes is awesome at giving the score. He works it in every chance he can during Lakers games.

raffy is insane.

RAFFY!

5-0 Dodgers (for Terry's sake.)

That was ripped.

Can't say this has been a dull start to this game.

1 1/2 innings and we've seen 4 of the 5 Bison tools already.

Furcal for MVP!

This is making me feel much better. I missed last night for a comedy show, and Saturday for a lacrosse game. I was beginning to think I was an offense jinx.

I guess I'm slower than those watching the game on regular TV, too. You're not alone Hallux!

---
More of this, please.

Furcal's OPS is 1.162 in 57Abs this season.

A healthy Furcal is awesome. That's 15 runs scored for Raffy in just less than 15 games.

Are the Dodger games vs. Braves on TBS and national TV?

Can't we tell Terry about tabbed browsers or having more than one window open instead?

222 TBS doesn't cover the Braves anymore.

TBS doesn't show the Braves anymore.

222
TBS no longer carries Braves games, unless they are on one of the Sunday MLB games they cover.

224
I no longer have the big iron on my hip.

Let the record show that 224 beat 225 proving that occasionally it can be done.

226 Why do you even try? ;)

However, Sunday's game will be on TBS because that's their national telecast.

Transcript of actual conversation between Yhency Brazoban and yours truly in the Jacksonville bullpen (a short wall separated us) before the 8th inning of last night's game:

Icaros (wearing Ghame Over shirt): Hey Yhency, have you seen this shirt before? It's you. We made this for you. See, there's an "h" right here.

Brazoban (looking at me like I'm a nut): Okay, thanks.

I don't normally do such things, but I felt this had to be done.

From what I understand, you might want to look to other than TBS for your Atlanta Baseball Club needs.

Loney is the human sacrifice fly!

For a fun number Maholm's WHIP for the game, through Kent's single, is 6.75.

Still no at bats tonight for Loney

so, is Loney trying to challenge the 3 sac flies Jose Lopez had yesterday?

231 that was scintillatingly awesome!

231 Did you give DT a plug?

206. Instead of assuming that, try defending it with something other than the result.

233 Help...me...

Loney is now one short of the single game record for sac flies.

The last guy to have three in a game was Edgar Martinez in 2002.

Chad Kreuter is among the names of the greats who have had three sac flies in a game. Kreuter did it with the Tigers.

So as I understand this - and correct me if I'm wrong - TBS doesn't cover the Braves anymore? Heh. Thanks all. Cool about Sunday, though.

231 Awesome, Icaros. He's probably already forgotten Eric Gagne.

Druw is still collapsing that back side. He really got under that that thing because his back leg was in a terrible position.

The last 2 dodger half innings i've missed have resulted in 9 runs. i'm thinking i should just not watch any more games.

At least Druw is hitting fly balls now.

Somebody had three sac flies in a game yesterday and I didn't notice?

Rats!

240 I thought it was good.

the people who make Jack In The Box commercials need to make Dodgers commercials. 100x better than Nomar Van or Kent Toast or that creepy guy who watched every game in the dark in various states of undress (but with hats).

246 Never seen "The Fly" with Vincent Price? Classic line from that movie. Vincent Price impressions don't translate real well on the 'net I suppose.

Loney will need to get a hit to keep his streak going. The rulebook states you can't keep a hitting streak going if you have sacrifice flies involved. If Loney was walked, hit by a pitch, sacrifice bunted, or reached on CI in all plate appearances, then he could keep his streak.

245 - Right through the wickets.

Loney has tied the LA Dodger record for sacrifice flies in a game, with two. It has been accomplished 22 other times, most recently by Andre Ethier last May.

http://www.bb-ref.com/pi/shareit/6myj

I really don't like the sac fly as a stat, but I enjoy its randomness.

Raffy is playing like he did in the second half of '05, when he was unstoppable.

The Dodgers will miss both Hudson/Smoltz this weekend, and maybe even Glavine.

248 that was a Vincent Price? I feel very silly comparing him to the smarmy guy from Jurassic Park.

254
I wouldn't say they'd be missing Glavine, Bob.

238

Didn't have the chance. It was awkward enough. But I did wear my DT shirt to this afternoon's game. The fans there don't seem to care much about the Dodgers.

Minotaur's best inning last night was when he picked off a guy at second, then picked off a guy at first, then froze the batter with a ridiculous curve for strike three. I was laughing like a little girl.

255 Indeed.

Just yesterday, both Jose Lopez and Yuniesky Betancourt had two sac flies for the Mariners against the Royals.

Welcome back Nomar!

That pitch looked like it bounced before Nomar hit it.

254 Might get Voloquez and Fogg in Cincinnati.

My favorite out-related RBI freaky stat is the game in San Francisco in 2004 when Milton Bradley drove in Dave Roberts thrice with groundouts

251 Does anyone know what the record is for most RBIs in a game without recording an official at-bat?

262
Despite Fogg, the Dodger offense appears cleared for takeoff.

OK, I'll stop.

a balk is a very PVL move by Nomar.

Don't put Beimel in.

"It picked off Adam LaRoche," says Vin cryptically on that balk.

---

Boy, CC Sabathia's off to a fine start.

254 Carlyle, TBA and Jurrjens per the Braves website.

261 I guess turning those pitches into hits is how you become a lifetime .315 hitter.

David Ortiz had 3 RBI with no ABs when he was on the Twins.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/MIN/MIN200007030.shtml

No balk will ever be better than Mark Hendrickson falling down, though.

255 In the original film, yes. In the more graphic remake it was indeed Jeff Goldblum.

264
David Ortiz as a Twin had 3 RBI (2 SF and a walk) against Boston on 7/3/2000. That's the most since 1956.

270
I give up. I'm laying down my keyboard to Bob, much like The Police to U2 at Band Aid.

Nice pitcher's duel in the Bronx tonight.

(Okay, no more sarcastic comments from me.)

Ortiz was taken out of the game in 2000 by Tom Kelly and Butch Huskey(!!!) was sent in to hit for him.

O.K. here we go Russell 3-run-Jack...

274 I feel the need to point out that I have tickets to the Police at the Hollywood Bowl. the Police was one of 3 bands I would pay $100 to ee. I am very very very happy, regardless of the fact that I have no one t go with.

274
No keep it up. I may get woozy later tonight because I can't eat anything more because I have to get a cholesterol test in the morning.

I believe the test will show that I have some.

Alright, I'm going to go watch a DVD and do some work for a bit. Can someone give me a holler if the Pirates somehow rally?

278
So you're saying that you will be So Lonely, and that no one will Stand So Close to [You]?

278 I'm jealous! I wanted to get tix for their show up here but blew it. I probably still could. I'd love to see those guys again after seeing them as a pre-teen.

281 If I was that clever, I would probably have someone to go with.

274

[picturing the moment as it happened, chills running thru my spine...]

There are lots of empty seats at Yankee Stadium now even though fans there are supposedly so diehard they would never leave.

As the "Twilight Zone" taught us:

PEOPLE ARE THE SAME ALL OVER!

282 I just realized they'd be in SF in a couple months. It's already sold out, I'm guessing?

282 hey- make it down here and you've got a ticket. I refuse to go alone.

U2 kind of blew them by the way side after that though.

270 , 273 Thanks for tracking that down. Loney's within striking distance of making a little history tonight.

288
Bad is my favorite U2 song ever, and the Band Aid version is the best.

In the history of regular season interleague play, did the Dodgers ever get to play at Yankee Stadium? I remember the Yankees coming to Chavez Ravine a few summers ago.

I realized earlier today that I'd love to see The Police before they officially call it quits.

The first player with three sac flies in a game was Harry Steinfeldt of the Cubs and he did it in 1909. Then Bob Meusel of the Yankees did it in 1927. Ernie Banks was next in 1961 (there weren't any sac flies for a period in the 1940s and 1950s). Then Russ Nixon did it in 1965.

And then on May 1 and May 3, 1986, Vince Coleman and Don Mattingly had three in a game.

Is that appropriately Starkian? Or does that qualify as a boring historical anecdote?

I believe that Yankee Stadium is the only AL Park that the Dodgers have not played a regular season game in.

And they never will.

U2 Thoughts makes me know what XeiFrank feels like when we talk about movies.

293
First off, your anecdotes are never boring.

Second, does SABR have regional meetings besides the big national conference? I'm thinking of joining.

Jason Bay & Gabe Kapler have the nerdiest swings!

297 - Nerdiest?

291 - nope, the Bums haven't visited Yankee Stadium outside of the World Series

296
There are regional meetings and the San Diego chapter (the Ted Williams chapter) is quite active.

The L.A./Orange County Chapter (Allan Roth) is not the most active. Probably because I'm vice president.

278 I saw the Police when they came through D.C. last fall, and they put on an amazing show. I'd been looking forward to seeing them live for so long that I grew concerned that I was setting myself up to be disappointed. There was no need to fear. It's amazing how much better Sting is when he's surrounded by Andy and Stewart (and I say that as one who's a fan of Sting's solo output). I'm envious that you'll get to see them at the Bowl.

question: if Loney doesn't have an AB tonight, what happens to the hitting streak?

302
I answered it above, but Loney needs a hit to keep his streak going. Sac flies don't get you off the hook.

294 Interleague play scheduling makes no sense to me. You would think that with all the history between the Dodgers and Yankees in New York, that someone would have ensured the Dodgers play at least one series before they knock the stadium down. Meanwhile, the Dodgers have been forced to play at Skydome in Toronto on at least two different seasons.

301 That helps me quite a bit. thanks. Because I have the same fears, and I am also a fan of (some) Sting solo work. I was seriously debating selling my tickets.

That double play was ridiculously great!

290

U2's "Pride" (In the name of Love, MLK version) is ONE of my favorites, I still remember hearing it for the first time in my little red truck, one of those life changing moments.

302 see 249

304
I think that because the Dodgers have played in three World Series at Yankee Stadium made it less necessary to get the Dodgers to play in the Bronx.

