Baseball Toaster was unplugged on February 4, 2009.
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TV and more ...
1) using profanity or any euphemisms for profanity
2) personally attacking other commenters
3) baiting other commenters
4) arguing for the sake of arguing
5) discussing politics
6) using hyperbole when something less will suffice
7) using sarcasm in a way that can be misinterpreted negatively
8) making the same point over and over again
9) typing "no-hitter" or "perfect game" to describe either in progress
10) being annoyed by the existence of this list
11) commenting under the obvious influence
12) claiming your opinion isn't allowed when it's just being disagreed with
Back about 10 years ago, I had a friend and former boss who was writing for The Naked Truth, which once upon a time was the most anticipated sitcom of the upcoming television season. That's right - even bigger than Caroline in the City. Starring Tea Leoni, it was going to be sexy. It was going to be funny. It was going to perform.
As it happened, the show didn't live up to expectations. Not even close. It was painful. In fact, so many things went awry with the production that my friend later commented to me that it was as if the entire thing had been shot atop a Native American burial ground.
The people involved with this pseudo-debacle, of course, got paid and moved on to their next challenge, but that didn't make their professional lives, their passions, their desire to do good work, much more tolerable. And that's where we are with the Dodgers, now that Game Over: The Eric Gagne Show has been put on hiatus.
Though our collective frustration with the Dodger injuries makes it tempting to take a shot at the Dodger medical staff, I'm going to hold off, since I really have no way of knowing whether its work is good or bad. (At best, we can once again know not to trust any soothing medical news coming from Chavez Ravine.) But you have to shudder to consider what the Dodger injury report would look like if the trainers and doctors could possibly do a worse job. For years, now, they have appeared powerless to prevent injuries and powerless to accelerate any recovery. There is one recent exception to this pattern in Cesar Izturis (due back from Tommy John surgery in well under a year), an exception that compels you to suggest that the day the Dodgers think Izturis is healthy, that's the day he should be sealed inside a glass vitrine for at least another month for his own protection.
While we wait to gather evidence on the medical staff, we turn to Gagne. Now, I love Gagne to death and feel bad kicking him when he's down, but the wheel in Gagne's brain is missing a spoke. His occasional mindless comments about how much the team needs to spend to win and his own need for respect through salary payments are the least of it. Barely a year ago, Gagne blundered into the cardinal sin of pitchers, altering his mechanics to compensate for an injury he suffered playing pepper, and soon found himself needing surgery. (This alteration, rather than the erroneous accusations that he was overworked in the second half of 2004, was the most probable cause.) Tonight, we learn from Dodger trainer Stan Johnston (via The Associated Press) that Gagne only revealed Wednesday that he had been pitching in pain all spring.
Mon dieu! What does it take to teach Gagne that his macho act serves no one? Pitching in pain? In March?! I'm telling you, I want to slap him.
Here's an idea for teams that sign pitchers to long-term contracts. Insert a clause that says that if the player doesn't acknowledge he's pitching in pain, the contract is void. And if a team forces a pitcher to pitch in pain and he gets hurt, the contract's salary is doubled. I'm only being partly facetious. These wise, wise old baseball men, they need someone to protect them from themselves.
Tell me I never played the game all you want. Baseball people are dumb. I love 'em, but they're dumb. That's the naked truth.
* * *
Some more details from Ken Gurnick at MLB.com about the injury and what Gagne faces:
Club officials said doctors will remove the same sensory nerve in Gagne's forearm that was entrapped by scar tissue and released through surgery last June.
The club said no timetable for his return could be determined until the surgery is performed, but it is believed an optimistic forecast (Editor's note - sound alarm bells) would be four to six weeks. He will be placed on the 15-day disabled list and replaced in the bullpen by Japanese right-hander Takashi Saito, whose contract was purchased from Triple-A Las Vegas. ...
