The next time I learn that a pitcher has an "ear infection", I'll know the truth..

Oh great.

Steroids? Don't resign him Ned!

This almost guaruntees that Gagne's option will not be picked up, providing the Dodgers with even more money to spend this offseason (assuming Baez doesn't get a BJ Ryan-esque contract from Flanders)

i doubt ned will give gagne a huge contract.

i doubt anytime will give gagne a long term deal.

according to henson, saito will be called up.

Sadly, this looks like the possible end to Game Over. Let the Bull's reign begin!

Yes, I still think the Baez trade was dumb.

Saito... uggggggggghhh.

Quick thoughts:
1. I'm getting really annoyed at the team's medical staff. There never seems to be any certaintly with this bunch, and the team suffers for it. I had a good tirade late in the '03 season about Odalis Perez and how his injury woes were handled - and the rant still applies.
If I'm in upper management I start examining the trainers' work very closely.
2. Good to get this out of the way early. IMO, it damages a team when a key component is in a long injury-caused limbo: He's a week away from returning! He's back! He's hurt! But he'll be better in a week, ad infinitum.
3. I'd much rather have Baez as closer than Duaner Sanchez, so kudos to Ned for planning ahead for exactly this situation.
4. Eric, we'll always have 2003.

Maybe it's not as bad as it sounds.

Brilliant move by the Pirates to put Chris Shelton on waivers.

Maybe it's not as bad as it sounds.

i dunno but removing a nerve from your elbow sounds pretty bad to me.

12- Maybe they just have to get rid of some scar tissue.

Steve Phillips just reported that Gagne is going to have his third Tommy John surgery.

re 13

lol! ive heard more talk about "oh its just scar tissue" in the last year then i ever have.

11 Shelton was a Rule 5 pick by the Tigers, a reward for their horrific 2003 season, not a waiver claim

14 - He is so dumb.

apparently every kind of elbow surgery to phillips is a tommy john surgery.

I said it at the time: Baez was a hedge against Gagne. And yes it should make you re-evaluate the Baez trade. It's reasonable to assume the LAD had more doubts about Gagne than they could say. Put it this way: You have to like the Baez trade a bit more now than you did a few weeks ago. (And I know there are people here who believe saves are over-rated).

Nate, were you able to get the Jacksonville tv cam? Didn't work for me.

How much more conditioning does Broxton need?

Nope, because Gagne is not replaceable, and Baez is eminently replaceable.

re 20

no, its not working for some reason. maybe its not even turned on. last year, it was always on regardless if there was a game or not. But i am listening to the audio. you can get it at jaxsuns.com

Adam Dunn just hit a homer really far. Roughly a field goal shot between the "stacks" in center field

16
Oh yeah, my mistake.

My friend who follows Japanese baseball told me that Saito was not even good in Japan. What is he doing in our pen?

23 thanks

I amend. Gagne is replaceable, but not by the likes of middle relievers like Baez.

25 - Saito's stats from Japan:

http://tinyurl.com/lv4lv

Joel Guzman is playing 1B for Vegas tonight. Unless they really don't like Ethier in CF (Duncan's there), I sense something might have happened regarding Saenz, Kent, or Loney

27 Baez had what, 41 saves last year? Whatever else he is, he's proven he can close, so calling him a middle reliever is inaccurate.

19 - No, I feel the same way about the trade. If I bring an umbrella because of threat of rain, whether it rains or not does not affect the quality of my decision.

I do not care what you call Baez, he is nothing special. I would be fine with Kuo as our closer.

Bill Plaschke writes sentences, but one wouldn't call him a "journalist."

I suppose the absence of Eric Gagne on one of the two big posters on Dodger Stadium was a good idea.

Kent and Furcal got those spots this year.

31 You should have added a "grasshopper" on the end of that :)

At least we don't have Tracy anymore. He'd probably make Brazoban the closer again.

Another season without Gange. The news coming the day after five Dodgers are injured in one game. Which happened two days after two starters are placed on the DL. So we have a new manager, a new GM, and half a team of new players, but in the end, we are going to relive 2005. Devistating.

Mark Hendrickson closing for the Rays. No wonder Baez was their closer.

Reports on the homer from 24 say that the ball hit a car, albeit on a bounce

I think it's just that they don't have anyone to play 1B at AAA.
I'd suspect that if Loney were to have gotten injured in Vegas Guzman would be switched over to 1B and a reserve outfielder put in Guzman's place.

I was talking today to a coworker about Kenny Lofton. Does he exist as a Dodger? I never saw him play in spring training. I've just read interviews with him. Are there photos of him in a Dodgers uniform extant or is that like finding a photo of that mysterious woodpecker in the Appalachians?