308
The question is now moot.

I answered it above, but Loney needs a hit to keep his streak going. Sac flies don't get you off the hook.

seems like he's aiming for the fences tonight.

311 Got the runner home from 3rd with less than two outs twice though. Bowa will love that.

Heard Stewart Copeland drummed during one of the Foo Fighters concert at the Forum! Too bad that didn't happen at the show I went to at the Oracle :-((

304 I was thinking that would make it more of a reason to schedule the Dodgers in the Bronx. The intrigue of interleague games to me, is the historic matchups.

Back for a sec.
Tix for Police seem still available for both Concord and Mtn View shows up here, to answer Fanerman's question.

And I'd forgotten that Elvis Costello was opening. Go, Hallux. Have a blast. Meet girls. Etc.

Okay, off to watch "Blast of Silence."

309 - you're slipping Bob, the Dodgers have played in 4 World Series' against the Yankees since moving to LA.

And 7 more while in Brooklyn.

315 Yes, I am aware.

I've seen Elvis 4 or 5 times. At least 2 of those were covers tours. Another one was a country tour. I'm hoping this is hits. The country show was horrid.

300
Bob, thanks. I just joined.

316
I don't worry about things that happened before I was born.

Especially when I can use that qualifier as an excuse.

There are still some tickets available for the Police/Costello show at the Bowl, believe it or not. Unfortunately for me, I will be out of town. Enjoy Hallux.

305

Definitely hang onto your tickets. Andy's blistering solos and Stewart's work on the skins alone are worth the price of admission.

318- Just so you know, there's a rule against using SABR membership to get free stuff, or impress women.

317 The Wiltern Theatre show for "The Delivery Man" was very good. I think that was the fifth time I saw him.

319 - so, you're not the guy to ask about public domain books at the library?

Penny just over 14 pitches/inning.

From the PE Blog tonight:
>>Talked to Dodgers OF Andruw Jones today and he said that he had made an adjustment in his swing that is helping him break out of his slump.

Jones said his upper body was not balanced correctly and ce[nt]er[e]d on his legs. After reviewing film, he said he made the adjustment which has helped him collect a few hits recently.

"I'm just trying to stay in between my legs," Jones said. "Sometimes you think you are comfortable and you actually are not."<<

And on cue, there's a nice hit from him.

What is that!? is it ice or heat, I'm guessing it's heat cause he's still pitching (Penny has something on his shoulder like when there done pitching & they put ice)

Every position player BUT Tex Loney with a hit now.

Can someone remind me about the benefits of icing your arm between innings like Penny is doing?

320 that's got to be for the second night (or band hold releases), because it was sold out for a good while.

I hate when bands option a second night, and don't get me started when the "second" night is the night before the "first" night...

I swear, I'm super excited for the show. I just wish that one of my friends was.

The San Diego SABR chapter gets a lot of support from the Padres. They get to use suites at Petco and stuff like that.

The only time the Dodgers ever approached the LA chapter about a meeting was back when Dan Evans was GM. He had a day at the stadium ready for us.

Then Paul DePodesta got hired. DePodesta was not particularly interested in talking to SABR members. Surprisingly, DePodesta would not fit in well at a SABR convention. More people at them want to talk about things like the 1920 American Association pennant race or baseball in Pennsylvania prisons.

The Blue Jays are using their ninth pitcher tonight at home. Texas and Toronto are in the 14th inning.

A.J. Burnett is hoping not to play the role of Ed Rommel.

When I was a young-teen (14,15) there was this kid who swang just like Penny & he loved bowling, I wonder if Brad Penny also enjoys bowling.

If we could play the Pirates every game, I think we'd go something like 120-42.

330 It's for Monday.

329

I have no clue, I really doubt it is ice I'm thinking it's a heading pad of some kind, you ice your arms when your done pitching at least that's how I was thought.

335 Monday is in San Diego, and that venue sucks, so I'm cool with that.

336

err, that should be HEATING pads.

alright, Loney- you've been served.

looks like the four way tie in the NBA west will end up with San Antonio 3, Utah 4, Houston 5 (with home court), and Phoenix 6.

Lakers get Denver, New Orleans gets Dallas (who blew them out a bit tonight).

I think the Lakers have a pretty good road to the Western Conference finals.

337 Sorry, I was looking at a 2007 calendar! That was for Wednesday 5/28 at the Bowl. Really, I don't see how that show can't book two nights at the Bowl - that's a gimme.

Nate McClouth is having a really good start to the year. Looking at his past stats, he finishes around average or slightly below.

Short night for Penny.

341 They did, and there are still a few seats available for Wednesday. There is nothing for Tuesday, when I have tickets, which went on sale first, and which makes me happy.

I've also never been to Hollywood Bowl, so I'm double excited.

Oh Kemp. Gotta love him.

Ok, Joe Torre is clearly not Grady Little.

He'll be benched tomorrow for that.

344
I've been to the Hollywood Bowl a bunch of times. It's fun in theory.

Don't try to park at the Bowl. Go for the Park and Ride.

344 Last rock show I saw there was Sting, with Squeeze opening. Because it's open air, it's not as loud as I like, but the sound is clear, of course, and it is a great venue.

Following the game on Gameday--why was Penny pulled after only 85 pitches, up 6-1?

347 I bet they bench the whole team tomorrow!

Man, Blast of Silence is really good so far. Too bad I can't keep from peeking at the Dodger game.

The number of outs matters not to a robot made of nails.

347 He meant to do that. Just like the base running thing. He was psyching people out. That's a PVL move.

I really think Penny was good for an inning or two more. I see no reason to ask for trouble here? At least we are hitting a day off so Joe probably can't burn down the bull-pen.

Note to offense--hello, are you awake? We are still in OK shape, but we haven't seen you since the second inning. Is Pittsburgs pitching really this fantastic?

I really think Penny was good for an inning or two more. I see no reason to ask for trouble here? At least we are hitting a day off so Joe probably can't burn down the bull-pen.

Note to offense--hello, are you awake? We are still in OK shape, but we haven't seen you since the second inning. Is Pittsburgs pitching really this fantastic?

350

Nothing's wrong with Penny physically, just Torre's decision.

348 I live about 10 minutes from there, so I was planning on a cab. Do they have a good cab population at the end?

No way that's a hit. The throw would have beat him if it was on target. Bad official scoring.

357
If you're 10 minutes away, just walk or take a bus. That cab is going to be very expensive.

Does the extra digit work Vinny?

349 Police/ Elvis/ Squeeze would make me retire from concerts. I believe that Squeeze is back on the road this year (I still prefer Jools Holland solo, with his Rhythm & Blues Band)

Got back a few minutes ago from the Indians-Tigers game. CC had absolutely nothing! He was clearly finished two batters before Renteria's grand slam and everyone in the park save Wedge knew it. It was kind of interesting/nice sitting in the park watching the results of bad decisions without the emotional attachment. I'd be dying right now if I were an Indians fan.

Tyler Kepner of the New York Times thinks that Andy Pettitte has a legitimate chance at the Hall of Fame.

Incredible.

359 noted. I meant that I was 10 minutes by car (with freeway), so it sees like the bus is the way to go.

360 I'm sure it's handy when he dials long distance.

363 Well, he has a legitimate chance at walking through the Hall of Fame...

That just killed Loney's chances of joining the Jose Lopez Club.

355 - nope, just the defense turning 2, makes it hard to score runs that way

Terrible call.

Actually, as I read Kepner's post more closely, he said he was just trying to drum up support for getting Pettitte in the "Hall of the Very, Very Good."

363 Anyone have a quick way to identify Pettite's closest statistical equivalents?

Buck Showalter last night on Baseball Tonight completely dismissed Jeff Kent's HOF credentials. I'm not the biggest JK fan but come on!

371
Per Baseball-Reference.com, Pettitte's most similar players are:

1. Jimmy Key (915)
2. Dwight Gooden (914)
3. Dave McNally (898)
4. Lefty Gomez (880) *
5. Ron Guidry (879)
6. Frank Viola (875)
7. Dazzy Vance (874) *
8. Bruce Hurst (874)
9. Mike Cuellar (873)
10. Lon Warneke (871)

Rockies lead the Friars 3-2 going into the top of the 9th in San Diego.

Vin should not attempt Spanish. :)

I know I'm considered the pessimist. But despite Vin's patter( and I love Vin), I just find it ominous at the moment. replacing an effective Penny and failing to do anything offensively in the 3rd-6th has me on edge.

Most plate appearances, 0 walks in a season, Los Angeles Dodgers:

116 Fernando Valenzuela, 1986
108 Don Sutton, 1969
103 Fernando Valenzuela, 1985
100 Fernando Valenzuela, 1987
87 Mariano Duncan, 1989

Matt Kemp has moved into a tie for 35th on this list with 41 (alongside Wilkin Ruan, Kevin Brown, Burt Hooton and Derrell Griffith). Of course, if he draws one walk in 2008, he's bounced.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pi/shareit/Tx2n

sigh.. ebay is not helping me acquire playoff tickets.

372 Thanks! That indeed looks like a list from the "Hall of Very Good" Most of it anyway.

Paulino looked out at 1B.

377
Did you try StubHub? They usually have tickets, but sometimes at a premium.

307

Aren't those moments more mood changing than life changing?

The Solution, I would like you to meet The Problem.

381

I phrased it that way for dramatic purposes, I went on my marry ignorant ways once the song was over...

380 oh yes. Too expensive, although I'm starting to waver.

382 - heh

384 I should say- too expensive because I fully expect the Nuggets to get killed. I'm not will to spend a lot when I have no faith in my team.

McClouth has a long way to go to break the all-time record for longest hitting streak to start a season.

It's 44 games by Willie Keeler in 1897. George Sisler started the 1925 season with a 34-game streak.

15

The ad for John Roseboro shows him on a 1968 baseball card in a Dodgers uniform. However, Roseboro was on the Twins that year.

there you go Loney.

The streak goes on.

