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About Jon
Thank You For Not ...

1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with

Jones Watch
2008-05-20 17:23
by Jon Weisman
Note: The Dodger Thoughts blog has moved to the Los Angeles Times.

From Diamond Leung at the Press-Enterprise:

"Whether the bad habit sort of caused (the cartilage tear) or the injury caused him to (collapse his back leg), it's the chicken or the egg with that one," Manager Joe Torre said. "I'm guessing there has to be a connection." Trainer Stan Conte said it is more likely that the cartilage tear, usually the result of twisting and turning motions, came because of gradual wear and tear and said the Dodgers had previously done examinations that didn't reveal anything at that time. ...

* * *

Reds at Dodgers, 7:10 p.m.

Comments (303)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-05-20 17:35:56
1.   gpellamjr
Did I miss something? Is Jones officially going on the DL?
2008-05-20 17:36:42
2.   scareduck
188 etc. in the prior thread - I agree with you, JT Dutch. I DON'T think this is over-interpreting what Torre is saying, i.e. there is a kink in Torre's mind about DeWitt's worth, and that Nomar is still ahead of DeWitt in Torre's mental depth chart. I got LAT'd in one of the previous posts, but it took 70-something games before Loney dislodged Nomar at first. It'll likely take a similar number of games before DeWitt dislodges Nomar.
2008-05-20 17:37:55
3.   Zak
Another Dodger examination revealed nothing at the time.
2008-05-20 17:38:15
4.   Jon Weisman
1 - No, you missed nothing.
2008-05-20 17:38:56
5.   Zak
Here's hoping that no Dodger has a day as bad as Jeter's day today.
2008-05-20 17:40:59
6.   Jon Weisman
2 et al - Look, I don't think I need to make it more clear that I think Garciaparra does not deserve to start. But these things should be judged by degrees. They are not black and white. Yes, the kids should get more of the benefit of the doubt. But things could be worse. And DeWitt is just one of the worst examples around to make the case for the kids getting mistreated.
2008-05-20 17:42:42
7.   Bluebleeder87
Hendy just got a hit! (texas leaguer but still) Florida leads the D-Backs 2-1 5th inning.
2008-05-20 17:43:32
8.   scareduck
5 - in which way is his day especially bad? Making errors is what Jeter does, and hitting into double plays is part of the game, etc.
2008-05-20 17:43:46
9.   Bluebleeder87
what does et al mean?
2008-05-20 17:43:55
10.   JT Dutch
2

"but it took 70-something games before Loney dislodged Nomar at first."

... Exactly.

2008-05-20 17:44:04
11.   underdog
2 Assuming DeWitt hasn't already dislodged Nomar some 20-30 games ago.

Shouldn't this post's subject header be Druw Jones Industrial Average? Naw, never mind.

2008-05-20 17:44:52
12.   Howard Fox
re: Jones...this sounds like the typical Dodger trainer doublespeak...

what? we gave him a physical...did you see anything? I didn't see anything? was there anything there?

we should just peruse the previous year's 60 day DL listings and sign them to free agent contracts each year...that way we never have to worry about it...

2008-05-20 17:45:15
13.   scareduck
6 - understood, Jon, but Torre's comment is just bizarre.
2008-05-20 17:46:16
14.   Zak
8 Yeah, but that's also a scary looking hand injury.
2008-05-20 17:46:55
15.   Howard Fox
better yet, next time we are even considering a big money free agent signing, agree on a price, then instead put that money to the Mattel Hospital or Childrens Hospital...

at least that way some good use would come out of it...

2008-05-20 17:49:02
16.   Jon Weisman
2/6 - And frankly, there should be a kink in Torre's mind about DeWitt's worth. It's still under 150 plate appearances into DeWitt's career. We still don't know what his true value his. Yes, it's better than Nomar, but I think the jury's out on whether he's gonna OPS .900 for the next 10 years.

Torre's assessment of DeWitt was positive, especially when taken into context with the consistent praise he has offered. This doesn't mean that I think Nomar should start, and it doesn't mean Torre thinks Nomar should start. Torre goes with the hot hand. Blake was not a hot hand in April - he was winning plaudits by merely being competent.

If you're not acknowledging the different circumstances surrounding DeWitt between April and now, you're simply not being fair.

2008-05-20 17:51:37
17.   Bluebleeder87
just finished reading the Wikipedia page on Piazza & it has some cool fun facts, man, I would have been shaking in my little boots if the greatest hitter who ever lived were giving me hitting instructions.
2008-05-20 17:52:21
18.   Bob Timmermann
9
I think all Latin questions should be handled by gpellamjr since he can write it better than the Pope.

But "et al." is short for "et alii" which means "and others."

If all the others are feminine, it would be "et aliae."

And if all the others are neuter, then it's "et alia."

2008-05-20 17:52:42
19.   sporky
From T. Jackson (same lineup as yesterday, I believe):

LF Pierre
RF Ethier
C Martin
2B Kent
1B Loney
CF Kemp
3B DeWitt
SS Hu
RH Billingsley

2008-05-20 17:53:16
20.   Zak
About Jones, it's one thing where he snapped a ligament or sustained an injury or something. But if you're saying the cartilage tear has been coming for a long time now because of wear and tear, doesn't that somewhat fall on the medical examiners?

Also, how many MLers fail medical exams before signing a big contract? Too few to be true, if you ask me. Does that seem normal? Not trying to start a whole conspiracy thread here or anything, but is it not weird how often the physicals come back just fine?

2008-05-20 17:53:25
21.   Jon Weisman
13 - If you said to me "Jon, I don't think you're the greatest writer in the world, but I plan on reading you for a long time to come," I take that as a compliment. I don't know how you wouldn't, unless your expectations were too high.
2008-05-20 17:54:16
22.   Bob Timmermann
I would think every pro athlete would have joints that show some wear and tear. I think it's a fine art trying to decide what is acceptable.
2008-05-20 17:54:47
23.   Howard Fox
21 now that is funny...I hope you meant it to be...oops...
2008-05-20 17:54:58
24.   Bob Timmermann
Jon, you're the greatest writer in the world, but I refuse to read anything more you write.
2008-05-20 17:56:07
25.   KG16
How is it that Kent still gets to bat clean up? Right now, this is a bigger pet peeve of mine than Pierre leading off. Shouldn't anyone else in the 3-7 spots be batting clean up?

Or am I just old fashioned that way?

2008-05-20 17:57:05
26.   Jon Weisman
20 - It's not like you get MRIs every day. A wear-and-tear injury is what it implies - something that develops over time, in between checkups.

Teams have no incentive to pay injured players. I don't think it's as easy as you think it is to discover career-threatening problems.

2008-05-20 17:57:07
27.   gpellamjr
18 Optime amice optime! Superior omnibus me es. Usually, though, when they're all neuter, people say "etc".
2008-05-20 17:58:05
28.   Strike4
18
So "inter alia" means among neuters?
2008-05-20 17:58:24
29.   Howard Fox
given our history, I like my charity idea more and more...
2008-05-20 17:58:40
30.   Bob Timmermann
28
No, it doesn't.
2008-05-20 17:59:15
31.   gpellamjr
24 For a moment, I thought bluebleeder had said that. I was going to praise him to the heavens.
2008-05-20 17:59:33
32.   nick
hi underdog....yeah, terrible day for Jeter; no update yet but getting hit in the hand is an easy way to miss six weeks...

re. the Torre thing: I'm of the opinion that we all overthink what managers say: managers use words the way squid use ink....