38 Hendrickson shut down the Orioles? Wow. They may have Mazzone, but who said they can hit?

So what's Frank Jobe's BA these days?

38- ? He's going for a CG shutout.

duaner is in for the mets.

37

The sad thing is..it might end up being worse than 2005...

40 Truby and Alvarez are both capable of playing 1B, and both are riding the bench. It's not like Duncan is worth ABs over those two. And why play Guzman at 1B when you're specifically trying to get him familiar with a new position?

37
We did a lot, but in the end really did nothing. I said in the off-season that this team looked like it had more injury problems than last year's team.

Duaner in for the Mets.

Tampa Bay's closer is Dan Miceli.

"Old Friend" Duaner Sanchez just K'd Jose Guillen in the 7th in New York. Guillen had tried to charge the mound to fight "old friend" Pedro Martinez who hit him twice with pitches.

Poor Jose Guillen. No one loves him.

45 Phoo. I should have refreshed before I noted that Sanchez came in.

Well there goes what i was calling "an above average bullpen", now its average, to go along with average starting pitching plus average starting offense.

Plus who knows if nomar is really healthy to where he can produce 18-20 hrs.

This team has obp but that's it, everything else is average.

The funny thing is, if the top prospects get called up for injuries, we will stay afloat, and end up with a little better record than last season and NOBODY in the mainstream media will say that ned put together a fragile team and call for his head on a platter, like they did with depodesta.

So what's Frank Jobe's BA these days?

Bank account...?

Does Nomar Garciaparra actually exist as a Dodger?

44
I saw Hendrickson and could not fathom he was put in to close. Baltimore has offensive issues.

yeah, this is rough. At this point I am afraid if we bring prospects up they will get hurt as well.

duaners in trouble!

56

Didn't Baltimore score 16 runs yesterday?

*was in the game before coming in to close

terrible AB by zimmerman, bad night all at the plate for him.

This team has obp but that's it, everything else is average.
If your offense must be one-dimensional, OBP is the dimension you want above all.

59
Yeah, but there offensive production went down a lot last season and I heard that basically Tejada does not look good at all. I would be worried if I was an Orioles fan, especially if Hendrickson just show you down for an entire game.

Can Repko close or play first?

Its nice to have Baez now with Gagne gone, you cant really have too many bullpen arms. But now Im afraid of the potential for Ned to give Baez a stupid contract after this season. We really need to hope that Kuo and/or Broxton can impress enough to prevent that from happening.

Bradley and Gagne were the two players I most looked forward to seeing play the last few years. Playoffs or not, this team will not have swagger.

By the way, did anyone see Bradley's triple last night to setup the winning run? He and Swisher were doing the dugout patty-cake. So sad.

*shot

If your offense must be one-dimensional, OBP is the dimension you want above all.

Very true, but the overall team picture is bad.

Akin pitch the last 3 innings in relief of Elbert, giving up a run in the process. Vero loses 1-0 in its opener

53-- I wouldn't say that NOBODY in the mainstream media will say that Ned put together a fragile team,etc.

In today's paper Simers went after Lofton and all the other injured Dodgers, and that's even before the news about Gagne.

Baez may be Jeff Shaw revisited, but with help from Kuo,Brazobahn and Broxton (when they call him up); the bullpen can at least be functional.

The problem is still going to be the starting pitching.

Did Gange's suspension count as games played or more precisely can the Dodgers claim insurance (if available) on Gange and would it carry over from last year?

gosh, how depressing.

And people scoffed at me picking the Padres to win the division.

Talk me down, Jon, and tell me about the half-full glass, 'cause I'm starting to think it's gonna be a looooooooooong season.

So, in the same 24-hour span in which the Dodgers shelve Gagne, the Giants lose Lowry and the Pads might lose Klesko.
Who knew the season-opening series could hold such importance for the Snakes and Rox?

What's the medical staff's batting average the last few years?

For allowing Gagne to pitch last spring on a bad knee, they started out 0-for-40 in 2005.

So much for all the dross about how the LAD couldn't possible be as unlucky, in terms of injuries, as they were last year.

Bruce Froemming is at it again.

Losing Klesko is a positive for the Padres.

53

I actually expect the opposite..we all think they won't say anything about Ned cause we think the media had it in for DePo all along (which alot of them did), but two straight years of an injury-riddled roster is still two years of an injury-riddled roster no matter what your biases are..atleast to journalists not with the name B. Plaschke, oh wait maybe that gave it away, how about Bill P.

Goodbye Jim.

Tracy gets thrown out of the game. After arguing an obvious call, that was a mistake by the umpires.