Johnston explained that doctors will remove the nerve that runs just under the skin along the forearm and crosses the elbow. Doctors isolated the nerve as the problem by numbing it Wednesday night and having Gagne throw a ball. The fact that the pain disappeared indicated that the nerve, and not scar tissue, was the cause of the pain.
Doctors released that nerve and relocated it in a 90-minute procedure last year, but according to Johnston, "That didn't calm it down well enough to pitch." Gagne underwent Tommy John elbow reconstruction in 1997.
He sprained his knee during the first week of spring workouts last year and rushed back to the mound four weeks later, pitching with an awkward hop to protect his leg. At the end of Spring Training, he suffered a sprained elbow ligament, although he insisted it had nothing to do with his knee injury. It is believed, however, that scar tissue formed from the elbow sprain and entrapped the nerve.
* * *
Update: Will Carroll checks in at Baseball Prospectus:
In about 20% of cases (according to a 1992 Kerlan-Jobe study), elbow reconstruction patients have problems with the ulnar nerve, but in this case, it is a sensory nerve crossing the elbow that is trapped. Some patients have pain when scarring entraps the nerve, while others have parasthesias--pain, numbness or tingling in the affected enervations. The ulnar nerve handles the pinkie finger and outside of the hand, something that would greatly affect Gagne when he grips his changeup. This sensory nerve appears to control feeling in the forearm.
There's no real track record for this type of surgery (excision) for a baseball pitcher, giving us little to go on for an estimate of recovery. The Dodgers have said he'll miss 4-6 weeks, though I think his season's in jeopardy.
I'm going to be nitpicky and I apologize..
Almost all baseball players have pain when they throw. It's when the pain is abnormal or unbearable that it becomes a problem.
That being said, there is a difference between the normal nagging thing and the "holy crap, my arm isn't working the right way" kind of pain.
That stupid playing through pain thing is pushed on most athletes when they are growing up. I remember one time that I got spiked during a practice during winter ball (instructional, games don't count league). I only had one stitch, but it still kind of hurt. I decided to skip the game that weekend. I figured it was winter ball and no way in heck was I going to let the wound get infected or anything over a stupid game that didn't count.
I was in high school at the time and my fellow teamates called me a you know what (female cat) for skipping the game. Of course, these same guys would skip games because they wanted to go to the beach or hang out with chicks..
That stupid playing through pain thing is pushed on most athletes when they are growing up. I remember one time that I got spiked during a practice during winter ball (instructional, games don't count league). I only had one stitch, but it still kind of hurt. I decided to skip the game that weekend. I figured it was winter ball and no way in heck was I going to let the wound get infected or anything over a stupid game that didn't count.
I was in high school at the time and my fellow teamates called me a you know what (female cat) for skipping the game. Of course, these same guys would skip games because they wanted to go to the beach or hang out with chicks..
While running cross country, I turned my knee running down a hill, nothing major, but it was discovered that I was slightly favoring my other leg.
Weeks later, whenever I would start running, I would have a noticable limp, but I was fine once I took a few strides. A little bit after that, the pain wouldn't wear off after the initial start, and I could barely move.
Turns out I had a massive stress fracture and I was out for the season. It all started when I was favoring that leg from a minor leg turn. After this, I learned my lesson about "being a man" through injuries. You'd think with millions on the line, Gagne would too.
I think you can handle it.
http://tinyurl.com/no9wk
I wouldn't think many 28-year old women in good shape just drop dead suddenly.
I'm hoping (perhaps against hope) that the fact that the nerve is close to th skin will make the surgery less invasive and shorten the recovery time.
Finally, Frank Jobe is a legend and a pioneer. But, it must be said, he is also pushing it in years. Surely, he has lost a step or two on his fastball. It might be time for him to move into the coaching ranks.
They called you a Queen? what were you wearing?
This line was confusing though...
"Army was Dixon's her first head coaching job."
If you must ask, I was wearing my tiara.. I tried to keep that part out of the story!
what a high roller!