2008-05-20 17:59:49
33.   MC Safety
Not sure which color alert for Edgar Renteria.

Maybe Bob could clarify.

2008-05-20 18:00:11
34.   Bluebleeder87
3-1 Florida on an absolute MAMMOTH shot by Uggla.
2008-05-20 18:00:44
35.   Howard Fox
but managers are so smart, just ask Tony LaRussa...
2008-05-20 18:02:31
36.   Zak
22 , 26 Totally agreed. Still, how many times do you hear about anyone failing a physical? I'm not being facetious.. I really can't remember the last one. I agree teams have no incentive to pay or sign an injured player, but that is not true about ML trainers. I hate sounding like a conspiracy nut, but an example would be Schmidt and Stan Conte. Is it not conceivable that they could be very good friends with old ties? Again, I'm just picking on Conte a bit irresponsibly, but it's amazing how these physicals are absolutely useless. Nomar passed one, Jones, Schmidt, Loaiza all passed them. Doesn't this at least bring Conte's reputation into question, or is it all bad luck?
2008-05-20 18:03:24
37.   Bob Timmermann
It's an orange alert for Edgar Renteria in Detroit.

Orange alert.

2008-05-20 18:04:58
38.   trainwreck
Chad Ford has the Clippers taking Westbrook over Gordon.
2008-05-20 18:05:43
39.   KG16
20 - part of the problem with some injuries (especially with ligaments, tendons, and cartilage) is that they aren't readily noticeable in the early stages. And unless the physical exam includes MRIs, x-rays, and a host of other pictures, you're likely not going to notice it until it becomes bad.

I messed up my shoulders pretty bad when I was younger. At first, I thought it was just tightness/soreness from going seven days a week at the time. I tried to power through it, as a young dumb kid, and likely developed tendinitis in both my shoulders. For a swimmer/water polo player, that's the equivalent of knee problems for any other sport. It took me sitting out a year to get my shoulders good, and even then I was only good for a single season. Today, I still occasionally get treatment when my shoulders tighten up.

And believe me, you become pretty good at faking the non-injury if it's a chronic thing. Long post short: Bob's right, it's like buying a used car; take a mechanic with you.

2008-05-20 18:05:59
40.   Bob Timmermann
Players will flunk physicals from time to time. It's usually just a matter of how much risk a team wishes to take.

The Yankees wouldn't take Greg Vaughn in a trade once because they didn't like something about him (I think it was a shoulder injury). He ended up playing for several more years.

2008-05-20 18:09:02
41.   regfairfield
J.D. failed one before signing with Boston.
2008-05-20 18:10:33
42.   Brent Knapp
21 23 But what if your wife/girlfriend said "you aren't the best in the world" (use your imagination)? I would not take that as a compliment. Hopefully DeWitt is mature ennough to know that Torre has had better (in A-Rod).
2008-05-20 18:14:54
43.   fanerman
42 In marriage, don't you choose your partner because he/she is the best for you? In baseball there are 30 teams and 30 starting 3rd basemen. You don't normally get to choose to have the team with the best one.
2008-05-20 18:15:22
44.   Jacob Burch
Ah, context.

"This kid, he's just been very tough. He may not be the greatest player in the world, but he is going to have a long career in this game as one of those special players that it's tough to win without."

2008-05-20 18:16:26
45.   Jacob Burch
As well:

"This kid has the calm of a veteran player," Torre said. "He's done some special things here in a short period of time.

2008-05-20 18:16:59
46.   underdog
32 Sorry about the game, man. There's always tomorrow! Or next week, or month...

And that's a great analogy, I dig it.

38 I wouldn't, but you never know what the Clips will be up to.

2008-05-20 18:18:34
47.   Louis in SF
From someone who had serious meniscus surgery last year, I can tell you it is a wear and tear injury and MRI's don't often tell the story. I am a tennis player and it does have a great impact on movement.

However, just about any doctor will tell you, you don't know the full extent until you clean it up. However, since they are just saying cartalidge clean-up, I don't think you can blame all of that on his terrible hitting this year and decrease last year. However, cleaning it up will help his legs and may eventually provide him with more confidence.

I tend to agree with Bob the Dodgers knew that he might have some physical issues but felt the risk was more than worth it.

2008-05-20 18:19:56
48.   Humma Kavula
Renteria singles. Which means that he goes 4-for-4, but in order to make The Griddle, he will need help, either from a whole bunch of Tiger hits, or a nine-run Mariner rally.
2008-05-20 18:22:07
49.   Jon Weisman
42 - You're leaving the second part of the quote, which I would always be happy to hear, given the alternative, as should anyone who isn't Sam Malone.
2008-05-20 18:23:58
50.   Bob Timmermann
I don't want everyone to agree with me. It will go to my head.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-05-20 18:25:29
51.   Johnny Nucleo
If someone told me I "wasn't the best X in the world", I'd work my butt off even harder to prove them wrong. I think it's a motivational trick to keep Blake from getting complacent.
2008-05-20 18:30:48
52.   Bluebleeder87
This is a great quote from Eric Karros:

"The most impressive thing is that it wasn't because of God-given talent. It was hard work," said former teammate, roommate and friend Eric Karros. "He took it upon himself to go to the Dominican Republic and learn how to catch. That speaks volumes of his desire and sacrifice to make himself the best player he could be."

2008-05-20 18:36:09
53.   Bob Timmermann
Cycle alert canceled in Detroit.

Stand down.

2008-05-20 18:38:01
54.   Ken Noe
More from Diamond: Tommy Lasorda...suggested to General Manager Ned Colletti during the offseason to sign Piazza the free agent as a backup catcher. "(Colletti) said, 'I just signed one two hours ago,'" Lasorda said. Sigh.
2008-05-20 18:40:49
55.   Brent Knapp
43 49 Most rational people are willing to accept they aren't the best in the world at everything. Most are even willing to admit that they aren't the best at ANYTHING. At work, most people would be thrilled if they were told by the head of their company that they are the best "job x" at their company or even at their branch. We were all thrilled when our football coach said "those are the best leg lifts I've ever seen." Not the whole world, just in a small group. We are content at being the best in a very small pond, simply because the world is too big to really be the best at anything. With a wife, or girlfriend, though, we truly expect to be the "best" at lots of things in her mind. We don't want to be the third funniest boyfriend she ever had, and we don't want to be the 2nd best lover she ever had. I don't know what this has to do with the dodgers. I use "we" loosely and probably mean "I" most of the time.
2008-05-20 18:43:58
56.   ryu
Hey Bob, have you ever appeared or considered appearing on Jeopardy?
2008-05-20 18:44:10
57.   Bob Timmermann
Kevin Gregg strikes out Upton and Byrnes with the bases loaded in the 8th to keep the Marlins ahead 3-2.
2008-05-20 18:45:12
58.   Bob Timmermann
56
I refuse to use my powers for petty financial gain.

That, and I'd likely lose.