77 - Yeah, that was never true. Not sure I expected it to be disproved in the first week, though.

79
I agree. The Padres are hoping to find some excuse to get rid of Klesko.

79 - Klesko, last season, had 38 XBH and 75 BB in 443 ABs. And that was a bad year.
He can hit.

What do you mean by "medical staff's batting average"? How often players came back in their expected time frame?

I love young players as much as the next guy, but it's funny how so many people put Baez on the same level as Kuo, Broxton and Osoria, as if the latter three have done anything.

Baez has a legitimate track record of major league success. Kuo has a ticking bomb for an elbow. Broxton didn't even bother to get in shape, and Osoria's pitches are chum for a typical MLB lefty. It would be neat to see them blossom like Bobby Jenks did.

At least Jose Cruz Jr. is set to have a good year.

[86] I think he's implying that part of the job of the medical staff, in addition to curing injuries, is preventing injuries.

I see that Tracy has the kind of leadoff hitter he's comfortable with.

75 LOL you're right GSfRB, and as much as I want to see the Dodgers in the playoffs I'd give that up for AZ & COL battling down to the wire.

And a Zaboni-aided 1-game playoff at Coors w/20+ runs be memorable and likely ensure whoever survived would go 3 'n out afterwards.

86

Klesko used to be a good hitter. His body's falling apart now. In the first half of 2004, he had no power. In the second half of 2005, he again fell apart, batting .211 with four home runs. He cannot be counted on from day to day because of all the ailments. He's a terrible fielder. The Padres are better off with Gonzalez.

88. They have accopmlished a lot, the minors count as well. In particular, Osoria has succeeded in Las Vegas, where no other young pitcher has. The best part about those guys is that they make a fraction of Baez's salary.

you can listen to the 51s game here

http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/app/milb/multimedia/audio.jsp

And the kind of #2 hitter Tracy is comfortable with.

I dont understand all the "The Sky is Falling" talk. Gagne's injury is left over from last season, which the Dodgers now have Baez to look to instead of an unproven Sanchez or Yhency. All injuries suffered yesterday are minor and we wont be seeing any players on the DL as a result. Nomar and Lofton aren't exactly being missed as Repko and Loney are filling in just fine for them.

The Dodgers have a healthy Drew a productive Cruz and a more solid starting rotation and bullpen.
What exactly is the problem here?

80

Seems to me, Simers is saying a lot of things about Ned -- not very nice things, either.

[cackle, cackle]

the minor league affliates have been dissapointing today with their offensive output. hopefully LV can turn that around. they are going against the giants Brad Hennessey.

Kim Ng is probably telling people "I told you I wasn't being too hard on Gagne during the arbitration hearing!"

93

Like I said, I love following prospects and realize that minor league stats can be predictive -- but I also accommodate the view that until you've done it in the majors, you haven't done anything. There are pretty strong question marks about each of those guys.

Lima gave up 4 runs in 5 innings today in AAA. Schmoll gave up 2 runs in 2/3 of an inning in relief of Lima. Needless to say, Norfolk didn't win

Brandon Watson's godfather is Eric Davis. Davis is also Jordan Farmar's godfather. He is like the Shawn Kemp of godfathers.

Sanchez four Ks in two innings, just struck out the side, up to 95 mph, trusting his offspeed stuff, too.

I really like Fred Lewis. Is his arm really so weak that he can't play CF?

96. Curtis Lowe
I dont understand all the "The Sky is Falling" talk.

If Kent and Drew go down, then I'll worry.

Doesn't Fred Lewis swing a glass bat?

Say goodnight Frank Robinson.

walking lewis isnt a good way to start a game.

its cool. billz strikes out ortmeier on a "high 90s" fb.

Without gagne, in my opinion the baez trade is looking unnecessary considering what we gave up.

Think about it, subract gagne from the bullpen, then nomar wasn't hitting the ball hard in spring training, which is making me wonder if he has lost his power, so our power consists of drew kent cruz period.
Our bench is pathetic.
Our starting pitching is average.

Its looking like baez might be the difference between 75 wins and 78 wins, not 84 wins and 87 wins.

Watching Frank Robinson get angry (and also get screwed by the umpires) makes me happy. I will go to hell for such things.

Remember that storm that hit LA earlier in the week? It finally got here to Utah and then stalled, so it snowed literally all day and we got nearly a foot of snow, on opening day for our minor league team. Thankfully, the Salt Lake Bees are opening on the road in Tucson.

no offense, but you are like a broken record MB.

112 See your confessor and maybe you can get a relatively light sentence of purgatory.

Keith Hernandez said when he started playing, players didn't charge the mound.