Fifteen for Lonestar!

James Loney is going to hit in 162 straight this season

387 As does Tex.

Tuned back in just in time to see that.

Btw, you'll be amused to hear that Pirates fans commenting on Bucs Dugout think that Vin Scully is "an ass" (direct quote, among other negative comments about him). Tres amusing.

389
Bob, didn't you collect baseball cards? More often than not, the cards of a certain year contained pictures and team alliances of the prior year. So, 1968 Topps featured, for the most part, 1967 baseball players (when Roseboro was on the Dodgers).

What a terrible plate approach.

Baffled

I pledge no allegiance to turn of the century anecdotes, 34-game hitting streak by George Sisler is were it's at.

At this point in the season, Penny should be protecting Loney in the lineup, with Jones hitting behind him.

392 -ooh, I like that.

395 based on the Pirates games I've listened to, they should be happy that their broadcasters aren't drunk, and are watching the game.

389 ,396
That said, there's no real rhyme or reason as to how Topps decides to handle a player that has switched teams during the offseason. Andruw Jones' 2008 Topps card has him on the Dodgers, for instance.

397 hey! I remember that guy! he used to comment 'round here.

395
Now I'll root, root, root for the Pirates fans in question to get scurvy.

Other than this being his first game back (and wanting to get him some ABs), why not have DeWitt hit for Nomar?

The fidget gets a walk.

Fleer needs to make more Billy Ripkin cards

A 120 foot double

Pirates pitchers do know that Garciaparra is cursed by the Sports Illustrated cover right? There is no need to pitch around him.

402 He's been way busy.

Everything's coming up Juan!

406
Ha!

http://tinyurl.com/5fhszd (NSFW)

401 - I think it depends on when a player switches teams, and if they can get a photo of him in the gear of his new team. I remember Strawberry's first Upper Deck card when he joined the Dodgers was a picture from the press conference.

So I guess this means Kemp is on the bench for the next game.

400

That reminds me, didn't we burst there bubble on the opening of there new stadium?

Pierre hits a "miracle double" according to Vin.

400 Seriously, and if there's any implication that Vin is some kind of homer announcer, then that's even more ridiculous. He may not be everything he once was, but he's still one of the best announcers out there, even today. Maybe some bitterness coming through listening to a non-hometown announcer when your team's getting beaten up.

We're the Mets now with the "Clap your hands" thing?

Ugh. No.

It seems odd that someone brought in as a pinchrunner wouldn't be able to score on a double. Yeah, yeah, DeWitt isn't in so much as a PR but as a sub for Nomar.

415 - agreed. Knowing that my unborn children will grow up without Vin Scully and Chick Hearn is almost enough reason for me not to have kids.

411
I don't have the cards in front of me, but I believe Dontrelle's 2008 Topps card is as a Marlin while Miguel Cabrera's is as a Tiger.

One of the great and hilarious quirks of baseball cards, especially Topps, is the awful airbrushing of other teams' logos and colors.

We're literally running circles around the Bucks tonight.

401 I imagine the lead time to go to press on the cards was a lot longer in 1968 than now.

a make up for kemp call last inning

417 OK. That's what I get for relying on gameday and not watching the game. Nevermind.

When it goes right, it goes right. Furcal up to .407 BA.

419 - honestly, I haven't seen a set of baseball cards in 15 years or so. Though the deal with Willis and Cabrera doesn't surprise me... probably more time to get a position player during spring training than a pitcher.

Though I do have to agree with the air brushing.

Do they still do the rookie/traded second sets?

416 I hate that, too.

Though I do like the Pac Man sound effect that pops up when an opposing player strikes out.

416 better than the Harry Belafonte "Dey Oh!" cheer.

I hate that yelp more than anything ever.

427 - I have three words for the cheer that I hate most:

ole
ole
ole

With the Dodgers up by so very much, why not bring in Young at second and let him get some at-bats? Let Hu play short and give Furcal some rest.

I'm glad it wasn't DeWitt that went down the guy has done it all at 3rd base & then some.

I feel sorry for people who can't recognize Vin's greatness. Most homer announcers would have called Pierre's "miracle double" a line shot down the line. In Chicago they'd be breathless.

Here is Andruw Jones' 2008 Topps card. Some typically poor airbrushing here:

http://tinyurl.com/5sby7c

better than the Harry Belafonte "Dey Oh!" cheer.

man, if you want my mind to go crazy with bad thoughts, do that cheer, ugh!!

428 I stand by my statement. DEY OH! is my most hated cheer. Ever. For anything.

and I hate a lot of cheers- even Zombie Nation for Dodger home runs.

Beimel threw six pitches. Why get Broxton up, let alone bring him in with a five (now seven) run lead?

My least favorite cheers are the ones repeated at Giant games, which may be a rule 1 violation, I'm not sure. They completely lack all imagination. "Giants" / "Barry" / some other team + a derogatory remark. No imagination whatsoever.

I had to exercise great restraint in holding off buying a pair of Kemp and Loney Suns bobbleheads today.

I just remembered the last time I moved and how long it took to pack.

They were pretty cool, though, in a completely goofy way, especially the Loney one.

Also, Carl's Jr. is called Hardee's in the South, not that I would eat there.

432 - I don't like that border design at all, looks like a 70s retread. As airbrushes go, that's not all that bad, it almost looks like the spring training uni.

425
The Cabrera card was airbrushed too.

http://tinyurl.com/69e23u

436 we all hate rhythmically yelling about what Barry may or may not do. (note- he does suck).

Not to make an issue of it, but it does seem from the way people talk about him here, that Louis Gonzales had a bad season for us last year. There is no "love" for him, fine, but he doesn't deserve the disparagement.

Yet he had an above MLB average season, in all three main categories.

BA: .278 (league avg. .270)
OBP: .359 (avg. .330)
SLG: .433 (avg. .430)

Not great, but certainly not deserving of the sneers he gets here.
Especially if you recall that for a bad spell for us last year, he carried more than a few games with his hot bat.

434 - dey oh is probably second on my list.

441

What was the MLB average for a LFer last year?

442 I thought you were a soccer fan! what's with the ole singing hate?

433

There is another one I really really dislike but I can't remember it right now.

So Vin the Sleuth notices that Adam LaRoche has a smaller-sized "A" on the back of his jersey, but brother Andy has a full-sized "A".

Wonder what xeifrank thinks of this.

444 - I'm marginally a soccer fan. I think the last time I went to a live game, I was in high school (and it was my high school). I'll watch FSC occasionally, but I couldn't tell you the name of the mid fielder for Newcastle or Barcelona.

I will admit to enjoying watching the Brazilians play.

441
Part of the derision of Gonzo is because he wasn't exactly a willing participant in his non full-time status. Pierre was everyday Juan last year, so there were 3 guys for the other 2 spots. Gonzalez was the worst of the three, especially factoring in defense. Yet he played the most (of the 3).

Umps don't like Kemp.

That's not a strike...

443 What was the MLB average for a LFer last year?

I understand that. But keep in mind we didn't have high expectations for him when he got signed. And I'm not saying he had a great year. Just that he gets a lot of bad press here on Dodger Thoughts. He doesn't deserve it.

446 the brothers discussed that on the pregame show- they don't know, and they don't care, as long as it's on a major league jersey.

447 fair enough

446 - Adam and Andy aren't really related. They're distant cousins, like TR and FDR.

Sweeney is certainly starting the year poorly. Has he lost it, or is it just a very small sample size?

435
Normally I'd say Broxton needs the work, plus there's an off day tomorrow. But, Big John pitched Sunday and Monday as well, so there's really no reason for the appearance tonight. Not the best way to start day 1 of the 11-man staff.

Gonzalez thought he was entitled to start in LF by divine right and not because he earned it. It's as if his bloop single in the 2001 World Series gave him a lifetime "start in the Majors" card.

451

I think he deserves it. Why should low expectations be his salvation? He can't play defense. He hits below average for his position, and he was a main contributer to last season's clubhouse drama, despite being a supposed team player.

Dude has always been a politician with the press, too.

456 - don't worry, we've got EDSP, we could have a six man staff, if we really needed to.

448 Point taken. I'd sort of forgotten about that.

459
Good point. Maybe Topps can airbrush an attached arm on Proctor's 2009 Topps card!

Wasn't Gonzo fairly good the first half of the year, which accounts for the good overall numbers. But then he seriously tailed off and objected quite loudly when it was clearly time to bench him -- if for no other reason than to give him some rest and make him fresh again. So there's the problem right there, without even considering from whom he was taking playing time.

My impression was that at this point in his career, Gonzo only has the endurance to put up decent numbers for half a season.

457 Luis XIV?

/Sorry

I like it how Loney is making Marte throw plenty of pitches, hehehe.

I blame the Pirates' poor pitching on the hideous catching gear. It looks like some stuff you can buy off Army of Two.

Also, not to pile on Gonzo, but 2008 marks the third time in three years -- with three different teams -- that he has started the year by saying what a privilege it is for him to play with talented young players and that he's all about the team, etc. Each of the last two years ended with bridge-burning exits, and I expect his Florida departure to be no different.

Wow. A 12 pitch at bat by Loney. Too bad it couldn't have ended with a homer.

If you bring your church program from the previous Sunday to a Monday night Jacksonville Suns game, you get $5 off your admission price.

I use to think "The Penguin" was a cute nickname for Ron Cey but he actually did walk & run like a penguin, weird.

I'm glad this isn't a close game. My cable box just reset.

Saito????

Someone needs to tell Torre that just because it's the ninth inning, he doesn't need to bring in Saito. At the same time, tell him that the 8th inning = Broxton every time either.

Wouldn't it make sure sense to use Park up for a few innings here? Isn't that why we have two long relievers on the team?

I'm discouraged by Joe Torres usage of our top closer.

Fortunately this is only Saito's sixth appearance. He really hasn't worked much this year.

[471- he just needs work, and no pressure work at that. No worries.