2008-05-20 18:47:53
59.   Brent Knapp
from cnnsi. "In addition to damaged cartilage, Jones said he has a golf-ball sized wart behind his knee that might have to be surgically removed. Because of the wart's location, he said, it can't be drained."
Golf ball sized wart next to his injured knee? Maybe Andruw is a witch.
2008-05-20 18:50:43
60.   ryu
58 I think you'd kick some serious butt on Jeopardy. Especially if there's a baseball or sports related category.
2008-05-20 18:51:12
61.   Jacob Burch
59 I believe the wart (cyst?) got some play a few posts back. It gave me the willies, so I glossed over most comments hinting towards it.
2008-05-20 18:53:18
62.   JT Dutch
58

... Don't worry about the "financial gain" bit -- you can always donate your winnings to me. But I agree with ryu in that you'd do pretty well for yourself on that show.

2008-05-20 18:56:32
63.   CanuckDodger
"Drain?" Since when do warts have fluid in them? It has to be something else.
2008-05-20 18:56:41
64.   Bob Timmermann
I could also encounter a category about literature. Or alcoholic beverages. Or ways to cook peaches.

I might know stuff, but there is no guarantee I would be able to buzz in fast enough.

One of my brothers was on Jeopardy and he said that the signaling system was very difficult to time and he also didn't think that my personality would pass muster with the producers.

I come from a very supportive family.

2008-05-20 18:56:44
65.   Bluebleeder87
59

[tries not to imagine the golf sized wart, but then fails & imagines it anyways...]

2008-05-20 18:56:58
66.   underdog
59 Well, we did do the nose.
2008-05-20 18:58:55
67.   Ken Noe
Coincidentally, Andre Either is missing a golf ball.
2008-05-20 19:00:04
68.   imperabo
Well he hits like he's made of wood. Does that make him a witch?
2008-05-20 19:00:26
69.   scareduck
50 - I'll agree with you, whatever it is. I just want the entertainment value of watching your head explode.
2008-05-20 19:01:21
70.   Bluebleeder87
this whole A. Jones wart thing kind of reminds me of when Gagne had that ear thing, remember that guys?
2008-05-20 19:01:38
71.   Icaros
That wart sounds more like one of those cysts elderly dogs get. Andruw would be about 217 years old in dog years, I think.
2008-05-20 19:01:47
72.   scareduck
63 - it sounds like a translation error. Does Jones speak English well enough to actually talk to the press? I don't think I've ever seen him interviewed.
2008-05-20 19:02:34
73.   ryu
64 What kind of difficulty did your brother have with the signaling system? Do some buzzers work better than others?
2008-05-20 19:05:42
74.   Jacob Burch
73 Usually the complaint is that they turn "on" at a seemingly random time. It's supposed to be the second alex stops reading the clue, I believe, but will often turn "on" considerably before that.

Also, there is (or was) a "lock out" for buzzing in early--if you attempted to try and buzz in early, you'd have to hope for either a stump or for the first buzzee to be incorrect.

2008-05-20 19:06:16
75.   Andrew Shimmin
Doesn't it sound like Torre was trying to do an Eckstein thing with DeWitt? Where not being that good is actually better than being good--a sign of strong character? It was not an artfully turned phrase, but I think it very unlikely that he was trying to insult the guy.
2008-05-20 19:08:33
76.   Marty
It has to be a cyst. Lots of people have them behind their knees and don't even know it.
2008-05-20 19:08:54
77.   Bob Timmermann
72
Andruw Jones is supposedly fluent in four languages: Dutch, Spanish, English, and the native language of Curacao which starts with a P.

From my travels to the Netherlands, most of the Dutch I encountered spoke English better than I did.

2008-05-20 19:09:09
78.   Bluebleeder87
the Snakes just lost.
2008-05-20 19:10:49
79.   underdog
Yep, thank you Marlins! Well done.

Now let's see if the Dodgers can make that a gain tonight.

2008-05-20 19:14:05
80.   scareduck
Only in bizarro-world does Cory Patterson make a good leadoff man.

Fortunately for the Dodgers, that's Dusty Baker's address.

2008-05-20 19:14:07
81.   Bob Timmermann
You have to appreciate a guy with an .800 BA
2008-05-20 19:14:11
82.   Jacob Burch
77 Papiamento, for the knowledge-craving.
2008-05-20 19:14:31
83.   Bob Timmermann
Dang, now it's .667.
2008-05-20 19:19:11
84.   underdog
Vin sounds mad at us for not talking about Brandon Phillips more consistently.
2008-05-20 19:19:13
85.   LoneStar7
good start for bills
2008-05-20 19:22:26
86.   CanuckDodger
76 -- How could people have cysts behind their knees and not know it? Bumps aren't supposed to be there.
2008-05-20 19:22:43
87.   Icaros
84

You could've said something.

2008-05-20 19:23:40
88.   Eric Stephen
There was a moment shown on FSN before the game, with Matt Kemp talking with Ken Griffey Jr. in the OF. Something about that shot just looked soooo right.
2008-05-20 19:23:54
89.   Bob Timmermann
I have cysts on my fingers and parts of my feet. They are growing on tendons or ligaments I believe.

The doctor looked at them and said, "Yeah, that happens."

2008-05-20 19:24:26
90.   underdog
I meant to. I've been busy!

Sorry, Vin.

2008-05-20 19:24:54
91.   Ken Noe
That Brandon Phillips made quite a play. I liked the little hop.
2008-05-20 19:28:29
92.   underdog
In other news, blue jays have built a nest in the hedges near my door. (And I don't mean Vernon Wells and co. I mean, the bird.) One of them has been standing watch on the railing near my front window for weeks now, and if my cats are near the window it will screech or peck at the window protectively. I didn't realize they were so protective. They don't realize my cats don't go outside.

It was cute at first but now it's irritating. Anyone know how to build a ScareJay? Or is there a place I can order an owl?

2008-05-20 19:29:19
93.   LoneStar7
wow bills looking sharp boys and girls lets hope he keeps this up
2008-05-20 19:29:29
94.   underdog
Billingsley dunn good there. Dunn real good.
2008-05-20 19:30:47
95.   Bluebleeder87
It's in the bite!
2008-05-20 19:30:52
96.   dianagramr
89

A-cysted living?

2008-05-20 19:30:55
97.   Marty
86 I've got one behind each knee. an MRI showed it. But I can't see them or feel them.
2008-05-20 19:34:27
98.   LogikReader
One quick question between innings:

Yesterday I mentioned I might stop by Carney's before the Indy Movie Premiere. Is there any difference between the Studio City location and the one on Sunset, taste wise?

Nice work Bison!

2008-05-20 19:34:40
99.   CanuckDodger
97 -- Why did you have an MRI done on your knees if you couldn't feel anything wrong?
2008-05-20 19:36:45
100.   LogikReader
The first hit was Ken*t* not Kemp. I wasn't watching but listening to the game just now.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2008-05-20 19:36:45
101.   LoneStar7
haha woohoo, sometimes lonestar just gets the best bounces and rolls on his singles lol..
2008-05-20 19:41:15
102.   LoneStar7
yes, ok here we go..if Hu cant get anything done here I'll basically lose my patience with him im sorry to say
2008-05-20 19:41:38
103.   Ken Noe
Did Kent wince on that slide?
2008-05-20 19:41:41
104.   underdog
Baseball is fun when you're playing the Keystone Kops!
2008-05-20 19:42:18
105.   underdog
That was kind of a generous hit awarded DeWitt there, but he/we will take it, I guess.
2008-05-20 19:43:47
106.   Eric Stephen
Either Vin's researcher needs to be fired, or we need to find out who keeps telling Vin that Hu is a SS.
2008-05-20 19:43:51
107.   Sushirabbit
Been some funny stuff these past few NPUTs.