He has a very selective memory. There have been fights in baseball since ... forever.

108 - [cackle, cackle]

112

I know someone who has a personal confessor.

Six Nationals had been hit the last two games. One of them was AFTER the teams had been warned, but Sanchez wasn't ejected. Then Felix Rodriguez came in and hit Lo Duca.

He was ejected.

Justice is not always just.

114

Sorry, i was just giving the reason why i think the baez trade is now looking unnecessary, i guess i should have just said the baez trade was unnecessary in my opinion, without giving a reason why.

114 I've been wanting to say that for a while too.

You can't bring up Nomar's ineffectiveness since the trade was made before spring training. Plus, it's questionable whether EJ or Tiffany will ever contribute to any wins in their career, so any contribution could be called a plus, especially if the team gets it together and makes a run at it this year.

118 Can't you just find out when your favorite priest is giving confessions and show up at that time? Or do you mean the priest will make a house call?

Personally (and once upon a time), I found the idea of a face-to-face confession (rather than the behind-the-screen style they show in movies) rather uncomfortable.

guzman works the count to 3-2 but hits it back to the pitcher.

billingsley has gone 2 so far, 1 infield hit (should have been an error on aybar), 2bb, 2k.

What is the lineup for the 51's?

Nate, are you watching the Vegas game? Why should it have been an error on Aybar? Radio commentary?

Jon,

How do you get wind of those reports so quickly, such as the Gagne one?

You were ahead of ESPN, no?

I posted a Gameday link for the Vegas game below, so I don't think we need play by play.

re 125

radio commentary. it was a grounder to his right that bounced off his glove because he tried to backhand it.

51s lineup.
duncan
aybar
ethier
guzman
young
robles
martin
valdez
billingsley

there is a gameday available if you go to milb.com

billingsley hasnt given up a FB yet. thats how you succeed in vegas. good job chad.

124
Duncan CF
Aybar 3B
Ethier RF
Guzman 1B
Young LF
Robles 2B
Martin C
Valdez SS
Billingsley P

I really should have refreshed, as I was expecting nate would probably beat me if he hadn't left for the moment, so sorry about 130

Which number will be greater in 2006:

1. Gagne's saves
2. Nomar's homeruns

your lineup is better anyways king. you took the time to put their positions next to the name :)

126 - No, I didn't get advanced on this. MLB.com posted it.

What happened to Laroche?

aybar starts off the vegas fireworks with a double, scores first LV run. yay.

re 135

laroche is starting the season in AA.

That sucks. I was hoping to see him next week when the 51s battle the rivercats up here in Sac. At least we'll get to watch him play on southernguide.

For those who were against the Bayez trade, I don't see your logic, especially now, Bayez is a proven closer and now he is going to have that role for the Dodgers this year and who knows after that.

What I don't understand is why bring up Saito, rather than bringing up Tiffany and say you are the man who will spot start but most likely give us 3 innings of quality relief.

Rick Sutcliff on opening day pointed out that Bob Welch came up pitching long relief and short relief, before he became a starter. This is what the Dodgers need now Bayez may not be Gagne, but he is a reasonable replacement, we have plenty of 1 inning wonders, Brazabon, Orsina etc, but what maybe more important are the bridge pitchers.

[132] all nomar has to do is hit one, i think.

139
What do you mean by "proven closer"?

Tiffany was traded to get Baez.

140
That order might be taller than it sounds.

If all it took was skill to be a closer then David Riske, Arthur Rhodes, LaTroy Hawkins and countless other high skilled middle relief pitchers would not have failed when given the chance. The idea that you can take any high skilled pitcher and turn him into a closer is a myth just as clutch hitting is a myth. Some can do it, some can't. Baez has, the real question is can he still do it as his skills decline. Time will tell but I don't see how anyone can say the trade isn't more important now then when it was made. If Ned was going to trade for a closer today he'd be giving up a heck of a lot more then a single A pitcher and a twice failed prospect. You'd be seeing the real prospects being tossed to the wind. Kuo couldn't even get 3 outs without walking two guys and someone said they would be happy with him as the closer. I'd like to actually see him pitch a major league inning without incident one time at least before I annoint him as a closer.

Clearly, some relievers are better than others. The question is, do you want to limit your best reliever - whether it's Baez or whoever - to only pitching the ninth, when a key situation might come sooner. I say no.

The idea that Arthur Rhodes and LaTroy Hawkins are highly skilled pitchers is a myth.

Quick question: How many Double letter rows are there in the reserved section? AA is the first row, and I know theres BB, is there a CC also?

dah, 2-run hr to fred lewis.