That is terrible news. Has not even hit major networks yet. Really sad to see someone with so much ahead of them lose their life suddenly.
That kid must be loaded.
actually hes not rich but hes a damn good poker player. I think buss probably isnt playing very high stakes right now.
interesting. i havent played 500 NL before. the highest ive played is 100.
28
I share your opinion of that movie
I don't share the opinion of the movie. I thought it was pretty good (not great, best picture). It was worth a watch and some of the character sketches were interesting, but the redemptions just seemed to come way to easy.
To that end, here's a quick list of Dodger injury problems - not injuries themselves because (stuff) happens, but examples of mishandled medical situations.
Dreifort! Dreifort! Dreifort! Darren will forever be remember as injury-prone, but how much of that was the fault of his body and how much was the fault of his body's caretakers?
Werth's wrist.
Penny. Heads should've rolled the moment he threw that abortive warm-up toss after his initial biceps strain.
Odalis Perez. Not just an injury, but one that created clubhouse ill will. Remember late in the '03 season when he complained nobody believed he was hurt?
Gagne. His pitching while favoring his knee last spring, woo. Has the term "injury cascade" ever been heard in Chavez Ravine?
I recall Kevin Brown had a stretch where nagging injuries kept him sidelined.
Todd Hundley. Damaged goods when LA got him, but couldn't they have issused a pre-trade warning his elbow was toast?
That's all I can think of.
Good night.
How long did Koufax pitch in pain successfully, in my mind based on my readings at least a year. However, he would have had a perfect right to retire at least a year or two early...Kirk Gibson, played in pain throughout the playoffs and World Series. He would have been complety justified to say no to being on the WS roster in 1988 ....While I don't see any quick fix to this great question and don't know how much the additional conditioning will help other Dodgers, I hope mnagement looks at this as an opportunity to really be creative and smart with its talent. I question the call-up to replace Gagne right now, but perhaps management is waiting for a better look at the other candidates in Las Vegas. This in my mind is a year to error on the side of being aggressive-bring them up earlier, rather than waiting a year.
Look at our bullpen without Ned's foresight.
1) Brazoban (struggled last season)
2) Kuo (rookie)
3) Osorio (rookie)
4) Saito (rookie)
5) Hamulak (rookie)
6) ?????
7) ?????
Thanks to Ned's foresight, Baez and Carter make up for those question marks.
My initial reaction to the news was depression. But I've got my bearings back.
Look for Ned to weave more of his magic and make a trade to bolster our bullpen. Ned's already improved our offense tenfold. This is no time to panic. I have confidence Ned's a GM who can deal with the injury bug. We'll be alright.
I do know these things:
1) I, too, am thankful Colletti traded for Baez.
2) I know someone else, also an athlete (not a pro) who had similar nerve surgery - also a nerve near the surface of the arm and she was back to playing softball less than two months later. That said, this wasn't Gagne we're talking about here and the question for me isn't will he be able to pitch again and relatively soon, because I think the answer is yes to both, but how effectively?
Also: Why did they call up Saito? They think Broxton's not quite ready, or wouldn't pitch enough, I'm guessing? Saito's more of a "veteran"? Not necessarily criticizing the move, just wondering aloud...
Anyway, here's to an injury free weekend. Otherwise, this is starting to seem like an Agatha Christie movie.
At Friday night's Angel game, my wife commented how much thinner he looked than the last couple of years. Isn't that what everyone has been doing when comparing pictures of Bonds before and after?
Cowherd on ESPNRadio has been going off this morning about Gagne and steroids, and how the problem can't be confined to just hitters. He is more often than not a blowhard, but its hard to argue with him on this.
I think, although he will never say it, Coletti saw the writing on the wall. That is why we have a new closer.