I had kids later (mid 30s); I recommend having them earlier. Sleep deprivation is easier when young. Degenerative discs usually don't appear till later-- now I pay with pain for carrying my 32 lbs 16 month old around at a fair. And two people working leaves little time. Daycare and parochial school put a dent in the gas money. yada yada

Still… Times uniform was washed to get clean: 3
Hours of work missed a week to get to practice: 1
Weekly hand washing of compression short for 6 year old: 1
Gas spent on getting to practice and games and make up games in one week: 1 tank.

Kid gets gameball = priceless.
He wanted to play catch till it got dark.

Wasn't around to read or post for awhile. My 11 year old step-nephew hung himself. Accidentally or intentionally it was sort of hard to tell. That funeral was really tough. Not because I knew him that well, but because it didn't take much of an emotional stretch to put myself in his dad's shoes. A while back Jon posted what we would wish for as something we most wanted. I didn't really have much. Win the lottery, my friend's ill daughter to make a miraculous recovery. Then my wife and I were watching a movie and there was a split second scene where the Dad ignores the 10 year old. Right then I thought, if I could get any wish granted, it'd be that young ones wouldn't feel ignored or invisible. I started to post it and sort of thought the moment had passed. Then this death. A bright little guy with the world before him. Puts a little perspective on worrying about who's playing where.

Thanks again for the site and the comments.

2008-05-20 19:44:05
108.   ucladodger
that was odd, to say the least.
2008-05-20 19:44:14
109.   LoneStar7
hmm...ok well bills and juan!
2008-05-20 19:44:17
110.   Ken Noe
And is Furcal imitating Bennett?
2008-05-20 19:44:27
111.   Eric Stephen
103
Not only that but Kent looked like he was limping noticeably rounding second.
2008-05-20 19:44:30
112.   ucladodger
Chad!
2008-05-20 19:44:59
113.   Bluebleeder87
Billingsley can do no wrong!
2008-05-20 19:45:11
114.   Andrew Shimmin
Vin, the run would have scored (and there'd only have been one out) if he had tagged first.
2008-05-20 19:45:57
115.   underdog
Chad just did what the batters right before him could not, hit the ball hard into the outfield for a legit hit. Well done, Bills!

How did Votto miss the bag on that grounder from Hu? Seemed like he was nearby, hard to believe he missed it.

2008-05-20 19:46:25
116.   Andrew Shimmin
111- He looked bad, but I'm not sure it was a limp. He may just run like a cartoon, now.
2008-05-20 19:46:38
117.   LoneStar7
Goodness I hate this black hole of weaklings...Please raff get healthy
2008-05-20 19:47:12
118.   Icaros
Either I'm mistaken or Vin is, but I'm pretty sure that if Votto tags 1st then throws home, the runner at home must be tagged out. Vin seems to think Votto just missed an easy dp by not tagging 1st.
2008-05-20 19:47:22
119.   underdog
This inning is so odd. It's like they're playing some weird poorly programmed baseball video game.
2008-05-20 19:48:42
120.   underdog
Gack, Sushi, I'm sorry to hear about your loss. That's really awful. :-( Don't know what else to say, words are nearly meaningless, but my heart goes out to your family.

Baseball may seem inconsequential after that, but I guess it's also nice to have something mindless to fall back on for a bit.

Peace.

2008-05-20 19:49:09
121.   LoneStar7
well thats a real shame 2 runs is great, but come on now
2008-05-20 19:52:37
122.   Bluebleeder87
Vinnie just busted an AA reference. "shortcomings" I don't think I've ever heard him use that word.
2008-05-20 19:52:46
123.   Eric Stephen
116
He may just run like a cartoon, now

That's not true. There was no cloud outline of Kent where he once stood, nor did Kent's feet and/or legs move at a supersonic pace before he actually took off.

2008-05-20 19:53:38
124.   Eric Stephen
Two straight nights Loney killed a sacrifice.
2008-05-20 19:53:43
125.   underdog
Anyone see this nugget, among many, in the FJM takedown of the latest Joe Morgan Chat (which was definitely Joe)?

>>SprungOnSports (Long Island): Andruw Jones is batting .170 for the Dodgers with 5 RBI, isn't it time that Joe Torre gave him some time off and played a young guy like Andre Ethier everyday?

Joe Morgan: I say no. You know the upside for guys like Ethier.

FJM: Yes you do. .296/.359/.464/.823, which are his career #s. Jones is currently at .176/.283/.288/.571. Last year Unduruw rocked HotLanta to the tune of .222/.311/.413/.724 in 154 games. So, the upside for Ethier = far better than Jones has been since 2006.

Joe: Andruw Jones is struggling, but even last year he drove in 90 runs for the Braves and has a superstar's upside.

FJM: That is a gooftastic thing to say.
<<
(Er, I cut out the last exchange 'cause there's a Rule 1 violation or two in there, but you can see it all on http://www.firejoemorgan.com/ )

2008-05-20 19:53:59
126.   Gen3Blue
114,118 That bothered me too, if the runner at first is out, the force is off at home.
2008-05-20 19:54:33
127.   Bluebleeder87
2 days in arrow for Loney! (hitter bunts, Loney snags the ball & FIRES to 2nd base for the out)
2008-05-20 19:55:43
128.   Eric Stephen
Isn't the Reds SS tonight married to Linda Evans?
2008-05-20 19:56:12
129.   Bob Timmermann
Mark Texeira would have gotten a force play on the bunt, hit three home runs, and saved three children from a burning building as well.
2008-05-20 19:56:25
130.   Icaros
125

D4P is already there.

2008-05-20 19:59:40
131.   Eric Stephen
I wonder if the club charges Chad for his "Reserved For Dodger Ace Chad Billingsley" parking spot sign or if it his deducted from his paycheck.
2008-05-20 20:00:02
132.   underdog
128 - That's Yanni. I believe John Tesh is playing first base, though.

130 - Meaning he posted that already, or that he lives inside FJM? Either of which could be true.

2008-05-20 20:00:13
133.   Gen3Blue
Observations: Bills is refreshing tonight for his ability to throw strikes.

Given the Reds errors, the D's offense didn't make much of that inning, though the extra at bats could tell later on.

2008-05-20 20:01:42
134.   mwhite06
Just looked up Jay Bruce's numbers in AAA. 363/392/669. The fact that Jay Bruce is in AAA while Corey Patterson starts for the Reds is CF is as agregious as AJones' presence in Torre's starting lineup.
2008-05-20 20:02:36
135.   LoneStar7
Well off to dinner, I'll be tracking as well as i can from the blackberry, would of loved to have a few more insurance runs from that last inning, oh well...go blue
2008-05-20 20:04:05
136.   Eric Stephen
One old man robs another.
2008-05-20 20:04:59
137.   underdog
Great play by Junior to rob Kent.

134 - And at this point it's even more egregious, given Jones has been a-cysted out of the lineup and Patterson is still there.

2008-05-20 20:05:09
138.   Icaros
132

Just figuring he probably has some internal alarm system notifying him of the birth of any new anti-Andruw Jones literature.

2008-05-20 20:05:15
139.   Marty
99 I tore the medial meniscus in each knee on separate occasions. After each MRI they would tell me about the damage and then say "oh yeah, you've also got a cyst in there. But don't worry, lots of people do"
2008-05-20 20:06:03
140.   underdog
You know, I was thinking that too, "Nice play, old man Griffey" and then I realized he's exactly my age! I guess either I'm an old man now, too, or sports has fouled up our perceptions of aging.