Billingsley got his first taste of vegas...a 2 run homer from the leadoff man after allowing a hit to the pitcher

144
Kuo pitched 5 innings last year and had 10 strikeouts. So Kuo has pitched an inning in the bigs.

radio guy said it didnt seem lewis got all of that.

146
That is just because you don't understand what makes up a highly skilled pitchers toolset and it is easier for you to make pithy TJ Simers comments then to take the time to understand something that is beyond your scope.

I guess that will be my last comment for a week.

151 If the wind's blowing right, you don't need to get all of it. Billingsley has done fine tonight, it's not his fault the Dodgers are pitching him in Vegas.

147

They've renumbered and releterred the rows.

What section are you sitting in? The bottom part of the reserved section shouldn't have double lettered rows.

The upper part does. And those sections all got distinct aisle numbers this year.

the 3ks are low. everything else i dont mind.

Actually, I'm looking at for tickets for friday night's game on the ticket exchange right now. Found section 4RS, Row B tickets....should be good right? There are some tix that say 12RS, row BB...those are the ones im confused about.

At least the 51s decided to try to give Chad the win, even after the homer tied it. Men on the corners with Ethier up, one run in (Valdez, Duncan, and Alvarez have done the damage in this inning, no prospects)

Toy Cannon,

I know this hurts your case, but I agree. Well said.

That is just because you don't understand what makes up a highly skilled pitchers toolset

I'm learning. Apparently, the first tool in any highly skilled pitcher's toolkit is an enormous WHIP.

Nate,

So much for my hope that Aybar would be the leadoff man in Vegas. I believe that's the spot that's most conducive to his development. It's like last September did not exist.

They are just teeing off on Hennessey

leadoff and hitting 2nd isnt that much different. hes at the top of the order setting the table still.

They are just teeing off on Hennessey

and he only gets charged with 1ER. he leaves the game with an era of 1.93. lol

I have both Baez and Gagne in my fantasy league; is it yet safe to say that I can release the latter and pick someone else up? Who will be the new setup man? Yhency? Carter? Help!

156

Section 12 is the part of the Reserved level ABOVE the concourse. Those rows have double letters.

12 is the first section like that just to the first base side of the stadium.

Baez had a career year, last year. It seems more likely luck than a break out, since his peripherals remained the same. Maybe he really is a poor man's Gagne (he'd have to have another breakout, this year, to match any of Gagne's big three; looks like we'll have a chance to find out), but I suspect he's a rich man's Paul Quantrill.

158- Can you explain what makes a closer special? Why it doesn't follow that a good closer is just a good relief pitcher who happens to be used in the way he is?

This is a perfectly earnest request; not that I'm above being glib, but if there's something to this that I can't see, I'm happy to have it shown to me.

145. Jon Weisman

Saving your best one inning pitcher to pitch in the 9th doesn't make sense to me either. Maybe teams should have a closer for the 9th inning and a "terminator" for situations with runners on with no one out for innings 6,7 or 8. :)

martins looked pretty bad this game. 2ks is reallh unmartin like

I love the A's announcers because they refuse to call the Angels the "LA Angels". Instead, they call them the "Angels of Anaheim".

168 - We call them "smokejumpers."

171. Jon Weisman

I had to google that one.

smokejumpers -- their job is to attack small wildland fires in remote areas before they grow too large.

Appropriate name but it doesn't roll off the tongue very well.

great AB by ethier. falling behind to a big lefty 0-2, battles back to 3-2 and on the 11th pitch, lines a single into CF.

This is so upseting. Really. I just have nothing to say.

From CBS Sportsline:
Dodgers trainer Stan Johnston said on a conference call Thursday night there was no immediate timetable for the return of Gagne, who saved 152 games from 2002-04 and was a near-unanimous winner of the NL Cy Young Award in 2003.

"I wouldn't say that," Johnston replied when asked if Gagne might miss the entire season. "After the surgeons get finished, there will be a timetable."

141, my definition of a proven closer is Bayez in that he has done it with a reasonable amount of success-41 saves last year. To john's point about using your best pitcher even if a closer at the most crucial time, is an argument that makes much sense, but sadley is not used by most teams.

My point is that given the structure of the exisitng team and the reserves at Las Vegas and the "real politic" of our current management and major league baseball-I think it makes the most sense to bring up the best arm who can contribute the most innings. Brining up just another releaver to replace one-doesn't make sense to me.

Louis,
I'm not being critical, but are you deliberately misspelling Baez?

kobes had like a million turnovers. he needs to stop trying to go one on one

178 Yahoo's box score says he has 2.

And people scoffed at me picking the Padres to win the division

You arent the only one. I picked them too.