Is it safe to assume that the quote attributed to "a former dodger" in the last ESPN Magazine was the work of Luis Gonzalez?

Keep in mind that Saito's last game was two nights ago when he blew the save and the game. Didn't pitch yesterday. No game tomorrow. No pressure right now. I disagree with you guys, I think it's actually great he's pitching right now.

475 I he was talking about the trouble with raising triplets, then yes. It is safe.

Our shortstop is hitting .407/.500/.695

476 harumph 474

477 Wasn't that a Star Trek episode?

479 Well at least your internet connection is faster, even if your cable is slow. ;-)

Bautista with the payback AB.

480

Haha, and I'm not even a Star Trek buff.

We win!

Vin's favorite hockey player from San Francisco just ended the game with a non-slap shot.

Cue Greg Brock.

So how did Saito's slider look?

480 well, they're all fuzzy...

Go Dodgers! It shouldn't have been a rubber game, but we'll take it. Let's keep it up, team! And everyone hit.

Loney has the hitting streak, but Furcal is up over .400 now. Wow!

Kemp is at .310. Just try to sit him now.
Ethier: .308
Pierre: up to .281

Jones: .157 with two more strikeouts today.

Yeah, I know batting average is a "lesser" statistic, but it's handy. It's time to sit Jones for a couple games. If it worked for Kemp (or so we were told that was the reason for the first benching), then it should be good enough for Jones.

475 What did "Gonzales" say in the latest ESPN magazine?

Hurrah!

Night all. Good to go in to the off day and road trip with a coupla victories.

Hasta.

peace out. good to see Brock (or read, as it were)

The Angels broadcast just showed "a crazy Angels fan" trying to fire up the team.

It was the Westside Rentals guy.

493

He gets more air time than some players. He was on during countless UCLA games, during the Tournament, and this Angels game.

The Dodgers Live highlights conveniently skipped the one play I was interested in seeing (since I missed the first inning): the Bison's crazy basepath adventures. I think they showed every other play in the first. Dang.

492 You too. Thanks!

So Kennedy and Lyons think the Dodgers have lost a lot because they've played against good teams and good pitchers.

They're not the best in the business for nuthin', folks.

im trying to find the exact quote, hold on a minute.

496 What did Kennedy say he did when his team faced a string of tough pitchers when he was a manager?

495 It was up on the new Gameday.

498 He managed in the bigs?

Hey, did you get a chance to read that New York magazine piece on D.B. Cooper I mention a month or so ago?

Good, n'est-ce pas?

495 On Gameday, it's play #4 for the inning, beginning with Kent's single.

497

Take your time, I'll hold your drink.

496 I'm guessing that you're all about the kids. Good job... and hit a website up!

500 He managed to Rangers and the RedSox in the early to mid 90s.

I can't help but pull for Nomar over Laroche. My head says Andy, but my heart says Nomar.

Who's with me!

(anyone?)

"They should trade Kemp while they can get a lot for him," says a former Dodger. "He's a great athlete, but he's a basketball player trying to play baseball." (Kemp was an AAU mate of the Hawks' Shelden Williams.)

505

Id rather pull for the guy who has a chance to be here for the next 6 years.

505 Nomar was always my favorite of the big 3 shortstops. He just looks like a ballplayer is supposed to look. There aren't a whole lot of non-Dodgers whom I have really liked, but Nomar was always one of them. So like you, I have a hard time rooting against him, even though my head says Andy. I'd love to see Nomar have one more good year for the Dodgers, as Andy is slowly phased into the position.

FWIW: Torii has also been one of my non-Dodger favorites, ever since he robbed Bonds of the homerun in the all-star game.

503 Yeah, lot's of prepping classes and big annual standardized tests coming up and getting ready for teaching AP next year and tutoring kids for assorted nonsense. Craziness. But hey, these folks are our future, and I'm all about the future. It's important and stuff.

504 I was just joshin' around.

505 No.

506 Kemp is hardly Michael Jordan.

506 - Thanks! I read that too. But as I recall, I thought the article was quoting a "scout". Am I wrong on that?

509 Duh. Sorry. It's been awhile since I've had cable, so I had forgotten that Kennedy does like to talk about his managerial career like it was yesterday. I had also forgotten that it's been over a decade since he's managed.

I wish I could get a big schedule like the one behind Torre in this postgame interview.

509 well. rest assured, you've been missed. Not that any of us would wish any different on you.

nope, its quoting "a former dodger" just as it says.

Mia can have his heart. I'd like some home runs!!

500 Yeah, I did; thanks for the link. It was a good read. I still say he died in the jump, just like I believe Butch and Sundance died in San Vicente. I wonder if D.B. hollered the same rule 1 violation as Butch and Sundance did in their famous leap?

Any Bay Area folk going to the Green Apple Festival on Sunday?

517 In my world, D.B. Cooper lived, Pat Buchanan was Deep Throat, there was a real Pope Joan, and the Roanoke settlers lived a long existence in hiding.

And Amelia Earhart was sippin' umbrella drinks somewhere.

David Bowie live at Isle of Wight Festival singing "Heroes". Channel 414 MHD. Now.

519 And don't forgot: there was no moon landing. It was all filmed on a Hollywood sound stage.

Eagles live, these guys should NOT dress themselves.

521

I was talking to a mega normal middle age gentlemen at Outback the other night and all the sudden he starts talking to me about how the moon landing was faked.

Or to be more precise, he said, "...I'm just sayin'" over and over.

It was really strange for me. This guy was more normal than my dad, then all of the sudden WAHM! he hits me with the crazy stuff.

I am predicting that Andruw Jones will hit his first two HRs for the Dodgers in Atlanta this weekend against his former team.

fact: the United States no longer has the technology to get to the moon. The previous technology was destroyed.

525 - yes, but the geenie is out of the bottle, we can rebuild it if we really wanted to.

I'm trying to think of the right analogy for the moon, it's one of those places you really want to go but then you get there and just shrug, and say, "really? this is it?"

Kind of like my experience of going to Havasu.

If David Bowie can make it into space, the United States government can.

523 I knew this guy for about a year. He was on my soccer team, and we would go to bars and stuff after soccer game with our teams and hang out. He was engaged to a nice girl and seemed like the most normal guy in the world. And then, about a year after I knew him, he hit me with how he would never file his taxes and the government can't make him and it's unconsititutional to tax people and how people don't have to pay taxes and the IRS can't get to you. Wow... I just never saw it coming.

523 There's a Carmax ad now whose punchline is "I'm just sayin'." I think the writer of the ad doesn't understand how people actually use that expression. It's meant like your Outback loon used it -- presenting a suggestive fact (or what he thinks is a fact), then pulling back, saying in essence "draw your own conclusions."

Plus the ad's message assumes you believe Carmax's sticker price is already ideally low. Says who?

It's one of the most insultingly stupid ads I've ever heard.

(Oh, is this off topic? I missed the game b/c I was at my son's play. Thrilled to hear Charley Steiner say the score when I finally could listen in the bottom of the 8th.)

525 by Linda Hamilton and a robot from the future?

528
You folks need to work in a public library sometime.

You'll get your fill of conspiracy theories. You also have to learn nod sympathetically.

531 True about the sympathetic nod. Funny.

I did alot of that with this guy. In a way, because it's actually hard to refute what they are telling you. They're usually very articulate and VERY well read in theories they speak of.

I mean if I told you cheese was actually blue. What could you say?

526 Genie is out of the bottle because Captain Nelson found it on the beach when returning from the moon -- or I think it was the moon -- maybe it was just outer space.

533
Just outer space. The show premiered in 1965. That was a full four years before the putative lunar landing.

I am sure it must be a big deal to people that saw it happen, but I could care less if they faked the moon landing.

As long as I know the moon is there then I am fine. Wait... is it there??

535
If there's no moon out there, then a lot of people are going to have to reschedule their Seders for this weekend.

535 - that's no moon...

[sorry]

Wow, A-Rod is already 15th on the all-time HR list.

I guess he has had a bit better of a career than Darren Dreifort.

No moon would mean 300 mph winds and a planet swiveling around like crazy.

I say we blow up the moon. It would be a hoot.

How would we blow it up when we can no longer get up there?

A giant lasar from Caltech?

Oooo. If it misfires, perhaps we can make a very large container of jiffy pop popcorn.

540 I mean "laser."

Errgg. It's late.

I'm sure the Mars Direct guys could find a way to blow up the moon. They have dozens of PhD's in physics and what not.

And those guys hate the moon.

506.

Sometimes it does seem as though Kemp's mind is elsewhere. I hope the new coaching staff can turn this basketball player into a baseball player. He could be a really good one.

He hasn't been playing baseball all that long, if I recall correctly.

540 Just send Bruce Willis.

544 Or Val Kilmer

539 -- Where did you read about what the effect would be on earth if there were no moon? That is pretty interesting.

or Juan Pierre.

or Mr. Repko.

546 My astronomy professor used to talk about it all the time. He worked at JPL once upon a time, and he used to talk about how the moon holds the earth's axis at a steady 23.5 degrees and slows the earth's rotation.

I'm pretty sure Discovery has done a documentary on it as well.

Here you go, Canuck:

http://shopping.discovery.com/product-52214.html

Mr. Repko would have to do the colliding to produce the intended effect. Mr. Pierre would be extraneous ... just as he is now, come to think of it. Oh please, oh please, can we send Mr. Pierre there first?

549 -- You had an astronomy professor? I thought you were a history major, like me. You can be drummed out of the history major fraternity for taking a real science course, if I'm not mistaken.

549 My astronomy professor once brought in a guest lecturer / amateur astronomer who extolled the virtues of telescopic star gazing while enjoying the influences of the uh, uh, uh, ... oh heck I'm blowing the punchline.

552 UCLA had (has?) a well-known Mickey Mouse course, Intro to Astronomy, provided you took it with the right instructor. I took it in one of my last years there, mostly as a heavenly bodies gazing exercise.