Okay, off to grab dinner too. Someone give me a holler if anything exciting happens.

2008-05-20 20:06:35
141.   Bluebleeder87
the Aflac trivia question is kind of hard.
2008-05-20 20:06:52
142.   berkowit28
72 According to Simers, Jones just answers "I don't know" to every question.
2008-05-20 20:06:57
143.   underdog
138 - Hee. I think he already subscribes to that newsletter and e-mail list.
2008-05-20 20:07:28
144.   Brent Knapp
I'm watching a little behind on my DVR and the replay shows Votta clearly touched first base and then threw home in the Second inning...Hu should have been out but the run should have scored because there was no longer a force at home.
2008-05-20 20:07:28
145.   scareduck
133 - The Reds are generally a pretty hacktastic team, though. I wonder how much of that is Bills getting them to swing at garbage.
2008-05-20 20:08:14
146.   dodgerinlv
Vin will be saying in a few innings when the score is 2-1 that the Dodgers could easily be leading 5-0, just like he did last night about how the Reds should have been leading 7-0.
2008-05-20 20:08:33
147.   scareduck
140 - I'm only a couple weeks younger than Randy Johnson. Imagine how that makes me feel, being the same age as one of the game's old men.
2008-05-20 20:08:41
148.   Bluebleeder87
The Bison!!
2008-05-20 20:09:04
149.   Marty
Sushi, that's an awful thing to have to go through. I've known a couple families who've lost kids to suicide and that must be the worst Hell to experience.
2008-05-20 20:09:27
150.   Bluebleeder87
looking at it again Matt Kemp is lucky it stayed in his glove.
Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2008-05-20 20:09:28
151.   Eric Stephen
Either there is a mic near the wall, or pure Bison power can be heard from a few hundred feet away.
2008-05-20 20:09:30
152.   68elcamino427
Robot Made of Nails perfects his route to the wall. Wall dented again.
2008-05-20 20:09:37
153.   underdog
Kemp just Griffey'd Griffey! Glad I stayed to see that.
2008-05-20 20:09:41
154.   ucladodger
And that guy cant play centerfield. To think, Coletti spent $100 million because they didn't think he could play center.
2008-05-20 20:10:08
155.   dodgerinlv
Does the curse placed on the Dodgers when Mike Piazza was traded retire along with Mike today?
2008-05-20 20:10:46
156.   Gen3Blue
Thank god the padding wasn't taken down for some reason. Like Vin's Wally Pipp remark.
2008-05-20 20:10:47
157.   underdog
147 - I know. But think about it logically, in the real world that's still not old! It's just funny. He seems like Methuselah to a lot of people in baseball terms, though.
2008-05-20 20:10:53
158.   Eric Stephen
146
But for it to be 2-1, the Reds will have to score a run.
2008-05-20 20:12:25
159.   Eric Stephen
Phillips was right to argue, but he probably should have been ejected for that.
2008-05-20 20:12:28
160.   ucladodger
Man, that thing was in the left-handed batters box.
2008-05-20 20:12:55
161.   bryanf
Anyone planning to see Vin and Wooden in June?
2008-05-20 20:13:03
162.   ucladodger
159

Ejected? You're kidding, right?

2008-05-20 20:13:16
163.   Bluebleeder87
Like Vinnie said if the umpire is consistently calling strikes at the same place, that's all you can ask for as a pitcher & as a hitter.
2008-05-20 20:14:09
164.   Bluebleeder87
Billingsley is coughing up those strikes like there's no tomorrow.
2008-05-20 20:14:29
165.   Jon Weisman
Martin and Phillips called out on outside pitches. Fair enough.
2008-05-20 20:14:33
166.   Gen3Blue
145 I'm not even remarking on the fact that the Reds aren't hitting it, I'm just tired of watching pitching without any command of the strike zone.
2008-05-20 20:15:13
167.   fiddlestick
I tore my ACL a year and a half ago. There was a cyst in there, too.
2008-05-20 20:15:36
168.   68elcamino427
Six K's for Bills through four innings. He looks confident tonight.
2008-05-20 20:18:01
169.   Lexinthedena
Bills, and Kuo are the only Dodger pitchers that I genuinly enjoy watching.
2008-05-20 20:18:28
170.   KingKopitar
I don't know what to do now. Kemp and Billingsley are both so awesome, who do pick as my favorite player?
2008-05-20 20:20:01
171.   Icaros
This is Gen3Blue's favorite type of game.
2008-05-20 20:21:59
172.   Lexinthedena
169 I mean starting pitchers.Kuo is a starter in my eyes. I don't care what Joe "Cornball Commercial" Torre says.
2008-05-20 20:22:30
173.   Bluebleeder87
I just checked both of my knees & I'm A-O.K., no golf like substance there. I also read a little about it & it's not all that big a deal, from what I understand it's basically knee fluid build up.
2008-05-20 20:24:30
174.   Strike4
107
Sushi, so sorry for your loss. My sympathies on such a painful tragedy.
2008-05-20 20:26:25
175.   68elcamino427
Bills kicks the fifth inning habit!
2008-05-20 20:26:36
176.   Brent Knapp
Vin is right about rick reuschel

http://tinyurl.com/3odxsk

2008-05-20 20:26:44
177.   Jon Weisman
107 - Oh, I forgot to respond. I am really, really sorry.
2008-05-20 20:27:19
178.   underdog
166 Not sure I get this. Who doesn't have command of the strike zone? The umpire? I know you don't mean Billingsley.
2008-05-20 20:27:43
179.   fiddlestick
DeOle!
2008-05-20 20:28:22
180.   Gen3Blue
171 I can't fairly disagree. But I can still complain about something. We shouldn't be making a guy with Belilse's numbers look so good. With a defense behind him--- it would be scoreless. There, is that pessimistic enough.
2008-05-20 20:28:39
181.   underdog
Mmmm, that BBQ'd blue jay made for a mighty tasty dinner, by the way. Scrumptious!
2008-05-20 20:32:30
182.   Bluebleeder87
176

he looks more Broxton to me, in that picture anyways.

2008-05-20 20:32:39
183.   Gen3Blue
107 SORRY I made light of anything before reading your post. I've been through something similar, and you have to get through it minute by minute. So sorry.
2008-05-20 20:33:29
184.   fiddlestick
Brandon Phillips fields grounders like Eric Byrnes.
2008-05-20 20:34:41
185.   Icaros
181

A co-worker was just telling me the other day about how blue jays peck at her cat in the window, and when the cat is outside, they literally fly down and tear fur off its back.

2008-05-20 20:35:47
186.   Eric Stephen
162
Sorry I was away for a little bit. Yes, Phillips should have been ejected. You're not allowed to argue balls & strikes. Normally you get some leeway from most umps, but not when you hop around in the batters box showing the ump up like that.
2008-05-20 20:38:53
187.   Jon Weisman
186 - He didn't show up the ump. He had an instant reaction and then a good-natured conversation and smile. An ejection there would have been shocking.
2008-05-20 20:41:05
188.   Bluebleeder87
187

That's how I saw it too.

2008-05-20 20:42:06
189.   Andrew Shimmin
If he gets a hit, here, I'm going to agree with Eric Stephen. If he GIDPs, I'll agree with Jon.
2008-05-20 20:42:19
190.   Eric Stephen
187 ,162
I looked at it again, and my instant reaction was harsh. On first sight it seemed like Phillips argued (and hopped around) more but you are right, he pretty much cut his reaction short immediately and was smiling the whole time.