Bradley and Gagne were the two players I most looked forward to seeing play the last few years. Playoffs or not, this team will not have swagger.

Its boring cheering for players with little upside whom arent good enough currently to be of any relevance in making the playoffs.

according to henson, saito will be called up

From Gagne to Saito.

Everything that was worth rooting for the last few years, has basically just left in one winter.

Wake me in 3 years.

167 I part company with many on this site in believing there is a difference between a "closer" and a merely good relief pitcher that has to do with a combination of physical and extra-physical skills. A few factors that make one a closer:

-Confidence in more than one pitch.
-Confidence in situations where the margin for error is minuscule.
-The ability to intimidate batters, and make them feel their chances of success are slight, which becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
-A certain theatrical ability, which produces favorable changes in the level of emotion among the fans. The "10th man" as an incremental factor only matters occasionally, but they way fans respond to the arrival of a notably successful closer is one of those moments.

I think the simple reason relief pitchers with these characteristics have evolved into one-inning "closers" was probably to allow them to be used more frequently during the season, since their effect on game outcomes was so positive. And for all the discussion of "smokejumpers," the fact is the ninth inning is often the most decisive inning.

The downside, however, is that a team's best relief pitcher begins to look at the 9th inning save as a kind of career entitlement, and that's dumb. Not all 9th innings are created equally. It's true that in some games, and against some teams, it might be better to use that pitcher against the 3-4-5 part of the lineup late in a game, regardless of which inning. Conversely, holding a three run lead against a lousy team with the bottom of the order coming to bat in the 9th shouldn't count in the save statistics.

But all in all, I think the closer is no Easter Bunny, he's real. Gagne was a classic. I just don't know enough about Baez to be able to say whether he could fill that role even half as well as Gagne did. However, I liked the way he pitched Tuesday night, so I'll choose for now to be hopeful that while Gagne recuperates, Baez will make good.

177. Bob Timmermann

y Bobb Timerman did you ask?

Bob, thank you for the correction, I think my Passover logistics are getting the best of me-if we could I would love to have spell check..Please Jon don't ban me after that statement, in an earlier life I was a radio journalist and my sister still is very much involved in the trade

Are MartinBillingsley31 and oldbear related?

Are MartinBillingsley31 and oldbear related?

i dont think so, but their opinions do seem to intertwine with one another.

183
Louis,
Some people (like me) make deliberate misspelling to make a joke and I thought I was missing out.

Since Vin Scully pronounces Baez's first name as "Danny", that may be what we go with, but I still think that in Cuba, the "s" in Danys wasn't silent.

Baez's first name is actually Denis, and his last name is actually Gonzalez...

181- So, there is such a thing as a closer, but save counts are the way to find one. Of your four criteria, it seems like one and three would be universal to good pitchers. Two and four are different; intangible, right? Was there anything about Gagne, in 2001, that made him look like he had either?

Baez's saves/blown saves over the last three years:

2003: 25/10
2004: 30/3
2005: 41/8

Over his career, Baez has blown about 20% of his total Save Opportunities.

Bbref says "Denis Baez Gonzalez"
Dodgers.com says "Danys Joseph Baez"

I need to get a look at his passport sometime.

Save counts ARE NOT the way to find one. I recast the sentence, but forgot that I'd changed the. . .Yeah, never mind. Sorry.

the AP story has been updated. this is disturbing.

Johnston said Gagne told him Wednesday he had been pitching in pain all spring

why not let the club know sooner gagne? quit trying to be mr. tough guy and try and get healthy.

188
I think I've asked about this before, but does anyone know where to find stats on save percentage? It would be nice to know what the average is, and what a "good" percentage is.

Some Spanish language sites that have pages from before the time Baez defected have his name as "Denis Baez".

So, he must have made some changes when he changed citizenship. I believe he's a Costa Rican citizen. That's where he went after he defected.

188. Andrew Shimmin
Over his career, Baez has blown about 20% of his total Save Opportunities.

That ain't good.

Actually, I agree with pretty much everything Miltie, MB31, GoBears, D4P, and BigCPA post.

This team is being ran backwards, and the only ones that seem to be 100% still optimistic are those that take Baseball America's word as the gospel that there are superstars in the minor leagues.

Nevermind the Dodgers mess up the youngsters before they even get here.

--Moving Broxton
==Moving Guzman
--Moving Denker

Even the minor league stuff is messed up.

If one were to not be optimistic about the minor leaguers, what from the 25-man roster would be worth watching? They've cut, traded, or demoted every high upside young player.

Honestly, its ridiculous.

You can only look the other way for so long.

To be precise, the last name is Báez.