546 Here are a few interesting theories about the effect of the Moon on earth and what would happen if there was no moon.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn4786-no-moon-no-life-on-earth-suggests-theory.html

http://spiff.rit.edu/classes/phys235/no_moon/no_moon.html

http://content.scholastic.com/browse/article.jsp?id=4850

552 My dad is a chemist, so I had to feign interest in the "hard sciences" in order to appease him.

Astronomy is great until you have to learn how to compute orbital velocities and all that lab stuff. I really struggled.

553 Carl Sagan was a huge fan of the silliness. Huge fan.

552 I am an English major who took real physics. They've let me stay in the English fraternity, and it's becoming rather handy now that my university is pushing a writing across the curriculum program. Some of the science professors claim it can't be done. Then I tell them how to make their labs writing intensive. They stare at me blankly as it suddenly dawns on them that I actually know what a real science lab is and that I know how to do technical writing. Ha! Chalk one up to the literature majors of the world. Sometimes it's actually useful to have a breadth of trivial knowledge.

556 And physics was great when it was telling you how hard you had to hit the ball to get it over the fence and how a curveball works.

Although I'm not a sciences guy at all, I took Astronomy classes in college until the math got to be too much. I did well in the first three courses, then in the fourth course I got a 13 on the first exam and figured it might be a good idea to drop the class.

By the way, if Cooper died in the jump, how did some (but only a very small amount) of his cash end up buried next to the bank of the Columbia River, hundreds of miles away from the plane's flight path?

557 My daughter is double-majoring: Theater and Mathematics. They haven't made her turn in the comedy/tragedy mask insignia yet. Her math aptitude is better than mine and I have a degree with the word "mathematics" in it. But she is only vaguely aware of who Danica McKellar is.

I work in engineering and the writing skills of some of my colleagues is abominable. I applaud more writing intensive studies in the sciences and you efforts towards that goal.

556 yes, yes, the silliness; that was the word I was desperately and clumsily groping for.

560 OK, "you/your" is simply a typo, but the subject/verb disagreement of "skills/is" is pretty cleverly placed, eh?

559 Wolves.

Three observations from attending tonight's game:

Our gifted Matt Kemp simply doesn't focus on what's in front of him. Besides the baserunning and the throwing home goofs, while in the on-deck circle he spent more effort on checking out the stands than checking out the pitcher. Our Nick LaLoush.

These new lights are more intense for sure. I wonder if that will cause outfielders to lose more fly balls.

It's a bummer when the guys sitting behind you steal your Dodger blanket from under your seat. It looked like a decent blanket.

D.B. Cooper had to have made it. He just had to.

Assuming Cooper did die, It's hard to imagine that some family member or friends in the Pacific Northwest wouldn't tie the disappearance of someone they know, who looked like Cooper, to the hijacking.

Most people just don't disappear into thin air without somebody putting two and two together.

The lede from the Times' game coverage tonight:

He had to wait a little longer than expected, but Dodgers Manager Joe Torre finally got a look Wednesday at the lineup he thought he'd start the season with.

With Ethier on the bench and Pierre in left?

And Nomar at third?

565 A minor detail ...

Night all. Off to sleep dreams of blowing up the moon with a laser beam ...

564 "Assuming Cooper did die, It's hard to imagine that some family member or friends in the Pacific Northwest wouldn't tie the disappearance of someone they know, who looked like Cooper, to the hijacking."

That appears to have happened to the people in the New York Magazine article. I tend to assume all these people who claim Cooper was their husband/uncle/neighbor/etc. are kooks, but what if one of them is really right?

Oh, and if any homeland security people are monitoring ... that thing about blowing up the moon: it's all a joke.

564 The other option is, maybe somebody did put two and two together, but just didn't want to ruin the guy's good time.

565 Tony Jackson wrote something similar, but hedged:

With the return of Nomar Garciaparra from the disabled list, the Dodgers finally were utilizing a lineup that somewhat resembled what they thought they would have on Opening Day.

Which I guess means any combo of Kemp, Ethier, Pierre and no DeWitt.

And someone named Mike Scarr, apparently filling in for Gurnick runs with the same idea as his lede:

It wasn't until Day 15 of the regular season but manager Joe Torre was finally treated to the lineup he envisioned this spring.

Let's test out our laser on Dane Cook, just to make sure it works.

I no longer have the big iron on my hip

Texas Red would be a good name for Kent.

Tomorrow's pitching match-up:

Derek Lowe vs.

wait for it.......

Buddy Carlyle

573 - Any chance that fill-in writer has a bumbling-but-faithful sidekick named "Dwigt?"

I went to Laserium once.

This could be the best 15 game stretch of Rafael Furcal's career:

.407/.500/.695

59 Abs.

Furcal is currently BABIPing at a .458 clip.

Sorry to be late, but from the Chinese folks here in Honolulu:

Gwo Hongzhur

Furcal is often this good. Hu, while likely to have a fine career, will probably never have 15 games this good in his life.

Last year Furcal had a 15-game stretch of .435/.500/.548.

In '06 he had one 15-game stretch where he went .406/.449/.734 and a different one where he went .448/.469/.810.

Eric dont you wish your '88 DVD had regular season games as well? Man, I'd really be jealous. Where did you order it if you dont mind me asking?

That was Eric Stephen. Alas, I'm still relying on old VHS recordings for my 1988 fix.

582 -- And it would be pretty darn silly to base a decision like what we with Furcal when he hits free agency based on a 15 game stretch of games, whether it is a good or bad stretch. Baseball America's Jim Callis was asked in his ESPN chat today if he thought the Dodgers should let Hu replace Furcal after this year. He said yes, and I doubt he is oblivious to Furcal's hot start.

585 The '88 DVD is at Costco for < $40.

587 -- Make that YESTERDAY'S ESPN chat.

587

Another 2006 would be good enough.

Any chance Furcal would accept arbitration if offered? Obviously we'll offer it since we have nothing to lose either way, but I wonder if he might actually take it.

585
I ordered it from Amazon because I had a gift card.

591 -- Only ending up with numbers like his 2007 numbers would make Furcal accept arbitration. Unless he gets hurt again I'm sure Furcal will at least do WELL in 2008 as a whole, and the better he does, the bigger his contract demands will be, in terms of both money and length. I think his demands are going to end up being extremely unreasonable for a team that has Hu waiting to play SS full time in the majors.

But do they need Hu to play second? Abreu is looking less and less likely to be Kent's replacement.

I can't imagine Ned going with Hu and Abreu up the middle.

There's something off about this latest post on the PE blog:

>>James Loney has extended his hitting streak to 15 games to start the season. Juan Pierre and Rafael Furcal had team-high hitting streaks of 15 games last season. Loney's is the longest streak since Nomar Garciaparra hit in 22 straight in 2006.<<

See if you can figure out what it is.

Exactly. Losing both Kent and Furcal for next season is gonna hurt. Furcal will probably be way too overpriced and a 6 year deal is not a good idea - but on the other hand, if you're going to overpay for someone, I'd rather it be Furcal. Too bad we already overpaid for someone else.

597 everyone thought Furcal was overpaid last time when the contract was handed out. Although I really don't want anyone other than our young guys signed for 6 yrs.

595 Ned isn't the only one who would be uncomfortable with Hu and Abreu up the middle. During ST I would have been fine with it, but I'm less inclined to count on Abreu for anything now. Kent and Furcal have been two of our best offensive threats. While I suspect offense will be made up elsewhere it is still a scary thought.

598 Everyone who thought that was wrong.

Furcal is at least equivelant to Jeter and Michael Young right now, and they're both getting absurd amounts of money. Furcal will get that, and deserve it.

596
Wouldn't Loney's streak be the longest since the aforementioned streaks of 2007?

Yeah it seems unlikely that Furcal will return. Hu seems more valuable as an SS than a 2B, anyway, right? There's still a season's worth for Abreu to try to make a better impression. I guess Delwyn is out of the picture at 2B. How are the free agent 2B?

I have a ton of respect for Furcal as a guy who came to LA on a somewhat controversial high priced free agency signing and responded with the best year of his career. That doesn't happen to the D's very often.
The list is very short actually- id be curious to see it.
I give him a pass for last year due to the fluky injury and being rushed back too early.... it hurt to watch him try to play last year, I guess we will see how this year goes, but it looks good so far.
Love to see Furcal-Hu up the middle.

The latest FJM entry takes a look at a piece of writing in which the author begins by claiming that Sabean is a better GM than Beane, then proceeds to present evidence in support of this claim that pretty much demonstrates the opposite.

598 -"everyone thought Furcal was overpaid last time"

That's not true at all. Many people felt that the contract was Colletti's biggest stroke of genius. Even the BP folks who look critically at the Dodgers thought so.

601
How are the free agent 2B?

Per Cot's Baseball Contracts, here is next year's FA class:

Second Basemen
Jamey Carroll * CLE
Ray Durham SF
Mark Ellis OAK
Marcus Giles COL
Mark Grudzielanek KC
Orlando Hudson ARZ
Jeff Kent LAD
Felipe Lopez WAS
D'Angelo Jimenez STL
Pablo Ozuna * CWS
Nick Punto MIN
Jose Valentin NYM
Jose Vidro * SEA

Ellis, Hudson, and a bunch of crap.

* Note: the star means that player has a 2009 option in his contract.

599 maybe my point wasn't clear, but that's what I getting at. I don't think anyone believes that contract was bad now. While I'm uneasy giving Furcal that many years (not saying he does or doesn't deserve them) I'm not sure what choice we have right now. Other than Hu-Furcal and Hu-Abreu, what are we looking at?

Miguel Tejada admits he is 33, not 31.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/5708800.html

602
*I have a ton of respect for Furcal as a guy who came to LA on a somewhat controversial high priced free agency signing and responded with the best year of his career. That doesn't happen to the D's very often.
The list is very short actually- id be curious to see it.*

Kirk Gibson's 1988 for one springs to mind. Not just for the postseason heroics, but he did post a career high in OPS+. Oh yeah, and he scored from 2nd on a wild pitch to win a game! :)

605
Likely Colletti targets:

Ray Durham SF
Marcus Giles COL
Mark Grudzielanek KC
Jeff Kent LAD

607
"The thing is I didn't want Houston to find out from somebody else," he said. "I wanted to find out just from my face. I'm a man and I'm responsible for everything."