I don't like that I was on the Angel Hernandez side spectrum of this argument.

2008-05-20 20:43:03
191.   Andrew Shimmin
So, Jon it is. Well done.
2008-05-20 20:46:23
192.   Jimi Shelter
107--That's heartbreaking. I'm really sorry.
2008-05-20 20:48:04
193.   Eric Stephen
189 ,191
If I remember my U.S. History correctly, the Lincoln-Douglas debates weren't actually decided until James Buchanan induced a GIDP from Douglas after the fact.
2008-05-20 20:48:50
194.   Gen3Blue
So for the D's first three hitters 0for9.
2008-05-20 20:48:59
195.   68elcamino427
#7, line drive.
2008-05-20 20:50:59
196.   Andrew Shimmin
Changed my mind, Eric Stephen was still right. Clearly Phillips should have been tossed.
2008-05-20 20:51:27
197.   Gen3Blue
That was a nice play, darn.
2008-05-20 20:53:15
198.   Sam NYC
Am I the only one who is really, really annoyed at the season Mark Hendrickson is having?
2008-05-20 20:53:54
199.   bryanf
Ryan Howard couldn't make it an even 200 Ks?
2008-05-20 20:56:31
200.   Bluebleeder87
all of a sudden Billingsley is pitching in the 7th inning.

Hey Eric did you wear boots when you were a little kid, being from El Paso & all? I use to wear boots up until high school even.

Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2008-05-20 20:56:59
201.   Icaros
198

He's having the same year he had when Ned traded for him. I promise it won't last.

2008-05-20 20:57:56
202.   Bluebleeder87
Nice job by Pierre the actually! those line shots are hard to read.
2008-05-20 20:58:02
203.   Gen3Blue
178 Sorry, I probably didn't express myself clearly. Put it this way, Bills is not always pitching from behind, and this is refreshing.
2008-05-20 20:58:18
204.   Eric Stephen
200
Enders is from El Paso. I'm from Palm Springs, and I've never worn boots in my life.
2008-05-20 20:58:30
205.   nick
what about "Andruw Jones: After the Bigs"--when will it air?
2008-05-20 20:59:17
206.   Eric Stephen
205
Ha! I made that joke last night.
2008-05-20 21:00:40
207.   Sam NYC
201 -- No, that's the thing. He's going to win the Cy Young award this year simply because he's not pitching for the Dodgers. I bet he's thinking, "Ha, ha, ha, I took your money and sucked, but I was a good pitcher the whole time, muah!" What a jerk.
2008-05-20 21:00:56
208.   Bluebleeder87
205

It airs tonight Nick when the game ends.

2008-05-20 21:01:04
209.   underdog
185 Delayed reaction, but that's just another reason my cats are indoors only critters. For their own protection! There are hawks in this neighborhood, too. That's all I need is to say my cat dragged into the sky by a hawk.

Well, gosh, this Billingsley fellow is having himself a good game. Be nice if the Dodgers could take some pressure off and score another run or two.

And that's a good start, Hu!

2008-05-20 21:01:09
210.   bryanf
Chad Billingsley: Ace.
2008-05-20 21:01:13
211.   nick
206 curses! I feared as much for a moment, but wasn't here last night (but I'll be here all week--rimshot)
2008-05-20 21:02:02
212.   underdog
See, not say.

And I should add that Billingsley had himself a good game.

let's go Pee Wee!

2008-05-20 21:03:09
213.   underdog
I think there should be a Dusty Baker homage manager character in my script, too. Replete with toothpick.
2008-05-20 21:03:54
214.   Gen3Blue
198 I know what you mean. Maybe he really belongs in Florida, where I think the first part of his season was OK when he was foisted on the Dodgers.
2008-05-20 21:04:06
215.   Icaros
209

I'd like to get a cat, but my place is so small. Plus I'm allergic.

It'd be nice to have someone to talk to, though.

2008-05-20 21:04:43
216.   Andrew Shimmin
Delwyn Young: Designated bunter.
2008-05-20 21:05:09
217.   underdog
203 Ah. Gotcha.

Pee-Wee is the DB: Designated Bunter.

2008-05-20 21:05:46
218.   underdog
Darn it! Too slow. I blame the blue jays for distracting me.
2008-05-20 21:06:35
219.   Icaros
I keep forgetting that I can root for Pierre now.
2008-05-20 21:07:10
220.   underdog
215 You can borrow one of mine anytime. I'll even shave them for you. But I should tell you so you're not disappointed, they don't actually talk. They do stare pretty well, though, as if listening.

Wow, a legit run! Cool.

2008-05-20 21:07:31
221.   bryanf
Does anyone else hear "White and Nerdy" whenever Pierre steals?
2008-05-20 21:08:37
222.   underdog
The Dodgers: We'll dribble you to death!
2008-05-20 21:09:11
223.   StolenMonkey86
Billingsley had a hit today, but Torre brings in a guy to bunt for the pitcher.

I don't get it.

2008-05-20 21:09:49
224.   underdog
Argh, Dusty drives me nuts. Your bullpen stinks! It doesn't matter who you bring in. I've got work to do, Dusty, work to do!
2008-05-20 21:10:04
225.   Jacob Burch
221 Unsure of the sarcasm here, but it is "Dirty," the song of which Weird Al parodied. One of the half dozen or so stock SB songs for the Dodgers.
2008-05-20 21:10:19
226.   Icaros
They do stare pretty well, though, as if listening.

That's all I ask of anyone.

2008-05-20 21:12:04
227.   bryanf
221 Yeah, sorry the sarcasm doesn't come through here. It's just another example of when I heard the Weird Al parody before the real song so my ears hear the Weird Al lyrics...
2008-05-20 21:12:14
228.   underdog
Billingsley: 1.97 ERA in his last 5 starts.
2008-05-20 21:12:20
229.   Gen3Blue
219 yeeaahhh JP. But it is hard. If we played the rest of the players we should, we could carry someone like JP--would it even cause some kind of synergy? I have to remember that Little was batting him eighth by the end of last year.
2008-05-20 21:12:24
230.   Eric Stephen
Billingsley's ERA was lowered to 3.76 with tonight's gem, probably putting his ERA+ at about 116. His FIP (from Hardball Times) will probably be around 3.09.

Hendrickson lowered his ERA to 3.72 (FIP 3.80 after a somewhat shocking 3.99 FIP last year).

2008-05-20 21:14:20
231.   Jacob Burch
227 I almost screamed out Y-O-D-A when the kinks came on a mix cd I made the other day, no worries.

My horrible radio and Charlie Steiner make me very sad I had to give up Vin/TV.

2008-05-20 21:15:08
232.   Bluebleeder87
at least the run scored.
2008-05-20 21:15:19
233.   jtrichey
Random notes tying things together in this thread:

I agree with Canuck, warts do not have fluid.

Cysts behind the knees are alled popliteal cysts. Popliteal is not one of the 4 languages that Jones can speak, that's Papamiento.

Everybody I have ever heard of from Curacao is said to be able to speak those same 4 languages "fluently". I don't believe it.

2008-05-20 21:15:49
234.   underdog
Repeat 222 here.
2008-05-20 21:16:46
235.   bryanf
Bills talking to Lowe in the dugout. Maybe Bills can give Lowe some tips!
2008-05-20 21:18:17
236.   bryanf
Does Martin not get an RBI for that?
2008-05-20 21:19:59
237.   Icaros
236

He does. Around here it's a Super Olney.