46 It may be true NC saw the writing on the wall about Gagne, but not about steroids, about his health in general. It's easy right now to make assumptions because of the steroid obsession and it's certainly possible this affected Gagne somehow, but there's plenty of evidence to the contrary, or to that it's a coincidence. The guy's body seemed less steroid-driven and more porkchop-formed. The decline in zip in his fastball is likely due to all the arm problems and pain. I still say they should have given him a bionic arm a year ago when they had the chance.
anyhow- "bluetahoe" ;)
we really do appreciate your nostradomus like forecast in getting solid bodied relievers baez and carter. after their aquisition, i was kind of secretly hoping gagne would go down. i'd also like to thank you for your wisdom in backing up other injury prone position with capable able bodied iron men like olmedo saenz, sandy alomar jr., ramon part deux, cody ross, and jason repko.
in humble gratitude,
jesse
Maybe Gagne pitched in pain because of the enormous pressure and derision from the media, fellow players, coaches, and even intelligent fans such as those found here.
LOL
i'm sure it's not mr. ned. ned doesn't use computers, remember?
BTW has Ramon II begun wearing #18. In the 4/5 photo gallery there is an unnamed Dodger apparently playing 2nd wearing #18 who I don't recognize ( at this point in the season it would be unusual for me to recognize more than a handful).
I have a question about the minor league line-ups yesterday. Isn't Corey Dunlap one of our 1B prospects? Was injured and that's why he didn't play or did we get rid of him sometime this off-season?
I'm no expert, but I think the belief that "If you use steroids, you will be buff" is a myth. In order to be buff, I think you probably also need to work out. Steroids without working out, however, nevertheless aid recovery and recuperation, which is critical for closers who pitch almost every day.
he came into camp way out of shape and is too fat to play baseball so he is in extended spring training.
He is on the roster at Vero Beach but they didn't roll him out to play yesterday-pun intended!
So would I. But that's not saying much, since the typical opinion elsewhere is that nothing short of arterial spray should keep a player off the field.
Shawn Green changed me for good on this when he revealed, after struggling all season in 2003, that he'd been playing with a sore shoulder. A few weeks off might have made a big difference.
Asterisks at the beginning and end of the passage.
lets start the betting line at 2.
Isnt that line pretty much consistent with every game so far this season?
Does anyone have photographic proof that Kenny Lofton indeed wears 6 in a Dodgers uniform?
It seems clear that he'll lose some sensation in two of his fingers...
It seems clear that he'll lose some sensation in two of his fingers...
As for Gagne, clearly he wasn't right all spring, capped off by his poor outing in the Freeway Series. Even without this latest problem,he was going to have to be brought along slowly this year anyway.
Baez gets a lot of grief on this site, perhaps because many commenters prefer the lure of the potential of minor leaguers.
But despite his perceived flaws, the guy saved a lot of games for a garbage team, and has the added incentive of his walk year. We'll just have to wait and see.
if it is his ulnar nerve, but stan johnson the trainer said it was just a "sensory nerve" just under the skin. we'll see though.
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=4952
So Kenny Lofton really does exist? Wow.
Will uses yet another spelling of Baez's first name. He uses Danny.
I need standardization!
I have no love for Tea Leoni. I also remember The Naked Truth being like the 3rd sitcom on the 3rd network functioning as Leoni's star vehicle and she flared out every single time. I still have no idea what H'Wood sees in her. Casting couch might have something to do with it.
Typical "Hollywood celebrity behavior," probably, but please don't generalize to all people in Los Angeles. There are far more regular joes here. I am really tired of the stereotypes.
On to baseball--I agree with Jon that a lot of the responsibility lies with Gagne. I've doubted the medical staff and their brimming optimism for a few years now.
But the player also has to communicate when he's hurting, and Gagne is a fiery competitor, which is also his weakness. He pushed himself to get out there last spring on a bad knee. Colborn, Tracy, and the rest of the staff let him, which was inexcusable to me, as well as unbelievable. The hopping around was the starkest communication you could get, and it was discounted--more stupidity. I will never understand why they wouldn't give the knee a little more time to heal, even if it meant not being ready for the season, rather than risking more serious injury. We can never prove the theory that the knee injury caused the elbow problems, but it is entirely reasonable to believe it did.