LOL Joseph..there is no way a Cuban is named Joseph...Josef perhaps?

When people argue about stuff about if a team should or shouldn't have a closer..it makes me wonder about every other concept that's been ingrained to us by every team..

With so many offensive statistics these days I think most people have figured out that the traditional roles are useless...all you need are players that get on base or that bring them home..preferably with all hitters doing both...pitching however has so many different roles that it gets ridiculous..

Why have a 5man rotation if there's a pitcher that can throw 400 innings a season like back in the day? Or maybe you expand the micromanaging of a single game towards a whole season..you have your "closer" starter pitching once or twice in a big series against a rival/good team and use your crapper starters (Tomko comes to mind) against your Rockies/Nats...

I'm not saying that would work..it would probably fail miserably..but there are enough ridiculous ideas that anyone can come up with that I really have no idea what does or doesn't work in baseball..you could fill your staff with a bunch of 3 inning pitchers and who knows that would work too..i've been rambling for much too long...

This team is being ran backwards, and the only ones that seem to be 100% still optimistic are those that take Baseball America's word as the gospel that there are superstars in the minor leagues.

thats an uncalled for jab.

Well, I don't know about the rest of you, but little things like my life and my job are making it rather hard to keep up with in-season Dodger Thoughts and are just in general interfering with my desire to park on the internet all day and watch and talk about baseball. Alas.

Thought I would pass along that in the Post article about tonight's Nationals' game the writer calls both Pedro and Guillen "drama queens." The two teams next meet at the Nationals' home opener; surely tonight's brawl ought to see a few thousand tickets, no?

It's just sad about Gagne. When he was so locked in a couple of years ago, he was really something amazing to watch. It's pretty hard to imagine he'll ever get there again at this point.

If Cleveland had used Betancourt exclusively in save situations, and used Wickman otherwise in close situations, would they have been nearly as successful? Betancourt was clearly their best reliever and took care of all the close situations that didn't involve a "narrow" lead in the 9th inning. Wickman was an above average reliever with a bit of a lucky ERA, who took care of the 3 run saves and the few truly tough saves. Wickamn was used in 14 games where he didn't have a save opportunity, compared to the likes of Mariano and Lidge, who had 24 games which they played in without a save situation. I don't have a rundown of the game situations, but I'm guessing Betancourt had much tougher situations than Wickman did on average.

It seems to me this is the best set up, don't use your best reliever as the closer, which I believe is essentially what Jon has said previously. Now that I think about it, this doesn't really seem to aid the argument of the importance of a closer, and the ability to close, but I'll post it anyways.

195. oldbear
You can only look the other way for so long.

lol So, you are looking down?

When people argue about stuff about if a team should or shouldn't have a closer..it makes me wonder about every other concept that's been ingrained to us by every team

And that's the sweet spot.

195,198
I'm pretty sure Nate is Tommy Lasorda's grandson.

197 If there's a Cuban named Leslie Anderson, then why not Joseph? It's not like there's never been a communist named Joseph.

Although I'm still amused over Anderson's name, he stuck out like a sore thumb on Cuba's WBC roster

It's not that there's a problem with Joseph, its just that..well..Denis Joseph Baez Gonzalez...something looks out of place..

Bob, appreciate your thoughts on my spelling, but is anyone on my wave length regarding the more pressing issue of why we are bringing up a pitcher who most think is average at best, replacing a pitcher who however, miss used was exceptional, when we could be bringing up a pitcher who in Billingsly everyone seems to think has the most potential?

Is Derek Lowe still scheduled to start on Sunday?

Tomko Friday, Lowe Saturday, Penny Sunday.

Sam breathes a sigh of relief.

so... loss, loss, win?

im assuming the sat game is during the day.

It'd be relatively easy to make a Save% and then run a regression to find out what's good, but I'm not sure it'd be worth it. The trouble with Saves, as dzzrtRatt (not alone, but most recently) pointed out is that they don't mean anything specific, so it's like trying to figure out if a player is good using only his BA. Unless dzzrtRatt is also right that there's more to closing than meets the eye. In which case it might be an indication of an intangible quality?

206- My question is why they're bothering to bring up another pitcher, when Cody Ross has already gotten two PH appearences.

from John Sickels 2006 predictions:
Biggest One-Month Surprise: Brett Tomko goes 4-0, 1.25 in April and wins Pitcher of the Month award.

Don't shoot the messenger.

holy cow kobe...

211
You may be right, though I think Save % should at least be mentioned anytime # of saves is mentioned. I mean, is a guy who saves 40 out of 50 games a better "closer" than a guy who saves 20 out of 20?

That really is such great news.