2008-05-20 21:21:02
238.   bryanf
237 I thought so...my fantasy league didn't credit it yet...what the heck?
2008-05-20 21:23:02
239.   Eric Stephen
Greg Maddux went 5 IP tonight (he will get a no-decision), putting his career IP total at an amazing 4873.2. Considering he averages about 6 IP/start, it would take him about 21 more starts to become the 13th pitcher with 5000 IP.

He broke his tie with Phil Neikro tonight with his 717th career start, and stands at 4th on the all-time list. He's 39 starts behind Don Sutton for 3rd place so Maddux will have to pitch into 2009 to pass him, but Sutton will never be passed on the best perm list.

2008-05-20 21:26:54
240.   Jiminy Cricket
I like to dream, and the dream of Bills with his recent <2.00 ERA and Kershaw as another ace in a few years has me positively giddy.
2008-05-20 21:28:09
241.   herchyzer
How's this for next season's Dodger lineup:

LF - LaRoche
CF - Kemp
RF - Ethier
3B - DeWitt
SS - Furcal (resigned)
2B - Hu
1B - Loney
C - Martin

Trade Pierre. I have no idea what to do with Jones.

2008-05-20 21:29:54
242.   Eric Stephen
Are people actually booing Kemp for that flyout? Maybe it has become second nature to simply boo the Dodger CF.
2008-05-20 21:32:07
243.   underdog
242 - I got the feeling it was one of those non-game booing things, like an usher taking a beach ball away or some such nonsense. Pretty sure it wasn't aimed at Kemp.
2008-05-20 21:33:49
244.   Eric Stephen
243
That makes sense. I'm naively hoping the booing was for the introduction of a beach ball rather than the removal of it. :)
2008-05-20 21:34:13
245.   bryanf
Booing at Dodger Stadium really ticks me off. Even booing Bonds angered me and I hate him with a passion.
2008-05-20 21:34:50
246.   underdog
Vegas update: 51s lost 7-1 to Tacoma, didn't do much with the bat at all. LaRoche went 0fer but had another walk. Orenduff struggled a great deal.
2008-05-20 21:34:54
247.   bryanf
244 I vow that if I ever get a beach ball passed to me I will pop it.
2008-05-20 21:36:20
248.   underdog
I love Vinnie, pulling out the Edgar Allen Poe reference here at the end.
2008-05-20 21:38:35
249.   jtrichey
Pierre never even tries to make a throw to the plate.
2008-05-20 21:39:00
250.   underdog
Dunn's big "defensive indifference" pays off.
Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2008-05-20 21:40:26
251.   Eric Stephen
250
Dunn would have a SB if I'm official scorer and/or Tsar of Baseball®.
2008-05-20 21:42:40
252.   MollyKnight
I just got home so I'm just seeing the game rundown now. Yay, Billingsley!
2008-05-20 21:43:04
253.   underdog
"Andruw Jones: Boy His Behind is Big," next after the game on FSN.

Sorry, I apologize, I promised I wouldn't make that kind of joke but couldn't resist. Thank you, thank you, I'll be here all week.

2008-05-20 21:43:23
254.   Icaros
251

Where do you stand on Jae Seo's save?

2008-05-20 21:43:35
255.   Gen3Blue
A Sammy smile.
2008-05-20 21:43:52
256.   bryanf
Love that little outfielder hop bump! Kemp and Ethier and Pierre.
2008-05-20 21:43:55
257.   underdog
Yay, Sammy!

The Sammy Smile™

Nice to see.

Night everyone.

2008-05-20 21:44:56
258.   Jacob Burch
248 For the TV-less, what was it?
2008-05-20 21:49:59
259.   fanerman
Good win!
2008-05-20 21:51:57
260.   nick
how about "Andruw Jones: Notorious and BIG"? thank you, thank you, ladies and germs///
2008-05-20 21:52:50
261.   underdog
258 - Referenced the story "The Tell-tale Heart" to talk about the Reds hitters today. It was a bit of a stretch - not sure if he's read that story recently... but I guess it represented how scary their lack of hitting has been this series.
2008-05-20 21:53:31
262.   MollyKnight
Yah! Two in a row!
2008-05-20 21:54:27
263.   KingKopitar
Does Billingsley not get the same amount of love as other pitchers because he usually ends up leaving during the 7th inning? Or is it because he's gotten the Will Carroll seal of disapproval?
2008-05-20 21:58:54
264.   Jon Weisman
263 - From whom do you mean?
2008-05-20 22:03:38
265.   68elcamino427
Great win for the Dodgers. Kemp has made big strides improving his defense and it looks like his bat is heating up again. Loney two for four. I like this line-up.

Billingsley, The Staff Ace.

2008-05-20 22:07:07
266.   Jon Weisman
Traffic advisory:

Lakers game and American Idol crowning happening downtown tomorrow night.

2008-05-20 22:09:06
267.   68elcamino427
266
Thanks for the heads up, we're going to see the Dodgers tomorrow night.
2008-05-20 22:09:58
268.   Bob Timmermann
For those not sure of where Downtown is, just remember it's where all the lights are bright.
2008-05-20 22:10:00
269.   Gen3Blue
263 That Will Carroll stuff is so bizzare.
I know I value defense way more than most, but in a faily close game how could you not have an outfield with good arms in the ninth? I guess I phrased that not to mention names.
2008-05-20 22:10:56
270.   regfairfield
269 Delwyn was already burned, who do you use?
2008-05-20 22:11:58
271.   Jon Weisman
http://www.flabber.nl/archief/020391.php

Het beste van The Office US!

2008-05-20 22:12:08
272.   dbenzen
Am I too old school but shouldn't Coletti just be embarrassed by the Andruw Jones signing?

Not just because Jones is proving last year wasn't a fluke, but because the current line-up is far more productive without the $36M man.

I know it's all a crap-shoot but Coletti just seems to attract the over-the-hill guys like Nomar, Gonzo, even Jason Schmidt. What's the deal here? And what new prospects has Coletti brought into the org? Kershaw?

2008-05-20 22:12:21
273.   LoneStar7
weirdest moment of Dinner: getting an update to my blackberry saying "juan pierre drives in Hu)..so hoorah everyone was in on the action, and Bills was nasty especially early. A sweep would be large with the red birds coming in town.
2008-05-20 22:13:21
274.   Gen3Blue
270 I didn't realize that, but I'm inclined to say anyone. Never mind.
2008-05-20 22:14:10
275.   Eric Stephen
269
Combining arm strength and OF coverage, who on the roster is better than Pierre defensively? I doubt Sweeney or Young (or LaRoche) are better in LF than Pierre.
2008-05-20 22:18:52
276.   Jon Weisman
272 - I don't see him bragging about it. What exactly are you expecting from him right now?
2008-05-20 22:20:38
277.   Jon Weisman
http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-andruw21-2008may21,0,2558049.story

"Manager Joe Torre said he would rather be without Jones for a month or so as he recovered from surgery rather than have him play the remainder of the season with the threat of his knee flaring up again."

2008-05-20 22:22:28
278.   Eric Stephen
This is for Eric Enders:

As a Dodger, Mike Piazza did in fact hit more home runs to the opposite field than pull shots (177 total):

76 opposite field (42 RF, 34 RCF)
69 pulled (45 LF, 24 LCF)
32 dead center

2008-05-20 22:25:39
279.   Gen3Blue
275 Of course you're right. Maybe a relief pitcher.