I wonder if Gagne's past experiences with hockey have given him somewhat of a Black Knight "Oh, it's just a scratch" sort of attitude about injuries.
And not to be too pollyanna-ish, but for anyone who is fretting about the Dodgers this early in the year, just a reminder:
Record to start 2005: 12 and 2.
As for tonight, I predict Tomko gives up one home run (tough lineup to keep homer-less), but the game is close.
"Paging Mr. Drew. Mr J.D. Drew, please come to the white paging phone."
some notables:
aubrey huff
derrek lee
alphonso soriano
melvin mora
carlos lee
milton bradley
juan pierre
jose gullien
jason schmidt
kerry wood (cubs will buy him out)
kelvim escobar
andy pettitte
mark mulder
barry zito
Derrek Lee is probably the class of the bunch, and i dont see him leaving the cubs.
5ip, 4h, 2er, 2bb, 3k, 1hr, 7-2 WIN
73 pitches (48/25)
Jacksonville picked up where they left off with a 2-0 win on a Brad Cresse walkoff 2-run HR. 5ip, 4k, 1bb for starter Danny Muegge. LaRoche 1-4. Top of the order is Abreu, Hu, Kemp, LaRoche.
------------
Mulder appears to be midway through a total collapse; his acquisition would almost certainly be disastrous.
To me, the two most appealing names on that list are Derrek Lee and, I hate to say it, Milton Bradley. Also, Melvin Mora could be a good pickup. He's one of the 10 best hitters in baseball, can play multiple positions, and would likely come relatively cheaply since he's nowhere near as famous as players of his caliber usually are.
Unfortunately, Colletti so far seems much more interested in a player's reputation than in his actual performance on the field. (Read: Garciaparra)
The sellout crowd was ready to erupt in the eighth inning. Closer Brian Fuentes jogged in to the intimidating riff of, um, Village People's "YMCA."
"Oh, I heard it. I was waiting for my song to come on, then crickets. It was disappointing," Fuentes said before Wednesday's game. "There's definitely a big difference when you come in and it's 'YMCA' instead of my song being played loud. That gets the adrenaline going and the crowd into it."
Beginning last season, Fuentes has entered to Staind's "For You," a much harder rocking tune.
A mini-controversy bubbled in New York on Tuesday, with talk-radio callers angry that the Mets' Billy Wagner had the audacity to enter to Metallica's "Enter Sandman," a song for years identified with Yankees' legend Mariano Rivera.
Rivera said he didn't mind if Wagner continued using the tune, and Metallica's manager offered his blessing.
So, back to the issue at hand, what is Baez gonna enter with?
And even though we ain't got money, I'm so in love with ya honey,
And everything will bring a chain of love.
And in the morning when I rise, you bring a tear of joy to my eyes,
And tell me everything is gonna be alright.
I like Mora, too. Would LA want to invest in a 3rd baseman, when they already signed Mueller through next year and have LaRoche (and Blake DeWitt). Probably not, unless they want to do what they're doing with others - move him to another position. Could certainly use his power...
Yo soy un hombre sincero
de donde cresce
la palma
y antes morir me quiero
echar mi versos de l'alma.
It would make me run through a brick wall.
And then Lee goes deep...
Your throat wouldn't survive the rubber ball assault if they played either song.
Apparently Lee hit it into the wind.
You say you're lookin' for someone
Who's never weak, but always strong
To protect you and defend you
Whether you are right or wrong
Someone to open each and every door...
But it ain't me, babe
No, no, no,
It ain't me, babe
It ain't me you're lookin' for babe.