But not so much of a responsible man that you wanted them to find out just from your face before they gave you the contract...

609 I'd give Ned more credit than that.

610
Technically, Houston didn't give him the contract, but rather they traded for it.

607 That's interesting, since the authors who wrote this biography...

http://tinyurl.com/3zta8s

...followed Tejada in the Dominican from about the time he was 13. He must have started using a false age really early on.

598 Why shouldn't Furcal get what he deserves from us rather than from another team?

It's pretty obvious that it's a seller's market for free agents now and for the foreseeable future. They can get not only a lot of money, but longer contracts than teams want them for ideally. That's the nature of the game. They get these "insurance" years at the end of the contract when they probably won't be worth those large sums, but that's the only way to get them now, in their prime. Does anyone think that Alex Rodriguez will really be worth 25 million 10 years from now? Unless, of course, inflation catches up. But even then, he'll surely be several years past his prime.

We're so used to getting vets way too late, in their declining years. For those to be even marginally useful, they need to be short contracts. (And even then, we criticize Colletti for getting them.) To get a great player in his prime, you just have to pay for what will probably be the beginning of his decline, over the rates (probably), in order to sew him up for his good years when he's a known quantity. When the time comes, IF we have a better youngster waiting in the wings, we trade him and pay par of his salary to a team that needs to him as a stopgap.

We do not have anyone better than Furcal anywhere near ready, as far as I am aware. It will be worth signing him on to a few extra years if we need to. Otherwise, some other team will.

How much do we have coming off the books at the end of this year?

Kent?
Furcal?
Lowe?
Loaiza?
Nomar?

Loaiza is replaceable with league min. Kent probably is replaceable with (Hu/Abreu). Lowe is a tougher one, but we do have some good young pitchers in the minors. Nomar is replaceable with young talent (LaRoche/DeWitt). There should be money in the coffers to sign Furcal if that's the direction we want to go. Am I missing anything else?
vr, Xei

604 I knew someone would call me on saying "everyone". I get in trouble with my wife whenever I say "you always..." While I agree there were many who thought it was an acceptable contract I also recall what seemed to be a louder sentiment that it was not good and Ned getting some grief for it initially. I think that sentiment softened quickly though.

I would like to see the "Blake DeWitt at 2B" experiment revisted. You can say that experiment was tried and it failed, but I doubt he was as bad defensively at 2B as Jeff Kent is now and has been for a while. The problem is there is a double standard for young players and old players. The sins of the PVL's are always forgiven.

Vidro doesn't play 2nd any more. I doubt he could do it full time (maybe a spot start).

Question: let's say we use a 4-outfielder (Ethier, Jones, Kemp, Pierre) platoon for the entire season.

Given that all 4 players will still be under Dodger control next season, can you envision us keeping all 4 players and doing the same thing next year?

614 I never said we shouldn't.

I get in trouble with my wife whenever I say "you always..."

Extreme generalizations are not a good idea. They're usually inaccurate, and thus don't work in your favor. They allow the other person to avoid the point you're trying to make and focus instead on identifying the ways in which your generalization is wrong.

615
Here's what I came up with a few months back for 2009:

Let's look at the likely 2009 payroll to see where the Dodgers stand (I'm making some assumptions, but bear with me):

Starters
C - Martin - $3.5m (estimated as "Super Two" arb)
1B - Loney - $500k (3rd year)
2B - Abreu - $400k (2nd year)
SS - Hu - $400k (rookie)
3B - LaRoche - $400k (2nd year)
LF - Ethier - $2.5m (estimated as "Super Two" arb)
CF - Andruw - $17.1m
RF - Kemp - $500k (3rd year)
Total Starters - $25.3m

Bench
OF - Pierre - $10m
OF - Repko - $1m (2nd year arb)
C - John Q. Backstop - $1m
1B - Mark Sweeney Type - $1m
IF - Lucille II Type - $1m
Total Bench - $14m

Starting Pitching
Penny - $9.25m (option picked up -- I've seen this reported as low as $8.75m)
Billingsley - $500k (3rd year)
Kuroda - $10m
Schmidt - $15.5m
Kuo - $500k (3rd year)
Total Starting Pitching - $37.75m

Bullpen
Saito - $6m (1st year arb eligible)
Broxton - $2m (1st year arb eligible)
Proctor - $2m (2nd year arb eligible)
Brazoban - $1.5m (2nd year arb eligible)
Meloan - $400k (2nd year)
Seanez Type - $1m
McDonald Type - $400k
Total Bullpen - $12.9m

Chaff
Nomar - $1.25m (part of deferred signing bonus)
Loaiza - $375k (optioni buyout)
Furcal - $4m (deferred signing bonus)
Total Chaff - $5.625m

Total 2009 Payroll (estimated) - $95.575m

The Dodgers could certainly afford Sabathia or extending Furcal, but it's not like we have a windfall of cash to spend.

I'll have to find 2010, but we might only be in the $60s right now.

619 - Maybe by that time someone will be desperate enough to make a trade, or we'll realize Pierre is the 4th outfielder, or Andruw could just explode and go Odalis on us.

605 - and internal options for second base? Besides Abreu/Hu?

I'm just spit balling here, but could DeWitt and/or LaRoche make the move to second?

Hu
Kemp
Ethier
Loney
Jones
LaRoche
Martin
DeWitt
(pitcher)

seems like a pretty decent line up for a few years to come

622
Here's a quick estimate of 2010, with some erroneous assumptions made of course:

Starters
C - Martin - $8m (4th year; 2nd year arb)
1B - Loney - $3.5m (1st year arb)
2B - Abreu - $500k (3rd year)
SS - Hu - $400k (2nd year)
3B - LaRoche - $500k (3rd year)
LF - Ethier - $4m (4th year; 2nd year arb)
CF - Pierre - $10m
RF - Kemp - $3.5m (1st year arb)
Total Starters - $30.4m

Bench
OF - Delwyn Young - $500k (3rd year -- I think I left him off 2009)
OF - Repko - $2m (3rd year arb)
C - John Q. Backstop - $1m
1B - Mark Sweeney Type - $1m
IF - Lucille II Type - $1m
Total Bench - $5.5m

Starting Pitching
Billingsley - $4m (1st year arb)
Kuroda - $13m
Kershaw - $400k (1st full year)
Kuo - $1m (1st year arb)
Withrow/Elbert - $400k
Total Starting Pitching - $18.8m

Bullpen
Broxton - $4m (2nd year arb)
Proctor - $3m (3rd year arb)
Brazoban - $2.5m (3rd year arb)
Meloan - $500k (3rd year)
Seanez Type - $1m
Seanez Type - $1m
McDonald Type - $500k
Total Bullpen - $12.5m

Detritus
Nomar - $1.25m (part of deferred signing bonus)
Total Detritus - $1.25m

Total 2010 Payroll (estimated) - $68.45m

621 but you always say that.

Yeah I know, it was a slip of the toungue. I do try to avoid those generalizations, but I do slip from time to time. I'm not always perfect :)

624
Is Hu any more qualified to bat leadoff than Pierre...?

Hu's career minor league:
.299/.345/.424/.769

Pierre's career major league:
.301/.348/.374/.722

616 - I don't think this was a case of "everyone" being incorrect on a technicality. I think there was a strong - though certainly not universal - sentiment that getting Furcal on a three-year deal was well worth the dollars.

In the DT archives from December 2005, I hedged my bets. "Again, to sum up - as an individual signing, the Dodgers are overpaying for Furcal. But we really just can't evaluate the signing until we see the other moves the team is making. Signing Furcal to this contract is a calculated risk, with potential of both reward and failure. It's too soon to know." But I also wrote, "Is this Furcal acquisition like getting the Delino DeShields of daydreams without trading a Pedro Martinez for him?"

Here's a comment from the thread:

15. natepurcell
the furcal deal is getting a lot of different reactions.

it seems, the sabre minded, pro depo supporters like this move....

I'm sure Joe or whoever can figure out that Hu isn't a lead-off hitter. He doesn't exude "speedy base-stealer" the way Pierre does.

614 -- Will Hu be as good an all-around player as Furcal in 2009? I doubt it. But I bet Hu will be as good as Furcal in 2010, and probably better than him starting in 2011 and continuing on. Furcal isn't even as good as Hu defensively right now.

So soon we forget. Why did Lasorda trade away Paul Konerko? Because Karros was having the best year of his career and Konerko, at that moment in time, didn't appear to be nearly as good as Karros, who was just entering his 30's and was not expected to decline as fast as he did. So here we are again. History about to repeat itself as it tends to do. Furcal is as hot as Hell itself and we all love him for it, but that just makes it all the more imperative to let reason and not emotion guide our actions. I say Campanis had the right idea when he said better to get rid of a player a year too early than a year too late.

2005-12-03 21:53:41
39. Steve
I think everyone agrees that Furcal is not going to be worth what he is getting paid. But at three years, he doesn't kill you. Now the question is who you surround him with. If you surround him with Izturis and Pierre, you're screwed. If you surround him with Bradley, Kent, and another solid platoon at first, you may have something.

630
I say we trade Hu and Justin Orenduff for Jason Isringhausen. Tommy told me bullpens win championships! :)

627 - eh, hadn't looked at Hu's career numbers, just put him lead off because he looks like a lead off hitter to me.

I guess that would make Martin the lead of man, a la Kendell in his prime

631
Wow, Stevestradamus!

2005-12-03 22:15:32
54. Steve
I'm stunned at how well I'm taking all of this.

just put him lead off because he looks like a lead off hitter to me

You could be a major league manager...!

The length of this thread is making loading the page on my laptop like loading it on my Treo.