277 Perhaps a blessing in disguise, now that he has stumbled on Kemp.

2008-05-20 22:30:46
280.   Eric Stephen
Matt Kemp's catch was the #2 web gem on Baseball Tonight.
2008-05-20 22:36:02
281.   68elcamino427
Let's do this NY tabloid style. So Joe Torre said that he would rather be without Jones ...
2008-05-20 22:41:14
282.   Bob Timmermann
The season finale of "Reaper" was either very poorly written, very poorly directed, or I suffered an alcoholic blackout during the middle of it.
2008-05-20 22:42:58
283.   imperabo
278 That's exactly what I expected. I watched a lot of Dodger games in that era, and I knew his swing well. Early in his career he would hit just about every ball up in the zone to opposite field or center. He would smash them, but other great hitters would hit homers on balls that he would hit for hard doubles because he didn't pull it. I distinctly recall when he started to pull pitches up and middle-to-in that he used to take oposite field. He really clobbered them to left when he saw the pitch coming. I think it was about '96 when he made this transition. I remember thinking then that he'd eventually pull one out of the stadium, which he did in '97.
2008-05-20 22:44:15
284.   underdog
280 - Yeah, too bad the BBTN crew blathered on about how many Emmys they should win this year instead of about Kemp during that clip. And I'd hoped for a Billingsley sighting during their "That's Nasty" pitching montage, too, but nothing. The Piazza tribute was nice, though, and made me mad all over again for the Dodgers losing him (I don't care how many good players they got in return, I will never be happy that trade happened). I hope he goes into the Hall as a Dodger but it'll be a tough call.
2008-05-20 22:44:45
285.   underdog
282 - Or all three? Glad I gave up on that show ages ago.
2008-05-20 22:45:43
286.   bhsportsguy
I have to say, I had a pleasant time at the game tonight but it was more because of spending the time having some nice conversations about the Dodgers, baseball in general, cooking, NBA draft, Dodgers, intro songs and Brady Bunch.

Chad pitched well, if the Reds could make a play in the infield, the game might still be going on.

2008-05-20 22:46:32
287.   ActLikeMajorMarket
To 272's query: Yes, Coletti should be held accountable. In any business, there is 'due diligence.' Signing any free agent (or high-end vendor/employee) should require such thought and analysis. In a major market a team needs established names and some prospects to sell tickets. Wasting millions on down-slide players should cost you. Asking the owner to sign large salary paychecks is far less than what should be the expectation for a Dodgers GM. DePodesta may have been abrasive with the local media, but his picks seem more germane to winning than what has been shown recently. For evidence, please see any quotes from Jones or Schmidt.
2008-05-20 22:48:13
288.   Xeifrank
Interesting statistical tidbits from tonight's game.

1. In the Dodgers highest leverage at-bat (LI=2.11), Chad Billingsley got an RBI single in the 2nd inning.

2. In the Reds highest leverage at-bat (2.56), Brandon Phillips hit into a double play.

3. Joe Torre brought Takashi Saito into the game with the Dodgers win expectancy sitting at 98.6%. A perfect example of a manager utilizing his closer based on the save statistic rather than on whether or not the situation requires arguably your best relief pitcher.

vr, Xei

2008-05-20 22:48:46
289.   Jon Weisman
282 - Only 6 1/2 more episodes for me to go before I get there!
2008-05-20 22:49:55
290.   bhsportsguy
287 DePodesta signed Jose Valentin, he traded for Jason Phillips, he gave J.D. Drew a player option in the second year of his contract with a no compensation if he opts out clause.

Certainly not massive deals like Schmidt or Jones but lets not build a statue for him either.

2008-05-20 22:50:35
291.   trainwreck
282
I thought that show moved to Thursdays?
2008-05-20 22:51:19
292.   Bob Timmermann
289
I'm not going to give away anything in particular, but there was one whole storyline which was very important in the last three episodes and it just disappeared into the ether like Richie Cunningham's older brother.
2008-05-20 22:51:45
293.   Jon Weisman
288 - Not disagreeing with you, but if say Cory Wade came in and gave up a hit, what does the WE drop to?
2008-05-20 22:51:59
294.   LAT
266. I love Dodger games when the Lakers are in the playoffs. The staduim is empty. No traffic, no lines, no problem.

Beautiful evening at the Stadium tonight.

2008-05-20 22:53:28
295.   Jon Weisman
287 - If that's the worst you can say about DePo, I'm ready with the marble.

292 - I don't know if anyone watches Big Bang Theory, but in the season finale, they seemed to act as if the big moment in the previous episode never happened. But my wife says I just don't understand women.

2008-05-20 23:00:44
296.   Xeifrank
293. Ok.
- A walk, keeping the score at 4-1 would drop the WE to 96.9%

- A run scoring single, making the score 4-2 would drop the WE to 97.5%

- A run scoring double, making the score 4-2 would drop the WE to 98.2%

- A run scoring triple, making the score 4-2 would drop the WE to 98.1%

- A two run HR, making the score 4-3 would drop the WE to 97.2%

There is a little bit of noise at this end of the WE spectrum, as a walk shouldn't be the most harmful of the five scenarios. But you can tell that even with another runner getting on base, the game is still pretty safe.
vr, Xei

2008-05-20 23:02:20
297.   Jon Weisman
296 - That's pretty instructive. Thanks.
2008-05-20 23:03:37
298.   regfairfield
290 Can we stop calling the Drew opt out a bad thing since it worked out perfectly? We got two good years from him, and none of his bad ones with no buy outs necessary.
2008-05-20 23:08:50
299.   Eric Stephen
295
I actually forgot about last week's "big moment" before you mentioned that. It's a good point on your part, but your wife might also be on to something (I'm not saying you're alone either!). :)
2008-05-20 23:12:20
300.   Jon Weisman
299 - Well, if we can talk about it here, my wife bought the kiss as a birthday present from a friend (with latent implications but nothing in the moment itself). I certainly would have taken it as something more serious - which certainly means Leonard would have too. But neither really acted much like it happened.

New post up top.

Show/Hide Comments 301-350
2008-05-20 23:17:55
301.   LoneStar7
Uggla seriously jacked that homer earlier...just saw the highlight.
2008-05-20 23:35:05
302.   Andrew Shimmin
Valentin put up a 109 OPS+ the year after he left. Phillips cost the Dodgers Ishii, who hasn't pitched in MLB since his 91 IP of 80 OPS+ the year he was traded.

DePo extended Odalis Perez. He let Tracy start Scott Erickson eight times. He non-tendered Shane Victorino. He traded Dave Roberts for nothing. He purchased Grabowski from the A's and sold Dave Ross to the Reds. He released Joakim Soria (what was the story behind that, anyway? Was he really out of baseball for four years?). There are arguments about any of that, plus Canuck would like to hang Hocheyvar around his neck, but that looks like the worst of his moves. You could argue that his were sins of omission, rather than commission, but that's a hard case to make about a guy who was around less than two years.

2008-05-20 23:50:50
303.   arborial
288 , 296 I remember reading somewhere earlier this season that Saito said he prefers to see some action everyday. It helps him to keep his rhythm. So maybe it was less about the stats and more about keeping him finely tuned for when he is really needed.

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