Oh, of course.
http://www.song-teksten.com/song_lyrics/defari/focused_daily/405_friday_s/
I wanna fly the world, like (??)
flies, to Is-rael, and like Ishmael Valdez
I pitch heat, lyrically
Over rugged beats under the ground, from the mainstream
See where I dwells, it's all about skills
This MC walk the walk when he talk, plus get on the wheels
But there's some explicitness - the PA folks wouldn't play it. Oh well!
The lights go out in the whole stadium, No Quarter by Led Zeppelin and cue the smog machine with flashing strobe lights. now thats an entrance!
If goin with Dylan, how about changing of the guard?? Or
Don't fall apart on me tonight..
Don't think twice it's alright..
Drifters Escape..
Everything is broken
Going, Going Gone..lol
High Water (everywhere)
If not for you
It Hurts Me Too
It Takes a Lot to Laugh, It Takes a Train to Cry
It's All Over Now, Baby(Dodger) Blue
It's Alright, Ma (I'm Only Bleeding)
Jokerman
Most Likely You Go Your Way and I'll Go Mine
Not Dark Yet
One of Us Must Know (Sooner or Later)
The Times They Are A-Changin'
I make love to mountain lions,
Sleep on red-hot branding irons,
When I walk the roadway shakes,
Bed's a mess of rattlesnakes,
Voodoo child, black cat bone,
Scratch your back, hear you moan,
Get me up, you go down, tall building, single bound,
War and peace, peace and love, say it if you dare,
Iron fist, velvet glove,
I'm so bad, baby I don't care,"
http://tinyurl.com/ke65v
Old friend Paul LoDuca and longtime nemesis Darin Erstad also make appearances.
Concerning Nomar:
... we believe Garciaparra is no longer anywhere close to the hitter he was the first six years of his career...The writing is on the wall for this signing to look bad for all involved, as a healthy season could yield .290/.330/.440 production.
No really, since I'm a Bruce Tramp I'll go with the opening to Born To Run (although that sends the wrong message to the opposition doesn't it?) How about Ramrod then?
This sux. Our season is not even a week old, and it already seems like it's over.
This must be what it feels like to be a Royals fan.
Lofton
Garciapare
Gagne
Baez
Alomar
Is the accent in the first word on the first or second syllable...?
I'm afraid I went to the well too many times with my Mussorgsky joke there.
The link for the Dodgers.com article is
http://tinyurl.com/ftjhs
So "two months" in Dodgers medical staff lingo translates to how many months/years/decades in real time?
Barry Bonds, obviously, should be using Wilco's "A Shot in the Arm."
As for myself, I'd use one of these...
Rage Against the Machine's version of "Maggie's Farm"
Curtis Mayfield's "Superfly"
Springsteen's "Roulette"
Zevon's "Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner"
Gil Scott-Heron's "Whitey on the Moon"
Something, in other words, that would make most of the fans in the stands wonder "What the &%$# is that all about?"
Dr. Jobe: "Well, we had to amutate the arm, turns out its been hurting his whole life and he just never told any one about it. Luckily we didnt have to amutate the whole arm, we saved his tattoos. He'll be back by spring training."
Instead we get Saito?
165 - I think they think that Broxton needs a bit more seasoning. But I wouldn't get too wrapped up in this. Things are going to be in flux for a while.
However, it was evident that Gagne was hobbled by the knee injury when he faced several batters in a spring-training game last year. That was inexcusable. I'm not sure what the chain of command was, but it's safe to aassume that it begins with the training staff, then moves up to the manager, followed by the GM. Gagne should never have thrown one in-game pitch while hobbled by that knee injury. Until he showed he could dial it up in the bullpen, you simply exempt him from all games.
I also disagree with implications that his varied work routine down the stretch in 2004 didn't have a residual effect, but that's another debate for another day.
Broxton needs more than seasoning. He needs to get in shape. He was grossly overweight entering spring training and according to some accounts his velocity was down.
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