2005-12-03 22:52:59

85. regfairfield
I'm not terribly excited about this. While it is far from the worst case scenario, it seems like money could have been better spent elsewhere.

Is anyone else concerned that Furcal set his career high in WARP by 3 this year? If it turns out he was just trying to get a contract, there is basically no difference between him and AP.

There's some great material here:

"It's something that happened the first time I signed my contract," Tejada said. "I had no intention of doing anything wrong. And now I feel like I'm 25 years old, maybe younger. I feel my legs are stronger than I used to be feeling. I feel great. I have a lot of energy."

For what it's worth, PECOTA has Hu becoming the better player in 2011. Since a lot of their value comes from defense, however, and PECOTA's defensive modeling is terrible, this probably doesn't matter. PECOTA is decent at projecting offense, and Furcal as the better hitter until 2009, it has Hu catching Furcal in 2010 and surpassing him in 2013.

Going by those numbers, it really does make no sense to re-sign him. However, PECOTA doesn't know Furcal was hurt last year, but hi projection isn't much worse than a natural regression from his 2007 projection.

dude says it's not a problem. so it's not a problem....

628 my saying "everyone" was not meant to critisize anyone here or elsewhere. My point was that signing him to what looks like an excessive contract now may end up looking favorable in the long run and was using his last contract as a point of reference.

I really was not trying to argue whether people here felt it was a bad contract or not.

638 In my defense, I had no idea what I was talking about back then.

Tejada cited in Mitchell report for steroid and HGH use

Tejada: "I had no intention of doing anything wrong"

Tejada lies about age

Tejada: "I had no intention of doing anything wrong"

638
OK, I feel dumb. Who was AP? Not Pujols, was it?

The trouble with letting Furcal go is this: He is our leadoff hitter. The powers that be are going to want a "traditional" leadoff hitter in that top spot, that is, someone with a lot of speed. Guess who that means, guys? It means we're stuck with Pierre because he's our only "leadoff hitter." So we better be praying that they are able to keep Furcal because then Pierre is expendable, even to the baseball traditionalists.

please, everyone, forgive my use of "everyone" it was unintentional

Who was AP?

Antonio Perez, I presume.

Antonio Perez

I really would have prefered that he didn't know that.

645 Antonio Perez?

Opinions vary depending on what is happening in the moment.
Furcal signs 3 year deal
November 2005 - everyone loves the 3 year deal
May 2006 - Furcal sucks, Ned's an idiot
Sept 2006 - Furcal ends up awesome, Ned's best move
Sept 2007 - another bad move by Ned
April 2008 - Ned's best signing, we should resign him and negate the great signing with a bad signing.

A Jones
Jan 2008 - 1/2 the camp says it was a good signing, Joe Sheehan of BP says it was the best FA signing of the winter. 1/2 the camp led by D4P say it was another Ned blunder
April 2008 - the 1/2 camp who liked the deal is now down to 1/10 and everyone is kicking a man known for long slumps while he's down. He's booed beyond belief by a crowd who has seen him get maybe 50 at bats.
Sept 2008 - the 9/10 camp of April will learn the lessons that sometimes slumps look awful but to read to much into it is a waste of time. Or the 1/10 crowd learns that sometimes a player just loses it. I'm betting against the 9/10 crowd.

647 - Forgiven :)

636 - well, if the whole practice of law thing doesn't work out...

650
OK, now I feel dumber. I figured you meant Furcal was no different than AP by selfishly playing for a new contract, but then I thought Antonio Perez never played for a contract.

Reading the statement now, something like 10 minutes (or 28 months!) later, I get what you were trying to say.

Cue the Fredo "I can handle things, I'm smaaaat!" clip for me.

652 Hey TC if I can't say everyone hated it then you can't say everyone loved :)

638
It wasn't just Andrew who was drinking the AP koolaid back in the day. Many posters no longer here felt he was going to be the guy even though he had no supporting peripherals for such a stance. 2005 was a strange time.
The fact that we had to talk about players like Edwards, Philips, Grabowksi, AP and others is something I hope we don't have to go through again.

maybe I was just only able to remember back to May of 2006

657

SOME people tend to overestimate home grown talent/potential and assume proven performers are replicable by near equivalent minor league numbers projected.

I was wondering why I didn't post anything about the Furcal signing, I realized I was gambling in Vegas at that time.

Looking back, its funny how certain players names got brought up like how signing Furcal protected prospects from being dealt for guys like Julio Lugo, or Nate proclaiming that only Adam Dunn could be considered for Joel Guzman.

There were questions about who we could get for Izzy around the deadline (Greg Maddux).

And Canuck and Nate were discussing which high school pitcher the Dodgers should draft and no, the Minotaur's name was not mentioned.

I probably chimed in a few days later when I got back but those were interesting times back then.

622, 625.

Why are Repko and Brazoban on the list--making $4.5 million combined in 2010?

This years Hollywood Stars game is scheduled for June 21st. On that day we play Cleveland at 12:55pm. In the past, the Stars game has always preceded the Dodger game. Are they switching in around this year, or will there be a 9:30 am first pitch? Anyone know?

657 When Oscar Robles is your #3 hitter you get desperate fantasies.

BTW - It wasn't until I reread that thread that I knew AP was Antonio "soon to be tossed into the Bradley trade" Perez.

Don't know what/whether I commented on it at the time, but I was solidly against the Furcal signing. I felt it was overkill -- we had a shortstop (Izturis) -- and extreme overpayment.

The market has changed a lot since then, probably in small part because of the per-year amount given to Furcal.

Looking back, there were tons of obvious signs that his offense was a fluke, namely the .381 BABIP, but also a flukish line drive rate for him.

His defense, at least according to zone rating, was off the charts good though, which is pretty surprisng.

665 Remember that Izturis was out until at least the middle of 2006 and he was also coming back from an unusual (for a position player) injury recovery from TJ surgery.

661
It's more of a placeholder than anything, but it's not out of the realm of possibility that both Repko & Brazoban will be around for their final year of pre-free agency in 2010.

This game is really the only thing I remember of Antonio Perez, but it was a doozy. I remember watching it a sports bar full of Mets fans, who were getting more and more pumped/obnoxious with each pitch:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/LAN/LAN200508140.shtml

I walked out of the bar that day with a very triumphant smile on my face.

Then again, his defense went down to off the charts terrible the next year. 2005 was just a massive fluke all around for him.

I don't get the point of the latest post at Juice Blog.

657 - I was a huge AP booster.

And there was nothing wanting him to get more play time over Robles and Edwards.

Anyone know of a good place to look up Dodger records by month, or records for a one-month period? I might have to actually buy the media guide this year! :)

Furcal is capable of being an offensive force. He is in his prime now and healthy and this is how good he is. He is one of the best players in baseball.

Throw out last year because he played injured. 2006, the second half, he was playing at pretty much the level he's playing at now, and he did it for three months. It's not a fluke.

Hu in his dreams never approaches this level in his prime, let alone the next few years. This conversation is ridiculous.

675 So Furcal has one year of injury, three months and 15 days of being the best player in baseball, and three months of being one of the worst. Why do you give the three months and 15 days more weight?

622 625 Why did the chaff turn into detritus? And what will it be called in 2011? I have to know!

675 The next few years ARE Hu's prime. We're talking about 2010, not now.

The reason for my question in 674 is that Furcal has 15 runs scored in April, with 12 games remaining. I wanted to know what the club record is for runs scored in April, or in any month.

Just perusing through some individual players' splits on Baseball-Reference.com I have found so far the following high run months on LA Dodger history:

Davey Lopes, May 1979 - 29 runs
Maury Wills, May 1962 - 28
Pedro Guerrero, June 1985 - 27
Shawn Green, June 2002 - 27

669 I was at that game. Werth and AP sucked the wind out of Pedro's sails real quick. Was also hot as hell that day so a win was a nice touch. However considering the way 2005 ended up might have been better to see a no-no.

669 Wow just looked at the pitching stats for that game. Brad Penny with a win and a complete game. I totally dont remember any of that.

679

Now, what was it Vin brought up about the Dodgers' Record when Raffy scores a run? It was some ridiculous number, something like an .800 winning percentage when he scores.

Furcal is at least equivelant to Jeter and Michael Young right now, and they're both getting absurd amounts of money. Furcal will get that, and deserve it.

Furcal's not equivalent to Jeter.

Furcal's career line: .286/.351/.411
Jeter's: .324/.388/.462

You have a point about Michael Young, but how much exactly does he make? Just because 1 team overpays for their player, doesnt mean the Dodgers need to as well.

Furcal, on the wrong side of 30, would be very fiscally irresponsible to extend at his current rate. Now sure, overpaying for him (since he's a pretty good player), is better than overpaying for crap like Ned has done in the past. But in the end, its still valuing someone more than what they need to be valued at.

Traditional slap hitters that arent exactly OBP machines are not worth 13 mils a year.

I'm sure there will be something more worthwhile to spend 13 mils/yr on.

If the Dodgers get a good year out of Furcal, they should thank him for his services and be happy they got 2 out of 3 good years out of him. The same thing should happen with Lowe as well.

679
I haven't yet found any LA Dodger April to beat Davey Lopes' 24 runs in April 1975, so I'm sticking with that for Furcal to shoot for until I find out otherwise.

682 - I've heard him mention that, but considering that the Dodgers when about 55-60 percent of their games when anyone scores, wouldn't most people do well in that category?

671 I dunno, but Eric S's comment on it cracked me up. Touché, Eric!

683 Jeter is the worst defensive shortstop in baseball, Furcal is one of the best.

Also note that Jeter's power has declined the last four years.

How are the free agent 2B?

Trade for Dan Uggla.
You get the power back that you are losing in Kent, plus he wont cost very much.

with Earth Day fast approaching I thought I'd share a discussion from dinner the other night. My 9 yr old daughter is becomming environmentally concerned and was chastising my 4 yr old daughter for using too many paper towels to dry her hands in the bathroom.