Why are they bringing up a pitcher at all? Don't we have too many already? We have a replacement for Gagne in Baez. By design, Baez was Gagne-in-waiting, so by definition he didn't need to be replaced. I think with all the Gagne-grieviing, Neddy panicked and his brain cramped with that move.

I didnt mean that as a personal shot at you Nate. I mean the "minor leaguers will save us all" attitude that alot of Dodger fans have. It just eerily reminds me of 2003 when all everyone could talk about was how Edwin Jackson/Greg Miller were gonna be the next Drysdale/Koufax, all the while ignoring what was going on at the MLB level.

Its a bleak time when everything about an organization goes against your core beliefs about what makes a team win. I find myself at odds with the Dodgers.

195

Actually, I agree with pretty much everything Miltie, MB31, GoBears, D4P, and BigCPA post.

Thanks oldbear, i got an uncalled for jab from nate, then a follow up by overkill94.
Its good to see someone appreciates my posts.
Maybe i'll take some time off from this site.

will Lawler's Law prevail tonight? lakers first one to 100...

D4P you've come a long way when Oldbear agrees with everything you say. Now all you have to do is stop watching baseball and make all of your baseball judgments based on the game with the spinning disks, and you'll be just like the rest of us.

220
That's the first time anyone has ever said anything like that about me. I was shocked. For one thing, I don't even know what I'm talking about most of the time...

When the home team is ready to start the top of the sixth tied or with a small lead, how does the manager determine his most critical time to use his best reliever? We only know the most critical time after the game is over. I would hold him until the estimated final 25 or so pitches to "close" the game.

Using the top save getters from last year:

Player/ Career Blown Save%

Chad Cordero/12.7
Bob Wickman/21.2%
K-Rod/ 21.1%
Trevor Hoffman/10.5%
Mariano Rivera/12.1%
Joe Nathan/12%
Brad Lidge/14.9%
Danys Baez/18.9%
Todd Jones/21.0%
Jason Isringhausen/13.9%
Derrick Turnbow/08.7%

Maybe if I tied it to something, instead of just throwing it out there, there would be a way to tell if it correlated to anything. Just for fun:

Gagne/3.6%

Carmelo with the dagger!

Late, and horn tooting, but I did some research into our friend Takashi.

http://dodgermath.com/?p=262

Not Luke Walton! Anybody but him.

221 Most of us don't know what we are talking about, but we do a good job of pretending like we do.

222 I'll pretend to know what I'm talking about right now (just throwing it out there).

I think the idea would be more like this - pitcher A (for argument, the starter) walks a couple of guys, the heart of the order is coming up, etc. You have a thin lead or the game is still within reach in the later innings.

Of course, someone can argue the later innings part. Heck, there might even be a more crucial part of the game later on. But at that moment, it's the most important pitching "moment" of the game.

Gagne was the only one in the bunch that never served time as a setup man.

223
I'm not so concerned with whether it correlates with anything as whether or not it helps tell more than just # of saves alone. Looking at those figures, I see that Baez blows quite a few saves. Should I be impressed with his high number of saves if he also has a high number of blown saves? Or, should I be more impressed with a guy who has fewer saves, but a higher save percentage?

darn. not really a good day for my respective sports teams.

I'm watching Crash. It's unpleasant.

230
You still got Budinger.

thats true trainwreck. i still have the great white hope and national championship aspirations for the wildcats next year.

and... i still have my prospects....(even though i know 3/4ths of them will fail to live up to expectations)

231
I could have warned you about that.

I've seen Yokohama pitch a bunch of times and according to my scorebooks, Saito never pitched in one. Nor did Saitoh!

I guess what I'm trying to say about the "Save" stat is that it would seemingly be more meaningful if it were a ratio than just a count. For example, how meaningful is it to talk about the number of earned runs a pitcher gave up last year? If I were to say "Pitcher X gave up 50 runs last year," you would have no idea whether that was good or bad unless you also knew how many innings that pitcher pitched. Thus, we use ERA rather than just # of ERs.

I see Saves the same way. How can I know whether 30 saves is good or bad unless I also know how many opportunities it took to get those 30 saves? I feel confident saying that every pitcher in the league could have 30 saves if given enough opportunities. Some might only need 30 opportunities to get 30 saves, while others might need all 162 games. But just knowing that they got to 30 doesn't mean much unless we know how many opportunities it took to get there.

All that being said, I don't mean to imply that getting to 30 saves (or even getting to one save) is necessarily any kind of accomplishment.

234- You did; possibly in exactly those words. But I figured I was probably much hipper than you. 8^) Guess not.

236
Much hipper than a guy who has a collection of "scorebooks"...?

New post up top.