She told her that when she grows up and there aren't any tress left it will be all her (4yr old) fault. And that if there are any trees left it's because she (9 yr old) saved them.

Id give Jeter a little edge, although he plays in a much better hitters park and his career avg is a little lower than that.

689
Are these paper towels in a public restroom, or at home...?

Going by +/-, Furcal saved 99.4 more runs with his glove than Jeter from 2005-2007.

691 public restroom

Jeter has no edge over Furcal right now nor for the next few years, that's the important point. What Jeter did 5 years ago doesn't matter much when comparing them right now. The argument that Furcal will gradually decline as Jeter has though, has merit, certainly. But for right now, and for next couple of years, Furcal is easily the best choice on offense and defense over Jeter and Young imho. The question is, is he worth the risk and expense to lock up longer than that. I still say, I'd rather have Hu and Furcal up the middle next year, than Hu and {random FA second basemen). I'd also be willing to give DeWitt or LaRoche a shot at 2nd.

Why did Furcal take a 3-year deal anyway? Is it just because we "overpaid" to get a short-term deal? Could we do it again?

692 What is .4 of a run? Getting thrown out at 2nd?

683 -- JoeyP and I agree about something. As Jim said in an episode of The Office, "Universe, you win."

688 -- And just like that, God is back in his heaven and all is again right with the world.

696 Using my own math, every play a middle infielder makes saves .789 of a run.

695 I consider 3yrs/$51mil as the bottom of what he'll get for his next contract. And he'd be lauded for taking a "hometown" discount.

675
What part of the conversation is ridiculous?
The part where not choosing to pay a player in his 30's 15-20 million a year and replace him with a guy making the minimum who can replicate the defense, and whose offense other then stolen bases might surpass the 15-20 million dollar guy in the 3rd year of the deal?

I like Rafy Furcal and felt he would have a break out year but I'm also not keen on breaking the bank on a speed SS in his 30's. We've already seen how valuable his legs are to his game. He's played 13 months on his contract and been highly productive 5 of those months because of leg issues. That is someone you want to gamble a 5 year mega million deal on? Not me, so if I'm ridiculous then so be it.

I'd be more then happy with a Loney, Ellis, Hu, LaRoche/DeWitt infield and spend the money elsewhere. An Ellis/Hu combo up the middle would be better then the Izzy/Cora days with offense to boot.

Now if Rafy would sign a two year deal, I'd be all over that.

687--Jeter's SLG'ing been fairly consistent the last 5yrs:
03-.450
04-.471
05-.450
06-.483
07-.452

I think it is more hyperbole or judgemental to conclude that Jeter's the worst SS in the major leagues:

His last 4 seasons of Rate 2:
04- 93
05- 103
06- 108
07- 98

Sure, Jeter is overpaid. But thats because the Yankees overpaid just about all their core guys when they resigned them all.

694

There isnt all that much decline in Jeters #s. Last year was pretty much right on his career avgs (yes SLG down from 5 years ago)
2006 I think he was 2nd or 3rd in MVP voting with a very good year.

682
The Dodgers are 112-53 (.679 win%) when Furcal scores a run:

2006: 56-30 (.651)
2007: 50-18 (.735)
2008: 6-5 (.545)

For comparison, the Dodgers are 48-27 (.640) when Pierre scores a run:

2007: 47-27 (.635)
2008: 1-0 (1.000)

Speaking of potential middle infielders, what's the take on De Jesus?

700 -- I could live with a two-year deal for Furcal, but no longer than that, and even that is contingent on Furcal doing so well the rest of this season that he would surely take an offer of a two-year contract as a grave insult. So, we go with Hu.

True, Jeter was great pretty recently. I think I was thinking more that he's on his downswing now.

I'd be happy with Mark Ellis. Not Kent's power, but very solid all around, always underrated. Okay, Hu and Ellis. With the Minotaur pitching, we don't need that much power up the middle. ;-)

704 -- DeJesus is is going to be an MLB SS for somebody. Good defense and hits for average, but has Cesar Izturis power. However, he also walks a lot, so that distinguishes him big time from Izturis.

703
To make that comparison fair, seems like you'd only want to consider games in which both players played.

This was prob already covered at some point… but not a bad Meloan outing yest. Control still an issue.

705
Exactly, he'd have to suck in 2008 to take a two year deal. Basically if he has the 2006 2nd half season in 2008 we should expect him to break the bank via free agency and we should not get involved because we do have a legitimate replacement.

Now I have to admit everything I know about Hu's defense is built on scouting. I've haven't seen enough of his game to make any kind of an subjective opinion. However when all the scouts call him the best defensive infielder in the minors and Joe Sheehan foams at the mouth when talking about his defense then I'm going to go with the conventional wisdom that the guy can handle the rock. Offense can be made up elsewhere but I love a defensive SS. Probably from watching to much of Mark Belanger when I was young.

708
Not really. It was a direct answer to 682 , and I included Pierre for comparison because both are leadoffy types.

Much of this conversation [which we've had multiple times--I think it's the high post numbers making us dizzy] depends on what LaRoche does when he returns. If he establishes himself as a dependable offensive force, I think it would make the decision to go with Hu next year an easier one. In that scenario, we'd still have DeWitt (or possibly Abreu) to fill in at 2b. In terms of free agents, Hudson's likely to be nearly as expensive as Furcal, but Ellis might be affordable. As good as Furcal is, we have someone ready to take over his position.

there is basically no difference between him and AP.

ouch.

703. Just out of curiousity, what is the Dodgers record in a game where "a pitcher" scored a run? vr, Xei

712
We would also be prepared to take an offensive hit at SS and/or 2B if -- and I realize this is a big if -- Andruw reverts to some semblance of the hitter he was just a few years ago.

We just passed Babe Ruth on the post numbers, can we pass Aaron, Bonds and Oh?
vr, Xei

711
Setting aside that "team record when Player X scores" is probably a meaningless stat, it's especially meaningless when you compare two players without looking only at games in which both players played. For one thing, Furcal's record is probably hurt by having Pierre also in the lineup (instead of, say, Kemp), whereas Pierre's record is probably helped by having Furcal also in the lineup (instead of, say, Lucille II).

705
Hey Canuck if you ever get a scouting report on Jonathan Dutton from the Great Lakes team can you pass it on to me.

667 - Yes, I recall. Which was why I supported (if memory serves) signing Garciaparra to play SS until Izturis healed, at which point Nomar would move to 3B. Seems like we had a fellow at 1B that never got an opportunity to play for Jim Tracy, but I can't recall his name.

Any chance Kent signs on to play another year with us? Has he said for sure he retires after this year? vr, Xei

710 Does Hu's talent allow him to become a great second baseman, if we decided to keep Furcal?

Or could Furcal, as he ages, move to second?

I don't see an heir to Kent in our system that could leave us better off than a Hu-Furcal middle infield.

I tend to agree that Furcal is a Jeter-level player and would be worth signing to whatever the market demands. I'd rather McCourt sink a lot of money into a great-hitting everyday shortstop than almost anything else, at least until Martin, Loney and Chad become eligible for FA.

Furcal is not just a great hitter for 15 days at a time. He is a great hitter, period, except when he's trying to play on a bad leg.

714
Last year the Dodgers were 14-2 when a pitcher scored a run, and they are 1-0 this year.

http://www.bb-ref.com/pi/shareit/M78N

720 Doubtful. Got the feeling this will be his last year. Plus, well, Kent would make a good DH for someone next year. His range at second keeps decreasing.

NPUT

722. That's the type of win% I was hoping to see, but a little light on the sample size.
vr, Xei

We didn't pass Aaron.
vr, Xei

717
I'm not arguing that it wasn't a meaningless stat, but feel free to spend the extra time searching through game logs for when both players played. One thing I know for sure: Every game Furcal scored a run, Pierre played.

It seems like you argue just to argue, even over frivolous crap like this.

717
I really agree with your Tejada comments. How he can say that crap with a straight face. I hope the Orioles sue him and I'm irritated that I ever advocated trading for his lying butt. It is one thing to lie to get to the big leagues, but once he's proven he's belongs, he has to come clean, especially after the age gate thing.
Or at least when you do come clean don't make any side comments about manning up or doing the right thing. Just admit you pulled a con game on the Orioles and while your sad they were fleeced, your enjoying the money they sent your way.

Using my own math, every play a middle infielder makes saves .789 of a run

Intuitively, that doesnt make sense.
That'd be like every time a batter makes one more single, instead of making an out, it would mean he'd be .789 runs better than he was before. Would that be true too?

Take a player that has 600Abs, and that player gets two more infield singles instead of outs---that he's going to be 1.57 runs better than he was before. How can two singles as opposed to outs create 1.57 runs?

How accurate are pure judgment calls be when analyzing defensive ability on a +/- system?

Its like someone can come up with any type of defensive statistic to explain what we already know, when really there isnt an additional explanation necessary.

Preventing runs comes down to the pitcher preventing HRs, preventing XBH, and preventing walks. If you run a regression with runs allowed against HRs, XBH, BBs, and then just say singles allowed--->I think its rather obvious which are going to be significant variables and which would not be.

If preventing singles (which by most cases means better infield defense) is not as significant as the other variables, then why put so much emphasis on it?

I heard an argument on here the other day that Greg Maddux wouldnt be a good pitcher with the Dodger defense behind him. But what made Maddux a great pitcher was that he didnt allow home runs and didnt walk people, two things where defense doesnt come into play.

Sure there's a marginal value in everything surrounding baseball--> including defense. But I think's its being mis-evaluated by some in the statistics community.

Maybe my developed bias from the Beltre/Cora/Izturis year is clouding my judgment on the issue...but no one will ever convince me to put so much emphasis on defense when there are clearly other more significant variables in preventing runs---that are much easier to see and less subjectively explained and analyzed.

719 the same guy that couldn't stick anywhere after leaving the Dodgers.

730- Clever gambit, dropping that at the end of the thread. Little did you know I'd be around to read it, and shame you.

SHAME!